World Court orders Texas to stay executions

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25703119/


The U.N.'s highest court on Wednesday ordered the United States to stay the executions of five Mexicans on Texas death row pending review of their cases.

Mexico had appealed to the World Court to block the executions. At hastily convened hearings last month, Mexico argued that the United States is defying a 2004 International Court of Justice order to review the cases of 51 Mexicans sentenced to death by state courts.

I think the appropriate response from the governor's office should be telling them to fuck off.

[Wild Cobra]

Maybe not. Let them stay the execution and deport them into a Mexican jail.

There's this thing called 'jurisdiction.' If Mexico wants to claim jurisdiction for it's citizens over US law, then so be it. That's just the ammunition we conservatives need to say the babies born to citizens of illegal immigrants are not US citizens.

Fourteenth Amendment, Section 1:


All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

[BradLohaus]

Fuck the World Court, and fuck the United Nations. Our tax dollars pay for a quarter of their budget, and they want to boss us around? If anybody ever car bombs the UN building then they should be given the Medal of Honor.

There, if I wasn't already in that Homeland Security database, I am now. :toast

[Anti.Hero]

Texas and Israel being bossed around.


The end of days are upon us :depressed

[Twisted_Dawg]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25703119/



I think the appropriate response from the governor's office should be telling them to fuck off.

The appropriate response is to get those needles ready.

[ElNono]

Maybe not. Let them stay the execution and deport them into a Mexican jail.

There's this thing called 'jurisdiction.' If Mexico wants to claim jurisdiction for it's citizens over US law, then so be it. That's just the ammunition we conservatives need to say the babies born to citizens of illegal immigrants are not US citizens.

Fourteenth Amendment, Section 1:

What you mention makes no sense at all. None of the prisoners in this case were born in America. Hence the request. If they were Americans, there would be no request.

[Oh, Gee!!]

That's just the ammunition we conservatives need to say the babies born to citizens of illegal immigrants are not US citizens.

what a jumbled mess you've manage to write.

[DarkReign]

World Court orders Texas to stay executions

Orders?! ORDERS?!

Yeah fucking right.....go back to sleep, young child.

[Wild Cobra]

What you mention makes no sense at all. None of the prisoners in this case were born in America. Hence the request. If they were Americans, there would be no request.

You missed my point.

By suing in the world court, Mexico is claiming jurisdiction over these five on death row. We have a problem with Anchor Babies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchor_baby) here. We really don't have to grant them citizenship because the mothers are really under Mexican jurisdiction unless we allow it, or demand it for law enforcement purposes. We should claim that illegal immigrants are under the jurisdiction of their native land for citizenship purposes of their offspring.

I say we use the jurisdiction aspect and deny babies born to illegal immigrants, citizenship. What do others here think?

[Sec24Row7]

Dear World Court,

In the immortal words of William Barrett Travis to Santa Ana at the Alamo.. (paraphrasing)...

"Go fuck yourself!"

Yours Truly,

Texas

[Oh, Gee!!]

You missed my point: deny babies born to illegal immigrants, citizenship.

cause your point is idiotic.

[ElNono]

You missed my point.

By suing in the world court, Mexico is claiming jurisdiction over these five on death row. We have a problem with Anchor Babies (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchor_baby) here. We really don't have to grant them citizenship because the mothers are really under Mexican jurisdiction unless we allow it, or demand it for law enforcement purposes. We should claim that illegal immigrants are under the jurisdiction of their native land for citizenship purposes of their offspring.


I really don't know if you're just trying to be funny, or you're serious. What part of the 14 amendment you quoted you didn't understand?

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

Whoever is born in this country is under US jurisdiction, and it's a US citizen. Period. No gray area there. No matter where the parents are from.
The request in the original story is about Mexican citizens, not US citizen.

If you were just kidding, never mind.



I say we use the jurisdiction aspect and deny babies born to illegal immigrants, citizenship. What do others here think?

Not without breaking the law, you can't do that. You would need to amend the 14 amendment for that.

[Sec24Row7]

The constitution needs to be amended for the children of non citizens born in the USA to not automatically be US citizens...

That needs to happen.

There should only be two ways to become a US citizen:

1)Be born to a US citizen at home or abroad

2)Be Naturalized.

[Wild Cobra]

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

Jurisdiction is my point.



Whoever is born in this country is under US jurisdiction, and it's a US citizen. Period. No gray area there. No matter where the parents are from.
The request in the original story is about Mexican citizens, not US citizen.

Not true. There are sevel cases where children born in the USA from mothers of other countries are not given citizenship. Why make it automatic for those here illegally?

From the wiki link I supplied:


United States v. Wong Kim Ark

In the case of United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), the Supreme Court ruled that a person who

* is born in the United States
* of parents who, at the time of his birth, are subjects of a foreign power
* whose parents have a permanent domicile and residence in the United States
* whose parents are there carrying on business and are not employed in any diplomatic or official capacity of the foreign power to which they are subject

becomes, at the time of his birth, a citizen of the United States, by virtue of the first clause of the 14th amendment of the Constitution.

Nothing here that makes it apply to someone here illegally. Notice that diplomats and offical capacities are automatically excluded. Withing the above requirements, "carrying on business" is a requirement for it to apply.

We can and we should stop this practice of allowing anchor babies.

[Wild Cobra]

The constitution needs to be amended for the children of non citizens born in the USA to not automatically be US citizens...

That needs to happen.

There should only be two ways to become a US citizen:

1)Be born to a US citizen at home or abroad

2)Be Naturalized.

3) Be born to a legal immigrant in the US.

[Wild Cobra]

Consider also that illegal immigrants cannot legally work in the USA. They are not legally visitors. they are therefore purposely ignoring their part to be under the jurisdiction of the USA. Those who work, do so either under the table which fails to submit to the jurisdiction of tax laws and labor laws. Those who obtain social security numbers and fake or marginal ID's to work are committing ID theft, yet are not taken legal action against under our jurisdiction.

They choose to be here without submitting to the jurisdiction of the land. Isn't that enough for you ElNono?

Senator Howard, the author of the fourteenth amendment said:


This amendment which I have clarified is simply declaratory of what I regard as the law of the land already..[It] does not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors, or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of person. It settles the great question of citizenship and removes all doubt as to what persons are or are not citizens of the United States.



Such things are considered as the purpose and/or scope and when loopholes appear, should be used. Just as the courts sometimes try to decide constitutional intent by reading the Federalist and Anti-Federalist papers.

[ElNono]

Jurisdiction is my point.
American citizens/residents are under American jurisdiction. That's all you need to know about that.



Not true. There are sevel cases where children born in the USA from mothers of other countries are not given citizenship. Why make it automatic for those here illegally?

There's actually only three cases for a children born in the US not to become a US citizen:

1) children born to foreign diplomats
2) children born to enemy forces engaged in hostile occupation of the country's territory
3) children born on Indian tribes



From the wiki link I supplied:

Nothing here that makes it apply to someone here illegally. Notice that diplomats and offical capacities are automatically excluded. Withing the above requirements, "carrying on business" is a requirement for it to apply.

You misunderstood what you read. The conditions you enumerate were those that applied to Wong Kim Ark. Not the conditions under which the 14 amendment applies.



We can and we should stop this practice of allowing anchor babies.

The only way I can see that happening legally is:
- Secure the border and stop illegal immigration
- Deny tourist visas to pregnant mothers

Other than that, you would need to amend the 14 amendment.

[ElNono]

Consider also that illegal immigrants cannot legally work in the USA. They are not legally visitors. they are therefore purposely ignoring their part to be under the jurisdiction of the USA. Those who work, do so either under the table which fails to submit to the jurisdiction of tax laws and labor laws. Those who obtain social security numbers and fake or marginal ID's to work are committing ID theft, yet are not taken legal action against under our jurisdiction.

They choose to be here without submitting to the jurisdiction of the land. Isn't that enough for you ElNono?


Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending them. I'm also going to correct you on something. I know a bunch of people that used to be illegal immigrants, and now regularized their situation, but even before doing so they all paid taxes. You don't need anything other than a passport to obtain a tax id. And as a matter of fact, if you have the chance to become legal resident/citizen, having tax records from even before your change of status is almost a complete must.
As far as any of the other crimes they commit, well, that's why there's the 'migra'. When they get caught, they get sent back.
Sorry, but the way I see it, it's easy to point the finger to the illegals, but the lack of enforcement of a secure border is as much a culprit if not more so.



Senator Howard, the author of the fourteenth amendment said:

Such things are considered as the purpose and/or scope and when loopholes appear, should be used. Just as the courts sometimes try to decide constitutional intent by reading the Federalist and Anti-Federalist papers.

The Supreme Court already ruled on this, and already set the precedent of what rules apply. For better or worse, that's what we have to work with. Like I said, there are legal solutions to this problem. Maybe if we would enforce them, then this wouldn't be a problem.
BTW, Canadians and pretty much any other nation have the same problem.

[Sec24Row7]

3) Be born to a legal immigrant in the US.

No. If either one of their parents is not a citizen, they should not get automatic citizenship.

[samikeyp]

Dear World Court,

:flipoff

Sincerly,
Texas.