Heat: Laimbeer: Lebron would be the best in my era

[Malik Hairston]

Do you think any of the Raptors are better individual defenders than Dennis Rodman was on the Pistons team? Then again you don't know about that era or the 90's since you were born right after 1990. You can't comment on any of this .

I don't know much about the 80s or 90s, but didn't Bill Laimbeer play for the best defensive team in the 80s?..didn't he play with Rodman?..wasn't he one of the dirtiest players in the league, in the "physical 80s"?..would he know about the 80s or 90s?..

[LkrFan]

I think LeBron would be good in the '80s due to his size, strength, and skillset - but not great. I just doubt he'd be able to have developed to the level we see him at right now due to the physical play. Teams that couldn't stop him would simply beat him up and dare him to come in the paint like he does now. The difference is when they knock him on his ass, would he have the mental for ude to keep doing it over and over like he does now? I doubt it. I agree with those who says he'll adjust to the physical play. It's the mental part that would prevent him from dominating the '80s. Say what you want about Kobe, but that's one tough SOB. Mentally and physically. Remember when his Achilles snapped? He limped to the FT line and to the locker room - without the aid of a teammate or a wheelchair. LeBron couldn't do that.

[Clipper Nation]

Say what you want about Kobe, but that's one tough SOB.

No, you can't be a repeat quitter and be "tough," Alfredo....

[Axegrinder]

[daslicer]

I don't know much about the 80s or 90s, but didn't Bill Laimbeer play for the best defensive team in the 80s?..didn't he play with Rodman?..wasn't he one of the dirtiest players in the league, in the "physical 80s"?..would he know about the 80s or 90s?..

You have to factor in that Laimbeer hated Jordan with a passion so you can only take his comments with a grain of salt that was more of a parting shot at MJ than a compliment towards Lebron. By your logic I guess I should take Rodman's comments seriously since he said recently that Lebron would be a second rate player during the 80's and 90s had he played during that time period. He also said the Heat would easily lose to any of the second tier teams during the 90's. I should also take John Salley's comments seriously since he said that Kobe is better than both MJ and Lebron since he was from that era. Your nothing but a hardcore Lebron fanboy. Do you honestly believe anybody on the current Raptors teams is a better one on one defender than Rodman and Dumars. Name me one guy who is better than those 2 defense wise.

[Malik Hairston]

Individual defense is irrelevant in a discussion about team defenses..

I provided numbers that demonstrate that the best defensive team in the 80s would be just a slightly above average defense in today's NBA..

Naturally, today's defenses have progressed due to the collection of more data, elaborate schemes and superior athleticism from the players..this can't really be argued..

The only counter-arguments from the posters in this thread are " Lebron couldn't handle the HARD FOULS of the 80s!!!".. unquantifiable sports cliches..

[sook]

The best? No.

Jab at Jordan IMO.

[Clipper Nation]

Amazing how real basketball discussion has returned now that Harlem is back, even though the circle-jerkers claimed that they were going to talk basketball after he was banned

[ambchang]

If a 35 year old Shawn Marion and Danny green can have a significant impact defending Lebron, rodman, pippen and such will shut him down.

People citing points per possessions are idiots. The rules are totally different and besides the 1989 pistons drating is closer to the grizzlies than the raptors. The author was purposely putting misguiding evidence to prove a point. Which is a shame. In fact the 1990 prisons have the same d rating as OKC this year. Which would rank them 6 th in today's league.

Fast forward to 1993, a team like the Knicks have and rating the same as the pacers and yet Jordan still puts up 30+ ppg.

[Splits]

Amazing how real basketball discussion has returned now that Harlem is back, even though the circle-jerkers claimed that they were going to talk basketball after he was banned

[Malik Hairston]

If a 35 year old Shawn Marion and Danny green can have a significant impact defending Lebron, rodman, pippen and such will shut him down.

People citing points per possessions are idiots. The rules are totally different and besides the 1989 pistons drating is closer to the grizzlies than the raptors. The author was purposely putting misguiding evidence to prove a point. Which is a shame. In fact the 1990 prisons have the same d rating as OKC this year. Which would rank them 6 th in today's league.

Fast forward to 1993, a team like the Knicks have and rating the same as the pacers and yet Jordan still puts up 30+ ppg.

Even if you want to take the best Pistons' defense, which would rank 6th today, as you said(not even top 5), Lebron has routinely dominated superior defenses..not only did Lebron dominate, like Jordan, but he did it while exerting significantly more energy(which has been echoed by people such as Bill Simmons and Zach Lowe, who aren't Lebron homers like myself) on defense and rebounding..

I can only imagine what Lebron could do if he was put in a situation where he didn't have to exert energy playing defense and rebounding, along with playing inferior defenses to today's teams..

Your rule change argument is irrelevant, as there are both rules that aid today's teams play defense and rules that aided defenses back in the 80s..

[daslicer]

Individual defense is irrelevant in a discussion about team defenses..

I provided numbers that demonstrate that the best defensive team in the 80s would be just a slightly above average defense in today's NBA..

Naturally, today's defenses have progressed due to the collection of more data, elaborate schemes and superior athleticism from the players..this can't really be argued..

The only counter-arguments from the posters in this thread are " Lebron couldn't handle the HARD FOULS of the 80s!!!".. unquantifiable sports cliches..

Right you provided numbers and you spun them just like all politicians do to forward their agendas. You didn't factor in the 80's rosters had more scorers due to the league not suffering from the effects of expansion yet. So of course the scoring would have been higher back than.

Actually you are full of when you say individual defense would be irrelevant when talking about team defense. So by your logic we can say the Spurs 3 le teams after '99 would still be better defensively without Bruce Bowen and Tim Duncan's presence I doubt it.

Also what do you mean by superior athleticism? The 80's and 90's was not a bunch of non athletic ymca white guys playing. There is not really not much difference between the current most athletic teams and the ones in the past. Run TMC, 90's sonics, 90's suns, 90's magic were pretty much as athletic as the top athletic teams today. Look at the current playoffs they are only 3 teams that are super athletic and that would be the Clippers,OKC,Rockets you can say Miami when the big 3 are injury free. Who else has out of world athleticism in the playoffs that rivals the 80's and 90's.

Lebron would still put up great numbers during that era but I don't think he would have it as easy as he does right now. It wasn't just hard fouls it was that fact that you could handcheck back then that it made it much more harder for an offensive player to score. Today the offensive player has the advantage because you literally can't touch them without a foul being called.

I rooted for Lebron in '10 and '11 to win it all simply because I felt he had the best chance at taking out the spurs hated rivals the Lakers and Mavs. In '10 he didn't get to the Lakers because he choked against the Celtics big time due to letting Pierce,Garnett, and Rondo get in his head. In '11 he let Marion, Terry and Stevenson get inside of his head and ended up choking that series. just based on what we know it is safe to say Lebron would have been mentally raped by those Piston teams.

[313]

LeBron is still, after b2b les, a mentally weak got.

But is it because of the generation he grew up in, or is that just his natural personality? I don't know.

If it's his personality, then he wouldn't have made it in back in the day.

[TDMVPDPOY]

he isnt dominating today, what makes u think he dominate in any era?

he puts up nice stats, but it doesnt look like he clearly dominates games or team defenses collapsing on him

a physical specimen like him who flops around in todays league? and u want to put him in previous decades?

[Malik Hairston]

I hope we will reach a day where NBA fans and media recognize dominance outside of simple PPG, tbh..

We have made a lot of progress with the advancement of more elaborate stats and better media coverage from guys like Lowe, Simmons, Haberstroh, Abbott, etc, but most people are still stuck on the concept of domination only proven by PPG..

[313]

I hope we will reach a day where NBA fans and media recognize dominance outside of simple PPG, tbh..

We have made a lot of progress with the advancement of more elaborate stats and better media coverage from guys like Lowe, Simmons, Haberstroh, Abbott, etc, but most people are still stuck on the concept of domination only proven by PPG..

Dat you, HarlemHeat37?

[Malik Hairston]

Good observation, bro, I wonder how you solved that..

Don't forget that $20 when Memphis loses, tbh..

[IrisHockey]

Dat you, HarlemHeat37?

Did you see Datsyuk's goal ?

[Malik Hairston]

Did you see Datsyuk's goal ?

Filthy..

[Kool Bob Love]

Amazing how real basketball discussion has returned now that Harlem is back, even though the circle-jerkers claimed that they were going to talk basketball after he was banned

I think everyone can agree that Harlem basketball takes are great. The problem is when he goes full Canadian. It's horse .

hope you follow he's lead now because I like reading your stuff too.

[313]

Good observation, bro, I wonder how you solved that..

Don't forget that $20 when Memphis loses, tbh..

Jesus man, didn't hear? That Nick Calathes got suspended and won't be back for the series. 'Fraid the bet is off due to health.

[313]

I don't keep up with all the fooking drama on this forum tbh fwiw

[313]

Did you see Datsyuk's goal ?

Unfortunately I missed the game /: just saw it on ESPN though

Red wings in 5 btw

[IrisHockey]

Unfortunately I missed the game /: just saw it on ESPN though

I have a feeling this will be our year, tbh... I don't know why, I'm trying not to put my expectations too high, but this year has that awkward feel to it. We're completely under the radar which works in our favor too. If we beat Boston, we can beat anybody.

Every other year we won the le it was almost expected at the start of training camp. This year will be one like we've never seen before if we pull it off.

[313]

I have a feeling this will be our year, tbh... I don't know why, I'm trying not to put my expectations too high, but this year has that awkward feel to it. We're completely under the radar which works in our favor too. If we beat Boston, we can beat anybody.

Every other year we won the le it was almost expected at the start of training camp. This year will be one like we've never seen before if we pull it off.

I'm on the fence tbh I don't want to get my expectations too high after what happened last year.

It still hurts.