If Obama is such a disastrously naive foreign policy noob...

[PixelPusher]

...then why do Bush and McCain keep co-opting his ideas? Bombing al-Qaeda in Pakistan, talking to Iran, re-focusing on Afghanistan, and now this:



McCain on 16-Month Iraq Exit
'It's a Pretty Good Timetable' (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/TheNote/story?id=3105455&page=1)
By TEDDY DAVIS, JAMES GERBER and GREGORY WALLACE
July 25, 2008

Remember when "timetable" was a dirty word for Republicans?
In a Friday interview, John McCain, R-Ariz., called 16 months "a pretty good timetable" for withdrawal from Iraq.

Back in January of this year, John McCain pilloried Mitt Romney for encouraging President Bush in April 2007 to develop a private "series of timetables and milestones" for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq.

"Timetables was the buzzword for those that wanted to get out," McCain scolded Romney at a Jan. 30 debate at the Reagan Library in Simi Valley, Calif.

How the (time)tables have turned.

During a Friday interview with CNN, McCain called a 16-month withdrawal from Iraq "a pretty good timetable."

That answer came when McCain was asked by Wolf Blitzer about the Iraqi prime minister's recent description of a 16-month timetable as "the right timeframe for a withdrawal, with the possibility of slight changes."

Barack Obama, of course, has long favored a 16-month timetable for withdrawal.

[clambake]

even the hardcore right has to acknowledge that borrowing a trillion dollars to wage war in a country over resources has killed the value of the US dollar. a timetable is a given to start any recovery. we have to use the time with intelligence.

[Mr. Peabody]

...then why do Bush and McCain keep co-opting his ideas? Bombing al-Qaeda in Pakistan, talking to Iran, re-focusing on Afghanistan, and now this:

It's simple. When Obama proposes those ideas, they stem from his naivete. When McCain and Bush follow his proposed ideas, it's because they used their experience and superior knowledge of facts to come to those ideas independently.

[Cry Havoc]

If Obama is such a disastrously naive foreign policy noob...

Then why do 200,000 German citizens show up for one of his addresses before he's even elected president?

[manufor3]

even the hardcore right has to acknowledge that borrowing a trillion dollars to wage war in a country over resources has killed the value of the US dollar. a timetable is a given to start any recovery. we have to use the time with intelligence.

+1

[Anti.Hero]

even the hardcore right has to acknowledge that borrowing a trillion dollars to wage war in a country over resources has killed the value of the US dollar. a timetable is a given to start any recovery. we have to use the time with intelligence.

We can acknowledge it all we want. There is money to be made for the higher ups so it matters naught.

[Anti.Hero]

Then why do 200,000 German citizens show up for one of his addresses before he's even elected president?

Free music, beer, bratwurst, etc etc

Fuck it, let's just let the citizens of the world elect Obamassiah. I highly value their opinions to set America back on the right track. :toast

[Mr. Peabody]

Free music, beer, bratwurst, etc etc



:lol I guess that was a shock to the beer and bratwurst vendors that were there selling their goods to the crowd.

Don't believe everything Hannity and Limbaugh tells you.


Berliners Jam Park to Hear, Touch Obama in Concert Atmosphere

By Patrick Donahue

July 24 (Bloomberg) -- Berlin's city center took on the atmosphere of a rock concert as more than 200,000 people jammed the German capital's Tiergarten park to hear U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama.

Spectators chanted ``yes we can,'' Obama's catchphrase, as the 46-year-old senator stressed the shared ``burdens of global citizenship'' that bind the U.S. and Europe. Beer and sausage vendors lining the park provided refreshments.

``He's extremely charismatic -- I've never seen anybody like this,'' said Wolfgang Zuchowsky, a 73-year-old retired police officer from Berlin. ``It's much better than what we've seen from the American style in the last few years, quite a bit more intellectual than the current president.''

The 220-foot (67-meter) Victory Column towered above the Democratic senator, who spoke facing the Brandenburg Gate, the historic monument that Chancellor Angela Merkel steered him away from using as the site of his speech. One sign held up said, ``Obama for Chancellor.''

``I thought he was very good,'' said Julian Metz, a 27-year- old architecture student in Berlin who shook Obama's hand after the speech. ``It was a great feeling to touch him.''

The speech drew parallels to those of American presidents past, notably Ronald Reagan's 1987 entreaty to Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev to ``tear down this wall'' and John F. Kennedy's claim -- then in front of the Schoeneberg City Hall in 1963 -- that he was one of them, ``Ich bin ein Berliner.''

[Cry Havoc]

Free music, beer, bratwurst, etc etc

Fuck it, let's just let the citizens of the world elect Obamassiah. I highly value their opinions to set America back on the right track. :toast

Don't let the truth get in the way of what you want to believe. You think 200,000 Germans would show up for McCain? Do you think 20,000 would show up for McCain?

Let me tell you what I highly value. I highly value the idea that it actually matters what other nations think of the U.S., because we live in a GLOBAL economy. I highly value the idea that that we need to not just be a developed nation, but an example to other developing nations. I value the idea that for a ~70 years now, America has set every standard across the globe for living conditions, economic prosperity, and the rights of civilians to live relatively free. And now the simple fact is we cannot just overpower countries with our mighty work ethic and domineering industrial strength -- because we ARE NOT INVINCIBLE.

I am NOT saddened by the fact that other nations are catching us, but I am HORRIFIED that our government has become an in-crowd of lobbyists and dominated by big businessmen acting in their own self-interest to line their pockets.

I am SICK of believing that this is "just a phase" that we are going through and that continuing to ignore issues like what pouring trillions (that's X,000,000,000,000 dollars+) worth of American currency into a war that has had no support and until 2 weeks ago not a single major success, I'm sick of thinking that doesn't affect and hurt (read: depress) our economy.

Mostly though, I'm tired of watching 8 years of a presidency run by a "C" student who does not possess the vocabulary or intellect that most modest college sophomores would have. I am tired of the world mocking us with good reason as our currency denigrates while other developed nations pass us. McCain openly espouses many of Bush's policies -- yeah, they've done so great. That's why we're in recession, possibly close to the 2nd great depression, the world hates us, and we are fighting an exorbitantly expensive war overseas while we cannot afford to educate our own youth here to better our country in the future.

I am sick of the GOP telling us to stick our heads in the sand and believe that it will all just go away someday like the wave of a wand from Harry Potter.

We deserve better than that. We deserve better than elections determined by 60+ year old individuals who vote the same ticket every four years even if the candidate was a convicted child molester.

But I'm hopeful that there is change possible. I'm hopeful that Obama has enough intelligence and wherewithal to bring the United States at least part of the way back. That he's resourceful enough to get some people off their butts who normally wouldn't vote, and actually line the ballot boxes for a reason other than "I'm voting for my party like I always do." I'm hopeful that this country can get back to it's position as the envy of the free world without needing a war to facilitate that effort. And I'm GLAD that he's not as experienced in politics, because from everything I have seen out of Congress, "experienced" is just another way to describe someone who has been shopped around enough that they know who the highest bidder is and how to sell to them. I see POTENTIAL in Obama, something I haven't seen in my young life at all in American politics.

---

There. I know you didn't read all that, but I don't care, because I finally said what I felt needed to be said. Resume your ostrich-like behavior and hoping 4 more years of the same will fix all our problems.

[Clandestino]

Then why do 200,000 German citizens show up for one of his addresses before he's even elected president?

because they're germans

[Mr. Peabody]

Don't let the truth get in the way of what you want to believe. You think 200,000 Germans would show up for McCain? Do you think 20,000 would show up for McCain?

Let me tell you what I highly value. I highly value the idea that it actually matters what other nations think of the U.S., because we live in a GLOBAL economy. I highly value the idea that that we need to not just be a developed nation, but an example to other developing nations. I value the idea that for a ~70 years now, America has set every standard across the globe for living conditions, economic prosperity, and the rights of civilians to live relatively free. And now the simple fact is we cannot just overpower countries with our mighty work ethic and domineering industrial strength -- because we ARE NOT INVINCIBLE.

I am NOT saddened by the fact that other nations are catching us, but I am HORRIFIED that our government has become an in-crowd of lobbyists and dominated by big businessmen acting in their own self-interest to line their pockets.

I am SICK of believing that this is "just a phase" that we are going through and that continuing to ignore issues like what pouring trillions (that's X,000,000,000,000 dollars+) worth of American currency into a war that has had no support and until 2 weeks ago not a single major success, I'm sick of thinking that doesn't affect and hurt (read: depress) our economy.

Mostly though, I'm tired of watching 8 years of a presidency run by a "C" student who does not possess the vocabulary or intellect that most modest college sophomores would have. I am tired of the world mocking us with good reason as our currency denigrates while other developed nations pass us. McCain openly espouses many of Bush's policies -- yeah, they've done so great. That's why we're in recession, possibly close to the 2nd great depression, the world hates us, and we are fighting an exorbitantly expensive war overseas while we cannot afford to educate our own youth here to better our country in the future.

I am sick of the GOP telling us to stick our heads in the sand and believe that it will all just go away someday like the wave of a wand from Harry Potter.

We deserve better than that. We deserve better than elections determined by 60+ year old individuals who vote the same ticket every four years even if the candidate was a convicted child molester.

But I'm hopeful that there is change possible. I'm hopeful that Obama has enough intelligence and wherewithal to bring the United States at least part of the way back. That he's resourceful enough to get some people off their butts who normally wouldn't vote, and actually line the ballot boxes for a reason other than "I'm voting for my party like I always do." I'm hopeful that this country can get back to it's position as the envy of the free world without needing a war to facilitate that effort. And I'm GLAD that he's not as experienced in politics, because from everything I have seen out of Congress, "experienced" is just another way to describe someone who has been shopped around enough that they know who the highest bidder is and how to sell to them. I see POTENTIAL in Obama, something I haven't seen in my young life at all in American politics.

---

There. I know you didn't read all that, but I don't care, because I finally said what I felt needed to be said. Resume your ostrich-like behavior and hoping 4 more years of the same will fix all our problems.

+1

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Then why do 200,000 German citizens show up for one of his addresses before he's even elected president?
that's the most stupidest thing i've ever read on here, and that is a tough task to achieve. :toast

[Mr. Peabody]

that's the most stupidest thing i've ever read on here, and that is a tough task to achieve. :toast

Oh, the sweet, sweet irony.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Oh, the sweet, sweet irony.
Remember that Obamessiah loves you

[Cry Havoc]

that's the most stupidest thing i've ever read on here, and that is a tough task to achieve. :toast

The most stupidest?

Pardon me if I don't pine for your intellectual approval in the future.