Kings: About the 2002 WCF

[lefty]

Yes the officiating in game 6 was horrible, but people keep forgrtting that :

- in the last minutes of game 5, the Lakers were blatantly robbed by the refs

- in game 4 the Kings allowed L.A to make a comeback and that idiot Divac had to tap the ball to the wrong guy

- in game 7, at home, Sacramento missed tons of FT's and Peja airballed an open 3

Yes Sacramento had the better team but the Lakers won fair and square

[Mark Celibate]

I'm on the "who gives a about this series?" bandwagon as well. Game 6 is extremely overrated in terms of poor officiating. Yeah, there were some questionable calls against the Kings, but I watched the entire game on YouTube years ago when this first came out and I was younger with more free time. I didn't see anything outwardly egregious. You also have to understand that the Kings were one of the all time whiniest teams ever. They were so outwardly demonstrative against any questionable call against them. The series before when they played Dallas, they were whining/crying after every call too and the commentators were calling them out on it. They just looked like mentally weak babies and it showed when they played an experienced LA team.

And of course we have game 7, where only one guy on Sacramento wanted the ball in crunch time.

While Kobe/Shaq were the superstars, guys like Rick Fox, Derek Fisher, and Horry had no problem taking big shots when the first two were double teamed.

[lefty]

- Bibby was a clutch mofo...his teammates not so much

- Adelman is a good coach, but playing Peja (who was coming back from an injury) in favor of Hedo (who was playing well) was re ed

[dfens]

imo people really underrate the reason why the 00s lakers were such a great comeback team. People overvalue kobe (clutch in the 4th) over the real value of having an entire frontcourt at the limit of fouling out in the 4th (shaq over an entire game), which obviously makes things much easier for the LA offense.

[dfens]

- Bibby was a clutch mofo...his teammates not so much

- Adelman is a good coach, but playing Peja (who was coming back from an injury) in favor of Hedo (who was playing well) was re ed

[Clipper Nation]

If the Lakers had Vince, T-Mac, AI, Kidd, or even Pierce instead of the cancer that year, they win that series in 4 or 5 games easily, tbh. Kobe choked multiple games away with 9-21, 8-24, 11-29 shooting nights.

[Kyle Orton]

Peja with the 9 years later redemption tbh

[lefty]

If the Lakers had Vince, T-Mac, AI, Kidd, or even Pierce instead of the cancer that year, they win that series in 4 or 5 games easily, tbh. Kobe choked multiple games away with 9-21, 8-24, 11-29 shooting nights.

In game 4, historically clutch Horry wins the game at buzzer

In the very next game, Choke-Webb leaves Horry wide open, same EXACT SAME SPOT, to help on Kobe but the latter ignores him and prefers ro take the tough contested shot

[Dex]

Getting screwed in one game can happen to any team in any series...and the Kings definitely were screwed in Game 6.

That doesn't explain their other 3 losses. And that's exactly why NBA isn't single-elimination.

Same thing goes for Spurs in 2004 and 2008, tbh.

[Clipper Nation]

In game 4, historically clutch Horry wins the game at buzzer

In the very next game, Choke-Webb leaves Horry wide open, same EXACT SAME SPOT, to help on Kobe but the latter ignores him and prefers ro take the tough contested shot

Just Kobe being Kobe. A selfish, cancerous choke artist. He was the Queens' MVP that series.

[Venti Quattro]

The officiating wasn't terrible in Game 6. The Lakers had a 9 FTA advantage if you don't factor in the +6 FTA that they got from the late-game fouling of the Kings (to stop the clock and hope the Lakers miss). Could you imagine the referees only giving LA only a 9 FTA advantage in a game the NBA absolutely planned to rig in favour of LA? David Stern should have fired the officiating crew after Game 6 because they did their jobs very poorly.

Meanwhile, the Lakers got absolutely hosed in Game 5. In that series, the Kings didn't win a game wherein they didn't have a double-digit free throw advantage over LA.

Chris Webber shot around 45% from the free throw line for the entire series. Not just one game. He averaged that in a conference finals. A career 65% shot 45% from the line!!! In a playoff series!!! In game 7, the Kings shot 16-30 from the line.

Shaq shot a little over 60% from the line in that series.

[Mark Celibate]

Getting screwed in one game can happen to any team in any series...and the Kings definitely were screwed in Game 6.

That doesn't explain their other 3 losses. And that's exactly why NBA isn't single-elimination.

Same thing goes for Spurs in 2004 and 2008, tbh.

That's a good point and I only remember two bad calls against the Kings in the fourth quarter of game 6 (the quarter in which the "rigging" took place). One where they called a phantom foul on either Vlade/Pollard when guarding Shaq and another where Kobe elbowed Bibby in the face off the ball (which was pretty bang bang). That's nowhere close to even justify a rigging IMO, it's only talked about because of Donaghy.

AGain, the Kings were the biggest bunch of babies I've ever seen as an NBA team and they made every call look much worse than it was by overreacting. Back when I watched the tape, I remember some got on their team was rolling around on the ground after getting called for a clear foul.

[ambchang]

The officiating wasn't terrible in Game 6. The Lakers had a 9 FTA advantage if you don't factor in the +6 FTA that they got from the late-game fouling of the Kings (to stop the clock and hope the Lakers miss). Could you imagine the referees only giving LA only a 9 FTA advantage in a game the NBA absolutely planned to rig in favour of LA? David Stern should have fired the officiating crew after Game 6 because they did their jobs very poorly.

Meanwhile, the Lakers got absolutely hosed in Game 5. In that series, the Kings didn't win a game wherein they didn't have a double-digit free throw advantage over LA.

Chris Webber shot around 45% from the free throw line for the entire series. Not just one game. He averaged that in a conference finals. A career 65% shot 45% from the line!!! In a playoff series!!! In game 7, the Kings shot 16-30 from the line.

Shaq shot a little over 60% from the line in that series.

This is a horrible take even for a Laker fan. First off,the Lakers had a +15 FTA advantage over the Kings in Game 6, don't try to rationalize the late game FTA because Kobe got FTs from elbowing Bibby in the face. 2nd, the Lakers had something like 25 FTA in the fourth quarter alone. Third, while the Kings and Lakers shoot about the same amount of FTs throughout the year, the Kings foul a LOT less. In fact, the Kings allowed 4 less FTA per game in the regular season. The Kings simply do not foul that much because they do not want to bog down the pace. That was by design, and the fact that the Lakers shot 40 FTAs in a game, is quite alarming. In 82 games, the Kings allowed 40 or more FTAs exactly ZERO times, and only once in the playoffs (that's the Game 6).

At the same time, the Kings shot 25 or less FTA in the regular season a little less than half the time in the regular season, and only 4 out of the 16 games (25%) in the playoffs. Just going by numbers alone will tell you that that game was an anomaly. In Game 5, the Kings shot 10 more FTA and the Lakers were hosed, and yet in Game 6 the Lakers shot 15FTA and it wasn't terrible? I am not in the camp of looking at FTAs and determining whether a game was called fairly, but at least be consistent in your own argument. BTW, the Lakers have two guys who go to the line consistently, Shaq (who gets intentionally fouled a lot), and Kobe (he drives a lot), everybody else just shoot these wide open shots created by Shaq and rarely gets fouled. Where as the Kings have everyone as an offensive threat and every single player could be fouled many times in a game.

[Mark Celibate]

This is a horrible take even for a Laker fan. First off,the Lakers had a +15 FTA advantage over the Kings in Game 6, don't try to rationalize the late game FTA because Kobe got FTs from elbowing Bibby in the face. 2nd, the Lakers had something like 25 FTA in the fourth quarter alone. Third, while the Kings and Lakers shoot about the same amount of FTs throughout the year, the Kings foul a LOT less. In fact, the Kings allowed 4 less FTA per game in the regular season. The Kings simply do not foul that much because they do not want to bog down the pace. That was by design, and the fact that the Lakers shot 40 FTAs in a game, is quite alarming. In 82 games, the Kings allowed 40 or more FTAs exactly ZERO times, and only once in the playoffs (that's the Game 6).

At the same time, the Kings shot 25 or less FTA in the regular season a little less than half the time in the regular season, and only 4 out of the 16 games (25%) in the playoffs. Just going by numbers alone will tell you that that game was an anomaly. In Game 5, the Kings shot 10 more FTA and the Lakers were hosed, and yet in Game 6 the Lakers shot 15FTA and it wasn't terrible? I am not in the camp of looking at FTAs and determining whether a game was called fairly, but at least be consistent in your own argument. BTW, the Lakers have two guys who go to the line consistently, Shaq (who gets intentionally fouled a lot), and Kobe (he drives a lot), everybody else just shoot these wide open shots created by Shaq and rarely gets fouled. Where as the Kings have everyone as an offensive threat and every single player could be fouled many times in a game.

Just to play devil's advocate though, isn't that argument slightly flawed considering in the regular season, they're not playing Shaq every night so I think you'd expect that number to go up in a series against the Lakers, right?

[ambchang]

Just to play devil's advocate though, isn't that argument slightly flawed considering in the regular season, they're not playing Shaq every night so I think you'd expect that number to go up in a series against the Lakers, right?

But given the Lakers and Kings shoot similar number of FTs, and the Kings allow less, logic flows that the Kings should shoot more than the Lakers in a h2h.

[Caltex2]

Everyone talks about Game 6 and it was a royal screw job but few talk about Game 4. A royal screw job in its own right. There's even a YouTube do entary on it.

[LkrFan]

If the Lakers had Vince, T-Mac, AI, Kidd, or even Pierce instead of the cancer that year, they win that series in 4 or 5 games easily, tbh. Kobe choked multiple games away with 9-21, 8-24, 11-29 shooting nights.

How did Griffin shoot in the WCFs?

[Clipper Nation]

How did Griffin shoot in the WCFs?

Fewer bricks than Kobe

[Ghazi]

2006 Finals were still gay though IMO TBH

[daslicer]

Everyone talks about Game 6 and it was a royal screw job but few talk about Game 4. A royal screw job in its own right. There's even a YouTube do entary on it.

I'll never forget the refs counting that bs half court 3 by Samaki Walker at the buzzer to end the second quarter. That shot was a huge shot in the arm for the Lakers momentum wise. If instant replay existed back then there is no way that shot counts.

[Clipper Nation]

2006 Finals were still gay though IMO TBH

Agreed. The Spurs would have won it all that year if they weren't ed by the ref$ against Dallas.

[LkrFan]

Fewer bricks than Kobe

Yep!

[whitemamba]

Kings have never been the same since. Daddy, Kobe and Co. drove that franchise into the ground, similar to what dallas did to us tbh.

[Caltex2]

I'll never forget the refs counting that bs half court 3 by Samaki Walker at the buzzer to end the second quarter. That shot was a huge shot in the arm for the Lakers momentum wise. If instant replay existed back then there is no way that shot counts.

Scott Pollard was fouled out on some BS calls IIRC, holding his hands up. Just one of many things about that game. The NBA clearly wanted a 7-game series.

[Chris]

Agreed. The Spurs would have won it all that year if they weren't ed by the ref$ against Dallas.

Yep, couldn't look at Dirk sideways that series without him getting 2 freebies. Manu going full re didn't help. Then Duncan layed an egg in overtime. That Spurs team was loaded too