Spot Number 20 - Top 50 Spurs

[timvp]

SpursTalk's Top 50 Spurs
1. Tim Duncan
2. David Robinson
3. George Gervin
4. Gregg Popovich
5. Angelo Drossos
6. Manu Ginobili
7. Tony Parker
8. Sean Elliott
9. James Silas
10. Bruce Bowen
11. Larry Kenon
12. Avery Johnson
13. Alvin Robertson
14. Johnny Moore
15. RC Buford
16. Artis Gilmore
17. Peter Holt
18. Mike Mitchell
19. Bob Bass

------------------------------

To pass the time until the start of preseason, let's see how SpursTalk.com ranks the Top 50 Spurs. Those eligible for the list include all players, coaches and owners. I don't want to define "top" too narrowly, but I think the best way to do it would be to think of the list as a list of the 50 most influential people who have helped make the Spurs one of the most successful franchises in the history of sport.

For more information on what we are doing, check out this thread (http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103061).

In this thread, we will vote for spot number 20. Please place your vote. If you will, also explain in this thread why you voted how you did.

Thanks.



P.S.

Poll options listed in alphabetical order. If you want to vote for someone not on the list, post in the thread and I'll add the person.

Voting will end 2AM CST Friday morning.

Please vote only once.

[timvp]

Here are my top ten contenders for this spot ... in no particular order:

Doug Moe
Second to Pop in all-time coaching wins for the Spurs with 177. Had a winning percentage of 56.7%. Coached the Spurs in their first season in the NBA. George Gervin won three of his four scoring titles under Moe. The Spurs never averaged less than 114.5 points with Moe as coach and his exciting style of coaching helped keep fan interest in those early days. Was the coach during the '79 playoffs when the Spurs were up 3-1 in the ECF and were only one win away from an NBA Finals meeting against the Seattle Supersonics . . .

Malik Rose
Played 509 regular season games with the Spurs over a span of eight seasons. His career averages with the Spurs are 7.5 points and 4.8 rebounds in 18.4 minutes per game. Rose along with David Robinson and Tim Duncan are the only players who were in the regular rotation during both of the first two championships. Averaged 9.3 points and 5.8 rebounds during the 2003 championship run. In an era where the Spurs struggled mightily in finding a capable backup bigman, Rose was an important ingredient to the first two championship teams.

Robert Horry
Played a total of 332 regular season games with the Spurs. His career averages with the Spurs were 4.7 points, 3.4 rebounds and 16.8 minutes per game. Played on the 2005 and 2007 championship teams. His legendary heroics played a large part in the 2005 championship. Averaged 9.3 points, 5.4 rebounds and 26.9 minutes during the 2005 playoffs. Although didn't start many games, he did close a large percentage of games during his five seasons in San Antonio.

Terry Cummings
Averaged 14.4 points, 6.9 rebounds and 26.7 minutes per game during his six years with the Spurs. In his first three seasons in San Antonio, averaged 19.3 points, 8.4 rebounds and 32.9 minutes. In the summer after his third season, he tore his ACL and that injury limited his ability for the rest of his career. Played in 361 regular season games in his Spurs career.

Billy Paultz
Played four and a half seasons in San Antonio from 1975 to 1980. In 371 career regular season games, Paultz averaged 14.2 points, 8.5 rebounds and 30.9 minutes per game. Made the 1975-76 ABA All-Star team as a member of the Spurs. Has the most career rebounds and blocks with the Spurs of anyone not on the current list.

Mark Olberding
Olberding's 536 regular season games played with the Spurs ranks him 10th on the all-time franchise list. During those games, averaged 10.5 points, 5.6 rebounds and 25.8 minutes per game. He played seven complete seasons with the Spurs -- from 1975 to 1982.

Mario Elie
Elie only two season with the Spurs. The 1999 championship season is the season he is most remembered for. He is credited with firing up his teammates and helping the Spurs in the mental toughness and clutchness department. Hit a number of big shots during the regular season and playoffs during 1999. He didn't do much of anything in the 1999-2000 season but his lone good season was a vital one in Spurs history.

Red McCombs
Was part of the needed financial muscle to bring the Spurs from Dallas to San Antonio. Remained with the Spurs for many of the early years. Left for a while to own the Nuggets but eventually returned. Bought the Spurs in 1988 and was the owner until selling to a local ownership group in 1993. His interest in the Spurs throughout the years has helped the Spurs survive in San Antonio because his wealth allowed him to survive in a small market. Didn't sell out to out of town ownership groups even though he could have banked more money.

Robert McDermott
Was the primary owner of the Spurs from 1993 to 1997 when he sold to Peter Holt. While he wasn't in charge for a long period of time, he made one hugely important move -- he hired Gregg Popovich. Seeing as Pop at the time was a lowly assistant coach on a losing Golden State Warriors team, the move was seen as a risk at the time. Not only did he hire Pop, he gave Pop full authority over the basketball operations. He only told Pop to do one thing and that was to bring back Sean Elliott. McDermott too could have sold for more money to outside investors but kept the team in town by selling to Holt. Some give McDermott credit for changing the culture of how the Spurs are run.

Stan Albeck
Coached the Spurs for three years -- from 1980 to 1983. Posted a 153-93 record during the regular season. His winning percentage as head coach is fourth best in franchise history. Made the Western Conference Finals in two out of his three years as coach. Both losses in the WCF were against the Lakers. The year before Albeck was coach, the Spurs were 41-41. The year after he left, the Spurs were 37-45.

[polandprzem]

red

[Kamnik]

Robert Horry!

Unforgetable what he did in 2005. Without him we wouldnt have that championship.

[Sense]

Red McCombs
Was part of the needed financial muscle to bring the Spurs from Dallas to San Antonio. Remained with the Spurs for many of the early years. Left for a while to own the Nuggets but eventually returned. Bought the Spurs in 1998 and was the owner until selling to a local ownership group in 1993. His interest in the Spurs throughout the years has helped the Spurs survive in San Antonio because his wealth allowed him to survive in a small market. Didn't sell out to out of town ownership groups even though he could have banked more money.


I keep reading that last sentence over and over... I don't know much about the guy, but are you sure it makes sense? :P Isn't it 1988?

[Obstructed_View]

Gotta go with Red here. I was tempted to vote for Mike Mitchell again, though. :)

[timvp]

I keep reading that last sentence over and over... I don't know much about the guy, but are you sure it makes sense? :P Isn't it 1988?

Good catch.

[Obstructed_View]

I keep reading that last sentence over and over... I don't know much about the guy, but are you sure it makes sense? :P Isn't it 1988?

No, that's correct. Keep reading it and you'll figure it out.

[Sense]

No, that's correct. Keep reading it and you'll figure it out.

It's 6:30 am and I haven't slept.. cut me some slack

[manufor3]

malik

[Obstructed_View]

It's 6:30 am and I haven't slept.. cut me some slack

:lol

[ShoogarBear]

Stan Albeck
Coached the Spurs for three years -- from 1980 to 1983. Posted a 246-153 record during the regular season.

Hokey smokes, he averaged 82 wins a year?


Actually, he was 153-93 with the Spurs.

[ShoogarBear]

I'd have to say it's between Moe, Malik, and McCombs.

Moe will actually end up being better known for being the Nuggets coach.

I'll probably end up voting for Malik for being the first true great bench player in Spurs history, but could see McCombs here as well.

[Kona]

Red.

[baseline bum]

No fucking way McCombs deserves any spot on the list, and here's why:

1) Too cheap to pay Strickland, so we ended up having Vinny Del Negro brought in as our PG savior while Strickland became one of the league's top players in Portland and Washington.

2) Too cheap to take on Barkley's contract in 92. Charles wins the MVP and gets to the Finals the next season.

3) Tried to get Bob Bass to trade David Robinson to New York for Ewing in a cost-cutting move. Not only does Ewing suck, but there's no way he'd have stayed in San Antonio once his contract was up.

Fuck BJ. He was the cheapest owner this team has ever had. I know Drossos used to get a lot of grief for being cheap, yet the Spurs always managed to have good talent like Silas, Kenon, Gilmore, Mitchell, and Moore surrounding Ice.

[Dex]

This is a tough one. I'm gonna have to stew on it for a while. Right now I'd have to say its down to Rose, Red, and Elie.

[rascal]

Doug Moe



He should have been higher than Bass.


No, Mike Mitchell. I thought he was picked already.

Just checked, Mitchell is on the list at 18. Then he is also on the poll list. Change my pick to Moe.

[xtremesteven33]

Malik all the way

[kobyz]

Malik have to be in the top 20

[ambchang]

Cummings, though didn't play long for the Spurs, helped the organization move from bottom-dweller to a contender. His contributions in giving inside scoring help and divert defensive attention from David Robinson helped quite a bit.
I was torn between him and Red.

[timvp]

I'm starting to kinda like the idea of Malik here. His time with the Spurs ended ugly but from 1999 to 2003, he was a huge part of the team. In that time frame, I'd say he established himself as the best bench player in team history. And Rose was very much needed because capable backup bigman might have been the weakest position of all since David Robinson came to town.

People remember his hustle and energy first and foremost but he actually had some huge games along the way. Game 2 against the Lakers in 1999, he had 13 points, five rebounds and guarded Shaq very well the game that ended up being the closest in the series. Game 5 against the Suns in 2003 with the series tied 2-2, Rose had 27 points and 13 rebounds off the bench when everyone else was struggling and it looked like the Suns could actually win that series. Game 2 against the Mavs in 2003 with the Spurs down 0-1 in a must win game, Rose came up with 25 points and six rebounds. Then who can forget the dunk on Mutombo during the Nets series which woke up a team that looked like it was about to choke in the Finals.

His time on the team didn't have a storybook ending but his importance in those first two championship teams can't be understated.

[Spurs Brazil]

I'll go with Malik.

He was the "Manu" for us off the bench during 99-03.

He played fantastic in 03 run. Against the Mavs he was a monter.

[Spooky]

Terry Cummings, he was a bad ass back in the day.

[rAm]

I'm starting to kinda like the idea of Malik here. His time with the Spurs ended ugly but from 1999 to 2003, he was a huge part of the team. In that time frame, I'd say he established himself as the best bench player in team history. And Rose was very much needed because capable backup bigman might have been the weakest position of all since David Robinson came to town.

People remember his hustle and energy first and foremost but he actually had some huge games along the way. Game 2 against the Lakers in 1999, he had 13 points, five rebounds and guarded Shaq very well the game that ended up being the closest in the series. Game 5 against the Suns in 2003 with the series tied 2-2, Rose had 27 points and 13 rebounds off the bench when everyone else was struggling and it looked like the Suns could actually win that series. Game 2 against the Mavs in 2003 with the Spurs down 0-1 in a must win game, Rose came up with 25 points and six rebounds. Then who can forget the dunk on Mutombo during the Nets series which woke up a team that looked like it was about to choke in the Finals.

His time on the team didn't have a storybook ending but his importance in those first two championship teams can't be understated.

Plus he was a fan favorite.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I went with TC. He was great before his injury. Horry was probably my second choice.

[rascal]

I'll go with Malik.

He was the "Manu" for us off the bench during 99-03.

He played fantastic in 03 run. Against the Mavs he was a monter.

Malik sucked. A role player before Doug Moe???

[rascal]

timvp I did not select Mohammed as it is saying. Change mine to Doug Moe
Thanks

[FromWayDowntown]

TC is tempting here, because along with Mo Cheeks, he was a huge part of shortening the learning curve for the baby Spurs in 89-90 and his playoffs that year were absolutely great -- 25.9 ppg, 8.7 rpg, 52% FG in that 7 gamer against Portland in 1990. He might have been even better in the Spurs futile effort in 1992 to beat Phoenix without Robinson. During those years, when he was at his best, Cummings was a beast and was huge to the Spurs' successes. Had that time extended for another year or two, Cummings would have been much closer to the top of this list.

Malik never had the kind of true impact on his teams that TC did, but Malik's best years extended for a longer period of time, the teams were ultimately more successful during that era, and Malik was a very big part of those successes. For that reason, I went with Malik over TC, though I'd be comfortable with those guys in either order.

I also considered Moe here, but in my mind putting Moe here means putting Albeck very close by and I'm not ready to put Albeck on the list quite yet. It's pretty difficult for me to distinguish Moe's accomplishments from Stan's -- both won a lot of games and had some good playoff runs, but were in SA for relatively short stints. I think Moe's impact on the franchise was to make the NBA game a must-see event for San Antonio with the frenetic pace those teams played; Albeck was able to build on that and was probably more successful in real terms, but his impact has to be considered in light of the fact that he ran off to New Jersey after the team's closest approach to the Finals in 1983. You could say that Albeck's departure revealed his successes, but his decision to leave really adversely affected the Spurs. I think there's a run of players next before either Moe or Albeck comes up.

[Barbarian]

malik. because he's the only person to ever cry having to leave S.A. for New York. or any other city for that matter. And he did it publicly......





















J/k
One of the first greatest Spurs bench players ever IMO. Instant energy off the bench on a championship team. Brings memories of the monster jab foot he had. Comical at times.

[Spurtacus]

Coming back to Horry on this.

[Kevin Blackistone]

Malik Rose before Doug Moe? Malik Rose? Seriously? A bit player?


Let's just vote Bill Bates as one of the top Cowboy greats of all time too.

This list is retarded.

[MannyIsGod]

Here are my top ten contenders for this spot ... in no particular order:

Doug Moe
Second to Pop in all-time coaching wins for the Spurs with 177. Had a winning percentage of 56.7%. Coached the Spurs in their first season in the NBA. George Gervin won three of his four scoring titles under Moe. The Spurs never averaged less than 114.5 points with Moe as coach and his exciting style of coaching helped keep fan interest in those early days. Was the coach during the '79 playoffs when the Spurs were up 3-1 in the ECF and were only one win away from an NBA Finals meeting against the Seattle Supersonics . . .

Malik Rose
Played 509 regular season games with the Spurs over a span of eight seasons. His career averages with the Spurs are 7.5 points and 4.8 rebounds in 18.4 minutes per game. Rose along with David Robinson and Tim Duncan are the only players who were in the regular rotation during both of the first two championships. Averaged 9.3 points and 5.8 rebounds during the 2003 championship run. In an era where the Spurs struggled mightily in finding a capable backup bigman, Rose was an important ingredient to the first two championship teams.

Robert Horry
Played a total of 332 regular season games with the Spurs. His career averages with the Spurs were 4.7 points, 3.4 rebounds and 16.8 minutes per game. Played on the 2005 and 2007 championship teams. His legendary heroics played a large part in the 2005 championship. Averaged 9.3 points, 5.4 rebounds and 26.9 minutes during the 2005 playoffs. Although didn't start many games, he did close a large percentage of games during his five seasons in San Antonio.

Terry Cummings
Averaged 14.4 points, 6.9 rebounds and 26.7 minutes per game during his six years with the Spurs. In his first three seasons in San Antonio, averaged 19.3 points, 8.4 rebounds and 32.9 minutes. In the summer after his third season, he tore his ACL and that injury limited his ability for the rest of his career. Played in 361 regular season games in his Spurs career.

Billy Paultz
Played four and a half seasons in San Antonio from 1975 to 1980. In 371 career regular season games, Paultz averaged 14.2 points, 8.5 rebounds and 30.9 minutes per game. Made the 1975-76 ABA All-Star team as a member of the Spurs. Has the most career rebounds and blocks with the Spurs of anyone not on the current list.

Mark Olberding
Olberding's 536 regular season games played with the Spurs ranks him 10th on the all-time franchise list. During those games, averaged 10.5 points, 5.6 rebounds and 25.8 minutes per game. He played seven complete seasons with the Spurs -- from 1975 to 1982.

Mario Elie
Elie only two season with the Spurs. The 1999 championship season is the season he is most remembered for. He is credited with firing up his teammates and helping the Spurs in the mental toughness and clutchness department. Hit a number of big shots during the regular season and playoffs during 1999. He didn't do much of anything in the 1999-2000 season but his lone good season was a vital one in Spurs history.

Red McCombs
Was part of the needed financial muscle to bring the Spurs from Dallas to San Antonio. Remained with the Spurs for many of the early years. Left for a while to own the Nuggets but eventually returned. Bought the Spurs in 1988 and was the owner until selling to a local ownership group in 1993. His interest in the Spurs throughout the years has helped the Spurs survive in San Antonio because his wealth allowed him to survive in a small market. Didn't sell out to out of town ownership groups even though he could have banked more money.

Robert McDermott
Was the primary owner of the Spurs from 1993 to 1997 when he sold to Peter Holt. While he wasn't in charge for a long period of time, he made one hugely important move -- he hired Gregg Popovich. Seeing as Pop at the time was a lowly assistant coach on a losing Golden State Warriors team, the move was seen as a risk at the time. Not only did he hire Pop, he gave Pop full authority over the basketball operations. He only told Pop to do one thing and that was to bring back Sean Elliott. McDermott too could have sold for more money to outside investors but kept the team in town by selling to Holt. Some give McDermott credit for changing the culture of how the Spurs are run.

Stan Albeck
Coached the Spurs for three years -- from 1980 to 1983. Posted a 153-93 record during the regular season. His winning percentage as head coach is fourth best in franchise history. Made the Western Conference Finals in two out of his three years as coach. Both losses in the WCF were against the Lakers. The year before Albeck was coach, the Spurs were 41-41. The year after he left, the Spurs were 37-45.

Brent Barry is noticeably absent from this list. If Malik is on there, Barry deserves to be on there.

[lurker23]

Malik is one of my most favorite Spurs of all-time (he might even top that list if I were forced to choose). Number 20 seems like a good spot for him.

On a side note, he's perhaps the only former Spur on this list that I could see coming back and wearing the Silver and Black again. I don't think he'd ever be a 6th man again on this team, but I could easily see him coming back as an 11th or 12th man in the next 3 years after this one.

[timvp]

Brent Barry is noticeably absent from this list. If Malik is on there, Barry deserves to be on there.I named Barry on the notable players not on the list next to players like Willie Anderson, Stephen Jackson and Dennis Rodman. It'd be pretty hard for me to make a case for Barry over any of the players on this list. At his best he was very useful but he wasn't at his best for long stretches and his clashes with Pop caused him to be in the doghouse a large portion of time.

[Brutalis]

The whole fan favorite thing is hurting this poll imo.

[rascal]

I'm starting to kinda like the idea of Malik here. His time with the Spurs ended ugly but from 1999 to 2003, he was a huge part of the team. In that time frame, I'd say he established himself as the best bench player in team history. And Rose was very much needed because capable backup bigman might have been the weakest position of all since David Robinson came to town.

People remember his hustle and energy first and foremost but he actually had some huge games along the way. Game 2 against the Lakers in 1999, he had 13 points, five rebounds and guarded Shaq very well the game that ended up being the closest in the series. Game 5 against the Suns in 2003 with the series tied 2-2, Rose had 27 points and 13 rebounds off the bench when everyone else was struggling and it looked like the Suns could actually win that series. Game 2 against the Mavs in 2003 with the Spurs down 0-1 in a must win game, Rose came up with 25 points and six rebounds. Then who can forget the dunk on Mutombo during the Nets series which woke up a team that looked like it was about to choke in the Finals.

His time on the team didn't have a storybook ending but his importance in those first two championship teams can't be understated.

I wish some of you people had a better understanding of how important the early years were to the teams futute success. Doug Moe meant more to the Spurs than Malik Rose.