My whole life changed in a heartbeat today...

[2Blonde]

My best friend is visiting me from Alabama until Sunday so she helped me with a Teacher Appreciation Luncheon today at SVHS and then we headed out for a fun day shopping. We hit Rustic imports and Soma Intimates for some sexy bras and then on to Vickie's Secret for more sexy bras. We had our arms piled high and went to the front to ask for dressing rooms when my phone rang. It was a number I didn't know. I answered to find my beautiful daughter crying on the other end and saying "Mom, I just had a really back wreck."

She was driving west on Borgfeld Rd. and about 1 1/2 miles west of 281 she got distracted for a second and with the slick roads from the rain the two passenger-side tires of her car slid of the road into the gravel. She jerks back on to the road and between overcompensating and the wet roads her car slid across into the east bound lane. she was left front end facing south and got T-Boned by a poor lady and her 4 year old daughter. Both cars were totaled and she and the other passengers were all transported to the hospital.

I am thanking God tonight that everyone survived the accident. The little girl walked away without a scratch, the Mom had some pain from the front airbag but should be fine and my daughter has some neck problems ( some that were from an earlier injury and some from this one that are going to require a visit to a neurosurgeon ( with the possibility of surgery down the road) and extensive Physical rehabilitation for her neck. She had some bumps, bruises and abrasions and a bad case of total body whiplash but she and everyone else are all going to be fine.

It will be a while before we buy her a another car. First she has to pay a 1,000 deductible and then we are not going to get a new car for a while until we are sure she gets the gravity of the devastation she could have/did cause by looking away from the road for 1 second. She is going to hate going back to being shuttled around by me & my husband but at least she's alive to be shuttled around.

What are your thoughts? How do think you would feel if it were your child driving. I'm NOT looking for advice, my husband and I have that totally covered. I'm just curious what you might do if the person you were responsible/cared for created such a large scale potentially deadly situation for her/himself through what I consider negligence. Obviously our first thoughts were for her safety, making sure we got to her quickly (threw the bras at the Victoria's Secret girl and ran out of store), supporting her, getting the proper medical attention. and thanking GOD for not taking away my baby.

What would your's be???

[RashoFan]

Not answering your question there. I hope your duaghter will recovery very quickly. I almost made that call with the FD but I had to stay back at the FD. I hope "my boys" took very good care of your daughter and of course the other 2 person in the other vehicle...Let me know if you need anything.

[TDMVPDPOY]

so where do i sign up for this teacher/student relationship thingy? i make you famous

[Pistons < Spurs]

Glad to hear everyone seems to be OK. I lost a friend in a very similar type of accident years ago.

I'm sure she appreciates the gravity of it all. And it's honestly something that could happen to anyone. All it takes is that one second of distraction. But I couldn't even begin to imagine how it would feel to have a child in such a situation where their life was at risk, or to think they had put someone elses life at risk. I'm sure it'd be a bit of a wakeup call for me though. Just one of those reminders at how short our time together could be.

[Slydragon]

Depends on how she was distracted. If she was texting/dialing then i would be very piss and not get her a car for a good while.

Hope everything goes well for both families.

[Trainwreck2100]

nevermind

[marini martini]

2 Blonde~
I went through a similar situation, 7 years ago. Only I had the Sheriff 's office cal me at work. They said, "mrs. SRE$#" your daughter has been in a wreck, and is being air lifted to University Hospital. She miraculously recovered. But it has been a battle for me, to to not worry every time she leaves the house. Seven years, and 8 car wrecks later, I've finally accepted her fate is not in my control.
Good luck, it's not going to be easy for the next few years.

[Trainwreck2100]

2Blonde, you are correct, in not lending her phone! keEP the ring It's yours

Is that some weird woman code???

[sabar]

Buy her another car? I wish my parents would buy me one car. Heck, I'll take a bicycle.

Anyways if it was my kid I'd blast them into last week for not paying attention, especially with wet roads. One or two slight differences in speed or location could of easily made this a triple fatality or worse.

[mrsmaalox]

Thank God everyone is okay! I can't see where I'd feel much differently from you in this case. I'd also be sticking to my guns making sure my kid learned a good lesson. My son, age 14, had his first and last I hope, brush with the law a few months ago; he and his best friend snuck out after midnight to go out joyriding with another neighborhood genius and ran their truck into a ditch (also on Borgfield Rd!!) That dreaded 3 am phone call was so horrible my instinct was to hold him and cry and baby him; but because he was totally unscathed, and scared shitless, I just couldn't let the life lesson slip away. The other 2 kids were out the next day without consequences while my son endured 2 weeks of hard labor and loss of electronics for a month. I think he learned a good lesson and I am just thankful he was not hurt, so i could give it to him!! ;)

[mrsmaalox]

so where do i sign up for this teacher/student relationship thingy? i make you famous

Are you high?

[duncan228]

What a scary thing to go through 2Blonde. I'm glad everyone will be okay. A call like that from your child will stop your heart.

As for your question, I agree with Slydragon. My reaction would depend on how she got distracted. Was she doing something she shouldn't have been, like texting or talking on the phone? Or did she change the radio station? There's a range of acceptable and unacceptable behavior, I would try to match my reaction to the behavior.

I would think that the accident itself will serve as a big lesson on how deadly it can be to lose focus behind the wheel even for a second. It sounds like it was severe enough to keep her shaking for days while she absorbs what happened. It does give you a prime "teaching" moment, I'm sure you'll have her complete attention. She must be frightened from the accident.

[PM5K]

created such a large scale potentially deadly situation for her/himself through what I consider negligence.

I didn't see any negligence in the story you wrote, maybe you left it out, or maybe I define it differently.

Accidents happen, that's why they are called accidents.

[Cry Havoc]

My best friend is visiting me from Alabama until Sunday so she helped me with a Teacher Appreciation Luncheon today at SVHS and then we headed out for a fun day shopping. We hit Rustic imports and Soma Intimates for some sexy bras and then on to Vickie's Secret for more sexy bras. We had our arms piled high and went to the front to ask for dressing rooms when my phone rang. It was a number I didn't know. I answered to find my beautiful daughter crying on the other end and saying "Mom, I just had a really back wreck."

She was driving west on Borgfeld Rd. and about 1 1/2 miles west of 281 she got distracted for a second and with the slick roads from the rain the two passenger-side tires of her car slid of the road into the gravel. She jerks back on to the road and between overcompensating and the wet roads her car slid across into the east bound lane. she was left front end facing south and got T-Boned by a poor lady and her 4 year old daughter. Both cars were totaled and she and the other passengers were all transported to the hospital.

I am thanking God tonight that everyone survived the accident. The little girl walked away without a scratch, the Mom had some pain from the front airbag but should be fine and my daughter has some neck problems ( some that were from an earlier injury and some from this one that are going to require a visit to a neurosurgeon ( with the possibility of surgery down the road) and extensive Physical rehabilitation for her neck. She had some bumps, bruises and abrasions and a bad case of total body whiplash but she and everyone else are all going to be fine.

It will be a while before we buy her a another car. First she has to pay a 1,000 deductible and then we are not going to get a new car for a while until we are sure she gets the gravity of the devastation she could have/did cause by looking away from the road for 1 second. She is going to hate going back to being shuttled around by me & my husband but at least she's alive to be shuttled around.

What are your thoughts? How do think you would feel if it were your child driving. I'm NOT looking for advice, my husband and I have that totally covered. I'm just curious what you might do if the person you were responsible/cared for created such a large scale potentially deadly situation for her/himself through what I consider negligence. Obviously our first thoughts were for her safety, making sure we got to her quickly (threw the bras at the Victoria's Secret girl and ran out of store), supporting her, getting the proper medical attention. and thanking GOD for not taking away my baby.

What would your's be???

First of all, I'm happy to hear your daughter is okay.

Now, onto your question.

Yes, it does depend on her behavior that caused the wreck, but I must ask you all: Have you, always, 100% of the time, paid attention behind the wheel? I know I haven't. I consider myself a VERY good driver -- I haven't been in a single wreck since I was 17 (a tractor was taking up an entire road in the country on the bottom of a hill and it was all I could do to miss it), I don't talk on the phone (I have a bluetooth for emergencies), don't listen to my iPod, I always check my mirrors before I change lanes, always use my signals... you get the idea.

However, to say there has never been a moment when I was floating on the grace of God would be a gross overstatement. I even fell asleep behind the wheel once -- I woke up doing 25 miles per hour, 2 tires barely on the road, 2 nearly in the ditch... in the opposite lane. I am so thankful that it was 4:30 am and there were no cars around for miles (no, I hadn't been drinking, I went to a Christian rock all-night lock-in).

I am certain that no human being on this Earth stays focused 100% of the time while driving. To say that she should be punished for something that we ALL do is a bit of a reach, in my opinion.

That said, I think in no way should she have another car handed to her. However... she just went through a life or death experience. She's probably really shaken and needs you to be compassionate now and firm later.

I guess this really comes down to a test of parenting. If you've done your job, you shouldn't need to impress upon her how incredibly dangerous a car is (when I was learning to drive, my dad said I was steering a 3000 pound bullet... that helped things sink in a lot), she should know by now. If the accident near-death experience doesn't teach her to be careful when driving... nothing will.

You are blessed to have your daughter still walking this Earth. Never forget that. :)

[phyzik]

Just read the origional post... didnt read replies so excuse me if its been said...

I know you said you dont want advice... but why post about it if you didnt? you know someone is going to post their opinion.... so here it is...

First of all, Im glad everyone is OK...

Second of all, dont you DARE buy her another car.... make her pay for it herself. Im not trying to sound mean, thats what happened to me... Make her pay for her own car and she will be super carefull not to fuck it up.

If you buy her a car she knows thats not on her dime and if she fucks up again she knows its not going too hurt her to much.... Make her think about her actions.... start now and make her pay for her own stuff and suffer the consiquences if she fucks up.

Even if she pays for it, your still the parent as long as she is living with you... you have the power to say no when she wants to drive it. Dont forget that.

[JoeChalupa]

Sounds to me like it wass an accident and not so much negligence. The same thing happened to me on an icy road in a split second. I'm just glad everyone is okay.

[phyzik]

Just read the origional post... didnt read replies so excuse me if its been said...

I know you said you dont want advice... but why post about it if you didnt? you know someone is going to post their opinion.... so here it is...

First of all, Im glad everyone is OK...

Second of all, dont you DARE buy her another car.... make her pay for it herself. Im not trying to sound mean, thats what happened to me... Make her pay for her own car and she will be super carefull not to fuck it up.

If you buy her a car she knows thats not on her dime and if she fucks up again she knows its not going too hurt her to much.... Make her think about her actions.... start now and make her pay for her own stuff and suffer the consiquences if she fucks up.

Even if she pays for it, your still the parent as long as she is living with you... you have the power to say no when she wants to drive it. Dont forget that.

If you dont want advice and just want to know what I would do.... I'd ground the fuck out of her (and thats all Im willing to say I would do publicly) for wasting my money on a car and not buy her another one. she would have to buy her own. Regardless if its her fault or not. If insurance pays for it, fine. After that she gets her own insurance if she wants a vehicle to drive.

[PM5K]

I'm not going to say any names, but let's just hope some people here don't have kids...

[PM5K]

Just read the origional post... didnt read replies so excuse me if its been said...

I know you said you dont want advice... but why post about it if you didnt? you know someone is going to post their opinion.... so here it is...

First of all, Im glad everyone is OK...

Second of all, dont you DARE buy her another car.... make her pay for it herself. Im not trying to sound mean, thats what happened to me... Make her pay for her own car and she will be super carefull not to fuck it up.

If you buy her a car she knows thats not on her dime and if she fucks up again she knows its not going too hurt her to much.... Make her think about her actions.... start now and make her pay for her own stuff and suffer the consiquences if she fucks up.

Even if she pays for it, your still the parent as long as she is living with you... you have the power to say no when she wants to drive it. Dont forget that.

That's such a stupid fucking post.

[Kori Ellis]

2Blonde, thank God everyone is okay. I too am curious what distracted her. If it was something that was actually negligent on her part - that's one thing but sometimes accidents just happen.

Maybe it's none of our business (but what the hell, it's on the forum :lol) so I am just curious as to what the distraction was because you say that you felt it was negligence.

For example, I know someone who hit the car in front of them because she was looking at a guy on the corner - that's negligent :lol

But I also know someone who was driving and was distracted for split second by something a passenger in the car did. She slightly went into the next lane and, like your daughter, overcompensated to get back. Her car started spinning in the middle off the freeway - spun several times across multiple lanes ... somehow no one hit her and she hit no one on the freeway. However, she spun out into the easement on the side of the freeway where an oil tank truck was broken down and she smashed into the side of it. Forunately it didn't explode and everyone in the car just had minor injuries (broken bones and whiplash, etc.) To me that wasn't negligence ... just an accident.

[2Blonde]

so where do i sign up for this teacher/student relationship thingy? i make you famous

Are you high?

:lol

Glad to hear everyone seems to be OK. I lost a friend in a very similar type of accident years ago.

I'm sure she appreciates the gravity of it all. And it's honestly something that could happen to anyone. All it takes is that one second of distraction. But I couldn't even begin to imagine how it would feel to have a child in such a situation where their life was at risk, or to think they had put someone elses life at risk. I'm sure it'd be a bit of a wakeup call for me though. Just one of those reminders at how short our time together could be.


You're right, it was most certainly a reminder and I have been seeing her in a different light this evening. Just thinking about how much I love her.

Depends on how she was distracted. If she was texting/dialing then i would be very piss and not get her a car for a good while.

Hope everything goes well for both families.


I hope so to. As far as the distraction, she looked away for a second because she was messing with some thing in her car. NOT her cell. She isn't even allowed to use it while driving until October first. It was laying on a seat in her car and went projectile. They couldn't even find the battery or the back cover in what was left of her car.


2 Blonde~
I went through a similar situation, 7 years ago. Only I had the Sheriff 's office cal me at work. They said, "mrs. SRE$#" your daughter has bee in a wreck, and is being air lifted to University Hospital. I asked what her "condition" was. She said, "I'M sorry, Mam we can not divulge this information." I then asked again, in a quite louder tone. She then told me, that they're was no response! WTF does thar mean???
2Blonde, you are correct, in not lending her phone! keEP the ring It's yours

Is that some weird woman code???


WTF??? Someone's been having Happy Evening instead of Happy Hour.:lol


Buy her another car? I wish my parents would buy me one car. Heck, I'll take a bicycle.

Anyways if it was my kid I'd blast them into last week for not paying attention, especially with wet roads. One or two slight differences in speed or location could of easily made this a triple fatality or worse.

We made an agreement with her years ago that she had to meet certain conditions in order for us to buy her a car. She had to save $1,000 for repairs/deductibles, maintain her grades, show responsible behavior, take driver's ed and a defensive driving course. We also put a GPS Tracker in her car that tells us where she is at all times and how fast she was going..( She wasn't speeding and in fact, rarely does). But after this accident, we will have a alot of work to do on her showing us how responsible she can be. She's been told not to mess with radio stations while driving, or to reach for things, etc... She broke one our safety rules. She signed a contract when she got the car that spelled out everything. She knew the deal & the consequences.


What a scary thing to go through 2Blonde. I'm glad everyone will be okay. A call like that from your child will stop your heart.

As for your question, I agree with Slydragon. My reaction would depend on how she got distracted. Was she doing something she shouldn't have been, like texting or talking on the phone? Or did she change the radio station? There's a range of acceptable and unacceptable behavior, I would try to match my reaction to the behavior.

I would think that the accident itself will serve as a big lesson on how deadly it can be to lose focus behind the wheel even for a second. It sounds like it was severe enough to keep her shaking for days while she absorbs what happened. It does give you a prime "teaching" moment, I'm sure you'll have her complete attention. She must be frightened from the accident.


I agree with everything you said. I told her I wasn't mad, that my first concern was her health and that of anyone else involved. But I think she needs to understand consequences come from even"acceptable " distracting behaviors like looking at the radio station for a few seconds.

I didn't see any negligence in the story you wrote, maybe you left it out, or maybe I define it differently.

Accidents happen, that's why they are called accidents.

Taking her eyes off the road when she knew better. Especially when she was driving in the rain. She could have caused the death of a mother, a 4year old child & herself. IMO she didn't lose cotrol of the car because of the rain, she lost control of the car by being distracted and the rain made her recorrecting go awry and start sliding around on the road. The rain was definitely a contributing factor but not the main cause IMO. But I wasn't there to see it happen and the officer didn't issue any citations, so legally I supppose it is considered an accident. That still doesn't make her portion of responsibility just go away though.


First of all, I'm happy to hear your daughter is okay.

Now, onto your question.

Yes, it does depend on her behavior that caused the wreck, but I must ask you all: Have you, always, 100% of the time, paid attention behind the wheel? I know I haven't. I consider myself a VERY good driver -- I haven't been in a single wreck since I was 17 (a tractor was taking up an entire road in the country on the bottom of a hill and it was all I could do to miss it), I don't talk on the phone (I have a bluetooth for emergencies), don't listen to my iPod, I always check my mirrors before I change lanes, always use my signals... you get the idea.

However, to say there has never been a moment when I was floating on the grace of God would be a gross overstatement. I even fell asleep behind the wheel once -- I woke up doing 25 miles per hour, 2 tires barely on the road, 2 nearly in the ditch... in the opposite lane. I am so thankful that it was 4:30 am and there were no cars around for miles (no, I hadn't been drinking, I went to a Christian rock all-night lock-in).

I am certain that no human being on this Earth stays focused 100% of the time while driving. To say that she should be punished for something that we ALL do is a bit of a reach, in my opinion.

That said, I think in no way should she have another car handed to her. However... she just went through a life or death experience. She's probably really shaken and needs you to be compassionate now and firm later.

I guess this really comes down to a test of parenting. If you've done your job, you shouldn't need to impress upon her how incredibly dangerous a car is (when I was learning to drive, my dad said I was steering a 3000 pound bullet... that helped things sink in a lot), she should know by now. If the accident near-death experience doesn't teach her to be careful when driving... nothing will.

You are blessed to have your daughter still walking this Earth. Never forget that. :)


She won't be handed another car any more than she was handed the first one as I explained earlier. She'll be lucky to get another car in 6 months to a year.
I know how blessed I am to have her still with me. I'll take a mad sullen teenager with no driving priveleges who is alive to see tomorrow anyday of the week.

[Slomo]

2Blonde, I'm glad your daughter is OK and that nobody was seriously injured in the accident.

I pretty much agree with your stance and while I'm sure your first thoughts were for her, it speaks volume about your character that your second thoughts was about the others.

She made a mistake and she need to understand that. Of course you should also evaluate whether it was a stupid mistake (ie mobile phone) or a result of an inexperienced driver - and address the issue accordingly. How long has she been driving? I know that a substantial number of accidents in Europe are caused by drivers in the first year of getting a license and that everybody is thinking of solution to address this (I personally like the French solution).

Driving is a necessity in today's world and grounding her for life is not the solution. After a cool down period you must get her back behind the wheel. Whether or not you buy her a car or when that happens is entirely up to you. I'm not going to tell you how to manage your finances or how to raise your kids (specially since I pretty much agree with your methods). But whatever you do be sure she understand what she did wrong and you're reasonably confident she has learned her lesson.

Scaring her of driving is not the solution either - scared drivers are bad drivers and dangerous.

[Slydragon]

What was she messing with? You still have me wondering. Don't have to answer it tho.

[2Blonde]

I know you said you dont want advice... but why post about it if you didnt?

How about because I can't sleep, people on this board are friends of mine, I had a very stressful evening and wanted to vent a little to people who know me. Is that good enough for you?

Second of all, dont you DARE buy her another car.... make her pay for it herself. Im not trying to sound mean, thats what happened to me... Make her pay for her own car and she will be super carefull not to fuck it up.

Maybe you should read the other post! We didn't before and won't be again just handing her the keys. She met a pretty stringent set of financial, physical, mental & ethical goals before she ever got her first car. Now she'll pay a thousand dollar deductible out of her own money and many other requirements we will have for her. Now may I DARE decide when & if to buy her another car?


If you buy her a car she knows thats not on her dime and if she fucks up again she knows its not going too hurt her to much.... Make her think about her actions.... start now and make her pay for her own stuff and suffer the consiquences if she fucks up.

She has been paying for 50% of every big ticket item she wants since she was about 8 or 9 years old. She has always paid at least half for her guitars, ipods, cell phone etc.. and if she damaged then or lost them, she footed the entire bill to get a new one. That's why I said I wasn't looking for advice. I knew people like you would get on their soapbox about a subject they know nothing about.


Even if she pays for it, your still the parent as long as she is living with you... you have the power to say no when she wants to drive it. Dont forget that.

Thank you, I never thought of that!!:rolleyes

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

You may want to think about putting her through an advanced driver training course.

[2Blonde]

What was she messing with? You still have me wondering. Don't have to answer it tho.

I think you can figure it out from all of my posts.:p:

[2Blonde]

FYI to those one or two who are telling me to everything short of putting her on a chain-gang...
I asked what you would do if it was your child or someone you cared about. I did not ask for you to tell me what I need to do? I was simply curious how others might handle this situation.

Teenagers are very fond of saying "So and So's Mom lets him/her do it, why can't I?" I was just a little curious if I'm in line with what most parents would do in this situation.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

She was changing the radio station, huh? That is pretty unfortunate, but hard to call it negligence, and since the cops thought it was an accident, fair enough.

Still think advanced driver training is a good idea because it would teach her things like how to control a car if you stray onto the verge (hold your line and ease back very slowly in the direction you want to go, or take it all the way off the road and slowly ease to a stop).

Incidentally, the judgemental people who are lecturing 2Blonde should just back off - your hard-line tut-tutting is just absurd. Everything she's ever posted about her parenting shows that she's a great parent.

[2Blonde]

You may want to think about putting her through an advanced driver training course.


We made an agreement with her years ago that she had to meet certain conditions in order for us to buy her a car. She had to save $1,000 for repairs/deductibles, maintain her grades, show responsible behavior, take driver's ed and a defensive driving course. We also put a GPS Tracker in her car that tells us where she is at all times and how fast she was going..( She wasn't speeding and in fact, rarely does). But after this accident, we will have a alot of work to do on her showing us how responsible she can be. She's been told not to mess with radio stations while driving, or to reach for things, etc... She broke one our safety rules. She signed a contract when she got the car that spelled out everything. She knew the deal & the consequences.

That's a good idea except that we already did it!:lol I told her on the way home tonight that she will be doing a refresher course as soon as she is healed though.

[2Blonde]

Not answering your question there. I hope your duaghter will recovery very quickly. I almost made that call with the FD but I had to stay back at the FD. I hope "my boys" took very good care of your daughter and of course the other 2 person in the other vehicle...Let me know if you need anything.

I didn't know you worked for the Bulverde/Spring Branch Volunteer FD? I assumed you were City of SA. A Lt. Tim Zelenek (sp?) was there from the Bulverde FD & an EMT named Terri (?) and Mr. Ortega transported her in the ambulance.
They were all so wonderful and took good care of her.

[2Blonde]

One more thing... I would like nothing more than to hold her and say it'll be alright Baby and think this will scare her into being a more responsible driver, BUT it won't!
She's a teenager and she needs to know there are consequences and really, really, really get it through her beautiful head that she almost caused the deaths of 4 people today. Only by the Grace and Mercy of God did they all three walk away from this.

I'm glad I got to meet her at the hospital since I heard how badly her car was torn up. I might have lost it and started crying to see my baby and think of her in that car..

[anakha]

Got my first car in college - a secondhand Jeep Wrangler-type of vehicle.

My folks's philosophy in getting that type of car was twofold - the hard-as-nails suspension kept my driving speed down, as any sustained speeds of over 80 kph made for a pretty bumpy ride; and that a vehicle that tough would at least offer decent protection in case of an accident.

Just something you might want to keep in mind, should you ever decide to get her another vehicle. :p:

[remingtonbo2001]

2Blonde, I think you've handled this situation as well as any individual could handle it.

I remember when I was rear ended by an 18-wheeler, my parents didn't even come and see my in the emergency room. While they had recieved the call that I had in an accident and was okay (my vitalities checked out), it still would have been nice from the standpoint of support.

I know your rules may appear to be "strict", but they also appear to be in her best interest. I would sincerely try to make that clear to her.

Anyways, kudos on the parenting.

[J.T.]

If my mom GPS'd my car I would have ran away from home when I turned 16. Shit I would have kept riding my bike everywhere if the alternative was to have some prison bitch shit like a GPS my into your car.

Anyway, one night my dad was driving home, and my dad is the safest driver I have ever met, and he spun out and rolled over two times in his Cadillac... car was totaled, dad hurt his knee but not badly. He was really lucky but knowing him he was driving 15 under the limit and pulled some James Bond shit to avoid a more severe wreck.

I guess the moral of the story is that bad shit happens on the highway when the road is wet/slick.

Glad to hear she is safe though, car accidents are not fun. On the bright side maybe your insurance will pay you more than the car was worth since it got totaled. I totaled my piece of shit Malibu in my first wreck...the wreck was my fault...and the insurance paid us three grand more than we owed on the car.

[BacktoBasics]

I'm totally serious because I haven't figured out what the thing was she was playing with but when you said batteries flying I'm think it was some kind of rabbit or other stimulus device but then you said "she wasn't supposed to use it till so and so" so now I'm confused if you put an age limit on sex toys.

Furthermore I would never ever ever admit fault. She should have just said she slid in the rain and left it at that. You just opened the door for all kinds of additional heartache down the road with the insurance companies. Then you posted on a public forum. I'd ask Kori to remove this thread.

If it were my Son I'd buy back the salvage and have him rebuild the car. Then he might appreciate what it is to respect a vehicle.

[GEICO Caveman]

Taking her eyes off the road when she knew better. Especially when she was driving in the rain. She could have caused the death of a mother, a 4year old child & herself. IMO she didn't lose cotrol of the car because of the rain, she lost control of the car by being distracted and the rain made her recorrecting go awry and start sliding around on the road. The rain was definitely a contributing factor but not the main cause IMO. But I wasn't there to see it happen and the officer didn't issue any citations, so legally I supppose it is considered an accident. That still doesn't make her portion of responsibility just go away though.

I am glad your kid is safe but sad for her if she's been hearing this same shit from you ever since the wreck. Holding it against someone for multitasking while driving like it's some kind of fucking sin for her not to drive like Jesus, Mary and Joseph were in the car with her.

Negligence my ass. What happened to your daughter was just an unfortunate coincidence, don't go on a mother fucking witch hunt trying to condemn her for this. Sometimes accidents happen and no one's at fault. She loses points for telling the truth to you though. She could have just said she slid off the road and when she got back on she spun out. That would've saved you and the insurance company some hassle.

[BacktoBasics]

I am glad your kid is safe but sad for her if she's been hearing this same shit from you ever since the wreck. Holding it against someone for multitasking while driving like it's some kind of fucking sin for her not to drive like Jesus, Mary and Joseph were in the car with her.

Negligence my ass. What happened to your daughter was just an unfortunate coincidence, don't go on a mother fucking witch hunt trying to condemn her for this. Sometimes accidents happen and no one's at fault. She loses points for telling the truth to you though. She could have just said she slid off the road and when she got back on she spun out. That would've saved you and the insurance company some hassle.

So not paying attention when its raining and driving around like a lackaisical jackass is mearly a coincidnece? Multitasking while driving is pretty much the Cardinal sin behind the wheel.

Either you got me with a quality troll job or you're a complete fucking moron. Maybe both.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

No matter how hard you try, you can't stop bad things from happening to your children.

What are you going to do, pull the radio from her car? She did something we've all done countless times and came out unscathed.

It's all luck, IMO.

[Shelly]

Yikes, K! I'm glad everyone is safe and sound. How scary for you and your daughter.

I dread when my kids will start driving. My son is 15-1/2 and doesn't even have his permit yet. He hasn't even asked to get it.

The only thing I have to offer is to get her driving again asap ... only because I think if you don't, she's going to be really afraid to in the future. I think she just learned learned a very important life lesson that she won't soon forget.

FWIW, my neighbor's kid has had his license for a year. In that year, he's had two accidents and a ticket. The last accident was just a few weeks ago, where he hit a pole in a parking lot at a slow speed. The car didn't look bad, but the damage was bad enough that they totaled it. Anyway, she was in the market for a new car to begin with and gave him her truck. Was that the right decision? I don't know, but she works in the med center and he goes to Central Catholic, so it obviously was the best decision for them. (Meaning, that it would probably been a lot of driving for her to get him to school and to work, etc. as we live on the NW side of town)

So my point is, do what you think is best and if you feel she's ready for another car, don't feel guilty about getting her one.

Again, I'm glad everyone is okay!

[BacktoBasics]

I love how this generation of parents allows their kids to fuck up beyond all comprehension...we're talking about the kind of fucking up that could cost people their lives and the turn around and justify putting them back in the same dangerous position because its all "luck" or "chance" or just a "normal unfortunate event".

A person damn near killed some people. They shouldn't be behind the wheel any time soon if not until they're 21 and learn to act like a mature responsible person who can handle a 2000 pound death trap.

Justifying the return of a child to an automobile simply because they attend school miles away from where mom works is a complete abortion of common sense.

[Brutalis]

Glad she's alright. Hope she doesn't get sued though..

[Shelly]

Because all 21 year olds and beyond drive responsibly too?

[SpursWoman]

OMG, K ... I'm so glad everyone is going to be okay. I don't think my heart will ever be able to stand my kids driving, I don't know what I'm going to do when the time comes.

If it helps at all .... if my own experience is any indication, she's learned a very valuable, life-long lesson. I had an accident when I was in high school, it wasn't my fault, but it involved a turning lane ... and I still have an illogical fear of them and avoid them whenever I can. :oops

She won't forget. And yeah, I'd get her driving again ... I was pretty scared to drive for a long time after that.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I love how this generation of parents allows their kids to fuck up beyond all comprehension...we're talking about the kind of fucking up that could cost people their lives and the turn around and justify putting them back in the same dangerous position because its all "luck" or "chance" or just a "normal unfortunate event".

A person damn near killed some people. They shouldn't be behind the wheel any time soon if not until they're 21 and learn to act like a mature responsible person who can handle a 2000 pound death trap.

Justifying the return of a child to an automobile simply because they attend school miles away from where mom works is a complete abortion of common sense.

So, how much driving experience would she gain by not driving for 4-5 years?

[BacktoBasics]

Because all 21 year olds and beyond drive responsibly too?No I simply picked a number that allows for a very large buffer zone between now and then.

I truely don't think we should be handing out driving licenses to 16 year old kids. Maybe 18....maybe even 21 I don't know. I do know that getting training and a license once shouldn't allow you to spend your entire life never retraining again.

It should be a requirement that every 2-3 years upon renewal you take a 48 hour refresher course in offensive and defensive driving.

Driving offenses have to be the least punishable crimes this country has to offer. We take shitty driving way too lightly.

oh you almost killed someone...heres a ticket don't do that again. Oh it was an accident....well give me that ticket back and be more careful. Good luck and have a jolly day :rolleyes

[BacktoBasics]

So, how much driving experience would she gain by not driving for 4-5 years? Ok I see what your saying. I'll retract. She should not be behind the wheel without adult supervision on the clearest of nicest days and yeah she should have her phone and radio yanked from the vehicle until its determined after a year or more's time that she's matured beyond a reasonable doubt.

She probably shouldn't be driving until she's completed some additional written courses in driving safety.

[Shelly]

I would have no problem with the driving age starting at 18. I don't know if it still is, but when we lived in Luxembourg, you had to be 18 before you could drive.

But the point is, no matter what the age, we all get distracted. It could be changing the radio station (which we are all guilty of!), chatting with a passenger in the car, or a screaming baby in the backseat.

[BacktoBasics]

I would have no problem with the driving age starting at 18. I don't know if it still is, but when we lived in Luxembourg, you had to be 18 before you could drive.

But the point is, no matter what the age, we all get distracted. It could be changing the radio station (which we are all guilty of!), chatting with a passenger in the car, or a screaming baby in the backseat.I totally agree. I've been in accidents where I was distracted. We all take the responsibility of driving way too lightly.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Italy is 18 as well, but you can drive a Vespa or Oppi at 14.

[1369]

My best friend is visiting me from Alabama until Sunday so she helped me with a Teacher Appreciation Luncheon today at SVHS and then we headed out for a fun day shopping. We hit Rustic imports and Soma Intimates for some sexy bras and then on to Vickie's Secret for more sexy bras. We had our arms piled high and went to the front to ask for dressing rooms when my phone rang. It was a number I didn't know. I answered to find my beautiful daughter crying on the other end and saying "Mom, I just had a really back wreck."

She was driving west on Borgfeld Rd. and about 1 1/2 miles west of 281 she got distracted for a second and with the slick roads from the rain the two passenger-side tires of her car slid of the road into the gravel. She jerks back on to the road and between overcompensating and the wet roads her car slid across into the east bound lane. she was left front end facing south and got T-Boned by a poor lady and her 4 year old daughter. Both cars were totaled and she and the other passengers were all transported to the hospital.

I am thanking God tonight that everyone survived the accident. The little girl walked away without a scratch, the Mom had some pain from the front airbag but should be fine and my daughter has some neck problems ( some that were from an earlier injury and some from this one that are going to require a visit to a neurosurgeon ( with the possibility of surgery down the road) and extensive Physical rehabilitation for her neck. She had some bumps, bruises and abrasions and a bad case of total body whiplash but she and everyone else are all going to be fine.

It will be a while before we buy her a another car. First she has to pay a 1,000 deductible and then we are not going to get a new car for a while until we are sure she gets the gravity of the devastation she could have/did cause by looking away from the road for 1 second. She is going to hate going back to being shuttled around by me & my husband but at least she's alive to be shuttled around.

What are your thoughts? How do think you would feel if it were your child driving. I'm NOT looking for advice, my husband and I have that totally covered. I'm just curious what you might do if the person you were responsible/cared for created such a large scale potentially deadly situation for her/himself through what I consider negligence. Obviously our first thoughts were for her safety, making sure we got to her quickly (threw the bras at the Victoria's Secret girl and ran out of store), supporting her, getting the proper medical attention. and thanking GOD for not taking away my baby.

What would your's be???

Wow, that stretch around Borgfield is an accident magnet. Glad to hear everyone made it through relatively unscathed.

I have to say I like the idea of making your daughter responsible for the $1K deductible. I think that will drive the gravity of her responsibility home better than anything else.

Now, let's talk about the unmentionables you and your friend bought from Soma Intimates......

[Shelly]

I totally agree. I've been in accidents where I was distracted. We all take the responsibility of driving way too lightly.

True dat. And Word to your mother!

[mrsmaalox]

A person damn near killed some people. They shouldn't be behind the wheel any time soon if not until they're 21 and learn to act like a mature responsible person who can handle a 2000 pound death trap.

Justifying the return of a child to an automobile simply because they attend school miles away from where mom works is a complete abortion of common sense.

I also agree that 15-16 is probably too young to hand out driver's licenses generally, but there are also some kids that age that are mature/sharp enough to be trusted with it. 21 is a bit much but maybe just a year would make a difference in a lot of cases. But driving is important to teach your kid how to become a responsible, contributing member of the family unit. Driving is an inevitable part of life and is necessary for a young person to be able to pull their weight in the family. Just like when they are younger they have to be taught and expected to do household chores, the older the family gets their responsibilites include helping with errands and out of the house obligations. There is no doubt that many kids get cars and driver's licenses as an indulgence, but please keep in mind that it's not always just a matter of "convenience" to the mother!!

[Cry Havoc]

Ok I see what your saying. I'll retract. She should not be behind the wheel without adult supervision on the clearest of nicest days and yeah she should have her phone and radio yanked from the vehicle until its determined after a year or more's time that she's matured beyond a reasonable doubt.

She probably shouldn't be driving until she's completed some additional written courses in driving safety.

She crashed driving in the rain. So you want her only to have perfect day driving experience?

:rolleyes

Move on. You're out of your depth here. You can't MAKE someone be a good driver. They have to step it up themselves and have a commitment to being better. There's not a fucking thing you can do to make someone pay attention behind the wheel when you aren't there. They have to accept that responsibility on their own. Constant supervision won't change a thing because the minute you step out of the car, it's not the quantity of parenting that's been done, it's the quality.

And what is wrong with forgiveness? She didn't intentionally wreck the car. She did something that we've ALL done at some point behind the wheel. She needs to be more careful, and I think almost dying is a pretty good way to drive the point home. Again, it's about the amount of respect and responsibility 2Blond and her husband can instill in the child, not how much they can go 1984 on her ass and watch her every move. Overbearing, judgmental parents who punish harshly for everything end up with kids who have no idea how to fend for themselves in the real world.


I also agree that 15-16 is probably too young to hand out driver's licenses generally, but there are also some kids that age that are mature/sharp enough to be trusted with it. 21 is a bit much but maybe just a year would make a difference in a lot of cases. But driving is important to teach your kid how to become a responsible, contributing member of the family unit. Driving is an inevitable part of life and is necessary for a young person to be able to pull their weight in the family. Just like when they are younger they have to be taught and expected to do household chores, the older the family gets their responsibilites include helping with errands and out of the house obligations. There is no doubt that many kids get cars and driver's licenses as an indulgence, but please keep in mind that it's not always just a matter of "convenience" to the mother!!

It's NOT the age.

AT ALL.

It's the parenting.

It doesn't matter WHAT age you make driving legal, if the parenting isn't there, the kid is still going to be a dumbass doing 85 while texting in the snow. I see 40 year olds EVERY SINGLE DAY in Chicago that should never, ever be behind the wheel of a car.

[BacktoBasics]

She crashed driving in the rain. So you want her only to have perfect day driving experience?

:rolleyes

Move on. You're out of your depth here. You can't MAKE someone be a good driver. They have to step it up themselves and have a commitment to being better. There's not a fucking thing you can do to make someone pay attention behind the wheel when you aren't there. They have to accept that responsibility on their own. Constant supervision won't change a thing because the minute you step out of the car, it's not the quantity of parenting that's been done, it's the quality.

And what is wrong with forgiveness? She didn't intentionally wreck the car. She did something that we've ALL done at some point behind the wheel. She needs to be more careful, and I think almost dying is a pretty good way to drive the point home. Again, it's about the amount of respect and responsibility 2Blond and her husband can instill in the child, not how much they can go 1984 on her ass and watch her every move. Overbearing, judgmental parents who punish harshly for everything end up with kids who have no idea how to fend for themselves in the real world.



It's NOT the age.

AT ALL.

It's the parenting.

It doesn't matter WHAT age you make driving legal, if the parenting isn't there, the kid is still going to be a dumbass doing 85 while texting in the snow. I see 40 year olds EVERY SINGLE DAY in Chicago that should never, ever be behind the wheel of a car.I can agree with some of your arguement against me. There's some validity there but LMAO @ its not the age its the parenting. I'm pretty sure none of us here have grown up to realize that we should have payed more attention to certain things our parents have told us.

I can't imagine that anyone here did something against the advice of their parents at the age of 16 only to come to term with how stupid it was in their 20's or 30's.

Not everything boils down to shitty parenting. Sometimes people aren't mature enough to take direction.

lol you can't make some be a good driver. Are you fucking retarded. I spend hours with my son on his catching and throwing. I'm pretty sure I helped him become better at it. You can absolutely make someone a good driver.

I went to a racing school and I can tell you first hand it made me a better driver.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

I'm glad 2Daughter and the other family are relatively OK. It reads like the results are better than one would expect for a crash this measurable.

I'm not a parent and I'm not about to get into that debate with the usual suspects, but I will relate what I believe from my upbringing. My parents helped me with getting my first vehicle because they could, but they expected much of the same things you and 2Grey do of your daughter.

I will say this, though. Deep down, I've always been a little glad my parents worried too much about me than not enough.

I think it's a great idea that you had your daughter save for her own deductible and be money-conscious from an early age. I think she'll probably learn from this experience, too, and will likely benefit from the hardships she'll now be facing.

Best wishes.

[RashoFan]

Taking her eyes off the road when she knew better. Especially when she was driving in the rain. She could have caused the death of a mother, a 4year old child & herself. IMO she didn't lose cotrol of the car because of the rain, she lost control of the car by being distracted and the rain made her recorrecting go awry and start sliding around on the road. The rain was definitely a contributing factor but not the main cause IMO. But I wasn't there to see it happen and the officer didn't issue any citations, so legally I supppose it is considered an accident. That still doesn't make her portion of responsibility just go away though.


Hopefully your daughter learned a important lesson about responsibility.Her actions do affect her and can impact complete strangers.
To eveyone who knows that area where the wreck was, be alittle more careful, vigilant, etc. through those curves. That is a spot where my dept makes quite a few accidents. We have to be cautious when we drive a fire/rescue/ems apparatus through there because of the weight of our vehicles could have a back end sliding.

[RashoFan]

I didn't know you worked for the Bulverde/Spring Branch Volunteer FD? I assumed you were City of SA. A Lt. Tim Zelenek (sp?) was there from the Bulverde FD & an EMT named Terri (?) and Mr. Ortega transported her in the ambulance.
They were all so wonderful and took good care of her.

We are the Bexar-Bulverde VFD, If figured yor daughter was being cared for by Timmy(you spelled the name right.) If it is who I think Mr. Ortega is, his name is Sam, He works for AMR. I am glad to know that your daughter was in good hands ( I trust Timmy with my family care if it was ever needed and I know Sam Ortegea well, he would be allowed to transport my family!)
Just let me know how she is doing and MAY I tell the guys that she is okay as far as medically it goes( Momma okay...she is in guarded condition, but I won't pass that along:lol)

[Cant_Be_Faded]

The initial post started out ridiculously promising in the first few lines but then fell off. Glad she's okay, remind her driving is a privilege not a right.

[PM5K]

I hope so to. As far as the distraction, she looked away for a second because she was messing with some thing in her car. NOT her cell. She isn't even allowed to use it while driving until October first. It was laying on a seat in her car and went projectile. They couldn't even find the battery or the back cover in what was left of her car.

Man I suck at riddles....

[CosmicCowboy]

2blonde, it sounds like you have handled it well up to this point. I had a very similar situation with my step son at the same age except that it was a one car accident involving him and his girlfriend...he drifted over and bumped a curb going about 45, over-corrected just like your daughter did and rolled his bronco...I got the call, and like you, my first question was "are you OK" and I dropped everything (not anything as titillating as erotic undergarments) and got there...he and his girlfriend were shaken up and had some bumps and bruises and were sore for a few days but did not have to be transported.

There are so many similarities between our kids that you might like to know how we handled it and how it turned out...

Like your daughter, my son was a "good" kid, made good grades in school, was fairly responsible for a teenager and not into drugs/alcohol etc. He immediately took responsibility for his mistake, admitted to not paying attention, and did not try to blame the wreck on anyone else...

I told him he knew what he did wrong and hopefully had learned from it. He was concerned about paying for the bronco (it was totaled) and I told him thats why I had insurance. I never mentioned the wreck again. I paid the deductible and bought him another car when I found another used one I liked.

He was 17 at the time. He's 30 now and has never had another accident. After the scare he got (which fortunately turned out OK) he was probably the safest and most paranoid driver in his high school.

You obviously know your daughter better than I do, but in my case I thought my son had "learned his lesson" about just how fast bad things can happen if you don't pay attention driving that I decided to handle it with a very light touch and it seemed to work out OK.

[E20]

I was in a fender bender the other day as well. Nothing happend and the guy was nice enough to settle outside the insurance companies. I just have to pay a dent and some paint damage.

[tlongII]

How did your whole life change because of this?

[mrsmaalox]

It's NOT the age.

AT ALL.

It's the parenting.

It doesn't matter WHAT age you make driving legal, if the parenting isn't there, the kid is still going to be a dumbass doing 85 while texting in the snow. I see 40 year olds EVERY SINGLE DAY in Chicago that should never, ever be behind the wheel of a car.

You make some good points, but believing that age is no factor is a bit unrealistic. Any university level child development class will teach you that bio/psycho/social development occurs at different rates in different kids. Those only start to "even out" well after puberty. Is parenting an equalizing factor? Of course. Is it the only factor? NO WAY. Why do you think insurance companies rates are affected by age and experience? Not because of how the driver's were parented, but because of scientifically documented data.

But never should parents be let off the hook for improper guidance/expectations of their kids.

[PakiDan]

2Blonde... I am sorry to hear this... I am glad that things were not much worse.... my prayers to you and your family... and ummm... I miss the sig :(

[Cry Havoc]

You make some good points, but believing that age is no factor is a bit unrealistic. Any university level child development class will teach you that bio/psycho/social development occurs at different rates in different kids. Those only start to "even out" well after puberty. Is parenting an equalizing factor? Of course. Is it the only factor? NO WAY. Why do you think insurance companies rates are affected by age and experience? Not because of how the driver's were parented, but because of scientifically documented data.

But never should parents be let off the hook for improper guidance/expectations of their kids.

I agree, a lot of it is biological too, but if those changes all evened out so much, I don't know how to explain the 45 year old guy blowing past me driving a late model Mercedes, texting, talking on the phone, and eating while he's driving 75 down a 55 mph highway.

Yes, I realize that it's in-part the kid's responsibility to grow up, but that's on the adolescent. The only control the OP has over them is how to react to this situation and to go forward from here. And personally, I feel the harsher the punishment for this, the more support is needed to remind the girl that her parents still love her. When something like this happens, a child becomes defensive, scared, and unsure about their abilities. They need to be reminded what they're worth to the people around them, and that is FAR more essential than any "grounding" or "no car until you're 70!". Again, that's my opinion on the matter.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

IMO, get her back driving as soon as you can. It'll prob. take her a while before she feels completely comfortable, but might as well start the process sooner than later.

And I seriously doubt a harsh punishment or anything would do any good. I know two people who have been in accidents, and all it took was that big scare of almost killing themeselves or getting inured badly (or killing/injuring the other people involved) to make them be very meticulous drivers.

Just my .03 (inflation)

[Ronaldo McDonald]

BTW those people have never been in an accident since (and that was like 10 years ago or so for both of them).

[Slomo]

I would have no problem with the driving age starting at 18. I don't know if it still is, but when we lived in Luxembourg, you had to be 18 before you could drive.

But the point is, no matter what the age, we all get distracted. It could be changing the radio station (which we are all guilty of!), chatting with a passenger in the car, or a screaming baby in the backseat.

It's 18 pretty much across Europe. The problem is experience not age. The French use to have a rule that a new driver (regardless of age) had to have a "90" sticker on the car whenever driving for the first year. That sticker meant she/he was not allowed to drive faster than 90 kmh (55 Mph). If a driver with such sticker was spotted driving faster or was caught driving without the sticker the penalty was quite severe. I think it's a good idea because it tries to limit the danger while gaining experience. More ideas along those lines are needed.

[MannyIsGod]

It's NOT the age.

AT ALL.

It's the parenting.

It doesn't matter WHAT age you make driving legal, if the parenting isn't there, the kid is still going to be a dumbass doing 85 while texting in the snow. I see 40 year olds EVERY SINGLE DAY in Chicago that should never, ever be behind the wheel of a car.

This is crap. This is just utter crap. Everything ever studied about a teenage brain says you're absolutely wrong.

[BacktoBasics]

This is crap. This is just utter crap. Everything ever studied about a teenage brain says you're absolutely wrong.
I'm going to test this out on a 9 year old with very good parenting. I'll report back with my findings.

[MannyIsGod]

The initial post started out ridiculously promising in the first few lines but then fell off. Glad she's okay, remind her driving is a privilege not a right.

Were you hoping 2blonde has a lesbian experience too?

[ploto]

My child knows that when he first gets a car that it is only to drive to and from school. That is it. The highest speed limit is 45 MPH on that route. As he gets more experience, the scope will be expand.

[J.T.]

One more thing... I would like nothing more than to hold her and say it'll be alright Baby and think this will scare her into being a more responsible driver, BUT it won't!

Depends on how serious your daughter takes this whole thing, but you're not 100% right here. I got in an accident when I was 18 that was completely my fault because I failed to check my blind spot before changing lanes. Everything looked fine in the mirrors and I just fucked up.

To this day I compulsively check my blind spot even when I know there are no cars behind or around me. And that accident was four years ago. Taking eyes off the road to fuck with the radio will be a tougher habit to break but given how severe this wreck was it wouldn't surprise me if it shocks her into developing a compulsion about it.

And I haven't been in an accident since that one.

[1369]

Were you hoping 2blonde has a lesbian experience too?

Wait....what did I miss?

[Cry Havoc]

This is crap. This is just utter crap. Everything ever studied about a teenage brain says you're absolutely wrong.

Really? So you think that teens with completely negligent parents make the best drivers?

[Mark in Austin]

FYI to those one or two who are telling me to everything short of putting her on a chain-gang...
I asked what you would do if it was your child or someone you cared about. I did not ask for you to tell me what I need to do? I was simply curious how others might handle this situation.

Teenagers are very fond of saying "So and So's Mom lets him/her do it, why can't I?" I was just a little curious if I'm in line with what most parents would do in this situation.

I'm glad to read everybody is okay.

I would say I loved her, that I was very happy she was okay, that I wouldn't know what I would do if something had happened to her, and that tonight we get some rest. There'll be plenty of time to deal with everything else tomorrow.

What I would want to convey to her is that first and foremost, I care about her, not the car or her mistakes.

Then the next day have the talk about consequences, being careful, what could have happened to the other lady and her child, etc. I don't think you are being too harsh - especially if it was spelled out to her ahead of time what would happen... I would just give it a little time to breathe before jumping into punishment/consequences/etc.

[2Blonde]

If my mom GPS'd my car I would have ran away from home when I turned 16. Shit I would have kept riding my bike everywhere if the alternative was to have some prison bitch shit like a GPS my into your car.

Well this warden gave this child a 3,000 pound moving projectile and sent her out in the world. Myself & Mr. Prison Warden won't apologize for doing everything we need to do to insure our prisoner (oops, I mean daughter) is not speeding & goes where she is supposed to. God forbid she be in an accident where nobody is conscious in order to call the police and the GPS be able to locate her.
She is more than welcome to ride a bike if she wants. She knew the standard and chose to drive.


I'm totally serious because I haven't figured out what the thing was she was playing with but when you said batteries flying I'm think it was some kind of rabbit or other stimulus device but then you said "she wasn't supposed to use it till so and so" so now I'm confused if you put an age limit on sex toys.

Furthermore I would never ever ever admit fault. She should have just said she slid in the rain and left it at that. You just opened the door for all kinds of additional heartache down the road with the insurance companies. Then you posted on a public forum. I'd ask Kori to remove this thread.
.
:lol I didn't realize that "what" caused her distraction would be such a huge topic. Whether she got :Distracted" while changing a radio station,reading a bible or playing with a vibrator doesn't really matter. The end result is that she wasn't paying as much attention to driving as she was supposed to. If she had then she would never had veered off the road in the first place, then she wouldn't have faced the prospect of over-correcting and turning into the oncoming lane.
I also think she did the right thing by telling the truth. How do we expect to teach our children to be honest and yet tell them to hedge around something that might get their insurance rates increased. I have a problem with putting my financial happiness ahead of my child's moral upbringing.



I am glad your kid is safe but sad for her if she's been hearing this same shit from you ever since the wreck. Holding it against someone for multitasking while driving like it's some kind of fucking sin for her not to drive like Jesus, Mary and Joseph were in the car with her.

Negligence my ass. What happened to your daughter was just an unfortunate coincidence, don't go on a mother fucking witch hunt trying to condemn her for this. Sometimes accidents happen and no one's at fault. She loses points for telling the truth to you though. She could have just said she slid off the road and when she got back on she spun out. That would've saved you and the insurance company some hassle.

What makes you think she is hearing awful things from me over and over again. I love my daughter and my first priority is to her. You're acting like I plan to chain her to a chair with a big spotlight and a run a loop tape telling her what she did wrong. We talked about it briefly and then tabled any discussion until after she is feeling better and out of her neck brace.

There is no witch hunt unless you know something I don't. Yes, I agree that accidents happen and nobody is at fault sometimes and I also know that sometimes someone is at fault. Your Point???

Oh, she wins points in my book. She certainly showed more character than you by telling the truth.


So not paying attention when its raining and driving around like a lackaisical jackass is mearly a coincidence? Multitasking while driving is pretty much the Cardinal sin behind the wheel.

Either you got me with a quality troll job or you're a complete fucking moron. Maybe both.
BINGO!!!!

No matter how hard you try, you can't stop bad things from happening to your children.

What are you going to do, pull the radio from her car? She did something we've all done countless times and came out unscathed.

It's all luck, IMO.

So, because we've done it then it makes it OK for her to do it too? If we rob a bank is it OK for her to do that too?:lol



A person damn near killed some people. They shouldn't be behind the wheel any time soon if not until they're 21 and learn to act like a mature responsible person who can handle a 2000 pound death trap.

Justifying the return of a child to an automobile simply because they attend school miles away from where mom works is a complete abortion of common sense.
Man, you're on fire tonight!!:toast It's interesting because I actually feel as though I deserve some of the blame myself. I keep wondering if maybe we let her start driving a little too soon because it was easier on us.


Glad she's alright. Hope she doesn't get sued though..
If she does then we are insured and I will be proud of her for telling the truth. Whatever life is going to throw at us, it going to throw at us. I would rather her be able to hold her head high and know she did the right thing.


We take shitty driving way too lightly.

oh you almost killed someone...heres a ticket don't do that again. Oh it was an accident....well give me that ticket back and be more careful. Good luck and have a jolly day :rolleyes
Again, a great point!


Wow, that stretch around Borgfeld is an accident magnet. Glad to hear everyone made it through relatively unscathed.

I have to say I like the idea of making your daughter responsible for the $1K deductible. I think that will drive the gravity of her responsibility home better than anything else.

Now, let's talk about the unmentionables you and your friend bought from Soma Intimates......

Sorry, my lips are sealed.:nope I heard you've been spending too much time in your bunk lately.


There is no doubt that many kids get cars and driver's licenses as an indulgence, but please keep in mind that it's not always just a matter of "convenience" to the mother!!
Well, I'm admitting that sometimes it is a contributing factor. It's easy to get excited about the fact that you don't have to make those 9:30pm runs to Walgreen's to get poster board for the last minute project anymore. You justify it to yourself by saying that the child who waited until the last moment to mention they needed something for school the next day will now have to suffer the consequences of going out and getting it themselves while you finally get to stay home for the first time in 16 years. I've felt that way and now I feel guilty. She is not the only one who got a huge wakeup call on Friday.

[2Blonde]

Here's what I saw when I went to the impound lot to get her things out of her car today. This is what happens when a 16 yr old gets her license at 16 when she wasn't ready. Skill is only part of the equation, having the mental maturity to know not to look away to change a radio station while you're driving down a slick rain soaked road is obviously very important as well.

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/5134/ckpfusion8230800007qi5.jpg

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/8069/ckpfusion8230800006ft4.jpg

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/6797/ckpfusion8230800003wv3.jpg

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/4654/ckpfusion8230800002yo3.jpg

The last 2 pics show how thankful we are nobody was in the car with her. There were 4 inches left in the passengers seat. It actually folded over itself. The steel from the seat track were embedded in the gear shift and the passenger door was right next to the driver's console.

[2Blonde]

You can't MAKE someone be a good driver. They have to step it up themselves and have a commitment to being better. There's not a fucking thing you can do to make someone pay attention behind the wheel when you aren't there. They have to accept that responsibility on their own. Constant supervision won't change a thing because the minute you step out of the car, it's not the quantity of parenting that's been done, it's the quality.
Actually there is... you could not let them get their license and/or provide a car for them to drive until and unless they themselves make that committment you are spouting.


And what is wrong with forgiveness? She didn't intentionally wreck the car.
Not a thing. I forgave her as soon as the words I'm sorry for breaking the rules" came out of her mouth. The other driver and her daughter also forgave her.


I'm glad 2Daughter and the other family are relatively OK. It reads like the results are better than one would expect for a crash this measurable.

I'm not a parent and I'm not about to get into that debate with the usual suspects, but I will relate what I believe from my upbringing. My parents helped me with getting my first vehicle because they could, but they expected much of the same things you and 2Grey do of your daughter.

I will say this, though. Deep down, I've always been a little glad my parents worried too much about me than not enough.

I think it's a great idea that you had your daughter save for her own deductible and be money-conscious from an early age. I think she'll probably learn from this experience, too, and will likely benefit from the hardships she'll now be facing.

Best wishes.
Thank You..:spin


Hopefully your daughter learned a important lesson about responsibility.Her actions do affect her and can impact complete strangers.
To eveyone who knows that area where the wreck was, be alittle more careful, vigilant, etc. through those curves. That is a spot where my dept makes quite a few accidents. We have to be cautious when we drive a fire/rescue/ems apparatus through there because of the weight of our vehicles could have a back end sliding.
I thought that needed another viewing!! Thank you, Rasho.:toast


We are the Bexar-Bulverde VFD, If figured yor daughter was being cared for by Timmy(you spelled the name right.) If it is who I think Mr. Ortega is, his name is Sam, He works for AMR. I am glad to know that your daughter was in good hands ( I trust Timmy with my family care if it was ever needed and I know Sam Ortegea well, he would be allowed to transport my family!)
Just let me know how she is doing and MAY I tell the guys that she is okay as far as medically it goes( Momma okay...she is in guarded condition, but I won't pass that along:lol) You are more than welcome to pass along our thanks. I cannot begin to express how thankful I am to "Timmy" for everything he did. He took car of my precious baby and kep me updated since I was stucki n rainy rush hour traffic.


Man I suck at riddles....
Too bad.:rollin


2Blonde... I am sorry to hear this... I am glad that things were not much worse.... my prayers to you and your family... and ummm... I miss the sig :( My sig is still on. Is it not showing up?


Were you hoping 2blonde has a lesbian experience too?

Well, actually there was this one time...:lmao

[tonylongoriafan]

accidents happen, you can't control things that are out of your hands. i once totaled 3 vehicles in 4 months (only one of them I was determined to be at fault) and i consider myself a good driver and fairly responsible adult (27 years old). i think all you can do is explain to your child the gravity of the situation and make her be responsible for herself. Make her pay the deductible and if she wants a new vehicle, make her pay for it. If her insurance goes up, thats part of the consequences of her actions.

The bottomline line is that ultimately this issue is out of your hands. You have to trust that your daughter understands for her self the gravity of the issue and just pray it never happens again...

[2Blonde]

accidents happen, you can't control things that are out of your hands. i once totaled 3 vehicles in 4 months (only one of them I was determined to be at fault) and i consider myself a good driver and fairly responsible adult (27 years old). i think all you can do is explain to your child the gravity of the situation and make her be responsible for herself. Make her pay the deductible and if she wants a new vehicle, make her pay for it. If her insurance goes up, thats part of the consequences of her actions.

The bottomline line is that ultimately this issue is out of your hands. You have to trust that your daughter understands for her self the gravity of the issue and just pray it never happens again...

I agree with most of what you said except the last paragraph. At 16, it is totally in my hands. Yes I do have to trust in her understanding at some point and pray it doesn't happen again, but it doesn't mean I stick my head in the sand and leave it up to fate. She's an amazing kid, but she's still a kid and kids need guidance.

[2Blonde]

Thank you to everyone who has expressed their concern about my daughter and the occupants of the other car. It means so much to us. You guys are amazing and have given me lots to think about and consider. Beginning Monday we get down to the business of doctors visits and rehab appointments, oh and school too!:wow

[tonylongoriafan]

I agree with most of what you said except the last paragraph. At 16, it is totally in my hands. Yes I do have to trust in her understanding at some point and pray it doesn't happen again, but it doesn't mean I stick my head in the sand and leave it up to fate. She's an amazing kid, but she's still a kid and kids need guidance.


it is your hands for now. okay, so if you want to ban her from driving, she'll have no choice but to live with it...until she's 18, then what. you ulimately know your child better than anyone and if you think your form of discipline is best, i am in no position to dispute that. all i'm saying is try not to over-react. all the happenings we experience mold us into who we are. if it were me, i would "ease" her back into driving as soon as she's up to it. without knowing you personally, i would give you the benefit of the doubt by saying you've raised and are raising a good kid. this accident, albeit devasting, is just an accident. the only thing that matters is that your child is okay and that you and her are able to take this experience and learn from it.

[MannyIsGod]

Really? So you think that teens with completely negligent parents make the best drivers?

No. What you miss is that regardless of parenting, a teenager will have a higher predisposition to unsafe driving.

[J.T.]

Well this warden gave this child a 3,000 pound moving projectile and sent her out in the world. Myself & Mr. Prison Warden won't apologize for doing everything we need to do to insure our prisoner (oops, I mean daughter) is not speeding & goes where she is supposed to. God forbid she be in an accident where nobody is conscious in order to call the police and the GPS be able to locate her.
She is more than welcome to ride a bike if she wants. She knew the standard and chose to drive.

Just out of curiosity if you catch her speeding on GPS, do you issue her a citation?

[ShoogarBear]

The initial post started out ridiculously promising in the first few lines but then fell off.

I am a bad person. I was thinking the same thing. :depressed


Glad to hear it was mostly a learning experience for everyone, and not much worse.

[mrsmaalox]

It's NOT the age.

AT ALL.

It's the parenting.

It doesn't matter WHAT age you make driving legal, if the parenting isn't there, the kid is still going to be a dumbass doing 85 while texting in the snow. I see 40 year olds EVERY SINGLE DAY in Chicago that should never, ever be behind the wheel of a car.


Really? So you think that teens with completely negligent parents make the best drivers?

It's really hard to understand what you're not getting here. Not one single person here has disagreed that good parenting is VERY important!! What is being taken to task though is your assertions that driving skills are ONLY parenting related, and that basic, normal human physiological/psychological development are NOT factors.
Your argument is basically no different than saying that a 98 yr old behind the wheel has skewed reflexes because of poor parenting!

[Cry Havoc]

It's really hard to understand what you're not getting here. Not one single person here has disagreed that good parenting is VERY important!! What is being taken to task though is your assertions that driving skills are ONLY parenting related, and that basic, normal human physiological/psychological development are NOT factors.
Your argument is basically no different than saying that a 98 yr old behind the wheel has skewed reflexes because of poor parenting!

We're talking about teenagers here. I would assume that teenagers have moderately good reflexes.

Okay, let me phrase it another way. My mom and stepdad taught me "how" to drive. How to shift, when to turn, how to look both ways, what to do when my car starts hydroplaning, driving in snow, how to go from point A to point B.

My dad taught me how to actually drive. Ways to look for accidents that are about to happen, ways to notice when a car isn't behaving like it should (i.e., the person isn't paying attention behind the wheel), ways to constantly evaluate your situation to leave yourself an out in case the situation gets bad around you and you need to find an escape route. It is amazing the number of accidents I've seen almost happen to us, but through my dad's quick reflexes, we averted a collision.

My point isn't that "it's all about the parenting", although that's what I said. But the part of driving that's up to the teenager is not directly within our ability to control. It's a responsibility they have to accept and grow up with.

What I'm arguing against is people who are arguing for an extended period of no car, no driving are not only taking away the opportunities to teach, but removing her chances to have experience behind the wheel. If she had been driving for 5 more years and that happens when she's 21, I bet she doesn't over-correct on the road and probably doesn't wreck. So obviously, experience plays a huge role here.


No. What you miss is that regardless of parenting, a teenager will have a higher predisposition to unsafe driving.

I completely agree with this, and I never said otherwise. But there are some teens that go through life without even a single serious accident.

[PM5K]

Just out of curiosity if you catch her speeding on GPS, do you issue her a citation?

No, she gets the motherfucking beat down...

[2Blonde]

Just out of curiosity if you catch her speeding on GPS, do you issue her a citation?


No, she gets the motherfucking beat down...

:lmao :lmao :lmao

[ShoogarBear]

Actually, I'm surprised no one has used GPS technology to come up with a "child-driver monitor", to follow things like speeding.

[2Blonde]

The initial post started out ridiculously promising in the first few lines but then fell off. Glad she's okay, remind her driving is a privilege not a right.

I am a bad person. I was thinking the same thing. :depressed
Well we went back the next day & I ended up with 6 new bras just in time for the Spurs season to start. Feel better now.:lol


Just out of curiosity if you catch her speeding on GPS, do you issue her a citation?
No, I've actually only gotten one alert that said she was going more than 2 MPH over speed limit. In any case I just ask her why and tell her to slow it down.


Actually, I'm surprised no one has used GPS technology to come up with a "child-driver monitor", to follow things like speeding.
That's exactly what hers does. It's not the kind that give you a map to find an adress. You can enter perimeters and times if you have a child who has a habit of leaving the school between certain hours. I have never done that. I simply entered the information saying I wanted to know how fast she was going and that I only want an alert emialed to me if she is going more than 2 mies over the speed limit. It's called a GPS Trackit through the Safe Teen Driving Club.

[ShoogarBear]

Well we went back the next day & I ended up with 6 new bras just in time for the Spurs season to start. Feel better now.:lol

TTIWWP

[2Blonde]

A lot of people here seem to be under the impression that we are going to ground her and never let her drive again. My comments about shuttling her around for the time being are because we are down to 2 cars & she happens to be in a hard collar neckbrace and on painkillers , neither of which are condusive to getting her back on the road. We don't intend to keep her off the road, just ease her back in to it when she is healed. We'll talk more about when we will get her a another car after we know if she has to have neck surgery and/or starts physica therapy.

[marini martini]

Any chance you will be meeting Rasho & the rest of us for lunch on Weds.???? Hope so!!!:toast

[2Blonde]

Well we went back the next day & I ended up with 6 new bras just in time for the Spurs season to start. Feel better now.:lol


TTIWWP

Bravatars baby, bravatars. Just pray the Spurs make it to the playoffs.
:cheer

[2Blonde]

Any chance you will be meeting Rasho & the rest of us for lunch on Weds.???? Hope so!!!:toast


Sending you a PM

[tlongII]

Is the car totalled? Looks like it might be from the pics.

[mrsmaalox]

I heard about this one (or something like it) on NPR recently. Unfortunately it may be a bit too humiliating for the kid. But the GPS thing sounds great, and I will be in the market for one in a about a year.

http://www.kiddrivers.com/program_details.html

[2Blonde]

Is the car totalled? Looks like it might be from the pics.
Yes, when I went to clean out her car I saw the devastation. I couldn't even get everything out because of the damamge. The passenger's seat was practically crushed and the passenger's door was where the seat shoudl have been. THe frame looks like a pretsel

[2Blonde]

I heard about this one (or something like it) on NPR recently. Unfortunately it may be a bit too humiliating for the kid. But the GPS thing sounds great, and I will be in the market for one in a about a year.

http://www.kiddrivers.com/program_details.html


Yeah, that one does look pretty humiliating. Plus I'd be afraid other kids would call in just to prank someone they don't like.

The one we went with was http://www.safeteendrivingclub.org/index.php

I will probably install it on my car until we get her another car. I personally like the idea of someone being able to locate me if something were to happen or to find my car if it gets stolen.

[J.T.]

Hey, driving on painkillers is a fun an interesting experience. Not as fun as driving on LSD though, but still pretty fun. Let her try it out. Just have them install a kill switch in the GPS. Better safe than sorry.

[Capt Bringdown]

Glad to hear nobody got seriously injured.

I think a tough love approach would be best. No car until you can afford to buy one yourself. That sounds hard, but this is the way of the world. Mistakes and accidents even when backed by good intentions still have consequences.

Good luck.

[travis2]

2Blonde, I'm happy everything is (relatively) fine with your daughter. I can't imagine what you were feeling because I can't imagine what I'd be feeling...we each have our own nightmare scenarios as parents.

My youngest just got her license...just before she turned 18. My oldest didn't get hers until after she was 17. Looking back, I don't think either one of them would have been ready at 16. It's not the maturity level (although they still have moments to increase the number of gray hairs on my head)...it's getting through the belief that "this can't happen to me". Now some will call that maturity, but it's not...it's experience. I have very good girls and I'm proud as hell of them...but nevertheless my oldest had 2 front-end collisions her first year of driving and I already need to check the alignment on my wife's car because my youngest evidently hit a curb too hard in a parking lot in wet weather.

So you won't be getting any unneeded advice from me...because I have my own troubles ! :lol

That car pic brought back some memories. My one "big one" happened at 16 too...I was turning off of a side street onto a 5-lane main street...truck was turning off the main road onto mine so I pulled out...only to find a Blazer paralleling the truck at 35-40 mph. (I was in a Datsun 510) No chance to even react...all I saw was grill. The drivers side of my car looked a lot like the passenger side of your daughter's car...not quite pushed in as far. Being tall helped...the seat was run all the way back so the mid-frame door post hit the seat back, absorbing some of the shock. I had momentary respiratory shock (my lungs wouldn't take a breath for about 30 seconds), an 8-inch vertical bruise on my left side and a bruise on my left thigh from hitting the steering wheel.

Good thing I was wearing a seat belt. And obviously your daughter was also.

The "compulsion" others have talked about is real. In my case, it's making sure I can see around vehicles. Oh, and wearing my seat belt religiously.

[PakiDan]

Sending you a PM

OOOHH OOOHH!! CAN I COME!?

[desflood]

2B, so glad to hear your baby's all in one piece. How horrifying!

[bdictjames]

You are very blessed.

[angel_luv]

I just read all this thread.

2Blonde, I am so glad your daughter is okay.

I was in a scary accident about a year ago.
It was not my fault. I was hit when someone ran a light instead of properly yielding and my car had to be totaled.

I was incredibly frightened after the collision and it meant the world to me that my mom came out right away to help me.

From that experience, I can encourage you that along with having an increased respect for driving, your daughter will always remember and appreciate how you were there for her.
I think you did a wonderful job.

I echo everyone who said that your daughter would benefit from not waiting too long to get behind the wheel again.
It took me several days before I was brave enough to let my mom get me a rental car. Even then she had to coach me through my first time driving it.
But I am so grateful that she did.
I wouldn't have recovered nearly so quickly without mom's assistance.


Blessings on you and your family. I pray your daughter is completely recovered quickly.
Please keep us posted on her wellbeing.

[Dex]

I'm probably just going to end up echoing a bunch of sentiments that have already been laid out, but here's my two cents.

First, thank god everyone was okay and walked away from the accident alive. I know that everyone immediately says "well it's good everyone is okay" after an accident story, but there's a reason for that. Regardless of the property damaged, insurance, repercussions...it really IS the most important thing.

As for the debate at hand, I would have to agree that you should not intentionally keep her from being behind a wheel any longer than her lack of a car and dealing with this situation naturally would.

I had a very similar situation when I first started driving, turning left out of a neighborhood on a blind curve. It was one of those situations where no fault was really determined because of the circumstance, but in retrospect...more experience on my part definitely could've averted that accident. If I had checked left and right twice, as I do now and have ever SINCE that accident, instead of once...it probably would've been avoided.

The point of the story is, I totaled the new Grand Prix my parents had bought me, and we were lucky to walk away with no injuries. They made me pay the deductible and the cost of the rise in my insurance. I was without a car for about a month while we sorted out the insurance stuff, found a new car for me, and got everything squared away.

Between the trauma of the accident, the month without my car, and the loss of my Grand Prix (which was a car I had found and absolutely loved), I had learned my lesson to pay more attention and be more responsible on the road. I don't think any grounding or punishment from my parents would've driven that point home any better. As long as your daughter grasps the fact that these sort of mistakes already come with a HUGE set of consequences, I'm not sure she needs you adding any more to the list.

Of course, every case is a little different. That was my one bad accident when I was young, and knock on wood, I've been driving for six years since without another. I'd love to hope that every person could be as lucky (or even luckier...), but it really depends on the person, their level of maturity, and a decent amount of good fortune. But like others have said...it definitely did add some new compulsions. I, too, never go anywhere without my safety belt on now, and I look left AND right about three times now before I cross lanes to turn left.

I guess the important thing is just to be supportive of her (which is sounds like you are doing a great job of), make sure she understands how easily these things can happen and how serious they can be, and don't inflate the situation to make it harder on her than it already is. If she's in a neck brace, has lost her car, risked innocent lives, and has obviously disappointed her parents (which, when I had my first wreck, was almost the worst part of it)...chances are she feels pretty bad about the situation and doesn't ever want to put herself back in it.

Sure, her age could've definitely played a part in it, but this sort of thing could happen to any responsible adult as well, even you and I. Considering that, I think you should work with your child so she knows how to handle it like an adult, even if she is still your little baby.

[MannyIsGod]

We're talking about teenagers here. I would assume that teenagers have moderately good reflexes.

Okay, let me phrase it another way. My mom and stepdad taught me "how" to drive. How to shift, when to turn, how to look both ways, what to do when my car starts hydroplaning, driving in snow, how to go from point A to point B.

My dad taught me how to actually drive. Ways to look for accidents that are about to happen, ways to notice when a car isn't behaving like it should (i.e., the person isn't paying attention behind the wheel), ways to constantly evaluate your situation to leave yourself an out in case the situation gets bad around you and you need to find an escape route. It is amazing the number of accidents I've seen almost happen to us, but through my dad's quick reflexes, we averted a collision.

My point isn't that "it's all about the parenting", although that's what I said. But the part of driving that's up to the teenager is not directly within our ability to control. It's a responsibility they have to accept and grow up with.

What I'm arguing against is people who are arguing for an extended period of no car, no driving are not only taking away the opportunities to teach, but removing her chances to have experience behind the wheel. If she had been driving for 5 more years and that happens when she's 21, I bet she doesn't over-correct on the road and probably doesn't wreck. So obviously, experience plays a huge role here.



I completely agree with this, and I never said otherwise. But there are some teens that go through life without even a single serious accident.

What you miss is that taking away her car on its own can teach a lesson. Every time she's inconvenienced by not having said vehicle, it hammers home the point that paying attention while driving is incredibly important and it reminds her of the consequences of what happens when she doesn't.

Whether she gets experience now or in six months she will still get experience at the same rate. That is not something you cannot accelerate although you somehow seem to think that it can. A person who has spent 200 hours driving has 200 hours of experience whether they got that before the age of 18 or not. The difference is, that an older person with 200 hours of experience is more often than not (by a long margin) going to be a better driver than a 20 year old with 200 hours of experience.

Yes, lots of teenagers go without ever experiencing a major wreck. That by no means that lots of teenagers go without doing something incredibly stupid while driving. If we got into a wreck every time we drove poorly then no virtually no one that drove at 16 would remain alive. Parents can teach a lot of things but they can't change the predispositions most teenagers have to bad driving due to the state of their brain at that age.

The bottom line is that no amount of teaching will really make teenage driving very safe. If it were up to me, there's no way I'd let people under the age of 18 drive.

[Cry Havoc]

What you miss is that taking away her car on its own can teach a lesson. Every time she's inconvenienced by not having said vehicle, it hammers home the point that paying attention while driving is incredibly important and it reminds her of the consequences of what happens when she doesn't.

Whether she gets experience now or in six months she will still get experience at the same rate. That is not something you cannot accelerate although you somehow seem to think that it can. A person who has spent 200 hours driving has 200 hours of experience whether they got that before the age of 18 or not. The difference is, that an older person with 200 hours of experience is more often than not (by a long margin) going to be a better driver than a 20 year old with 200 hours of experience.

Yes, lots of teenagers go without ever experiencing a major wreck. That by no means that lots of teenagers go without doing something incredibly stupid while driving. If we got into a wreck every time we drove poorly then no virtually no one that drove at 16 would remain alive. Parents can teach a lot of things but they can't change the predispositions most teenagers have to bad driving due to the state of their brain at that age.

The bottom line is that no amount of teaching will really make teenage driving very safe. If it were up to me, there's no way I'd let people under the age of 18 drive.

I agree with most of this. However, an 18 year old who has been driving for 2 years will likely be better off than an 18 year old with very limited experience.

Personally, I would like to see much more of an emphasis placed on getting a driver's license. In Europe, a license costs upwards of 2 to 3 thousand euros. Lose it? You gotta pay that again. Drink and drive? HA! You're done. Just done. Get used to public transit.

I don't think the age is the problem in this country nearly as much as poor instruction and few consequences (which I think you mentioned earlier in this thread).

My point is, I'm not sure there is a consequence that can go beyond "watching your life almost end". I'm pretty sure that makes everything else pale in comparison.

[MannyIsGod]

I agree with most of this. However, an 18 year old who has been driving for 2 years will likely be better off than an 18 year old with very limited experience.

Personally, I would like to see much more of an emphasis placed on getting a driver's license. In Europe, a license costs upwards of 2 to 3 thousand euros. Lose it? You gotta pay that again. Drink and drive? HA! You're done. Just done. Get used to public transit.

I don't think the age is the problem in this country nearly as much as poor instruction and few consequences (which I think you mentioned earlier in this thread).

My point is, I'm not sure there is a consequence that can go beyond "watching your life almost end". I'm pretty sure that makes everything else pale in comparison.

For most people. Teenagers pretty much think they are immortal, so it doesn't tend to phaze them nearly as much. I know I did some fuuuuuuuuuuucked up shit in cars when I was 18-22 or so. I've driven 120 for a couple of hours straight on a drive to College Station, I made baaaaaaaaaaaaad passes that were basically games of chicken, and generally fucked around far too much.

Now I drive like a grandmother. What a difference 7-8 years makes.

[marini martini]

Now I drive like a grandmother. What a difference 7-8 years makes.

I hear ya!:toast

:lmao:lmao:lmao

[Cry Havoc]

For most people. Teenagers pretty much think they are immortal, so it doesn't tend to phaze them nearly as much. I know I did some fuuuuuuuuuuucked up shit in cars when I was 18-22 or so. I've driven 120 for a couple of hours straight on a drive to College Station, I made baaaaaaaaaaaaad passes that were basically games of chicken, and generally fucked around far too much.

Now I drive like a grandmother. What a difference 7-8 years makes.

I've pretty much been the same behind the wheel in terms of aggressiveness and speeding since I turned 19. I'm definitely a far better driver now, but I never really drove crazy. I'm usually less than 10 miles per hour over the speedlimit, max, and in town I always stay under the limit. I've been over 100 exactly twice (Both were very rural, deserted roads, and I have to do that in a Mustang GT at least once or twice) while behind the wheel. But I realize that I am the exception and most definitely not the rule.

[Negrito8]

children should not operate heavy machinery.

buy her a horse.

[Bigzax]

glad your daughter is okay blondie...