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DarrinS
09-10-2008, 10:31 AM
From the Financial Times

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bfdd387c-7d3d-11dd-8d59-000077b07658.html?nclick_check=1




By Clive Crook

Published: September 8 2008 03:00 | Last updated: September 8 2008 03:00

This article is not the first to note the cultural contradiction in American liberalism, but just now the point bears restating. The election may turn on it.

Democrats speak up for the less prosperous; they have well-intentioned policies to help them; they are disturbed by inequality, and want to do something about it. Their concern is real and admirable. The trouble is, they lack respect for the objects of their solicitude. Their sympathy comes mixed with disdain, and even contempt.

Democrats regard their policies as self-evidently in the interests of the US working and middle classes. Yet those wide segments of US society keep helping to elect Republican presidents. How is one to account for this? Are those people idiots? Frankly, yes - or so many liberals are driven to conclude. Either that or bigots, clinging to guns, God and white supremacy; or else pathetic dupes, ever at the disposal of Republican strategists. If they only had the brains to vote in their interests, Democrats think, the party would never be out of power. But again and again, the Republicans tell their lies, and those stupid damned voters buy it.

It is an attitude that a good part of the US media share. The country has conservative media (Fox News, talk radio) as well as liberal media (most of the rest). Curiously, whereas the conservative media know they are conservative, much of the liberal media believe themselves to be neutral.

Their constant support for Democratic views has nothing to do with bias, in their minds, but reflects the fact that Democrats just happen to be right about everything. The result is the same: for much of the media, the fact that Republicans keep winning can only be due to the backwardness of much of the country.

Because it was so unexpected, Sarah Palin's nomination for the vice-presidency jolted these attitudes to the surface. Ms Palin is a small-town American. It is said that she has only recently acquired a passport. Her husband is a fisherman and production worker. She represents a great slice of the country that the Democrats say they care about - yet her selection induced an apoplectic fit.

For days, the derision poured down from Democratic party talking heads and much of the media too. The idea that "this woman" might be vice-president or even president was literally incomprehensible. The popular liberal comedian Bill Maher, whose act is an endless sneer at the Republican party, noted that John McCain's case for the presidency was that only he was capable of standing between the US and its enemies, but that should he die he had chosen "this stewardess" to take over. This joke was not - or not only - a complaint about lack of experience. It was also an expression of class disgust. I give Mr Maher credit for daring to say what many Democrats would only insinuate.

Little was known about Ms Palin, but it sufficed for her nomination to be regarded as a kind of insult. Even after her triumph at the Republican convention in St Paul last week, the put-downs continued. Yes, the delivery was all right, but the speech was written by somebody else - as though that is unusual, as though the speechwriter is not the junior partner in the preparation of a speech, and as though just anybody could have raised the roof with that text. Voters in small towns and suburbs, forever mocked and condescended to by metropolitan liberals, are attuned to this disdain. Every four years, many take their revenge.

The irony in 2008 is that the Democratic candidate, despite Republican claims to the contrary, is not an elitist. Barack Obama is an intellectual, but he remembers his history. He can and does connect with ordinary people. His courteous reaction to the Palin nomination was telling. Mrs Palin (and others) found it irresistible to skewer him in St Paul for "saying one thing about [working Americans] in Scranton, and another in San Francisco". Mr Obama made a bad mistake when he talked about clinging to God and guns, but I am inclined to make allowances: he was speaking to his own political tribe in the native idiom.

The problem in my view is less Mr Obama and more the attitudes of the claque of official and unofficial supporters that surrounds him. The prevailing liberal mindset is what makes the criticisms of Mr Obama's distance from working Americans stick.

If only the Democrats could contain their sense of entitlement to govern in a rational world, and their consequent distaste for wide swathes of the US electorate, they might gain the unshakeable grip on power they feel they deserve. Winning elections would certainly be easier - and Republicans would have to address themselves more seriously to economic insecurity. But the fathomless cultural complacency of the metropolitan liberal rules this out.

The attitude that expressed itself in response to the Palin nomination is the best weapon in the Republican armoury. Rely on the Democrats to keep it primed. You just have to laugh.

The Palin nomination could still misfire for Mr McCain, but the liberal reaction has made it a huge success so far. To avoid endlessly repeating this mistake, Democrats need to learn some respect.

It will be hard. They will have to develop some regard for the values that the middle of the country expresses when it votes Republican. Religion. Unembarrassed flag-waving patriotism. Freedom to succeed or fail through one's own efforts. Refusal to be pitied, bossed around or talked down to. And all those other laughable redneck notions that made the United States what it is.

DarkReign
09-10-2008, 10:49 AM
If the Democratic party and its hangers'-on were more like Obama in approach and demeanor, they would win much, much more often.

But theyre not. Theyre a house divided trying to run the country. Republicans, in contrast, at least give the impression (even if they arent) that they are united. And for good reason, that goes a long way at election time, whether it be local thru national.

What also doesnt help their cause are the talking heads on television. I dont expect anyone to remember, but I made a comment a week ago about being "above the bullshit".

The media may not have the proper respect for the office and the run-up to it, internet forums certainly have zero respect for the campaign season, but they arent running for the office. They will not be the single-most powerful individual in the world.

The candidates (especially) and their parties (certainly) should use a higher degree of levity and grace in context of political elections. Especially for POTUS.

IMO, both candidates have shown the proper regard (as is expected), but the campaign committees are questionable at best. Its a shit-smearing contest, whichever monkey has less fecal matter and a better smell at the end of the "race" wins.

I find the entire process so entirely revolting, I havent paid much attention beyond this forum, the RNC and the DNC. I watched Palin, McCain, Biden and Obama's speeches. I'll watch the debates in the entirety. After those, I'll then pay attention almost daily.

I dont want my opinion influenced by loose-lipped political-leaning media morons who have agendas and sponsorships to worry about to cloud my judgement. I wish most people would do the same, or at least try to limit their exposure to this crap.

Because this entire process is like parental supervision. Dont blame the media for being biased or degrading, change the fucking channel, nitwit. Some personal responsibility and especially personal restraint are needed, IMO. Approach the election with an open-mind and choose the candidate you feel best represents your convictions.

Most people are lemmings to one side or the other, so its of no surprise most people already have their minds made up because, much like sports teams, they associate their chosen party as "we" and "us" and if So-And-So is elected, "we" win.

Its the human condition to want to be apart of something greater than yourself, and I understand that. But choose the hill you die on wisely, is my point. Regardless of who is telling you to do so.

Findog
09-10-2008, 10:52 AM
"Democrats look down on working-class people" is a dumb and tired cliche. Like George W. Bush and John McCain know anything about the common man?

If you're middle class or below and you vote GOP, you are voting against your own economic self-interest. The GOP and their supporters have a severe persecution and inferiority complex.

101A
09-10-2008, 10:59 AM
If you're middle class or below and you vote GOP, you are voting against your own economic self-interest.


Unless you are like me. I used to be in that class; but am no longer. Had Democrats been in power, and had their way, I believe I never would have made the (significant) move upward I have made.

boutons_
09-10-2008, 11:07 AM
"I never would have made the (significant) move upward I have made."

job and economy growth have both done better under Dems than Repugs, for 60 years.

what would have blocked you under Dems?

Since dubya took office, the lower 95% have stood still or lost ground, and that's accelerating and will do for the forseeable future. "trickle down" didn't work in the 80s under Reagan and it hasn't worked under dubya. People are fucking stupid.

fyatuk
09-10-2008, 11:08 AM
If you're middle class or below and you vote GOP, you are voting against your own economic self-interest.

That's pure bullshit. Raising the minimum wage HURTS my economic situation. Requiring me to either pay a penalty or carry health insurance hurts me. Raising payroll taxes instead of fixing SS hurts me. Continuing to grant unions way too much power hurts me indirectly. Raising taxes on corporations hurts me indirectly. Protectionist taxes (as some Dems have suggested lately) hurts me by reducing competition and raising prices.

I am in the very lower end of middle class, and the GOP is certainly in MY economic best interest.

Voting Democratic is in the best interest of the very poor, or the union workers and that's about it.

Anti.Hero
09-10-2008, 11:12 AM
I think the BIG problem is how we buy into all this worthless bullshit from both sides that has absolutely nothing to do with the fucking problems that are about to PWN us.

Why the hell can't we get someone to come in and say NO WAY can you increase capital gains tax when you need to be increasing the # of people who invest, but at the same time we MUST get the government to quit bailing out these fools. The world has absolutely NO faith in America's investment structure right now. It is downright scary how much shit the government has piled onto this collapse.

There is no real heavy discussion about imperative topics, we just occupy ourselves with this stupid party bullshit.

You can't really have discussion, when most peoples knee-jerk reaction is to defend their party.

JoeChalupa
09-10-2008, 11:16 AM
If the Democratic party and its hangers'-on were more like Obama in approach and demeanor, they would win much, much more often.

But theyre not. Theyre a house divided trying to run the country. Republicans, in contrast, at least give the impression (even if they arent) that they are united. And for good reason, that goes a long way at election time, whether it be local thru national.

What also doesnt help their cause are the talking heads on television. I dont expect anyone to remember, but I made a comment a week ago about being "above the bullshit".

The media may not have the proper respect for the office and the run-up to it, internet forums certainly have zero respect for the campaign season, but they arent running for the office. They will not be the single-most powerful individual in the world.

The candidates (especially) and their parties (certainly) should use a higher degree of levity and grace in context of political elections. Especially for POTUS.

IMO, both candidates have shown the proper regard (as is expected), but the campaign committees are questionable at best. Its a shit-smearing contest, whichever monkey has less fecal matter and a better smell at the end of the "race" wins.

I find the entire process so entirely revolting, I havent paid much attention beyond this forum, the RNC and the DNC. I watched Palin, McCain, Biden and Obama's speeches. I'll watch the debates in the entirety. After those, I'll then pay attention almost daily.

I dont want my opinion influenced by loose-lipped political-leaning media morons who have agendas and sponsorships to worry about to cloud my judgement. I wish most people would do the same, or at least try to limit their exposure to this crap.

Because this entire process is like parental supervision. Dont blame the media for being biased or degrading, change the fucking channel, nitwit. Some personal responsibility and especially personal restraint are needed, IMO. Approach the election with an open-mind and choose the candidate you feel best represents your convictions.

Most people are lemmings to one side or the other, so its of no surprise most people already have their minds made up because, much like sports teams, they associate their chosen party as "we" and "us" and if So-And-So is elected, "we" win.

Its the human condition to want to be apart of something greater than yourself, and I understand that. But choose the hill you die on wisely, is my point. Regardless of who is telling you to do so.

I concur. I may be a liberal democrat but I'm no left wing nut. I actually run a very conservative household but have an open mind as well.
I've been saying it for years that the Democratic party of JFK needs to return and Obama has given us that hope once again.
The time is NOW!!

101A
09-10-2008, 11:18 AM
On the same theme as the orginal post: Paglia Telling it Like it Is (http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/09/10/palin/index3.html)

101A
09-10-2008, 11:19 AM
Since dubya took office, the lower 95% have stood still or lost ground,

Link.

101A
09-10-2008, 11:20 AM
job and economy growth have both done better under Dems than Repugs, for 60 years.


Link.

And remember, the Republicans controlled Congress for most of Clinton's tenure.

DarrinS
09-10-2008, 11:21 AM
I've been saying it for years that the Democratic party of JFK needs to return and Obama has given us that hope once again.
The time is NOW!!



JFK was more conservative than Obama or McCain.


His displomacy with regard to Castro/Krustev was "Get those missles the fuck out of Cuba and get them out NOW!" He didn't want to snuggle with them and sing kumbaya.

He was a military hawk.

He was for reducing personal income tax and corporate taxes.

He ran a frugal govt.


JFK would be loathed by today's Democratic party.

101A
09-10-2008, 11:47 AM
JFK was more conservative than Obama or McCain.


His displomacy with regard to Castro/Krustev was "Get those missles the fuck out of Cuba and get them out NOW!" He didn't want to snuggle with them and sing kumbaya.

He was a military hawk.

He was for reducing personal income tax and corporate taxes.

He ran a frugal govt.


JFK would be loathed by today's Democratic party.

No shit. Kennedy cut the top marginal rate by nearly 1/2! Obama is trying to inch it back up to that level.

JoeChalupa
09-10-2008, 12:02 PM
JFK was more conservative than Obama or McCain.


His displomacy with regard to Castro/Krustev was "Get those missles the fuck out of Cuba and get them out NOW!" He didn't want to snuggle with them and sing kumbaya.

He was a military hawk.

He was for reducing personal income tax and corporate taxes.

He ran a frugal govt.


JFK would be loathed by today's Democratic party.

Not by MY Democratic party which is the point I was making.

Viva Las Espuelas
09-10-2008, 12:08 PM
Not by MY Democratic party which is the point I was making.
???

possessed
09-10-2008, 04:29 PM
Not by MY Democratic party which is the point I was making.

Zell Miller posts here!

Will you challenge boutons to a duel? :makemyday