Buck Harvey: Ginobili goes down — how long until he goes?

[Spurs Brazil]

Ginobili goes down — how long until he goes?
Buck Harvey - BEIJING — The Spurs had no choice. They had to go along with Manu Ginobili.

They had to say, yes, we trust you. They had to accept that the same Ginobili they love in tense moments is the same Ginobili who will sacrifice everything to play with his Argentine buddies.

They had no choice but to allow Ginobili to do what he shouldn't have done.

Now?

It will be the Spurs' choice.

Today, with an ice pack on his notorious left ankle, Ginobili would do it all over again. To defend his gold medal against the Americans, with Maradona in the stands, Ginobili would have played in Beijing if he had to be propped up with chopsticks.

“I don't forget that eight years ago we were fighting for eighth place in the World Championships,” he wrote on his Web site this week, “and did not make the Olympics at all.”

He built an international power, and the sea change came in Indianapolis in the 2002 World Championships. Then, just before he joined the Spurs, he and Argentina became the first to beat a U.S. team consisting of NBA players.

That tournament also introduced what would become Ginobili's weakness. He severely sprained his left ankle for the first time, and what followed was telling. Ginobili hobbled out for the gold-medal game.

Argentina doctors should have stopped him, and some within the Spurs organization wonder if this decision haunts Ginobili still. Other bruises have come and gone for El Contusion; this one is as fresh as ever.

When he collapsed here, there was nothing traumatic about it. He drove, LeBron James cut him off and he passed while landing. Athletes with pre-existing injuries get hurt this way.

Ginobili stayed on the floor for a few minutes, then limped to the bench where he removed his left sneaker. He held his ankle with both hands, as if that would relieve the pain.

Within minutes he was in the locker room, never to return. And after the game, without knowing the injury report, the Argentina coach didn't count out Ginobili for the bronze-medal game. He was as optimistic as the Argentines were in Indianapolis in 2002.

The ankle bothered Ginobili in his rookie year, and it sure did last season. It may have cost the Spurs a championship, too. Given that, he owed it to his employer to rest. There's some loyalty that comes with a $10 million annual salary.

In mid-June Ginobili was leaning that way. “The ankle injury is worse than I thought,” he admitted to reporters in Argentina.

Gregg Popovich saw a crack and went public. “My concern,” he said then, “is that it is going to get worse. He's got to seriously consider his health.”

Ginobili flew back to San Antonio shortly after for another injection, but he began to talk about playing again. When Argentina announced Ginobili would carry the flag for the opening ceremonies in Beijing, that cinched it.

Popovich knew he had lost. All he could do was send a trainer to Buenos Aires to monitor Ginobili's workouts with the national team.

Now Popovich is waiting for the medical reports, and he and his staff are anxious. One source said this last summer: If the shot Ginobili received in June didn't take, and if he played and re-injured the ankle, he might need surgery.

Ginobili just turned 31. With or without surgery, how long can he be effective?

Ginobili's contract is up in two years. The Spurs have already discussed an extension, and now they have another reason to wait a year before making a decision. There's no rush.

But Ginobili's fragile status will be part of the equation. Tim Duncan and Tony Parker will be the only Spurs under contract in 2010, not counting Ian Mahinmi's minimum deal. That means there's a lot of cap room.

An NFL team wouldn't hesitate. They'd cut the aging, limping player and find someone else.

But finding another Ginobili is impossible. He's been the Spurs' most popular and most fearless.

Still, his style was always going to burn out early, and that's why this summer could be another sea change. Ginobili risked everything when he came to Beijing, and he lost.

He chose, and he was wrong. And now it is someone else's turn to choose.

[email protected]
http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/columnists/buck_harvey/Ginobili_goes_down__how_long_until_he_goes.html

[ducks]

The ankle bothered Ginobili in his rookie year, and it sure did last season. It may have cost the Spurs a championship, too. Given that, he owed it to his employer to rest. There's some loyalty that comes with a $10 million annual salary.

[Oh, Gee!!]

we traded sean elliott for getting sick, and that wasn't even his fault

[completely deck]

I would really hate to see Ginobili's career with the Spurs end due to an injury.

[50 cent]

Dead on article by Buck.

Ginobili made a stupid decision and now the Spurs have to consider all possible options for the betterment of the franchise.

[ducks]

buck harvey starting the pr move
incase the let manu walk

[MiamiHeat]

All the NBA teams should band together and sign an agreement - all teams will have a 'You can only play in the Olympics if your team says it is OK' clause into future contracts.

this HAS to go for american players too, so it looks fair.

[xtremesteven33]

no way does pop trade manu. NO WAY!!

Manu will never regret playing this year, life is about gambles, you win some you lose some.

Manu in some ways is just as important as Tim Duncan. his value and importance to the team is undervalued for whoever u trade him for.

no way this happens. and whoever says it should doesnt know what theyre talking about.

(and its not because im a manu fan either)

[mrspurs]

Buck=Waste Of Space

[ducks]

Buck=Waste Of Space

so if they do not meet your standards you kill them?

[TampaDude]

The Spurs cannot win a title without Manu...unless they can find another "Manu"...

[Oh, Gee!!]

no way does pop trade manu. NO WAY!!

it's not Sophie's Choice. It's a business, grow up Manu fan.

[ducks]

The Spurs cannot win a title without Manu...unless they can find another "Manu"...

yeah they can
they just have to find someone else by trading his broken done body to a team that likes broken down bodie and get close to = value back

manu is replacable
just like tp and duncan

if spurs get a player close to manu's abilities they will be fine and could easily win the title




people said without david spurs would not win a title and they DID

[samikeyp]

if spurs get a player close to manu's abilities they will be fine and could easily win the title

If it were only that easy.

[lefty]

The ankle bothered Ginobili in his rookie year, and it sure did last season. It may have cost the Spurs a championship, too. Given that, he owed it to his employer to rest. There's some loyalty that comes with a $10 million annual salary.

Your country comes first.

Kobe Bryant is playing for the U.S team, but he also has a job in L.A

He too runs the risk of getting injured.

Stop babbling stupid things

[gospursgojas]

The Spurs cannot win a title without Manu...unless they can find another "Manu"...

They've won 2 without him... He wasn't a big factor in 2003.


we traded sean elliott for getting sick, and that wasn't even his fault


:tu


Time to pull the trigger.... and this is coming from a guy who's favorite spurs is manu. But I love the team as a whole way more than any individual player on the team

[TampaDude]

They've won 2 without him... He wasn't a big factor in 2003.


I'm talking about 2009, not 2003.



Time to pull the trigger.... and this is coming from a guy who's favorite spurs is manu. But I love the team as a whole way more than any individual player on the team

+1 I'm a SPURS fan first! :toast

[50 cent]

I would trade Manu for SJax in a second.

[Bruno]

Lame article :td

We don't even know how serious is Manu's injury and Harvey is writing an article like he has a career ending injury. :rolleyes

[ChumpDumper]

Lame article :td

We don't even know how serious is Manu's injury and Harvey is writing an article like he has a career ending injury. :rolleyesAgreed. No need to jump the gun like this in August.

[ElNono]

They've won 2 without him... He wasn't a big factor in 2003.

Sure he wasn't. :rolleyes
Go take a look at the tape for game 4 or 5 against the Nets, where he has that steal in the closing minutes, followed by a floater over KMart.
He won us that game.
Go ask Richard Jefferson who changed the momentum in Game 6, after stealing the ball from him and going for a dunk.

The problem is that you have short memory.

[ElNono]

Agreed. No need to jump the gun like this in August.

The funny thing is that he probably already had an article written about how special Manu is in the unlikely event that Argentina would have beat Team USA today. He's just pissing in the wind right now.

[ChumpDumper]

The funny thing is that he probably already had an article written about how special Manu is in the unlikely event that Argentina would have beat Team USA today. He's just pissing in the wind right now.It's more likely he had this one about his getting injured ready in advance, since there is no way the US would have lost to Argentina with or without Manu :stirpot:

[EVAY]

I'm so sorry to hear Spurs folks reacting like this. He has proven over and over again that patriotism is more important to him than money. I would have thought that folks in San Antonio would respect that, perhaps even understand it.

Ginobili in Argentina is the equivalent of Tiger Woods in America right now. If Tiger had said he would not play for an American team because Nike was afraid he would hurt himself, folks would be blaming him for not being patriotic enough. I respect the guys who play for their countries. Ten million buys the loyalty it buys. It buys, for Manu, all the grit and drive and talent he has every single night of the season for his nba team. It buys a willingness to put his team before himself and his own statistics by playing hurt when necessary, by coming off the bench behind a guy like Finley who hasn't Manu's youth or talent, by never whining or crying when others on the team get more press and adulation. He doesn't owe the Spurs or San Antonio one other thing. He entered into his contract with them, and they with him, as an economic transaction. Manu has more than lived up to his end of the agreement. The Spurs are quick to point out the "business" aspect of the sport when it is to their advantage in negotiations. They, and we, should expect the same from the athletes we pay to play here.

His country didn't engage in a bidding war to buy his loyalty. It didn't have to. He is true to his nation of birth. Isn't that something we should applaud???

Manu got hurt during the regular season in San Antonio. So should the Argentines say that he shouldn't have played so hard for the Spurs because he had the Olympics coming up? C'mon guys. Country is bigger than salaries or nba seasons.

Buck Harvey has really sunk to a new low. I wasn't certain that was possible.

[spursfan09]

as a spur fan I am totally pissed off at this situation. Ginobili should have never played. Knowing he will not be healthy changes the outlook on the season and it has not even begun.

[T Park]

It may have cost the Spurs a championship, too. Given that, he owed it to his employer to rest. There's some loyalty that comes with a $10 million annual salary.



Thank you for stating the obvious Buck.


Country is bigger than salaries or nba seasons.


When did Argentina start paying him 10 million a year?

Oh yeah never. When playing for your country gets you multiple houses and nice cars and all that stuff, come back and talk to me.



Great, so now hes looking at surgery possibly?

Great job Ginobili.... The epitome of selfish.

[ChumpDumper]

If Tiger had said he would not play for an American team because Nike was afraid he would hurt himself, folks would be blaming him for not being patriotic enough.Nobody cares enough about the Ryder Cup for that to matter.

[T Park]

I find it hilarious that golf is being compared to basketball in terms of getting injured.

Fail.

[Ocotillo]

All the NBA teams should band together and sign an agreement - all teams will have a 'You can only play in the Olympics if your team says it is OK' clause into future contracts.

this HAS to go for american players too, so it looks fair.

Yeah, I yearn for the days when the Olympics were for amateurs. The genie is out of the bottle but this is what happens.

I didn't even like the idea of the original Dream Team.

Even if a player doesn't get injured, more often then not, they end up having an off year the following season because they have been playing competitive ball to long without an extended period of rest.

Screw it, the Olympics should basically be track and field and swimming and few other events. We don't need softball, synchronized diving, the horseback riding, baseball, cycling, yada, yada, yada......

Hell why not have rodeo or cricket? Do they have shuffleboard?

[T Park]

Agreed, the college players should be playing in these olympics.

[DPG21920]

This is just such a bad situation. I really hope that Manu stays and the fans will be loyal. I understand the arguments made, but I really do not agree with them. Trade Ginobili? For who? Not only did we steal him for 9-10M per year (which makes it hard to get fair value) he is at his lowest value right now, so who can we get? Even if we do trade him, is that person going to do for San Antonio (fans, clutch, passion...) what Manu has done?

I hope he can heal close to fully, without surgery. Every one is injured in the NBA, it does not mean you trade them. But I guess if you can get a homerun deal, then you do it?

[mytespurs]

Talk about piling on....

When it rains, it pours as they say.

Chicken Littles are proclaiming the sky is falling.

Bruce Harvey reminds me a lot of Bil Plasichke with the LA Times....jumping on whatever bandwagon is running at the moment.

Trade him, cut him, burn him at the stake....geez!!

We won't know for a bit the extent of Manu's injury. I hope it's not too serious and that he is given enough time to heal so that he comes back strong when it matters = playoffs.

[DPG21920]

How is Manu Ginobili selfish? Did he not agree to a contract that is way under his value? I mean, when you are trying to save money when signing players, especially like Ginobili, you know you are going to have to concede other areas, Olympic play was one of them.

[DPG21920]

No one was saying he was selfish when he was playing for the Spurs, giving it his all in the WCF.

[EVAY]

TPark, with all due respect, I think you missed the point. The comparison is NOT between golf and basketball as a potential source of athletic injury, the comparison is between a sports deity in one country and a sports deity in another. Woods is the American "athlete of the year" multiple years...Ginobili is the "athlete of the year" in Argentina multiple years.

[Mark in Austin]

He has proven over and over again that patriotism is more important to him than money. I would have thought that folks in San Antonio would respect that, perhaps even understand it.


If that were true, he would return his salary to the Spurs for games he misses due to an injury sustained while representing Argentina.

If Manu agreed ahead of time to waive any Spurs salary obligations while he recovered from injury, THAT would be putting country ahead of MONEY. That would demonstrate the (noble and admirable) principle that he valued representing Argentina over anything else. Right now, all he's doing is putting his country ahead of the Spurs Organizaton, which really isn't all that much of a sacrifice for Manu.

[DPG21920]

One thing for sure: Manu has put himself in a precarious situation. He has lost all leverage with the Spurs, and now some with the fans as well.

[mytespurs]

One thing for sure: Manu has put himself in a precarious situation. He has lost all leverage with the Spurs, and now some with the fans as well.


"Some fans" being the key words here. This guy plays with so much passion and has the commitment to be the best he can be. I don't doubt Manu at all.

The Spurs may let him go in a year or two but I hope they don't regret it.

[Ocotillo]

I have to go back and read it again but I thought the gist of the article was not about trading Manu but rather letting him walk in 2010.

[ducks]

No one was saying he was selfish when he was playing for the Spurs, giving it his all in the WCF.

if he was not he would have been selfish
he is paid to play

[T Park]

How is Manu Ginobili selfish? Did he not agree to a contract that is way under his value? I mean, when you are trying to save money when signing players, especially like Ginobili, you know you are going to have to concede other areas, Olympic play was one of them.

The Spurs didn't have to concede anything.

Especially with this extension he wants now.

He gets 8.5 9 mill a year.

The least he can do is head his employer's asking of "staying home"

[anakha]

Agreed. No need to jump the gun like this in August.

Considering the way several people here on ST already have jumped the gun - can you really blame Harvey for doing the same? :lol

[DPG21920]

The Spurs didn't have to concede anything.

Especially with this extension he wants now.

He gets 8.5 9 mill a year.

The least he can do is head his employer's asking of "staying home"

Spurs knew what they were getting into when they signed Ginobili. Yes he makes 9M a year. He should be making Luol Deng/Joe Johnson money, not Nene money.

[DPG21920]

I do agree about the extension though, the Spurs should concede no more.

[duncan228]

Chicken Littles are proclaiming the sky is falling.

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x282/duncan228/oddsandends/chickenlittlegif.gif

(I love this gif. :lol)

[T Park]

No one was saying he was selfish when he was playing for the Spurs, giving it his all in the WCF.

U can't quite seperate employer volunteer can you?

[NewJerSpur]

If Manu does have to miss any real playing time come the start of the season I'll be cool (not thrilled) with the decision to shut him down and get him healthy....as long as Finley doesn't see an increase in the minutes he would've received this year (which hopefully wouldn't be that many) prior to the injury. This would be a time to see what Udoka and the new guys have to offer the team in terms of helping out the overall depth which has seemed to decline the past few seasons. That said, I'll wait with baited breadth to hear any news on the ankle.

[DPG21920]

U can't quite seperate employer volunteer can you?

The fact that he was visibly hurt and could of caused himself serious long-term damage means he should of sat out. Judging by his play, the Spurs would not of been worse off.

Whether it was playing for his employer (Spurs) or volunteering for his country (Argentina), he was hurt and risking serious injury. If he was hurt that bad, then you should consider both selfish acts (playing for the Spurs and Argentina) imo.

[Jobbs]

If Kobe went out and re-injured his finger worst than it was before, would the Lakers be pissed? Probably not.
For Kobe it was more of a ego thing than representing his country which Manu was doing.
Point is, we've got 2 months before preseason starts. We don't know how bad he's hurt. For all we know it could've just tweeked it which causes more pain than normal.
I can't hate Manu for what he did. He's given us so much the last 6 years that if he retired tomorrow, I wouldn't be mad.

[T Park]

The fact that he was visibly hurt and could of caused himself serious long-term damage means he should of sat out. Judging by his play, the Spurs would not of been worse off.

Whether it was playing for his employer (Spurs) or volunteering for his country (Argentina), he was hurt and risking serious injury. If he was hurt that bad, then you should consider both selfish acts (playing for the Spurs and Argentina) imo.

No you can't consider, working for your employer selfish, while volunteering to play in something that doesn't benefit your employer one iota.

He was advised and asked to stay home and not play, he disobeyed that and defied that request, so he should be treated accordingly

[T Park]

If Kobe went out and re-injured his finger worst than it was before, would the Lakers be pissed? Probably not.For Kobe it was more of a ego thing than representing his country which Manu was doing.
Point is, we've got 2 months before preseason starts. We don't know how bad he's hurt. For all we know it could've just tweeked it which causes more pain than normal.
I can't hate Manu for what he did. He's given us so much the last 6 years that if he retired tomorrow, I wouldn't be mad.


The hell they would't

They would say "While you were screwing around with this team, you could've gotten the finger fixed, been rehabbing it, and been 100% for the regular season opener or close to it."

[ArgSpursFan.]

No you can't consider, working for your employer selfish, while volunteering to play in something that doesn't benefit your employer one iota.

He was advised and asked to stay home and not play, he disobeyed that and defied that request, so he should be treated accordingly

get a life mofo

[Jobbs]

The hell they would't

They would say "While you were screwing around with this team, you could've gotten the finger fixed, been rehabbing it, and been 100% for the regular season opener or close to it."

:lol I haven't heard Phil Jack or anyone over in their FO say Kobe stay home.

[T Park]

:lol I haven't heard Phil Jack or anyone over in their FO say Kobe stay home.

Phil won't say it.

But I gaurantee if you asked him he would say what I said.

Mark it down.

[SequSpur]

Fuk.. Buck Harvey is fukin dead on. Unbelievable.

[ArgSpursFan.]

ginobili was stupid to play in games 1 and 2 of the WCF and pops was stupider for letting him play

ginobili was stupid all by himself to try and play in the olympics

(stupid if he wanted to keep playing in the nba) but he knew the risk of playing in the olympics and went ahead and did it and possibly got real hurt, so it's the spurs turn to make a decision

I really hope He gets traded.seriusly
SA don't deserve a guy like Ginobili.Period

[beirmeistr]

I'm so sorry to hear Spurs folks reacting like this. He has proven over and over again that patriotism is more important to him than money. I would have thought that folks in San Antonio would respect that, perhaps even understand it.

Ginobili in Argentina is the equivalent of Tiger Woods in America right now. If Tiger had said he would not play for an American team because Nike was afraid he would hurt himself, folks would be blaming him for not being patriotic enough. I respect the guys who play for their countries. Ten million buys the loyalty it buys. It buys, for Manu, all the grit and drive and talent he has every single night of the season for his nba team. It buys a willingness to put his team before himself and his own statistics by playing hurt when necessary, by coming off the bench behind a guy like Finley who hasn't Manu's youth or talent, by never whining or crying when others on the team get more press and adulation. He doesn't owe the Spurs or San Antonio one other thing. He entered into his contract with them, and they with him, as an economic transaction. Manu has more than lived up to his end of the agreement. The Spurs are quick to point out the "business" aspect of the sport when it is to their advantage in negotiations. They, and we, should expect the same from the athletes we pay to play here.

His country didn't engage in a bidding war to buy his loyalty. It didn't have to. He is true to his nation of birth. Isn't that something we should applaud???

Manu got hurt during the regular season in San Antonio. So should the Argentines say that he shouldn't have played so hard for the Spurs because he had the Olympics coming up? C'mon guys. Country is bigger than salaries or nba seasons.

Buck Harvey has really sunk to a new low. I wasn't certain that was possible.


Excellent post.

[exstatic]

What do you think would the the reaction at the average company if an employee disregarded the wishes of management and did something that cause him to miss considerable work time? They'd be fired.

I always thought Manu was smart, but he must not have been paying attention for the last 6 years. You defy Pop at your absolute peril. I'm guessing he just went off the untouchable list. They won't just move him, but I think if the right deal for a really good young player comes along, he's history. I don't think that would have been the case before this summer.

[wildbill2u]

Lame article :td

We don't even know how serious is Manu's injury and Harvey is writing an article like he has a career ending injury. :rolleyes

The fact is that these type of injuries can become chronic if they are severe and the weakened ankle is liable to be reinjured more easily every time stress is put on it.

Have we seen this over the years with Manu's left ankle. Yes we have.

That being said, you ride on the horse that brung you. Forget about all that Manu brings to the table when he is healthy and you are left with the unappetizing fact that an oft injured Manu is not great trade bait for a player with similar abilities.

How many of you have scoffed at the Rockets Yao and T-Mac for being useless because they have a history of injuries?

[ducks]

manu would almost fit perfectly with the rockets
always hurt

[smeagol]

Great job Ginobili.... The epitome of selfish.


I have read some stupid shit coming from you over the years, but this one wins the gold medal.

You can hang it around your neck and wear it proudly :rolleyes

[timvp]

First of all, I'd never trade Manu. That is just crazy talk. No team is going to give you a player close to as good. You trade Manu now and you'd be lucky to get 60 cents on the dollar. More importantly, he's an amazing player combined with the perfect mental makeup to be a Spur. I wouldn't even trade him if they Spurs got a player of the same skill level due to the intangibles he brings ... much less selling him low like the Spurs would be doing.

Secondly, it's both dumb and pretty unfair to have expected him not to play for Argentina. I never thought for one second he'd rest this summer. Argentina basketball is the thing he'll remember most fondly after he retires from the game. You can't tell him not to play in the Olympics and not to defend his gold medal. In a perfect world, of course we'd hope that he spent the summer in a jacuzzi getting a foot massage for three and a half months but that is unrealistic. The only thing the Spurs could do was hope he didn't get hurt. Unfortunately he did.

Now the best thing to do is just deal with it and move on. Do what needs to be done to have him healthy by the playoffs. The regular season doesn't matter -- as we saw last year. Ginobili was SuperManu last year in the regular season but burning him out in March ended the Spurs' season. If he needs surgery or months upon months of rest, do it. It may be tough to make the playoffs with a limited Manu but it's impossible to win a championship with a limited Manu, so hope TD and TP carry the Spurs during the regular season.

I do think this injury is pretty damn serious. For him to sit out against the United States (and it sounds like the bronze medal game, too), he must have really F'ed it up. In 2002, he played on a decimated ankle. During the playoffs he played. I think he'd put up with more pain during the Olympics than he would during the playoffs just because the Olympics is one-and-done while the playoffs is a grind. If he doesn't play in the bronze medal game, I'm guessing there is something really wrong and he's going to need time to recuperate.

Overall, I'm not pissed at Manu or the Spurs for how this was handled. Everything went how it was going to go. The Spurs had to caution Manu but Manu had to ultimately play. If I'm mad at anything regarding Manu, it isn't the Olympics ... it'd be not coming ready to play in Game 1 against the Lakers. I don't know if his head was in Beijing back then or what but his lack of focus that game was something I've never seen out of him. He even admitted after the game that he wasn't ready to play. Watching the tape recently, he played like his brain was somewhere else. If I'm the Spurs, I get him the medical help he needs but I also demand that he now gives his full concentration to the Spurs. His Argentina national team time should be over. This has to be the end of that road. Now it is Spurs for the rest of his career.

The scary thing is that when Manu was around 27 and 28 years old, a lot of Spurs fans said that Manu plays so hard and so reckless that he'll be broken down by age 31 or 32. Well now he's 31. I'm sincerely hoping he has more gas left in the tank. I personally think he does but that he and the Spurs have to be smart about it. The Spurs can't have him carry the team during the regular season and Manu can't sacrifice his body in games that don't matter. If it takes playing him 20 to 24 minutes and skipping back-to-back games in the regular season to have him fresh by the playoffs, that's what needs to happen. Healthy Manu plus TD and TP in the playoffs is a team that has great championship potential. Hobbled Manu ends the Spurs chances.

Bottomline is this sucks but there is no reason to rush to judgment or sell Manu when his value is low. Get him healthy, figure out how to keep him healthy for the playoffs and go try to win championship number five.

[smeagol]

:clap:clap:clap @ timvp

[Emmanuel Ginobili 20]

He will be fine just because this guy is a warrior among all the warriorers.Just be cool Spurs fans.I talked to him after the game he told me he will just be fine before the regular season started.

[smeagol]

If I'm the Spurs, I get him the medical help he needs but I also demand that he now gives his full concentration to the Spurs. His Argentina national team time should be over. This has to be the end of that road. Now it is Spurs for the rest of his career.

This is what I was thinking, even before the Olympics started. And I'm sure Manu was thinking this too. He already skiped the Olympics qualifiers. I'm sure this is the end of his NT career.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Trade Manu for Beno

[ducks]

This is what I was thinking, even before the Olympics started. And I'm sure Manu was thinking this too. He already skiped the Olympics qualifiers. I'm sure this is the end of his NT career.

I would think huh

[ducks]

Trade Manu for Beno

trade manu for a healthy ?

[DPG21920]

I have already said most of the same things Timvp, I just hate that the Spurs have pretty much the only superstar in the league that you can not play starters minutes or amount of games. It puts so much pressure on other players and almost gives you the mindset that he is fragile.

Like if you think you are going to get hurt, you will type deal. But you do not trade him unless it is a top tier player (Howard, Lebron, ...) which is not happening.

[The Franchise]

Manu for Monta Ellis.

[The Franchise]

Just kidding.:lol

[T Park]

I'm sorry, I can't agree with he should've been allowed to play.

You put a significant investment into him, you rely on him very heavily as a franchise, that means hes an employee who should respect your wishes when it comes to offseason endeavors.



I have read some stupid shit coming from you over the years, but this one wins the gold medal.

You can hang it around your neck and wear it proudly



If insulting me makes you feel better, whatever.

[DPG21920]

Manu for Monta Ellis.

No way. The only way you trade Ginobili is if you get a no brainer, home run deal. Monta is the kind of deal the Spurs would get for Manu that would be getting lower value than he is worth. That is the perfect example of an offer the Spurs would get that they should say hell no to.

[T Park]

Manu for Monta Ellis.

Throw in Stephen Jackson and you've got a deal.

[dbreiden83080]

Oh yes i loved the whole idea that "Manu is playing for his country and the hell with the Spurs, some things are more important than money"

Right easy as hell to say when you get paid healthy or injured. Manu never should have done this. Anyone who encouraged him to play in the Olympics in my opinion was wrong. We all saw how hurt he was in the playoffs. Man was out there hobbling around on one foot and letting scrub defenders shut him down. Now he gets hurt again, same ankle injury that plagued him last year and in the playoffs. Who knows what shape he will come into camp like?? What a horrific decision Manu made this Summer.

[DPG21920]

Just kidding.:lol

Damn it! Well thanks for giving me an example to use!

[ploto]

Manu could have just as easily done what he did to that ankle practicing in a gym somewhere, as playing in the Olympics.

I actually do not think it is as drastic an injury as people think. I believe the Spurs got to him to keep him from playing on it.

[duncan228]

Now the best thing to do is just deal with it and move on. Do what needs to be done to have him healthy by the playoffs.

timvp with the voice of reason.

It is what it is and all the bitching and whining and he-shouldn't-have-played won't change it. I hope it's not too serious, and I hope he recovers completely. It's a shame he got hurt but there's not much else to do but wait it out.

[ChumpDumper]

I believe the Spurs got to him to keep him from playing on it.:lol

With all the leverage they have -- oh, that's right -- they have none.

[exstatic]

Manu could have just as easily done what he did to that ankle practicing in a gym somewhere, as playing in the Olympics.

I actually do not think it is as drastic an injury as people think. I believe the Spurs got to him to keep him from playing on it.

He didn't land on anyone, he didn't step on anyone, he just cut and passed the ball. I'd say his ankle is pretty fucked up right about now.

[The Franchise]

I think it's a good thing that Manu wanted to play for Argentina. The only problem I have is he should have been totally healthy. If the ankle wasn't healthy he shouldn't have played. Most people that are defending it will do a 180 if it turns out to be serious, and fucks up the Spurs season.

[T Park]

Manu could have just as easily done what he did to that ankle practicing in a gym somewhere, as playing in the Olympics.

I actually do not think it is as drastic an injury as people think. I believe the Spurs got to him to keep him from playing on it.


Yeah he could. But had he done what the Spurs said to do, rest for a couple months, rehab, the do some workouts, he probobly would've improved by now.

But no, Manu is a doctor.

[pad300]

Damn it! Well thanks for giving me an example to use!

Try this one

Joe Johnson (ATL)
for
Manu Ginobili, Matt Bonner

(Bonner is there to make the salary cap stuff work)
The salaries work. Does ATL do it? Does SAS do it? Picks from Either side?

Manu is better than Johnson per minute. Johnson plays more minutes. Manu is a better leader and more clutch.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

People on here take the Spurs way to seriously, they value them to high. No one has a right to criticize him since no one here knows what it's like to be a part of select few to represent your country in the O's.

[The Franchise]

People on here take the Spurs way to seriously, they value them to high. No one has a right to criticize him since no one here knows what it's like to be a part of select few to represent your country in the O's.

Would you say that if you were paying him 10 mil a year?:lol

[DPG21920]

Try this one

Joe Johnson (ATL)
for
Manu Ginobili, Matt Bonner

(Bonner is there to make the salary cap stuff work)
The salaries work. Does ATL do it? Does SAS do it? Picks from Either side?

Manu is better than Johnson per minute. Johnson plays more minutes. Manu is a better leader and more clutch.

That is pretty close to fair value, considering Joe is much younger. He is not the competitor that Manu is but the fact that he would be playing primarily shooting guard is a bonus because he is more productive when he does not have to play point guard. I do not think Atlanta does that or the Spurs, but if we had to trade Manu, I would not be upset at the return we got for him.

[sprrs]

Everyone's turning on Manu all of a sudden. You have to understand that the things that helped the Spurs win three championships are the same things that made him want to play for his country. You have to take the good with the bad.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Would you say that if you were paying him 10 mil a year?:lol

Like I said before, the Spurs knew what they were getting in him. The knew they'd have to hold their breath.

[DPG21920]

The Spurs knew what they were getting when they inked Manu. There are no surprises, just hope that he is ok and that he is not traded for nothing comparable in return, if at all.

[Kori Ellis]

Yeah he could. But had he done what the Spurs said to do, rest for a couple months, rehab, the do some workouts, he probobly would've improved by now.

But no, Manu is a doctor.


You realize Manu didn't diagnosis himself as ready to play, right? He was evaluated by doctors.

[DespЏrado]

I just can't help but shake my head in disbelief at this crap.

Manu is injured again. The guy is going to be the next Grant Hill the way he is pushing himself. And as he ages the arthritis and the recovery times will just get worse. I can't blame him for pushing himself. The guy is a hell of a competitor, it's just that perhaps if he had made better choices earlier, if he would have shut it down for the months after he first started injuring that ankle, he might have a few more rings and possibly a shot at another medal...

Every time the tendons get inflamed, his arthritis will get worse. I have to hope that they can do something with surgery soon, so that they can stabilize the entire ankle before he even thinks about standing up without an air-cast...If not surgery, he needs to shut it down for the next 3-6 months....

It's too bad that the rest of his career looks like it might be plagued by the constant worry of re-injury and a nagging lack of explosiveness. I wonder if after this we will ever see a consistent super Manu ever again?

[TheMadHatter]

It's not a question of representing your country.

Manu wasn't healthy going into the Olympics and he KNEW it. He willingly risked further damage by playing and that is not right at all. I'd be pissed as hell at him if he were on the Lakers.

[MB20]

It's not a question of representing your country.

Manu wasn't healthy going into the Olympics and he KNEW it. He willingly risked further damage by playing and that is not right at all. I'd be pissed as hell at him if he were on the Lakers.

It was his decision. Right or wrong (we will never agree).
Knowing Manu, he won't regret it.

Now it's Spurs management's call.

Trade him or keep him.
I don't care anymore.

[DespЏrado]

One other point to make is that if Kobe showed the slightest sign of needing to shut it down the US team would and could shut him down. The US team, for all that Kobe brings to the table for them, would not risk losing access to NBA stars if a player of Kobe needed to shut it down and couldn't. And the US team could suffer the absence of Kobe or any of it's stars without missing a beat.

[Mr. Body]

Manu has every right to play for his country. This meant far more for his team and teammates than sitting out. If it costs him this season, it's more than worth it.

It's the Spurs' fault for not building a bench to sop around these problems.

[objective]

If he needs surgery or months upon months of rest, do it. It may be tough to make the playoffs with a limited Manu but it's impossible to win a championship with a limited Manu, so hope TD and TP carry the Spurs during the regular season.

...

The scary thing is that when Manu was around 27 and 28 years old, a lot of Spurs fans said that Manu plays so hard and so reckless that he'll be broken down by age 31 or 32. Well now he's 31. I'm sincerely hoping he has more gas left in the tank. I personally think he does but that he and the Spurs have to be smart about it.

I feel this is the key to the next few years as a whole, and the injury from this morning's game was a symptom, not a cause.

Ginobili is more likely than not to be past his prime. Whether that's because of the burnout of playing so much and so hard, injuries, or time catching up to a player on the wrong side of 30, that's the situation. He's a jumpshooter now, it happens to everyone when they lose their athleticism. Maybe it'll come back in stretches, but it's done. He'll heave up more and more three-pointers, the Spurs will be easier to stop. He'll also have more and more turnovers as his attempts to drive without being capable of the moves he pulled 3-5 years ago will be easier and easier to defend.

He probably is 'limited Manu' now, based on age and wear and tear. And the Spurs aren't talented enough to win a title with 'limited Manu' unless bad things happen to other teams.

Can't really trade him, nothing the Spurs get in return can make them better.

The Spurs have had their opportunities to add talent over the years to try to alleviate some of the pressure but wasted it (Including he who's name must not be spoken).

They've done nothing this off-season to change that either, other than adding Udoka 2.0 in Roger Mason and keeping obstacles in place to guarantee that Mahinmi won't be a difference maker. Getting boned by Splitter didn't help.

It's a shame, but "it is what it is".

[carina_gino20]

Overall, I'm not pissed at Manu or the Spurs for how this was handled. Everything went how it was going to go. The Spurs had to caution Manu but Manu had to ultimately play. If I'm mad at anything regarding Manu, it isn't the Olympics ... it'd be not coming ready to play in Game 1 against the Lakers. I don't know if his head was in Beijing back then or what but his lack of focus that game was something I've never seen out of him. He even admitted after the game that he wasn't ready to play. Watching the tape recently, he played like his brain was somewhere else. If I'm the Spurs, I get him the medical help he needs but I also demand that he now gives his full concentration to the Spurs. His Argentina national team time should be over. This has to be the end of that road. Now it is Spurs for the rest of his career.


I think forcing a Game 7, and winning Game 7 in NO, cost him a lot mentally and physically. He was drained and probably had a mental meltdown that sometimes happens when you come from a high.

I hope he will be healthy. That said, he's probably going to restyle his game again with more jumpshots than wacky drives. He already showed improvement in his midrange jumper last season.

[weebo]

I think forcing a Game 7, and winning Game 7 in NO, cost him a lot mentally and physically. He was drained and probably had a mental meltdown that sometimes happens when you come from a high.

I hope he will be healthy. That said, he's probably going to restyle his game again with more jumpshots than wacky drives. He already showed improvement in his midrange jumper last season.

Oh God no...sounds like he's turning into Vinny Del Negro! :depressed

[jackseven]

The same reason some of you are mad at Manu is also the same reason you love him on the Spurs. Doug Collins actually said something insightful today by quoting Pop. I think the line was Ginobili may be more of a competitor than he is talented.

If Manu took off the Olympics, you might as well call him Ted because it wouldn't be Manu. He's crazy, fearless, and he'll do anything to win. Manu was never going to have the polish of Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant - he comes with a lot of good and a little bit of bad. It's just part of what you get with Manu. Playing in the Olympics wasn't a heady decision if you were taking a standardized test essay, but it was something Manu had to do.

The Spurs knew what they were getting when they inked him to that $50m deal.

[Spurtacus]

I just got home. Haven't watched the game. Is it THAT bad? Or did he just tweak his ankle again?

[angel_luv]

I love Timmy and will always wish him well.

But if the Spurs were to trade Manu, I could never root for them the same again.

[AC#21_TD ERA]

By Manu playing in the fucking olympics was a selfish stupid move. He knew he wasn't right but his stubborness got the better of him and now he's paying the consequences. Every decision you make there's a consequence. So it's time we trade that selfish cunt.

:pctoss

[Solid D]

http://www.nba.com/media/act_dan_majerle.jpg

For Kori and timvp.

[DespЏrado]

I just got home. Haven't watched the game. Is it THAT bad? Or did he just tweak his ankle again?

It didn't even look like an injury. So he re-injured it on a cut that shouldn't have even bothered a healthy ankle. The fact that he never came back and the Agentina doctors said it was practically "impossible" to play in the bronze medal game, then yes it's bad.

I'd say it's bad enough that I am worried about the rest of his career on bum wheels.

[Dex]

I see the point Buck is forcing here, but bad article, and unfair to Manu. Bad form.

Funny, too. I immediately just scrolled this thread for timvp's response, and found it more enlightening than Buck's.

I guess that's the difference between just a beat writer and a real fan.

[carina_gino20]

I just got home. Haven't watched the game. Is it THAT bad? Or did he just tweak his ankle again?

His landing didn't look so tragic. But it's the same ankle he hurt in the playoffs. He limped off the court, went to the locker room and didn't come out again, and now team doctors say that the ligament is very inflamed.

[carina_gino20]

Oh God no...sounds like he's turning into Vinny Del Negro! :depressed

It's the safest way for him now. We love him for his reckless play, but for the sake of longevity, he has to develop a reliable midrange if he doesn't want to be banged up by the time the playoffs roll around.

[Spurtacus]

Thanks for the replies. I will be watching the game later on DVR.

[anakha]

By Manu playing in the fucking olympics was a selfish stupid move. He knew he wasn't right but his stubborness got the better of him and now he's paying the consequences. Every decision you make there's a consequence. So it's time we trade that selfish cunt.

:pctoss

And the stupidity factor on ST jumps once again. :lol

[edgar]

Trade Him While He Has Value

[Solid D]

http://www.nba.com/media/act_dan_majerle.jpg

For Kori and timvp.

Discussion from 2 and 1/2 years ago. Will Manu last past 2010 when his contract expires?

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34981

[sassystriker]

Thank You Manu for playing in the Olympics!! MAde us proud as hell!!

[Lakers_55]

I'll add this. It really sucks he had to get hurt, and if it's serious, just rest him for a few months. It will give the Spurs bench a chance to see what they can do, and SA will still make the playoffs even if Manu only plays half the year.

[ducks]

I bet manu needs the knife

[ducks]

Manu could have just as easily done what he did to that ankle practicing in a gym somewhere, as playing in the Olympics.

I actually do not think it is as drastic an injury as people think. I believe the Spurs got to him to keep him from playing on it.

why did he not then oh wait he is above obeying pop
something rasho does not like to do either

[SequSpur]

why did he not then oh wait he is above obeying pop
something rasho does not like to do either

got damn you're so fucking stupid.

[carina_gino20]

got damn you're so fucking stupid.

That's no secret. Ducks is overjoyed by Manu's injury.

[Capt Bringdown]

What decision can the Spurs make? Manu's value has diminished considerably because of his increasing fragility. I don't think there would be a lot of interest if they were to put him on the trading block.

[rj215]

While Manu's dedication to his country is admirable, he owes something to the team that pays his salary. If he was healthy then the Spurs shouldn't have had any issues with him playing but since he was already trying to rehab a nagging injury that may have cost us a repeat chance this past season, he should have sat out. What's worse is Manu have also jeapordized next season in an already tough conference with this move.

I hope the Spurs don't trade him and that they do sign him to an extension. But the new contract should stipulate restrictions on his offseason commitments to his national team.

[Capt Bringdown]

The regular season doesn't matter -- as we saw last year.

What? The regular season was HUGE last year. We really could have used HCA, don't you think?

And HCA was absolutely vital for the Celts in their championship run. It will probably be the same for this year's champion.

The regular season matters quite a bit IMO.

[hater]

:lmao at the people already calling a career ending injury

Manu will be back for spurs a few more seasons then go to Europe.

[Ice009]

While Manu's dedication to his country is admirable, he owes something to the team that pays his salary. If he was healthy then the Spurs shouldn't have had any issues with him playing but since he was already trying to rehab a nagging injury that may have cost us a repeat chance this past season, he should have sat out. What's worse is Manu have also jeapordized next season in an already tough conference with this move.

I hope the Spurs don't trade him and that they do sign him to an extension. But the new contract should stipulate restrictions on his offseason commitments to his national team.

I'm going to say something here. Maybe Manu should have sat out the whole Lakers series. If Manu sat out the Lakers series he could have been even closer to 100% in the Olympics and not re-injured it. The result would have still been the same because the Spurs lost to the Lakers anyway with Manu playing injured.

You can make an argument both ways. He shouldn't have played for the Spurs in the playoffs or Argentina in the Olympics.

What would we have said as Spurs fans if Manu sat out the whole Lakers series? We probably would have wanted him to play even injured if he wasn't risking further injury to it. Argentina the same. Personally, I don't know how I would have reacted had Manu sat out that series. If his ankle was really bad I think I would have been OK with him sitting out the Lakers series, but we all know that we were going for the repeat and Manu wanted to play, no way he wanted to sit out. Same deal in the Olympics - Manu was going for the repeat and he wanted to play.

btw this article by BUCK HARVEY is total bullshit. I am thinking of sending him and email for this shit.

[NZ Spurs]

They had to accept that the same Ginobili they love in tense moments is the same Ginobili who will sacrifice everything to play with his Argentine buddies.


He wasn't playing with his buddies, its the fucking Olympics.

[DespЏrado]

:lmao at the people already calling a career ending injury

Manu will be back for spurs a few more seasons then go to Europe.

Knowing what happened to Grant Hill makes Manu's injury a huge worry, what do we know about Manu's Ankle?

It's severely inflamed.
His teammate Delfino said he was in a huge amount of pain even at half time about 20 minutes later.
He has arthritis in that ankle which is aggravated by chronic inflammation, and will only get worse with continued stress.
The Spurs had already talked with Manu about surgery.
The injury to his left ankle is starting to pass the one time and done thing and is starting to appear to be a chronic problem, and could lead to long term structural damage to the ankle and the other parts that he uses to compensate with.
He gets steroid injections in that ankle (at least more than a few in the past 6 months) to reduce swelling which over time degrades the elasticity of the tendons.

Add all of that up and you get a 31 year old player who relies on his explosiveness to play the game, who may no longer have the ability to be explosive.

I am worried about Manu's career. It's not too early to see that the end of his career isn't that many years away.

[DespЏrado]

I'm going to say something here. Maybe Manu should have sat out the whole Lakers series. If Manu sat out the Lakers series he could have been even closer to 100% in the Olympics and not re-injured it. The result would have still been the same because the Spurs lost to the Lakers anyway with Manu playing injured.

You can make an argument both ways. He shouldn't have played for the Spurs in the playoffs or Argentina in the Olympics.

What would we have said as Spurs fans if Manu sat out the whole Lakers series? We probably would have wanted him to play even injured if he wasn't risking further injury to it. Argentina the same. Personally, I don't know how I would have reacted had Manu sat out that series. If his ankle was really bad I think I would have been OK with him sitting out the Lakers series, but we all know that we were going for the repeat and Manu wanted to play, no way he wanted to sit out. Same deal in the Olympics - Manu was going for the repeat and he wanted to play.

btw this article by BUCK HARVEY is total bullshit. I am thinking of sending him and email for this shit.

Um a lot of the spurs fans here actually were begging Manu to be forced to sit out at least the first two games of the WCF, I certainly didn't want him playing until he could at least recover from the injury, and get some of the inflammation down to the point that he wasn't risking re-injury.

[duncan228]

Jeff McDonald: An Argentine update on Manu (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/archives/2008/08/jeff_mcdonald_a_13.html)

Unless you've been living in a cave with only dial-up Internet access, you've already seen the scene nobody in South Texas or Buenos Aires wanted to see: Manu Ginobili, pain painted on his face, holding his ankle in agony.

Ginobili was injured in the first quarter of Team Argentina's Olympic clash with the USA's Redeem Team on Thursday night/Friday morning, providing Spurs coach Gregg Popovich with an "I told you so" moment of the bitterest sort.

We just received an email from Hernan Sartori, an Argentine journalist covering his home country's now-impossible gold-medal defense, who was on the scene in Beijing. Here are the highlights (or, if you're a fan of either the Spurs or the Argentines, the lowlights) of Sartori's update:

According to Diego Grippo, the Argentine team doctor, Ginobili has re-strained the ligament in his left ankle that hampered him in the Western Conference playoffs last season. The Spurs guard also has tendinitis in the flexor tendon on the same foot.

Our Hombre in Beijing reports the mood in the Argentine camp to be understandably somber. Some players told him Ginobili was "destroyed spiritually" after reinjuring himself.

What struck Sartori most from press row was that, after heading to the locker room for treatment, Ginobili did not return to the bench to watch the rest of the game. "That was the most alarming sign he is not OK," Sartori wrote in his e-mail.

At any rate, Ginobili's Olympic foray is over. He is not expected to play in Argentina's bronze-medal game against Lithuania.

Ginobili is supposed to have an MRI sometime Saturday in Beijing. Spurs officials will likely hold off on any official comments at least until after those results are in.

[timvp]

What? The regular season was HUGE last year. We really could have used HCA, don't you think?

And HCA was absolutely vital for the Celts in their championship run. It will probably be the same for this year's champion.

The regular season matters quite a bit IMO.
How did you manage to take that quote out of context? Did you read the sentence prior to it or the sentence after it?


Do what needs to be done to have him healthy by the playoffs. The regular season doesn't matter -- as we saw last year. Ginobili was SuperManu last year in the regular season but burning him out in March ended the Spurs' season.
What Manu does in the regular season isn't important. Playing great in the regular season and fizzling out in the playoffs doesn't help the Spurs at all. Whether Ginobili's 2008-09 campaign is a success will be determined 100% on what he does in the playoffs.

[Ice009]

Thanks for posting that Duncan228.

What do you guys think? I really hope Manu's ankle is OK.

[timvp]

According to Diego Grippo, the Argentine team doctor, Ginobili has re-strained the ligament in his left ankle that hampered him in the Western Conference playoffs last season. The Spurs guard also has tendinitis in the flexor tendon on the same foot.

:pctoss

That's bad news. His foot sounds pretty messed up. He'll need a long time to not only heal but to heal to a point where he's not at a risk of injury. If the tendons are still stretched, he might need surgery.

Luckily the playoffs are a long ways away. If you are a Spurs fan, we better hope TD and TP can do the heavy lifting this year and Mason and Udoka can at least hold the fort.

Oh and that noise you hear is Michael Finley oiling up his joints getting ready to play 25 minutes a game this year.

[carina_gino20]

How did you manage to take that quote out of context? Did you read the sentence prior to it or the sentence after it?


What Manu does in the regular season isn't important. Playing great in the regular season and fizzling out in the playoffs doesn't help the Spurs at all. Whether Ginobili's 2008-09 campaign is a success will be determined 100% on what he does in the playoffs.

I think last year, what he did was important. But only because the race was so tight and our bench was non-existent at some points. But I do agree with preserving him more in the RS. If nothing else, it will force the others to step up.

[carina_gino20]

Jeff McDonald: An Argentine update on Manu (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/archives/2008/08/jeff_mcdonald_a_13.html)

Unless you've been living in a cave with only dial-up Internet access, you've already seen the scene nobody in South Texas or Buenos Aires wanted to see: Manu Ginobili, pain painted on his face, holding his ankle in agony.

Ginobili was injured in the first quarter of Team Argentina's Olympic clash with the USA's Redeem Team on Thursday night/Friday morning, providing Spurs coach Gregg Popovich with an "I told you so" moment of the bitterest sort.

We just received an email from Hernan Sartori, an Argentine journalist covering his home country's now-impossible gold-medal defense, who was on the scene in Beijing. Here are the highlights (or, if you're a fan of either the Spurs or the Argentines, the lowlights) of Sartori's update:

According to Diego Grippo, the Argentine team doctor, Ginobili has re-strained the ligament in his left ankle that hampered him in the Western Conference playoffs last season. The Spurs guard also has tendinitis in the flexor tendon on the same foot.

Our Hombre in Beijing reports the mood in the Argentine camp to be understandably somber. Some players told him Ginobili was "destroyed spiritually" after reinjuring himself.

What struck Sartori most from press row was that, after heading to the locker room for treatment, Ginobili did not return to the bench to watch the rest of the game. "That was the most alarming sign he is not OK," Sartori wrote in his e-mail.

At any rate, Ginobili's Olympic foray is over. He is not expected to play in Argentina's bronze-medal game against Lithuania.

Ginobili is supposed to have an MRI sometime Saturday in Beijing. Spurs officials will likely hold off on any official comments at least until after those results are in.

Thanks for the update, duncan228.

[DarkMaverick]

I hope Manu recovers soon.

[AC#21_TD ERA]

And the stupidity factor on ST jumps once again. :lol

Do you reckon you can speak to your mates the Power Rangers and see if they can fix Manu's ankle with the super powers they have?:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

Also did you know that in the event of Manu's latest ankle injury RC Buford has been in contact with the Power Rangers to join the Spurs next season. Reports said that he offered them a 2 year deal. The Powers Rangers are seriously considering the offer but they also have another offer on the table to perform with a European team. :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[BOHOLANO#21]

I'm so sorry to hear Spurs folks reacting like this. He has proven over and over again that patriotism is more important to him than money. I would have thought that folks in San Antonio would respect that, perhaps even understand it.

Ginobili in Argentina is the equivalent of Tiger Woods in America right now. If Tiger had said he would not play for an American team because Nike was afraid he would hurt himself, folks would be blaming him for not being patriotic enough. I respect the guys who play for their countries. Ten million buys the loyalty it buys. It buys, for Manu, all the grit and drive and talent he has every single night of the season for his nba team. It buys a willingness to put his team before himself and his own statistics by playing hurt when necessary, by coming off the bench behind a guy like Finley who hasn't Manu's youth or talent, by never whining or crying when others on the team get more press and adulation. He doesn't owe the Spurs or San Antonio one other thing. He entered into his contract with them, and they with him, as an economic transaction. Manu has more than lived up to his end of the agreement. The Spurs are quick to point out the "business" aspect of the sport when it is to their advantage in negotiations. They, and we, should expect the same from the athletes we pay to play here.

His country didn't engage in a bidding war to buy his loyalty. It didn't have to. He is true to his nation of birth. Isn't that something we should applaud???

Manu got hurt during the regular season in San Antonio. So should the Argentines say that he shouldn't have played so hard for the Spurs because he had the Olympics coming up? C'mon guys. Country is bigger than salaries or nba seasons.

Buck Harvey has really sunk to a new low. I wasn't certain that was possible.
yup. spurs fans here just don't understand how playing for your country is as important as fighting in a war to defend your country. MANU said it many times how sweet it is to play with millions of people cheering for you than a couple of millions. if i'm in MANU's shoes i would do the same and proudly wear my country's color anyway i can. peace.

[timvp]

spurs fans here just don't understand how playing for your country is as important as fighting in a war to defend your country.Massive fail.

[cly2tw]

Well, Manu had only himself to blame, not for playing for his country but for trying too hard at floppling. The previous two flops he applied on LBJ on the defensive end, he got one foul called on himself and one on LB. We all know that Manu also is a master at flopping on offense. So, when he drove by LB, he might have thought it worthwhile to flop again. Yet, this time he sprained his ankle due to bad motions on his side.

What's the moral? Flopping is a risky business! Only try it at your own risk. ;)

[DROB4EVER]

He will be fine and come back stronger than ever next yr. It takes about 2 months for that type of injury to heal. As long as he gets proper treament which he will.

Pops will likely cut his mins down next yr to 25-27 range to keep him from over working it.

[Kori Ellis]

People that are projecting how long it will take him to heal are funny. The MRI hasn't even been taken yet to say how severe the injury is. Some people on the forum are writing him off for his career, while other say he will be fine in a couple months.

At least wait til tomorrow until you all put on your Dr. SpursTalk hats and project is demise or return to glory.

[anakha]

Do you reckon you can speak to your mates the Power Rangers and see if they can fix Manu's ankle with the super powers they have?:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

Also did you know that in the event of Manu's latest ankle injury RC Buford has been in contact with the Power Rangers to join the Spurs next season. Reports said that he offered them a 2 year deal. The Powers Rangers are seriously considering the offer but they also have another offer on the table to perform with a European team. :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

Calling Ginobili a 'selfish cunt' and making avatar jokes. Weak.

[exstatic]

People that are projecting how long it will take him to heal are funny. The MRI hasn't even been taken yet to say how severe the injury is. Some people on the forum are writing him off for his career, while other say he will be fine in a couple months.

At least wait til tomorrow until you all put on your Dr. SpursTalk hats and project is demise or return to glory.

Normally, I would agree with "wait and see", but considering that he made an average basketball move, and crumpled to the court, I'd say his ankle is fucked. Chide me after the MRI if I'm wrong. I don't think I am. I think they'll shut him down (assuming no surgery) until after the new year. Four months should be about right, and what he would have had if he hadn't played Olympic ball.

[Kori Ellis]

Normally, I would agree with "wait and see", but considering that he made an average basketball move, and crumpled to the court, I'd say his ankle is fucked. Chide me after the MRI if I'm wrong. I don't think I am. I think they'll shut him down (assuming no surgery) until after the new year. Four months should be about right, and what he would have had if he hadn't played Olympic ball.

Oh I think there's definitely something pretty wrong too. It's becoming more evident that it's probably something chronic. After all, he was cleared to play - it's not like him was playing when he was actively injured. And you are right, he wasn't even doing anything amazing when it happened. That's why I wanted to be clear in another thread that this could have happened to him at any time - at the practice facility or even just running across the street. It didn't happen because he was playing in the Olympics.

I'm just not ready to write off his career, trade him for scrubs, or on the flip side, say he'll be back in 2 months. I'll wait to see what's wrong with and see if he needs surgery or what.

[DespЏrado]

Normally, I would agree with "wait and see", but considering that he made an average basketball move, and crumpled to the court, I'd say his ankle is fucked. Chide me after the MRI if I'm wrong. I don't think I am. I think they'll shut him down (assuming no surgery) until after the new year. Four months should be about right, and what he would have had if he hadn't played Olympic ball.


That's pretty much how I see it. If this weren't the same damn injury that has been coming back over and over again, I would believe that it wasn't this bad.

But Ginobili didn't even twist the ankle. It didn't turn or roll, it was him putting weight on it that caused him to miss one of the biggest games of his career.

And we have the doctors for Argentina saying he shouldn't play on it, which is an absolute "hell has frozen" over first. If they are saying it's bad then I am pretty sure the foot has actually fallen off and Manu is now going to lead the Argentina paraplegic olympic team to unheard of glory.

But seriously, I do worry that Manu will not be able to be the explosive chaos on the court that made him such a force. I worry that he's going to be running on a gimped ankle that requires serious surgery to get back to playing strength. And I worry that the dude is 31 going on 40 at this point.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Totally lame article - any time you step on a basketball court you know there's a good chance that you'll sprain your ankle. I know - I did it 37 times in 16 years.

Manu's just going to have to cross his fingers and manage it fo the rest of his career, he knows that.

[T Park]

What? The regular season was HUGE last year. We really could have used HCA, don't you think?

And HCA was absolutely vital for the Celts in their championship run. It will probably be the same for this year's champion.

The regular season matters quite a bit IMO.


Yeah the Spurs won a game 7 on the road.
I'd say HCA didn't mean shit.

[Spurtacus]

Spurstalk reacts to Ginobili's injury.

http://k53.pbase.com/v3/46/576046/2/46012980.jump.jpg

[T Park]

If surgery fixes the ankle and keeps it from coming back, get it done.

Anythig for him to be 100% by the playoffs.

Mason Udoka and others can hold down the fort.

[Whisky Dog]

Manu did what was important to Manu. There are an infinite amount of things in this life more important than your job, and Manu did what was important to him - good for him. Companies (including sports franchises) use up people all the time and toss them aside once they become too expensive and/or too old, and just replace them like a cog in a machine. Going down swinging for his country on one leg is a memory that he will take with him to his death bed.

I hope it doesn't mean an effective end to his prime playing career and render him virtually useless, but if it does then that's just the way it goes. He's given us and the Spurs so much to remember and has been a part of 3 titles. He's done his job and done it well.

[Holt's Cat]

So fucking predictable.

On to 2010.

[Kori Ellis]

Totally lame article - any time you step on a basketball court you know there's a good chance that you'll sprain your ankle. I know - I did it 37 times in 16 years.

Manu's just going to have to cross his fingers and manage it fo the rest of his career, he knows that.

Manu didn't twist it. He didn't roll it. And they are considering surgery. So it's not just that he has an average chance of spraining an ankle like every other player out there.

[Jahivah]

I wont shed a single tear. The writing was on the wall with Ginobli. He has alot of miles on those ankles. Once they go bad they almost never are the same again. The Spurs did nothing in the offseason. All of their starters with the exception of TP are over 30 and they refused to add youth to the bench.

[Kori Ellis]

I wont shed a single tear. The writing was on the wall with Ginobli. He has alot of miles on those ankles. Once they go bad they almost never are the same again. The Spurs did nothing in the offseason. All of their starters with the exception of TP are over 30 and they refused to add youth to the bench.

They added Roger Mason to their wing rotation. I'm not sure who you wanted, but they didn't have much money to spend.

[jackseven]

I've sprained my ankle the day before I played in a regional billiards tournament (semi-pro player) after I turned 35. It hurt but I just gutted it out. I guess I'm just tougher than Manu.

[xellos88330]

In my opinion I think that Manu goofed up. He is the face of Argentina right now. If he wishes to be a sort of "ambassador" for Argentina for a while, he better start taking care of himself. I think it would be in the best interests of both the Spurs and Argentina to let Manu get some much needed rest. If he doesn't, Manu will continue to burn himself out and his career will end all too early.

[johngateswhiteley]

i cannot believe the idiocy in this thread. rest him through february if necessary, who cares. dude has a right to play for his country...the Spurs don't own him. damn.

there is nothing wrong with Manu that can't heal...he comes back too early each time. let him sit for 6 months...so what.

[johngateswhiteley]

People that are projecting how long it will take him to heal are funny. The MRI hasn't even been taken yet to say how severe the injury is. Some people on the forum are writing him off for his career, while other say he will be fine in a couple months.

At least wait til tomorrow until you all put on your Dr. SpursTalk hats and project is demise or return to glory.

thats part of the craziness...

[xellos88330]

yup. spurs fans here just don't understand how playing for your country is as important as fighting in a war to defend your country. MANU said it many times how sweet it is to play with millions of people cheering for you than a couple of millions. if i'm in MANU's shoes i would do the same and proudly wear my country's color anyway i can. peace.


Well since you put it that way, since when does the military send in hobbled soldiers to battle? The only way I see is out of desperation. My brother was wounded in Iraq and he was never sent back into battle. If they sent him back in while not fully recovered I would be short one brother, and the army would be short one damn fine soldier. Represent your country by all means, just make sure you are at peak condition so everyone will know what country you come from, and how truly great your country is.

[roycrikside]

Agreed, the college players should be playing in these olympics.

Hey, blame American ego for that one, bud. NBA players play in the Olympics because the USA and their egotistical fans can't stand to lose at basketball. If they made a rule that no NBA player could participate in the Olympics, regardless of what country he plays for, some foreign team like Lithuania or Greece would win the gold easily over a U.S. college team. Especially now with all the good college players jumping into the NBA right away after one or two years.

Americans started this mess in 1992, so don't go crying about it now because it hurts the Spurs. That's the thing about international basketball that drives me insane. Only Americans think they have pride and something to prove. Every country that plays has heart and pride and want to do well.

[roycrikside]

manu would almost fit perfectly with the rockets
always hurt

Remind me again who played more last year, Manu or Tony? Who got the Spurs into the playoffs, Manu or Tony?

[roycrikside]

I'm sorry, I can't agree with he should've been allowed to play.

You put a significant investment into him, you rely on him very heavily as a franchise, that means hes an employee who should respect your wishes when it comes to offseason endeavors.





If insulting me makes you feel better, whatever.

A lot of people here seem to confuse "employee" with "indentured servant." The Spurs control Manu nine months a year, not twelve. And at the end of the day playing Olympic basketball is safer than a whole lot of shit most guys do in their off time, whether it's surfing, riding a motorcycle, hanging out in questionable nightclubs, etc.

I'm going to say this one last time and hopefully TPark will get it.

MANU IS NOT ON THIS PLANET FOR YOUR PERSONAL AMUSEMENT. HE IS A HUMAN BEING WITH HIS OWN MIND AND FREE WILL. HE WILL DO WHATEVER THE FUCK HE WANTS AND HE WILL NOT ASK YOUR PERMISSION OR CARE WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT IT.

Like Pop says, GET OVER YOURSELF.

[baseline bum]

I think it's a bit selfish of Spurs fans to expect Manu to not try to defend his country's gold medal. Obviously it has now turned out to be the wrong choice, but Manu's never been one to go the conservative route. Manu's willingness to say to hell with the consequences in the name of winning is a double-edged sword that's cutting the team a bit right now, but is overall one of the Spurs most powerful weapons. If Manu wants to go do something for himself and for his country in his offtime, I'm not going to fault him for it.

[roycrikside]

The people here who say stuff like Manu should be traded or he shouldn't be signed to an extension (the same people who complain about mercenary whore athletes wanted Manu to act like a mercenary whore) are hilarious. Do you all honestly think Manu cares? Do you think if he's a Toronto Raptor or playing ball in Spain or Italy in 2010 he'll think to himself for one second, "I wish I didn't play in the '08 Olympics?"

He's not wired that way, folks. If he was programmed to regret things or worry about risks, then no one here would've ever heard of Manu Ginobili.

If the Spurs don't want him, too bad, but somebody will. If he doesn't get 10 million, oh well he'll get 7 million. Big deal, he already has made enough to live comfortably several lifetimes over. And if his injury is so severe that he never plays again, then guess what, his last game was in an Argentine uniform, and I don't think he'd mind that one bit.

No guts, no glory.

I'm not Argentine and have never even visited South America, but I am foreign, so maybe I have some perspective on it. I've understood from the beginning that as a Spurs fan he was never "our" Manu Ginobili. We were just borrowing him for a while. Ultimately, he belongs to Argentina.

[polandprzem]

Damn

Manu played on a jammed ankle in last months of a season.
He was risking his health, for what?

[carina_gino20]

The people here who say stuff like Manu should be traded or he shouldn't be signed to an extension (the same people who complain about mercenary whore athletes wanted Manu to act like a mercenary whore) are hilarious. Do you all honestly think Manu cares? Do you think if he's a Toronto Raptor or playing ball in Spain or Italy in 2010 he'll think to himself for one second, "I wish I didn't play in the '08 Olympics?"

He's not wired that way, folks. If he was programmed to regret things or worry about risks, then no one here would've ever heard of Manu Ginobili.

If the Spurs don't want him, too bad, but somebody will. If he doesn't get 10 million, oh well he'll get 7 million. Big deal, he already has made enough to live comfortably several lifetimes over. And if his injury is so severe that he never plays again, then guess what, his last game was in an Argentine uniform, and I don't think he'd mind that one bit.

No guts, no glory.

I'm not Argentine and have never even visited South America, but I am foreign, so maybe I have some perspective on it. I've understood from the beginning that as a Spurs fan he was never "our" Manu Ginobili. We were just borrowing him for a while. Ultimately, he belongs to Argentina.

:tu

[Slippy]

Oh I think there's definitely something pretty wrong too. It's becoming more evident that it's probably something chronic. After all, he was cleared to play - it's not like him was playing when he was actively injured. And you are right, he wasn't even doing anything amazing when it happened. That's why I wanted to be clear in another thread that this could have happened to him at any time - at the practice facility or even just running across the street. It didn't happen because he was playing in the Olympics.

.

Not so sure about that. The Spurs may have cleared him but they did also think rest would have benifited him the most. It had to be serious for him to be wearing a ankle boot before he started training. The difference in the level of exertion playing competitively as opposed to practicing or running across the street is huge especially in a high impact sport such as basketball.

I can vouch for this. I did my achilles 4 days ago playing one on one at the gym. For a variety of reasons i hadn't played ball for weeks. For the first few days last week all I did was shoot around. Then came the one on one . I was doing what i'd done for 20 years with no problem, back-peddling and then lunged forward. Pop, all of a sudden i was on the ground. It felt like some-one kikced me in the back of my foot. I paid the price for not getting into shape first and easing myself into it.

[SPURS50]

Ginobili's the man! The spurs go only as far as he goes! that's it! The spurs trade ginobili for what? A half ass competitor who could care less if the team wins or losses, there's alot of those scrubs around. No thanks!

[timvp]

Americans started this mess in 1992, so don't go crying about it now because it hurts the Spurs.The USA wasn't the first team to use professionals in international competition.


That's the thing about international basketball that drives me insane. Only Americans think they have pride and something to prove. Every country that plays has heart and pride and want to do well.That's the difference between being the top dog and being the underdog. The USA has to look at is as something to prove because nothing short of a gold is adequate for the best basketball playing nation in the world. On the other hand, every other country can be ecstatic just getting a medal. The difference in expectations is the biggest reason for the changes in perspective.

[The_Game]

it's a joke

I've said it all summer..people are idiots to say the spurs would of won against the lakers if manu was heathly. guess what, HE NEVER IS.

[Harry Callahan]

Remind me again who played more last year, Manu or Tony? Who got the Spurs into the playoffs, Manu or Tony?

Both of them got them in the playoffs you stupid idiot. That's why they call it a team.

[Harry Callahan]

A lot of people here seem to confuse "employee" with "indentured servant." The Spurs control Manu nine months a year, not twelve. And at the end of the day playing Olympic basketball is safer than a whole lot of shit most guys do in their off time, whether it's surfing, riding a motorcycle, hanging out in questionable nightclubs, etc.

I'm going to say this one last time and hopefully TPark will get it.

MANU IS NOT ON THIS PLANET FOR YOUR PERSONAL AMUSEMENT. HE IS A HUMAN BEING WITH HIS OWN MIND AND FREE WILL. HE WILL DO WHATEVER THE FUCK HE WANTS AND HE WILL NOT ASK YOUR PERMISSION OR CARE WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT IT.

Like Pop says, GET OVER YOURSELF.

Freewill is the reason he was in China. His health was compromised and common sense was ignored here.

The three months of this 2008 offseason will negatively impact the coming 9 months. When Manu is back in SA, sitting on the bench at the AT&T center, possibly in a cast or a soft boot watching his teammates playing regular season games in October or even November, he will probably feel a twinge of regret for ignoring Popovich.

It was obvious in the NBA playoffs as well as the Olympics that Manu was compensating for his ankle.

I am beginning to think that resting the ankle for even an extended period will not be the answer. A tenative Ginobili is not an effective Ginobili and the laker series showed just how limited he was. He was pushing the envelope in the WCFs just like he did in the Olympics. His body is telling him no when is heart and mind are saying yes. He's got to get well before he takes the court again.
I don't know if a surgical option is the thing to do at this point, but if something can be done now that will allow Manu to play basketball for 3-4 more years without the pain and discomfort he is in now, I am all for it.

[urunobili]

This is what I was thinking, even before the Olympics started. And I'm sure Manu was thinking this too. He already skiped the Olympics qualifiers. I'm sure this is the end of his NT career.

i think Manu will play the world cup in Turkey though... :wakeup

[benefactor]

The people here who say stuff like Manu should be traded or he shouldn't be signed to an extension (the same people who complain about mercenary whore athletes wanted Manu to act like a mercenary whore) are hilarious. Do you all honestly think Manu cares? Do you think if he's a Toronto Raptor or playing ball in Spain or Italy in 2010 he'll think to himself for one second, "I wish I didn't play in the '08 Olympics?"

He's not wired that way, folks. If he was programmed to regret things or worry about risks, then no one here would've ever heard of Manu Ginobili.

If the Spurs don't want him, too bad, but somebody will. If he doesn't get 10 million, oh well he'll get 7 million. Big deal, he already has made enough to live comfortably several lifetimes over. And if his injury is so severe that he never plays again, then guess what, his last game was in an Argentine uniform, and I don't think he'd mind that one bit.

No guts, no glory.

I'm not Argentine and have never even visited South America, but I am foreign, so maybe I have some perspective on it. I've understood from the beginning that as a Spurs fan he was never "our" Manu Ginobili. We were just borrowing him for a while. Ultimately, he belongs to Argentina.
I have said this before and I will say it again...there is a fine line between patriotism and selfishness. The tone of your post really gives the impression that Manu shouldn't give a damn about us at all.

I know that its important for him, but that does not give him the right to give the Spurs the finger when they have invested 9-10 mil a year in him. But he did, and he reinjured his ankle...and now its looking like it might be a recurring theme for him for the rest of his career. I am not going to call for a trade at this point, but I wouldn't be surprised or pissed off if they did trade him. The NBA is a business and Manu is empolyed by a frachise that has its own interests to look after. Regardless of how he feels about his country he took a risk that affects his job here. Now his employer has some hard decisions to make.

That being said, this is hardest kick to the balls we have received this offseason...and we have taken some pretty good shots already. We have no idea when we will see him on the court again. With everything that has come out there is a good chance he will have surgery on it, which could mean not getting him back until after the all star break.

I am not joining the cliff jumpers, as I know we can still contend and hang in there until he gets back, but man...getting screwed by Splitter, multiple free agents and now one of our own hurts man. It really hurts.

[SenorSpur]

Two words: Grant Hill

Recall how Grant Hill pushed himself to the brink during the first round series against Philly in the spring of 2000. Despite having severely injured his ankle before the start of that series, Hill gave into the competitive pressure and decided to play in the series anyway. Remember his ankle got progessively worse and he ended up missing Game 2 entirely. Despite this, the Pistons went on to sweep the Sixers. Meanwhile, Grant's ankle worsened to the extent that he didn't play again at all in the next round. We all know the story that followed. He was hobbled by the recurring injury, pain and inflammation that followed for the next 7 years!

I don't want to prematurely paint Manu's situation as this dire, but the fact remains that there is something chronically wrong with his ankle. He really needs to treat this injury very carefully and very seriously. Take the necessary time to rehab and for once "listen to his body" instead of his competitive urges. He's a 31 year-old player with a lot of miles on those wheels. In no way should he try and accelerate the process by coming back too soon - especially if he wants to extend his career. I know that's not how he's wired, which is the quality that has made him as great a player as he is.

As Spurs fans, we all want him to do what is in the best interest of him getting back onto the court as healthy and as soon as possible. At the same time and depending on the extent of the injury, there could be larger issues at stake. If the condition with his ankle is chronic, then he needs to be cognizant, not only the extensive rehab that lies ahead, but also his quality of life after basketball.

As far as the decision he made to play in the Olympics, it's no use second-guessing him on that now. I'm sure if he had to do it all over again, he would make the EXACT same decison. However just out of curiosity, if one were to ask Grant Hill if he regrets playing on that bum ankle 8 years ago, I wonder what his answer would be?

[MiamiHeat]

If Manu thinks patriotism is more important than money, then give the money back to the spurs.


What's that? He isn't going to give it back?

Then shut the f up.

[Solid D]

As Ginobili declines, Messi rises. Argentina's new hero.

:smokin

[Solid D]

Fast forward ahead to 2012 or 2016. Messi carries the flag of Argentina into the stadium as FC Barcelona or some other club agonizes.

http://lionelmessi.soccerstar.org/images/lionel%20messi_18.jpg

[Dartherus]

If that were true, he would return his salary to the Spurs for games he misses due to an injury sustained while representing Argentina.

If Manu agreed ahead of time to waive any Spurs salary obligations while he recovered from injury, THAT would be putting country ahead of MONEY. That would demonstrate the (noble and admirable) principle that he valued representing Argentina over anything else. Right now, all he's doing is putting his country ahead of the Spurs Organizaton, which really isn't all that much of a sacrifice for Manu.


If Manu thinks patriotism is more important than money, then give the money back to the spurs.


What's that? He isn't going to give it back?

Then shut the f up.

No commercial contract will obligate the employee to become a SLAVE of the employer....

Manu is on VACATION, and in any employment you have, you can do in vacation whatever you want. BTW, an insurance is signed before going to olympics that would cover the missing labor days, if they happen.

Besides, you complain so much about Manu as is it your money, when the truth is that the owners of the money got a real bargain for what they paid for.

Manu DIDN'T BREAK ANY CLAUSE in the contract, and delivered far more VALUE than what he was paid (if you compare how many overpaid players are in the league or how is the average performance of players with a similar salary than him).....

....and adding to pure performance and attitude, clutch plays, team chemistry and a lot of other intangibles, he's also the most SPECTACULAR player of a team that was considered 'boring' among NBA fans (Magic and Barkley defining him as the most EXCITING international player to watch)....

Another value provided? Manu is very POPULAR, and has a very strong presence on the US latin community (read latin MARKET), that also delivers value to the people who pay him the bills....

So, THINK better when you complain about the money being paid to Manu, instead of posting STUPID comments.

[exstatic]

i think Manu will play the world cup in Turkey though... :wakeup

I think after the Bejing disaster, the Spurs won't talk contract again with Manu until 2010, and since that's when the WCs are, they may not talk at all if he decides to play NT ball again.

[T Park]

Yeah if decides stupidly to play in that, the Spurs will tell him, fine let the country of Argentina pay you freaking 9 million a year.

[T Park]

No commercial contract will obligate the employee to become a SLAVE of the employer....

Manu is on VACATION, and in any employment you have, you can do in vacation whatever you want. BTW, an insurance is signed before going to olympics that would cover the missing labor days, if they happen.

Besides, you complain so much about Manu as is it your money, when the truth is that the owners of the money got a real bargain for what they paid for.

Manu DIDN'T BREAK ANY CLAUSE in the contract, and delivered far more VALUE than what he was paid (if you compare how many overpaid players are in the league or how is the average performance of players with a similar salary than him).....

....and adding to pure performance and attitude, clutch plays, team chemistry and a lot of other intangibles, he's also the most SPECTACULAR player of a team that was considered 'boring' among NBA fans (Magic and Barkley defining him as the most EXCITING international player to watch)....

Another value provided? Manu is very POPULAR, and has a very strong presence on the US latin community (read latin MARKET), that also delivers value to the people who pay him the bills....

So, THINK better when you complain about the money being paid to Manu, instead of posting STUPID comments.


:lol

Omg so Manu would be a "slave" to the Spurs if they told him not to play in the exhibitions?

Now I've seen everything :lmao

[picnroll]

Spurs shouldn't sign Manu unless it's cheap. The guy makes decision that hurt the team that pays him so screw him. Spurs wouldn't have let him lay on a bad ankle in a title game like the asshole Argentine coaches did in the World championships so let him and the ankle he's fucked up for Team Argentina sign for $5 with Bahia Blanca.

[Dartherus]

:lol

Omg so Manu would be a "slave" to the Spurs if they told him not to play in the exhibitions?

Now I've seen everything :lmao
Could you ELLABORATE a worthy answer instead of a silly attempt to make a joke?

My point was that NO WORKER, IN ANY AREA can be told what to do on VACATION....slavery times are far behind when employer was able to decide for the employee.

Spurs can suggest him not to play, perfect, but NOTHING ELSE...that's the point of that paragraph and the use of the slavery analogy....any interpretation beyond that is yours not mine.

BTW, what about the rest of the points I made? Did anyone find the contract clause manu broke? Do you still think he delivered less that what he's paid? Do Zach Randoplh provides more value compared with his earnings, because he won't play tournaments on vacations?

[roycrikside]

I have said this before and I will say it again...there is a fine line between patriotism and selfishness. The tone of your post really gives the impression that Manu shouldn't give a damn about us at all. <<

Judging by all the comments people have made these past few months about him, I would have to conclude that if you think Manu doesn't care about Spurs fans, then the feeling is mutual. So many people here view him as property and not a person. The general sentiment seems to be, "His body is used up, so he can take a long walk off a short pier."

I have no idea how any of it will work out, but one thing I'm positive about is that Manu shouldn't feel guilty about anything. He signed a 6 year, 55M contract, or something close to that, right? I think he's already given the Spurs 55M worth of NBA production, even with two years left. Only fools would argue otherwise.

[T Park]

Could you ELLABORATE a worthy answer instead of a silly attempt to make a joke?

My point was that NO WORKER, IN ANY AREA can be told what to do on VACATION....slavery times are far behind when employer was able to decide for the employee.

Spurs can suggest him not to play, perfect, but NOTHING ELSE...that's the point of that paragraph and the use of the slavery analogy....any interpretation beyond that is yours not mine.

BTW, what about the rest of the points I made? Did anyone find the contract clause manu broke? Do you still think he delivered less that what he's paid? Do Zach Randoplh provides more value compared with his earnings, because he won't play tournaments on vacations?


He was asked to not play, and he played.

But whatever, use the weak "hes on vacation" bullshit arguement.

[ArgSpursFan..]

I really want Manu out of SA,hopefully the cheap ass SA FO wont be willing to pay him what he wants and He can walk away to help another NBA franchise win a championship.
SA US fans don't deserve a guy like Ginobili,you guys deserve a team like the LA Clippers in your town,and there´s where you´re heading to,with the last 3 yrs FO desitions.
Good luck(I´ll need it)

[Cherry]

Some fans don't deserve a player like Ginobili.

San Antonio is a small market, Manu sign a contract knowing that SA is the best place to win a Championship (not the best market to make money), he's coming off the bench and help to win 3 rings in 7 years, all for the same price. All for the team.

But, if Money is all that matters:

-he should play for Panathinaikos instread Bologna

-he should play for Denver instread San Antonio

-he should play the Euroligue (Euros) instread the NBA (Dollars)

His work is the NBA but his spirit is the National Team ...Injuries can happen (you like it or not, playing or not, resting or not, in the NBA, the olymplics, etc)

Loyalty and money are not the same thing for Manu Ginobili. That's why San Antonio´s small market will never be THAT lucky again with a steal in the 57Th pick for less money. Never.

[anakha]

I really want Manu out of SA,hopefully the cheap ass SA FO wont be willing to pay him what he wants and He can walk away to help another NBA franchise win a championship.
SA US fans don't deserve a guy like Ginobili,you guys deserve a team like the LA Clippers in your town,and there´s where you´re heading to,with the last 3 yrs FO desitions.
Good luck(I´ll need it)

ArgSpursBan is back?

[Cherry]

ArgSpursBan is back?

I don't know if he's the same :lol

[DMX7]

I really want Manu out of SA,hopefully the cheap ass SA FO wont be willing to pay him what he wants and He can walk away to help another NBA franchise win a championship.
SA US fans don't deserve a guy like Ginobili,you guys deserve a team like the LA Clippers in your town,and there´s where you´re heading to,with the last 3 yrs FO desitions.
Good luck(I´ll need it)


You're an idiot. Stop making these B.S. assertions. You know how many NBA teams probably want Manu Ginobili with a chonric injury at 10+ million dollars a year? 0, including the Spurs. They didn't really want him playing in the olympics to begin with and now that he may need surgery it's even worse. Players sitting in street clothes behind the bench aren't worth a dime so get that B.S. out of your head. Spurs will have patience with Ginobili because of what he's done for the team (and rightfully so) but he's still a paid employee, so don't think he's immune to everything or that he's more important than Tim Duncan, because that's what it sounds like you're saying.

Talk about delusions grandeur... and stop making new account names.

[Dartherus]

You're an idiot. Stop making these B.S. assertions. You know how many NBA teams probably want Manu Ginobili with a chonric injury at 10+ million dollars a year? 0, including the Spurs. They didn't really want him playing in the olympics to begin with and now that he may need surgery it's even worse. Players sitting in street clothes behind the bench aren't worth a dime so get that B.S. out of your head. Spurs will have patience with Ginobili because of what he's done for the team (and rightfully so) but he's still a paid employee, so don't think he's immune to everything or that he's more important than Tim Duncan, because that's what it sounds like you're saying.

Talk about delusions grandeur... and stop making new account names.
I'll stand outside the name calling, but just remember:

Manu DIDN'T BREAK ANY CLAUSE of the contract he signed. He was free to do whatever he wants while ON VACATION.

NBA seasons of 82 games, plus playoff are more likely to produce injury than international tournaments, and examples are everywhere you see. As some other poster said somewhere, Grant Hill doesn´t play FIBA tournaments and he´s chronically injured.

Manu provided back to the Spurs, FAR ABOVE of what a player with his salary provides to their teams in NBA....in any way you want to see it, performance, clutch playing, attitude, latin market popularity, spectacular plays in a team labeled as 'boring'......

Why then fans are complaining? No legal issues, return of investment.....if you complain about Manu, what should fans say about contracts given to players like Marbury, Brian Grant, Rashard Lewis?

Again, he didn't disrispect the legal contract, he provided FAR more value than what is the NBA performance for that salary.....¿what is your problem with him then? care to ellaborate?

Will you be able to present RATIONAL ARGUMENTS instead of foolish name calling or other distractions?

[Admiral]

I would trade Manu for SJax in a second.

Exactly what I was thinking.

SJax > Manu. Always. :)

[ducks]

name one team the last decade that won a title that paid a big tax

[benefactor]

Judging by all the comments people have made these past few months about him, I would have to conclude that if you think Manu doesn't care about Spurs fans, then the feeling is mutual. So many people here view him as property and not a person. The general sentiment seems to be, "His body is used up, so he can take a long walk off a short pier."

I have no idea how any of it will work out, but one thing I'm positive about is that Manu shouldn't feel guilty about anything. He signed a 6 year, 55M contract, or something close to that, right? I think he's already given the Spurs 55M worth of NBA production, even with two years left. Only fools would argue otherwise.
Your reasoning is so incredibly flawed.

He chooses to use himself up by playing in the games on an ankle that was not healed...and by hurting it again without even really doing anything overly traumatic towards it I have to assume that he knew it wasn't 100% and played anyway. The general sentiment is that even if he was limping around it still wasn't going to stop him from playing. He let his passion override his reason and chose to risk his health...and you are saying Spurs fans have no right to be pissed about this? And I hate to break the news to you, but the reality of it is that being the best person in the world matters little if you can't step out on the court and produce. If he cannot someone should be brought in who can. You can have a coworker that has a great personality and will give you the shirt off their back if you ask him too...but if that person can't do the work, then they will get fired...and that company will find someone who can do the work to replace them.

And what is with this "he has already given them 55 million worth of production" crap? I think that is the stupidest shit I have ever heard. He is on the books for 2 more years and over 20 million dollars. He hasn't fulfilled anything, because he is still going to be eating up that much of our cap space over the next 2 years and he is probably going to be sitting on the bench for most of this year. You can't say that just because he arguably gives more effort than any other player, that he only needs to provide 4 years of his 6 year commitment and still get a 20+ million dollar payday. YOU would have to be a fool to argue otherwise.

[ducks]

ArgSpursFan.. are you related to ArgSpursFan. poster

[MaNuMaNiAc]

ArgSpursFan.. are you related to ArgSpursFan. poster

:lol

He's the one and only.

[diego]

He chooses to use himself up by playing in the games on an ankle that was not healed...

and its not the first time! he did the exact same thing only months ago during the entire playoffs, the selfish bastard.


and by hurting it again without even really doing anything overly traumatic towards it I have to assume that he knew it wasn't 100% and played anyway. The general sentiment is that even if he was limping around it still wasn't going to stop him from playing. He let his passion override his reason and chose to risk his health...and you are saying Spurs fans have no right to be pissed about this?

Exactly, who needs an MRI or a doctor to determine what his injury is. Its obvious that he was hurt before, during and after the olympics, and the fact that he played the entire playoffs and the olympics injured shows what a selfish, self-centered, spurs hating SOB he really is. if he really cared about the spurs fans, he would protect his health and retire already so no one here would have to worry about him.



And I hate to break the news to you, but the reality of it is that being the best person in the world matters little if you can't step out on the court and produce. If he cannot someone should be brought in who can. You can have a coworker that has a great personality and will give you the shirt off their back if you ask him too...but if that person can't do the work, then they will get fired...and that company will find someone who can do the work to replace them.

Exactly, like that Duncan guy, he's already had knee surgery and cost us a ship because of it, and if it werent for Nazr Mohammed and Rasho Nesterovic, his plantar fascitis would have cost us a ship in 05 as well. If he misses another 10 games this season with his knee problems, we'll need to replace his old ass. The same with Parker, he is only 26 and has already had several injury problems and missed games. The next spurs player to miss games because of injury should be fired immediately, and if they arent, spurs talk posters should create threads with lopsided trade ideas and aimless bitching to compensate for their continued employment.


And what is with this "he has already given them 55 million worth of production" crap? I think that is the stupidest shit I have ever heard. He is on the books for 2 more years and over 20 million dollars. He hasn't fulfilled anything, because he is still going to be eating up that much of our cap space over the next 2 years and he is probably going to be sitting on the bench for most of this year. You can't say that just because he arguably gives more effort than any other player, that he only needs to provide 4 years of his 6 year commitment and still get a 20+ million dollar payday. YOU would have to be a fool to argue otherwise.

Because everyone knows, the only team in the entire history of the NBA to have injury problems affect them and their cap situations is the san antonio spurs. its completely unfair how other teams never have to deal with this. While we're at it, we should fire pop, RC, and the entire coaching staff for not predicting when an injury will occur, and how much a player will produce. a minimum turnaround of 2ppg or 2reb per $1Million salary should be set. Its absolutely inexcusable that a small market team, over the cap, doesnt win the championship every year. Its not like there is any competition or luck involved.

[DarkMaverick]

I'll stand outside the name calling, but just remember:

Manu DIDN'T BREAK ANY CLAUSE of the contract he signed. He was free to do whatever he wants while ON VACATION.

NBA seasons of 82 games, plus playoff are more likely to produce injury than international tournaments, and examples are everywhere you see. As some other poster said somewhere, Grant Hill doesn´t play FIBA tournaments and he´s chronically injured.

Manu provided back to the Spurs, FAR ABOVE of what a player with his salary provides to their teams in NBA....in any way you want to see it, performance, clutch playing, attitude, latin market popularity, spectacular plays in a team labeled as 'boring'......

Why then fans are complaining? No legal issues, return of investment.....if you complain about Manu, what should fans say about contracts given to players like Marbury, Brian Grant, Rashard Lewis?

Again, he didn't disrispect the legal contract, he provided FAR more value than what is the NBA performance for that salary.....

Very well said.

[ArgSpursFan..]

Manu is the CHEAPEST superstar in the NBA,the guy is one of the top 15 players in the league,the second best SG just half a step behind Kobe,and He doesn´t refuse to be used as a bench player,+ He´s clutch,team player and a great Human being.
If you guys in SA think you´ll ever get some one even close to Manu Ginobili again in franshise History,you´re all fucking morons.
Please,let him go if He´s so much of a pain in the ass for playing with the Arg.NT. and bring onboard some one like Melo to SA. That´s exactly the tipe of person you all need down there.

[DarkMaverick]

Manu is the CHEAPEST superstar in the NBA,the guy is one of the top 15 players in the league,the second best SG just half a step behind Kobe,and He doesn´t refuse to be used as a bench player,+ He´s clutch,team player and a great Human being.

I agree and that is why I love Ginobili...



Please,let him go if He´s so much of a pain in the ass for playing with the Arg.NT. and bring onboard some one like Melo to SA. That´s exactly the tipe of person you all need down there.

I dont think it's our decision to make and certainly NOT yours so stop making foolish suggestions like getting Melo or some other shit. Stop bitchin!

[DespЏrado]

Manu is the CHEAPEST superstar** in the NBA,the guy is one of the top 15 players in the league,the second best SG just half a step behind Kobe,and He doesn´t refuse to be used as a bench player,+ He´s clutch,team player and a great Human being.
If you guys in SA think you´ll ever get some one even close to Manu Ginobili again in franshise History,you´re all fucking morons.
Please,let him go if He´s so much of a pain in the ass for playing with the Arg.NT. and bring onboard some one like Melo to SA. That´s exactly the tipe of person you all need down there.


**When healthy. Only applicable to the first 25 minutes of play. And does not apply to a team that has to rely on him to get a birth in the playoffs.

[Martin R]

San Antonio without Manu = No ring.

Manu in any other team = Playoff spot secured.

[ArgSpursFan..]

**When healthy. Only applicable to the first 25 minutes of play. And does not apply to a team that has to rely on him to get a birth in the playoffs.

I´ll tell you why Manu´s unkle got messed up last season,because He had to PLAY INJURIED for 3 weeks when TP was out and TD missed a couple of games. So if your gonna**manu´s health coze He got messed up playing hurt for SA,your just an ungreatfull SOEB.
Manu´s unkle didn´t get messed up first in Beijin,it was in the reg season.

[underdawg]

and its not the first time! he did the exact same thing only months ago during the entire playoffs, the selfish bastard.

I think most Spurs fans agree that we would have rather seen Manu sit out with his injury and get knocked out of the playoffs than him risk his career. It's easy to say that after the fact, but going in to the playoffs if I were given a choice of Manu missing the playoffs and us losing vs. him ruining his career and us winning the title I would always choose him to sit.

[diego]

thats not our decision to make.

manu chose to play...

...and pop chose to play him.

but of course, the idiot is manu, not pop. pop wanted him to rest... after playing 17 games injured.

but like ive said a billion times... until his career is ruined, this is all moot. no one here can say that, not even Dr. Tpark or Nostraduckus.

[Kori Ellis]

...

If you continue to post here and start new screen names, I will contact your internet provider and notify them of your abuse. This an official request for you to never post on SpursTalk again under any screenname or IP address. If you have any further comments, you can private message me. However, you aren't welcome here.

Thanks.

[underdawg]

thats not our decision to make.

manu chose to play...

...and pop chose to play him.

but of course, the idiot is manu, not pop. pop wanted him to rest... after playing 17 games injured.

but like ive said a billion times... until his career is ruined, this is all moot. no one here can say that, not even Dr. Tpark or Nostraduckus.

I agree it's a little too early to say his career is ruined, but it does bring an uncertainty to his health that will always stay with him. Something you do have to admit is that Pop didn't have the knowledge that the Argentine Team did in making the decision to play Manu. Ultimately that's where the blame lies - it's just like a boxer that wants to keep fighting. It's up to the corner to protect him from his own desire to win.

[Kori Ellis]

That would be a good thing to know,since I travell all the time and log on wireless with my laptop on every caferetia with wi-fi service available.
thanks back.

Cool, I'll get your name, address and phone number from your original ISP.

Good luck.

[anakha]

That would be a good thing to know,since I travell all the time and log on wireless with my laptop on every caferetia with wi-fi service available.
thanks back.

http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/23/f_BullshitDetm_3f8231b.gif (http://www.picoodle.com/view.php?img=/3/8/23/f_BullshitDetm_3f8231b.gif&srv=img33)

[ducks]

San Antonio without Manu = No ring.

Manu in any other team = Playoff spot secured.

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

just like aj would never win a title
spurs would never win a title with david robinson

[benefactor]

and its not the first time! he did the exact same thing only months ago during the entire playoffs, the selfish bastard.

No one knew of the seriousness of the injury until afterwards. It was downplayed buy Pop and by Manu. I was not a member here during the playoffs, but I said many times to many other Spurs fans that he should be benched during the playoffs if he can't go...and someone else who is healthy should take his minutes. As good a coach as Pop is, he was stupid for playing him as much as he did.


Exactly, who needs an MRI or a doctor to determine what his injury is. Its obvious that he was hurt before, during and after the olympics, and the fact that he played the entire playoffs and the olympics injured shows what a selfish, self-centered, spurs hating SOB he really is. if he really cared about the spurs fans, he would protect his health and retire already so no one here would have to worry about him.

Doctors in Argentina have already said that he re-injured the same ligament he had injured during the WCF...the same one that would not go down for three weeks after he quit playing. The fact that he played in the playoffs hurt and the Olympics hurt proves he is allowing his competitive juices override his ability to listen to his body. I would not want Manu playing in the playoffs or the Olympics if A. He could not contribute at a high level and B. If he was going to risk serious injury. Neither scenario benefits us or him in the long run.


Exactly, like that Duncan guy, he's already had knee surgery and cost us a ship because of it, and if it werent for Nazr Mohammed and Rasho Nesterovic, his plantar fascitis would have cost us a ship in 05 as well. If he misses another 10 games this season with his knee problems, we'll need to replace his old ass. The same with Parker, he is only 26 and has already had several injury problems and missed games. The next spurs player to miss games because of injury should be fired immediately, and if they arent, spurs talk posters should create threads with lopsided trade ideas and aimless bitching to compensate for their continued employment.

Now you are just being silly. None of these scenarios can be compared to Manu. He is a balls out player that has had a serious ankle injury since the Suns series. He has not had adequate rest to heal it...and that is both his(Olympics) and Pops(should have been on the bench during the Lakers series, whether we win or lose) fault. He could wind up with surgery that would put him out until possibly the all star break...and with that sort of recurring ankle injury there is a possibility that he could never come back the same. Would you like Grant Hill's phone number so I can have some one lace you up with some information on it?


Because everyone knows, the only team in the entire history of the NBA to have injury problems affect them and their cap situations is the san antonio spurs. its completely unfair how other teams never have to deal with this. While we're at it, we should fire pop, RC, and the entire coaching staff for not predicting when an injury will occur, and how much a player will produce. a minimum turnaround of 2ppg or 2reb per $1Million salary should be set. Its absolutely inexcusable that a small market team, over the cap, doesnt win the championship every year. Its not like there is any competition or luck involved.
What you said here is just wasted keystrokes...because it has absolutely nothing to do with what I said. The point I was getting at was that he should be ready to go right now. He has a 20+ million dollar commitment to fulfill to this team. If he is hurt he should not play...Spurs, Argentina, pickup game, whatever. Injuries happen to many key players on many franchises, but injuries that could be prevented or worsened because they were not allowed to heal properly should never happen...even it costs you a title, or a gold medal.

[Jobbs]

Hmmm I know this may sound left field but do you think Manu is faking the injury?

[DROB4EVER]

Hmmm I know this may sound left field but do you think Manu is faking the injury?

I dont think so - Gold to him is far more important than NBA title. He was warned that playing on it could cause further injury.

Needs to keep his ass in a lawn chair till Late october and hopefully he will be Ok by early season. If Mason plays well and we can get something out of Hill and Fin Udoka, I tell Manu to ride the pine till mid season.

If he comes back to early, we could have another playoffs of manu the gimp!

[carina_gino20]

Hmmm I know this may sound left field but do you think Manu is faking the injury?

No chance. Did you see him in the bronze medal game? The guy wanted so much to play. If he had faked it against US, he would've played against Lithuania and to hell with public opinion. But that's not Manu.

[diego]

the fact of the matter is that right now, duncan has had more serious injuries than manu has, and he is still playing. does manu rely on his athleticism more than duncan? yes, no question. but its not like manu is the first basketball player to twist his ankle and swell the ligaments. if he had to have knee surgery or bone problems it would be far more serious.


as for grant hill, you should check to see if you even have his phone number. Hill had a bone bruise then played on it a couple weeks later (with the approval of the Pistons' medical staff), which caused him to BREAK his ankle.

Bone. Break.

Not the same at all, is it?
I'm sure some of the resident Pistons fans can confirm this for you, since apparently all you know is that Hill aggravated some kind of ankle injury.

[Jobbs]

I only brought up that it might be fake because Manu knew they had no shot vs the US. So he got out the game pretty early. Kobe was guaring him so he would have to work extra hard on offense and really hurt himself more. Maybe he got paid under the table to fake it who knows.

I doubt all this happened but it crossed my mind a couple of times.

[carina_gino20]

I only brought up that it might be fake because Manu knew they had no shot vs the US. So he got out the game pretty early. Kobe was guaring him so he would have to work extra hard on offense and really hurt himself more. Maybe he got paid under the table to fake it who knows.

I doubt all this happened but it crossed my mind a couple of times.

Then you don't know Manu at all.

He's already going back to the US tomorrow to start rehabilitation instead of going back to Argentina. People are talking of the possibility of surgery.

[Manu-of-steel]

Thank you for stating the obvious Buck.



When did Argentina start paying him 10 million a year?

Oh yeah never. When playing for your country gets you multiple houses and nice cars and all that stuff, come back and talk to me.



Great, so now hes looking at surgery possibly?

Great job Ginobili.... The epitome of selfish.
The epitome of being an idiot. You are playing for a country even without monetary gain, and you will be labeled selfish?

[Spurtacus]

Manu looked pretty good there on the bench. I think he'll be fine. Hopefully no surgery.

[Manu-of-steel]

:lol

Omg so Manu would be a "slave" to the Spurs if they told him not to play in the exhibitions?

Now I've seen everything :lmao

STFU.

[Manu-of-steel]

You're an idiot. Stop making these B.S. assertions. You know how many NBA teams probably want Manu Ginobili with a chonric injury at 10+ million dollars a year? 0, including the Spurs. They didn't really want him playing in the olympics to begin with and now that he may need surgery it's even worse. Players sitting in street clothes behind the bench aren't worth a dime so get that B.S. out of your head. Spurs will have patience with Ginobili because of what he's done for the team (and rightfully so) but he's still a paid employee, so don't think he's immune to everything or that he's more important than Tim Duncan, because that's what it sounds like you're saying.

Talk about delusions grandeur... and stop making new account names.

You are the one who is delusional. If magete could grab that much money, if cuban could give diop that much money, manu could fetch much more than what the spurs could offer. But the thing is, manu agreed to play with the spurs, because he likes the fo here. It's not always about the money.

[spursfan09]

Watching the game last night I saw Manu jumping up and down. so hopefully that was a good sign. either that or he injured it even more. :) Anyways I think Manu was just as injured during the NBA playoffs, but he did not stop playing at all even though one could tell he was really hurting. At least in these olympics he did not play at all when he reinjured himself. So I don't question his loyalty as much.

[Manufan909]

Hopefully he rests for the firsst month of the season and then comes back even better than before, then idiots like t park and ducks will STFU.

Unless I missed the post that confirmed they were doctors/people who actually know what it feels like to choose between your country and your job while having a semi-healed ankle.

[casero]

The problem with you people is you think Manu is just working for the spurs.
That's so wrong. For Manu it's not a job, it's what he loves, it's his life.
In Argentina when you start to play a sport, you do it in a Club, you pay a membership fees every month to stay on the club.
Manu went to the olympics because he loves basketball, and he left everything to play, he did it for the Spurs, he did it for Argentina, and he will do it again for the spurs, because he loves the game, he loves to play.

There is no magic around Manu, why do you like him? Because you see him enjoying the game, because left all on the field, and you are not used to that.

For you it's all money, I'm here reading your posts "it will cost...", you don't understand how to love the game, you don't understand how manu loves the game.

You don't want him anymore, it's perfect, he will find another place to play.
Manu owe a lot to the spurs, and the spurs owe a lot to Manu, let me tell you, the Spurs wouldn't be as famous as they are now if Manu wouldn't played for them.

Enjoy Manu's game... don't think about money.

That's why you can't stand the Olympics... because you don't love the game as Manu does.

Regards.

[ducks]

Hopefully he rests for the firsst month of the season and then comes back even better than before, then idiots like t park and ducks will STFU.

Unless I missed the post that confirmed they were doctors/people who actually know what it feels like to choose between your country and your job while having a semi-healed ankle.

are you a doctor ?

[CaptainLate]

[QUOTE=Spurs Brazil;2728888]Ginobili goes down — how long until he goes?
Buck Harvey - BEIJING — The Spurs had no choice. They had to go along with Manu Ginobili.

They had to say, yes, we trust you. They had to accept that the same Ginobili they love in tense moments is the same Ginobili who will sacrifice everything to play with his Argentine buddies.
[snip]
Still, his style was always going to burn out early, and that's why this summer could be another sea change. Ginobili risked everything when he came to Beijing, and he lost.

He chose, and he was wrong. And now it is someone else's turn to choose. ]


I said last year that b/c of his playing style he'd start going downhill in his early thirties. And now we know he will be having surgery next week.

Prediction: Spurs traded the Iceman...they will not break the bank on a new (or extended) contract for Manu. If he goes elsewhere, then so be it. Spurs will retool around TnT (Tim 'n Tony) with or w/o Manu. Both Tony and Manu know that Tim, not Manu, is the man.

[Red Hawk #21]

I only brought up that it might be fake because Manu knew they had no shot vs the US. So he got out the game pretty early. Kobe was guaring him so he would have to work extra hard on offense and really hurt himself more. Maybe he got paid under the table to fake it who knows.

I doubt all this happened but it crossed my mind a couple of times.

I don't think Manu would ever do something like that, he is just too much of a competitor.