Mexican Immigrant Marine denied Medal of Honor

[whottt]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/09/18/ST2008091803946.html

Marine Denied Medal of Honor
Sergeant Took Grenade's Blast in Fallujah, Was Lauded by Bush

Sgt. Rafael Peralta, 25, will be awarded a posthumous Navy Cross. (U.s. Marines Via Associated Press)


Who's Blogging» Links to this article
By Ann Scott Tyson
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, September 19, 2008; Page A16

According to the secretary of the Navy, Marine Sgt. Rafael Peralta gave his life to save his comrades in the Iraqi city of Fallujah in 2004, grabbing a hostile grenade, pulling it to his body and absorbing the brunt of the blast. President Bush later praised Peralta as a hero.


But a decision by Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates not to recommend him for the Medal of Honor, the nation's highest military honor, stirred an outcry yesterday by his family and Marines whose lives he saved.

Peralta instead will be posthumously awarded the second-highest award for valor in combat, the Navy Cross, the military announced Tuesday.

Peralta's family members said they could not understand the decision, which was delivered to Peralta's mother, Rosa, by a Marine general on Tuesday.

"She is really disappointed," Peralta's sister, Icela, said in a telephone interview from her home in San Diego. She said her mother has no plan to accept the Navy Cross from the military. "At this point, she doesn't want to receive that medal right now," she said.

A Marine Corps spokesman said medical evidence was conflicting as to whether he was capable of grabbing the grenade given a head wound he had suffered moments earlier.

Peralta, an immigrant from Mexico City who enlisted in the Marine Corps the day before receiving his green card, was serving with the 1st Battalion of the 3rd Marine Regiment during the U.S. military assault to retake Fallujah in November 2004.

After clearing scores of houses over three days, Peralta, 25, volunteered to join a squad that lacked all its men and stay on duty the night of Nov. 14, allowing his comrades to rest, according to an official military account.

The next day, while clearing another house, Peralta was caught in crossfire between insurgents and Marines, the account said. He was shot in the head and mortally wounded, probably by "friendly fire," the account stated. As the insurgents fled the building, they threw a fragmentation grenade, which landed near Peralta's head.

Then, "without hesitation and with complete disregard for his own safety, Peralta reached out and pulled the grenade to his body, absorbing the brunt of the blast, and shielding his fellow Marines only feet away," the account said.

In May 2005, Bush praised Peralta for giving "his life to save his fellow Marines" in the battle of Fallujah.

At least three other service members who died in the Iraq war covering grenades with their bodies in order to save others have received the Medal of Honor posthumously: Marine Cpl. Jason Dunham, who used his body and helmet to cover a grenade when his platoon was ambushed in April 2004; Navy Petty Officer Michael Monsoor, who in September 2006 threw himself on a grenade in Ramadi although he alone could have escaped; and Pvt. 1st Class Ross A. McGinnis, a machine gunner who pinned a grenade tossed into his Humvee in Baghdad in December 2006.


Although the military citation states that Peralta deliberately reached out and absorbed the grenade, medical evidence was unclear as to whether that was possible because of his mortal head wound, said Maj. David Nevers, a Marine Corps spokesman.


"There was conflicting evidence in this case as to whether he could have performed his final act given the nature of his injuries," Nevers said. "Some believe he did so; others say it is unlikely."

Given the rigorous and exacting criteria for the Medal of Honor, Nevers said, "there must be no doubt or margin for error."

Peralta's family said they suspect the Medal of Honor was not given because an investigation in 2005 found that the bullet fragment in Peralta's head probably came from friendly fire. The military, however, said the friendly fire finding had "no bearing on the decision to award the Navy Cross," a decision made by Navy Secretary Donald C. Winter.

"I don't feel that it's fair," Icela Peralta said, adding the family has been inundated by calls from Peralta's military comrades, including some who were in the house with Peralta.

"They feel they are being treated as liars," she said, "They are alive thanks to my brother, and all agree he should get the medal."

Staff researcher Julie Tate contributed to this report.

[whottt]

I saw a segment on this in the news...this guy got blasted in the head by an M-16 and the medical evidence said he was killed instantly, they said there was no way he could have been alive after getting shot in the head like that. They said he had to be dead. But every guy that was with him in the house said he reached out and pulled that grenade into his body before it exploded and that's the reason they were alive. They said they saw him do it and the Medical Examiners said it must have been a death twitch that accidentally caught the grenade.


Tis is ignorant...if the guys that are alive because he ate that grenade say he did it, that should be enough. Plus even if he did it in death he still saved their lives.

3 other guys that have done similar actions in Iraq have been given the CMOH.

[Quasar]

That's a real shame... this guy is a hero and should be treated as such!

[TDMVPDPOY]

wheres the black kid gif, thats racists.

[whottt]

wheres the black kid gif, thats racists.

http://spurstalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=7

[Anti.Hero]

Just give it to him. He died for the country ffs.


Stupid fucking politicians.

[whottt]

The lack of response to this thread is alarming. What the fuck is wrong with you people?



Tell you what Shasta and Mad...you guys give me your comments on what you think this man deserves(no politicized bullshit), just what sort of honor he himself deserves, and I will take you off ignore to see what you have to say about this.

[baseline bum]

Pulling in a grenade on a death twitch sounds like a pretty unrealistic explanation to me. That's two movements at least... one to stick your arm out, another to pull it back in to drag the grenade in. I don't see any way that could be involuntary.

[whottt]

Pulling in a grenade on a death twitch sounds like a pretty unrealistic explanation to me. That's two movements at least... one to stick your arm out, another to pull it back in to drag the grenade in. I don't see any way that could be involuntary.



Especially since they said the grenade landed by his head and it ended up under his body with him on top of it. That'd be one hell of a fortuitous death spasm.


I feel for this guy's mom...she's not bitter about her son dying, not even if it was because of friendly fire...she just wants to see him honored the way the men who were with him say he deserves to be honored. That's not asking for a lot for a guy who saved his fellow soldiers with what was probably his dying act. I hope pressure is being put on on the right people to get this done.


It's not like there's a double standard being asked for here...3 other guys in Iraq have been given a CMOH for the exact same action.

The military is notoriously difficult to pressure on this sort of thing though.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

I'll take the eyewitness Marines view over the ME. Hell, they fucked up the Tillman investigation, too.

[PixelPusher]

It's the Medal of Honor, not an induction into the Baseball Hall of Fame. Do they think it somehow dilutes the significance of the award to give it someone who's actions are clearly meritorious, just because a couple of medical examiners can't be sure he was conscious when he did it? Is there only a small ration of MOHs to give out?

[whottt]

Is there only a small ration of MOHs to give out?

They are extremely difficult to get...especially if you are still alive.

Only 4 or 5 of them have been given in the Iraq War so far IIRC...all of them to guys who died.

[anakha]

Do they think it somehow dilutes the significance of the award to give it someone who's actions are clearly meritorious, just because a couple of medical examiners can't be sure he was conscious when he did it?

This.

[whottt]

The lack of response to this thread is alarming. What the fuck is wrong with you people?



Tell you what Shasta and Mad...you guys give me your comments on what you think this man deserves(no politicized bullshit), just what sort of honor he himself deserves, and I will take you off ignore to see what you have to say about this.


Amzing the amount of good hearted libs so worried about the troops that couldn't be bothered with clicking on this thread.


That seemingly respond to every other post I make.


They care so much.

[whottt]

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (2 members and 0 guests)
whottt, Shastafarian


About fucking time you stupid fuckwad...I made sure to post that when you were responding to every post I was making...amazing how you managed to skip this one.


You're shit dude.

[Shastafarian]

Amzing the amount of good hearted libs so worried about the troops that couldn't be bothered with clicking on this thread.


That seemingly respond to every other post I make.


They care so much.

You're calling me out for not posting in a fucking internet thread? Why don't you go jerk off to yourself in the mirror some more. I read it and decided there was nothing to add. It's outrageous. What do you want me to say you piece of shit cuntrag?

[whottt]

You're calling me out for not posting in a fucking internet thread? Why don't you go jerk off to yourself in the mirror some more. I read it and decided there was nothing to add.

Nothing to add? Nothing to add? You think there is nothing to add?

And you consider yourself a liberal?




It's outrageous. What do you want me to say you piece of shit cuntrag?


Sure you clicked on it...that's why you've been whining non-stop about being on ignore.

[Shastafarian]

Nothing to add? Nothing to add? You think there is nothing to add?

And you consider yourself a liberal?


What would you like me to add?

[Shastafarian]

I didn't post in this thread either

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105816

Why didn't you cherry pick that one douchenozzle?

I can't even pick which threads I wanna reply to anymore...you're such a cock gobbler.

[ballhog]

How did this devolve into name-calling? Some dude died and didn't get the CMOH. Can't give it to everyone. I trust the guys making the calls on that one. Did anyone see 'Courage Under Fire'?

[Shastafarian]

How did this devolve into name-calling? Some dude died and didn't get the CMOH. Can't give it to everyone. I trust the guys making the calls on that one. Did anyone see 'Courage Under Fire'?

I'll edit all of my name calling if whottt agrees to as well. He started all this shit by calling me out and calling me a "stupid fuckwad".

[whottt]

How did this devolve into name-calling? Some dude died and didn't get the CMOH. Can't give it to everyone. I trust the guys making the calls on that one.

It's better to give it to someone who doesn't deserve it than it is to not give it to someone who does.

You don't seem to understand...no one is arguing whether or not he covered the grenade...they are argung about whether or not he was still alive when he did it. I don't think it matters.


Furthermore, there's a lot of ignorance about Mexican Immigrants in this country...they don't all want to turn America into Mexico. And this guy is proof of that.


I already knew that though...after September 11th when I went to join the Military, 90% of the guys on that bus that day were Mexicans. I have a strong feeling a disproportionate amount of the guys fighting in Iraq are Mexican or Mexican American. Sure seemed that way when I went to join.

That's a point that needs to be made...I am pretty sure McCain knows it as well which is why he had the immigration stance he had.

I want the Pro-American ones over here...

[SnakeBoy]

I've decided to become a liberal so who cares about some stupid idiot that joined the military. If he would have gotten some edjumacation he wouldn't have been dumb enough to go over there.


“You know, education, if you make the most of it, if you study hard and you do your homework, and you make an effort to be smart, uh, you, you can do well. If you don’t, you get stuck in Iraq.” — John Kerry

[baseline bum]

SnakeBoy's always such a great source of intelligent debate in this forum.

[Biernutz]

If he pulled the grenade in to his body and the other Marines saw it , that's good enough for me. Give it to him!!!

[Wild Cobra]

I have avoided this thread, I consider the thing stupid.

Whott... Please don't start a link based on the race card.

People, any clue at how many non-minorities are denied the honor that may deserve it, at least in the eyes of those writing up the application?

That's all I have to say on this stupid thread.

[whottt]

I have avoided this thread, I consider the thing stupid.

You consider what stupid?




Whott... Please don't start a link based on the race card.

I made no link based on the race card at any time in this thread. But I want to make sure every person on this forum knows this guy was a Mexican Immigrant.




This story was on the news and that is the reason I sought the article out because it is an amazing story of heroism.

This man either deliberately saved the lives of comrades with what was his dying act, or he did in death. It is more certainly not a common story.


I don't really get why you think I am playing the race card...I mentioned his Mexican heritage not because I think he is being discriminated against because of it...

But to make sure people know who some of the guys are over there fighting in Iraq.


It's important that you know it Wild Cobra.


This man went to Iraq the day after he became a US citizen and his entire life as an American was spent fighting a war on behalf of this country.


No one is aying he was denied the MOH because he was an Immigrant..the only accusation by anyone is that he was denied it because it was friendly fire that killed him.







Here is the list of the MOH's that have been given out in the Iraq War:


Name Service Rank Place of action Date of action Unit Notes
Smith, Paul R.Paul R. Smith* Army E-07Sergeant First Class near Baghdad, Iraq 02003-04-04 April 4, 2003 B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion Held the enemy at bay allowing for the wounded to be carried out
Dunham, JasonJason Dunham* USMC E-04Corporal Iraq, near Syrian border 02004-04-14 April 14, 2004 3rd Battalion 7th Marines Fought hand-to-hand with the enemy and hurled himself on a grenade to protect fellow Marines
Monsoor, Michael A.Michael A. Monsoor* Navy Master At Arms Second Class Ramadi, Iraq 02006-09-29 September 29, 2006 Seal Team Three, Delta Platoon Saved the lives of his fellow SEALs at his sniper position by diving on a grenade
McGinnis, Ross A.Ross A. McGinnis* Army Specialist Iraq 02006-12-06 December 6, 2006 C Company, 1-26th Infantry Saved the lives of four soldiers by diving on a grenade while inside HMMWV



3 of the 4 were given to men who covered a grenade to save others. This man did that as well...the debate is about whether or not he did it alive or dead...I don't think it matters.

[SnakeBoy]

the debate is about whether or not he did it alive or dead...I don't think it matters.

No, it does matter. Still the Navy Cross is quite an honor.

http://www.medalofhonor.com/

The deed performed must have been one of personal bravery or self-sacrifice so conspicuous as to clearly distinguish the individual above his comrades and must have involved risk of life. Incontestable proof of the performance of service is exacted and each recommendation for award of this decoration is considered on the standard of extraordinary merit.

[Spooky]

As a liberal who is also Mexican American, I believe he deserves the MOH. I suspect his immigrant status affected the decision. If you go to
http://www.virtualwall.org/valor.htm

There are plenty of examples bravery and sacrifice involving covering up grenades.
Daniel Fernandez and Robert Henry Jenkins Jr are two of them.

[whottt]

As a liberal who is also Mexican American, I believe he deserves the MOH. I suspect his immigrant status affected the decision. If you go to
http://www.virtualwall.org/valor.htm

There are plenty of examples bravery and sacrifice involving covering up grenades.
Daniel Fernandez and Robert Henry Jenkins Jr are two of them.


They've given the MOH to Mexican Immigrants and Mexican Americans before...that's not why they didn't give it to him.

Hispanic MOH Winners:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Hispanic_Medal_of_Honor_recipients


Lots of them.


I agree with his mom, I think it's because he got shot by friendly fire and or they legitimately don't think he could do it.

It's not because he's Mexican, the Military is pretty good about not letting stuff like that impact their decision.


Keep in mind...he still might get it, some guys don't end up getting theirs until decades later.

I encourage you to email his Congressmen:


Congressman Brian Bilbray - maps.google.com
2150 W Washington St # 210, San Diego - (619) 291-1430
Directions and more »


Congressman Susan Davis - maps.google.com
4305 University Ave # 515, San Diego - (619) 291-1430
Directions and more »



I already did.

[Spooky]

I hope your right Whott. That is the reason I put "suspect" not "think". I do know that this type of thing has happened before. I just can't exactly remember right now.

[whottt]

There are a lot of Mexican MOH Winners...that's not it.

It is because the shot he took to the head was friendly fire IMO...that's what his Mama thinks too. Friendly fire killing a heroic man always sucks badly, and the Military does have a track record of trying to snuff that kind of stuff.


Just like they did with Pat Tillman.

Funny thing is his Mama doesn't care if it was friendly fire that killed him...his buddies that were there with him are telling her that he deserves it and that's why she's upset. They are still telling her that. IF it was just some kind of stunt they would have already let it die so as not to torture his mom. But they are still pushing for it...

[Spooky]

There are a lot of Mexican MOH Winners...that's not it.

It is because the shot he took to the head was friendly fire IMO...that's what his Mama thinks too. Friendly fire killing a heroic man always sucks badly, and the Military does have a track record of trying to snuff that kind of stuff.


Just like they did with Pat Tillman.

Funny thing is his Mama doesn't care if it was friendly fire that killed him...his buddies that were there with him are telling her that he deserves it and that's why she's upset. They are still telling her that. IF it was just some kind of stunt they would have already let it die so as not to torture his mom. But they are still pushing for it...


Good points.