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  1. #26
    Real Warrior Warlord23's Avatar
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    A solution based fully on private insurance is only suitable for markets where the customer has the option of walking away from the deal. Unfortunately healthcare is not one of those markets, because a person's (or their loved one's) life is the single most important thing for them. If you had great health insurance via your job, then went to the individual market after losing the job, and insurance companies refuse to cover you because you are not a profitable customer, you're ed in a way that's very different from having to give up a car that got totalled.

    When 60% of individual bankruptcies are due to medical bills, and when the US has been dead last among developed countries in healthcare affordability, quality and access - and all this has stayed constant pre and post ACA, you know that a single payer solution for the essentials is the only way out.

  2. #27
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    LOLeftist Logic Fallacy: It is NOT OK to kill babies if we can force them into unwanted, piss-poor quality insurance to add a few more pennies into our Partner's coffers. It IS OK to kill babies SECONDS before they are delivered and it IS OK TO DEMAND OTHERS PAY FOR IT.

    Love how you can use what you deem as "disposable commodities" to fit your narrative at every turn. Just turn down the hypocrisy just a notch or two so you can border on re ed instead of clinically brain dead.
    Chucho, go back to MX, can you swim? and take your ignorance with you.

  3. #28
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    Everyone values their self worth in the US too much to accept a single payer when it doesn't cost them anything. I have an in-law on medicare that was diagnosed with a clearly incurable and highly aggressive brain cancer. Medicare must have spent hundreds of thousands so far resulting in a horrendous quality of life for him trying to "fight the good fight against the cancer". Single payer could and should inevitably have "death panels".

    Y'all ready for that?

  4. #29
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    Everyone values their self worth in the US too much to accept a single payer when it doesn't cost them anything. I have an in-law on medicare that was diagnosed with a clearly incurable and highly aggressive brain cancer. Medicare must have spent hundreds of thousands so far resulting in a horrendous quality of life for him trying to "fight the good fight against the cancer". Single payer could and should inevitably have "death panels".
    You are totally full of bull .

    We don't have single-payer because BigInsurance/BigMedicine has rigged the system and corrupted politicians

    There's plenty of end-of-life scamming by outside of Medicare to suck down $Bs in hopeless care behind the bull of "we must do everything to save a life". $100K/year for cancer drugs, gives you 2 or 3 VERY ty months more to live. Happens EVERY ing day.

    BigInsurance has been operatring DeathPanels for decades until ACA came along.

  5. #30
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    A solution based fully on private insurance is only suitable for markets where the customer has the option of walking away from the deal. Unfortunately healthcare is not one of those markets, because a person's (or their loved one's) life is the single most important thing for them. If you had great health insurance via your job, then went to the individual market after losing the job, and insurance companies refuse to cover you because you are not a profitable customer, you're ed in a way that's very different from having to give up a car that got totalled.

    When 60% of individual bankruptcies are due to medical bills, and when the US has been dead last among developed countries in healthcare affordability, quality and access - and all this has stayed constant pre and post ACA, you know that a single payer solution for the essentials is the only way out.
    As I understand Ryan's ACA replacement, I think as long as you maintain continuous coverage via employer sponsored healthcare (or COBRA), your "rating" wouldn't change and insurance companies would not be able to refuse/price you out. I think it's that way now with employer sponsored and COBRA healthcare and they (Congress) would add private insurance to be the same.

  6. #31
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    As I understand Ryan's ACA replacement, I think as long as you maintain continuous coverage via employer sponsored healthcare (or COBRA), your "rating" wouldn't change and insurance companies would not be able to refuse/price you out. I think it's that way now with employer sponsored and COBRA healthcare and they (Congress) would add private insurance to be the same.
    that "continuous coverage" angle is only to stop people from signing up only when they get sick.

    RyanCare doesn't appear to include "buy insurance or get penalized", so RyanCare STARTS OFF in a death spiral.

  7. #32
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    and Ryan plans to kill Medicare and ACA and roll all his victims into RyanCare

    =================

    Republicans hope to repeal Medicare — the single-payer system that most seniors rely on to cover their health costs — and replace it with a voucher.

    This voucher will cover some of the cost of inferior coverage that will leave seniors with higher out-of-pocket costs than they would have paid under traditional Medicare.

    As a bonus, the total cost of paying for an individual senior’s care — that is, the government’s share of the costs plus the individual’s share — could rise as much as 40 percent.

    it’s impossible to know exactly how much more seniors will pay for inferior health coverage under the Republican Medicare plan, because Paul Ryan hasn’t exactly been forthcoming with figures like how much the vouchers will be worth or how much he expects his proposal to cost. In 2011, however, Ryan did provide enough information to allow researchers at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities to calculate how much costs would increase for seniors. Their conclusion was grim.

    There are two reasons why moving more seniors into private health plans will jack up the overall cost of care. One is that private insurers simply have far more administrative costs than a government plan. The other is that traditional Medicare has far more power to bargain down health costs than private insurers.

    https://thinkprogress.org/the-republican-medicare-plan-is-an-atrocity-315e16ebbe0f#.w2ubh25sw

  8. #33
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    and Ryan plans to kill Medicare and ACA and roll all his victims into RyanCare

    =================

    Republicans hope to repeal Medicare — the single-payer system that most seniors rely on to cover their health costs — and replace it with a voucher.

    This voucher will cover some of the cost of inferior coverage that will leave seniors with higher out-of-pocket costs than they would have paid under traditional Medicare.

    As a bonus, the total cost of paying for an individual senior’s care — that is, the government’s share of the costs plus the individual’s share — could rise as much as 40 percent.

    it’s impossible to know exactly how much more seniors will pay for inferior health coverage under the Republican Medicare plan, because Paul Ryan hasn’t exactly been forthcoming with figures like how much the vouchers will be worth or how much he expects his proposal to cost. In 2011, however, Ryan did provide enough information to allow researchers at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities to calculate how much costs would increase for seniors. Their conclusion was grim.

    There are two reasons why moving more seniors into private health plans will jack up the overall cost of care. One is that private insurers simply have far more administrative costs than a government plan. The other is that traditional Medicare has far more power to bargain down health costs than private insurers.

    https://thinkprogress.org/the-republican-medicare-plan-is-an-atrocity-315e16ebbe0f#.w2ubh25sw
    In other words, you and think progress are just making up.

  9. #34
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    In other words, you and think progress are just making up.
    nope, Ryan's bull plans are full of "magic asterisks" and short on numbers. iow, he's full of Ayn Rand's .

  10. #35
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    nope, Ryan's bull plans are full of "magic asterisks" and short on numbers. iow, he's full of Ayn Rand's .
    WAS being the operable word. Last I checked Ryan wasn't President.

  11. #36
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    WAS being the operable word. Last I checked Ryan wasn't President.
    Don The Con ain't gonna write RyanCare, he's just gonna sign it, eyes and brain closed. His priority in self-aggrandizement and self-enrichment.

  12. #37
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    Don The Con ain't gonna write RyanCare, he's just gonna sign it, eyes and brain closed. His priority in self-aggrandizement and self-enrichment.
    Burqa-Deaux the omnipotent prurient fortune teller.

  13. #38
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    Burqa-Deaux the omnipotent prurient fortune teller.
    my predictions are a ton better than yours, but still just predictions.

    Trash doesn't GIVE A FLYING about his voters, and neither do the Repugs.

  14. #39
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    my predictions are a ton better than yours, but still just predictions.

    Trash doesn't GIVE A FLYING about his voters, and neither do the Repugs.
    and you thought Hillary did?

  15. #40
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    and you thought Hillary did?
    again, your defense is "my Trash is just as bad Hillary".

  16. #41
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    ObamaCare’s Medicaid expansion launched less than three years ago, but states have already signed up more able-bodied adults than they ever expected to enroll. Many states have even enrolled more people than they thought would ever even be eligible.

    This welfare explosion threatens state funding for public safety, education, infrastructure, and programs for the truly needy. It also increases upward pressure on Congress to act swiftly and repeal the failed law.

    In a study published Nov. 16 led “ObamaCare Expansion Enrollment is Shattering Projections,” we found that states have now enrolled more able-bodied adults than they said would ever enroll. And not just slightly — in fact, states have enrolled more than twice as many adults as they expected to ever enroll, at any point in the future.
    While some on the left will no doubt point to this enrollment explosion as a sign of immense success, in reality, the explosion has disastrous ramifications for states, taxpayers, and the most vulnerable among us.

    Nationwide, nearly 600,000 seniors, children with developmental disabilities, and other needy individuals are on Medicaid waiting lists for community-based services. Some of them have been waiting for more than a decade. Many will pass away before ever receiving the services they desperately need. Instead of providing relief to these truly needy individuals, ObamaCare’s expansion moves able-bodied adults to the front of the line. And every penny that’s spent to prop up this welfare expansion is a penny that can’t go to helping the vulnerable.

    This new ObamaCare reality is already setting in, particularly in Arkansas. There, since the state chose to expand Medicaid to able-bodied adults, 79 members of the waiting list have died and 700 more truly needy individuals are now on the list.

    One of those waiting is Skylar Overman, a 10-year-old Arkansas girl with a rare neurological condition. She’s spent nearly her entire life on a waiting list to get the specialized care she needs. And while nearly 3,000 needy Arkansans like Skylar are left waiting, the state has enrolled roughly 325,000 able-bodied adults in their expansion, moving them to the front of the line.

    http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blo...-story-socials

  17. #42
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    Let them suffer and die, or "Just Go To The Emergency Room".

    America is the most ed up, inhumane country of all the developed countries.

  18. #43
    Veteran Th'Pusher's Avatar
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    ObamaCare’s Medicaid expansion launched less than three years ago, but states have already signed up more able-bodied adults than they ever expected to enroll. Many states have even enrolled more people than they thought would ever even be eligible.

    This welfare explosion threatens state funding for public safety, education, infrastructure, and programs for the truly needy. It also increases upward pressure on Congress to act swiftly and repeal the failed law.

    In a study published Nov. 16 led “ObamaCare Expansion Enrollment is Shattering Projections,” we found that states have now enrolled more able-bodied adults than they said would ever enroll. And not just slightly — in fact, states have enrolled more than twice as many adults as they expected to ever enroll, at any point in the future.
    While some on the left will no doubt point to this enrollment explosion as a sign of immense success, in reality, the explosion has disastrous ramifications for states, taxpayers, and the most vulnerable among us.

    Nationwide, nearly 600,000 seniors, children with developmental disabilities, and other needy individuals are on Medicaid waiting lists for community-based services. Some of them have been waiting for more than a decade. Many will pass away before ever receiving the services they desperately need. Instead of providing relief to these truly needy individuals, ObamaCare’s expansion moves able-bodied adults to the front of the line. And every penny that’s spent to prop up this welfare expansion is a penny that can’t go to helping the vulnerable.

    This new ObamaCare reality is already setting in, particularly in Arkansas. There, since the state chose to expand Medicaid to able-bodied adults, 79 members of the waiting list have died and 700 more truly needy individuals are now on the list.

    One of those waiting is Skylar Overman, a 10-year-old Arkansas girl with a rare neurological condition. She’s spent nearly her entire life on a waiting list to get the specialized care she needs. And while nearly 3,000 needy Arkansans like Skylar are left waiting, the state has enrolled roughly 325,000 able-bodied adults in their expansion, moving them to the front of the line.

    http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blo...-story-socials
    How are these people being moved to the front of the line? If people are waiting for specialized care how is enrolling new people on Medicaid affecting the existing Medicaid enrollees' wait?

  19. #44
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    "79 members of the waiting list have died and 700 more truly needy individuals are now on the list"

    doesn't explain how Medicaid expansion was the exclusive cause, but no problem, it's a hit piece.

    Did doctors, clinics, hospitals refused to treat Medicaid patients because they couldn't make their standard exorbitant profit?

    maybe Aransas' taxes are too low to finance taxpayer funded clinics, hospitals? Or maybe it's just a slave state stuck in the 19th century?

    the real problem is fleecing of Americans by for-profit medical care, which is blindly, reflexively cheered on by RMT



  20. #45
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    Let them suffer and die, or "Just Go To The Emergency Room".

    America is the most ed up, inhumane country of all the developed countries.
    350 million people. Only 1 other 1st world country in the top 10 populated countries; Japan with 100 million.

    It's simple correlation of proportion. We are 2.5 times bigger than the next closest 1st world country.

    It really, really is that simple as to "why" we can't.

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