POLL: it ends now 92 vs 08 Team

[lebomb]

92 here and its not close. :lmao

[Thunder Dan]

1992 had a better bench

http://www.checkoutmycards.com/CardImages/Cards/013/796/07F.jpg

[Brutalis]

Like I said.. 1992.

[manufor3]

92

[baseline bum]

A team with Magic/Jordan/Bird would beat any team comprised of any set of 12 other players who ever lived.

[Medvedenko]

A team with Magic/Jordan/Bird would beat any team comprised of any set of 12 other players who ever lived.

I agree in their prime....I agree...but in 92 only MJ was in his prime.

[rj215]

The team with the greatest player ever, the greatest PG, the greatest SF, couple of the top 3 PFs and a few of the top Cs....Plus the 2008 Redeem Team is hyper athletic but they aren't are smart as the Original. If they played a best of 7, it would be 4-1 or 4-2 Dream Team....And Kobe is the best all around player right now but he's not MJ. It's a shame that time makes people forget how good and how competitive MJ was. Put him on this years Lakers and they'd win the Finals....no way he'd let Paul Pierce outplay him...

[lefty]

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/5185/surveyuv4.jpg

[TheMadHatter]

The team with the greatest player ever, the greatest PG, the greatest SF, couple of the top 3 PFs and a few of the top Cs....Plus the 2008 Redeem Team is hyper athletic but they aren't are smart as the Original. If they played a best of 7, it would be 4-1 or 4-2 Dream Team....And Kobe is the best all around player right now but he's not MJ. It's a shame that time makes people forget how good and how competitive MJ was. Put him on this years Lakers and they'd win the Finals....no way he'd let Paul Pierce outplay him...

Nope. MJ would not carry this Laker team past the Celtics. He slows Pierce down a little, but no way does he plug up all the enormous defensive holes that existed. All the Celtics would have to do is run screen roll plays for Pierce to switch off MJ. Whose gonna block him at the rim....Gasol? I don't think so.

The teams that had the best success against the Celtics were tough and physical teams like CLE and DET. Teams that could keep Pierce and co. in check with multiple shot blockers at the rim and force him/them to shoot outside.

[TheNextGen]

The team with the greatest player ever, the greatest PG, the greatest SF, couple of the top 3 PFs and a few of the top Cs....Plus the 2008 Redeem Team is hyper athletic but they aren't are smart as the Original. If they played a best of 7, it would be 4-1 or 4-2 Dream Team....And Kobe is the best all around player right now but he's not MJ. It's a shame that time makes people forget how good and how competitive MJ was. Put him on this years Lakers and they'd win the Finals....no way he'd let Paul Pierce outplay him...


Even MJ wouldnt lead a bunch of softies like The Lakers past this last years Celtics. You're right, its a shame that time makes people forget how competitive MJ was, but its a shame how people can overhype him aswell.

[Medvedenko]

I forgot MJ never had a bad series or lost in the playoffs. I totally forgot, I thought he won every game while scoring 40 per game on 90% shooting all while playing defense on each opponent for the entire game.

[monosylab1k]

I forgot MJ never had a bad series or lost in the playoffs. I totally forgot, I thought he won every game while scoring 40 per game on 90% shooting all while playing defense on each opponent for the entire game.

He never lost in the Finals. He never played on a team that set a record for epic losing in the Finals. And he'd never quit on his team the way Kobe has done plenty of times in the past. Kill yourself.

[monosylab1k]

:lmao Laker Fags think Jordan couldn't lead their team better than Kobe.......Swap out Jordan for Kobe and the Lakers beat Boston in 5.

He would never have allowed that Game 4 meltdown to happen.

[Medvedenko]

:lmao Laker Fags think Jordan couldn't lead their team better than Kobe.......Swap out Jordan for Kobe and the Lakers beat Boston in 5.

He would never have allowed that Game 4 meltdown to happen.

Sure they do....I can play your game.
Swap out Pippen and replace them with Gasol and let's see how the Bulls do.

[TheNextGen]

:lmao Laker Fags think Jordan couldn't lead their team better than Kobe.......Swap out Jordan for Kobe and the Lakers beat Boston in 5.

He would never have allowed that Game 4 meltdown to happen.

I WANT WHAT HE'S SMOKIN :rollin

[TheNextGen]

Sure they do....I can play your game.
Swap out Pippen and replace them with Gasol and let's see how the Bulls do.

If they replace Marbury with Jordan, Knicks would be champs right now.

[SenorSpur]

92 in an all-out runaway ROUT!

That '92 team was THE best team ever assembled in basketball history. Need proof? That team amassed the largest average margin of victory of any team in Olympic history.

On many an occasion, I've listened to interviews where either Jordan or Magic proclaimed that the toughest competition they faced was in practice against one another. Those sessions would be all-out wars. The intensity was so high that there would be near-fights every single day.

That team was so vastly superior in mind, body and heart, that one cannot compare. Those guys would "wax the floor" with this latest collection of pampered NBA superstars.

[TheNextGen]

92 in an all-out runaway ROUT!

That '92 team was THE best team ever assembled in basketball history. Need proof? That team amassed the largest average margin of victory of any team in Olympic history.

On many an occasion, I've listened to interviews where either Jordan or Magic proclaimed that the toughest competition they faced was in practice against one another. Those sessions would be all-out wars. The intensity was so high that there would be near-fights every single day.

That team was so vastly superior in mind, body and heart, that one cannot compare. Those guys would "wax the floor" with this latest collection of pampered NBA superstars.

hmm..you would think that the margin of victory was so high because maybe the competition sucked ass. Wait...thats exactly what Magic and Jordan proclaimed.

[baseline bum]

I agree in their prime....I agree...but in 92 only MJ was in his prime.

Bird was a clearly lesser player by that time, but Magic was only 31 or 32 and was still a franchise-level player at the time, even after a year away from the game.

[dallaskd]

Sure they do....I can play your game.
Swap out Pippen and replace them with Gasol and let's see how the Bulls do.

Lakers still lose to Boston. Bulls are soft and worse off but MJ is a god so Chicago wins. fail.

[TDMVPDPOY]

one name

DAVID ROBINSON

[TheMadHatter]

Jordan on the Lakers doesn't change the FINAL outcome of the series one bit. The Lakers major problems were on the DEFENSIVE end, mainly in terms of shot-blocking and rebounding. Two areas where Jordan would have the LEAST impact. Nice try.

It's incredible how stupid people are when it comes to star players. You need a TEAM to win at the highest level, no player in history has ever done it entirely on his own. Not even Jordan, he failed many a time until he got a quality cast of characters around him and a great HOF coach to help guide him.

[baseline bum]

Jordan on the Lakers doesn't change the FINAL outcome of the series one bit. The Lakers major problems were on the DEFENSIVE end, mainly in terms of shot-blocking and rebounding. Two areas where Jordan would have the LEAST impact. Nice try.

It's incredible how stupid people are when it comes to star players. You need a TEAM to win at the highest level, no player in history has ever done it entirely on his own. Not even Jordan, he failed many a time until he got a quality cast of characters around him and a great HOF coach to help guide him.

Jordan's a far superior defender to Bryant. You could throw Jordan on Pierce or Allen instead of hiding Bryant on Rondo. Jordan is also the ultimate finisher at the rim, and no one (or four) keeps him out of the lane. With Jordan instead of Bryant, no way LA takes more than 6 to win the series.

[baseline bum]

Not even Jordan, he failed many a time until he got a quality cast of characters around him and a great HOF coach to help guide him.

You mean like that HOF coach Kobe has and that deep supporting cast that blitzed through the western conference playoffs?

[phyzik]

Medvedenko... you DO realize Kobe is fucking sucking it up in the olympics so far except for that sweet alleyoop from Kid.... right?

There is no freaking way Jordan would have sucked this bad.... and Kobe isnt even that bad. In fact he is damn good..... Jordan was just that much better.

[TheMadHatter]

Kobe is 30 years old and has played more games this year than anyone on the team. He had one week of rest after the NBA Finals and was back on the horse preparing for the Olympics with Team USA. He is also playing with a dislocated pinky on his SHOOTING hand which directly affects his SHOOTING. Put things in perspective.

Kobe doesn't need to dominate for us to beat teams by 30-40 pts. He's still playing lockdown defense. And please fucking stop with this "Jordan would never had....", nobody on this forum actually thinks Kobe is better than Jordan.

[stretch]

:lmao @ lebomb constantly saying that this topic isnt worth his time, yet he spends time making about another 20 posts on the subject, and then makes a whole new thread dedicated to the same exact subject

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

NO

FREAKIN

COMPARISON.

92 was the only Dream Team there will ever be, and any comparisons to that team are asinine.

[BUMP]

NO

FREAKIN

COMPARISON.

92 was the only Dream Team there will ever be, and any comparisons to that team are asinine.


[/discussion]

[TheMACHINE]

Jordan's a far superior defender to Bryant. You could throw Jordan on Pierce or Allen instead of hiding Bryant on Rondo. Jordan is also the ultimate finisher at the rim, and no one (or four) keeps him out of the lane. With Jordan instead of Bryant, no way LA takes more than 6 to win the series.


:lol:lmao :hat

[monosylab1k]

Kobe is 30 years old and has played more games this year than anyone on the team. He had one week of rest after the NBA Finals and was back on the horse preparing for the Olympics with Team USA. He is also playing with a dislocated pinky on his SHOOTING hand which directly affects his SHOOTING.

:cry

everybody give Kobe a break on how much he sucks in the Olympics...he's vewwy vewwy tired! Kobe needs more nappy time :cry

[baseline bum]

Laker fans are fucking stupid using the weak supporting cast excuse. Kobe lost them that series. All season and all playoffs that supporting cast was huge for them, and they were the deepest team in the league last year. Every NBA writer picked them to beat Boston, because none of them anticipated Bryant pulling an 04 Kobe again.

[monosylab1k]

Laker fans are fucking stupid using the weak supporting cast excuse. Kobe lost them that series. All season and all playoffs that supporting cast was huge for them, and they were the deepest team in the league last year. Every NBA writer picked them to beat Boston, because none of them anticipated Bryant pulling an 04 Kobe again.

Everybody was sucking off Lamar Odom & Gasol up until the Finals, talking about how great they were and how Odom was the best #3 option in the league, then after getting the shit kicked out of them by Boston it's "how do you expect Kobe to win with a shitty supporting cast?"

[TheMACHINE]

Everybody was sucking off Lamar Odom & Gasol up until the Finals, talking about how great they were and how Odom was the best #3 option in the league, then after getting the shit kicked out of them by Boston it's "how do you expect Kobe to win with a shitty supporting cast?"

So are you saying that Gasol and Odom were crazy ass good in the Finals?

[monosylab1k]

So are you saying that Gasol and Odom were crazy ass good in the Finals?

I guess when your leader starts playing like shit, the #2 and #3 guys are quick to follow.

[TheMACHINE]

I guess when your leader starts playing like shit, the #2 and #3 guys are quick to follow.

haha ok...nice one. Start backtracking.

[monosylab1k]

haha ok...nice one. Start backtracking.

Remember that time the Bulls lost in the Finals because Pippen & Kukoc sucked?

[TheMACHINE]

Remember that time the Bulls lost in the Finals because Pippen & Kukoc sucked?


im starting to think that you dont even know what the point of your arguement is anymore. Think about it a little more...then start digging yourself out of the hole you made.

[monosylab1k]

im starting to think that you dont even know what the point of your arguement is anymore. Think about it a little more...then start digging yourself out of the hole you made.

:lmao why do Lakers fans enjoy making morons out of themselves?

[TheNextGen]

im starting to think that you dont even know what the point of your arguement is anymore. Think about it a little more...then start digging yourself out of the hole you made.


Mono is busting a Kobe...he's talking outloud but not thinking.

[TheMACHINE]

:lmao why do Lakers fans enjoy making morons out of themselves?


i take it your done with your case...its ok..we wont bring it up...we didnt noticed you were confused. I do like your strategy..."umm im stuck...let me put on a ROFL emote and call him a moron, and maybe they wont notice."

[monosylab1k]

Mono is busting a Kobe...he's talking outloud but not thinking.

oh this is just rich! man there are some stupid ass motherfuckers in this thread.

[TheNextGen]

oh this is just rich! man there are some stupid ass motherfuckers in this thread.


i take it your done with your case...its ok..we wont bring it up...we didnt noticed you were confused. I do like your strategy..."umm im stuck...let me put on a ROFL emote and call him a moron, and maybe they wont notice."

Holy crap! You were right. He does do that!

[monosylab1k]

i take it your done with your case...its ok..we wont bring it up...we didnt noticed you were confused. I do like your strategy..."umm im stuck...let me put on a ROFL emote and call him a moron, and maybe they wont notice."

Stuck where? Explain where i'm stuck please, if you can. I'm just fine with my stance. Maybe, just maybe, you're the fucking moron that isn't getting it.

[TheMACHINE]

So according to Mono, Lakers fans cant say that the supporting cast sucked in the Finals, but when asked if the supporitng cast was good, its a "no" but only cuz Kobe sucked. ok. Good case.

[TheNextGen]

So according to Mono, Lakers fans cant say that the supporting cast sucked in the Finals, but when asked if the supporitng cast was good, its a "no" but only cuz Kobe sucked. ok. Good case.

Cocaine is one hella of a drug.

[TheNextGen]

So according to Mono, Lakers fans cant say that the supporting cast sucked in the Finals, but when asked if the supporitng cast was good, its a "no" but only cuz Kobe sucked. ok. Good case.

Hello man..wake up...When Gasol goes one on one with Garnett on the post and does a fade away hook shot and bricks...dont you know its Kobe's fault. Sheesh! But if MJ were there. His shot would go in and Gasol would be iron strong and bully Garnett.

[monosylab1k]

So according to Mono, Lakers fans cant say that the supporting cast sucked in the Finals, but when asked if the supporitng cast was good, its a "no" but only cuz Kobe sucked. ok. Good case.

Nobody qualified the supporting cast sucking only "in the Finals" they just said the supporting cast sucked. Go re-read the words of your own fellow fans you stupid, stupid motherfucker.

[TheMACHINE]

Nobody qualified the supporting cast sucking only "in the Finals" they just said the supporting cast sucked. Go re-read the words of your own fellow fans you stupid, stupid motherfucker.

So ONCE AGAIN, I'll ask you. How was Kobe's supporitng cast in the Finals?

[monosylab1k]

So ONCE AGAIN, I'll ask you. How was Kobe's supporitng cast in the Finals?

as good as their leader. like every supporting cast in history.

[monosylab1k]

i'll ask you - how was Kobe in the finals?

[TheNextGen]

as good as their leader. like every supporting cast in history.

haha...what a goober. You should be writing children's books.

[TheMACHINE]

i'll ask you - how was Kobe in the finals?

Kobe wasn't that good. Its hard to play 1vs3. Too bad his supporting cast didn't step up to ease up the triple teams. See what I did there?

[monosylab1k]

haha...what a goober. You should be writing children's books.

Well at least you actually read books, i'll give you that much.

[monosylab1k]

Kobe wasn't that good.

Thank you.

[TheMACHINE]

Thank you.

Because Lamar and Pau sucked ass.

You're welcome.

Catch 22? :king

[TheNextGen]

You two are retarted. I'll end this.

Kobe sucked, cuz his suporting team sucked. So..the whole team sucked. Im off to work!

[monosylab1k]

Jordan wasn't that good

[monosylab1k]

You two are retarted. I'll end this.

Kobe sucked, cuz his suporting team sucked. So..the whole team sucked. Im off to work!

Don't burn the fries.

[TheNextGen]

Don't burn the fries.

That's what your wife keeps saying to me when she orders the Ultimate Cheeseburger, Large Fries, side of Ranch and a Large DIET coke everyday she's here. She's on a diet, she wants to keep her sexy Whale like figure for the Mailman.

[monosylab1k]

That's what your wife keeps saying to me when she orders the Ultimate Cheeseburger, Large Fries, side of Ranch and a Large DIET coke everyday she's here. She's on a diet, she wants to keep her sexy Whale like figure for the Mailman.

whatever you say there, Slugger. Keep working on those witty comebacks and maybe you can work the drive thru line.

[TheMACHINE]

That's what your wife keeps saying to me when she orders the Ultimate Cheeseburger, Large Fries, side of Ranch and a Large DIET coke everyday she's here. She's on a diet, she wants to keep her sexy Whale like figure for the Mailman.

Oh SHIT! :lol:lmao


Watchout. Mono is gonna come back with a "You're a Mother Fucking Moron"

:lobt2:

[monosylab1k]

Kobe wasn't that good.

[TheNextGen]

whatever you say there, Slugger. Keep working on those witty comebacks and maybe you can work the drive thru line.

Cuz "Don't burn the fries" was the best comeback ever!! Oh wait! uh oh...he busted the "Drive thru line" comeback. CRAZY!

[monosylab1k]

Cuz "Don't burn the fries" was the best comeback ever!! Oh wait! uh oh...he busted the "Drive thru line" comeback. CRAZY!

I'm just amused you admitted to reading children's books and have a lucrative job in fast food.

[TheNextGen]

I'm just amused you admitted to reading children's books and have a lucrative job in fast food.

I'm also amused that you have Infectious Mononucleosis, but arn't embarassed to let everyone on Spurs Talk know.

[monosylab1k]

I'm also amused that you have Infectious Mononucleosis, but arn't embarassed to let everyone on Spurs Talk know.

:bking

[TheMACHINE]

I'm also amused that you have Infectious Mononucleosis, but arn't embarassed to let everyone on Spurs Talk know.


:wow

[monosylab1k]

Kobe wasn't that good.

[TheMACHINE]

really...he wasnt

[TheMadHatter]

I get Spur fan hatred of the Lakers......we've ended their playoff hopes too many times to count. But Mav fan......not drawing the connection here. When the hell was the last time we even faced off in the playoffs?

Anyways, we get it. Kobe wasn't that great in the Finals, but neither were any of his teammates. He alone wasn't the reason that they lost, and really there isn't much he could have done as an individual to change the final outcome of the series. The Lakers needed strong interior defense and rebounding to keep Pierce out of the lanes and KG and Perkins off the glass.

Explain to me how Michael Jordan fixes this enough to make a difference in the final outcome. Like I said before, maybe he slows down Pierce a little more but all BOS would have to do is run screen roll plays to get a weaker defender onto Pierce. Who is going to block Pierce at the rim......nobody. The Lakers lost as a TEAM. Let's end this stupid discussion now.

[baseline bum]

I get Spur fan hatred of the Lakers......we've ended their playoff hopes too many times to count. But Mav fan......not drawing the connection here. When the hell was the last time we even faced off in the playoffs?

Anyways, we get it. Kobe wasn't that great in the Finals, but neither were any of his teammates. He alone wasn't the reason that they lost, and really there isn't much he could have done as an individual to change the final outcome of the series. The Lakers needed strong interior defense and rebounding to keep Pierce out of the lanes and KG and Perkins off the glass.

Explain to me how Michael Jordan fixes this enough to make a difference in the final outcome. Like I said before, maybe he slows down Pierce a little more but all BOS would have to do is run screen roll plays to get a weaker defender onto Pierce. Who is going to block Pierce at the rim......nobody. The Lakers lost as a TEAM. Let's end this stupid discussion now.

1) Jordan is strong enough to fight over a screen that Kobe cannot.
2) Jordan is strong enough to not get bullied by Pierce when the Celtics switched him on him. He's also strong enough to get to the rim and finish against Pierce. On the flip side, he's strong enough to keep Pierce from going nuts in the lane on the other side of the ball.
3) Jordan had a devastating post game that Kobe has never even tried to cultivate since '04.
4) Michael Jordan can actually play defense. You don't have to hide him on the Rajon Rondos, Bruce Bowens, and Doug Christies of the league that Phil Jackson has had to put Kobe on for years.

[baseline bum]

5) Jordan wouldn't shoot 40.5% or constantly jack up stupid threes at 32%

[TheMadHatter]

1) Jordan is strong enough to fight over a screen that Kobe cannot.
2) Jordan is strong enough to not get bullied by Pierce when the Celtics switched him on him. He's also strong enough to get to the rim and finish against Pierce. On the flip side, he's strong enough to keep Pierce from going nuts in the lane on the other side of the ball.
3) Jordan had a devastating post game that Kobe has never even tried to cultivate since '04.
4) Michael Jordan can actually play defense. You don't have to hide him on the Rajon Rondos, Bruce Bowens, and Doug Christies of the league that Phil Jackson has had to put Kobe on for years.

1.) Not against the illegal NFL screens KG was setting.

2.) The Celtics kept Lebron James from finishing at the rim and held him to a ridiculously low 19% from the field for the first couple of games. If Lebron ain't getting to the hoop there is no way Jordan is having that much more success. Jordan has tried going 1-5 in his career and failed many a time, most notably against the Pistons.

3.) In Jordan's day it was illegal to double team a man in the post if he didn't have the ball already, which is why Jordan was able to be so effective from there.



"The new rules only affect post players if they are double-teamed by the defense. The defense may double-team any player at any time. With the old illegal defense guidelines, a player could not be double-teamed unless he had the ball"

4.) Kobe can play very good defense, hence his nickname on Team USA "dober-mamba". The problem is he is relied upon to do everything on offense as well, he is put on weaker players like Bowen and Rondo to conserve his energy. Not because he is a crappy defender. Don't take my word for it, here is what Carlos Boozer had to say about Kobe a few weeks back:

"Kobe can stop anybody!"

[Medvedenko]

Like I said in prior posts....

You take Kobe off the team and put in Jordan, they still lose in 6.

Jordan can't gaurd Ray, Piece and garnett by himself. Oh, shit...I forgot he can, my bad.

[Anti.Hero]

Kobe is 30 years old and has played more games this year than anyone on the team.


Just another day at the office. Let's do work.

[baseline bum]

1.) Not against the illegal NFL screens KG was setting.

2.) The Celtics kept Lebron James from finishing at the rim and held him to a ridiculously low 19% from the field for the first couple of games. If Lebron ain't getting to the hoop there is no way Jordan is having that much more success. Jordan has tried going 1-5 in his career and failed many a time, most notably against the Pistons.

3.) In Jordan's day it was illegal to double team a man in the post if he didn't have the ball already, which is why Jordan was able to be so effective from there.



4.) Kobe can play very good defense, hence his nickname on Team USA "dober-mamba". The problem is he is relied upon to do everything on offense as well, he is put on weaker players like Bowen and Rondo to conserve his energy. Not because he is a crappy defender. Don't take my word for it, here is what Carlos Boozer had to say about Kobe a few weeks back:

"Kobe can stop anybody!"

Jordan could fight over the Bad Boys and Karl Malone, but he couldn't hang with KG's "NFL" screens? :lmao

Like Jordan didn't have to carry his teams. That's rich; Kobe Bryant is the most overrated defensive player in years. Good defensive players play good offensive players; not people who can't hit a jump shot or put the ball on the floor.

LMAO @ saying LeBron could finish like Jordan. No one finishes at the rim like Jordan, and only someone who never watched him play would argue otherwise.

[The Franchise]

Jordan could fight over the Bad Boys and Karl Malone, but he couldn't hang with KG's "NFL" screens? :lmao

Like Jordan didn't have to carry his teams. That's rich; Kobe Bryant is the most overrated defensive player in years. Good defensive players play good offensive players; not people who can't hit a jump shot or put the ball on the floor.

LMAO @ saying LeBron could finish like Jordan. No one finishes at the rim like Jordan, and only someone who never watched him play would argue otherwise.

You have to admit the man does make sense.

[TheMadHatter]

baseline bum has apparently never heard of Scottie Pippen, Ron Harper, or Dennis Rodman. All of whom were assigned the task of guarding the opposing team's best players so Jordan could conserve his energy on offense.


First of all, I am going to clear this up: young Michael Jordan (1985-1993) was one of the greatest defensive guards in history. He in on the short list of greatest defensive guards, along with Walt Frazier, Sidney Moncrief, K.C. Jones, and Joe Dumars. Jordan's only weakness was being posted up. Magic Johnson exploited this in games 1 and 2 of the 1991 Finals. After putting 3 fouls on Jordan in the first half of game 2, Phil Jackson opted to move Pippen over to guard Magic and put Jordan on James Worthy. Fortunately for Jordan and Jackson, Worthy was playing on a sprained ankle, which eliminated his dominance (he had 3 inches on Jordan, and he was the guy who dropped 42 points on Dennis Rodman in Game 7 of the 1988 finals).

Young Jordan was an exceptional ball defender and he was the very best player of his era at roaming the passing lanes.

There, it's out. He was a very good defender. I don't have any problems with his 1988 defensive player of the year award and his 6 first-team all defense awards up that point.

However, after that, he was a very overrated defender. He got old and lost a step and it showed. It happens to everybody, but Jordan's fans couldn't accept it. Let me give examples.


In 1995 and 96, Clyde Drexler and Anfernee Hardaway continued giving Jordan problems when they posted up on him. That is undertandable as they were bigger than Jordan. However, Jordan's lost a step on his quickness and in 1996, Pooh Richardson lit up Jordan...Pooh Richardson. Damon Stoudamire had his way with Jordan that year (Stoudamire's rookie season). While Stoudamire was very quick, Phil Jackson's answer to him spoke volumes about Jordan: Phil put Scottie Pippen on Stoudamire. Jordan was so slow that a 6'7" 225 lb FORWARD was Jackson's answer to a guard. Phil began opting to put Ron Harper on the other team's better offensive guard. Jordan fanatics claim this was "resting" Jordan for offense. No, this is called "rationalizing." Young Jordan guarded the other team's best guard AND lit up his opponents for 32+ PPG.


Old Jordan simply could not guard the best guards any more (remember when he got caught in the switch with Allen Iverson the next year and how bad Iverson made him look?) .

What was truly sad was that Jordan continued making first team all-defense, but Ron Harper did not. Jordan wasn't even the best defensive guard on his own team any more. He didn't deserve those accolades.

Kobe is not the defender Jordan was, but he's no slouch either. He just can't be called upon to do everything at the age of 30. Neither was Jordan though. Stop rewriting history with your revisionist bullshit.

[baseline bum]

So you're basically admitting that Jordan was an elite defender at age 30, and didn't start falling off until about age 32. Thank you for proving my point.

[TheMadHatter]

So you're basically admitting that Jordan was an elite defender at age 30, and didn't start falling off until about age 32. Thank you for proving my point.

You mean this point?



"Michael Jordan can actually play defense. You don't have to hide him on the Rajon Rondos, Bruce Bowens, and Doug Christies of the league that Phil Jackson has had to put Kobe on for years."

Please stop. This is too easy.

[stretch]

LMAO @ saying LeBron could finish like Jordan. No one finishes at the rim like Jordan, and only someone who never watched him play would argue otherwise.

i dont think he was really talking about his finishing ability. he was talking about finding a way to get to the hoop. and honestly, when Jordan puts his head down and drives, I think pretty much anyone would be less afraid of him than when Lebron puts his head down and drives, because lebron is bigger, stronger, and faster than jordan. he was saying more that if Lebron can't bulldoze his way to the hoop, then Jordan probably wouldnt fare any better. granted, Jordan was more skilled, so he could find other ways to get to the hoop.

and he did bring up a good point, that until Jordan learned to play better team ball, he was unable to beat the Pistons. the reason he could take over at any time, was because early in the games, he would get his teammates involved, which would make the opposing defenders have to respect their shot more, so late in games, when they were still in a rhythm, Jordan could have an easier time getting a shot off. and if they still decided to collapse on Jordan, then he could dish it out, as evidenced by GW shots in the Finals by guys like Paxson and Kerr.

again, I love Jordan. my favorite player ever. greatest player ever. but many people forget in his early years, he played a lot like Kobe did, not knowing when and when not to get his teammates involved. but when he figured that out, he was absolutely unstoppable. again, i think the main thing that sets kobe and jordan apart, are not their skillset. their skills are extremely comparable and very close. but Kobe does not have the leader's mentality that Jordan had, which is what separates the two.

[stretch]

4.) Kobe can play very good defense, hence his nickname on Team USA "dober-mamba". The problem is he is relied upon to do everything on offense as well, he is put on weaker players like Bowen and Rondo to conserve his energy. Not because he is a crappy defender.

I don't get why people use this excuse for Kobe, but not for Lebron. Only Lebron has to do A LOT more on offense for his team. But when he wants to, he has proven he can shut anyone down, including Kobe which he did twice this year in two very close 4th quarters, while Kobe had absolutely no answer for Lebron. And IMO at his best, Lebron is a far better defender than Kobe, because he plays more of a Bruce Bowen "shut-down" type of defense, forcing the ball either out of his opponents hand or into a bad shot. Kobe just hacks and goes for steals and turnovers. If Lebron gets some quality help, he will start making all-defense teams as well.

[baseline bum]

James Worthy = Rajon Rondo? ok

[TheNextGen]

Man. The way people talk about Jordan these days. Jordan is better than Kobe...but you guys act like he's Jesus Christ. That Boston team will still beat the Lakers even if he replaced Kobe. Boston will still be triple teaming his ass...and Lamar and Pau will still be pussies. Even jordan cant beat the 08 Champs.

[baseline bum]

Man. The way people talk about Jordan these days. Jordan is better than Kobe...but you guys act like he's Jesus Christ. That Boston team will still beat the Lakers even if he replaced Kobe. Boston will still be triple teaming his ass...and Lamar and Pau will still be pussies. Even jordan cant beat the 08 Champs.

Do you ever post anything not fellating Kobe? You must be Stu Lantz or some relation.

[angelbelow]

well at this point lebomb was right, its really not even close.

[TheMadHatter]

Do you ever post anything not fellating Kobe? You must be Stu Lantz or some relation.

Do you ever post anything not blasting Kobe? You must be mono or some relation.

[baseline bum]

Do you ever post anything not blasting Kobe? You must be mono or some relation.

Not in the NBA forum lately, with all the ridiculous Kobe threads.

Kobe fans are like George W. Bush supporters. Neither can do any wrong, and their failures are all attributable to those that surround them.

[Booharv]

Jordan>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kobe

[TheMadHatter]

Not in the NBA forum lately, with all the ridiculous Kobe threads.

Kobe fans are like George W. Bush supporters. Neither can do any wrong, and their failures are all attributable to those that surround them.

Except this WASN'T a Kobe thread and 99% of the Kobe threads are about people BASHING Kobe like you. Find me one thread on this forum where the OP is "openly fellating" Kobe like you say.

[monosylab1k]

Not in the NBA forum lately, with all the ridiculous Kobe threads.

Kobe fans are like George W. Bush supporters. Neither can do any wrong, and their failures are all attributable to those that surround them.

:lmao so true.

What's funny is that I don't even hate Kobe, I just hate Kobe supporters. They're as fucking annoying as it gets.

[baseline bum]

:lmao so true.

What's funny is that I don't even hate Kobe, I just hate Kobe supporters. They're as fucking annoying as it gets.

No shit. Kobe is an amazing player. I hate how the media and the Kobe fans hype him up like he's the greatest player of the last 10 years though. Spurs fans will admit when Duncan or Ginobili fucks up, Mav fans with Nowitzki, Rocket fans with McGrady, but Laker fan can never come to admit it when Kobe blows a series. Laker fans earned all the shit they get when they beat their chests and yelled about their depth all year and then turn on them and blame them for Bryant's failures when Kobe gets badly outplayed by Pierce in the Finals.

[rj215]

Kobe is super talented, super competitive and IMHO the best overall player right now BUT he still hasn't figured out when to take over and when to let his teammates help him. That's one aspect of the game where Jordan was a master. Jordan passed out to Kerr and Paxson for game winning shots and still had moments like his shot over Russell. Jordan's no god but no one has been close since.

And I don't get how some Laker fans can be so enthusiastic about next season with all the talent they have and then at the same time say that the talent they had wasn't good enough to win in the Finals. Yes I realize they lost Bynum but they essentially upgraded that position with Pau. I don't know if Bynum was healthy that they even get past the Spurs.

And lastly when did Paul F'n Pierce suddenly become this unstopable force? Kobe should have destroyed that dude; if for no other reason than to shut him up during this offseason.

[TheMadHatter]

Kobe is super talented, super competitive and IMHO the best overall player right now BUT he still hasn't figured out when to take over and when to let his teammates help him. That's one aspect of the game where Jordan was a master. Jordan passed out to Kerr and Paxson for game winning shots and still had moments like his shot over Russell. Jordan's no god but no one has been close since.

And I don't get how some Laker fans can be so enthusiastic about next season with all the talent they have and then at the same time say that the talent they had wasn't good enough to win in the Finals. Yes I realize they lost Bynum but they essentially upgraded that position with Pau. I don't know if Bynum was healthy that they even get past the Spurs.

And lastly when did Paul F'n Pierce suddenly become this unstopable force? Kobe should have destroyed that dude; if for no other reason than to shut him up during this offseason.

Basketball is not that simple. It's all about matchups. The team we had last year was incredibly efficient on offense but mediocre to poor in most defensive categories (compared with other playoff teams). This worked well against teams with mediocre defenses like DEN and UTA where we could just outscore them and win, but poorly against SAS and BOS who could hold LAL to 10-15 pts lower than their average. We were fortunate SAS had ran out of gas and Manu was injured, I'm not sure we take out a fully healthy and charged SAS team without Bynum.

But as you know one player can change the dynamics of a team dramatically, especially if that player is at the C position where he can impact the game the most on both ends of the floor. Think how good would the Spurs defense be without their anchor Tim Duncan? Without that last line of defense nothing else really works. Take Garnett off the Celtics and they probably aren't near the defensive team they were last season. Bynum coming back will also change the rotations dramatically. Radmanovich to the bench, Gasol to PF, Odom to SF.....these are big, big changes. I'm excited just to see how it will all turn out (don't tell me you wouldn't if you had 3 7fters on the floor).

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

I can't believe you guys are still arguing this point.

PG Magic Johnson/John Stockton
SG Michael Jordan/Clyde Drexler
SF Larry Bird/Scottie pippen/Chris Mullin
PF Karl Malone/Charles Barkley/(ahem)Christian Laettner
C David Robinson/Patrick Ewing

I don't know how that simple roster list doesn't answer the question!? :lol

[BUMP]

Man. The way people talk about Jordan these days. Jordan is better than Kobe...but you guys act like he's Jesus Christ. That Boston team will still beat the Lakers even if he replaced Kobe. Boston will still be triple teaming his ass...and Lamar and Pau will still be pussies. Even jordan cant beat the 08 Champs.

he actually is for 48 minutes

[MannyIsGod]

92 wins but its a LOT closer than many people are giving it credit for. If you subtract Boozer and JKidd from this team and replace them with Duncan/Brand and Baron Davis then I think it gets even closer.

[TDMVPDPOY]

92 wins but its a LOT closer than many people are giving it credit for. If you subtract Boozer and JKidd from this team and replace them with Duncan/Brand and Baron Davis then I think it gets even closer.

i dont think guys like brand/bosh/howard can defend drob/ewing....maybe duncan...but this will give them alot trouble to who is going to help duncan downlow to defend against malone or barkley

[stretch]

Man. The way people talk about Jordan these days. Jordan is better than Kobe...but you guys act like he's Jesus Christ.

I completely agree with this, and im a diehard Jordan fan.


That Boston team will still beat the Lakers even if he replaced Kobe. Boston will still be triple teaming his ass...and Lamar and Pau will still be pussies. Even jordan cant beat the 08 Champs.

I disagree with this. A lot of the reason Lamar and Pau played like pussies is because Kobe is a terrible leader/motivator. Jordan would get them motivated, even if it means calling them out a bunch and punching them in practices. And even if they dont win, they dont get humiliated the way they did, and the DEFINITLEY do not blow that 20 point lead in game 4. it would have been a hard fought series down to the wire.

[stretch]

i dont think guys like brand/bosh/howard can defend drob/ewing....maybe duncan...but this will give them alot trouble to who is going to help duncan downlow to defend against malone or barkley

as i have said before, even though i cant stand him and think he is massively overrated, i think that if they had KG on this team instead of Boozer, as good as the team already is, they would be considerably better.

[stretch]

I can't believe you guys are still arguing this point.

PG Magic Johnson/John Stockton
SG Michael Jordan/Clyde Drexler
SF Larry Bird/Scottie pippen/Chris Mullin
PF Karl Malone/Charles Barkley/(ahem)Christian Laettner
C David Robinson/Patrick Ewing

I don't know how that simple roster list doesn't answer the question!? :lol

because it doesnt.

[TheNextGen]

Do you ever post anything not fellating Kobe? You must be Stu Lantz or some relation.

:lmaoThis comment coming from a guy who has Kobe quote's on his signature..

:lol

[TheNextGen]

I completely agree with this, and im a diehard Jordan fan.



I disagree with this. A lot of the reason Lamar and Pau played like pussies is because Kobe is a terrible leader/motivator. Jordan would get them motivated, even if it means calling them out a bunch and punching them in practices. And even if they dont win, they dont get humiliated the way they did, and the DEFINITLEY do not blow that 20 point lead in game 4. it would have been a hard fought series down to the wire.

I understand your view, but to say they would win because of motivational factors is a bit much. Jordan is a hard competitor and he'll lay it on the floor, but we cant really say that his leadership will necessarily effect the pussiness of Odom and Gasol.

[baseline bum]

Seriously, you're like that alleged Laker fan who only comes here to talk about how great Olajuwon is in any David Robinson thread. Trolls who pretend to be fans of other teams suck.

[Gino]

I hate Kobe, but this team might actually be better.

That 92 team was never challenged and didn't even have to work very hard. They win this poll on name recognition alone.

But did that team play better weakside defense? Was that team better in the open court with an over the hill bird and a retired Magic?


This team is blowing out their opponents when their opponents are actually in the same breath talent wise.

Germany had an NBA MVP. Spain has Gasol, Calderon etc.

[stretch]

I understand your view, but to say they would win because of motivational factors is a bit much. Jordan is a hard competitor and he'll lay it on the floor, but we cant really say that his leadership will necessarily effect the pussiness of Odom and Gasol.

It affected the pussiness of Scottie Pippen and co. They werent out there airballing shots in a game seven, faking migraines because they were too scared of the bright lights.

[stretch]

I hate Kobe, but this team might actually be better.

That 92 team was never challenged and didn't even have to work very hard. They win this poll on name recognition alone.

But did that team play better weakside defense? Was that team better in the open court with an over the hill bird and a retired Magic?

This team is blowing out their opponents when their opponents are actually in the same breath talent wise.

Germany had an NBA MVP. Spain has Gasol, Calderon etc.

I think this team is better defensively and has too much all-around athleticism for the 1992 team, especially when they start going to their bench with guys like Bird, Mullin, and Stockton. Those guys will get run out of the gym by CP3, Deron, Wade, etc... Thats why I would put my money on 2008 in a 7 game series.

[ambchang]

Celtics are less athletic than the Lakers, yet they won. Spurs are less athletic than the Hornets, yet they won. Golden States are more athletic than every single team in the league, yet they couldn't make the playoffs. Phoenix is more athletic than every single team in the league not named GS and they lost in the first round.

Athleticism does not translate into wins.

Besides, Pippen, Jordan, Robinson, Barkley, Malone are not athletic slouches either.

[Medvedenko]

Kobe's the only player on the current olympic team that would start on the 92 team...oh as per Larry Bird's most recent interview.

I still say this team wins due to players being more in their prime with relation to the 92 team. Both teams in their prime...well than 92 all the way.

[dickface]

Kobe's the only player on the current olympic team that would start on the 92 team...oh as per Larry Bird's most recent interview.

Over who? SG is already taken.

[baseline bum]

I think this team is better defensively and has too much all-around athleticism for the 1992 team, especially when they start going to their bench with guys like Bird, Mullin, and Stockton. Those guys will get run out of the gym by CP3, Deron, Wade, etc... Thats why I would put my money on 2008 in a 7 game series.

Pippen, Robinson, Jordan, and Ewing are all better defenders than anyone on the 2008 team. There's no one even close to Pippen or Robinson.

[stretch]

Celtics are less athletic than the Lakers, yet they won. Spurs are less athletic than the Hornets, yet they won. Golden States are more athletic than every single team in the league, yet they couldn't make the playoffs. Phoenix is more athletic than every single team in the league not named GS and they lost in the first round.

Athleticism does not translate into wins.

Besides, Pippen, Jordan, Robinson, Barkley, Malone are not athletic slouches either.

I agree with every point here. But there are other intangibles that go into the reasons for their losses. The Lakers simply were not as good of a team (and i dont even know if they are any more athletic). The Hornets mentally were not ready to beat the Spurs. Golden State has a terrible playing system, plays no defense, and lacks talent. Phoenix had the same issue as Golden State, although I don' see where all that athleticism you speak of comes from. Amare? Who else? Marion was not there. Hill is not what he once was obviously. Barbosa is fast, but i wouldn't say he is a spectacular athlete in many other areas. Atlanta is a hell of a lot more athletic than Phoenix. Washington is more athletic.

Anyways, back to the point, yes, 2008 is more athletic. But they are also a mentally strong team, have just as much if not more talent. They have a good and balanced offensive/defensive system.

Neither team is incredibly proficient at shooting the 3 (with the exception of a couple players on each team who are/were great shooters, or not shooters at all, pretty much everyone is/was a "hot/cold" type of long-range shooter)

The 1992 has a little better post game (even though their big men were more of jump-shooting big men, similar to the 2008, as their best post player is Barkley), but the 2008 has better midrange/penetration game.

2008 also is a better defensive team and has more athleticism to spare for defensive purposes.

[stretch]

Pippen, Robinson, Jordan, and Ewing are all better defenders than anyone on the 2008 team. There's no one even close to Pippen or Robinson.

Correction: Robinson was a good shot blocker. I know a bunch of Spurs fans are now going to blow their chodes over this, but he was not simply a great defensive player. He was a great shotblocker.

Ewing was a shotblocker as well. Also got dunked on frequently. Soft.

[Medvedenko]

Over who? SG is already taken.

I don't know...maybe SF....as he is bigger than MJ. Don't take this as my opinion but of Larry Bird...

[lebomb]

FoxSports:



Redemption is inevitable.


Coach Mike Krzyzewski can rest easily and go back to Duke with the satisfaction of knowing that the pseudo-NBA coaching job he's done has been a rousing success.

Just as important, this young group of players can be proud of the way they have handled themselves on and off the floor.

Now it's time to get serious.

Let's compare this team, winning by an average of 32.2 points a game to the original Dream Team of 1992, a group that has a lot to do with why the players of this generation fell in love with the game in the first place.

It's hard to fathom any group being capable of shutting down the talent of the trio of Kobe Bryant, LeBron James and Dwyane Wade when they are so focused. Then again, they haven't had to deal with Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen and Clyde Drexler defending them. At 6-9, 260, James is astoundingly strong with athleticism, explosiveness and skill that has never been seen before.

Then again, he's never had Charles Barkley or Karl Malone staring him down either.

The reason this year's team has been so effective has been its on-the-ball pressure flustering opponents into complete collapse, with a tower of strength in the presence of Dwight Howard to dominate the boards and intimidate.

Well, Bryant, James, Wade, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Jason Kidd — and throw in the ultra-long Tayshaun Prince just for good measure — wouldn't faze the ballhandling ability of Magic Johnson, John Stockton, Jordan, Pippen or Drexler one iota.

Does anybody in their right mind believe Howard would have his way with David Robinson and Patrick Ewing? It would have been a great experience for him to get throttled by Robinson and Ewing, not to mention Hakeem Olajuwon, during the regular NBA season just for educational purposes.

Unquestionably, the competition is light years beyond what it was in 1992, when the international basketball was in its infancy, but that's not to say this year's team is that much more impressive than the Chuck Daly-coached team that won by an average of 43.8 points a game. The closest game they had in '92 was a 117-85 win in the gold medal game against Croatia.

In all fairness, Colangelo certainly would have spent more time balancing out the team with size as opposed to really putting together the best group of talent. Prince was added for defense; Carlos Boozer for some bulk, Howard to play center, and Kidd for the conscience of moving the ball. Other than that, it was a grab-bag of super-athletes.

There could not be a better designed team than the way Rod Thorn put together the 1992 roster. They had great speed and athleticism with Jordan, Drexler and Pippen — with that odd combination of strength, power and athleticism that Barkley brought to the table. Malone with Barkley and Ewing combined to be as powerful and intimidating as any front line that has ever played in the Olympics.

There has never been a better point guard at finding ways for a team to reach its potential than Johnson, and Stockton is the all-time leader in assists and steals — in many ways defining the position. And when it comes to multi-skilled players with great hands, shooting ability, basketball sense and the versatility to make everybody them better — Larry Bird (although his back rendered him helpless in the 1992 Olympics) and Chris Mullin were perfect complements. It was ironic that Christian Laettner an All-American from Duke for Krzyzewski (who was an assistant to Daly) was added gratuitously and was never more than an average NBA player.

But it wasn't as if it mattered.

The way this year's team has responded, nothing else Colangelo could have done would have made them perform at a higher level. Extending their time together has made them bond stronger and accent each other's strengths. Four years ago they weren't ready, particularly not for the incessant bickering caused by Larry Brown as coach.

Krzyzewski is much better suited to deal with the impetuous inclinations of youth that the likes of Carmelo Anthony bring to the table. His teams at Duke have been dominated by teenagers more every year.

Daly was brought in to deal with adults. As the stories would have it, there was no more intense basketball that year than the intrasquad game played in Monte Carlo with Barkley talking trash to Jordan, Daly had to stop the game at midstream for fear of what those players would have done to each other before the Olympic games would have begun.

It was never about anything else but winning with the Dream Team, other than learning what it was like to be an international rock stars and emissaries as they were. The Redeem Team has finally figured that out, too. Colangelo, Krzyzewski — along with assistants Mike D'Antoni and Nate McMillan — have helped make sure they not only want to win, but to restore the love and respect the Dream Team initially introduced to the rest of the world.

And it has worked.

The pride and reverie restored by this group can't help but bring back memories of their forefathers, so to speak. In some ways it has been a relief because nobody was quite sure how this team would handle itself.

It isn't fair to compare this team to the Dream Team that introduced a different caliber of basketball to the rest of the world, and will forever be ingrained in the annals of pop culture as the greatest team ever assembled on any number of levels.

This team has earned its own place in history for restoring our faith in this generation of basketball to erase sometimes ugly drama of the past eight years and bringing back the pride and the gold back home where it belongs.

[stretch]

It's hard to fathom any group being capable of shutting down the talent of the trio of Kobe Bryant, LeBron James and Dwyane Wade when they are so focused. Then again, they haven't had to deal with Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen and Clyde Drexler defending them. At 6-9, 260, James is astoundingly strong with athleticism, explosiveness and skill that has never been seen before. Then again, he's never had Charles Barkley or Karl Malone staring him down either.

And who did Jordan, Pippen, and Drexler have to deal with defending them? John Starks? Reggie Miller? :lmao

Let's see how those guys fare against guys like Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, Ben Wallace, etc... in fact, Jordan and co didnt have to deal with such high caliber athletes like Kobe, Lebron, and Wade. if you turn it one way, you gotta turn it the other. Lets see how those guys fare on both ends of the court against each other. If you had a game of 3 on 3, id put my money on Kobe/Lebron/Wade ALL FUCKING DAY over Jordan/Pippen/Drexler.


Well, Bryant, James, Wade, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Jason Kidd — and throw in the ultra-long Tayshaun Prince just for good measure — wouldn't faze the ballhandling ability of Magic Johnson, John Stockton, Jordan, Pippen or Drexler one iota.

Like Magic can play defense? Stockton was tiny as hell. And the Jordan, Pippen, Drexler argument was already taken care of. Fact is, both teams are going to be having trouble guarding each other. Its ridiculous how people only think that 2008 would have issues guarding 1992. I have a hard time seeing Jordan being able to physically compete with Lebron, who is athletically superior to Jordan in virtually every single way. CP3 and Deron would absolutely tear Stockton to bits, and would completely blow by Magic with ease. And if Prince can give Kobe fits, im more than positive he can give Pippen and Drexler fits.


Does anybody in their right mind believe Howard would have his way with David Robinson and Patrick Ewing?

No, but its not like his athleticism couldn't give them fits on both ends either. And at least hes not a soft bitch choker like Ewing.

[ambchang]

I agree with every point here. But there are other intangibles that go into the reasons for their losses. The Lakers simply were not as good of a team (and i dont even know if they are any more athletic). The Hornets mentally were not ready to beat the Spurs. Golden State has a terrible playing system, plays no defense, and lacks talent. Phoenix had the same issue as Golden State, although I don' see where all that athleticism you speak of comes from. Amare? Who else? Marion was not there. Hill is not what he once was obviously. Barbosa is fast, but i wouldn't say he is a spectacular athlete in many other areas. Atlanta is a hell of a lot more athletic than Phoenix. Washington is more athletic.

Was speaking particularly about athleticism, and the point was to say that athleticism does not equate to wins. I also agree with the Suns, Atlanta was athletic, but barely made the playoffs in the pitiful East.


Anyways, back to the point, yes, 2008 is more athletic. But they are also a mentally strong team, have just as much if not more talent. They have a good and balanced offensive/defensive system.

Neither team is incredibly proficient at shooting the 3 (with the exception of a couple players on each team who are/were great shooters, or not shooters at all, pretty much everyone is/was a "hot/cold" type of long-range shooter)

The 1992 has a little better post game (even though their big men were more of jump-shooting big men, similar to the 2008, as their best post player is Barkley), but the 2008 has better midrange/penetration game.

2008 also is a better defensive team and has more athleticism to spare for defensive purposes.

I would argue that the 92 team was much better defensively.

Let’s look at the respective rosters:
92 08
Larry Bird Carmelo Anthony
Christian Laettner Carlos Boozer
Karl Malone Chris Bosh
Michael Jordan Kobe Bryant
David Robinson Dwight Howard
Scottie Pippen LeBron James
John Stockton Chris Paul
Clyde Drexler Tayshuan Prince
Chris Mullin Michael Redd
Magic Johnson Dwayne Wade
Patrick Ewing Deron Williams

I tried to match up the players as close as possible, but 92 got one more centre, and 08 got one more PG.

Pippen was one of the best perimeter defenders ever (and he can defend the post as well), Tayshuan Prince, while good, isn’t even the best perimeter defender in the league today (Bowen and Artest).

Jordan was great defensively, not as good as Pippen, but still better than anyone on the 08 team.

Robinson will be addressed later on.

Ewing is called the Hoya Destroya for a reason, he was a dynamic low post defender, much better than Dwight Howard (athletic, little basketball defensive IQ), Carlos Boozer (no need for explanation), and Chris Bosh (ditto).

Jason Kidd and Chris Paul are not any better than Magic Johnson was on defense, while John Stockton was light years ahead of any PG on the 08 squad defensively.

Lebron James definitely has an upper hand when compared to Charles Barkley on defense.

The other guys are pretty even defensively. Basically, for every over-the-hill Larry Bird, there is a Carmelo Anthony, for every Christian Laettner, there is a Carlos Boozer.

As for midrange game, Jordan had the best mid-range game of any player, ever.
Karl Malone and Ewing are known as 18-foot shooting bigs (who can score inside of course).
Robinson’s got a great 15 foot jump shot, even though at that point in his career, he was primarily a dunker.
Larry Bird can shoot from anywhere.
Laettner, though he sucked, was as good as anyone pulling up from 18.

On the 08 squad, Kobe, Carmelo Anthony, Boozer, and Wade are the answers. I see this being pretty even, with perhaps a light advantage to the 92 squad.

On penetration, 08’s got Lebron, Kobe, Paul and Williams on the outside, but only Bosh can really handle the ball for a big man.

On the 92 squad, Jordan, Drexler, Pippen, Stockton, and Magic can all go to the hole whenever they want, while Robinson can penetrate and score with the best of them.



Correction: Robinson was a good shot blocker. I know a bunch of Spurs fans are now going to blow their chodes over this, but he was not simply a great defensive player. He was a great shotblocker.

Ewing was a shotblocker as well. Also got dunked on frequently. Soft.

I am shocked you said this regarding Robinson.

You are talking about a man who was one of the best defensive bigs of all time along with Russell and Hakeem. He was named DPOY in 92, being the first player in NBA history to rank top 5 in blocks, steals and rebounds in the same season, while also ranking top 10 in points and FG%, making him the second player to rank top 10 in 5 major statistical category (the other being Larry Bird, I think).

He was named All-D 1st team 4 times, 2nd team 4 times while playing in an era of the best bunch of big men (along with Hakeem, Ewing and Shaq, and to a lesser extent Sabonis, Divac, Daughtery, Mutombo, and Mourning).

You are talking about a man, who held Shaq to 22.5 throughout a whole series during Shaq’s prime, doing it with a floating particle in his back. That is pretty darn impressive.

To say that Robinson was simply a good shot blocker and not a good defensive player is largely incorrect.

As for Ewing, he was named to All-D team three times (mostly because of Robinson and Hakeem), manned the middle for a defensive-oriented Knicks team and called the Hoya Destroya for his defensive prowess with Georgetown.

[lebomb]

And who did Jordan, Pippen, and Drexler have to deal with defending them? John Starks? Reggie Miller? :lmao

Let's see how those guys fare against guys like Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, Ben Wallace, etc... in fact, Jordan and co didnt have to deal with such high caliber athletes like Kobe, Lebron, and Wade. if you turn it one way, you gotta turn it the other. Lets see how those guys fare on both ends of the court against each other. If you had a game of 3 on 3, id put my money on Kobe/Lebron/Wade ALL FUCKING DAY over Jordan/Pippen/Drexler.



Like Magic can play defense? Stockton was tiny as hell. And the Jordan, Pippen, Drexler argument was already taken care of. Fact is, both teams are going to be having trouble guarding each other. Its ridiculous how people only think that 2008 would have issues guarding 1992. I have a hard time seeing Jordan being able to physically compete with Lebron, who is athletically superior to Jordan in virtually every single way.



No, but its not like his athleticism couldn't give them fits on both ends either. And at least hes not a soft bitch choker like Ewing.

Lebron would not be on Jordan or vice versa........ Kobe and Jordan would be going at it. Lebron would be staring at Malone or Pippen probably.

I ask again....you fail to answer.....HOW OLD ARE YOU? Seriously......because you sound like a young guy that probably didnt even watch basketball in the 80-90s.

[lebomb]

ambchang..........great post man......great post. :downspin:

[ambchang]

And who did Jordan, Pippen, and Drexler have to deal with defending them? John Starks? Reggie Miller? :lmao

Let's see how those guys fare against guys like Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, Ben Wallace, etc... in fact, Jordan and co didnt have to deal with such high caliber athletes like Kobe, Lebron, and Wade. if you turn it one way, you gotta turn it the other. Lets see how those guys fare on both ends of the court against each other. If you had a game of 3 on 3, id put my money on Kobe/Lebron/Wade ALL FUCKING DAY over Jordan/Pippen/Drexler.

After reading this, I really have to question whether you have seen Jordan, Pippen and Drexler in their prime. You are probably the first person to say that you would pick the Kobe/Lebron/Wade team with such conviction.

Back in the late 80’s, early 90’s, there was a bunch of great perimeter defenders such as Sidney Moncrief , the late great Dennis Johnson, Gary Payton, Dennis Rodman (inside and out), Joe Dumars, Alvin Robertson (even though he was a Spur, I think he was slightly overrated as a defender), Rodney McCray, Michael Cooper, and Maurice Cheeks. These players were every bit as good defensively as perimeter defenders are today.


Like Magic can play defense? Stockton was tiny as hell. And the Jordan, Pippen, Drexler argument was already taken care of. Fact is, both teams are going to be having trouble guarding each other. Its ridiculous how people only think that 2008 would have issues guarding 1992. I have a hard time seeing Jordan being able to physically compete with Lebron, who is athletically superior to Jordan in virtually every single way. CP3 and Deron would absolutely tear Stockton to bits, and would completely blow by Magic with ease. And if Prince can give Kobe fits, im more than positive he can give Pippen and Drexler fits.

Magic, though not Pippen as a defender, did play solid team defense, he is no worse than Kidd is at this stage of his career. Stockton was tough as nails, and 10x the defender Chris Paul could ever be, and is certainly better than Deron Williams. Isiah Thomas couldn’t tear Stockton to bits, so why would CP3, who was compared to Thomas last year, be able to? Tim Hardway and Kevin Johnson were ultra quick point guards, they didn’t shred Stockton to bits.

Jordan likely won’t guard Lebron, Barkley with his strength and quickness would probably get that assignment, along with Pippen, who could defend quick and strong players wouldn’t be over matched. Malone and Robinson could also provide relief.


No, but its not like his athleticism couldn't give them fits on both ends either. And at least hes not a soft bitch choker like Ewing.

A choker, yes, soft? Ewing battled all kinds of painful injuries in his career to carve out a HOF career, I just don’t know where you would get the idea that he was soft.

Besides, Ewing can choke all he wants, he has more than adequate replacements on his team during crunch time on the 92 squad.

[stretch]

Jason Kidd and Chris Paul are not any better than Magic Johnson was on defense, while John Stockton was light years ahead of any PG on the 08 squad defensively.

After reading this absolutely ridiculous part of your paragraph, i didn't have much more to say to you, untill i read this...


I am shocked you said this regarding Robinson.

You are talking about a man who was one of the best defensive bigs of all time along with Russell and Hakeem. He was named DPOY in 92, being the first player in NBA history to rank top 5 in blocks, steals and rebounds in the same season, while also ranking top 10 in points and FG%, making him the second player to rank top 10 in 5 major statistical category (the other being Larry Bird, I think).

He was named All-D 1st team 4 times, 2nd team 4 times while playing in an era of the best bunch of big men (along with Hakeem, Ewing and Shaq, and to a lesser extent Sabonis, Divac, Daughtery, Mutombo, and Mourning).

You are talking about a man, who held Shaq to 22.5 throughout a whole series during Shaq’s prime, doing it with a floating particle in his back. That is pretty darn impressive.

To say that Robinson was simply a good shot blocker and not a good defensive player is largely incorrect.

As for Ewing, he was named to All-D team three times (mostly because of Robinson and Hakeem), manned the middle for a defensive-oriented Knicks team and called the Hoya Destroya for his defensive prowess with Georgetown.

Bruce Bowen is one of the best perimeter defenders the league has ever seen (IMO better than Pippen), and never won a DPOY. Tim Duncan is arguably the best defensive big-man ever, and never won a DPOY. Nuff said.

later.

[ambchang]

After reading this absolutely ridiculous part of your paragraph, i didn't have much more to say to you, untill i read this...

Could you explain to me how that was ridiculous?
You are saying that Kidd and CP3 are better defenders than Magic was, or are you saying that Stockton wasn't a great perimeter defender?


Bruce Bowen is one of the best perimeter defenders the league has ever seen (IMO better than Pippen), and never won a DPOY. Tim Duncan is arguably the best defensive big-man ever, and never won a DPOY. Nuff said.

later.

Tim Duncan and Bruce Bowen never got on All-D teams too? Do you know how the system works? Media picks DPoY, while coaches picks All-D teams. While media does come up with some curious selections once in a while, it would be difficult to argue that NBA coaches would get this wrong. Robinson was on 4 all-D teams, and he played in an era with Hakeem, Mourning and Mutombo.

Seriously, I am not trying to denigrate you, did you actually see any of the dream team players in 92, or even 93 and 94?

[lebomb]

I want to know Stretches age......bet he didnt see these guys play.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

I want to know Stretches age.

You're getting a little too involved with him here.

[lebomb]

You're getting a little too involved with him here.



................ :lmao I didnt ask for his address. :rolleyes

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

No, because it would be dumb to do that through comment.

[ambchang]

I also do not get the idea of where this 08 squad is such a defensive juggernaut.

Let’s look at the score of opposing teams vs. the US compared to their average scores vs. other opponents.

Vs. US vs. others
China 70 74 (73.25 in regulation)
Angola 76 61.25
Greece 69 86.5
Spain 82 84 (80.75 in regulation)
Germany 57 68.25
Australia 85 91.4

True that 08 does hold their opponent slightly below their average despite playing at a faster pace, but keep in mind you are comparing against teams that are much less talented than the US teams of both 92 and 08.

I didn’t do the 92 scores, because the 92 opponents were even worse than those who play now, and it would show no purpose but to show how much they sucked.

[lebomb]

No, because it would be dumb to do that through comment.


.......age is dumb though :p:

[IronMexican]

The 92 dream team are full of old people now, i got the 2008 team.

[lefty]

The 92 dream team are full of old people now, i got the 2008 team.

THey were younger in 92 :D

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

So was the 2008 team.

[lebomb]

So was the 2008 team.


Id take the 92 team back then over the 2008 team back then. :(

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Id take the 2008 team right now over the 92 team right now.

[BWS-1994]

My vote goes to the '92 team because they were probably the best of their time. Or because my knowledge about those days are limited.

2008 is great. But there are other names that could've made them better.

[polandprzem]

I just wonder how you want to compare them?

basketball was different in 1992 - with the play of dream team and current Olympic squad I probably would choose redeem to ween!