Magic was the best player on the floor. He orchestrated the offense and was the best player on defense. The 1st option doesn't mean who takes the most shots. In 2014, Duncan was the best player on the floor.
Stats via Basketball Reference.
Mo Williams wasn't on the '07 Cavs, buddy. I believe the two PG's were Boobie Gibson and Damion Jones.
Your overall point is still valid, though. That '07 Cavs team was bad, yet LBJ willed them to a Finals appearance based on his greatness alone.
I had to ctrl+F those numbers and it looks like you cited the 81-82 season not 79-80.
If we're looking at Playoff numbers for their first championships:
Kawhi: 119 ORtg 101 DRtg (+18) | .191 WS/48 | 23.1 PP100 51.0 FG%
TD: 110 ORtg 92 DRtg (+18) | .243 WS/48 | 30.3 PP100 51.1 FG%
Magic: 117 ORtg 100 DRtg (+17) | .203 WS/48 | 20.9 PP100 51.8 FG%
Bird: 109 ORtg 95 DRtg (+14) | .198 WS/48 | 24.9 PP100 47.0 FG%
Kobe: 107 ORtg 107 DRtg (0) | .115 WS/48 | 28.9 PP100 44.2 FG%
Kawhi fits with TD (although he's head and shoulders above the rest), Magic, and Bird a lot better than Kobe does.
Kawhi: Hey, look at me everybody, I'm good!
Durant: Hey, you da man Kawhi! Hey, look everybody, Kawhi won himself another regular season award!!!
Lebron: You da real king of the regular season Kawhi!
Westbrook: Damn man, you're special! They should call you super nova Leonard! Did you really make that 15-footer against the T-Wolves with your eyes closed?
Kawhi: Yep, that was me.
Kyrie: Damn , you got it all going on.
Love: Can we be friends?
Kawhi: Aww gee, thank guys. All that hard work is really starting to pay off. I think I'm going to pat myself on the back.
Durant: Yeah, well, wish I could stay and chat but ya know, playoffs are starting and well you know, I got to prepare and things but, hey, enjoy the offseason. Training camp starts 5 months.
Kawhi: playoffs? oh yeah, right. Well, oh, gee, sounds like fun. But, I'm going to have fun too. I'm gonna go home and invite over my baby's mamma and, and, and I've got these board games Candy Land and Yahtzee and, and we'll watch some movies... Have you ever seen the Hottie and the Nottie starring Paris Hilton??? Oh were--
Janitor: Hey, Kawhi, stop staring at your DPOY award and look up, Durant's gone.
Kawhi: I know. I just wanted to feel special.
Janitor: You are special Kawhi. The regular season is yours to own man and nobody can take that away from you. Now, are you gonna set aside that award and hold the dustpan still or am I going to have to do everything myself?
More Hoops' butt hurt replies
Last edited by YGWHI; 05-27-2016 at 02:34 AM.
That isn't how ORtg and DRtg are meant to be used. That's pure manipulation of stats. Though, that was clever.I said Magic at age 22 so that would be the numbers from his 81-82 season. You must be sipping acid if you think he was heads and shoulders above Magic and Bird. Not even the stats you manipulated show that.
Last edited by Hoops Czar; 05-27-2016 at 02:52 AM.
Probably nobody, but most complete player doesn't equal best player.
"Why is this so hard to understand?" This thread is about him making NBA ALL First team and that's how he gets it.
Are you saying Tim Duncan wasn't head and shoulders above Magic and Bird? The stats would certainly indicate that.That isn't how ORtg and DRtg are meant to be used. That's pure manipulation of stats. Though, that was clever.
And yes ORtg - DRtg = NetRtg but I guess that's some voodoo manipulation.
Anyways this entire argument is absurd, we're seriously comparing Kawhi to some of the best players to ever play in the NBA. As if it would be an insult to not be as good as them.
Correct. Tim Duncan at age 22 was not head & shoulders above Bird (24) and Magic (22).Are you saying Tim Duncan wasn't head and shoulders above Magic and Bird? The stats would certainly indicate that.
And yes ORtg - DRtg = NetRtg but I guess that's some voodoo manipulation.
Enes Kanter 2016 playoffs
ORtg 126 DRtg 105 (+21) WS/48 .226
I guess Kanter is head and shoulders above all of them.
The Spurs were also a much better defensive team than the '82 Lakers so the Drtg is going to be way off. Drtg isn't an accurate measure of one's individual defense.
Last edited by Hoops Czar; 05-27-2016 at 03:45 AM.
We'll just have to agree to disagree. imo the Celtics and Lakers had more talent and support around Bird and Magic than Timmy had.
3 people voted LMA for first team at forward ahead of either LBJ, Kawhi and Durant? What were they thinking? Glad LMA made the All-NBA team with us, I think he'll be a monster next season. Well deserved for both.
Durant has improved plenty on defense ...
Actually, I'm exactly smart enough to realize that those things don't mean he's the second best player in the league, which is why I stated precisely that for the benefit of those comparing him to Hakeem, Jordan, Duncan, Magic and Bird.
Pop has been pushing that angle for a year now. He believes hes that good of a player and so do I. Considering weve been right about him being a superstar level player since 13 and Pop in 12..Id stick to that.Actually, I'm exactly smart enough to realize that those things don't mean he's the second best player in the league, which is why I stated precisely that for the benefit of those comparing him to Hakeem, Jordan, Duncan, Magic and Bird.
It's not about opportunity, so much as it is about him not being the prototypical top five player. He's just not the creator a James or even Durant is and he also can't consistently get to the line.
He can and likely will make incremental improvement in these areas, but if they're to win a championship with him as the best player, it's going to have to be somewhat akin to '14.
I've been saying for a year and half that the offense, while still indisputably efficient, is no longer explosive.
Hoops, you have too much time on your hands to write that typa up...sad.
read the post - IT SAYS AT 24.
Pop doesn't believe he's that good. Pop believes he CAN be that good, and that's why he's treating him as such. I think that's a good way to nurture the growth of a talented and constantly-improving player. Kawhi is amazing. He's just not Lebron or KD yet. Not sure why so many Spurs fans are offended by that reality.
Durant has been an elite defender since he came into the league. But only when he decides to be.
Durant was robbed, 'nuff said. Leonard is way overrated on offense and even on defense as a man defender. He's the best guy on the globe at getting interceptions but a complete cornerback denies his man positive plays rather than merely going for showy stats of his own. Kawhi is more of a risk-taking cornerback, or a very good strong safety. Danny Green is more of a complete cornerback.
Briefly took you off ignore to see if you had anything useful to say.
And you don't. KL is not Iverson or CP3 gambling to get steals.
The thing I don't understand about KL is that he has GREAT defensive instincts, but is inept from an offensive standpoint. I fail to see how he can continue to NOT MAKE PLAYS when it matters on the offensive end. Athletically, he's like Lebron, if he wants to get to the rim, he can, but he chooses not to.
The sad part is at 24 he should be over the "it needs to look good" phase and into the "2 points is 2 points" on the brink of "I need to draw a foul/I want the defense to do this so I'll" and he's no where near this.
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