Any Idiots on here still voting for Obama

[spurspur]

Please tell me all you guys have snapped out of the change and hope thing.

[clambake]

mccain: "it's all about change"

[spurspur]

clambake "I am a communist"

[florige]

Who is this?

[2centsworth]

clambake "I am a communist"

as much as I don't like clambake's opinions, he does have a good point.

He once told me he has donated all of his investment interest and capital gains for the benefit of old people. That's pretty cool IMO, never expecting to make a profit on investments to help old people.

I know I couldn't do that.

[sontinospurs]

Please tell me all you guys have snapped out of the change and hope thing.

to what, keep things they way they are? No thanks. I dont know about you
but this medical system really is shit. its kicking my ass.....in this country it pays not to get sick.:bang

[Mr. Peabody]

No, I think all of the "idiots" in here are voting for McCain.....:toast

[JoeChalupa]

McCain's speech last night just re-affirmed my decision to vote for Barack Obama and I'm going to help in any way I can. It's time to Barack the vote and take back the country that I've served and loved all my life. The time is now my friends to join together and defeat the Palin/McCain ticket and keep America from another 4 years of the same old policies of the Bush administration, and make no mistake about it my friends, another 4 years is exactly what we'll get from the smooth talking express and that IS a bridge to nowhere we cannot afford to cross. Bad experience and unproven experience is not what we need and we will not be duped again, not this year.
The time for real change and opportunity is NOW, NOW, NOW!!
YES WE CAN!! SI SE PUEDE!!

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q283/mcctatas/1208476396703ol7.gif

[florige]

McCain's speech last night just re-affirmed my decision to vote for Barack Obama and I'm going to help in any way I can. It's time to Barack the vote and take back the country that I've served and loved all my life. The time is now my friends to join together and defeat the Palin/McCain ticket and keep America from another 4 years of the same old policies of the Bush administration, and make no mistake about it my friends, another 4 years is exactly what we'll get from the smooth talking express and that IS a bridge to nowhere we cannot afford to cross. Bad experience and unproven experience is not what we need and we will not be duped again, not this year.
The time for real change and opportunity is NOW, NOW, NOW!!
YES WE CAN!! SI SE PUEDE!!

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q283/mcctatas/1208476396703ol7.gif



You need to get into his campaign somehow. You are fired up!!:lol I can totally see you going out on the campaign trail tearing shit up!!!!

[spurspur]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means. Go drink some jamba juice and talk about how the man is bringing you down at Starbucks.

I for one don't want the country to be brought down by higher taxes on people and businesses. It will sure be a great economy when people get laid off cause their business has to cut back and then they pay higher taxes.

did you see obama on o'reilly? He was so unsure of every word it was pathetic.

What has obama accomplished? Anything?

[clambake]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means. Go drink some jamba juice and talk about how the man is bringing you down at Starbucks.

I for one don't want the country to be brought down by higher taxes on people and businesses. It will sure be a great economy when people get laid off cause their business has to cut back and then they pay higher taxes.

did you see obama on o'reilly? He was so unsure of every word it was pathetic.

What has obama accomplished? Anything?

did you notice the 2 for 1 stock split on union pacific?

[Mr. Peabody]

did you see obama on o'reilly? He was so unsure of every word it was pathetic.



Yeah, I know. O'Reilly is usually such a great forum for getting you point across and explaining your positions.

[sabar]

Every 4 years the exact same things happen. Candidates say all the right things, then 2 years later half the people that voted for them regret it. These people have trained all their lives on how to give speeches, but saying something and doing something are two different things.

If there is any justice in the world all politicians will be abducted by aliens and we are forced to elect, gasp, a normal human being.

[cool hand]

yeah, cuz I am anti-nazi.

[spurspur]

Obama on O'reilly " ummmmm ummmm change ummm umm hope ummmm ummm bush sucks ummmmmm ummm"

[spurspur]

yeah, cuz I am anti-nazi.

You must be pro-terrorist then

[sontinospurs]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means. Go drink some jamba juice and talk about how the man is bringing you down at Starbucks.

I for one don't want the country to be brought down by higher taxes on people and businesses. It will sure be a great economy when people get laid off cause their business has to cut back and then they pay higher taxes.

did you see obama on o'reilly? He was so unsure of every word it was pathetic.

What has obama accomplished? Anything?

Wake up SpurSpur, this country has already been brought down. McCain=Bush. He reiterated his support for him in his speech. And as it
came out today, were still losing jobs!!:bang:bang

[cool hand]

You must be pro-terrorist then


no anti-nazi

[Mr. Peabody]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means.

That doesn't make any sense. How would your ability to speak English determine whether you understood the phrase "Si, Se Puede"?

[cool hand]

anti- fuck with countries that really don't have terrorists until we invade them.

[Mr. Peabody]

Obama on O'reilly " ummmmm ummmm change ummm umm hope ummmm ummm bush sucks ummmmmm ummm"

Damn, my Tivo must have cut off that part of the interview.....:wow

Stupid Tivo.

[cool hand]

anti-bullshit invasions.

[cool hand]

anti-create an enemy when there really isn't one

[cool hand]

anti-waste money for a bullshit war.

[2centsworth]

Yeah, I know. O'Reilly is usually such a great forum for getting you point across and explaining your positions.

the great speaker who will change the hearts of dictators and terrorist with words. If he can't handle O'Reilly, who looked to me he was trying to give Obama a fair shake, then he's screwed with Amadinejad. Or maybe Obama sells us out to Iran which makes communication much easier.

[clambake]

then he's screwed with Amadinejad.

nobody knew this guy before bush came along.:toast

[sontinospurs]

the great speaker who will change the hearts of dictators and terrorist with words. If he can't handle O'Reilly, who looked to me he was trying to give Obama a fair shake, then he's screwed with Amadinejad. Or maybe Obama sells us out to Iran which makes communication much easier.

Who gives a shit about that asshole O'reilly? He's nothing but a smug prick, who looks out for himself and his ideals.:toast

[Mr. Peabody]

the great speaker who will change the hearts of dictators and terrorist with words. If he can't handle O'Reilly, who looked to me he was trying to give Obama a fair shake, then he's screwed with Amadinejad. Or maybe Obama sells us out to Iran which makes communication much easier.

Because talking to Bill O'Reilly on his show in an effort to win over Republicans is exactly like talking to Ahmadinejad. Great analogy.

Using that logic, McCain didn't do that well last night talking to the American public. How will he ever give a State of the Union address...?

[boutons_]

"Please tell me all you guys have snapped out of the change and hope thing."

But when McSame, showing great originality, adopts the "change" theme in his acceptance speech, it's so much more credible, right? :lol

[2centsworth]

Wake up SpurSpur, this country has already been brought down. McCain=Bush. He reiterated his support for him in his speech. And as it
came out today, were still losing jobs!!:bang:bang

how did Bush bring down this country and how will Obama create jobs?

I ask the question about Bush because I blame the ills of the economy more on the Tech Bubble of the 90s, followed by 911, and then corporate coruption after that. Now we have a subprime mortgage mess.

How is Bush or any politician responsible for that?

[2centsworth]

Because talking to Bill O'Reilly on his show in an effort to win over Republicans is exactly like talking to Ahmadinejad. Great analogy. Bill is worse, I get it.:toast



Using that logic, McCain didn't do that well last night talking to the American public. How will he ever give a State of the Union address...? What does that have to do with national security? Also, the whack jobs did a pretty good job of disrupting last night.

[Mr. Peabody]

What does that have to do with national security?

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Thanks for proving my point.:toast

[2centsworth]

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. That's my point.
that's not your point. Obama thinks he's skilled enough to talk to Amadinejad without any preconditions. That's on the record and part of his national security plan. You're saying he can't even handle O'Reilly.

[2centsworth]

Who gives a shit about that asshole O'reilly? He's nothing but a smug prick, who looks out for himself and his ideals.:toast

I get it. Leaders of terrorist states will be much nicer so Obama can explain himself. I think maybe it's because Libs and those terrorist leaders think a lot alike and believe Obama should easily develop rapport.

[spurspur]

Well I am:
anti - killing babies
anti - raising taxes
anti - allowing illegals to become citizens with no problem
anti - universal healthcare
anti - reparations for slavery
anti - cutting and running in Iraq

[2centsworth]

Well I am:
anti - killing babies
anti - raising taxes
anti - allowing illegals to become citizens with no problem
anti - universal healthcare
anti - reparations for slavery
anti - cutting and running in Iraq

you're never going to win the nahne nahne boo boo game with libs. They are experts.

[01.20.09]

Present.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a228/laledesi/ElectoralVotes.jpg

[Spurminator]

This is a really good thread.

[Mr. Peabody]

that's not your point. Obama thinks he's skilled enough to talk to Amadinejad without any preconditions. That's on the record and part of his national security plan. You're saying he can't even handle O'Reilly.

Is he going on some Ahmadinejad talk show in Iran in an effort to win over Republican voters? I don't understand the argument you are making. You are trying to equate complex global security talks with appearances on a right wing-leaning talk show. I don't see the two as being comparable.

[2centsworth]

This is a really good thread.
:lmao

[sontinospurs]

Well I am:
anti - killing babies
anti - raising taxes
anti - allowing illegals to become citizens with no problem
anti - universal healthcare
anti - reparations for slavery
anti - cutting and running in Iraq

you must have great health care

[Mr. Peabody]

Well I am:
anti - killing babies
anti - raising taxes
anti - allowing illegals to become citizens with no problem
anti - universal healthcare
anti - reparations for slavery
anti - cutting and running in Iraq

:wtf

[spurspur]

you must have great health care

Yes i worked hard my whole life to get a good job. My company pays for my healthcare. I have worked very hard in order for that to happen.

[rascal]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means. Go drink some jamba juice and talk about how the man is bringing you down at Starbucks.

I for one don't want the country to be brought down by higher taxes on people and businesses. It will sure be a great economy when people get laid off cause their business has to cut back and then they pay higher taxes.

did you see obama on o'reilly? He was so unsure of every word it was pathetic.

What has obama accomplished? Anything?

Companies will not cut back on workers and lay off if they have the work no matter what taxes are.

[Mr. Peabody]

I get it. Leaders of terrorist states will be much nicer so Obama can explain himself. I think maybe it's because Libs and those terrorist leaders think a lot alike and believe Obama should easily develop rapport.

Your argument is absolutely ridiculous. It would be like me arguing - Well, McCain's strength is in reaching across the aisle to work with others that don't agree with him and find common ground. However, he can't seem to find enough common ground with liberal voters to sway them. How the hell is he going handle people like Ahmadinejad...?

[spurspur]

Companies will not cut back on workers and lay off if they have the work no matter what taxes are.

If companies have to pay higher taxes, it means there overhead will be higher. Therefore, they will have to cut overhead. Whats the easiest way to cut overhead? Layoff people. Genius idea Barack

[rascal]

If companies have to pay higher taxes, it means there overhead will be higher. Therefore, they will have to cut overhead. Whats the easiest way to cut overhead? Layoff people. Genius idea Barack


No if they have the work they will not cut the people because they lose money if they don't have enough people to do the work.

[angel_luv]

Barack the vote

IMO- That slogan was cute in the primaries, but sounds lame now due to overuse.

[spurspur]

IMO- That slogan was cute in the primaries, but sounds lame now due to overuse.

Its a lame slogan. Angel are you excited about a female vice president?

[spurster]

All the promises from both parties to cut my taxes and your taxes doesn't make sense to me. We're already running huge deficits (while fighting two wars). The last time I checked, paying off a debt costs more than paying off the bill right away. To my mind then, these tax cuts are really tax increases in the long run. As for stimulating the economy, if the huge deficits we currently have (and have had for most of BushCo) aren't stimulating the economy that much, how does a bigger deficit change that?

[Buddy Holly]

Yes i worked hard my whole life to get a good job. My company pays for my healthcare. I have worked very hard in order for that to happen.

You got all that from turning tricks?

[George Gervin's Afro]

Its a lame slogan. Angel are you excited about a female vice president?

One that wants to abolish sex education? :lmao

[spurspur]

You got all that from turning tricks?

Wow hilarious buddy holly! Hilarious!

[Buddy Holly]

One that wants to abolish sex education? :lmao

And a woman's right to choose. :p:

[2centsworth]

Your argument is absolutely ridiculous. It would be like me arguing - Well, McCain's strength is in reaching across the aisle to work with others that don't agree with him and find common ground. However, he can't seem to find enough common ground with liberal voters to sway them. How the hell is he going handle people like Ahmadinejad...?

You handle Ahmandinejad with the threat of force. Those threats can't be empty neither. That's a real difference between McCain and Obama.

[Buddy Holly]

Wow hilarious buddy holly! Hilarious!

Wasn't a joke.

[George Gervin's Afro]

You handle Ahmandinejad with the threat of force. Those threats can't be empty neither. That's a real difference between McCain and Obama.

Let me know when's the last time Iran attacked anyone.

[2centsworth]

And a woman's right to choose. :p:

Can I choose to kill you without consequence?

[2centsworth]

Let me know when's the last time Iran attacked anyone.


:lmao:rollin

[Buddy Holly]

Can I choose to kill you without consequence?

Well, yes you can.

[George Gervin's Afro]

:lmao:rollin

Ok when was it?

[angel_luv]

Its a lame slogan. Angel are you excited about a female vice president?

Yes and no.

I want a qualified Vice President who will help run this country with integrity and courage.

If Sarah Palin is that Vice President and gets elected, I will be happy to have her as a role model to women.

But I am not going to vote for Sarah Palin because she is a woman- nor does the fact that she is female earn her my automatic trust.
She will have to convince me she is worth voting for along with all the rest of the canidates.

So far the only information I have on ALL of the candidates is their past successes- which, while admirable, won't help the country tons now since those victories are past - and that each of them do well reading speeches that were written for them.

I haven't made up my mind fully about any canidate yet.
Bring on the debates. :)

[2centsworth]

Well, yes you can.

without consequence? Are you posting from China?

[George Gervin's Afro]

Can I choose to kill you without consequence?

Sort of like throwing away embryos rather them to being used for stem cells? Wouldn't that be considered killing?

[2centsworth]

Ok when was it?

is your position that IRAN is not involved in any attacks or conflicts around the world?

[Buddy Holly]

without consequence? Are you posting from China?

Oops, read that wrong.

So it's not ok to take a life without consequences, correct? Is that what you're getting at?

[Anti.Hero]

as much as I don't like clambake's opinions, he does have a good point.

He once told me he has donated all of his investment interest and capital gains for the benefit of old people. That's pretty cool IMO, never expecting to make a profit on investments to help old people.

I know I couldn't do that.

I pay for old people who didn't save for their own retirement every 2 weeks.




No big deal though...I get a smile back on my face when I remember the government won't be able to take shit once I withdraw my rothIRA funds. I'm sure the goverment will change that within the next 40 years though :bang

[2centsworth]

Sort of like throwing away embryos rather them to being used for stem cells? Wouldn't that be considered killing?

we can debate when life begins. A heart beat is a starting point for me.

[2centsworth]

Oops, read that wrong.

So it's not ok to take a life without consequences, correct? Is that what you're getting at?

without legal consequences, yes.

[Buddy Holly]

we can debate when life begins. A heart beat is a starting point for me.

You're fine with abortion if it happens within the first 21-24 days? :lol

[Buddy Holly]

without legal consequences, yes.

Ah, you've gone and just made it so that in your head, murder is acceptable, because murder is fine without consequences, oops... "legal" consequences.

Well guess what, just like the death penalty has no "legal" consequences, neither does abortion.

[George Gervin's Afro]

is your position that IRAN is not involved in any attacks or conflicts around the world?

You keep telling us how dangerous they are so I assumed you have something to back that up. You seem to want others to believe that if they get a nuke then it's over yet they have never attacked anyone. So what are we to do? believe the same right wings nuts who proclaimed Iraq was a grave and imminent threat? Thee same folks are trying to get us to buy their baseless accuastions again.

Answer one question. Why would Iran, or any country for that matter, risk being wiped off the face of the earth by the US?

[2centsworth]

I pay for old people who didn't save for their own retirement every 2 weeks.




No big deal though...I get a smile back on my face when I remember the government won't be able to take shit once I withdraw my rothIRA funds. I'm sure the goverment will change that within the next 40 years though :bang


clambake is very generous or is broke, but either way he either doesn't make a penny on his investments or he pledges not to make a penny. That's some hardcore sacrifice.

[clambake]

I pay for old people who didn't save for their own retirement every 2 weeks.




No big deal though...I get a smile back on my face when I remember the government won't be able to take shit once I withdraw my rothIRA funds. I'm sure the goverment will change that within the next 40 years though :bang

fortune common and preferred has dipped a little......but i'm gonna hang on to it anyway.:toast

[clambake]

clambake is very generous or is broke, but either way he either doesn't make a penny on his investments or he pledges not to make a penny. That's some hardcore sacrifice.

i'm still a bit ticked about the gallaher sale......and that was last year.

[2centsworth]

Why would Iran, or any country for that matter, risk being wiped off the face of the earth by the US?

Exactly. The threat of force from the US is real. Show weakness and see how Hezbolah runs wild. Libs will give their terrorist attacks some type of moral equivalency and the terrorist will get all sorts of chances.

[2centsworth]

i'm still a bit ticked about the gallaher sale......and that was last year.

why be ticked when the profit goes to someone else.

[td4mvp21]

I'm voting for Obama and I am not an idiot. Like Joe Chalupa said, I don't want four more years of Bush policies dominating the country. We are in two wars right now, the economy is shit, and education is shit (thanks to No Child Left Behind).

[clambake]

why be ticked when the profit goes to someone else.

i'm also a fund raiser for the leukemia and lymphoma society.

couldn't you (at least) have donated that piece of shit tv to CCF?

[FromWayDowntown]

I think Obama is probably going to end up getting about 1,000 votes nationwide by the time this whole election thing is over, with the vast majority of those votes coming from some tight-knit, anti-Irish burg in West Virginia where electricity hasn't yet been provided.

[2centsworth]

Ah, you've gone and just made it so that in your head, murder is acceptable, because murder is fine without consequences, oops... "legal" consequences.

you truly need to learn to read. I'll simplify it for you, there are legal consequences for killing another human being except when your life is in danger because of that person.

Abortion extends those rights to a form of contraception.




Well guess what, just like the death penalty has no "legal" consequences, neither does abortion.

the legal consequence is death. I murder you and then I lose my life.
Abortion is I murder my kid because as in the words of Obama, a kid is punishment.

[2centsworth]

i'm also a fund raiser for the leukemia and lymphoma society.

couldn't you (at least) have donated that piece of shit tv to CCF?

do you really donate all of your profits on all of your investments?

btw, how do I send a tv to CCF?

[Buddy Holly]

you truly need to learn to read. I'll simplify it for you, there are legal consequences for killing another human being except when your life is in danger because of that person.

Abortion extends those rights to a form of contraception.

No, I understood you. But go ahead and make it so it's ok.



the legal consequence is death. I murder you and then I lose my life.
Abortion is I murder my kid because as in the words of Obama, a kid is punishment.

Right, because everyone who's ever murder has has lost their lives. Hell, get a good enough lawyer and you can get off scot-free.

[2centsworth]

Murder is murder. You take a life, you take a life.

if that's your stance then why the double standard?





Right, because everyone who's ever murder has has lost their lives. Hell, get a good enough lawyer and you can get off scot-free.

You asked about the death penalty and i told you it was a legal consequence. Now I agree with you many lawyers and legislators have perverted our system of justice.

[clambake]

do you really donate all of your profits on all of your investments?
i was wondering why you would make that initial claim. care to explain?


btw, how do I send a tv to CCF?
i would suspect you'd know.

[Buddy Holly]

2Cents, watch the following.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4267856870762913584

[2centsworth]

2Cents, watch the following.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4267856870762913584

I can't watch video from this computer, so you're going to have to explain your position to me.

[Buddy Holly]

if that's your stance then why the double standard?

That's not my double standard, that's yours.

I'm fine with Judges having the right to put someone to death if it's called for. I'm also fine with a woman having the right to decide for herself.

[Buddy Holly]

I can't watch video from this computer, so you're going to have to explain your position to me.

It's Carlin's Back in Town special. The first 15 minutes deal with woman's rights, abortion, life and death.

[2centsworth]

i was wondering why you would make that initial claim. care to explain?

You told me one time that you would donate all of your investments profits for the benefit of old people and that my unwillingness to do so was uncaring.



i would suspect you'd know. not without customs stealing or taxing the crap out of it where my kid couldn't afford to get it. Gifts have to be small. btw, it's a great charity where anyone, even students, can make a real difference. Politics has nothing to do with it, because all sorts of people particiate.

[DarkReign]

Well I am:
anti - killing babies (well, thats one way to put it)
anti - raising taxes (who isnt?)
anti - allowing illegals to become citizens with no problem (John McCain says "Hello")
anti - universal healthcare (fair)
anti - reparations for slavery (...from left field, here comes...?)
anti - cutting and running in Iraq (nice use of the party-approved line)

Youre a Mavrick.

[clambake]

You told me one time that you would donate all of your investments profits for the benefit of old people and that my unwillingness to do so was uncaring.
:lol i never told you that :lol


not without customs stealing or taxing the crap out of it where my kid couldn't afford to get it. Gifts have to be small. btw, it's a great charity where anyone, even students, can make a real difference. Politics has nothing to do with it, because all sorts of people particiate.

good for you......and i mean that sincerely:toast

[DetroitGurl]

Yes i worked hard my whole life to get a good job. My company pays for my healthcare. I have worked very hard in order for that to happen.

you are one, ONE of the lucky ones.....i too, along with many, MANY other citizens who have worked long, and hard to to establish themselves in the company, only to get axed. with no kiss goodbye. no health care. nothing. some with only a sign on the door, indicating they have closed.

what do you tell the 40-ish person then? it's ok, just start over. :depressed

[2centsworth]

That's not my double standard, that's yours.

here's the double standard. YOu said, and I quote, " Murder is Murder. You take a life, then you take a life". I know you were talking about the death penalty, but why wouldn't that standard apply to abortion?

[clambake]

will abortion be illegal if mccain is president?

[2centsworth]

you are one, ONE of the lucky ones.....i too, along with many, MANY other citizens who have worked long, and hard to to establish themselves in the company, only to get axed. with no kiss goodbye. no health care. nothing. some with only a sign on the door, indicating they have closed.

what do you tell the 40-ish person then? it's ok, just start over. :depressed

you have no choice but to pick yourself back up and continue life. You will receive a helping hand from the government in the form of Unemployement which btw McCain talked about yesterday.

My recommendation would be to downsize, get the best job you can quickly, live frugaly and save your ass off. Forget materialism, because it's a path to nowhere.

As far as healthcare, I'm with you all the way. The government should just whipe away all of their health programs, do away with all health related tax deductions, and give everyone a health care voucher good for basic coverage with any carrier. Each carrier would be required to carry a basic policy and couldn't deny anyone.

[2centsworth]

will abortion be illegal if mccain is president?

no, but I'm all for increased scrutiny. Most of these abortions are being used as a form of contraception. We need those people to use Rubbers, and not only to avoid abortion, but also for a whole host of other reasons.

[Buddy Holly]

here's the double standard. YOu said, and I quote, " Murder is Murder. You take a life, then you take a life". I know you were talking about the death penalty, but why wouldn't that standard apply to abortion?

No, I was putting that out there as your way of looking at things. Because you asked me if you could murder without consequences.

Again, I have no problem with the death penalty, when they deserve it and that's a slippery slope and I also have no problem with a woman having the right to choose to have a abortion or not. I wouldn't root for an abortion and I wouldn't root for no abortion, I'd let the person carrying the baby decide that.

[clambake]

no, but I'm all for increased scrutiny. Most of these abortions are being used as a form of contraception. We need those people to use Rubbers, and not only to avoid abortion, but also for a whole host of other reasons.

yeah, the "abstinence" program is backed by complete morons.

do you know anybody that promotes that?

[2centsworth]

No, I was putting that out there as your way of looking at things. Because you asked me if you could murder without consequences. you brought the death penalty into the conversation. I'm just responsiding to what you're saying.



Again, I have no problem with the death penalty, when they deserve it and that's a slippery slope and I also have no problem with a woman having the right to choose to have a abortion or not. I wouldn't root for an abortion and I wouldn't root for no abortion, I'd let the person carrying the baby decide that.

you're consistent which is good, but abortion is still killing a kid that committed no crime.

[Buddy Holly]

you're consistent which is good, but abortion is still killing a kid that committed no crime.

What crimes do animals like pigs, chickens and cows commit? How about deers and buffalo? What crimes?

And don't come back with "They're animals, we're human."

FYI. I hate PETA. I eat bacon, meat and chicken.

[clambake]

What crimes do animals like pigs, chickens and cows commit? How about deers and buffalo?

uh oh

[DetroitGurl]

you have no choice but to pick yourself back up and continue life. You will receive a helping hand from the government in the form of Unemployement which btw McCain talked about yesterday.

My recommendation would be to downsize, get the best job you can quickly, live frugaly and save your ass off. Forget materialism, because it's a path to nowhere.

As far as healthcare, I'm with you all the way. The government should just whipe away off of their health programs, do away with all health related tax deductions, and give everyone a health care voucher good for basic coverage with any carrier. Each carrier would be required to carry a basic policy and couldn't deny anyone.


you saying mccain talked about unemployement at the rally. i dont want to hear about unemployement, i would like to hear about jobs. real jobs. created HERE, not sent overseas. but we wont.

quickly? find a job? where might that be? at the local mcdonalds where the corporations wish to pay the young the kids? downsize? what if this bread winner has 5 kids. ALL PAID FOR through the "healthcare" provided at his job? material things were never a need. so this man or woman should go on "welfare", and have others pay for them? that cant be right either? can it?

listen, i have my own standards of who i would like to see run this country. and to be honest with you, at this point in the economy.....i dont care if its hillary, mccain, obama, mccains wife, hillarys daughter, or tim duncan. every time we have elections, they all, ALL promise us "this/that" and what happens, they all lie. they bullshit their way in our minds and hearts......and then step on them.

i just want to see a fair president run this place.

oh, my thoughts on the war. im done. its time. quit babysitting the world, when our own backyards are very, VERY dirty.

[2centsworth]

yeah, the "abstinence" program is backed by complete morons.

do you know anybody that promotes that?


abstinence should be presented as an option. I happen to believe it's the best option, but i can't honestly say I abided by that before I was married.

there has to be give and take, and when both sides do not compromise, we all lose. When it comes to this topic I happen to believe both sides have good opinions.

Ideally I would like sex education to be promote Abstinence with rubbers.
That's how families should teach it too. Beauty of abstinence, but keep rubbers in your pocket or purse just in case.

[2centsworth]

you saying mccain talked about unemployement at the rally. i dont want to hear about unemployement, i would like to hear about jobs. real jobs. created HERE, not sent overseas. but we wont.

you said you're unemployed, so I addressed your immediate issue. However, if you want to talk about some pipe dream like protectionism fine, but that's not going to take place anytime soon if ever. btw, who in the hell wants protectionism anyways. I don't want to spend $12 for a loaf of bread.



quickly? find a job? where might that be? at the local mcdonalds where the corporations wish to pay the young the kids? downsize? what if this bread winner has 5 kids. ALL PAID FOR through the "healthcare" provided at his job? material things were never a need. so this man or woman should go on "welfare", and have others pay for them? that cant be right either? can it?

I thought we were talking about you, but it sounds like you have an imaginary person which we could never discuss because the imaginary mitigating circumstances are endless.



listen, i have my own standards of who i would like to see run this country. and to be honest with you, at this point in the economy.....i dont care if its hillary, mccain, obama, mccains wife, hillarys daughter, or tim duncan. every time we have elections, they all, ALL promise us "this/that" and what happens, they all lie. they bullshit their way in our minds and hearts......and then step on them.

I agree with you 100%, so that's why we have to continue to try to get them out of our lives. I would take a Bill Clinton right now, but between these two canidates, McCain/Palin is this best choice.



i just want to see a fair president run this place.

oh, my thoughts on the war. im done. its time. quit babysitting the world, when our own backyards are very, VERY dirty.

I agree to an extent. We need to continue putting fear into our enemies and still get involved in humanitarian efforts such as darfur.

[2centsworth]

What crimes do animals like pigs, chickens and cows commit? How about deers and buffalo? What crimes?

And don't come back with "They're animals, we're human."

FYI. I hate PETA. I eat bacon, meat and chicken.:dizzy

[DetroitGurl]

you said you're unemployed, so I addressed your immediate issue. However, if you want to talk about some pipe dream like protectionism fine, but that's not going to take place anytime soon if ever. btw, who in the hell wants protectionism anyways. I don't want to spend $12 for a loaf of bread.

my husband is, and as far as the 5 kids, that would be my brothers situation. how is wanting jobs a pipedream? proctect me and the people from sending jobs overseas.


I thought we were talking about you, but it sounds like you have an imaginary person which we could never discuss because the imaginary mitigating circumstances are endless.

these are not imaginary people. they are very real. in my own family. and people all across the usa. there is nothing imaginary about that scenario.


I agree with you 100%, so that's why we have to continue to try to get them out of our lives. I would take a Bill Clinton right now, but between these two canidates, McCain/Palin is this best choice.

i would take back bill clinton everyday of the week and twice on sunday. who cares if he was getting a blow job. he was running this country well. and not because he was republican or democrat. but because he was one hell of a president.


I agree to an extent. We need to continue putting fear into our enemies and still get involved in humanitarian efforts such as darfur.

our enemies do not lie in iraq, however they may now. i for one do not feel any safer, with saddam gone. watch some arabic tv. see what the media there will not allow you to see here. besides, the "enemy" as died. why are we still there? we have lost so much, and gained only one thing. the evil hearts of many people around the world who see us as the "terrorist". no, i do not feel any safer. at all.

and to clear it up now. i am muslim. i am lebanese. i am however, american. born and raised.

[spurspur]

my husband is, and as far as the 5 kids, that would be my brothers situation. how is wanting jobs a pipedream? proctect me and the people from sending jobs overseas.



these are not imaginary people. they are very real. in my own family. and people all across the usa. there is nothing imaginary about that scenario.



i would take back bill clinton everyday of the week and twice on sunday. who cares if he was getting a blow job. he was running this country well. and not because he was republican or democrat. but because he was one hell of a president.



our enemies do not lie in iraq, however they may now. i for one do not feel any safer, with saddam gone. watch some arabic tv. see what the media there will not allow you to see here. besides, the "enemy" as died. why are we still there? we have lost so much, and gained only one thing. the evil hearts of many people around the world who see us as the "terrorist". no, i do not feel any safer. at all.

and to clear it up now. i am muslim. i am lebanese. i am however, american. born and raised.

What does your symbol at the bottom mean? Why did you lose your job?

We are still in Iraq because we trying to get them to the point to where they are able to sustain and govern themselves. We do not want Iraq to turn into a terrorist safe haven. I am not saying that invading Iraq was a good idea, but I feel that leaving before the job is complemented is a bad idea. My brother in law just got back from there and I have other friends that are there right now. They feel the same way.

What about Obama's plan and accomplishments makes you think he is the best candidate?

[DetroitGurl]

What does your symbol at the bottom mean? Why did you lose your job?

We are still in Iraq because we trying to get them to the point to where they are able to sustain and govern themselves. We do not want Iraq to turn into a terrorist safe haven. I am not saying that invading Iraq was a good idea, but I feel that leaving before the job is complemented is a bad idea. My brother in law just got back from there and I have other friends that are there right now. They feel the same way.

What about Obama's plan and accomplishments makes you think he is the best candidate?

my symbol is in arabic, and it says "may allah make your ramadan period generous". meaning while we fast, make it worth the while, pray for those in need. im glad you asked, i do not want anyone on here to think it means something "terrorist". its like saying merry christmas, and meaning it from your heart, not the mall.

it was not me, who lost the job, it was my husband.

iraq, will never sustain and govern themselves. remember, its how they live, and have lived for many, MANY years. it was established before jesus walked the earth. they are used to living in that way. it wasnt a terrorist haven before. but now, it may be. you cant invade a place that has nothing to do with the other.....so, at this point, BECAUSE we are there, im sure there are some now. thats obvious, turn on the news. bombings everyday. i HATE to say this because yes, saddam was a bad man, but it was safer before he died for the people. and please, i beg, do not believe everything the news tells you, that its much better now. i have lost 3 cousins in that "war", and im tired of seeing the boys come home in caskets. it sickens me. its not only bad the soldiers, but for hte people who live there, and cant even send their kids to school out of fear for bombs. im not saying it was "perfect" in saddams days, but it wasnt this way.

i never said i wanted obama. quite frankly i havent made my choice of who i want. i acutally do not like any of them, if i may be honest. my biggest arugment with mccain is he is very strong in supporting the war. i am not. obama has gone back and forth about the war. that scares me.

[RandomGuy]

Please tell me all you guys have snapped out of the change and hope thing.

Please tell me why the Republican party deserves my vote.

They betrayed fiscal conservatives during Bush's presidency with a lot of rubber stamp votes.

They backed Bush to the hilt, despite the criminally negligent handling of Iraq for 4 years, directly killing our servicemembers and an untold number of Iraqis through their bungling.

I was an independent before Bush, and have a McCain 2000 t-shirt in my closet, but I will not be voting for a Republican for a long, long time.

Personally, I have seen very few competant Republicans that inspire my confidence. The party has given itself to the radical right, lock, stock, and barrel, and throughout the Bush presidency, has shown itself to place political litmus tests over competency.

The Republicans should be fired.

If the Dems take the ball and do the same stupid shit, then they should be fired too.

Sooner or later the apparatchiks will get the message.

All told, the best way I have found this election to see how someone would govern would be their handling of their campaign.

The talent and motivated people that Obama has attracted unseated a virtually unstoppable Hillary juggernaut and have proven themselves to be disciplined, savvy, and smart. Hollow "elitist" charges aside, I would rather have that brainpower in power than the hacks that seem to be attracted to the GOP.

Obama is not some great savior, and, just like McCain, has said some rather obviously pandering things, but nowhere near the degree that McCain has.

From what I have seen, neither Republican on the ticket has more than the most rudimentary understanding about geopolitics.

While the bumpkinism displayed by Palin seems to play well domestically, it takes intelligence and an ability to think in sophisticated terms with an open mind to really succeed as a president. God knows the current presidency has shown us that.

McCain may be fairly open-minded for a conservative, but the party hacks he will invariably have to employ should he become president, along with a woman who has admitted not knowing what her job would be do not inspire my confidence.

[2centsworth]

my husband is, and as far as the 5 kids, that would be my brothers situation. how is wanting jobs a pipedream? proctect me and the people from sending jobs overseas.

If you and your husband don't have kids, and then work anywhere. If you can't find work there, move. As far as sending jobs overseas, if you're referring to the auto industry, if obama closes those doors to international competition, expect hyper inflation. $1 will go to 10 cents in a freakin hurry. Right now it's taking 20 years or so for a $1 to go to 50cents. Protectionism will force the $1 to 10 cents in 10 years or less.

Your best bet is working and retraining.




these are not imaginary people. they are very real. in my own family. and people all across the usa. there is nothing imaginary about that scenario. Retraining would be my advice. What is Obama promising, government dependence?




i would take back bill clinton everyday of the week and twice on sunday. who cares if he was getting a blow job. he was running this country well. and not because he was republican or democrat. but because he was one hell of a president. fiscally I agree with you 1000%.




our enemies do not lie in iraq, however they may now. i for one do not feel any safer, with saddam gone. watch some arabic tv. see what the media there will not allow you to see here. besides, the "enemy" as died. why are we still there? we have lost so much, and gained only one thing. the evil hearts of many people around the world who see us as the "terrorist". no, i do not feel any safer. at all. you are safer whether you feel it or not.



and to clear it up now. i am muslim. i am lebanese. i am however, american. born and raised.

awesome.

[spurspur]

Please tell me why the Republican party deserves my vote.

They betrayed fiscal conservatives during Bush's presidency with a lot of rubber stamp votes.

They backed Bush to the hilt, despite the criminally negligent handling of Iraq for 4 years, directly killing our servicemembers through their bungling.

I was an independent before Bush, and have a McCain 2000 t-shirt in my closet, but I will not be voting for a Republican for a long, long time.

Personally, I have seen very few competant Republicans that inspire my confidence. The party has given itself to the radical right, lock, stock, and barrel, and throughout the Bush presidency, has shown itself to place political litmus tests over competency.

The Republicans should be fired.

If the Dems take the ball and do the same stupid shit, then they should be fired too.

Sooner or later the apparatchiks will get the message.

All told, the best way I have found this election to see how someone would govern would be their handling of their campaign.

The talent and motivated people that Obama has attracted unseated a virtually unstoppable Hillary juggernaut and have proven themselves to be disciplined, savvy, and smart. Hollow "elitist" charges aside, I would rather have that brainpower in power than the hacks that seem to be attracted to the GOP.

Obama is not some great savior, and, just like McCain, has said some rather obviously pandering things, but nowhere near the degree that McCain has.

From what I have seen, neither Republican on the ticket has more than the most rudimentary understanding about geopolitics.

While the bumpkinism displayed by Palin seems to play well domestically, it takes intelligence and an ability to think in sophisticated terms with an open mind to really succeed as a president. God knows the current presidency has shown us that.

McCain may be fairly open-minded for a conservative, but the party hacks he will invariably have to employ should he become president, along with a woman who has admitted not knowing what her job would be do not inspire my confidence.

I would argue that Bush has not been a true conservative during his presidency. Things like:
- Allowing illegals to get social security
- Not doing anything about the illegal alien problem
- Raising spending
are all not conservative values.

These are all things that Obama would make worse not better. I do not think Bush has been a good president by any means. Just because Bush has not been the greatest success, doesn't mean that the next Republican candidate will be a failure.

I don't think Mccain is a great candidate by any means, but he is lightyears ahead of Barack Obama.

[DetroitGurl]

If you and your husband don't have kids, and then work anywhere. If you can't find work there, move. As far as sending jobs overseas, if you're referring to the auto industry, if obama closes those doors to international competition, expect hyper inflation. $1 will go to 10 cents in a freakin hurry. Right now it's taking 20 years or so for a $1 to go to 50cents. Protectionism will force the $1 to 10 cents in 10 years or less.

we have one on the way. we are afraid to move, so this can happen in another town, or city. we are established here. im not just referring to the auto world. i work for one of the big 3. im the industrial buyer there.


Your best bet is working and retraining.


i can understand that, but do you see my point, when 20 something walks in for the interview, vs an older man........how do you retrain that? when not even given the chance.


Retraining would be my advice. What is Obama promising, government dependence?

again, try to find work, decent work when the lines are forever long.



fiscally I agree with you 1000%.
;)



you are safer whether you feel it or not.
and that is your opinion to say that. i am not safer. that is my opinion and feeling to say that.



awesome.
thank you :)

[101A]

Please tell me why the Republican party deserves my vote.

They betrayed fiscal conservatives during Bush's presidency with a lot of rubber stamp votes.

They backed Bush to the hilt, despite the criminally negligent handling of Iraq for 4 years, directly killing our servicemembers through their bungling.

I was an independent before Bush, and have a McCain 2000 t-shirt in my closet, but I will not be voting for a Republican for a long, long time.

Personally, I have seen very few competant Republicans that inspire my confidence. The party has given itself to the radical right, lock, stock, and barrel, and throughout the Bush presidency, has shown itself to place political litmus tests over competency.

The Republicans should be fired.

If the Dems take the ball and do the same stupid shit, then they should be fired too.

Sooner or later the apparatchiks will get the message.

All told, the best way I have found this election to see how someone would govern would be their handling of their campaign.

The talent and motivated people that Obama has attracted unseated a virtually unstoppable Hillary juggernaut and have proven themselves to be disciplined.

Obama is not some great savior, and, just like McCain, has said some rather obviously pandering things, but nowhere near the degree that McCain has.

From what I have seen, neither Republican on the ticket has more than the most rudimentary understanding about geopolitics.

While the bumpkinism displayed by Palin seems to play well domestically, it takes intelligence and an ability to think in sophisticated terms with an open mind to really succeed as a president. God knows the current presidency has shown us that.

McCain may be fairly open-minded for a conservative, but the party hacks he will invariably have to employ should he become president, along with a woman who has admitted not knowing what her job would be do not inspire my confidence.

But Obama is gonna charge a top marginal rate nearly 63% over what you, yourself stated should be the highest rate in this country.

How, in good conscience, can you vote for him.

Regarding Palin and the "job" quote - have you seen the video. She was pretty clear in it; that she didn't want a "do nothing" job; and if that was what the VP job was, she didn't want it. Apparently, it is something more involved than that.

Also, "normal party hacks" - you mean like all of the guys McCain DIDN'T select for his running mate; or the ones that Palin chased out of Alaska - and he almost picked a Democrat? WTF makes you think his first phone call after the election is gonna be to James Baker? I'm betting it won't be.

You want a ticket that isn't normal - and you're gonna go with a product of the Chicago machine who picked Joe Fucking Biden as his running mate?

McCain criticized his OWN party in his speech; read the quotes from Woodward's new book; he was OPENLY critical of the way the administration managed the Iraq war. I can almost guarantee Joe Lieberman will be in the cabinet. This AIN'T gonna be George's dad's cabinet!

Also, don't compare Palin's speaking ability with GW's - that insults ALL of our intelligence; just because she doesn't speak with a patrician slur doesn't make her slow; you're better than that.

[ggoose25]

McCain may be fairly open-minded for a conservative, but the party hacks he will invariably have to employ should he become president, along with a woman who has admitted not knowing what her job would be do not inspire my confidence.

I couldn't have said it better.

Everyone who thinks McCain will turn back into a reformist once he's in the white house might be right. But what does that say about his character if he's willing to sell out his principles for the presidency. The ends do NOT always justify the means.

OK, so McCain is a Mavrick in conservative clothes. Even if he wins the election, he has to reward all the right-wingers that he probably does not identify with (but is now indebted to) high ranking positions. With his history of loyalty, you know he doesnt have the balls to turn his back on the Karl Rove proteges who might get him elected.

We will be stuck with the same neoconservative idiots who engineered the Iraq war. Sounds like 4 more years of the same, no matter how much of a rebel McCain claims to be.

[RandomGuy]

it wasnt a terrorist haven before. but now, it may be. you cant invade a place that has nothing to do with the other.....so, at this point, BECAUSE we are there, im sure there are some now. thats obvious, turn on the news. bombings everyday. i HATE to say this because yes, saddam was a bad man, but it was safer before he died for the people.

The problem you are going to have making this argument is that, almost invariably,

1) most conservatives in the US are horribly ignorant about what is going on in the rest of the world, getting their news almost exclusively from conservative US sources

2) most conservatives in the US are patently unable to admit that our country might make a mistake or do anything wrong. for them patriotism is defined by how loudly they can shout "USA is great", and not by actually thinking objectively about what is best for the nation.

Combine the two above common charactoristics about a huge number of Americans, and you end up with an inability to understand or comprehend that there are people who don't see the US as some shining "city on the hill"

The war on "terror" is a war of ideas, and that is something they just can't wrap their minds around.

They want real, tangible enemies to defeat. They cling to some simplistic worldview that if you just kill the right people, we will "win".

A large part of their problem stems from #2 above.

Because they can't conceive or admit that the US ever does anything less than honorable, they can't understand the idea that we are really fighting, namely that the US is some evil monster bent on destroying muslims.

We aren't fighting Osama bin Laden. We are fighting an ideology. You can't kill an ideology with bullets. You can kill an ideology with moral authority, and discrediting that idea, by showing its weaknesses. This worked with communism in the Cold War, and will work with this ideology.

Try to find a conservative who will admit that though. Such a complex understanding of the issue is beyond them.

That is why the US will continue to fail at the "war" on terror until we get someone who is capable of understanding nuances and subtlity in charge.

[spursfan09]

I speak English so i don't know what your last sentence means.


well you should try to understand, because pretty soon the people who speak that language will be the majority anyway. :wow

[spurspur]

Try to find a conservative who will admit that though. Such a complex understanding of the issue is beyond them.


I would venture to say that the average conservative's IQ is higher than the average liberals.

[spurspur]

well you should try to understand, because pretty soon the people who speak that language will be the majority anyway. :wow

Thats what scares me

[2centsworth]

Please tell me why the Republican party deserves my vote.

They betrayed fiscal conservatives during Bush's presidency with a lot of rubber stamp votes.

you are on the money. the worst of the decisions was medicare part D which by most accounts is a $20 trillion dollar program.



They backed Bush to the hilt, despite the criminally negligent handling of Iraq for 4 years, directly killing our servicemembers through their bungling. nothing criminal about fighting a war and supporting your country is to be expected when at war.



I was an independent before Bush, and have a McCain 2000 t-shirt in my closet, but I will not be voting for a Republican for a long, long time. lots of reasons to think that way.




Personally, I have seen very few competant Republicans that inspire my confidence. The party has given itself to the radical right, lock, stock, and barrel, and throughout the Bush presidency, has shown itself to place political litmus tests over competency. there's truth to that.



The Republicans should be fired. they are going lose the senate, so both branches of congress will be dem.



If the Dems take the ball and do the same stupid shit, then they should be fired too. we should stick to making the best choices and not leave it to experiment.



Sooner or later the apparatchiks will get the message. they got the feakin message alright with the McCain nomination. Plus, McCain keeps beating that message into their brains. Seems to be working.



All told, the best way I have found this election to see how someone would govern would be their handling of their campaign.

that is a lame example of experience, but I understand that's all Obama has. Obama is running a popularity contest. Funny thing is, GW did the same thing in 2000. He was nowhere near as competent as the others in the republican primary.



The talent and motivated people that Obama has attracted unseated a virtually unstoppable Hillary juggernaut and have proven themselves to be disciplined, savvy, and smart. Hollow "elitist" charges aside, I would rather have that brainpower in power than the hacks that seem to be attracted to the GOP. Liberals smart, Republicans stupid, that's political game is tired and people are getting sick of it.



Obama is not some great savior, and, just like McCain, has said some rather obviously pandering things, but nowhere near the degree that McCain has. please be more specific, because the only pandering I'm seeing is from Obama with his attempt to buy votes and his inconsistent, sometimes stupid, remarks.



From what I have seen, neither Republican on the ticket has more than the most rudimentary understanding about geopolitics. :lol Can't wait for the debates.



While the bumpkinism displayed by Palin seems to play well domestically, very sexist and prejudice, but we can't help that you look down on people.


it takes intelligence and an ability to think in sophisticated terms with an open mind to really succeed as a president. God knows the current presidency has shown us that.

you seem to be very open-minded calling people stupid, bumpkins, apparats.



McCain may be fairly open-minded for a conservative, but the party hacks he will invariably have to employ should he become president, along with a woman who has admitted not knowing what her job would be do not inspire my confidence. ...for a conservative:lol .

you're very open-minded.

[spursfan09]

Yes i worked hard my whole life to get a good job. My company pays for my healthcare. I have worked very hard in order for that to happen.

so I guess you think people who don't have good healthcare or healthcare insurance brought it upon themselves? I am an American who goes to college full time and can only work part time 20 hrs a week, no health coverage for me. Universal healthcare sure looks good to me. Then when I graduate I can get a good job with health insurance.

[RandomGuy]

But Obama is gonna charge a top marginal rate nearly 63% over what you, yourself stated should be the highest rate in this country.

Source? Such claims of huge swings tend to be a bit exaggerated, and I would like to see a neutral analysis before really going in on that.

Either way, the people who have benefitted most from our economy and whose % increases in income have only accelerated during the last 25 years while everybody else has either stagnated or arguably lost ground do not inspire my sympathy.

All the wealth that I accumulate in this world will mean shit the instant I die, and it won't matter to me what % I got to keep, as long as I had enough to live fairly comfortably and provide for my kids.

Anything beyond that is icing on the cake. That is the principle that progressive tax rates are based on and I fully agree with the ethical principle behind it.

[JohnnyMarzetti]

I would venture to say that the average conservative's IQ is higher than the average liberals.

Your own idiotic posts are proof that you are wrong.

http://rejectmccain.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/mccain-yawn.jpg

[RandomGuy]

I would venture to say that the average conservative's IQ is higher than the average liberals.

From what I am given to understand "liberals" tend to be better educated overall than "conservatives".

This would tend to indicate the opposite.

You might venture to say it, but without actual data, I would venture to say you are simply guilty of little more than confirmation bias. :p:

[spursfan09]

Thats what scares me

As I'm sure all people who are different from you do.

[DetroitGurl]

We aren't fighting Osama bin Laden. We are fighting an ideology. You can't kill an ideology with bullets. You can kill an ideology with moral authority, and discrediting that idea, by showing its weaknesses. This worked with communism in the Cold War, and will work with this ideology.

TOTALLY 100% agree with that.

[RandomGuy]

so I guess you think people who don't have good healthcare or healthcare insurance brought it upon themselves? I am an American who goes to college full time and can only work part time 20 hrs a week, no health coverage for me. Universal healthcare sure looks good to me. Then when I graduate I can get a good job with health insurance.

Except for the fact that more and more costs are shifting from the insurance companies to private citizens.

It is a nasty cycle. More people without health insurance go to the hospital or doctor, can't pay and force hospitals and doctors to charge more to the customers who can pay (read: insurance companies), who in turn charge more in premiums, forcing more people to go without health insurance.

The ONLY way to break this cycle is to allow people to die on the curbs of hospitals after you refuse to treat them for lack of insurance.

We have a de-facto nationalized health care system now, and it is breaking down as we speak.

But hey, there's a free market solution to everything, right?

Pfft.

[RandomGuy]

Anyways my time here is at an end.

Take care all, and please don't reward the Republicans for the last 8 years. They don't deserve it.

[spursfan09]

Except for the fact that more and more costs are shifting from the insurance companies to private citizens.

It is a nasty cycle. More people without health insurance go to the hospital or doctor, can't pay and force hospitals and doctors to charge more to the customers who can pay (read: insurance companies), who in turn charge more in premiums, forcing more people to go without health insurance.

The ONLY way to break this cycle is to allow people to die on the curbs of hospitals after you refuse to treat them for lack of insurance.

We have a de-facto nationalized health care system now, and it is breaking down as we speak.

But hey, there's a free market solution to everything, right?

Pfft.

I am not sure what you are saying. I don't go to the doctor at all because I do not have insurance. i am not putting any cost on anyone. All I can do is pray that I do not get sick or need medical attention until I graduate and get a good job with benefits. But I don't expect people who don't care about others to really care about my situation.

[DetroitGurl]

I am not sure what you are saying. I don't go to the doctor at all because I do not have insurance. i am not putting any cost on anyone. All I can do is pray that I do not get sick or need medical attention until I graduate and get a good job with benefits. But I don't expect people who don't care about others to really care about my situation.

i do care about that, and you.....without even knowing you. i fear that same situation that you are in now. my insurance is "good" my husbands was better. we lost my husbands, and if something happens to mine......wow, i do not know what we will do. not many places pay insurance......its very scary. and we are a upper middle class family, in 37 he is 39. with our first child on the way.

[101A]

From what I am given to understand "liberals" tend to be better educated overall than "conservatives".

This would tend to indicate the opposite.

You might venture to say it, but without actual data, I would venture to say you are simply guilty of little more than confirmation bias. :p:

My wifes a professor; we run in a VERY liberal, and VERY "educated" crowd.

Education does not equate to intelligence. The liberal posters on this board, yourself included, are better thinkers, and believe it or not, more open minded than the great majority of them. They sit around and talk amongst themselves over beer; it's really hilarious; solve all the worlds problems with nary a dissenting voice - if only we'd put their brilliant selves in charge. Yes, it is just as arrogant and elitist as you imagine it is.

Over a campfire earlier this year, they decided their ought to be a 100% tax on ALL income over 300K - and none of them could see ANY drawbacks to that.

[101A]

The problem you are going to have making this argument is that, almost invariably,

1) most conservatives in the US are horribly ignorant about what is going on in the rest of the world, getting their news almost exclusively from conservative US sources

2) most conservatives in the US are patently unable to admit that our country might make a mistake or do anything wrong. for them patriotism is defined by how loudly they can shout "USA is great", and not by actually thinking objectively about what is best for the nation.



Because you say so?

Source?

[VaSpursFan]

All the promises from both parties to cut my taxes and your taxes doesn't make sense to me. We're already running huge deficits (while fighting two wars). The last time I checked, paying off a debt costs more than paying off the bill right away. To my mind then, these tax cuts are really tax increases in the long run. As for stimulating the economy, if the huge deficits we currently have (and have had for most of BushCo) aren't stimulating the economy that much, how does a bigger deficit change that?

+1. you make an incredibly salient point. for the life of me, I cannot comprehend how people scream for tax cuts without the understanding that if you do not reduce expenses proportionally, you will run a deficit. at this point, taxes have to be raised to generate enough incremental revenue, if expenses do not increase, to chip away at our enormous deficit. while i don't want it to happen, i understand that that it's a necessary evil.

[Ocotillo]

+1. you make an incredibly salient point. for the life of me, I cannot comprehend how people scream for tax cuts without the understanding that if you do not reduce expenses proportionally, you will run a deficit. at this point, taxes have to be raised to generate enough incremental revenue, if expenses do not increase, to chip away at our enormous deficit. while i don't want it to happen, i understand that that it's a necessary evil.

I wonder if anyone has asked McCain if he plans to include the cost of the Iraq occupation in the budget? Bush has had it as an "off budget" item and it's a whopper. If McCain says he would include it in the budget, then specifically, what would he cut beyond "earmarks"?

Will he resort to saying if he cuts taxes, revenues will increase and wave it off with that?

[DetroitGurl]

well fine folks.....im out for the weekend......thank you for the great talk and debates today......i mean that.....

have a good one.

salwa~

[cool hand]

JOHN MCCAIN WANTS AMENSTY AND BIG OIL TAXES BREAKS.........Is that conservative?

[2centsworth]

I wonder if anyone has asked McCain if he plans to include the cost of the Iraq occupation in the budget? Bush has had it as an "off budget" item and it's a whopper. If McCain says he would include it in the budget, then specifically, what would he cut beyond "earmarks"?

Will he resort to saying if he cuts taxes, revenues will increase and wave it off with that?

Take a hard look at al the off balance sheet debts, iraq will be the least of your worries

[JoeChalupa]

My vote is a cold steel lock. Palin won't walk the talk.

[dg7md]

I am still an avid Obama supporter and so is everybody else I know, and the only way McCain is getting votes is stealing Obama's campaign (with the 'change').

[mavs>spurs2]

Bush will go down in history as the worst president ever. The idiots are the one's somehow defy all logic and vote for McCain after this 8 year fiasco.

[td4mvp21]

Bush will go down in history as the worst president ever. The idiots are the one's somehow defy all logic and vote for McCain after this 8 year fiasco.

:lol

[Mr. Peabody]

Over a campfire earlier this year, they decided their ought to be a 100% tax on ALL income over 300K - and none of them could see ANY drawbacks to that.

:lol
Nice.
:lol

Sounds like some of the guys I hung out with in college.

[Mr. Peabody]

I would venture to say that the average conservative's IQ is higher than the average liberals.

http://img.skitch.com/20080904-erkhr34h17bd18txha26dicfpk.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/40/103508691_af17c27a83.jpg?v=0
:lmao

[jack sommerset]

Votes for O'Bama in Texas is a waste of time. Just like a vote for McCain in New York is a waste. Very sad. Every vote does not count.

[mavs>spurs2]

:lol

there's nothing funny about the general stupidity of the american public

[tomtom]

http://ccinsider.comedycentral.com/cc_insider/2008/09/jon-stewart-ann.html

refute this bitches!

[td4mvp21]

there's nothing funny about the general stupidity of the american public

Dude I agreed with your original post, the delivery was just funny.