I hereby declare the Messi-Penaldo discussion oficially over

[Hoops Czar]

Haaland had 0 goals in the semi finals and finals of all tourneys City played in. They scored 12 goals in those 5 matches.

Haaland is great but never had the decisive goals often enough. Much like lewandowski they score when the team scores in bunches, but very very rarely do you recall match winning goals. Haaland suffers from playing on a brilliant team, Messi inarguably had more of a carry job in the NT than Haaland in CL.

Well OK, however, I can't recall Messi scoring a big or decsive goal in the French Ligue one because there were no big or decisive games to begin with. I'm also well aware that PSG won their league by a single point over Lens. I'm also aware that it's undoubtedly the only top five league they would have finished first in. Yes, Man City are brilliant but it's almost forgotten that PSG had Mbappe and Neymar in addition to Messi. That's not too shabby either. Talk about a bunch of classic underachievers.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Well OK, however, I can't recall Messi scoring a big or decsive goal in the French Ligue one because there were no big or decisive games to begin with. I'm also well aware that PSG won their league by a single point over Lens. I'm also aware that it's undoubtedly the only top five league they would have finished first in. Yes, Man City are brilliant but it's almost forgotten that PSG had Mbappe and Neymar in addition to Messi. That's not too shabby either. Talk about a bunch of classic underachievers.

PSG have zero midfield and very very top heavy along with Neymar injured for half of every season. I totally agree they underachieved, but even now they’re much worse needing a dubious penalty just to scrape a point off of Newcastle. The team was horribly balanced. And man city were the kings of underachievers in CL for many years now but credit to them for getting over the hump now.


If psg only won the league by 1 point and Messi had 16 goals and 16 assists last season so clearly without him, they aren’t winning the league. They also don’t win the league the season prior to him joining. But either way, the team was a let down in CL, but Messi was incredibly decisive in the WC, and that’s why he understandably won the ballon d’or. Haaland is a luxury piece and a brilliant one, but city actually look much worse without Rodri than they do with Haaland.

[DAF86]

Have you ever actually sat down and watched an EPL game involving Man City within the last decade? The majority of teams park the bus against City making it more challenging to score. It's why City has so much possession because opposing teams put ten in the box.

You mean like teams used to do against Messi's Barcelona? You think Messi wouldn't do well and statpad under those cir stances?

yeah, there's more scoring in the premier league in general because the level of compe ion is much greater than that hole of a French Ligue one. The City-Chelsea game was an anomaly. As bad as City's defense has been this year, they rarely give up more than a goal or two. Let me put it another way, if City and PSG switched places, they would absolutely thrash the French Ligue one. City would be centurions every season.

Yeah, because City are the much better side. That's the advantage Haaland had at club level.

Lets keep it simple, Messi won the Ballon D'or because it was a WC year and his team won, not because of his stat padding in a farmer's league. But, it's also pretty obvious that Messi was surrounded by better players at Argentina than Haaland had at Norway. Put Messi on Norway and Haaland on Argentina, Norway doesn't make it out of the group stage while Argentina are still competing for a WC.

Swap Haaland for Messi in City, Messi would thrive under a system and manager that got the most of him, and City would still win it all.

Swap Messi for Haaland in Argentina, they don't win the World Cup.

Simple as that.

But this isn't about hypotheticals, this is about what happened. And what happened is that Messi posted better individual stats while winning the same amount of tournaments, with the difference that Messi won the most important one. Conclusion = Messi was the rightful winner of the Ballon D'or.

[FrostKing]

Thought the same in the mid 80s, tbh... eras are different though, once you start talking about rule changes, pitch quality, etc...

True. There will always be nostalgia bias.

In the past before Leagues were globally accessible the Legends were remembered by a handful of International knockout games. Now these same players are being watched as they age in domestic leagues.

I haven't really watched much footy since the WC. I really enjoyed it. Seems many of the participating stars are struggling since. Hoping the Euros rebounds my interest.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

No Rodri, no party.

Haaland isn't even the most important City player

[lefty]

No Rodri, no party.

Haaland isn't even the most important City player

Also that RW sonce Mahrez left has been meh , Bernardo, Foden, Alvarez are great but it’s not the best position for them, Mahrez could break down defenses 1 on 1
Gundo’s absence is also felt

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Also that RW sonce Mahrez left has been meh , Bernardo, Foden, Alvarez are great but it’s not the best position for them, Mahrez could break down defenses 1 on 1
Gundo’s absence is also felt

Well said!

[Hoops Czar]

No Rodri, no party.

Haaland isn't even the most important City player

Box score sniffing aside, it's actually no Grealish, no Doku, No De Bruyne, No Rodri, no party. Rodri's importance is magnified only because City doesn't have a suitable replacement backing him up. Phillips is straight up trash, Nunes isn't very good either and Lewis is raw and unpolished. City's best and most important player is De Bruyne and it's not even close. They have players that can break the lines but very few that can actually unlock defenses. However, Haaland's role is understated. His presence alone makes City a better squad. He takes attention away from Alvarez and Foden allowing them to work in more space. No shame in admitting Haaland isn't City's best player just like there's no crime in admitting that Mbappe was PSG's best player.

The Luton Town exhibition game was a car crash offensively. A rebound goal by Bernardo and a slow roller of the side of the goalies leg by Grealish was all that separated City from losing to one of the worst teams in the EPL. A decent team and they would have lost for sure, Rodri or no Rodri.

[Hoops Czar]

Also that RW sonce Mahrez left has been meh , Bernardo, Foden, Alvarez are great but it’s not the best position for them, Mahrez could break down defenses 1 on 1
Gundo’s absence is also felt

Doku is three times the player Mahrez was even though he plays on the left side. Mahrez was a bench player for much of the season last year. They miss is penalty takes and his free kicks but they mis Gundogan a lot more.

[Hoops Czar]

You mean like teams used to do against Messi's Barcelona? You think Messi wouldn't do well and statpad under those cir stances?



Yeah, because City are the much better side. That's the advantage Haaland had at club level.



Swap Haaland for Messi in City, Messi would thrive under a system and manager that got the most of him, and City would still win it all.

Swap Messi for Haaland in Argentina, they don't win the World Cup.

Simple as that.

But this isn't about hypotheticals, this is about what happened. And what happened is that Messi posted better individual stats while winning the same amount of tournaments, with the difference that Messi won the most important one. Conclusion = Messi was the rightful winner of the Ballon D'or.

Haaland had 61 goals + assists compared to Messi's 40 across all compe ions last season playing in a more compe ive league. , Haaland had more goals scored in the EPL (36) than Messi had goals + assists combined (32) in Ligue one. Messi didn't even lead his own team in goals + assists. That distinction belongs to Mbappe with 50.You're being obtuse if you think Messi won it for any other reason than winning the World Cup.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Box score sniffing aside, it's actually no Grealish, no Doku, No De Bruyne, No Rodri, no party. Rodri's importance is magnified only because City doesn't have a suitable replacement backing him up. Phillips is straight up trash, Nunes isn't very good either and Lewis is raw and unpolished. City's best and most important player is De Bruyne and it's not even close. They have players that can break the lines but very few that can actually unlock defenses. However, Haaland's role is understated. His presence alone makes City a better squad. He takes attention away from Alvarez and Foden allowing them to work in more space. No shame in admitting Haaland isn't City's best player just like there's no crime in admitting that Mbappe was PSG's best player.

The Luton Town exhibition game was a car crash offensively. A rebound goal by Bernardo and a slow roller of the side of the goalies leg by Grealish was all that separated City from losing to one of the worst teams in the EPL. A decent team and they would have lost for sure, Rodri or no Rodri.

Haaland once again rarely gets the decisive goals. He’s a luxury and without service he’s a ghost. Doesn’t mean he isn’t a great player but the cherry on a well oiled machine not the engine.

Also Haaland had everyone setting things up for him to score at the receiving end, Messi was the one having to service mbappe as he plays far deeper. A game where Haaland doesn’t score isn’t nearly as good as one where Messi doesn’t score as Messi has to drop deep and player much deeper just to get the ball forward. Haaland just has to wait for the ball to ge to him.

I have no problem saying mbappe was PSG’s best player, but Messi isn’t even a top 2 option for scoring for psg. City were winning elk’s well before Haaland arrived. That system Pep has is a dream for any striker as nobody generates more chances consistently as city does thanks to their insane depth and midfield.

Remove Messi from Argentina, they don’t get out of the group stage, remove Haaland from city and they’re still right at the top.

Your stats for goals and assist combined during ballon d’or voting:

Haaland: 61

Messi: 56


Your “40” is wrong

Yes, epl is tougher than French league but epl also has far more scoring than the French league and city were dominating epl even before Haaland arrived. PSG failed to win the league the season prior to Messi arriving.


It’s unfortunate for Haaland, as most other seasons he would’ve won ballon d’or, but as we discussed before zero goals in semi finals and finals where city scored a whopping 12 goals don’t help his case.

Haaland is a victim of man city city’s strength as a team overall where Messi had the much bigger carry job Argentina.

Of course, without the WC, Messi wouldn’t have even been top 3 in voting but a stellar WC definitely helped his case.

[Hoops Czar]

Haaland once again rarely gets the decisive goals. He’s a luxury and without service he’s a ghost. Doesn’t mean he isn’t a great player but the cherry on a well oiled machine not the engine.

Also Haaland had everyone setting things up for him to score at the receiving end, Messi was the one having to service mbappe as he plays far deeper. A game where Haaland doesn’t score isn’t nearly as good as one where Messi doesn’t score as Messi has to drop deep and player much deeper just to get the ball forward. Haaland just has to wait for the ball to ge to him.

I have no problem saying mbappe was PSG’s best player, but Messi isn’t even a top 2 option for scoring for psg. City were winning elk’s well before Haaland arrived. That system Pep has is a dream for any striker as nobody generates more chances consistently as city does thanks to their insane depth and midfield.

Remove Messi from Argentina, they don’t get out of the group stage, remove Haaland from city and they’re still right at the top.

Your stats for goals and assist combined during ballon d’or voting:

Haaland: 61

Messi: 56


Your “40” is wrong

Yes, epl is tougher than French league but epl also has far more scoring than the French league and city were dominating epl even before Haaland arrived. PSG failed to win the league the season prior to Messi arriving.


It’s unfortunate for Haaland, as most other seasons he would’ve won ballon d’or, but as we discussed before zero goals in semi finals and finals where city scored a whopping 12 goals don’t help his case.

Haaland is a victim of man city city’s strength as a team overall where Messi had the much bigger carry job Argentina.

Of course, without the WC, Messi wouldn’t have even been top 3 in voting but a stellar WC definitely helped his case.

In many cases, Haaland scored the first goal which a lot of times was the decisive goal. After that, City piled on goals for fun, turning close games into a laugher. I don't know what a decisive goal looks like in Ligue 1 because it's a one team league. Lens is probably the second best team and they got smacked sideways by Arsenal in Champions League.

PSG had won seven les in nine years prior to Messi's arrival so it's not like they were short on success. It's not like Messi was doing more with less. mbappe and Neymar are considered two of the best strikers in the world and both of them are capable of creating their own shot with or without Messi's help.

Argentina is no, 1 in world football power rankings and Norway is 44. There's a slight gap in talent between the two. If you take Messi off Argentina, they'll still be in the top five or ten. They probably wouldn't win a WC but they'd be very compe ive. The same can't be said for Norway.

I was using FBRef to tally Messi's goals + assists. In Ligue 1, he had 16 goals and 16 assists. In Champions league, he had 4 goals and 4 assists. What am I missing here?

https://fbref.com/en/squads/e2d8892c...l-Compe ions

Your last sentence is spot on. Without winning the WC, Messi doesn't win the Ballon d’or.

[DAF86]

Haaland had 61 goals + assists compared to Messi's 40 across all compe ions last season playing in a more compe ive league. , Haaland had more goals scored in the EPL (36) than Messi had goals + assists combined (32) in Ligue one. Messi didn't even lead his own team in goals + assists. That distinction belongs to Mbappe with 50.You're being obtuse if you think Messi won it for any other reason than winning the World Cup.

I never said that, tbh. Of course Messi won it because of the WC. What I'm saying is that casuals like you think Messi was outside the WC and that couldn't be further from the truth. He had a pretty dammn good season for PSG. In fact, he had an historic one. In fact, many PSG fans thought he was the man of the tournament in Ligue 1. At the end of the day, Messi was a rightful winner of the Ballon D'or, just like Haaland would have also been if he had been selected. Anyone screaming robery is just being a subjective got, tbh.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

In many cases, Haaland scored the first goal which a lot of times was the decisive goal. After that, City piled on goals for fun, turning close games into a laugher. I don't know what a decisive goal looks like in Ligue 1 because it's a one team league. Lens is probably the second best team and they got smacked sideways by Arsenal in Champions League.

PSG had won seven les in nine years prior to Messi's arrival so it's not like they were short on success. It's not like Messi was doing more with less. mbappe and Neymar are considered two of the best strikers in the world and both of them are capable of creating their own shot with or without Messi's help.

Argentina is no, 1 in world football power rankings and Norway is 44. There's a slight gap in talent between the two. If you take Messi off Argentina, they'll still be in the top five or ten. They probably wouldn't win a WC but they'd be very compe ive. The same can't be said for Norway.

I was using FBRef to tally Messi's goals + assists. In Ligue 1, he had 16 goals and 16 assists. In Champions league, he had 4 goals and 4 assists. What am I missing here?

https://fbref.com/en/squads/e2d8892c...l-Compe ions

Your last sentence is spot on. Without winning the WC, Messi doesn't win the Ballon d’or.

Dude that is beyond ridiculous and you know it. Messi was suspended 3 games during WQ qualifiers and Argentina scraped by just to qualify:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/s...0on%20Thursday.

It wasn’t till Messi came back that he got them to squeak by. No shame in admitting Messi had a far far bigger carry job with Argentina than Haaland did with city.

I got my goals assists stats from transfermarket

[lefty]

Doku is three times the player Mahrez was even though he plays on the left side. Mahrez was a bench player for much of the season last year. They miss is penalty takes and his free kicks but they mis Gundogan a lot more.

Ok I'll bump this when Doku wins PFA and helps Leicester wins a PL le

[Hoops Czar]

I never said that, tbh. Of course Messi won it because of the WC. What I'm saying is that casuals like you think Messi was outside the WC and that couldn't be further from the truth. He had a pretty dammn good season for PSG. In fact, he had an historic one. In fact, many PSG fans thought he was the man of the tournament in Ligue 1. At the end of the day, Messi was a rightful winner of the Ballon D'or, just like Haaland would have also been if he had been selected. Anyone screaming robery is just being a subjective got, tbh.

I never said that, tbh. I said Messi's numbers were inflated because he was playing in a one team league, playing alongside two super stars who also put up great numbers. I mean, is there even such a thing as putting up historic numbers in Ligue one? PSG is the Man City of Ligue one. Seven les in nine years speaks for itself. I don't see any comparisons between the EPL and Ligue one other than they both reside in Europe. They're worlds apart in terms of compe ion. In fact, I don't believe for a second that Messi would put up comparable statlines if he had played in the EPL. That's my contention.

The Ballon d’or honors the male player who performed best over the previous year. Messi didn't have a better year than Haaland, he had a better month and a half. Also, you don't it's a coincidence that a French football magazine award presented in Paris, France had a little something to do with Messi walking away with no. 8??? Then, I don't know what to tell you. Of course he's a great player and deserved to be nominated. I never said otherwise.

I also don't buy the notion that Haaland plays for a great team and that works against him. Name me an NBA MVP that played for a losing team? Yeah, City were great before he arrived but they didn't win Champions League until he showed up and they became just the second team in EPL history to win the treble. What did Messi's team do outside of the WC? They won Ligue one like they were expected to do and they were eliminated from Champions League like they were expected to do.

[Hoops Czar]

Dude that is beyond ridiculous and you know it. Messi was suspended 3 games during WQ qualifiers and Argentina scraped by just to qualify:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/s...0on%20Thursday.

It wasn’t till Messi came back that he got them to squeak by. No shame in admitting Messi had a far far bigger carry job with Argentina than Haaland did with city.



I got my goals assists stats from transfermarket

I can't read that article because I don't have a subscription. I'm confused. Are you saying they almost didn't qualify for the WC? They finished 6 points off Brazil and 15 points better than Peru who lost to Australia in a play off.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022...ion_(CONMEBOL)

Why are you comparing club and country? I was talking about Norway, not City. Yeah, Messi had a bigger carry job at Argentina than Haaland had at City but so what? Norway has no talent outside of Haaland. Argentina still has Alvarez, Martinez, Dybala and Di Maria and they're aren't going to drop out of the top ten to fifteen if Messi isn't there. Norway is currently 44th with Haaland. The two teams couldn't be any further apart in the rankings. They're complete polar opposites.

[FrostKing]

Haaland had 0 goals in the semi finals and finals of all tourneys City played in. They scored 12 goals in those 5 matches.

Haaland is great but never had the decisive goals often enough. Much like lewandowski they score when the team scores in bunches, but very very rarely do you recall match winning goals. Haaland suffers from playing on a brilliant team, Messi inarguably had more of a carry job in the NT than Haaland in CL.

Ronaldo during Real's UCL hostage takeover is only Striker that regularly scored in big matches and it was almost never decisive moment.

Come on UCL SemiFinals, gameplan #1 cut off the 9 Striker. Facing Italians? He ain't touching the ball

I'll step in and defend Lewy. When he first joined Bayern and they played those heavyweight classics against Real, Robben & Ribery were selfish. I watched alot of Bundesliga at the time and never remember them partnering on an attack. No surprise Bayern 3-Peat again when both retired and Lewy created partnership with Coman & Gnabry. Muller especially.

I absolutely loved those 3-straight UCL of Bayern vs Real. Attended sports bars. My favorite era.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Ronaldo during Real's UCL hostage takeover is only Striker that regularly scored in big matches and it was almost never decisive moment.

Come on UCL SemiFinals, gameplan #1 cut off the 9 Striker. Facing Italians? He ain't touching the ball

I'll step in and defend Lewy. When he first joined Bayern and they played those heavyweight classics against Real, Robben & Ribery were selfish. I watched alot of Bundesliga at the time and never remember them partnering on an attack. No surprise Bayern 3-Peat again when both retired and Lewy created partnership with Coman & Gnabry. Muller especially.

I absolutely loved those 3-straight UCL of Bayern vs Real. Attended sports bars. My favorite era.

Are you kidding? Ronaldo scored a ton in ucl and many were decisive. All the crazy comebacks Madrid had in second legs were usually thanks to Ronaldo prior to the final. He was often a ghost in the ucl finals but anything before that it absolutely was decisive as he would have 90% of their goals.


Lewy is the complete opposite, he would get his goals while Bayern were on a roll, but if it’s a tight 1-0 or 2-1 in ucl rarely would lewy be found. Kane is already on pace to crush what lewy was doing with Bayern. Lewy and Ronaldo are very different in ucl.

[DAF86]

I never said that, tbh. I said Messi's numbers were inflated because he was playing in a one team league, playing alongside two super stars who also put up great numbers.

And you are horribly wrong. We have stated that the Premier League has a more open style of play and teams score more goals. Also, playing along other superstars goes against your individual numbers, just like in the NBA. Messi would have scored more goals if he was the one taking penalties instead of Mbappe or if he didn't have to share free kicks with Neymar. PSG game style was also built for Mbappe being the finisher, while Messi played as a playmaker. All of this played agaisnt Messi getting more goals.

If Messi played in City, under Pep and alongside Julián Alvarez, who compliments Messi's game like no other player, Lionel would have won another Golden Boot.

So, yeah, your argument has no merit at all.

I mean, is there even such a thing as putting up historic numbers in Ligue one?

Yeah, that's why no other player did what Messi did. If it were so easy to stat pad in Ligue 1, one would assume another guy would have done what Messi did.

PSG is the Man City of Ligue one. Seven les in nine years speaks for itself. I don't see any comparisons between the EPL and Ligue one other than they both reside in Europe. They're worlds apart in terms of compe ion.

You say they are worlds apart in terms of competation yet acknowledge that City dominates PL just as much, if not more, than PSG in Ligue 1. The season prior to Messi joining PSG, PSG didn't win the league, tbh.

In fact, I don't believe for a second that Messi would put up comparable statlines if he had played in the EPL. That's my contention.

And, like I said, you are laughably wrong. Swap Messi for Haaland in City, Messi would thrive under Pep's system, playing alongside Julian in a more open league. Not only he would get more stats, he would also have won it all.

While Haaland in PSG would have scored less because he would have needed to share finishing responsabilites with Mbappe, and he wouldn't have been the penalty taker.

The Ballon d’or honors the male player who performed best over the previous year. Messi didn't have a better year than Haaland, he had a better month and a half.

No, Messi had a better all around season. He won just as much, but with a WC on top, and he produced numbers just as much as well. He also had more MOTMs across all compe ions and a better SOFA score. Any objective stat out there favours Messi over Haaland.

Also, you don't it's a coincidence that a French football magazine award presented in Paris, France had a little something to do with Messi walking away with no. 8??? Then, I don't know what to tell you.

You mean the same French people who lost the WC final to Messi and booed him on the Ballon D'or Gala?

I also don't buy the notion that Haaland plays for a great team and that works against him. Name me an NBA MVP that played for a losing team? Yeah, City were great before he arrived but they didn't win Champions League until he showed up and they became just the second team in EPL history to win the treble. What did Messi's team do outside of the WC? They won Ligue one like they were expected to do and they were eliminated from Champions League like they were expected to do.

I don't know who are you arguing against here, but I never said playing for City went agaisnt Haaland, in fact, quite the opposite: the only reason Haaland ended 2nd is exactly because he played for City, which allowed him to score and win like he wouldn't in any other club.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

I can't read that article because I don't have a subscription. I'm confused. Are you saying they almost didn't qualify for the WC? They finished 6 points off Brazil and 15 points better than Peru who lost to Australia in a play off.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022...ion_(CONMEBOL)

Why are you comparing club and country? I was talking about Norway, not City. Yeah, Messi had a bigger carry job at Argentina than Haaland had at City but so what? Norway has no talent outside of Haaland. Argentina still has Alvarez, Martinez, Dybala and Di Maria and they're aren't going to drop out of the top ten to fifteen if Messi isn't there. Norway is currently 44th with Haaland. The two teams couldn't be any further apart in the rankings. They're complete polar opposites.

Argentina barely qualified in 2018, without Messi they fail to qualify for a WC for the first time in their history:

https://amp.theguardian.com/football...e-to-world-cup

Argentina without Messi:

https://soccernet.ng/2016/09/stats-s...ntina.html/amp


Man city without it Haaland:

Man City record without Haaland
All compe ions: P7 W6 D1 L0 GF17 GA2

That above is from April 2023. Doesn’t mean Haaland isn’t important or immense, but a far far more balanced side than anything messi had in years.

If Messi ghosts for Argentina they rarely win, not the case for Haaland with city.


Messi had 7 decisive goals for psg including the one that sealed them the le that they didn’t win the season prior and barely won by a single point. So yes, he was decisive and without him they def don’t win that league.

https://www.messivsronaldo.app/detai...winning-goals/



And yes, there is talent on that Argentina squad, but inarguably without Messi they don’t get out of the group stage yet with him they win the world cup.

[FrostKing]

Are you kidding? Ronaldo scored a ton in ucl and many were decisive. All the crazy comebacks Madrid had in second legs were usually thanks to Ronaldo prior to the final. He was often a ghost in the ucl finals but anything before that it absolutely was decisive as he would have 90% of their goals.


Lewy is the complete opposite, he would get his goals while Bayern were on a roll, but if it’s a tight 1-0 or 2-1 in ucl rarely would lewy be found. Kane is already on pace to crush what lewy was doing with Bayern. Lewy and Ronaldo are very different in ucl.

I always preferred CR7 to your Messi so you're preaching to the choir.

Do you remember a time Lewy's team lost to a lesser side? Pretty rare. He always lost to stacked Spanish sides. He won with Coman & Gnabry. Where are they today. Bayern always had the lesser midfield. It was Lewy, Neuer & Muller. Pep ran off. When Bayern won - Thiago & Javi. There was no Neymar or Bale coming to Germany.

Rooting for Kane. But he won't reach it.

[FrostKing]

[FrostKing]

Petty boy had to take home his 20th ballon. Well Lewy raised Barca out of the gutter he left it

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Petty boy had to take home his 20th ballon. Well Lewy raised Barca out of the gutter he left it

Hahaha no man, lewy has been dog e this season, and declining rapidly. Bayern have to be laughing their asses off trading lewy for Kane while Barca are stuck with an albatross of a contract now. I want lewy to do well obviously for Barca but he’s washed up now and is a lot like Suarez’s final season in Europe.

As for Barca/bayern it was always mueller who killed Barca, even in the 8-2 Lewa was horrible. But fortunate to have such a stacked team that when he does ghost his teammates can carry him. Lewy has taken Barca to multiple straight europas, a new low for the club.



And Bayern lost to Villarreal which was an epic epic choke job, and to Atletico when they were the favorites.

Barca’s only truly mediocre opponent was Roma, everyone else usually made the final or won it after beating Barca.