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  1. #91
    Make a trade steal
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    I'm skeptical about Wilcox. Guy is not basketball-smart, he's lazy, and he's no shot-blocker. He used to be athletic, but if you've seen him this season he looks slow and overweight.

    I'd rather Collison who, whilst unspectacular, is a solid lunchpail-type worker. He goes to the boards, plays tough post D, and has a solid midrange jumper, but he's also not really a shot blocker... he's basically a younger, quicker version of KT.

    Come to think of it, neither of these guys truly fills our need, although either could potentially blossom or crash in the Spurs' system. End of the day, we're talking about help this year, so I take the smarter guy (more apt to learn our system quickly), and that is Collison.
    Why do you say Wilcox is lazy and not smart?

  2. #92
    Make a trade steal
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    Interesting. I know they have liked Collison - many think he'd work really well next to Duncan. But Wilcox is like the anti-Pop player... lazy on D, athletic , and rumored not to be the best practice player. As I said in the other thread about him, even with all his defensive laziness, he's still worth a look because he can run the floor, rebound and score.
    Wilcox is a big finisher and the spurs need a big with some athleticism.
    The lazy tag may not be justified. Put him on the spurs and I'm sure he would work harder on the defensive end because he knows thats a big requirement to Pop.

  3. #93
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    spurs fans don't deserve tony parker....

    +1

  4. #94
    Make a trade steal
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    I would take Rasho back right now, the spurs interior defense is obsolete.

    No, I don't want the Spurs revisting past failures.

  5. #95
    "The ball don't lie." dbestpro's Avatar
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    My only interest in regards to another big is a shot blocker. Thomas's game has come around and he and Bonner can provide everything we need of the post position except shot blocking. When teams are attacking the basket we need another big who can send the ball the other way or at least alter the shot. The ability to score is not an issue as we have plenty of scoring options. Collison does not fit the need.

  6. #96
    real fans go bald mountainballer's Avatar
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    My only interest in regards to another big is a shot blocker. Thomas's game has come around and he and Bonner can provide everything we need of the post position except shot blocking. When teams are attacking the basket we need another big who can send the ball the other way or at least alter the shot. The ability to score is not an issue as we have plenty of scoring options. Collison does not fit the need.
    My only interest in regards to another big is a better player. no matter in what department this guy is an upgrade, I take him. to claim KT and Bonner provide everything except shot blocking is pure nonsense.
    (sure, it would be very nice to get Camby, but whenever the Clippers put him on the market, they will get 5 better offers than whatever we can give them.)

    if they get Collison, they upgrade interior defense, low block scoring and rebounding, especially offensive rebounding. it wouldn't be a huge step, but it would be a significant upgrade.

  7. #97
    "The ball don't lie." dbestpro's Avatar
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    My only interest in regards to another big is a better player. no matter in what department this guy is an upgrade, I take him. to claim KT and Bonner provide everything except shot blocking is pure nonsense.
    (sure, it would be very nice to get Camby, but whenever the Clippers put him on the market, they will get 5 better offers than whatever we can give them.)

    if they get Collison, they upgrade interior defense, low block scoring and rebounding, especially offensive rebounding. it wouldn't be a huge step, but it would be a significant upgrade.
    No where did I mention Camby. In Thomas you will get what Collison can give now that Thomas is healthy. I just want another person capable of blocking a shot other than Tim. Collison does not fit what we are lacking. Camby is not the only big that knows how to block a shot.

  8. #98
    Believe. thOOdee's Avatar
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    Nick collison would be a huge step up from the other 6'10 players on the team but still. come on! I rather hold out like others had mentioned for a 7 footer that can block shots and just get in the way. Regardless of his offensive game. How many 6'10 white guys do we need. COME ON! this better be just a rumor

  9. #99
    Veteran baseline bum's Avatar
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    I'm skeptical about Wilcox. Guy is not basketball-smart, he's lazy, and he's no shot-blocker. He used to be athletic, but if you've seen him this season he looks slow and overweight.

    I'd rather Collison who, whilst unspectacular, is a solid lunchpail-type worker. He goes to the boards, plays tough post D, and has a solid midrange jumper, but he's also not really a shot blocker... he's basically a younger, quicker version of KT.

    Come to think of it, neither of these guys truly fills our need, although either could potentially blossom or crash in the Spurs' system. End of the day, we're talking about help this year, so I take the smarter guy (more apt to learn our system quickly), and that is Collison.
    Good post. With Tim's prime drawing to an end, the Spurs can't afford to screw around with projects if they can get someone to contribute now instead.

  10. #100
    The Dominator Duncan2177's Avatar
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    Yea lets trade Parker who helped us win 3 championships and was finals mvp in 07. Some spurs fans=Crack monkeys

  11. #101
    Ruffy RuffnReadyOzStyle's Avatar
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    The Spurs should just go ahead and trade Parker for Gortat . . .
    I don't understand what's the fascination with trading Parker and Manu... I don't see many fans of NO trying to trade West or Paul, nor Portland fans wanting Oden or Roy out. Do we not realize what we have? You just don't break a proven championship core even if the trade sounds somewhat appealing, let alone all those flying around that are not even equal in value.
    Exactly. WTF, people?

    No let's better just stay with what we have pretend like we aren't going to get our asses handed to us in the playoffs and wait 'till Hill becomes a free agent and decides to sign with a team that could get him more than 15 minutes a game. Yeah let's go spurs.
    Stop with the drama queen act. Hill will be a FA in 2012 - until then we have him on a very cheap rookie contract. And stop ignoring the obvious - Hill will take a bunch of Finley's minutes next year.

    Who's pretending we can beat the Lakers in 7 games? We all know we need another big, we just don't think Hill for Marcin fucking Gortat is the answer. Nor is trading Tony Parker for a bunch of maybe.

    Stop panicking in January like someone who doesn't know the Spurs - you've been here long enough to know better.
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  12. #102
    ┌∩┐(●_●)┌∩┐ DAF86's Avatar
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    Stop with the drama queen act. Hill will be a FA in 2012 - until then we have him on a very cheap rookie contract. And stop ignoring the obvious - Hill will take a bunch of Finley's minutes next year.
    Obvious to who? to me it is obvious that Finley shouldn't be playing 35 minutes per game right now but Pop doesn't think so, so you never know. You should be the one stop ignoring the obvious: Gortat not only will be a great adition to this team for years to come but also for this season, thing that we can't say of Hill.

    Who's pretending we can beat the Lakers in 7 games? We all know we need another big, we just don't think Hill for Marcin fucking Gortat is the answer. Nor is trading Tony Parker for a bunch of maybe.
    So tell me what is the answer? We won't get a damn thing for Vaughn, Udoka or Oberto. And trading one of the big three definitely isn't the answer.

    Stop panicking in January like someone who doesn't know the Spurs - you've been here long enough to know better
    I've never been the kind of fan that panicks after a regular season loss, but I always try to say what I trully think. And right now I think we have no chance of getting past the Lakers in the PO, but I also think that we're one decent big man away of having a fair chance of doing so. That's why I proposed that trade.

  13. #103
    Ruffy RuffnReadyOzStyle's Avatar
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    Obvious to who? to me it is obvious that Finley shouldn't be playing 35 minutes per game right now but Pop doesn't think so, so you never know. You should be the one stop ignoring the obvious: Gortat not only will be a great adition to this team for years to come but also for this season, thing that we can't say of Hill. (1)

    So tell me what is the answer? We won't get a damn thing for Vaughn, Udoka or Oberto. And trading one of the big three definitely isn't the answer. (2)

    I've never been the kind of fan that panicks after a regular season loss, but I always try to say what I trully think. And right now I think we have no chance of getting past the Lakers in the PO, but I also think that we're one decent big man away of having a fair chance of doing so. That's why I proposed that trade. (3)
    (1) Finley's playing 28mins not 35, still too much, but you can bet Hill's minutes will increase next year - it is a natural progression we've seen with most players new to the Spurs' system. Next year Finley will be the 5th swing or retired, count on it. Hill hasn't been a great addition to the team? Which team are you watching?

    As for Gortat, he's a solid player, but he's no Bynum-stopper, and if you are talking Lakers, that's what you're describing. And you still haven't convinced me why Orlando would give up their first big off the bench who they like and is earning 700k.

    (2) I don't have the answer, except to say that I think Pop is playing CIA games with Mahinmi and that he will just appear fit and healthy one day soon and start playing. If not him, a salary dump trade at the deadline for someone.

    (3) Just about every year things look bleak some time between Christmas and the start of March. And for each of the last 6 years the Spurs have gone deep in the playoffs despite the apparent mid-season gloom. trust in the FO and the team is all I can say - they have proven that they know what they're doing.

  14. #104
    Make a trade steal
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    (1)
    (3) Just about every year things look bleak some time between Christmas and the start of March. And for each of the last 6 years the Spurs have gone deep in the playoffs despite the apparent mid-season gloom. trust in the FO and the team is all I can say - they have proven that they know what they're doing.
    Yea, they really knew what they were doing last year when they did not have enough off the bench to make up for Manu being nicked up in the playoffs.

  15. #105
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    Defensively, Collison is no better than Oberto, let alone Kurt Thomas. Too slow-footed, not a strong post defender, lacks awareness.

  16. #106
    Ghost of Mr. K SenorSpur's Avatar
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    I don't understand what's the fascination with trading Parker and Manu... I don't see many fans of NO trying to trade West or Paul, nor Portland fans wanting Oden or Roy out. Do we not realize what we have? You just don't break a proven championship core even if the trade sounds somewhat appealing, let alone all those flying around that are not even equal in value.
    Exactly. There's no need to suggest any sort of roster overhaul, much less the thought of jettisoning one of our big three. Besides, you don't simply change out 3-4 players on your roster and expect "instant soup".

    The Spurs simply need to seek to add a complmentary, reserve big, who can defend, rebound, and is a threat to score down low. I know that's a tall order because practically every team in the NBA needs such a player and the Spurs have litttle to no trade assets. A tall order, but not an impossible one. Collison isn't the ideal fit, but if he is the best they can get come the trade deadline, I'll take him. It's the frontline where there is the biggest deficiency right now. In order for the Spurs to improve their chances of advancing in the West, Tim desparately needs help.

  17. #107
    real fans go bald mountainballer's Avatar
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    Defensively, Collison is no better than Oberto, let alone Kurt Thomas. Too slow-footed, not a strong post defender, lacks awareness.
    huh? slow footed? KT is as mobile as a hippo with cement shoes. Collison will look like a roadrunner on speed compared to him.
    yes, Collison is a similar player to Fab, there is a reason why many think he will fit well.
    but at this point he is a huge upgrade over Fab. younger, stronger, can leap a bit, better 15 footer. nice upgrade on defense and significant upgrade on offense.
    any trade package for Collison will likely include Fab and his cap friendly contract anyhow, so it would be replacing Fab with a similar but younger and better player. that's a nice improvement in my books.

  18. #108
    Believe.
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    About Collison- So when and if its official when will we know?
    Last edited by 1usamotorsports.com; 01-20-2009 at 09:43 AM. Reason: forgot

  19. #109
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    huh? slow footed? KT is as mobile as a hippo with cement shoes. Collison will look like a roadrunner on speed compared to him.
    yes, Collison is a similar player to Fab, there is a reason why many think he will fit well.
    but at this point he is a huge upgrade over Fab. younger, stronger, can leap a bit, better 15 footer. nice upgrade on defense and significant upgrade on offense.
    any trade package for Collison will likely include Fab and his cap friendly contract anyhow, so it would be replacing Fab with a similar but younger and better player. that's a nice improvement in my books.
    Yeah, he's certainly more mobile than Thomas, but that doesn't make him a better defender. KT's footwork, smartness and physicality are vastly superior. He doesn't have Oberto's size and smarts, either. What he brings over Oberto on the offensive end may very well be worth the added cost, depending on what else you offer, but I was just analyzing the defence.

  20. #110
    real fans go bald mountainballer's Avatar
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    Yeah, he's certainly more mobile than Thomas, but that doesn't make him a better defender. KT's footwork, smartness and physicality are vastly superior. He doesn't have Oberto's size and smarts, either. What he brings over Oberto on the offensive end may very well be worth the added cost, depending on what else you offer, but I was just analyzing the defence.
    you ignore my point. he wouldn't replace KT but likely defend more mobile bigs who KT no longer can guard. Collison will look better against Gasol than KT would. also against West.
    about size and smarts. he does have exactly the same size like Fab and is stronger. Collison measured 6'9'' without and 6'10'' in shoes. unlike many white bigs he also displays an above average wingspan at 7'1 1/2'' and a very good standing reach of 9'. combined with a better leaping ability than Fab (who can't leap at all, as we know) he plays significantly bigger than Fab.
    (there is a reason why he averages 3 more rebounds per 40 minutes than Fab)
    smarts? Collison is pretty smart. look out that this would become even more obvious if he got the chance to play for the Spurs.

  21. #111
    black&gray, not blue&gay! koriwhat's Avatar
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    No, I don't want the Spurs revisting past failures.
    championships? if it wasn't for his contract is all i'm saying...
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  22. #112
    Veteran temujin's Avatar
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    Collison -the mere existence of whom I totally and proudly ignored untill I quickly read the first page of this thread- would be #10, 11 or 12 on the rotation.

    Could anyone PLEASE remind me the last time when a #10, 11, 12 of any team rotation has contributed to a Conference or NBA final?
    Other than for a couple of jokes while in the shower?

  23. #113
    Veteran temujin's Avatar
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    you ignore my point. he wouldn't replace KT but likely defend more mobile bigs who KT no longer can guard. Collison will look better against Gasol than KT would. also against West.
    about size and smarts. he does have exactly the same size like Fab and is stronger. Collison measured 6'9'' without and 6'10'' in shoes. unlike many white bigs he also displays an above average wingspan at 7'1 1/2'' and a very good standing reach of 9'. combined with a better leaping ability than Fab (who can't leap at all, as we know) he plays significantly bigger than Fab.
    (there is a reason why he averages 3 more rebounds per 40 minutes than Fab)
    smarts? Collison is pretty smart. look out that this would become even more obvious if he got the chance to play for the Spurs.
    I wonder why the Lakers haven't done that Collison for Gasol and a couple of first rounders.
    I guess it's just a matter of time.

  24. #114
    Veteran HarlemHeat37's Avatar
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    I highly doubt we acquire anybody of this talent..

    we're most likely going to ride with Oberto and Mahinmi, and honestly, I have no problem with that..the fact that they haven't made any noise tells me that they're happy with what Ian is currently showing, and they believe he can contribute this year..

    I'm in the minority here, but I believe we can definitely win a title this year with the current 15-man roster we have..I don't think we need to add anybody, I think we need to just improve as a team defensively and in terms of effort..

    regarding Collison..I don't really see how he improves our team significantly..it's not worth putting up with his contract..

  25. #115
    It's a process... mexicanjunior's Avatar
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    Collison -the mere existence of whom I totally and proudly ignored untill I quickly read the first page of this thread- would be #10, 11 or 12 on the rotation.
    If Collison were with the Spurs, he would be starting ahead of Bonner...easily. He brings the defense and rebounding Oberto couldn't while also having a better offensive game.

  26. #116
    Ghost of Mr. K SenorSpur's Avatar
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    I highly doubt we acquire anybody of this talent..

    we're most likely going to ride with Oberto and Mahinmi, and honestly, I have no problem with that..the fact that they haven't made any noise tells me that they're happy with what Ian is currently showing, and they believe he can contribute this year..

    I'm in the minority here, but I believe we can definitely win a title this year with the current 15-man roster we have..I don't think we need to add anybody, I think we need to just improve as a team defensively and in terms of effort..

    regarding Collison..I don't really see how he improves our team significantly..it's not worth putting up with his contract..
    I'd like to think that Ian figures into their plans this year, but somehow that idea seems to fade with each passing game. If the Spurs are truly happy with their roster, this would contradict the published reports that claim they are again in the market for a big before the trade deadline.

  27. #117
    It's a process... mexicanjunior's Avatar
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    I'd like to think that Ian figures into their plans this year, but somehow that idea seems to fade with each passing game. If the Spurs are truly happy with their roster, this would contradict the published reports that claim they are again in the market for a big before the trade deadline.
    If the Spurs approved of their current big situation, I don't think we would have read as much about them trying to sign Mutumbo...

  28. #118
    Veteran HarlemHeat37's Avatar
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    I would agree, but I haven't really taken any of the "rumors" seriously..we hear Spurs rumors every year, and there usually isn't a big move..we're always the first team people mention in regards to any veteran addition..

  29. #119
    Govt, stay away!
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    If the Spurs approved of their current big situation, I don't think we would have read as much about them trying to sign Mutumbo...
    They weren't. It was all trumped up BS by Mutombo's agent...
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  30. #120
    fuk yo team clown tp2021's Avatar
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    I think its a little funny that this thread is still going despite...
    Did you guys listen to the audio? Stein doesn't mention anything about Nick Collison. He just says that it's no secret that the Spurs are looking for one more player before the deadline.

    The Collison part looks like just a teaser that ESPN.com added in because Bucher had mentioned it in the mag.
    I know the discussion has become more general, but still.
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