General Trades Discussion

[GSH]

I thought Duhon was going to be the bargain of the offseason, last year. He's a competent distributor of the ball, and I was expecting maybe $5.2M for two years. Then the Magic gave him $14M+ for four years. Now he's no bargain, and I don't trust him for three more guaranteed years.

[Mel_13]

Two minor trades the Spurs could make using McDyess' contract if they fail to acquire a starting PF . . .

1) McDyess for Dooling. The Bucks have Jennings, Udrih and Livingston at PG. The Spurs could pay the $500, 000 difference in guaranteed salary. Dooling is similar to Hill, in that he's a combo guard, who can defend, is an okay three-point shooter and he's Spurs material. Serviceable backup, with only one year left on his contract. I'd prefer him to Watson.

2) McDyess for Tolliver. Same general reasoning. The Wolves are overloaded with bigs/shooting fours and Kahn recently talked about giving players who there's no longer room for a chance to play elsewhere, like they did with Flynn. The Spurs could pay the 500, 000 difference in guaranteed salary. I like this one less, because Tolliver is not starting material, but he would fill the need for a fifth big/additional shooting four and he only has one year left on his contract.

The first trade doesn't work technically since the Bucks are also over the cap, but that's not really the point. I think you're missing something in the consequences of taking on Dice's contract.

In both cases you're sending Dice's contract and 500K for a player making around 2M with just one year left on the contract. The other team still will have to pay the remaining 2.1m to pay off Dice.

The net result is that they're paying 2M to not have the player when they could have kept the player for same 2M. There's no reason for either team to make that trade.

[TD 21]

The first trade doesn't work technically since the Bucks are also over the cap, but that's not really the point. I think you're missing something in the consequences of taking on Dice's contract.

In both cases you're sending Dice's contract and 500K for a player making around 2M with just one year left on the contract. The other team still will have to pay the remaining 2.1m to pay off Dice.

The net result is that they're paying 2M to not have the player when they could have kept the player for same 2M. There's no reason for either team to make that trade.

Yeah, I forgot the total value and was only thinking about the guaranteed part. Ilyasova, Dooling and Brockman for McDyess and Blair works. But the Spurs would have to really be down on Blair to make this trade. I wouldn't do it.

The reason both teams would do those trades I proposed is they'd give a player a chance to play elsewhere, which is always intelligent. You don't want to get a reputation as a place that hordes players just for the sake of it. Neither team has a use for those guys anymore and they'll just rot on the bench and not be re-signed anyway.

[Russo21]

One possible trade, before july 1, could be with Toronto as our partner...that's 'cause this trade could involve all their "long term" contracts.
After the Valenciounas choice, maybe they decided to start rebuilding from zero.

Her's the deal :

RJ + Dice contract + Bonner for Bargnani + A. Jhonson + Kleiza

Yeah that would be nice i reckon. I've thought of the exact same deal.

Bargnani- Really good offensive player at 21ppg, young and can spread the floor lol. Last year averaged 5.2 rebounds and 0.7 blocks. house for a guy of his size playing his minutes. We dont really need help offensively. And from what i know about him, he is totally rat at defense so he might not help us that much. So pass. But that being said. I'd take him over Bonner any day.

Johnson- I like his game. 10pts 6reb 1 block 1 steal type of guy. 4 fouls per game in just 25 minutes. So he seems like a guy that could be pushed around a little bit being just 210lbs. Not to bad really. I'd take him over Bonner and Blair and lock him in the weight room all summer.

Kleiza- Same production as RJ at about half the price. 11pts 4reb 30 odd % from three. Not great but i'd take him over RJ as he is far younger and far cheaper and if i remember correctly, probably marginally better then RJ defensively.

So to sum up. Our offense probably gets better. But i dont know if our rebounding, interior defense or wing defense would improve which are our main concerns.

So although it wouldnt really improve us that much, i'd do it just for the sake of Bonner and RJ getting the out of San Antonio

[DesignatedT]

No idea why Toronto would agree to that.

[CGD]

Before july 1st, Dice is only guaranteed a portion of his salary. After July 1st the entirety of his salary is guaranteed. This is why the FO would want to trade him before July 1st. He loses his trade value after that date (actually Nov 1st, but the NBA could still be in the lockout then and trades can't happen during the lockout.). A team can save a lot of luxury tax $ if they trade for Dice then cut him, thus only owing a portion of his salary.

I'm thinking that the Spurs are going to keep the saving for themselves...

[CGD]

Kaman for Dice+RJ+pick. Before dismissing it read this: http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jun...ppers-20110623.

Two things stand out:

(1) Clippers are looking for a veteran SF. Consider that Iggy's deal is for the same length as RJ's and for significantly more each year. Not saying RJ is better than Iggy, just a cheaper SF vet option (about 5M/year cheaper). I'm not convinced Iggy is worth the premium... for most of his career he's been the leading scorer on a crap team.

(2) Kaman is coming off an injury, and at least one team (Sixers) raised that as a concern in a recent trade proposal. Notwithstanding his expiring contract, the Clippers have a glut of front court players and other teams know that the Clippers are eager trying to move the increasingly disfavored Kaman. In any event, the failed trade involving Kaman for Iggy discussed in the article I think gives some insight on Kaman's value.

[cdcast]

There's not alot of good players in Dice's price range, even if they package him with Blair, there's very few options out there for a Dice trade. For example:

The Suns have Mikael Peatrus' expiring contract, the Suns would save a couple mil in the deal and the Spurs could then use Peatrus' expiring for another trade later on.

The Hornets have Jarett Jack, he's making $5 mil this season and next. Would the Hornets trade Paul's BFF and would the Spurs want a $5 mil backup PG? I think not.

Look for the Spurs to let Dice's contract expire this week and get rid of RJ with the amnesty clause in the new CBA. As good as it's gonna get.

[DesignatedT]

Any chance either NJ or SA would consider a RJ/Outlaw type of swap? I'm not even sure the Spurs would be interested in this but it could definitely match up.

[ace3g]

I've always been intrigued by acquiring Outlaw because he is a 6'9 SF.

Others have mentioned but realistic trades that could happen involving RJ are for either Outlaw or Josh Childress.

[bluebellmaniac]

Look for the Spurs to ... get rid of RJ with the amnesty clause in the new CBA. As good as it's gonna get.

We are a small market team and I doubt that even with an amnesty clause, we'd cut RJ. With an amnesty clause we'd still have to pay him out the next 3 years ($30M) and I don't see this team s ing out money like that. An amnesty clause would just exempt that salary from being computed into the luxury tax. It's made for teams like Dallas, LA, Miami, etc that don't want to pay the tax, but can afford to pay out the contract.

It would be like when Dallas released Finley and we picked him up for cheap, because he was already being paid by Cuban. Same would happen with RJ... probably Cuban would pick him up and we'd have payback.

[Russo21]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3ofzotg

[DesignatedT]

What about PHX wanting to get rid of Pietrus? Any chance of that?

[TimmehC]

What about PHX wanting to get rid of Pietrus? Any chance of that?

One would think they'd take a straight-up trade for Dice's unguaranteed contract. But, then the Spurs would have too many SF's unless they can somehow dump RJ.

[Duncan2177]

Jefferson+Dice for Camby it works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3wyk2at

[tdunk21]

Jefferson+Dice for Camby it works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=3wyk2at

blazers are kinda set at SF position with wallace and batum...imo they would not trade for another SF in RJ

[Duncan2177]

blazers are kinda set at SF position with wallace and batum...imo they would not trade for another SF in RJ

Or Bonner+Dice for Varejao


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=5wshqab

[DesignatedT]

Gotta find a team who has a need for a SF. Right now, Clippers and Cavs. Holding them back is they probably want to make a run at a free agent SF before taking on RJ's hefty contract. Still seem like the most likely suitors though.

[cdcast]

[QUOTE=TimmehC;5328748]One would think they'd take a straight-up trade for Dice's unguaranteed contract. But, then the Spurs would have too many SF's unless they can somehow dump RJ.[/QUOT

The main reason to trade for Pietrus would be his expiring contract. The Spurs could then package him in a RJ or TP trade.

An RJ/Blair/picks trade isn't very attractive but throw in Pietrus' $5.3 mil expiring contract, maybe a team will bite but then again they probably would still say no. Pietrus would give the Spurs another trade piece regardless.

[Spurtacus]

RJ salary

2011: 9,282,000
2012: 10,164,000
2013: 11,046,000 *player option*
2014: UFA

fyi

[TeKu]

Ah just admit the run is done and blow it all up...

Send Manu & RJ to Chicago for Deng/Brewer/Gibson + Mirotic & 1st rounder. Manu has to go to a contender and on the Bulls would hopefully see them continually pound Miami out East.

Send TP & Blair to G-State in a 3-way trade with the 76ers that sees Monta land in Philly and Williams/Nocioni/Klay Thompson & 2 1st rounders come to the Spurs.

Leaves Timmy (just no way we can ever trade him) to mentor a bunch of decent youngsters while Bonner/Nocionis contracts expire in yr 2 and we play the lottery/capspace game.

Williams/Thompson
Neal/Thompson/Brewer
Deng/Leonard/Brewer
Taj/Timmy/Bonner
Splitter/Timmy

+ picks & stashed Euros

Clearly has zero chance of happening right now but at the end of next season...?

[CGD]

RJ salary

2011: 9,282,000
2012: 10,164,000
2013: 11,046,000 *player option*
2014: UFA

fyi

For the sake of comparison, Iguodala, for the same # of years, will earn:

2011-12: $13,531,750
2012-13: $14,718,250
2013-14: $15,904,750 *ETO*
2014-15: UFA

The Clips, who are actively looking for a SF vet, were offering a package centered around Kaman (an expiring contract mind you) for a player slated to earn MORE money per year over the same term. It was Philly, not the Clips, that balked.

Now is Iggy 4-5M "better" than RJ? We can debate that, but I will note this: Iggy was the best scorer on a crap team for a LONG time. My sense is that he'd only be marginally better than RJ in the Spurs system. Put differently, given the right system RJ could be a good (and cheaper) fit on the Clips.

As for Kaman, if he can regain his confidence post injury he would be a solid fit for the Spurs. If he doesn't pan out, well he's off the books in a year anyway (at the same time as TD)... Oh, and by moving RJ you can make a compelling case to a free agent SF (I like Prince) that if he signs with the Spurs the SF position is essential his for the taking...

[lmbebo]

For the sake of comparison, Iguodala, for the same # of years, will earn:

2011-12: $13,531,750
2012-13: $14,718,250
2013-14: $15,904,750 *ETO*
2014-15: UFA

The Clips, who are actively looking for a SF vet, were offering a package centered around Kaman (an expiring contract mind you) for a player slated to earn MORE money per year over the same term. It was Philly, not the Clips, that balked.

Now is Iggy 4-5M "better" than RJ? We can debate that, but I will note this: Iggy was the best scorer on a crap team for a LONG time. My sense is that he'd only be marginally better than RJ in the Spurs system. Put differently, given the right system RJ could be a good (and cheaper) fit on the Clips.

As for Kaman, if he can regain his confidence post injury he would be a solid fit for the Spurs. If he doesn't pan out, well he's off the books in a year anyway (at the same time as TD)... Oh, and by moving RJ you can make a compelling case to a free agent SF (I like Prince) that if he signs with the Spurs the SF position is essential his for the taking...

sounds decent

It would have to be Bonner and Rj for kaman to work.

[DesignatedT]

Jefferson/Bonner for Kaman would be ing fantastic.

[DesignatedT]

What if LAC wanted RJ and Splitter for Kaman. Would anyone be willing to do that?