Mike Miller to Lakers---the party's over!

[lotr1trekkie]

If the Grzz pull the trigger on a deal of Lamar Odom for Mike Miller the Lakers will be unbelieveable. I don't want to think about it.

[sook]

the grizzlies won't make another trade with the lakers...rofl

[timvp]

a) What trade are you talking about?

b) Mike Miller is on Minnesota.

c) That trade would make it easier for the Spurs to guard the Lakers.

[peacemaker885]

BS title just to get attention. McCain fever...

[1Parker1]

:lol This would actually make it easier for the Spurs to defend the Lakers. 3 point defense is a Popovich specialty. And that's basically all Mike Miller does. :)

[Flux451]

i hate Mccain

[Tully365]

Rip Van Winkle thread.

I hope Milwaukee doesn't trade Lew Alcindor!

[Allanon]

The Mike Miller + Jason Collins to the Lakers for Odom rumor is quite popular right now. I'm sure there is some truth in it. It works out in many ways and is good for both the Lakers and Minnesota.

Lakers get a gritty/tough small forward & Minnesota clears cap space. If the trade does happen, the Lakers will get alot tougher and be able to give Paul Pierce some bruises if they meet in the Finals again.

I don't like it though since I like Odom but aside from that:
1) He's the kinder/gentler locker room voice to offset Kobe
2) He's versatile as hell
3) Matchup problems galore when you try to guard Odom

The only bad thing about Odom is his price. He's not "the man" and doesn't want to be "the man" but he's getting paid almost as well as "the man". Give him $8-$10 million and Lakers should re-sign him and keep the core intact.

[DPG21920]

a) What trade are you talking about?

b) Mike Miller is on Minnesota.

c) That trade would make it easier for the Spurs to guard the Lakers.

a) Yes

b) Yes, where have these people been, he was included in the Love/OJ Mayo deal

c) Please do this trade

[Heath Ledger]

shit i missed the bus when was MM traded to minnesota?

[DPG21920]

On draft day

[Solid D]

http://badpussy.org/uploads/files/6n1jtdx5n40tbre8vrr2.jpg

Why would you ever want to post a sig like this, with or without Bynum, when the conference the Lakers play in has so many 50-win teams in it?

[timvp]

Lakers get a gritty/tough small forward & Minnesota clears cap space. If the trade does happen, the Lakers will get alot tougher and be able to give Paul Pierce some bruises if they meet in the Finals again.
Huh?

Since when is Mike Miller gritty or tough? Give Paul Pierce bruises? Are you thinking of the right Mike Miller?

[Allanon]

http://badpussy.org/uploads/files/6n1jtdx5n40tbre8vrr2.jpg

Why would you ever want to post a sig like this, with or without Bynum, when the conference the Lakers play in has so many 50-win teams in it?

Putting my sig where my mouth is. I'm hoping for a 70 win season. I know, I know call me crazy.

[Brutalis]

Hopefully they do it. Will be easier to beat the Lakers this year if so :tu

[Allanon]

Huh?

Since when is Mike Miller gritty or tough? Give Paul Pierce bruises? Are you thinking of the right Mike Miller?

He's one of the tougher dudes in the NBA. He's always been known as a gritty/tough guy on the court. You think Mike Miller is soft?

[DPG21920]

Huh?

Since when is Mike Miller gritty or tough? Give Paul Pierce bruises? Are you thinking of the right Mike Miller?

He thought he was Mike Tyson! Mike is tough and gritty, but not the tough and gritty to shut down or bother Pierce. I love MM, but his effort on defense far outweighs his abilities.

[DPG21920]

Putting my sig where my mouth is. I'm hoping for a 70 win season. I know, I know call me crazy.

You are crazy! So, I want you to state that the Lakers will win 70 games so that we can have it on record. That way we can bump this thread and see how close you were.

[Tully365]

The Mike Miller + Jason Collins to the Lakers for Odom rumor is quite popular right now. I'm sure there is some truth in it. It works out in many ways and is good for both the Lakers and Minnesota.

Lakers get a gritty/tough small forward & Minnesota clears cap space. If the trade does happen, the Lakers will get alot tougher and be able to give Paul Pierce some bruises if they meet in the Finals again.

I don't like it though since I like Odom but aside from that:
1) He's the kinder/gentler locker room voice to offset Kobe
2) He's versatile as hell
3) Matchup problems galore when you try to guard Odom

The only bad thing about Odom is his price. He's not "the man" and doesn't want to be "the man" but he's getting paid almost as well as "the man". Give him $8-$10 million and Lakers should re-sign him and keep the core intact.

I agree with your views on Odom. But Miller makes a lot of money too. Odom won't lead a team to the title as the #1 option, but if he's your #4 option, I'd say your team is in damned good shape. I wouldn't risk messing with the chemistry.... If L.A. doesn't feel confident going into this season with a healthy Bynum joining Kobe, Gasol, and Odom, they need to consult with some mental health experts, not make any more trades. I'd take Odom on the Spurs in a heartbeat.

[Medvedenko]

If this trade goes down I'll be a happy laker fan.
Dfish
Kobe
Miller
Pau
Bynum

Yes, having Odom is great, however in the SF role he needs a consistent J which he doesn't. Slashing to the rim and posting up is his strong suit and we have that with Kobe, Pau and Bynum. Also, at the price, given the lakers need to extend Bynum, it's a no brainer. You have a beautiful outside weapon when Kobe creates and put Sasha with Kobe and Miller and it's lights out.

[Biernutz]

The Lakers Suck--Now to Miller--the Griz are stupid and will take any deal that doesn't make sense!

[xtremesteven33]

If its true i hope it happens. Miller is no where near as good as Odom is.

[tav1]

This probably indicates that Bynum is healthy and looks good. Mike Miller to the Lakers doesn't improve the team any, unless they see Bynum taking a huge step and want to create offensive space for him. Even then, the trade is a wash from a Spurs perspective.

Why would the T-Wolves want Odom? Help me.

[Solid D]

With Kobe deciding to forego surgery, the Lakers could use an extra scorer to keep them in games.

[Allanon]

He thought he was Mike Tyson! Mike is tough and gritty, but not the tough and gritty to shut down or bother Pierce. I love MM, but his effort on defense far outweighs his abilities.

Nah, I don't think Mike's going to shut down Paul Pierce, by bruises I mean he has no problem with giving PP a good hard foul whereas you'd be pressed to find a Laker player willing to give a hard foul.

[Allanon]

Why would the T-Wolves want Odom? Help me.

For the cap space. Odom gets $14 million this year then he's off the books.

[Medvedenko]

Spur fans who say this is a lateral move don't understand team balance. It's ok....if this move does happen, the lakers are way better for it. If they keep Odom, than I'll guess we'll see as well. However, for a balanced team with proper spacing this makes way more sense than shoving Odom at the 3.

[HarlemHeat37]

this trade would be horrible for the rest of the West..

Odom is extremely overrated..he did absolutely nothing against us last year on isolation plays..he couldn't even beat Fab most of the time..most of his offense comes from Kobe and even Gasol, and he has no jump shot..

Miller can create his own shot AND he's one of the better 3-point shooters in the NBA, which is something the Lakers will lack in their starting lineup..

hopefully Odom stays in LA..

[timvp]

He's one of the tougher dudes in the NBA.Negative.


He's always been known as a gritty/tough guy on the court. You think Mike Miller is soft?He's not soft but he's far from the enforcer you make him out to be. He's a jumpshooter who doesn't play much defense. He'll drive to the basket and take contact sometimes but those trips are few and far between.

I'm not sure what toughness you are talking about from a guy who doesn't play D, doesn't get to the free throw line and doesn't foul. What aspect of the game does he show toughness in? I'm not saying he's a bad player (I'd actually really like him on the Spurs) but toughness doesn't have anything to do with what makes him good.

[DPG21920]

For the cap space. Odom gets $14 million this year then he's off the books.

They probably want him because he is better than Mike. He would also add some size to the roster with a line up of Love, Al and Odom that would be a nice athletic and skilled front line. Plus as mentioned, it would give them cap flexibility for the next two years, although next years cap space in not as important as 2010.

The only way Mike is better than Odom is at shooting, which might help the Lakers at the 3 spot, but I hope to God this trade happens. One because imo, it makes the Lakers much easier to deal with and two, I like the Wolves as well.

[Medvedenko]

I've done more research and this is just pure speculation and not even a rumor really. Deep down I believe the lakers will try playing with Odom at the 3.

[remingtonbo2001]

For the cap space. Odom gets $14 million this year then he's off the books.

Won't LA need cap space to extend Bynum's contract?

This rumor has more holes in it than a block of swiss cheese.

[The Truth #6]

Sasha and Miller on the same team would be a lot of metrosexuality to contend with.

[Medvedenko]

Sasha and Miller on the same team would be a lot of metrosexuality to contend with.


You're definitely right about that one....too many hair braids for one team to contend with.

[Sissiborgo]

I mean no Odom fits better in the L.A i think because then we got 2 shooters and kobe shoots much and miller wont be getting as much shots as he used to get in Memphis.....

[xtremesteven33]

Phil is too smart to make this kind of trade.

it wont happen

[ulosturedge]

lol please make this trade happen.

[bostonguy]

The Mike Miller + Jason Collins to the Lakers for Odom rumor is quite popular right now. I'm sure there is some truth in it. It works out in many ways and is good for both the Lakers and Minnesota.

Lakers get a gritty/tough small forward & Minnesota clears cap space. If the trade does happen, the Lakers will get alot tougher and be able to give Paul Pierce some bruises if they meet in the Finals again.

I don't like it though since I like Odom but aside from that:
1) He's the kinder/gentler locker room voice to offset Kobe
2) He's versatile as hell
3) Matchup problems galore when you try to guard Odom

The only bad thing about Odom is his price. He's not "the man" and doesn't want to be "the man" but he's getting paid almost as well as "the man". Give him $8-$10 million and Lakers should re-sign him and keep the core intact.

:lmao:lmao:lmao Kobe Bryant couldnt guard Paul Pierce by any means in the finals so how does Miller stand much of a chance than the Lakers best perimeter defender? Miller will be racking up fouls rather quickly if Pierce gets him one on one! :toast

[Allanon]

He's not soft but he's far from the enforcer you make him out to be. He's a jumpshooter who doesn't play much defense. He'll drive to the basket and take contact sometimes but those trips are few and far between.

I'm not sure what toughness you are talking about from a guy who doesn't play D, doesn't get to the free throw line and doesn't foul. What aspect of the game does he show toughness in? I'm not saying he's a bad player (I'd actually really like him on the Spurs) but toughness doesn't have anything to do with what makes him good.

When Mike Miller fouls you, you'll get a bruise.


He thought he was Mike Tyson! Mike is tough and gritty, but not the tough and gritty to shut down or bother Pierce. I love MM, but his effort on defense far outweighs his abilities.

Looking through the league, you won't see many more shooting guards tougher than Mike Miller. What other shooting guards out there would give a good hard foul almost every time? Raja Bell, Matt Harpring are the 2 guys that come readily to mind other than Mike Miller.

[Allanon]

:lmao:lmao:lmao Kobe Bryant couldnt guard Paul Pierce by any means in the finals so how does Miller stand much of a chance than the Lakers best perimeter defender? Miller will be racking up fouls rather quickly if Pierce gets him one on one! :toast

That is the point exactly. :lol

Miller ain't stopping Paul Pierce but Paul Pierce will surely remember each and every one of those fouls. With the bigger Lakers this year, the tables will be turned this year with the Celtics being the undersized team.

[DPG21920]

When Mike Miller fouls you, you'll get a bruise.



Looking through the league, you won't see many more shooting guards tougher than Mike Miller. What other shooting guards out there would give a good hard foul almost every time? Raja Bell, Matt Harpring are the 2 guys that come readily to mind other than Mike Miller.

Why do you keep quoting me, I said he was tough, that is even in the parts you highlighted.

[Allanon]

Why do you keep quoting me, I said he was tough, that is even in the parts you highlighted.

Ah, because timvp asked why I thought he was tough, just showin' it's not just me that thinks so.

[DPG21920]

But he is tough because the way he plays, not because he takes hard fouls. I have never seen him be the enforcer you make him out to be. He is tough because he always stays in the game and competes and is not afraid to go to the rim or to guard players.

[xtremesteven33]

What other shooting guards out there would give a good hard foul almost every time? Raja Bell, Matt Harpring are the 2 guys that come readily to mind other than Mike Miller.


Ginobili

[Allanon]

But he is tough because the way he plays, not because he takes hard fouls. I have never seen him be the enforcer you make him out to be. He is tough because he always stays in the game and competes and is not afraid to go to the rim or to guard players.

Yes, all those qualities make him tough, I agree. You've never seen Mike Miller take a hard foul on somebody?

[DPG21920]

Yes, all those qualities make him tough, I agree. You've never seen Mike Miller take a hard foul on somebody?

Not really. Maybe a few times, but I have seen Matt Bonner take some hard fouls. I think Mike's toughness is with regard to his mental strength and attitude. He won't back down ever, even if that means playing more physical than he would like to. He would take a hard foul if the coach or players asked him to. I guess you could say that some players would not do that.

[The Franchise]

This trade would actually be a small step back for the Lakers. The Lakers already have enough jumpshooters. Mike is a better shooter, but his defense is less than average. He may give you three more ppg than Odom, but he will give 10 back at the other end of the court.

[DPG21920]

Also, Mike is more of a small forward, I mean he is like 6'8. Nocioni is a guy I would classify as "hard". Mike is just tough.

[Allanon]

Not really. Maybe a few times, but I have seen Matt Bonner take some hard fouls. I think Mike's toughness is with regard to his mental strength and attitude. He won't back down ever, even if that means playing more physical than he would like to. He would take a hard foul if the coach or players asked him to. I guess you could say that some players would not do that.

Yes I agree, he's tough, you don't have to convince me, it's timvp that doesn't think so "Since when is Mike Miller gritty or tough?" :D

[angelbelow]

Do It Mitch!

[DPG21920]

This trade would actually be a small step back for the Lakers. The Lakers already have enough jumpshooters. Mike is a better shooter, but his defense is less than average. He may give you three more ppg than Odom, but he will give 10 back at the other end of the court.

I do not know, although Mike is not the best defender, it is not from the lack of effort. He really works his butt off on that end of the court for the most part. The Lakers will have a nice group of defenders at most positions so all they need is for people to put in the work and Mike would do that.

But I still hope this trade happens.

[The Franchise]

I do not know, although Mike is not the best defender, it is not from the lack of effort. He really works his butt off on that end of the court for the most part. The Lakers will have a nice group of defenders at most positions so all they need is for people to put in the work and Mike would do that.

But I still hope this trade happens.

Don't get me wrong. I'm a Mike Miller fan. Before getting Ron Artest I was hoping the Rockets could pull off some kind of trade to get him. But he would actually have been an upgrade for us. I just don't see how trading him for Odom would make the Lakers any better. A lot of Laker fans seem to undervalue his importance to the team, but I don't see Mike raising their level of play.

[DPG21920]

Don't get me wrong. I'm a Mike Miller fan. Before getting Ron Artest I was hoping the Rockets could pull off some kind of trade to get him. But he would actually have been an upgrade for us. I just don't see how trading him for Odom would make the Lakers any better. A lot of Laker fans seem to undervalue his importance to the team, but I don't see Mike raising their level of play.

I agree. I was just saying it would not be a step backwards defensively for the Lakers. Definitely a step backwards over-all.

[Gino]

Amazing that anything that originated on Hoopsworld.com could create so much buzz.

Its from Hoopsworld! Its not real!

[IronMexican]

Why is everyone so worked up about a trade that wont happen? I'd love it though.

[Spur-Addict]

I wish the Lakers would do something like this. Do this and you take away some size and length which would be fantastic.

[lefty]

He's one of the tougher dudes in the NBA. He's always been known as a gritty/tough guy on the court. You think Mike Miller is soft?

:lol

[timvp]

When Mike Miller fouls you, you'll get a bruise.Miller rarely fouls. He's one of the least fouling players in the NBA. And this so-called enforcer one flagrant foul in the last seven years. You'd think a guy who makes a habit of committing hard fouls would rack up more, no?


Looking through the league, you won't see many more shooting guards tougher than Mike Miller. What other shooting guards out there would give a good hard foul almost every time? Raja Bell, Matt Harpring are the 2 guys that come readily to mind other than Mike Miller.:lol @ comparing Miller to Harpring and Bell. I kinda now hope this trade goes through so I can bring up how you thought Miller was Bill Laimbeer reincarnate.

Oh and quoting DPG isn't exactly the best reference. He likes going against what timvp says and is on record as saying Bargnani is a stud in the making, Iguodala wasn't going to re-sign with the Sixers and the Spurs were in danger of losing Kurt Thomas.

[DPG21920]

Miller rarely fouls. He's one of the least fouling players in the NBA. And this so-called enforcer one flagrant foul in the last seven years. You'd think a guy who makes a habit of committing hard fouls would rack up more, no?

:lol @ comparing Miller to Harpring and Bell. I kinda now hope this trade goes through so I can bring up how you thought Miller was Bill Laimbeer reincarnate.

Oh and quoting DPG isn't exactly the best reference. He likes going against what timvp says and is on record as saying Bargnani is a stud in the mkaing, Iguodala wasn't going to re-sign with the Sixers and the Spurs were in danger of losing Kurt Thomas.

I was going with what you said foolish. I said Mike was not an enforcer.

Please post a link to where I said Bargnani was going to be a stud.

Many others saw the cap problems that signing AI might cause along with some other teams having cap space.

I never said I thought the Spurs were in real danger that KT was going to be gone, I said I did not like the fact he was an UFA and that he did not have to give the Spurs a chance to match if he did not want to.

Didn't you say the Ime Udoka would be the perfect replacement for Bowen, only to later say he would not be because: "things change"? And didn't you say that that Mahinmi has "a 50/50 chance" of sticking in this league or not? Hmmmm, I would think everyone only has those two options.

[timvp]

Please post a link to where I said Bargnani was going to be a stud.

Many others saw the cap problems that signing AI might cause along with some other teams having cap space.

I never said I thought the Spurs were in real danger that KT was going to be gone, I said I did not like the fact he was an UFA and that he did not have to give the Spurs a chance to match if he did not want to.I should have used an emoticon to show I was kidding.


Didn't you say the Ime Udoka would be the perfect replacement for Bowen, only to later say he would not be because: "things change"?For what the Spurs had to spend, Udoka was the perfect option last summer. He is about as good of a Bowen replacement as there can be in terms of defense first attitude and a reliance on corner three-pointers, but last year proved that Bowen is miles ahead of Udoka defensively. I've basically given up on the idea Bowen can be replaced by another defensive specialist. He'll need to be replaced by another type of player. The problem is his replacement will likely have to be an all-around talent ... and those types of players are both expensive and hard to come by.

Maybe Udoka can surprise this year and show more lateral quickness and an improved offensive game. I guess we'll see.


And didn't you say that that Mahinmi has "a 50/50 chance" of sticking in this league or not? Hmmmm, I would think everyone only has those two options.I don't understand what your beef is with that point. I give Mahinmi a 50% chance to stick. What is your percentage?

[DPG21920]

I should have used an emoticon to show I was kidding.

Ha, you are getting worse than AHF was to me when I first got here. That is why I changed my avatar to Tupac!



For what the Spurs had to spend, Udoka was the perfect option last summer. He is about as good of a Bowen replacement as there can be in terms of defense first attitude and a reliance on corner three-pointers, but last year proved that Bowen is miles ahead of Udoka defensively. I've basically given up on the idea Bowen can be replaced by another defensive specialist. He'll need to be replaced by another type of player. The problem is his replacement will likely have to be an all-around talent ... and those types of players are both expensive and hard to come by.

Maybe Udoka can surprise this year and show more lateral quickness and an improved offensive game. I guess we'll see.

I just do not see how people could look at Bruce, see how great of a defender he is/was and think that someone could really replace that, especially someone as old as Ime. I mean, I really like him and he will play a nice role, but not replace Bruce. I agree with your point about needing to have an all around player, because if you cannot get someone who defends just as well as Bruce, the strategy of having a player like him on the floor goes out the door. I guess we needed to define replace. If people meant that Ime would take his spot, than yes maybe. But if they thought he would be as valuable then no.


I don't understand what your beef is with that point. I give Mahinmi a 50% chance to stick. What is your percentage?

It was just one of those on the fence statements you gave when Bruno was grillin' ya. Everyone has those odds and it does not say anything. It is like saying when he takes a shot he will either miss it or make it. Just funny. Should have used a smilie to let you know I was kidding....But I don't use smilies because they are for girls.

[Pero]

Miller rarely fouls. He's one of the least fouling players in the NBA. And this so-called enforcer one flagrant foul in the last seven years. You'd think a guy who makes a habit of committing hard fouls would rack up more, no?

:lol @ comparing Miller to Harpring and Bell. I kinda now hope this trade goes through so I can bring up how you thought Miller was Bill Laimbeer reincarnate.

Oh and quoting DPG isn't exactly the best reference. He likes going against what timvp says and is on record as saying Bargnani is a stud in the making, Iguodala wasn't going to re-sign with the Sixers and the Spurs were in danger of losing Kurt Thomas.

Dude, did you post this or something very similar somewhere else too?!? I think I read it like twice before. Am I just having a serious dejavu right now? :lol

[bostonguy]

That is the point exactly. :lol

Miller ain't stopping Paul Pierce but Paul Pierce will surely remember each and every one of those fouls. With the bigger Lakers this year, the tables will be turned this year with the Celtics being the undersized team.

A "bigger" Lakers team means nothing if they cant play quality team defense. The Jazz had a size advantage over LA and that didnt really do all that much. Outside Bynum and perhaps Odom, the Lakers wont really have that big size advantage that you keep talking about. Gasol/Vlad are soft, Big Baby/Powe>>>Mihm/Powell. Bynum will be the only real advantage but if the Lakers D continues to be soft, he will be in foul trouble often and early with Pierce waltzing down the lane.

Giving hard fouls doesnt result in good defense.

[duncan228]

...But I don't use smilies because they are for girls.

:lol Hasn't helped me. :)

[timvp]

Ha, you are getting worse than AHF was to me when I first got here. That is why I changed my avatar to Tupac!At least I let that Bargnani topic die and I didn't bump the AI2 thread . . .


I just do not see how people could look at Bruce, see how great of a defender he is/was and think that someone could really replace that, especially someone as old as Ime. I mean, I really like him and he will play a nice role, but not replace Bruce. I agree with your point about needing to have an all around player, because if you cannot get someone who defends just as well as Bruce, the strategy of having a player like him on the floor goes out the door. I guess we needed to define replace. If people meant that Ime would take his spot, than yes maybe. But if they thought he would be as valuable then no. I don't think anyone thought he'd replace Bowen. But most thought he'd be able to provide 40-50% of his defense. It turns out Udoka can't defend the same type of players Bowen can, so it doesn't really work.

And age doesn't really have much to do with it. Udoka was younger when he got here than Bowen was.


It was just one of those on the fence statements you gave when Bruno was grillin' ya. Everyone has those odds and it does not say anything. It is like saying when he takes a shot he will either miss it or make it. Just funny. Should have used a smilie to let you know I was kidding....But I don't use smilies because they are for girls.Everyone has a 50% chance of making it? Really? TD didn't have a 50% chance to make it. Malik Hairston doesn't have a 50% chance of making it.

Saying someone has a 50% chance of making it isn't the same thing as saying someone will either not make or will make it.

[Big P]

I'm pretty sure this is coming from a Hoopsworld article, talking about which trades the articles author THINKS should happen..pretty sure thats where this "rumor" is coming from.

[Allanon]

A "bigger" Lakers team means nothing if they cant play quality team defense. The Jazz had a size advantage over LA and that didnt really do all that much. Outside Bynum and perhaps Odom, the Lakers wont really have that big size advantage that you keep talking about. Gasol/Vlad are soft, Big Baby/Powe>>>Mihm/Powell. Bynum will be the only real advantage but if the Lakers D continues to be soft, he will be in foul trouble often and early with Pierce waltzing down the lane.

Giving hard fouls doesnt result in good defense.

Lakers are an underrated defensive team because they play at a high tempo so there's alot of scoring regardless. Lakers were one of the best defensive teams last year in almost every stat category except ppg allowed but that's the result of the speed of the game. A more telling stat would be opponent fg% which the Lakers were something like top 5.

A bigger team will be much more effective than last year. Last year the Celtics totally abused the Lakers inside. You don't stop guys like Paul Pierce, but you can foul the hell out of them to slow them down.

This year, Perkins will have to deal with Bynum instead of Odom. No more PJ Brown. Who's gonna sub in for Perkins when he gets in foul trouble guarding Bynum...6'9 Glenn Davis?

Kobe gets the Allens instead of Posey.

Not having Posey and PJ Brown this year is gonna cost the Celtics their repeat.

Although I don't like a Mike Miller trade at least he'll bring some toughness to the Lakers if it does happen.

[lefty]

Lakers and Celtics won't go back to the Finals in 2009 anyway

[DPG21920]

At least I let that Bargnani topic die and I didn't bump the AI2 thread . . .

I don't think anyone thought he'd replace Bowen. But most thought he'd be able to provide 40-50% of his defense. It turns out Udoka can't defend the same type of players Bowen can, so it doesn't really work.

And age doesn't really have much to do with it. Udoka was younger when he got here than Bowen was.

Everyone has a 50% chance of making it? Really? TD didn't have a 50% chance to make it. Malik Hairston doesn't have a 50% chance of making it.

Saying someone has a 50% chance of making it isn't the same thing as saying someone will either not make or will make it.

You can't bump the Bargs thread because it needs some time and a lot of people thought signing Brand would cause some cap problems with AI. Many people thought that Udoka was a perfect replacement for Bowen, but I was referring to someone his age would have to improve their defense to match Bruce and people that age are generally set in their ways.

I get what you are saying about the 50/50, it was just funny to spin it.

[Allanon]

Lakers and Celtics won't go back to the Finals in 2009 anyway

It's good for everybody that the Celtics lost Posey & PJ Brown. It doesn't seem like the Celtics realized how much Posey meant to their team.

If your Spurs make it to the Finals vs Celtics, Manu wouldn't have to worry about Posey roughin' him up.

On the flip side, it sucks Posey went to the Hornets.

[DPG21920]

:lol Hasn't helped me. :)

Now that is funny!!!!!!!!!

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

:lol @ Mike Miller being tough and gritty. Is it his hair clips or hair band that makes him tough and gritty? :lmao

[The Truth #6]

If white players can't be gritty and tough, then what's left? Lazy and stylish? Slow and foreign?

[DPG21920]

Maybe Collins just ruined the deal????

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Golf-cart-bogey-ruins-Jason-Collins-score-el?urn=nba,107950

I was going to let this unusual news intentionally slip past my blog radar — you know, save new Minnesota center Jason Collins anymore embarrassment — but then I realized just how little was going on, and, more importantly, just how much my dad would enjoy it. So ... sorry, Jason — family first.

Per Jerry Zgoda of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune:

New Timberwolves center Jason Collins probably will miss training camp and the regular season's opening week after undergoing surgery in California on Monday to repair an elbow tendon.

Collins was injured in what a team spokesman called a "freak" golf-cart accident. He partially ruptured his triceps tendon after his golf cart skidded and tipped over.

And that's that. Collins is expected to miss eight weeks. Doh!

But here's what I want to know: Did Collins' twin brother, Utah Jazz center Jarron, actually feel Jason's pain at the time of the accident? Like, was Jarron chilling at home in California, sipping ice tea out on the porch, when all of a sudden a lightning bolt of pain shot through his arm?

And what about Brook and Robin Lopez? They're twins, they went to Stanford — did they feel anything?

So many questions, man. So. Many. Questions. We need a CSI: Minnesota.

[timvp]

Maybe Collins just ruined the deal????I don't think this deal is anywhere close to being done. And even if it were, Collins is strictly a salary filler. He could be retired for all the Lakers care.

[Allanon]

You are crazy! So, I want you to state that the Lakers will win 70 games so that we can have it on record. That way we can bump this thread and see how close you were.

Yes, barring any major extended injuries (Kobe or Bynum) I think the Lakers will win 70 games this year. If not 70, it will be pretty damn close ... 66+ range.

This Laker team is the most talented since the Showtime days...even more talented than the no-depth Kobe/Shaq days.

Lakers only lost 4 games in 2.5 months when Pau played after the trade. With Bynum + Ariza back to full health.......watch out 95/96 Bulls.

[DPG21920]

I don't think this deal is anywhere close to being done. And even if it were, Collins is strictly a salary filler. He could be retired for all the Lakers care.

It was a joke. Collins brothers could be the worst twins ever in basketball.

[sook]

believe it or not Lakers fans, Odumb isn't a bad player.

He gives you guys Key size and you don't need another jump shooter trust me.

All the defensive power house teams give the lakers problems so thats what they need to upgrade on.

[bostonguy]

Lakers are an underrated defensive team because they play at a high tempo so there's alot of scoring regardless. Lakers were one of the best defensive teams last year in almost every stat category except ppg allowed but that's the result of the speed of the game. A more telling stat would be opponent fg% which the Lakers were something like top 5.

A bigger team will be much more effective than last year. Last year the Celtics totally abused the Lakers inside. You don't stop guys like Paul Pierce, but you can foul the hell out of them to slow them down.

This year, Perkins will have to deal with Bynum instead of Odom. No more PJ Brown. Who's gonna sub in for Perkins when he gets in foul trouble guarding Bynum...6'9 Glenn Davis?

Kobe gets the Allens instead of Posey.

Not having Posey and PJ Brown this year is gonna cost the Celtics their repeat.

Although I don't like a Mike Miller trade at least he'll bring some toughness to the Lakers if it does happen.


For an unproven championship winning team, you sure do run your mouth like they are proven. You are scared of the Celts. You rooted for the Pistons to beat us this year because you knew the Celts were going to beat you. Now you are getting on your knees praying that Posey will be such a huge loss for the Celts. Giddens/Walker are capable of being productive role players and while that wont replace what Posey brought, it will be good enough to aim for a repeat.

Kobe hasnt proven he can lead the Lakers to a championship. The Lakers showed havent shown they can handle true adversity. Gasol is soft and Odom goes MIA when it matters most. Bynum needs to also prove he can stay healthy.

You really shouldnt be running your mouth like the Lakers have no worries or concerns. They still havent proven themselves as champions. Until this current core does that, you have no right to talk. You ought to be more respectful to your daddies. :toast

[Allanon]

For an unproven championship winning team, you sure do run your mouth like they are proven. You are scared of the Celts. You rooted for the Pistons to beat us this year because you knew the Celts were going to beat you. Now you are getting on your knees praying that Posey will be such a huge loss for the Celts. Giddens/Walker are capable of being productive role players and while that wont replace what Posey brought, it will be good enough to aim for a repeat.

You don't actually think the Celtics improved their team this year do you? Letting "Kobe-Stoppa" Posey walk was the best Christmas present the Celtics could have given the Lakers :D

I was afraid of the Celts last year this is true. But this year, I don't even think they're going to make it out of the East. So no, not worried about the green guys at all. They're a year older and a defensive stopper or two shorter.



Kobe hasnt proven he can lead the Lakers to a championship. The Lakers showed havent shown they can handle true adversity. Gasol is soft and Odom goes MIA when it matters most. Bynum needs to also prove he can stay healthy.
Bynum is all that is needed. Fans are going to be crying to trade up Perkins after Bynum is done with him.



You really shouldnt be running your mouth like the Lakers have no worries or concerns. They still havent proven themselves as champions. Until this current core does that, you have no right to talk. You ought to be more respectful to your daddies. :toast

The only thing the Lakers need to be worried about this year is health. I'll be really enjoying my Christmas dinner this year :whine

[urunobili]

please do this Kuptchak! and become early ejaculation chokers!

[thispego]

LOL. lakers fans are so stupid. you got gasol for nothing! any success your team has from last season on deserves an *. You. Got. Gasol. For. Nothing. stop acting like your amazed at how talented your team is... it's all a farce and a major slap in the face to the rest of the league.

[urunobili]

LOL. lakers fans are so stupid. you got gasol for nothing! any success your team has from last season on deserves an *. You. Got. Gasol. For. Nothing. stop acting like your amazed at how talented your team is... it's all a farce and a major slap in the face to the rest of the league.

Thanks... that made me feel better about the fact that Garnett has a ring now...

[thispego]

Thanks... that made me feel better about the fact that Garnett has a ring now...

does it really bother you that kg has a ring? it doesnt me at all. celtics built a legit title contender the old fashioned way and it worked out for them. I'm just glad the lakers' cheating ways werent rewarded with another championship.

[Allanon]

LOL. lakers fans are so stupid. you got gasol for nothing! any success your team has from last season on deserves an *. You. Got. Gasol. For. Nothing. stop acting like your amazed at how talented your team is... it's all a farce and a major slap in the face to the rest of the league.

I'm not amazed about the amont of talent, I'm amazed at how quick it was from the lottery 3 years ago...thank you Chris Wallace!

I think I can live with an asterik and a few rings :D

[thispego]

I think I can live with an asterik and a few rings :D

i'd rather revel in rings my team won fair and square than enjoy ill-gotten success

[Sean Cagney]

Odom is better IMO, alot harder to guard for the Spurs than Miller would be.

[thispego]

goddamn if only i had the power to ban on this shit. you'd all be fucking gone like dust in the wind.

[Banzai]

goddamn if only i had the power to ban on this shit. you'd all be fucking gone like dust in the wind. your avatar is funny.:rollin

[thispego]

Excuse me, can you tell me how to get to the medical school? I'm supposed to be giving a lecture in about twenty minutes and my driver's a bit lost.

You go straight ahead and you make a left over da bridge.

That's a lovely accent you have. New Jersey?

Austria.

hah Well then, g'day, mate. Let's throw another shrimp on the barbie.

Let's not.

[Allanon]

Excuse me, can you tell me how to get to the medical school? I'm supposed to be giving a lecture in about twenty minutes and my driver's a bit lost.

You go straight ahead and you make a left over da bridge.

That's a lovely accent you have. New Jersey?

Austria.

hah Well then, g'day, mate. Let's throw another shrimp on the barbie.

Let's not.

"Pardon me, do you have any Grey Poupon?"

One of the funniest movies ever for sure.

[T Park]

Miller is a worse choker and what not than Odom is.

Do that trade Lakers, please.

[bostonguy]

You don't actually think the Celtics improved their team this year do you? Letting "Kobe-Stoppa" Posey walk was the best Christmas present the Celtics could have given the Lakers :D

They will be improved within themselves. They have the experience and they know what it takes to get the job done. Getting rid of Paul "Laker Killer" Pierce would have been the best xmas gift for Lakers fans especially after the way he outplayed Kobe in the biggest stage of em all. The celts still have the boston three party, an improving pg in rondo and a solid bigman in Perkins. JR Giddens is going to be a nice wing player to have on the team this year. Celts management have done their job well finding the pieces to fit about Bostons big 3.


I was afraid of the Celts last year this is true. But this year, I don't even think they're going to make it out of the East. So no, not worried about the green guys at all. They're a year older and a defensive stopper or two shorter.

It's not that you dont think they are coming out of the east. It's that you hope they arent coming out of the east. You would prefer to play anyone else. Age wont be a factor for anyone other than possibly Ray Allen but he is more than good enough to be a 3rd option still. Lakers bench has 3 scrubs in Powell/Walton/Vlad, Sasha is okay but nothing special, Mihm is often injured, Farmar is inconsistent and Ariza is a good defensive player with no jumper. Keep Odom from going left and he is useless, Gasol is soft, Fisher isnt getting any younger which leaves you with Kobe/Bynum. Your team is good but it isnt that good.


Bynum is all that is needed. Fans are going to be crying to trade up Perkins after Bynum is done with him.
I can live with Bynum and Kobe getting their points while the Celts D locks down on everyone else. Go ahead and underestimate the Celtics though. You didnt think they were good enough this year either.


The only thing the Lakers need to be worried about this year is health. I'll be really enjoying my Christmas dinner this year :whine

Nah it is more than just health. This Lakers team hasn't handled adversity well when it's hit them.When this Lakers is able to overcome real adversity, come back and talk to me. When Kobe is able to lead his team during these moments, come back and talk to me.

I know the xmas day game is one you are salivating over. It is killing you inside that the Celtics are the team that prevented LA from winning the championship especially with that 39 point ass kicking they gave them to seal it. :whine

[Allanon]

They will be improved within themselves. They have the experience and they know what it takes to get the job done. Getting rid of Paul "Laker Killer" Pierce would have been the best xmas gift for Lakers fans especially after the way he outplayed Kobe in the biggest stage of em all. The celts still have the boston three party, an improving pg in rondo and a solid bigman in Perkins. JR Giddens is going to be a nice wing player to have on the team this year. Celts management have done their job well finding the pieces to fit about Bostons big 3.

Hahah, "they will be improved within themselves"...very original answer. Everybody knows the Celtics downgraded when they let Kobe Stoppa Posey walk away and lost the toughness of PJ Brown. The media even wrote some article about how the Celtics are no longer favored to repeat because of this boneheaded move.



It's not that you dont think they are coming out of the east. It's that you hope they arent coming out of the east. You would prefer to play anyone else. Age wont be a factor for anyone other than possibly Ray Allen but he is more than good enough to be a 3rd option still. Lakers bench has 3 scrubs in Powell/Walton/Vlad, Sasha is okay but nothing special, Mihm is often injured, Farmar is inconsistent and Ariza is a good defensive player with no jumper. Keep Odom from going left and he is useless, Gasol is soft, Fisher isnt getting any younger which leaves you with Kobe/Bynum. Your team is good but it isnt that good.

Actually I wish the Celtics would come out of the East because the Lakers could beat them easily now. I just don't think it's going to happen. Teams like the the Cavs and Sixers actually improved in the offseason while the Celtics FO patted themselves on the back and "improved within themselves".



I can live with Bynum and Kobe getting their points while the Celts D locks down on everyone else. Go ahead and underestimate the Celtics though. You didnt think they were good enough this year either.
Celtics can't live with Bynum and Kobe getting their points.



Nah it is more than just health. This Lakers team hasn't handled adversity well when it's hit them.When this Lakers is able to overcome real adversity, come back and talk to me. When Kobe is able to lead his team during these moments, come back and talk to me.

Adversity? I'm pretty sure it was the Celtics that didn't face adversity last year while the Lakers had more adversity than practically any team. Let's see, Lakers started 3 centers in the same season, Kobe required surgery on his pinky since All-Star, traded off 2 more guys for Ariza, then Trevor Ariza got lost for the season, traded for and integrated Pau in mid-season. I don't think much more adversity could have happened to 1 team.



I know the xmas day game is one you are salivating over. It is killing you inside that the Celtics are the team that prevented LA from winning the championship especially with that 39 point ass kicking they gave them to seal it. :whine

Nah, by Christmas time, there wouldn't be much left for the Lakers dominance to prove on the season. The Christmas Day game is not about revenge but rather it will be about enjoyment :whine

[bostonguy]

Hahah, "they will be improved within themselves"...very original answer. Everybody knows the Celtics downgraded when they let Kobe Stoppa Posey walk away and lost the toughness of PJ Brown.
Those 2 wont be why we wont be able to repeat. Go ahead and keep thinking that though. They will be much better at closing out series and not allowing them to go 7 games. They know what it takes to get the job done unlike that current Lakers team.


Actually I wish the Celtics would come out of the East because the Lakers could beat them easily now. I just don't think it's going to happen. Teams like the the Cavs and Sixers actually improved in the offseason while the Celtics FO patted themselves on the back.

It's not that you dont think it is going to happen. You hope it isnt going to happen. The Cavs put better role players around Lebron but that wont be enough. Again, the Celts will be better at closing out series this year. Sixers did improve but not enough to dethrone the defending champs. And :lmao at thinking the Lakers would have it easy vs the Celts.:lmao:lmao Laker fans hatred of the Celts is flat out comedy.



Celtics can't live with Bynum and Kobe getting their points.

Sure they can because those 2 will be working hard as hell to get their points while the Celts D locks everyone else down. 2 on 5 wont be enough to beat the Celts.



Adversity? I'm pretty sure it was the Celtics that didn't face adversity last year while the Lakers had more adversity than practically any team. Let's see, Lakers started 3 centers in the same season, Kobe required surgery on his pinky since All-Star, traded off 2 more guys for Ariza, then Trevor Ariza got lost for the season, traded for and integrated Pau in mid-season. I don't think much more adversity could have happened to 1 team.

Celts had 2 game 7's and faced a 10 point deficit on the road against the Pistons. Lakers swept the worst team in the postseason in Denver, beat Utah in an easy 6, and beat the spurs in 5 games. That wasnt much (if any) of playoff adversity. Then comes along the finals and they finally face tough times and the get exposed. Huge difference between regular season and playoff adversity. Celts have proven themselves in true playoff adversity while the Lakers have not.


Nah, by Christmas time, there wouldn't be much left for the Lakers dominance to prove on the season. The Christmas Day game is not about revenge but rather it will be about enjoyment :whine

The city of Los Angeles disagrees with you there. When I visited that city last month, I wore my Paul Pierce jersey all over downtown one day. Tons of Laker fans kept saying "xmas day you are going down" etc etc etc. They are salivating over that game and deep down inside you are too. You need any kind of early satisfaction to make yourself feel like you are superior to the Celts.


It is still bothering the hell out of you that this took place and this taste hasnt gone away.....

MvooIa-Fd_A&feature=related

:whine

[Allanon]

Those 2 wont be why we wont be able to repeat. Go ahead and keep thinking that though. They will be much better at closing out series and not allowing them to go 7 games. They know what it takes to get the job done unlike that current Lakers team.

Again, not just me that thinks this. The media and even Celtic fans are pissed that the Celtics let Posey walk, most people think the Celtics down-graded rather than "improved from within".



It's not that you dont think it is going to happen. You hope it isnt going to happen. The Cavs put better role players around Lebron but that wont be enough. Again, the Celts will be better at closing out series this year. Sixers did improve but not enough to dethrone the defending champs. And :lmao at thinking the Lakers would have it easy vs the Celts.:lmao:lmao Laker fans hatred of the Celts is flat out comedy.

No I hope it does happen, it'll be the easiest Finals since Philadelphia a few years ago. I'm more worried about LeBron.



Sure they can because those 2 will be working hard as hell to get their points while the Celts D locks everyone else down. 2 on 5 wont be enough to beat the Celts.
Bynum's gonna work hard getting points against Perkins? Kobe's going to have a hard time scoring on Tony Allen? Hahah, it's going to be like a kid in a candy store for Kobe and Bynum. Celtics have no answer for them this year.



Celts had 2 game 7's and faced a 10 point deficit on the road against the Pistons. Lakers swept the worst team in the postseason in Denver, beat Utah in an easy 6, and beat the spurs in 5 games. That wasnt much (if any) of playoff adversity. Then comes along the finals and they finally face tough times and the get exposed. Huge difference between regular season and playoff adversity. Celts have proven themselves in true playoff adversity while the Lakers have not.
The Lakers had an easy first round. Jazz were much tougher than anticipated and the Lakers came back from being majorly down on the Spurs...not quite Celtic adversity but enough if combined with their plagued season while the Celtics waltzed through the regular season.



The city of Los Angeles disagrees with you there. When I visited that city last month, I wore my Paul Pierce jersey all over downtown one day. Tons of Laker fans kept saying "xmas day you are going down" etc etc etc. They are salivating over that game and deep down inside you are too. You need any kind of early satisfaction to make yourself feel like you are superior to the Celts.

It's fun talking smack to Celtic fans. If I were to meet a Celtic fan at a bar, I'd tell him the same smack. Doesn't mean I'm afraid. I gave kudos to the Celtics for their win last year but this year. Posey stopped Kobe, Perkins, KG and PJ Brown beat the crap out of Pau and Odom. This year though, the Celtics lost alot of that toughness and don't stand a chance with Bynumite and Ariza returning.

[bostonguy]

It's fun talking smack.

We agreed on something

[Allanon]

We agreed on something

Indeed :whine

[bostonguy]

Hey, answer me this... and be honest. Who were you cheering for during that 21 year absence of the Celtics? Trust me, were hoping that we can meet again so we can send you on another 20 year vacation... just like last time:toast

Well that did improve your finals record vs Boston to 2-8 but it worsened to an overall 2-9 record this year.:toast

[bostonguy]

:lol No, serious, did you remain a die-hard Celtics fan or were you cheering for any team that played the Lakers. Its cool to admit it, I mean, Im a die-hard Raiders fan, but not recently:lol

Sadly I was born the year LA beat them in 87. I didnt start watching basketball until 1995 when the Celts got their asses kicked by the Magic. Your dawg Ricardo Fox was on the roster during the time.

I was also a proud witness to the Antoine Walker era during his time in Boston. :depressed:depressed

[bostonguy]

2002 was cloud 9 especially that huge come from behind 26 point victory in game 3 vs the Nets. Kenny Anderson and that fat pudge Rodney Rodgers to go with mister shimister Antoine "I die by the 3" Walker. Walkers motivating the team in 3rd quarter down by 26 was comedy!:lmao I was expecting some shimmer moves rather than seriousness. That was a sweet comeback and they nearly pulled another out of their ass but Pierce missed a game tying free throw.

[mrspurs]

a) What trade are you talking about?

b) Mike Miller is on Minnesota.

c) That trade would make it easier for the Spurs to guard the Lakers.

Alot easier

[ShoogarBear]

Sasha and Miller on the same team would be a lot of metrosexuality to contend with.

How can you forget the Pau-Meister?

[Lakers_55]

I really have to laugh at the fights going on in here. Being biased, I say it's only a matter of time before the Lakers pass the Celtics in championship totals. Look at NBA history, there are two teams that have proven they can rebuild effectively and consistently. One is the Lakers, the other is the Spurs. Once this Boston team is done, they will be out of the picture for a long time again.

[Brutalis]

Spurs retool more than they rebuild.

[lotr1trekkie]

Sorry, I posted that Miller was in Memphis. That being said the main idea was that it would be a great deal for LA. He was the type of addition I was hoping the Spurs could make in the offseason. He's clearly one of the top 3 point shooters in the league but has always played on awful teams.

[bostonguy]

I really have to laugh at the fights going on in here. Being biased, I say it's only a matter of time before the Lakers pass the Celtics in championship totals. Look at NBA history, there are two teams that have proven they can rebuild effectively and consistently. One is the Lakers, the other is the Spurs. Once this Boston team is done, they will be out of the picture for a long time again.

While they will deal with their dark days once Pierce/KG retire, you dont know that it will be over 20 years again before they get back into the thick of things again.

It's okay to be bitter that the Celtics ended your season and embarrassed them in the clincher. That is pissing you off deep down inside and it wont go away until next June at the earliest (assuming both teams get there and assuming the Lakers were to get the job done). You can speculate all you want about how the Lakers will do this season. Until they get the job done, this is the bitter taste you will have to deal with.:toast

[Lakers_55]

While they will deal with their dark days once Pierce/KG retire, you dont know that it will be over 20 years again before they get back into the thick of things again.

It's okay to be bitter that the Celtics ended your season and embarrassed them in the clincher. That is pissing you off deep down inside and it wont go away until next June at the earliest (assuming both teams get there and assuming the Lakers were to get the job done). You can speculate all you want about how the Lakers will do this season. Until they get the job done, this is the bitter taste you will have to deal with.:toast

I have no bitter taste, my team wasn't supposed to be there, yours was. You will jump off the Celtic Bandwagon when they fold this year. Everyone is gunning for them now.

I posted this before, I'll post it again. Back in 1988 Sports Illustrated ran a story after the Dodgers won the World Series how LA was doing great in all sports. Lakers were world champs, and USC was ranked number 1. All they could say was, enjoy it while it lasts, LA. Well, Lakers lost the finals the following year, Dodgers didn't even make the playoffs and USC faded quickly.

Regarding your signature, I'll say it enjoy it while it lasts. I say you don't win again with any of those sports, at least this year. The Laker franchise knows how to win, they consistently do it, they will be back. You won't.

[bostonguy]

I have no bitter taste, my team wasn't supposed to be there, yours was. You will jump off the Celtic Bandwagon when they fold this year. Everyone is gunning for them now.

I posted this before, I'll post it again. Back in 1988 Sports Illustrated ran a story after the Dodgers won the World Series how LA was doing great in all sports. Lakers were world champs, and USC was ranked number 1. All they could say was, enjoy it while it lasts, LA. Well, Lakers lost the finals the following year, Dodgers didn't even make the playoffs and USC faded quickly.

Regarding your signature, I'll say it enjoy it while it lasts. I say you don't win again with any of those sports, at least this year. The Laker franchise knows how to win, they consistently do it, they will be back. You won't.

I am behind this team win or lose. I was with them for 13 of the 21 year drought (Been a fan since 95) plus the Celtics bandwagon isnt nearly as big as the Lakers one. Of course good things will come to an end.

[spursreport]

There is the curse of Chick Hearn. The Lakers havent won since summer 2002 the same summer of his passing. Maybe his spirits arent allowing a championship since he wont be there in person to witness it?? It is just weird with that timing.

[The Truth #6]

How can you forget the Pau-Meister?

It was ignorance on my part.