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  1. #451
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    You have a much different opinion of RC than I. He serves under Pop.
    Indeed I do, considering he drafted Ginobili, Giricek, Parker, Scola, Splitter, Hill, effectively Leonard, and Murray despite never having (nor trading for) a lottery pick.

  2. #452
    Veteran offset formation's Avatar
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    I don't think it is anything other than a gamble. But how far south has it gone with Pau? Always looking to re-loading with the over-the-hill players Pop prefers has a downside, too. Rudy has been a mixed bag. And Patty is grossly overpaid - with ripple-effect consequences for the roster that have been discussed ad nauseam here. Without a great on-court talent such as Kawhi, I believe the Spurs have begun their descent into mediocrity or worse under the present regime and its approach.

    Hey, I was raised on the Dallas Cowboys. Say what you will about the unceremonious dismissal of Tom Landry by Jerry Jones, however, it had been clear for a couple of seasons that he was beyond his expiration date. It happens to the best.
    What team gets more out of its players and possible targets each year than PATFO?

    Again, we are **easily** a 60 win team with Kawhi.

  3. #453
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    Indeed I do, considering he drafted Ginobili, Giricek, Parker, Scola, Splitter, Hill, effectively Leonard, and Murray despite never having (nor trading for) a lottery pick.
    I would add James Anderson to the list. He was off to an incredible start his rookie season, until he suffered a fractured foot and was never the same. Different takes on whether Leonard was the actual target. The jury is still out on Murray, but White has also shown promise. A list of the bad choices would be pretty lengthy, too. But that wasn't really my point. I don't know exactly how the Spurs FO functions, however, I doubt the picks are a result of RC's talent evaluations or even his decisions. Pop is his boss. The Spurs' FO has a very different org chart than other sports franchises.

  4. #454
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    I would add James Anderson to the list. He was off to an incredible start his rookie season, until he suffered a fractured foot and was never the same. Different takes on whether Leonard was the actual target. The jury is still out on Murray, but White has also shown promise. A list of the bad choices would be pretty lengthy, too. But that wasn't really my point. I don't know exactly how the Spurs FO functions, however, I doubt the picks are a result of RC's talent evaluations or even his decisions. Pop is his boss. The Spurs' FO has a very different org chart than other sports franchises.
    Mahinmi was one of Buford's worst picks and he's playing his tenth year in the league. You can't blame the injuries to Livio Jean Charles or Robertas Javtokas on Buford. Of course Leonard was the actual target, you think Pop's not going to throw a fit trading his favorite player for someone Buford didn't love? So why do you want to clear house on a front office that has shown tremendous ap ude in the draft in a period when the Spurs are going to depend entirely on the draft to rebuild the team? I don't want to go back to this team bungling the draft every year back in the 90s.

  5. #455
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    What team gets more out of its players and possible targets each year than PATFO?

    Again, we are **easily** a 60 win team with Kawhi.
    PATFO has had a core of 3 HOFers playing together on reasonable contracts longer than any team in the history of the modern NBA. That, coincidentally, is how the Dubs patterned themselves on the Spurs as much as their refinement of the Beautiful Game. The franchise is on the cusp of losing the last of that core in short order, and the cupboard is pretty bare sans Kawhi. Re-tooling year after year with some long-in-the-tooth vets chasing a ring worked when Tim, Tony and Manu anchored the team. When that core is gone - either physically or just owing to inability to really perform that method of re-tooling will not cut the mus . You have to have a continuous core to do that. Which players cons ute that kind of core if Kawhi is gone?

  6. #456
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  7. #457
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    Mahinmi was one of Buford's worst picks and he's playing his tenth year in the league. You can't blame the injuries to Livio Jean Charles or Robertas Javtokas on Buford. Of course Leonard was the actual target, you think Pop's not going to throw a fit trading his favorite player for someone Buford didn't love? So why do you want to clear house on a front office that has shown tremendous ap ude in the draft in a period when the Spurs are going to depend entirely on the draft to rebuild the team? I don't want to go back to this team bungling the draft every year back in the 90s.
    Yeah, I have often wished the Spurs could have benefitted from the Mahinmi pick. (As an aside, the reason we didn't was because Mahinmi suffered an injury that led to his inability to perform for the Spurs before they gave up on him...)

    My point, though, is that Pop didn't part with Hill because RC pulled the trigger over Pop's ultimate objection. Pop is RC's boss. But, please, you must admit that whatever success players drafted by PATFO have gone on to achieve in the NBA, they have not achieved it in a Spurs uniform, and our current crop of youngsters are a mixed bag at this point. The cupboard looks pretty bare to me, and the older guys are a big question mark going forward, too.

  8. #458
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    Why is this chump rehabbing in NYC?!?
    Offseason trade is coming,
    Let the pimp his "fancy ghetto trash" clothesline where the the hoodrats be lol

  9. #459
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    No timetable? Lol. There's a timetable. It's called the end of the season.

  10. #460
    Veteran bklynspursfan's Avatar
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  11. #461
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    Yeah, he's done!

  12. #462
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    not sure if this is good or bad news

  13. #463
    Go Spurs Go!! dbreiden83080's Avatar
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  14. #464
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    Its increasingly clear this fool is merely running out the clock so he never has to suit up again in a Spurs uni.

    I hope a truce can be arranged in the offseason and they can come to an agreement. But its straight up toxic between them now. My bet is that he's gone.

  15. #465
    Go Spurs Go!! dbreiden83080's Avatar
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    Its increasingly clear this fool is merely running out the clock so he never has to suit up again in a Spurs uni.

    I hope a truce can be arranged in the offseason and they can come to an agreement. But its straight up toxic between them now. My bet is that he's gone.
    He is not someone we want around anyway. I have sadly come to this conclusion. He is no leader, and is soft. If somebody hurt his feelings, get over it. Your quad has been cleared to go for months and months, and you are too mentally weak to play. I am NOT going from idolizing Tim Duncan, who was tough as nails and all about the team to this fool, all about himself it would appear and fragile mentally and physically. So long KL..

  16. #466
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    Thanks for posting. What I'm not seeing in any of these articles is if the Spurs medical staff diagnosed Kawhi's injury the same as Tony's and recommended surgery straightaway. That would explain quite a bit as to why Kawhi's rehab is nothing the same as Tony's and why it's harder to predict a timeline. If surgery was not recommended as it was with Tony then everyone comparing the two is wasting their time- apples and oranges.

  17. #467
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    Yeah, I have often wished the Spurs could have benefitted from the Mahinmi pick. (As an aside, the reason we didn't was because Mahinmi suffered an injury that led to his inability to perform for the Spurs before they gave up on him...)

    My point, though, is that Pop didn't part with Hill because RC pulled the trigger over Pop's ultimate objection. Pop is RC's boss. But, please, you must admit that whatever success players drafted by PATFO have gone on to achieve in the NBA, they have not achieved it in a Spurs uniform, and our current crop of youngsters are a mixed bag at this point. The cupboard looks pretty bare to me, and the older guys are a big question mark going forward, too.
    Their first round picks have been 28, 30, 26, 29, and 29 since the Kawhi pick (they didn't have a 2012 draft pick since they sent it to Golden State in the Jefferson salary dump). They have two borderline starters in Anderson and Murray (though Murray shows the talent to eventually be an average starter), one guy who got hurt in LJC, one bust in Milutinov, and one unknown in White. I think that's pretty good considering how most picks that late turn out. Scola was a big up but not having room on the roster for guys like Corey Joseph and Gordon Giricek can hardly be considered a strike against Buford. Unless you were a fan 25 years ago you haven't seen a Spurs team that couldn't draft. I'm not trying to defend Buford's free agent moves, they have been a real mixed bag with last summer being complete . But free agency isn't a priority in a total rebuild, which is what this team is going to need after losing Leonard.

  18. #468
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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    More like Wojtek these days imo

  19. #469
    Veteran Spurs9's Avatar
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    More like Wojtek these days imo
    Tspense

  20. #470
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    Their first round picks have been 28, 30, 26, 29, and 29 since the Kawhi pick (they didn't have a 2012 draft pick since they sent it to Golden State in the Jefferson salary dump). They have two borderline starters in Anderson and Murray (though Murray shows the talent to eventually be an average starter), one guy who got hurt in LJC, one bust in Milutinov, and one unknown in White. I think that's pretty good considering how most picks that late turn out. Scola was a big up but not having room on the roster for guys like Corey Joseph and Gordon Giricek can hardly be considered a strike against Buford. Unless you were a fan 25 years ago you haven't seen a Spurs team that couldn't draft. I'm not trying to defend Buford's free agent moves, they have been a real mixed bag with last summer being complete . But free agency isn't a priority in a total rebuild, which is what this team is going to need after losing Leonard.
    1. Mahinmi was not a bad pick at all, he was just criminally underused and doghoused by Pop and suffered from bone chips in his ankle that were undetectable and only found during exploratory surgery.

    2. Milutinov is not a bust. He may have been mishandled rights-wise but he's a damn good player in the Euroleague who starts, finishes, and has won player of the week before.

  21. #471
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    No timetable? Lol. There's a timetable. It's called the end of the season.
    Funny and sad at the same time.

  22. #472
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    Their first round picks have been 28, 30, 26, 29, and 29 since the Kawhi pick (they didn't have a 2012 draft pick since they sent it to Golden State in the Jefferson salary dump). They have two borderline starters in Anderson and Murray (though Murray shows the talent to eventually be an average starter), one guy who got hurt in LJC, one bust in Milutinov, and one unknown in White. I think that's pretty good considering how most picks that late turn out. Scola was a big up but not having room on the roster for guys like Corey Joseph and Gordon Giricek can hardly be considered a strike against Buford. Unless you were a fan 25 years ago you haven't seen a Spurs team that couldn't draft. I'm not trying to defend Buford's free agent moves, they have been a real mixed bag with last summer being complete . But free agency isn't a priority in a total rebuild, which is what this team is going to need after losing Leonard.
    I don't totally disagree with you about the draft picks. Hindsight is always 20-20 about guys that were drafted later that became better, and I won't play that game. My initial comment, with which you took issue was based on the (perhaps questionable) assumption that if the Spurs cut ties with Pop, then they would cut ties with his man, RC. I think the FA moves have been worse than a mixed bag, though, and I think those are also extremely important in a rebuild. And finally, I do not believe the same old approach to signing fading vets to complement a 3-star HOF core will cut it in an era when the only "star" at the core is LMA.

  23. #473
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    I don't totally disagree with you about the draft picks. Hindsight is always 20-20 about guys that were drafted later that became better, and I won't play that game. My initial comment, with which you took issue was based on the (perhaps questionable) assumption that if the Spurs cut ties with Pop, then they would cut ties with his man, RC. I think the FA moves have been worse than a mixed bag, though, and I think those are also extremely important in a rebuild. And finally, I do not believe the same old approach to signing fading vets to complement a 3-star HOF core will cut it in an era when the only "star" at the core is LMA.
    Thd problem is no playmakers. Had murray been as advertised as a slasher and rim attacker, and/or kl not crying all year, this would be a really good team. No one on this team casuses defenses to collapse, murray cant even pass the ball around the perimeter correctly.

    Spurs relying on kyle anderson, green, and injured rudy gay to drive the ball. Not good

  24. #474
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    Thd problem is no playmakers. Had murray been as advertised as a slasher and rim attacker, and/or kl not crying all year, this would be a really good team. No one on this team casuses defenses to collapse, murray cant even pass the ball around the perimeter correctly.

    Spurs relying on kyle anderson, green, and injured rudy gay to drive the ball. Not good
    Yes. That's the primary problem on the floor. So, in the upcoming off-season, it is essential for us to clear out the backcourt clutter and get a legit PG. Unfortunately, it is also essential to get another legit big (and, hopefully, dump Pau). That is a lot to accomplish for a FO that is accustomed to finding long-in-the-tooth vets to become complementary players around a core of 3 HOFers. I can't see PATFO forsaking any of their pets or adopting a new MO.

  25. #475
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    What a disaster that would be to lose RC at a time where the draft will be absolutely critical to the team. I think Pop retires early to not have to deal with a rebuild but given his and his staff's record with player development it would be a devastating blow to lose him.
    There is no need to rebuild. We are 4th in the West even with an injury-plagued season and with 20mil sitting in New York. Even replacing that 20 mil with two competent players, like Batum and Walker for an eg that popped into my head, would be a clear upgrade and be the top 4 team in the league.

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