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View Full Version : Summer League Game 2 - Thoughts



timvp
07-16-2008, 08:06 AM
I got a couple PM requests so here's some quick thoughts . . .

Overall, the Spurs were really ugly to watch offensively. There were a few points when the Spurs summer league team looked decent offensively, but those points were few and far between. Their defense was decent but they missed a lot of perimeter rotations. The Spurs ended up losing the game 76-68 against the New Orleans Hornets.

-George Hill really struggled offensively. He went 0-for-10 from the field and hit only half of his free throws. His major problem right now offensively is finishing at the rim. He doesn't get much elevation and doesn't have much touch near the rim. That's probably due to playing against inferior talent in college, so Hill will have to learn how to finish against athletic bigs. His point guard skills weren't as impressive as his first game out. Defensively, Hill tries hard and can sometimes be really good at that end. Other times, he gets blown by and fouls too much. There's really no way to consider this game anything other than a disappointment. He didn't look like someone ready to be in the rotation for an NBA championship level team. That said, there are a lot more summer league games to be played so he has plenty of time to redeem himself. Thinking Hill could go from a shooting guard at IUPUPIUIPIUI to being a good point guard in an NBA summer league right off the bat was probably asking too much. It should also be noted that Hill was wearing an elbow brace (or at least some padding) for the first three quarters before taking it off for the fourth quarter. We'll see if that's an injury that could slow him down.

-Ian Mahinmi didn't play well. His post moves were slow and deliberate. The Hornets were able to easily shut him down a number of times. His robotic nature really stood out against an NBA caliber player in Hilton Armstrong. Defensively, Mahinmi was decent. Not spectacular but he usually made the right rotation. Part of the problem for Mahinmi is he's not getting many good looks. He went 2-for-9 in this game and almost every shot was contested. The Spurs need to do a better job of giving him the ball in spaces he can operate. So far in summer league, Mahinmi's lack of coordination has been disappointing. He almost murdered himself when he stole a pass and tried to go coast to coast. The good news is that Mahinmi does still look like he has good potential. If he can get in a rhythm offensively, I think he can go from looking like D-League fodder to looking ready for an NBA rotation rather quickly. The talent is there, he just needs to get rolling.

-James Gist was the best player on the floor tonight for the Spurs. By far. Offensively, he finished powerfully around the basket. When he's near the rim, he's going to go up and dunk it. Even more impressively, Gist drained two long jumpers, including a three-pointer. His stroke looks really smooth for a guy who spent so much time around the basket at college. Defensively, Gist has very good energy, plus he hustles endlessly. He had 14 points and 11 rebounds in only 27 minutes. I'm not sure if we're just seeing Gist at his best or if he's really this good. If this is how good he really is, Gist is going to be a major steal. Very good athlete at almost 6-foot-9 with a hustling, aggressive nature who can shoot from the outside? Yeah, I'll take that for a late second rounder. (Note: The box score gave him five turnovers but I think that's an error. I remember two or three but I'm guessing the score keeper mixed him and Mahinmi up a few times.)

-Malik Hairston looked better but still didn't look too impressive. He drove to the hoop and finished nicely a couple times. He has good elevation and hang time around the basket. It'd be good to see him hit a few jumpers to get his confidence going. Defensively, I have been extremely underwhelmed. He blatantly didn't hustle a few times on that end of the court. If he pulled that on a Pop coached team, he'd be so far in the dog house he'd need a road map to find his way back out. Hairston doesn't look much like an NBA player at this point ... but again, there's still time.

-Anthony Tolliver is the only player on the team who is consistently knocking down jumpers. He started at power forward and had a solid game. His lack of size hurts him defensively but he competes very well on that end of the court. If he keeps shooting like this and he proves he's big enough to play power forward, he's definitely a player to take a closer look at in preseason.

-Devin Green had some good moments and his statline looks pretty decent but he still doesn't look like a legitimate NBA player. He's basically a Jeremy Richardson clone and Richardson didn't last last year on the Spurs. Good summer league player, decent training camp fodder ... but that's where it ends.

The Spurs play today at 3PM CST against the New York Knicks. This will be a good test for Mahinmi and Hill to see how they respond to a poor performance. It will be interesting to see if we'll get a glimpse of their competitive nature. It will also be interesting to see if Gist can continue looking like the best player on the team.

Mr.Bottomtooth
07-16-2008, 08:09 AM
:tu Nice write-up. Now we get to see Spurs/Knicks on the big screen. :smokin

Mr.Bottomtooth
07-16-2008, 08:10 AM
I wonder how much ST will explode if Gist has another great game today.

timvp
07-16-2008, 08:13 AM
I wonder how much ST will explode if Baby Shawn Kemp has another great game today.

Fixed.

:smokin

timvp
07-16-2008, 08:18 AM
http://boss.streamos.com/wmedia/nba/nbacom/summer_league/full/summer08_sasnoh_21.asx

There's an archive video of the entire game.

Mr. Body
07-16-2008, 08:20 AM
Hill was a mid to late second rounder the Spurs took twenty spots too high. He has talent but there were far too many question marks. They need to quit falling in love with players due to personality. If they wanted a defensive point guard they should have gone for Chalmers, who already is a terrific defender and played against top notch competition at his level. Hill is an undersized shooting guard having instantly to transform into a position he does not play against far superior talent than he's faced before. Good luck.

Hairston was seen as the second commodity out of the trade with Phoenix. They got a second rounder next year and Hairston was a throw-in. Trouble is, there might have been decent guys they otherwise could have had.

Gist might be a steal, as you say.

Twisted_Dawg
07-16-2008, 08:23 AM
So timvp....do you agree we could have gotten George Hill in the second round and used our first round pick for a better known player?

On the bright side, Hill has had 15 rebounds in two games which is not too shabby.

rlballin1
07-16-2008, 08:40 AM
It would have been virtually impossible to get Hill in the second round. Not as high as his stock was anyways. I didn't see the game, I just read all of the comments that were posted while the game was going on, and I am shocked how many bandwagoning, short sighted fans are on Spurstalk

Hill had a bad offensive night, true, its not promising when some one slumps. But TimVp was right, you have to look at how the player performed when his jumper isnt falling. Hill consistently took it to the hole. Thats what we want from our point guard!!! Drawing fouls in the REAL NBA equals players going to the bench, which equals easier victories if the opposing teams players are on the bench.
THIS IS A GOOD THING!!!!!!
From what i read I see a player that creates contact, plays hard nose defense, and rebounds constantly. HMMMMMMM sounds like a smart basketball player to me

rlballin1
07-16-2008, 08:44 AM
Plus he does all this when his shot ISNT falling. WOW imagine what he could do on a good night. Ladies and Gentleman this is not a talent that could have been scooped up in the second round. For christs sake he was recruited by FLORIDA, the two time NCAA champions. So obviously the boys got skills. So lets take the college IUP thing out of it.

Ignorant Spurs fans were comparing him to JVaughn after one game?!?!?! Wow, jVaughn hasnt drove to the hole and drawn a fould since the summer of 88. Take the gun down from your temple, read up on basketball, and look deeper. The kid is good

silk
07-16-2008, 08:48 AM
I don't think hill would have been there for us in the second round, lakers, celtics, or an other team would have take him before us

I'm more concerned that besides his raw talents, mahinmi doesn't seem to be able to crack the rotation for a championship team ...

Mr. Body
07-16-2008, 08:48 AM
It would have been virtually impossible to get Hill in the second round. Not as high as his stock was anyways.

Then his stock was overvalued and you don't need him. At best, with slight effort, they could have done what Houston did: drafted a desired player still on the board and trade him down. They could easily have drafted Greene or Arthur and turned him into George Hill plus another player. They apparently didn't even try.

Regardless, pulling a back-up point, who isn't really a point, with a pick that could net one of two lottery projected players, not to mention other seasoned top school players still on the baord, while you're intending to sign a guy like Roger Mason who can handle the point anyway, is so baffling it's alarming.

rascal
07-16-2008, 08:51 AM
Gist will be the player that saves last years draft from being a complete bust. He will be the best value the spurs got in last years draft. Gist is a strong finisher around the basket something the spurs badly lacked and when he improves his perimeter game he will be a solid nba player.

rlballin1
07-16-2008, 08:55 AM
Ummm its not like the signing of Roger Mason was intended before the draft started. Roger Mason was one of those signings which came to us after many other players had been taken off the board.
Come on dude, do you really think the Spurs put no thought into the process whatsoever??? They get PAID to scout, make deals, trades and etc. We here do this a hobby. Common sense: which would have more information about availabilty: a blogger? or a GM???

rlballin1
07-16-2008, 08:58 AM
Finishing around the basket is something we lacked???????? wow MAnu, Parker, and Tim are famous for breath-taking and 1 shots. So finishing around the basket was not one of our weakpoints by far. Our inability to knock down open shots was our achilles heel. Hill has a nice stroke, he can fix that

I hate to judge after 2 games but Gist has promise, maybe he can help further in our domination of the paint but he is still a long shot

Cant_Be_Faded
07-16-2008, 09:03 AM
sigh
another depressing morning on spurstalk

Hopefully Hill isn't a china doll and will step up tonight.

rascal
07-16-2008, 09:04 AM
Finishing around the basket is something we lacked???????? wow MAnu, Parker, and Tim are famous for breath-taking and 1 shots. So finishing around the basket was not one of our weakpoints by far. Our inability to knock down open shots was our achilles heel. Hill has a nice stroke, he can fix that

I hate to judge after 2 games but Gist has promise, maybe he can help further in our domination of the paint but he is still a long shot
There are no finishers coming off the bench. The spurs lack athleticism and players who can run with Parker.

Thats why you see so few easy transistion points off long rebounds or outlet passes or off turnovers. Those type of easy points help eliminate long scroing droughts that happen when your mainly relying on getting points from hitting perimeter shots.

Mr.Bottomtooth
07-16-2008, 09:06 AM
Fixed.

:smokin

:lol :tu

rlballin1
07-16-2008, 09:13 AM
The San Antonio Spurs are not the Phoenix Suns. You can not watch a spurs game and say damn why aren't they alley-ooping all day. Popovich's system requires people who can knock down open shots. Period
We hit open shots, we win.
Now I'm not saying athletic swingmen arent something we need, nothing could be further from the truth. However, we would see more playoff exits if we focus on getting people who can only finish around the basket, and clanking everything from outside 5 ft.
Hill and Gist seem to fill both needs. Gist is athletic and can bang. Hill is a smoother player who can shoot the three, and as a bonus can get to the rim at will it seems. These were fine picks......one of our best drafts

Solid D
07-16-2008, 09:27 AM
Thanks for the report. I have not seen the game. Not sure if it's worth watching nor if I have time to do so.

Regarding Hill and his draft slot, there have been two sources say that Boston was going to take Hill at 30, if he was available. Chuck Miketinac during his Maximum Sports (Channel 11 San Antonio) broadcast stated this on Sunday night.

Ocotillo
07-16-2008, 09:32 AM
Thanks for the summary.

I'm not worried about Hill at this stage. There is all summer and training camp for him to learn. The IUPUI thing does count as even though he was recruited by major college programs, he has been accustomed to playing against inferior talent, he has to adjust and I believe he will.

Hairston better step it up or update his Passport.

So far like everyone else, I am lovin' James Gist. I hope he didn't just have a good couple of games, I am hoping this is a pattern.

What does have me concerned is Mahinmi. With the Splitter debacle, it is critical this guy steps up. While he may not be ready to start in the NBA, one would hope by now he would be dominating the SL.

Marcus Bryant
07-16-2008, 10:03 AM
So Hill and Mahinmi's games aren't polished yet. Oh no.