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  1. #51
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    Is that something he can improve on? What is the prognosis for Boban?
    There is no need to critique garbage time PnR defense b/c the other players aren't doing their jobs & Pop isn't calling defensive set so they are just out there freestyling. Boban's job is to score a bucket for each point he concedes & not let the 3rd stringers eat into the 20 pt cushions, he's one of the main reasons for the historic point differential.

  2. #52
    Believe. steeledl's Avatar
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    Doesn't have the tools to change? Seriously? What the do you know about his "tools"? You do realize that he's played a grand total of 270 minutes? (That's less than Rasuel Butler has played, and we all feel like we've barely seen him.) After 270 minutes, watching on television, you've been able to determine that he doesn't have the tools to change? You really should be an NBA scout.

    BTW - his DRTG is 92, which is the best on the team. Yeah, he hasn't been in against starters. But he's been in against the same opponents that the rest of the bench guys have been playing against. And none of them have a 92 DRTG. Your "first guess" was just that... a ing guess.
    He is obviously an NBA player...... But the Spurs have much higher standards and expectations defensively than he can ever become. You can't teach what he doesn't have ..... But go on and out DRtg against garbage compe ion .


    the league has changed and it is unforgiving of slow big men.

  3. #53
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    He is obviously an NBA player...... But the Spurs have much higher standards and expectations defensively than he can ever become. You can't teach what he doesn't have ..... But go on and out DRtg against garbage compe ion .


    the league has changed and it is unforgiving of slow big men.
    You still have yet to say what he doesn't have. Repeating yourself like an idiot is fun I guess.

  4. #54
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    I share the concern about his help defense.

  5. #55
    HTTR Ditty's Avatar
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    I think he will be fine. I've noticed also that his defense doesn't look as effective as it was earlier in the season. He seems a little slower also recently (dealing with some type of injury?) I think he can be a nice rotational player in the league for the right price when he continues getting comfortable with the NBA speed.

  6. #56
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    I'm thinking last night Dallas penetrators Felton and Parsons getting into the lane, Boban rotating, and shots getting blocked or desperation scoop shot rainbows. He is still routinely beating his opponent down the floor on both ends.

    About the only thing I don't like him doing is switching on pnr but outside of Bosh I can think of very few NBA 5's that can pull that off. It's why for example we zone up with ICE with Duncan.

    This is what I am talking about when I say speaking to basketball as its played on the court. It's like you (guys) don't even watch the game.

  7. #57
    Believe. steeledl's Avatar
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    You still have yet to say what he doesn't have. Repeating yourself like an idiot is fun I guess.
    The last sentence should get you started in figuring it out.......... If you can't figure out the rest by simply watching games then you should stop, tbh.

  8. #58
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    It really depends. He can be a valuable of the guy bench..

    Its all about the money. Just like cojo or belli..its about the money

  9. #59
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    The last sentence should get you started in figuring it out.......... If you can't figure out the rest by simply watching games then you should stop, tbh.
    Saying the league isn't forgiving is not discussing how the game is actually played. It's a gross generalization that appeals to emotion and not sense. Before that you bring up drtg which furthers my point. Your problem is that I understand statistical evidence and how the game is played.

    Marc Gasol is about as athletic as Boban and he was 1st team all-nba last season. Cognitive dissonance is a .

  10. #60
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    There is no need to critique garbage time PnR defense b/c the other players aren't doing their jobs & Pop isn't calling defensive set so they are just out there freestyling. Boban's job is to score a bucket for each point he concedes & not let the 3rd stringers eat into the 20 pt cushions, he's one of the main reasons for the historic point differential.
    I disagree with that. I think Pop expects everyone to work on their games in garbage time, specially because in this crew there are talented rotational players being developed who would have really played more minutes if not for our deep bench. But I will concede that it is tough to get too much from the 4th Q alone.

    I do hope Boban is a keeper. I have been in his camp, his church, temple and congregation. I just have started to temper my expectations bc he is out of position a lot. Frankly I would not have him way out in the perimeter guarding anyone, just let him give everyone space, and hang back. TD is the best for training Boban, bc he's not as mobile himself either, but TD is uncanny making super quick reads, and anticipating. You can't surprise TD, he has an awareness of those around him, and he's vocal. Obviously Boban is not on that level, so his lack of ability to recover into plays or help in a timely fashion is trouble.

  11. #61
    Believe. steeledl's Avatar
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    Marc Gasol is about as athletic as Boban and he was 1st team all-nba last season. Cognitive dissonance is a .


    Wut.................... Typical unreasonable Spurs fan. You see the world black and silver. That's okay it just leads to outlandish positive points of view .

  12. #62
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    Wut.................... Typical unreasonable Spurs fan. You see the world black and silver. That's okay it just leads to outlandish positive points of view .
    And again he doesn't address any actual argument.

    Marc Gasol the similarly sized C for the Memphis Grizzlie is the in bent 1st team All-NBA C. Boban has similar athleticism in terms of speed, quickness, and strength. You are claiming that he is missing something and you cannot articulate anything other than insipid unfounded generalizations.

  13. #63
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    Comparing him to the typical US prospect when the European progression is obviously different is fun particularly in this particular instance. Your knowledge of statistics is basically arithmetic
    This is an example of a pair of empty sentences. They aren't asserting anything, and they provide no support.

    Qualitatively I have never seen you talk about basketball as it's played on the court. Instead we get these dressed up opinions presented as fact.
    Pretty empty here. Your attack is that I don't lead all of my opinions with "In my opinion,". That's just a stupid critique. I don't remember the last time you did that to your opinions, so I don't see why you want to mention when others don't do it.

    You dropped my argument about similar prospects who came over like Baynes and Splitter both of whom he is starting out better than.
    Lol at "You dropped my argument," like this is a high-school debate. First, that's clearly just an opinion, and it's not even coded as such. Secondly, he's not better than Splitter was his first year, nor is he better than Splitter was at 27. He's probably a better scorer (note, this is my opinion), and he has better stats. But he's not as mobile, and he also doesn't cut as well on PnR. So right now, Boban's slowing down the offense. And I don't think it's simply familiarity. He's not going to get faster or more agile. As he gets better, the league will adjust to defending him. So I'm not all that keen to project him as being significantly improved this time next year.

    I can't believe you tried to push per-36 stats for a garbage-time player as though they aren't deeply flawed. That's completely disingenuous and doesn't warrant further comment.

  14. #64
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    This is an example of a pair of empty sentences. They aren't asserting anything, and they provide no support.



    Pretty empty here. Your attack is that I don't lead all of my opinions with "In my opinion,". That's just a stupid critique. I don't remember the last time you did that to your opinions, so I don't see why you want to mention when others don't do it.



    Lol at "You dropped my argument," like this is a high-school debate. First, that's clearly just an opinion, and it's not even coded as such. Secondly, he's not better than Splitter was his first year, nor is he better than Splitter was at 27. He's probably a better scorer (note, this is my opinion), and he has better stats. But he's not as mobile, and he also doesn't cut as well on PnR. So right now, Boban's slowing down the offense. And I don't think it's simply familiarity. He's not going to get faster or more agile. As he gets better, the league will adjust to defending him. So I'm not all that keen to project him as being significantly improved this time next year.

    I can't believe you tried to push per-36 stats for a garbage-time player as though they aren't deeply flawed. That's completely disingenuous and doesn't warrant further comment.
    I support my opinions with facts. You just grandstand and wave your hands over generalizations.

    Give one credible metric for your claims on his foot speed. I have watched him beat opposing big men down the court from moment he signed on.

    He has an issue with timing, angles, spacing, and the like. He has the bone bruise in autumn and could not participate in TC practices so that makes sense. When he first started playing they only ran the basic motion with him on the court and he would fumble around between the slot and high post as the ball swung around. He has gotten better in that set and they started running horns with him as well as other looks.

    Of course the league will adjust as will Boban. You have no idea what those adjustments will be so it's amusing that you would claim certainty. This is exactly what I am talking about. You can try your "I know you are but what I am" routine all you like. You still use half-assed statistical analysis, gratuitous generalizations and cannot talk about how the game is played on the floor.

    As for the per 36, of course his efficiency will go down but its sky high as it is. I'm not going to say that he is really a 24/15 guy but even 10/7 guys are a scarcity in this league.

  15. #65
    Damn You Commies T Park's Avatar
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    And again he doesn't address any actual argument.

    Marc Gasol the similarly sized C for the Memphis Grizzlie is the in bent 1st team All-NBA C. Boban has similar athleticism in terms of speed, quickness, and strength. You are claiming that he is missing something and you cannot articulate anything other than insipid unfounded generalizations.

    Going to respectfully disagree......

  16. #66
    Believe.
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    Is he good enough to be your 5th big? High probability.

    Is he good enough to mold your offense (spam Boban post ups) and defense (PnR coverage) around him in a second unit? Low-moderate probablility.

    Is he good enough when you aren't molding your offense and defense around him to be your backup C? Moderate probability.

    My guess is that Pop is confident in the first, dubious about the second, and trying to figure out the third.

  17. #67
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    And the notion that players that come over from Europe are going to progress differently than typical prospects is not empty. Your blanket dismissal certainly is.

    We have two empirical examples of what i am talking aobut within the Spurs organization in Splitter and Baynes.

  18. #68
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    Going to respectfully disagree......
    With what?

  19. #69
    Believe. steeledl's Avatar
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    And again he doesn't address any actual argument.

    Marc Gasol the similarly sized C for the Memphis Grizzlie is the in bent 1st team All-NBA C. Boban has similar athleticism in terms of speed, quickness, and strength. You are claiming that he is missing something and you cannot articulate anything other than insipid unfounded generalizations.
    you make no argument . You are a moron who's basis an argument on faulty assumptions

  20. #70
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    you make no argument . You are a moron who's basis an argument on faulty assumptions
    word of the day: irony

  21. #71
    Believe. steeledl's Avatar
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    Lol this s hopeless if he thinks "foot speed", in this instance, means sprinting down the court. This dude looks like his feet have bricks weighing him down when he trys to move from side to side, guard the pick and roll, or get to spots defensively...... Hints constantly getting put on posters.

  22. #72
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    Lol this s hopeless if he thinks "foot speed", in this instance, means sprinting down the court. This dude looks like his feet have bricks weighing him down when he trys to move from side to side, guard the pick and roll, or get to spots defensively...... Hints constantly getting put on posters.
    nice strawman.

    He's been asked to switch on pnr and had issues. I already addressed this simpleton. Do you need me to quote it or do you think you can figure it out on your own?

  23. #73
    Believe.
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    He started the season looking like another premier find by RC Buford. Then he started to get dunked on, especially by other eastern european players ironically. Now he should be allowed the time to go back to the drawing board and adjust. Could be that his early success made him too big for his britches and thought it was going to be easier than it really was. Could be watching tape of him exposed his weakness. Im going to wait to see if he readjusts before I make up my mind. If I had to I would say his offense is going to be there but his defense may only be good in certain situations as in centers who only play down low.

  24. #74
    Millennial Messiah UNT Eagles 2016's Avatar
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    So OP is concerned with Boban who had 7pts, 7reb on 2-3 shooting, but not fathead who laid another egg and ended up with an impressive 1-5 shooting performance?
    Would you put down your wife if she played in the WNBA and only shot 1-5? No.........you'd be ecstatic about the one she made and would make sure everyone else under the sun heard about everything else she did right. Let's get some perspective here.

  25. #75
    The Boognish FuzzyLumpkins's Avatar
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    He started the season looking like another premier find by RC Buford. Then he started to get dunked on, especially by other eastern european players ironically. Now he should be allowed the time to go back to the drawing board and adjust. Could be that his early success made him too big for his britches and thought it was going to be easier than it really was. Could be watching tape of him exposed his weakness. Im going to wait to see if he readjusts before I make up my mind. If I had to I would say his offense is going to be there but his defense may only be good in certain situations as in centers who only play down low.
    I actually think it's amusing how hard the opposition goes at him. They act like they accomplished something when they do it, that's for sure.

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