McDonald: Horry All But Gone; Finley Still Listening

[duncan228]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Spurs_Horry_all_but_gone_Finley_still_listening.ht ml

Spurs: Horry all but gone; Finley still listening
Jeff McDonald - Express-News

In the summer of 2005, Michael Finley was one of the hottest commodities on the NBA’s free-agent market.

When he eventually agreed to a deal that took him from Dallas to San Antonio, he was hailed league-wide as the missing piece that would surely net the Spurs another championship.

Three years later, Finley is back on the free-agent market, one championship ring heavier. Though he isn’t commanding the same type of breathless attention at age 35 as he was at 32, one thing hasn’t changed with time.

The Spurs still want him.

And Finley, apparently, is listening.

“He’s been talking to the Spurs, and he’s interested in continuing to talk to the Spurs,” Finley’s agent, Henry Thomas, said Friday. “He’s just taking his time, weighing his options.”

Negotiations with Finley will continue as the summer moves along. Negotiations with another of the Spurs’ veteran free agents, meanwhile, might never begin in the first place.

The Spurs haven’t held serious talks with Robert Horry since the season ended, leading to speculation — some of it coming from the 37-year-old forward himself — that his days in San Antonio are done.

Lost in the Spurs’ summertime youth movement, Horry told a San Antonio television station this week he doesn’t believe he will be back next season.

If he doesn’t get an offer from another team, Horry — a 16-year NBA veteran who garnered two of his seven championship rings with the Spurs — could be forced to retire.

And so, it appears Finley could be the final free-agent holdover from last year’s Spurs team with a chance to return in 2008-09. Kurt Thomas, the 35-year-old forward-center who re-upped earlier this week, is the only free agent the Spurs have retained so far.

Finley is coming off a 2007-08 season that was statistically solid, though seldom spectacular. He started 61 games, averaging 10.1 points, and shot 41.4 percent from the field — including 37 percent from 3-point range.

All of those numbers represented modest improvements on Finley’s 2006-07 contributions, though his production dipped in the postseason.

The Spurs still value Finley’s veteran leadership and professional presence in their locker room, and are open to bringing him back.

Just like in 2005, Finley is listening.

[NewJerSpur]

Fairly disturbing article after this past season. Have to see how it unfolds. Anyone up to start a "Finley Watch" Thread?

[timvp]

I don't know why it is taking the mainstream media so long to figure out Horry won't be back. After RC straight up said it during a summer league broadcast, that should have closed the door.

Finley, unless another team decides to open the bank, will be back. That scares me because Pop might overplay him, however that is the case. Finley as a deep reserve would be pretty good insurance. Finley as a starter or even a main player off the bench would be a disaster.

[Das Texan]

I don't know why it is taking the mainstream media so long to figure out Horry won't be back. After RC straight up said it during a summer league broadcast, that should have closed the door.



Because McDonald is a fucking idiot?

[Kori Ellis]

Finley, unless another team decides to open the bank, will be back. That scares me because Pop might overplay him, however that is the case. Finley as a deep reserve would be pretty good insurance. Finley as a starter or even a main player off the bench would be a disaster.

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

[ducks]

lets hope the young guns though can step up and pop trust them in the playoffs to

[rj215]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

Very true. Experience off the bench and depth might be a big problem next year. I didn't want him back but as a 5th wing, he wouldn't be bad.

[knee-knee-3]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

I agree. Mason may (and hopefully will) chew up Fin's minutes, but having a vet on the bench that knows the system and has playoff experience is not a terrible option.

[ducks]

horry was on record that he did not want to coach
be intersting to know if mike wants to

[NewJerSpur]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

The thing that makes me uncomfortable about Fin's game is his lack of effort on the defensive end....not that he's ever been the most stellar of defenders, but he was abused and exploited (especially in the post) trying to guard SF's that had any kind of advantage over him physically. This scares me even more than those offensive droughts he has the potential to go into every other game.

[ducks]

The thing that makes me uncomfortable about Fin's game is his lack of effort on the defensive end....not that he's ever been the most stellar of defenders, but he was abused and exploited (especially in the post) trying to guard SF's that had any kind of advantage over him physically. This scares me even more than those offensive droughts he has the potential to go into every other game.

barry was really as bad

you have to have one vet guy on the system
next year you can get rid of mike

[Kori Ellis]

The thing that makes me uncomfortable about Fin's game is his lack of effort on the defensive end....not that he's ever been the most stellar of defenders, but he was abused and exploited (especially in the post) trying to guard SF's that had any kind of advantage over him physically. This scares me even more than those offensive droughts he has the potential to go into every other game.

As the 5th wing, if he's used in spot minutes, it won't matter much. He'll probably see a lot of DNP-CD's and rare games of over 10 mpg.

[DynastyBuilder]

I don't know why it is taking the mainstream media so long to figure out Horry won't be back. After RC straight up said it during a summer league broadcast, that should have closed the door.

I think those of us on here are the only one's outside of Utah that saw and heard it, likewise it sounds like RC believes the same thing according to his statements at the KT signing.

[NewJerSpur]

Still rather have a hobbled Barry that can hit a shot from anywhere on the court and doesn't need much time to warm up than a healthy Finley who gives no effort on the defensive end of things at this stage in his career. Nevertheless, that ship has sailed and the decision was made regarding Barry's future after that calf injury. If Fin does come back, Kurt and Ian have to step it up defending the paint if Finley, by some chance, sees major minutes.

[NewJerSpur]

As the 5th wing, if he's used in spot minutes, it won't matter much. He'll probably see a lot of DNP-CD's and rare games of over 10 mpg.

Hopefully Pop won't be too tempted to throw him back into the starting lineup for any real length of time if one of the newer SG's/SF's falters a bit. It will also be interesting to see how well Udoka progresses this season.

[ss1986v2]

i have no problem having finley back, as long as hes fighting to steal minutes from udoka, not getting the starting nod. now i wanted barry back in that role, but since that wasnt in the cards, finley is the next best thing.

[Spurtacus]

Given what's out there, Finley is probably a better third stringer than anyone out there. He'd be playing behind Ginobili and Mason.

[lurker23]

Anyone have any idea what kind of money Finley is likely seeking? My best guess is around the LLE, but the Spurs might want him to take the veterans minimum. I wonder if length of contract is an issue too; I wouldn't expect the Spurs are offering anything more than 1 year plus a 1 year team option.

[T Park]

Given what's out there, Finley is probably a better third stringer than anyone out there. He'd be playing behind Ginobili and Mason.

Blasphemy, don't you know that they could sign the non practicing Devin Brown instead!!

[SenorSpur]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

On the contrary. I don't trust Pop to give minutes to a younger player over one of his favorite reserves. Pop has demonstrated a tendency to "overvalue" some veterans who were clearly past their primes (NVE, Damon, Horry and Finley last season). The mere fact that he's contemplating bringing Finley back is disturbing - especially in light of the horrendous scoring droughts this team endured with him as the starting 2-guard.

For those that still laud his shooting ability, showing up every 5th game or so does not qualify as consistent performance and does not warrant bringing him back for yet another season. Mark my words: if Finley does return, I wouldn't be surprised if he has his share of starts for this team.

[Manufan909]

Oh god no. Please Pop, PLEASEEEEEEEEEEE don't start Finley ever again, unless Mason, Bowen, Manu, and Udoka are all hurt.

[The Truth #6]

If Mason doesn't start, then we're off to a bad start.

In theory bringing Finley back for a deep reserve role sounds nice but I still don't trust it. If he couldn't even come off the bench as a 6 man to be productive, then how is he going to function as an 8th or 9th player off the bench? I don't see it happening. Looking back it was unnatural how much the team had to work to accommodate him so that he could be productive. That's why I think they should try to find a younger player to develop. I've lost confidence in the coaching staff to develop young players but they're going to have to this season. We can't keep doing the same old anymore.

[roycrikside]

I don't like him at all, but he could have a certain role on the team. He could play in the games Manu misses with minor injuries, or like for example if Pop wants to rest him in a back-to-back situation, Fin could play one of the games instead.

And all the games Manu is healthy, he can rack up the DNP-CDs a la Steve Smith.

[Spurs Brazil]

If Finley is back to be the 5th wing good. Other than that not a good thing

[mystargtr34]

Mason will probably play about 25 minutes a night, Manu will be up for about 23 at the 2 spot and 5 minutes in a PG role. That leaves about 10 minutes for Fin.

Im fine with that.

[mrspurs]

I don't know why it is taking the mainstream media so long to figure out Horry won't be back. After RC straight up said it during a summer league broadcast, that should have closed the door.

Finley, unless another team decides to open the bank, will be back. That scares me because Pop might overplay him, however that is the case. Finley as a deep reserve would be pretty good insurance. Finley as a starter or even a main player off the bench would be a disaster.

thats why i dont want finley around....we lost last season, we may lose again this season............id rather lose with rookies then lose with veterans, one thing is for sure, after next season there will be another and then another..im close to 50, fish and play basketball everyday if god allows, and i can personally tell ya, you lose alot from age 32 to 35.......finley barely had anything when we got him....finley has nothing left...if the FO keeps the fin. the FO would be making another stupid move imo....and they aint made one yet this offseason

[mrspurs]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

when the younger guys begin to collapse under pressure and we go on a 3 maybe even 4 game losing streak(something unheard of around here for yrs) if fin is on the end of the bench guess what pop is gonna do?...and then guess what fin is gonna do? pop is gonna put fin in and fin is gonna score lights out and we are right back to this thread next season again.........lose the dead weight

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

Come on Kori, Finley will be treated like Horry was this past season. We'll get to the playoffs and he'll get his playing time for his veteran presence, even if he's giving us jack out on the court.

Pop's had a mancrush on Fin ever since he came here for cheap while Cuban was still paying him 20 mil a year.

The moment Mason struggles and Manu is gimpy, we'll be treated to the human turnstile logging significant minutes at the two.

And that sucks.

[Obstructed_View]

The moment Mason struggles and Manu is gimpy, we'll be treated to the human turnstile logging significant minutes at the two.

And that sucks.

Not half as bad as when he's logging significant minutes at the 4. Just wait.

[Kori Ellis]

Come on Kori, Finley will be treated like Horry was this past season. We'll get to the playoffs and he'll get his playing time for his veteran presence, even if he's giving us jack out on the court.



Robert Horry played 8-10 mpg in the playoffs with a few DNP CD's mixed in.

[AFBlue]

The way this article is written it sounds like Finley, not the Spurs, is the one taking his time to make his decision. If that's the case, it tells me that Pop and co. have likely told him he'll have a much smaller role and will have to compete for minutes with all the other wings.

Boston, in the meantime, lost Posey and could probably offer a more significant role. Then there's the hometown Chicago Bulls and all their turmoil...they could really use a veteran presence. Finley could opt for either situations over the Spurs at this point.

I think there's probably still a REALLY good chance Finley is back with the Spurs, but I don't think it will be as the "starter" necessarily. Fin will have to prove himself.

Having said all that, I think there's a very good chance that Mason and/or Udoka fail to live up to expectations fairly early and Finley moves up the depth chart if he's on this team.

[bigfan]

I have no problem keeping Finley if the price is right. Now that Bones and Big Shot Rob are gone, having an experienced marksman on the bench may come in handy during the season.

[Drom John]

If we were talking early ABA, (WHL, USFL), then Finley is big enough of a name to merit a lot more money than the NBA.

So now that we have the cash rich Europeans. Is an aging former star worth a European bid?

Likewise, could Horry retire to Europe?

[benefactor]

Im with all the rest that are worried...this situation makes me feel like I have an ulcer coming on.

I like Finley. He has been a good role player for us and has hit some clutch shots. But with the way Pop has the tendency to go to certain players that he likes for long stretches makes this move worrisome. I don't want to see Mason have a good shooting year only to rot on the bench during important stretches in the playoffs while Pop thinks he should use his "proven" players.

[MarHill]

I have no problem keeping Finley if the price is right. Now that Bones and Big Shot Rob are gone, having an experienced marksman on the bench may come in handy during the season.


Yep, I agree!

I'm one of the few pro-Finley people and what the anti-Finley don't seem to get is that a coach especially someone like Pop like players who are professional and fits well with the chemistry of his team.

I know some have said that Pop has a man-crush on Finley. Whatever!

Yes, he has been inconsistent with shooting. But in the three years, I've seen him as a Spur he has several big shots in key moments of the game. Remember Game 1 of Spurs-Suns playoff series this past season.

I like him coming back as a reserve off the bench and he can eat up some minutes during the regular season as well.

C'mon on back Finley!!!!:rollin

[urunobili]

i like him as a Danny Ferry 2003 kinda role :tu and i think that is exactly what Pop will do with him... Roger Mason is here to take his old minutes

[remingtonbo2001]

What's with all the Finley hate.

It's as though Bonner and Finley have taken the Rasho/Beno role from 06'.

Really folks, having Finley's verteran presence would be great for this ball club.

[T Park]

Don't you know?

Pop HATES younger players.

Ignore 2005 and 2003 though.

[wildbill2u]

I think Pop will use him as a deep reserve. And that's not a bad thing. I know Spurs fans think having Finley back would be a disaster, but it really isn't - if his playing time is limited. He's a great veteran presence and will help the younger players on this team learn things both on and off the court. I trust Pop knows that Finley geting 20+ mpg isn't a good thing for this team.

The scary part of the upcoming season is relying on Mason as the Findog replacement as an outside shooter. He had one decent shooting year out of four. What if this wasn't a breakout year and he doesn't come through--and we all know about the 'first year shooter's curse' on the Spurs.

I'm not sure Finley is the ideal guy we'd want, but we might need what he's got left. And that's scary.

[AFBlue]

Don't you know?

Pop HATES younger players.

Ignore 2005 and 2003 though.

This has nothing to do with the topic, but your sarcasm is WAY overused. Of the 46K posts you've made, how many do you think actually contributed to an argument or weren't drenched with sarcasm?

Just an observation.

[benefactor]

What's with all the Finley hate.

It's as though Bonner and Finley have taken the Rasho/Beno role from 06'.

Really folks, having Finley's verteran presence would be great for this ball club.
Veteran presence? Yes. More minutes than he should be playing? No.

I think most of the hate is coming from fears of the latter happening, because anyone who has watched the Spurs over the last few years knows thats how Pop likes to roll.

[AFBlue]

Veteran presence? Yes. More minutes than he should be playing? No.

I think most of the hate is coming from fears of the latter happening, because anyone who has watched the Spurs over the last few years knows thats how Pop likes to roll.

If he earns it by virtue of good shooting, there should be no problem with Finley getting minutes.

If he earns it by default because of poor play by Mason and Udoka....Spurs are in trouble.

[benefactor]

If he earns it by virtue of good shooting, there should be no problem with Finley getting minutes.

If he earns it by default because of poor play by Mason and Udoka....Spurs are in trouble.
Agreed. :tu

[Findog]

Why aren't the Mavs trying to bring Finley home?

[Kindergarten Cop]

Why aren't the Mavs trying to bring Finley home?

I'm puzzled by that as well, considering Cuban's past comments:


"I would hope that after his contract is over in San Antone, he would consider the Mavs as an option," Cuban said Monday. "I don't know that he would, but our entire organization has that much respect for him."

I'm pretty sure though that the Mavs can only offer him a minimum contract now that they've used up their exceptions (at least I believe they have). The Spurs can offer him more than any other team, but there's no guarantee that they are willing to do so.

[ceperez]

If Mason doesn't start, then we're off to a bad start.

In theory bringing Finley back for a deep reserve role sounds nice but I still don't trust it. If he couldn't even come off the bench as a 6 man to be productive, then how is he going to function as an 8th or 9th player off the bench? I don't see it happening. Looking back it was unnatural how much the team had to work to accommodate him so that he could be productive. That's why I think they should try to find a younger player to develop. I've lost confidence in the coaching staff to develop young players but they're going to have to this season. We can't keep doing the same old anymore.

Agree 100%, if Mason doesn't start then we definitely are screwed.

Pop keeps favoring veteran players even if they don't produce. He's gambling that he'll see one final act of brilliance. We played Van Exel to the detriment of Beno Udirh, we played Stodamire to the detriment of maybe even DeMarr Johnson. We gave Finley an unbelievable amount of minutes to contribute, while more efficient players like Udoka sat on the bench.

Enough already!

[ceperez]

The scary part of the upcoming season is relying on Mason as the Findog replacement as an outside shooter. He had one decent shooting year out of four. What if this wasn't a breakout year and he doesn't come through--and we all know about the 'first year shooter's curse' on the Spurs.

I'm not sure Finley is the ideal guy we'd want, but we might need what he's got left. And that's scary.

That's completely unfounded! Finley at his prime was better than Mason in his prime (i.e. now). Unfortunately Father Time has caught up, Mason without a doubt is not only a better shooter but a more versatile player than can play point and penetrate. One other thing, Mason can hit the shot off the dribble... not happening with Finley.

Besides, if you want to have a player that did exactly what Finley did for us (that is do nothing but camp on the 3 point line), then you've got Bonner, Udoka, Bowen and Tolliver to do that.

[SenorSpur]

If Mason doesn't start, then we're off to a bad start.

In theory bringing Finley back for a deep reserve role sounds nice but I still don't trust it. If he couldn't even come off the bench as a 6 man to be productive, then how is he going to function as an 8th or 9th player off the bench? I don't see it happening. Looking back it was unnatural how much the team had to work to accommodate him so that he could be productive. That's why I think they should try to find a younger player to develop. I've lost confidence in the coaching staff to develop young players but they're going to have to this season. We can't keep doing the same old anymore.

The Truth speaks the truth! :tu

[SenorSpur]

Agree 100%, if Mason doesn't start then we definitely are screwed.

Pop keeps favoring veteran players even if they don't produce. He's gambling that he'll see one final act of brilliance. We played Van Exel to the detriment of Beno Udirh, we played Stodamire to the detriment of maybe even DeMarr Johnson. We gave Finley an unbelievable amount of minutes to contribute, while more efficient players like Udoka sat on the bench.

Enough already!

:tu :tu

Don't forget an unbelievable number of shots afforded to Finley as well. His wild inconsistency was one of the key factors that led to his departure from the Mavs - via the amnesty rule.

I truly get the loyalty and "extra rope" Pop affords to proven veterans. However when their performance becomes wildly inconsistent and their skills decline to the point where their on-court presence becomes counter productive, that's a problem. That's where Finley is now. If we see it, surely Pop sees it too. Blind loyalty and denial is a dangerous thing.

I'll say it again. The offensive droughts this team had during the season and the playoffs occurred with Finley as starting 2-guard. As was stated earlier, If Finley couldn't cut it as a starter, how the hell can he be expected to produce as a 4th or 5th wing?

[AFBlue]

That's completely unfounded! Finley at his prime was better than Mason in his prime (i.e. now). Unfortunately Father Time has caught up, Mason without a doubt is not only a better shooter but a more versatile player than can play point and penetrate. One other thing, Mason can hit the shot off the dribble... not happening with Finley.

Besides, if you want to have a player that did exactly what Finley did for us (that is do nothing but camp on the 3 point line), then you've got Bonner, Udoka, Bowen and Tolliver to do that.

We HOPE Mason is a better shooter and we HOPE he has the ability to hit the shot off the dribble and penetrate, but wildbill2u's assertion isn't "completely unfounded".

Mason has had one decent shooting year, and really a good 10-game stretch where he started and was extremely productive. Spurs fans, most of which never heard of Mason before he signed with the team, are HOPING that he can recreate that production....but it's not a given.

If Mason does falter (let's hope not!) early and Udoka struggles to be consistent, the Spurs will need SOMEONE to pick up the slack. If it's Finley, the Spurs are screwed. But let's be honest, if it's anyone else....the Spurs are screwed.

[exstatic]

We HOPE Mason is a better shooter and we HOPE he has the ability to hit the shot off the dribble and penetrate, but wildbill2u's assertion isn't "completely unfounded".

Mason has had one decent shooting year, and really a good 10-game stretch where he started and was extremely productive. Spurs fans, most of which never heard of Mason before he signed with the team, are HOPING that he can recreate that production....but it's not a given.

If Mason does falter (let's hope not!) early and Udoka struggles to be consistent, the Spurs will need SOMEONE to pick up the slack. If it's Finley, the Spurs are screwed. But let's be honest, if it's anyone else....the Spurs are screwed.

Re-creating or even besting Finley's production from last year isn't that high a bar to hit, and really, that's Mason's target. I think Mason will do fine, probably much BETTER than Finley if he's given Fin's opportunities. To me, the BIG plus of Mason is that he's already played in a motion offense (the Princeton) with Washington, something most new Spurs struggle to learn in year one. I also expect the usual year two bump in productivity from Udoka this year.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Why aren't the Mavs trying to bring Finley home?

Because he's old and he sucks.

As others have mentioned, the Spurs had to sacrifice defense, the flow of their offense, and touches for other players just to even get Finley going in a game.

It's really pretty sad Pop even wants to bring the guy back as a reserve. I don't mind having a vet or two on the squad that can produce in limited time, but how can you count on him off the deep bench when the only way he showed a pulse in games last year was if you sacrificed the entire offense to get him some shots and dealt with the reality of playing defense 4 on 5?

[AFBlue]

Re-creating or even besting Finley's production from last year isn't that high a bar to hit, and really, that's Mason's target. I think Mason will do fine, probably much BETTER than Finley if he's given Fin's opportunities. To me, the BIG plus of Mason is that he's already played in a motion offense (the Princeton) with Washington, something most new Spurs struggle to learn in year one. I also expect the usual year two bump in productivity from Udoka this year.

Udoka's year-two bump is really what I'm looking for this season.