Your Vote, Your Reasons

[Shastafarian]

Victoria Jackson = angel_luv????

"I don't want a political label, but Obama bears traits that resemble the anti- Christ and I'm scared to death that un- educated people will ignorantly vote him into office.

You see, what bothers me most, besides being a Communist, and a racist (Obama writes in his book, From Dreams of My Father, "I found a solace in nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and and animosity against my (white) mother's race.") (Obama's "religion" of the last 20 years is Black Liberation Theology. What is that? "It is simply Marxism dressed up in Christian rhetoric. But unlike traditional Marxism, Black Liberation Theology emphasizes race rather than class. It's leading theorist is James Cone who says Jesus was black, African-Americans are the chosen people, and whites are the devil. Cone says, "What we need is the destruction of whiteness, which is the source of human misery in the world." The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor), is that he is a LIAR. He pretends to be a Christian and he incriminates himself everytime he speaks about Christianity. To lie about being a believer in Christ is very dangerous. Lightning could strike him at any minute! But seriously, he doesn't have a clue what the Bible says and yet he pretends to be a church- going Christian to win votes. That is sooooo evil."

http://www.victoriajackson.com/


I know what you're thinking....who is Victoria Jackson? She used to be on SNL in the 80's and early 90's.

[cool hand]

Bob Barr......because the two party systen SUCKS.

[Tully365]

Victoria Jackson = angel_luv????

"I don't want a political label, but Obama bears traits that resemble the anti- Christ and I'm scared to death that un- educated people will ignorantly vote him into office.

You see, what bothers me most, besides being a Communist, and a racist (Obama writes in his book, From Dreams of My Father, "I found a solace in nursing a pervasive sense of grievance and and animosity against my (white) mother's race.") (Obama's "religion" of the last 20 years is Black Liberation Theology. What is that? "It is simply Marxism dressed up in Christian rhetoric. But unlike traditional Marxism, Black Liberation Theology emphasizes race rather than class. It's leading theorist is James Cone who says Jesus was black, African-Americans are the chosen people, and whites are the devil. Cone says, "What we need is the destruction of whiteness, which is the source of human misery in the world." The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor), is that he is a LIAR. He pretends to be a Christian and he incriminates himself everytime he speaks about Christianity. To lie about being a believer in Christ is very dangerous. Lightning could strike him at any minute! But seriously, he doesn't have a clue what the Bible says and yet he pretends to be a church- going Christian to win votes. That is sooooo evil."

http://www.victoriajackson.com/


I know what you're thinking....who is Victoria Jackson? She used to be on SNL in the 80's and early 90's.

Victoria Jackson's entire comedy repertoire consisted of talking like an 8 year old girl and acting confused. Even her political opinions aren't as painful to endure as her "comedy."

[Shastafarian]

Victoria Jackson's entire comedy repertoire consisted of talking like an 8 year old girl and acting confused. Even her political opinions aren't as painful to endure as her "comedy."

I always thought her comedy routine was an act. It turns out she really is an idiot.

[romad_20]

I went ahead and switched in the booth today. I was going to write in Paul, but said what the heck, and hit Obama/Biden. Palin was a no go for me from the start. I could have gotten behind a moderate VP if McCain would have chose one, but his utter lack of regard for the office and this woman's critical thinking skills and lack of understanding of things outside of Alaska was too much.

My decision was based on the fact that Obama's message of bipartisanship and working together with repubs appealed to me. I also have always agreed with his stance on the Iraq war. Taxes and government spending are big issues for me to overlook, but I saw no other choice in the end. I hope the national healthcare system gets put on the very back burner.

One more point, I also voted for him because I think it will go a long way in repairing America's image in the rest of the world. We will have a person in office that, at one time in our country's short history, would have been enslaved. I think that's a major step for America and shows that the American dream is still alive and well.

[ashbeeigh]

:tu

I love this because this may be the one and only time ever in our lives when we agree on something.

[ElNono]

I went ahead and switched in the booth today. I was going to write in Paul, but said what the heck, and hit Obama/Biden. Palin was a no go for me from the start. I could have gotten behind a moderate VP if McCain would have chose one, but his utter lack of regard for the office and this woman's critical thinking skills and lack of understanding of things outside of Alaska was too much.

My decision was based on the fact that Obama's message of bipartisanship and working together with repubs appealed to me. I also have always agreed with his stance on the Iraq war. Taxes and government spending are big issues for me to overlook, but I saw no other choice in the end. I hope the national healthcare system gets put on the very back burner.

One more point, I also voted for him because I think it will go a long way in repairing America's image in the rest of the world. We will have a person in office that, at one time in our country's short history, would have been enslaved. I think that's a major step for America and shows that the American dream is still alive and well.

I'm glad you exercised your right to vote, regardless if you voted Marxist... :lol

[ploto]

I think when it comes to issues of faith- as discussed above- that people are called to move beyond the simple notion of saying-- I trust God so now I do not have to do anything. As if that is all that is expected. But I do not agree with that. I believe in faith and believe in trust, but God still calls me to thought and action. I am required to use my gifts and intellect to make choices-- all with the proper focus and intention. But it is not accurate to say that somehow I can do whatever I want without any investigation or attempt to discover the issues and claim it is all fine and justified because I said I trust God. I believe very deeply in personal responsibility. We all have choices to make in life. We do not sit and do nothing, so somehow we make decisions. That is where people do not understand, because to make a choice or a statement without any regard for the facts of the matter is careless and irresponsible, and to lay the responsibility at God's feet is not, in my opinion, correct. Sure, you can pray to make the right choice, and you can ponder all in the context of your faith, but at some point and time you do become responsible for your choices, and you have to own up to how you have made them. I do not know about you, but God does not come and tell me what to do. I can try to discern it in my life, and I think my intentions do matter, but to me to make a decision in good faith requires that I use all at my disposal to make an informed choice within the context of my beliefs.

That is why i asked Angel- how much she had researched both candidates' faith fully and equally so that she could make an informed choice. Your criteria can be faith-based, but the information you put through that process must be as well-informed as possible.

[angel_luv]

I believe very deeply in personal responsibility. We all have choices to make in life. We do not sit and do nothing, so somehow we make decisions. That is where people do not understand, because to make a choice or a statement without any regard for the facts of the matter is careless and irresponsible, and to lay the responsibility at God's feet is not, in my opinion, correct. Sure, you can pray to make the right choice, and you can ponder all in the context of your faith, but at some point and time you do become responsible for your choices, and you have to own up to how you have made them.


I agree with this.

I do believe in using common sense in making decisions.

At the same time though, I must remain open in the case which God instructs me to do something which may not make complete ( or any) sense to me.

I can testify that I have prospered every time I listened to God.

[ElNono]

At the same time though, I must remain open in the case which God instructs me to do something which may not make complete ( or any) sense to me.

Would you end somebody's life if god instructed you to?

[Shastafarian]

Would you end somebody's life if god instructed you to?

The $64,000 Question

[romad_20]

I'm glad you exercised your right to vote, regardless if you voted Marxist... :lol

Thanks :rollin

http://www.fistfuloftalent.com/images/2008/06/27/karl_marx.jpg

[LnGrrrR]

I agree with this.

I do believe in using common sense in making decisions.

At the same time though, I must remain open in the case which God instructs me to do something which may not make complete ( or any) sense to me.

I can testify that I have prospered every time I listened to God.

Is this true prosperity, like, "I'm so glad I demanded a raise from my boss and got it!", or the fake prosperity, like, "I know that I just lost my job... but now I have opportunities to get a better one!"

:D

[ratm1221]

Would you end somebody's life if god instructed you to?

I'm sure she would. I wouldn't put anything past this lunatic.

[angel_luv]

Would you end somebody's life if god instructed you to?

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that this was a sincere and not a sarcastic question.

God would not instruct me to do something which is in violation of His Word.
See the Ten Commandments for the answer to your question.
(Exodus 20)

[angel_luv]

Is this true prosperity, like, "I'm so glad I demanded a raise from my boss and got it!", or the fake prosperity, like, "I know that I just lost my job... but now I have opportunities to get a better one!"

:D

I have two jobs and in the past year was given raises at both, without even having to ask. :D

[ElNono]

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that this was a sincere and not a sarcastic question.


It was sincere.



God would not instruct me to do something which is in violation of His Word.
See the Ten Commandments for the answer to your question.
(Exodus 20)

Well, you said:

"I must remain open in the case which God instructs me to do something which may not make complete ( or any) sense to me."

that's why I was wondering...

[Shastafarian]

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that this was a sincere and not a sarcastic question.

God would not instruct me to do something which is in violation of His Word.
See the Ten Commandments for the answer to your question.
(Exodus 20)

So was Joshua obeying the commandment that says "thou shall not murder" when he stormed Jericho and killed all those people inside the walls?

[Trainwreck2100]

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that this was a sincere and not a sarcastic question.


You can tell it's sarcastic by the way he spells God.

[Shastafarian]

You can tell it's sarcastic by the way he spells God.

Not everyone thinks god reads the interwebs. A lowercase "g" isn't gonna kill anyone.

[ElNono]

You can tell it's sarcastic by the way he spells God.

That's pretty much how I always spelled it. Why? Is there something wrong with that?

[romad_20]

Not everyone thinks god reads the interwebs. A lowercase "g" isn't gonna kill anyone.


No, but old testament god will.

[Shastafarian]

That's pretty much how I always spelled it. Why? Is there something wrong with that?

He thinks as long as you capitalize the "g" in god you aren't breaking the "thou shall not use my name in vain" commandment. He's wrong but it's still funny.

[Trainwreck2100]

That's pretty much how I always spelled it. Why? Is there something wrong with that?

Christian god is spelled God.

[Shastafarian]

No, but old testament god will.

:lol

Nice

[angel_luv]

So was Joshua obeying the commandment that says "thou shall not murder" when he stormed Jericho and killed all those people inside the walls?

When a soldier kills someone in a war zone is it considered murder?

Were our forefathers wrong for intiating the War of Independence? After all, they shed blood in obtaining this land and their freedom.

Those are sincere questions.

[ElNono]

Christian god is spelled God.

Whatever, I don't think anybody is not understanding me here.

[angel_luv]

It was sincere.



Well, you said:

"I must remain open in the case which God instructs me to do something which may not make complete ( or any) sense to me."

that's why I was wondering...


God's Word is His already spoken instructions to me.

I know I am not to murder. I know I am to love God with all my heart and love my neighbor as myself.
I know I am to tithe. I know I am to pay my taxes.

I don't need guidance in these areas. The standards have already been set; the precepts have already been recorded.

[Shastafarian]

When a soldier kills someone in a war zone is it considered murder?

Were our forefathers wrong for intiating the War of Independence? After all, they shed blood in obtaining this land and their freedom.

Those are sincere questions.

Well I'm not claiming to live by the letter of the bible. Sometimes bloodshed is necessary. Joshua and his army storming Jericho and killing civilians was murder, sure.

[ratm1221]

I have two jobs and in the past year was given raises at both, without even having to ask. :D

So you really believe praying gets you petty things like raises at work? Where exactly does this start and end? If a little girl prays for a kitten and she gets a kitten, that's because she prayed? Who's fault is it if she doesn't get the kitten? She didn't pray enough?

That logic makes absolutely no sense to me.

[Trainwreck2100]

He thinks as long as you capitalize the "g" in god you aren't breaking the "thou shall not use my name in vain" commandment. He's wrong but it's still funny.

No, saying God dammit is using his name in vain. Spelling god like you would any other god shows a lack of respect. i know you people view him as fictional as greek gods but is respect for another's belief that hard to ask.

[ElNono]

God's Word is His already spoken instructions to me.

I know I am not to murder. I know I am to love God with all my heart and love my neighbor as myself.
I know I am to tithe. I know I am to pay my taxes.

I don't need guidance in these areas. The standards have already been set; the precepts have already been recorded.

I see... thanks for answering the question.

[romad_20]

When a soldier kills someone in a war zone is it considered murder?

Were our forefathers wrong for intiating the War of Independence? After all, they shed blood in obtaining this land and their freedom.

Those are sincere questions.

:wow Not the same as talking to someone no one can see and killing people because of what he says.

[Shastafarian]

God's Word is His already spoken instructions to me.

I know I am not to murder. I know I am to love God with all my heart and love my neighbor as myself.
I know I am to tithe. I know I am to pay my taxes.

I don't need guidance in these areas. The standards have already been set; the precepts have already been recorded.

Yeah but what if you got a new message and it told you to kill someone? Would you do it in the name of God?

[ElNono]

No, saying God dammit is using his name in vain. Spelling god like you would any other god shows a lack of respect. i know you people view him as fictional as greek gods but is respect for another's belief that hard to ask.

Rest assured I respect your belief. I just don't believe nor respect your god.

[ratm1221]

God's Word is His already spoken instructions to me.

I know I am not to murder. I know I am to love God with all my heart and love my neighbor as myself.
I know I am to tithe. I know I am to pay my taxes.

I don't need guidance in these areas. The standards have already been set; the precepts have already been recorded.

People that get messages from god get a nice warm coat and a room with white, padded walls.

[Shastafarian]

No, saying God dammit is using his name in vain. Spelling god like you would any other god shows a lack of respect. i know you people view him as fictional as greek gods but is respect for another's belief that hard to ask.

lol It is using his name in vain. It is using it "flippantly and routinely" and "is certainly to treat God's name as if it had no meaning". I'm sorry I don't cater to your superstitions.

[clambake]

why wouldn't god, considering your immense relationship with him, tell you if obama were the anti-christ?

[Trainwreck2100]

:wow Not the same as talking to someone no one can see and killing people because of what he says.

If you dont do it the voices won't go away :( And after they go away you start to miss them AND you killed somebody.

[ratm1221]

why wouldn't god, considering your immense relationship with him, tell you if obama were the anti-christ?

Good question.

[romad_20]

If you dont do it the voices won't go away :( And after they go away you start to miss them AND you killed somebody.

Agreed. I know how pesky those damn voices can be

[Trainwreck2100]

lol It is using his name in vain. It is using it "flippantly and routinely" and "is certainly to treat God's name as if it had no meaning". I'm sorry I don't cater to your superstitions.

You see it as using his name in vain, i really don't give a crap how you use it, cause you don't believe. I also don't care how you use it when you talk to other's like yourself, i just ask that when talking to someone that does believe that you show respect for their beliefs.

[Trainwreck2100]

Agreed. I know how pesky those damn voices can be

Just the one was bad, the other three were my friends.

[clambake]

Good question.

has she asked god if obama is the anti-christ?

if she hasn't, then why not?

[Shastafarian]

You see it as using his name in vain, i really don't give a crap how you use it, cause you don't believe. I also don't care how you use it when you talk to other's like yourself, i just ask that when talking to someone that does believe that you show respect for their beliefs.

How should I show respect? Should I start participating in your beliefs? Because that's what capitalizing god would be. No thanks. I don't like to participate in things I don't believe in.

[ElNono]

You see it as using his name in vain, i really don't give a crap how you use it, cause you don't believe. I also don't care how you use it when you talk to other's like yourself, i just ask that when talking to someone that does believe that you show respect for their beliefs.

I respect your belief in whatever it is, be it god, zeus, tim duncan, satan, etc et etc. If that's what works for you, great. But please don't ask me to believe or respect YOUR imaginary friend.

[angel_luv]

So you really believe praying gets you petty things like raises at work? Where exactly does this start and begin? If a little girl prays for a kitten and she gets a kitten, that's because she prayed? Who's fault is it if she doesn't get the kitten? She didn't pray enough?

That logic makes absolutely no sense to me.

I pray always, about everything.


"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you.
For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks, the door will be opened.
"Which of you, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone?
Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake?
If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!
So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.





Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God

[Trainwreck2100]

How should I show respect? Should I start participating in your beliefs? Because that's what capitalizing god would be. No thanks. I don't like to participate in things I don't believe in.

Then what do you call Allah? since saying Allah to a Muslim is apart of their "superstition"

[Shastafarian]

Then what do you call Allah? since saying Allah to a Muslim is apart of their "superstition"

So you're equating using the name of different deity with capitalizing a letter in the english language....seriously?

[clambake]

I pray always, about everything.

do you pray for obama's soul or his defeat?

do you ask god to reveal the truth about obama?

[Trainwreck2100]

I respect your belief in whatever it is, be it god, zeus, tim duncan, satan, etc et etc. If that's what works for you, great. But please don't ask me to believe or respect YOUR imaginary friend.

I'm not asking you to respect my imaginary friend, I'm asking you to respect my beliefs. I'm not saying do it for God because that's pointless since you don't belive in him.

[angel_luv]

God has been very gracious to me. He has answered all my prayers, even the ones I said once and then shoved to the back of my mind.

[clambake]

God has been very gracious to me. He has answered all my prayers, even the ones I said once and then shoved to the back of my mind.

so you never prayed for god to reveal the truth about obama?

[ElNono]

I'm not asking you to respect my imaginary friend, I'm asking you to respect my beliefs. I'm not saying do it for God because that's pointless since you don't belive in him.

I am respecting your belief. I didn't tell you not to believe, did I?

[ElNono]

Then what do you call Allah? since saying Allah to a Muslim is apart of their "superstition"

god

[angel_luv]

do you pray for obama's soul or his defeat?

do you ask god to reveal the truth about obama?

I pray for both Senators McCain and Obama that they grow in their knowledge and love of the Lord and lead in a way that brings honor to Jesus and blessings on all of us.

And I pray if either is unwilling or unable to do the above, that the other candidate gets elected.

I pray that God gives all votes the wisdom necessary to elect the candidate best suited to run our country.

And I ask all this in Jesus name, knowing that God will answer my prayers.

[Trainwreck2100]

So you're equating using the name of different deity with capitalizing a letter in the english language....seriously?

I'm equating you using a deity's name in one case and not the other. God's name is God not god. god can be any number of gods, beit zeus, mercury, or any other ones planets are named after. Go look in a dictionary and you will see there is a difference between God and god.

[angel_luv]

Yeah but what if you got a new message and it told you to kill someone? Would you do it in the name of God?

No, because God is a God of order. He does not contradict the Bible when He speaks to peoples' hearts.

This is the last question of this kind I am going to answer for you.

You are mocking me and I am not going to dignify that sort of behavior with a response.

[ElNono]

I pray for both Senators McCain and Obama that they grow in their knowledge and love of the Lord and lead in a way that brings honor to Jesus and blessings on all of us.

And I pray if either is unwilling or unable to do the above, that the other candidate gets elected.

I pray that God gives all votes the wisdom necessary to elect the candidate best suited to run our country.

And I ask all this in Jesus name, knowing that God will answer my prayers.

Well, this is the kind of stuff I wanted to hear. This is good news. If Obama wins then according to the above, that's god's choice, thus angel will be happy about it. Good.

[angel_luv]

I see... thanks for answering the question.

You're welcome. :)

[Trainwreck2100]

I am respecting your belief. I didn't tell you not to believe, did I?


So if i walked up to a muslim and say negative things about their religion. I'm respecting it as long as i don't tell them not to believe that? If i go to a muslim and said "you guys pray on yoga mats three times a day":lol That's respecting their beliefs, because i didn't tell them not to believe

god
I wasn't talking to you

[clambake]

I pray for both Senators McCain and Obama that they grow in their knowledge and love of the Lord and lead in a way that brings honor to Jesus and blessings on all of us.
how can that prayer happen if you think one is the anti-christ?


And I pray if either is unwilling or unable to do the above, that the other candidate gets elected.
how could you even consider "you know who"?


I pray that God gives all votes the wisdom necessary to elect the candidate best suited to run our country.
so it's all up to god and we've been wasting our time? i only ask this because you say god answers all your prayers.


And I ask all this in Jesus name, knowing that God will answer my prayers.
see what i mean?

now, why in the name of hell wouldn't you ask god if obama is the anti-christ?

it's only the single most important question you should have on your mind.

[ElNono]

So if i walked up to a muslim and say negative things about their religion. I'm respecting it as long as i don't tell them not to believe that? If i said "you guys pray on yoga mats three times a day":lol That's respecting their beliefs, because i didn't tell them not to believe

You would be expressing your opinion. If he takes offense on that, then he's the one being intolerant. It's not that complicated, really.

[LnGrrrR]

Angel_Luv, do you ever question God's word?

After all, some other rather important people have..

"The first time we hear Abraham engage God in conversation, God has just promised to give him a great reward (Genesis 15:1). But Abraham responds with doubt. “O Lord God, what will you give me, since I am childless?” (Genesis 15:2)."

"Despite seeing a bush burning with fire but not consumed, despite seeing his shepherd’s staff transformed into a serpent, and despite seeing his hand become leprous and then healed of leprosy, Moses fires back question after question and challenge after challenge to the God revealed specially and uniquely to him: “I AM THAT I AM; I WILL BE WHO I WILL BE.” Moses appears not to recognize his conversation partner, the God of his father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, as he questions God repeatedly in their dramatic conversation: “Who am I, that I should go to Pharaoh, and that I should bring the sons of Israel out of Egypt?” (Exodus 3:11). “Now they may say to me, ‘What is God’s name?’ What shall I say to them?” (Exodus 3:13). “What if they will not believe me, or listen to what I say?” (Exodus 4:1). “Please, Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither in the past nor since you have spoken to your servant. I am slow of speech and tongue” (Exodus 4:10). “Please Lord, send someone else to do it” (Exodus 4:13). "

From http://www.rzim.org/GlobalElements/GFV/tabid/449/ArticleID/8831/CBModuleId/1133/Default.aspx

Note to Angel: I'm not trying to "trick" you; I'm merely pointing out that if God exists, I think he appreciates critical thinking more than blind faith. :)

[angel_luv]

Well, this is the kind of stuff I wanted to hear. This is good news. If Obama wins then according to the above, that's god's choice, thus angel will be happy about it. Good.

I will pray regularly for whomever is elected president. Even with both candidates qualifications, the candidates have a daunting task ahead of them and need the prayers.

For the record, I pray for all of you who post in these thread with me as well.

[clambake]

Thanks For Not Answering The Specific And Yet Simple Questions.

[Trainwreck2100]

You would be expressing your opinion. If he takes offense on that, then he's the one being intolerant. It's not that complicated, really.

So if i grab a muslim prayer mat, burn it and put it out with my piss right in front of him, I'm not disrespecting him or his beliefs? I'm defiling a sacred object, but I'm not telling him to convert so I'm fine?

[ElNono]

So if i grab a muslim prayer mat, burn it and put it out with my piss right in front of him, I'm not disrespecting him or his beliefs? I'm defiling a sacred object, but I'm not telling him to convert so I'm fine?

How is it a sacred object if you are not a Muslim? To you it's just a mat.

[clambake]

i think it's ashame that god would fuck with a follower and not tell them that the anti-christ could lead her. that god is a funny dude.

[Trainwreck2100]

How is it a sacred object if you are not a Muslim? To you it's just a mat.

Am i disrepecting them or not?

[ElNono]

Am i disrepecting them or not?

I don't think you are.

[angel_luv]

Angel_Luv, do you ever question God's word?

After all, some other rather important people have..

"The first time we hear Abraham engage God in conversation, God has just promised to give him a great reward (Genesis 15:1). But Abraham responds with doubt. “O Lord God, what will you give me, since I am childless?” (Genesis 15:2)."

"Despite seeing a bush burning with fire but not consumed, despite seeing his shepherd’s staff transformed into a serpent, and despite seeing his hand become leprous and then healed of leprosy, Moses fires back question after question and challenge after challenge to the God revealed specially and uniquely to him: “I AM THAT I AM; I WILL BE WHO I WILL BE.” Moses appears not to recognize his conversation partner, the God of his father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, as he questions God repeatedly in their dramatic conversation: “Who am I, that I should go to Pharaoh, and that I should bring the sons of Israel out of Egypt?” (Exodus 3:11). “Now they may say to me, ‘What is God’s name?’ What shall I say to them?” (Exodus 3:13). “What if they will not believe me, or listen to what I say?” (Exodus 4:1). “Please, Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither in the past nor since you have spoken to your servant. I am slow of speech and tongue” (Exodus 4:10). “Please Lord, send someone else to do it” (Exodus 4:13). "

From http://www.rzim.org/GlobalElements/GFV/tabid/449/ArticleID/8831/CBModuleId/1133/Default.aspx


I have fears and doubts at times, ones just like the ones you cited.

A favorite Scripture in times of doubt for me is



"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes?
Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?
Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life?
"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin.
Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these.
If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?
So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?'
For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them.
But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.
Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.



The times when I experience pain, fear, and doubt are the ones in which I am most grateful to have faith.

I have the blessed assurance that the same God who came through for Abraham, Moses, and me numerous times already along my life's journey will continue to make a way for me.

[Trainwreck2100]

I don't think you are.

So by that logic, I can walk into a VFW hall, grab old glory, burn it and put it out with my piss. And if those old guys take offense they are being intolerant?

[ElNono]

So by that logic I can walk into a VFW hall grab old glory burn it and put it out with my piss. And if those old guys take offense they are being intolerant?

What's a VFW?

[Trainwreck2100]

What's a VFW?

verterans of foreign wars

[ElNono]

So by that logic, I can walk into a VFW hall, grab old glory, burn it and put it out with my piss. And if those old guys take offense they are being intolerant?

Is this 'old glory' yours? If it is, then there's nothing preventing you from doing whatever you want with it. And no, it wouldn't be disrespectful, because it's your property and you do whatever you want with it.
If it's not yours, then you're destroying their property, thus I can see why they would be pissed.

[romad_20]

So by that logic, I can walk into a VFW hall, grab old glory, burn it and put it out with my piss. And if those old guys take offense they are being intolerant?

Old Glory. Get it right















I'm just f-ing with you

:lol

[Trainwreck2100]

Is this 'old glory' yours? If it is, then there's nothing preventing you from doing whatever you want with it. And no, it wouldn't be disrespectful, because it's your property and you do whatever you want with it.
If it's not yours, then you're destroying their property, thus I can see why they would be pissed.

in this situation it's mine,

But i can see why we don't coexist, if you can somehow condone pissing on the US flag in front of veterans no less.

[ElNono]

in this situation it's mine,

But i can see why we don't coexist, if you can somehow condone pissing on the US flag.

I don't condone anything... But if it's your flag and you want to piss on it, who am I to tell you otherwise?

[LnGrrrR]

I have fears and doubts at times, ones just like the ones you cited.

A favorite Scripture in times of doubt for me is




The times when I experience pain, fear, and doubt are the ones in which I am most grateful to have faith.

I have the blessed assurance that the same God who came through for Abraham, Moses, and me numerous times already along my life's journey will continue to make a way for me.

If your Faith gives you strength, that's wonderful I think. I just caution you not to let Faith be your ONLY guide. As shown above, God respects those who think critically and show good reasoning. Therefore, I suggest that you not only vote based on how faithful the candidates proclaim themselves, but by their actions. Which one seems to follow the tenets that God has laid out more? That should seemingly be more important to you than what each candidate claims.

Would you rather elect someone who believed in God, but did not follow his tenets (lied, cheated, etc), or elect someone who DIDN'T believe in God, yet still managed to be a good family man, gave to charity often, and was truthful?

[angel_luv]

Angel_Luv, do you ever question God's word?

After all, some other rather important people have..

"The first time we hear Abraham engage God in conversation, God has just promised to give him a great reward (Genesis 15:1). But Abraham responds with doubt. “O Lord God, what will you give me, since I am childless?” (Genesis 15:2)."

"Despite seeing a bush burning with fire but not consumed, despite seeing his shepherd’s staff transformed into a serpent, and despite seeing his hand become leprous and then healed of leprosy, Moses fires back question after question and challenge after challenge to the God revealed specially and uniquely to him: “I AM THAT I AM; I WILL BE WHO I WILL BE.” Moses appears not to recognize his conversation partner, the God of his father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, as he questions God repeatedly in their dramatic conversation: “Who am I, that I should go to Pharaoh, and that I should bring the sons of Israel out of Egypt?” (Exodus 3:11). “Now they may say to me, ‘What is God’s name?’ What shall I say to them?” (Exodus 3:13). “What if they will not believe me, or listen to what I say?” (Exodus 4:1). “Please, Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither in the past nor since you have spoken to your servant. I am slow of speech and tongue” (Exodus 4:10). “Please Lord, send someone else to do it” (Exodus 4:13). "

From http://www.rzim.org/GlobalElements/GFV/tabid/449/ArticleID/8831/CBModuleId/1133/Default.aspx

Note to Angel: I'm not trying to "trick" you; I'm merely pointing out that if God exists, I think he appreciates critical thinking more than blind faith. :)

Note the end of the chapter in Exodus you cited...



Then the LORD said, "If they do not believe you or pay attention to the first miraculous sign, they may believe the second.
But if they do not believe these two signs or listen to you, take some water from the Nile and pour it on the dry ground. The water you take from the river will become blood on the ground."

Moses said to the LORD, "O Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither in the past nor since you have spoken to your servant. I am slow of speech and tongue."

The LORD said to him, "Who gave man his mouth? Who makes him deaf or mute? Who gives him sight or makes him blind? Is it not I, the LORD ?

Now go; I will help you speak and will teach you what to say."

But Moses said, "O Lord, please send someone else to do it."

Then the LORD's anger burned against Moses and he said, "What about your brother, Aaron the Levite? I know he can speak well. He is already on his way to meet you, and his heart will be glad when he sees you.
You shall speak to him and put words in his mouth; I will help both of you speak and will teach you what to do.
He will speak to the people for you, and it will be as if he were your mouth and as if you were God to him.
But take this staff in your hand so you can perform miraculous signs with it."

If you read the whole chapter, God was very patient with Moses- gave him confirmation to go with His instructions, but Moses kept coming back with lame excuses.

I say lame because one would think Moses would not doubt a God who spoke to him through a burning bush, turned a staff into a snake, and cured a leperous hand all in a matter of minutes.

God is not against reason. God understands that we as humans are afraid.
What God is against is us exalting our reason and/ or our fear above His Word.

In contrast to Moses, Abraham, though he first responded in fear, set his preconceived ideas aside, took God at His Word, and God was pleased with that.


After this, the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision:
"Do not be afraid, Abram.
I am your shield,
your very great reward. "
But Abram said, "O Sovereign LORD, what can you give me since I remain childless and the one who will inherit my estate is Eliezer of Damascus?"
And Abram said, "You have given me no children; so a servant in my household will be my heir."

Then the word of the LORD came to him: "This man will not be your heir, but a son coming from your own body will be your heir."
5He took him outside and said, "Look up at the heavens and count the stars—if indeed you can count them." Then he said to him, "So shall your offspring be."
Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness.

[Trainwreck2100]

I don't condone anything... But if it's your flag and you want to piss on it, who am I to tell you otherwise?

Oh BTW I didn't quite understand your answer to this, if i piss on an American flag after i set it on fire in front of veterans, are they intolerant for taking offense to that?

[ElNono]

Oh BTW I didn't quite understand your answer to this, if i piss on an American flag after i set it on fire in front of veterans, are they intolerant for taking offense to that?

That's because you're a little slow. Let me put it on a little more detail.
Doing what you described is protected speech under the 1st amendment of the constitution. And while they're free to express their anger at you from doing that, they're also being intolerant to you for exercising your right. Being intolerant is not a crime. Is simply thinking your moral values are more important than somebody else.

[ploto]

I do not like the ministers who preach a Gospel of prosperity as if the rewards Jesus promised are material. I understand that this is very popular and draws people to their churches, but I do not think it is what is intended. When Jesus speaks of all I will receive, I believe they are to be spiritual gifts- mercy, compassion, forgiveness,-- not a raise, or a house, or a car.

As someone asked, I do not pray for specific outcomes, but instead for me to face each situation in my life with grace, compassion, and the mercy with which God deals with me. I think it is an immature faith to believe it is about what I get out of it. I also think it is dangerous to go back to an Old Testament notion that people's position in life are somehow indicative of their faith. Jesus himself disputed those notions with the man born blind and the disussion of the rich man entering heaven.

I truly hope Angel, that your faith is not dependent upon you getting what you want because a faith of that sort is not very deep.

I also do not agree with the notion that if anyone is elected then that is whom God chose. That is a dangerous notion in a democratic society and a world in which we make our own choices of our will. All the election means is that he/she is whom the voters chose- not God.

[angel_luv]

Would you rather elect someone who believed in God, but did not follow his tenets (lied, cheated, etc), or elect someone who DIDN'T believe in God, yet still managed to be a good family man, gave to charity often, and was truthful?



Neither is a disireable candidate in my book- the first because he is all talk and no action and, therefore, is no good from the start and the second because I believe there is no sustenace outside of Jesus and I want to elect someone with long term great character.



I do use logic ( contary to what many posters on here may believe :lol) but God's word always comes first with me.

Because it is the first example that comes to mind...

A lot of people might feel it is logical to have sex with a person before choosing to marry them.
I can understand that sort of thinking- it makes sense to me, from a purely practical standpoint.
However, I believe that following the Bible, which says to save sex until marriage, is the better course of action because God blesses obedience.

So where some might view me as being at a disadvantage for remaining a virgin until my wedding night, I trust God that I am in truth benefiting my marriage by my adherence to the standards God has set for me.

[manufor3]

mccain will be anything you want in return for a vote. pro-life, pro-choice, you tell him and he'll say ok.

true fact

[Trainwreck2100]

That's because you're a little slow. Let me put it on a little more detail.
Doing what you described is protected speech under the 1st amendment of the constitution. And while they're free to express their anger at you from doing that, they're also being intolerant to you for exercising your right. Being intolerant is not a crime. Is simply thinking your moral values are more important than somebody else.

:lol You condone pissing on the flag in front of veterans. I thought i was fucked up but damn. Some of those guys have 1 arm.

[ElNono]

:lol You condone pissing on the flag in front of veterans. I thought i was fucked up but damn. Some of those guys have 1 arm.

The US Constitution does. If you don't like it there's plenty of other countries to go to.

[angel_luv]

I do not like the ministers who preach a Gospel of prosperity as if the rewards Jesus promised are material. I understand that this is very popular and draws people to their churches, but I do not think it is what is intended. When Jesus speaks of all I will receive, I believe they are to be spiritual gifts- mercy, compassion, forgiveness,-- not a raise, or a house, or a car.

As someone asked, I do not pray for specific outcomes, but instead for me to face each situation in my life with grace, compassion, and the mercy with which God deals with me. I think it is an immature faith to believe it is about what I get out of it. I also think it is dangerous to go back to an Old Testament notion that people's position in life are somehow indicative of their faith. Jesus himself disputed those notions with the man born blind and the disussion of the rich man entering heaven.

I truly hope Angel, that your faith is not dependent upon you getting what you want because a faith of that sort is not very deep.

I also do not agree with the notion that if anyone is elected then that is whom God chose. That is a dangerous notion in a democratic society and a world in which we make our own choices of our will. All the election means is that he/she is whom the voters chose- not God.

I pray for specific outcomes because it helps me recognize it when God gives specific answers, which He always does, even if the answer is not now or a flat out no.

I believe that God wants us to have both virtue as well as physical blessings, Ploto.
I stand with you in the agreement that we are to first seek God. But I know from a lifetime of experience that when I first seek God, He adds His blessings onto my life.

Think of how people are as parents- they want their kids to have food, education and get good jobs but also delight in buying their kids cars, clothes, electronics.

If a parent desires all the best for his/ her offspring, how much more our benevolent God!

My faith is strong but not as deep as I would like it to be. Thank God it deepens daily. Having my prayers answers strengthened my faith, just as having a friend come through strengthens human friendships.

Because there is free will, God will let America elect whomever they choose- just like he allowed Israel to have a king.

My prayer is that whomever gets elected will become the president God wants him to be. I have faith that, that will happen and that God will protect & bless me and my until it does.

[Trainwreck2100]

The US Constitution does. If you don't like it there's plenty of other countries to go to.


It's your right to piss on the flag, in front of veterans, and it's not being disrespectful to boot. I'd wager a good many of ACLU's lawyers agree with you on the first part, but not the second

[Shastafarian]

No, because God is a God of order. He does not contradict the Bible when He speaks to peoples' hearts.

This is the last question of this kind I am going to answer for you.

You are mocking me and I am not going to dignify that sort of behavior with a response.

No I was being serious. Is the sabbath Sunday or Saturday?

[LnGrrrR]

That's because you're a little slow. Let me put it on a little more detail.
Doing what you described is protected speech under the 1st amendment of the constitution. And while they're free to express their anger at you from doing that, they're also being intolerant to you for exercising your right. Being intolerant is not a crime. Is simply thinking your moral values are more important than somebody else.

I don't think it's intolerance to get mad at someone for doing something like that, as I think displays of that sort are intolerance of a sort themselves. I can see no political/social protest that would be made by urinating on a flag that couldn't be done in another way. I'm not saying it shouldn't be allowed; just that veterans wouldn't be considered 'intolerant' any more than blacks mad at KKK members could be considered 'intolerant'.

[LnGrrrR]

Neither is a disireable candidate in my book- the first because he is all talk and no action and, therefore, is no good from the start and the second because I believe there is no sustenace outside of Jesus and I want to elect someone with long term great character.

I do use logic ( contary to what many posters on here may believe :lol) but God's word always comes first with me.

Because it is the first example that comes to mind...

A lot of people might feel it is logical to have sex with a person before choosing to marry them.
I can understand that sort of thinking- it makes sense to me, from a purely practical standpoint.
However, I believe that following the Bible, which says to save sex until marriage, is the better course of action because God blesses obedience.

So where some might view me as being at a disadvantage for remaining a virgin until my wedding night, I trust God that I am in truth benefiting my marriage by my adherence to the standards God has set for me.

Trust me, you're missing out :)

I never understood why a God would need obedience/submission in order to validate the worth of a person (other than being a jealous God, of course). I can't tend to understand it when people do either. But you are free to your beliefs.

[ElNono]

It's your right to piss on the flag, in front of veterans, and it's not being disrespectful to boot. I'd wager a good many of ACLU's lawyers agree with you on the first part, but not the second

Flag desecration in front of veterans has been done before. Defacing a flag is protected speech under the US Constitution as established in Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), and reaffirmed in U.S. v. Eichman, 496 U.S. 310 (1990). I'm fairly sure the ACLU lawyers are well aware of that.

[Shastafarian]

I'm equating you using a deity's name in one case and not the other. God's name is God not god. god can be any number of gods, beit zeus, mercury, or any other ones planets are named after. Go look in a dictionary and you will see there is a difference between God and god.

Then you're doing the same thing. Maybe you should start using Jehovah or Yahweh.

[ElNono]

I don't think it's intolerance to get mad at someone for doing something like that, as I think displays of that sort are intolerance of a sort themselves. I can see no political/social protest that would be made by urinating on a flag that couldn't be done in another way. I'm not saying it shouldn't be allowed; just that veterans wouldn't be considered 'intolerant' any more than blacks mad at KKK members could be considered 'intolerant'.

I'm not saying it's wrong for them to get mad at the act, or even express their anger (free speech). But by bitching about it they're establishing their morals above the morals of the person carrying the act. And please, my understanding is that what the KKK did was illegal. This isn't.

[Trainwreck2100]

Flag desecration in front of veterans have been done before. Defacing a flag is protected speech under the US Constitution as established in Texas v. Johnson, 491 U.S. 397 (1989), and reaffirmed in U.S. v. Eichman, 496 U.S. 310 (1990). I'm fairly sure the ACLU lawyers are well aware of that.

yeah see i said
It's your right to piss on the flag, in front of veterans, and it's not being disrespectful to boot. I'd wager a good many of ACLU's lawyers agree with you on the first part,.

i didn't need to google it either to know its a right

I said they wouldn't agree on it being disrespectful, some might think it is.

[LnGrrrR]

Think of how people are as parents- they want their kids to have food, education and get good jobs but also delight in buying their kids cars, clothes, electronics.

If a parent desires all the best for his/ her offspring, how much more our benevolent God!

In response:

Luke 18:24 Jesus (http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth-topics/jesus.htm) watched him go and then said to his disciples, "How hard it is for rich people to get into the Kingdom of God!

Luke 18:25 It is easier for a camel (http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth-topics/camel.htm) to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!"

[ElNono]

yeah see i said .

i didn't need to google it either to know its a right

I said they wouldn't agree on it being disrespectful, some might think it is.

I never claimed that the veterans wouldn't be pissed off about it, just as you are whenever I refer to your god as god.

[angel_luv]

The US Constitution does. If you don't like it there's plenty of other countries to go to.

The US Constitution allows it. I wouldn't go so far as to say it condones it.

[LnGrrrR]

I'm not saying it's wrong for them to get mad at the act, or even express their anger (free speech). But by bitching about it they're establishing their morals above the morals of the person carrying the act. And please, my understanding is that what the KKK did was illegal. This isn't.

Eh, I wouldn't call it 'intolerance' but that could be semantics. And the KKK does many illegal things, but some legal (such as holding rallies).

[Trainwreck2100]

I'm not saying it's wrong for them to get mad at the act, or even express their anger (free speech).

.

[Trainwreck2100]

I never claimed that the veterans wouldn't be pissed off about it, just as you are whenever I refer to your god as god.



you are saying they have the right to flag piss (which i'm not arguing) but you are also saying its not disrespectful, which i am arguing.

[angel_luv]

In response:

Luke 18:24 Jesus (http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth-topics/jesus.htm) watched him go and then said to his disciples, "How hard it is for rich people to get into the Kingdom of God!

Luke 18:25 It is easier for a camel (http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth-topics/camel.htm) to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God!"

Hard, but not impossible.

Example: Bruce Bowen is a Christian and he is also quite rich.




"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.

You can HAVE money and serve God, you just cannot serve Money and serve God




But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well

[Shastafarian]

Hard, but not impossible.

Example: Bruce Bowen is a Christian and he is also quite rich.


And he's voting for Barack Obama.

[angel_luv]

Trust me, you're missing out :)

I never understood why a God would need obedience/submission in order to validate the worth of a person (other than being a jealous God, of course). I can't tend to understand it when people do either. But you are free to your beliefs.

Don't tempt me. :)



I kid! :lol

[ElNono]

The US Constitution allows it. I wouldn't go so far as to say it condones it.

You need to look up what the word 'condone' means in a dictionary.

[angel_luv]

You need to look up what the word 'condone' means in a dictionary.

I did and I see what you mean.

I thought condone meant to approve of, but you are right, it does not mean that.

My bad.

[Shastafarian]

I think I've asked at least 5 times in this forum and several times in this thread about the Sabbath being on Sunday vs Saturday. Still no replies.

[ElNono]

Yes you are you're saying they are being intolerable, unless you believe lacking tolerance is right? Not a right mind you, but right as in correct.

Because intolerence is a right. i'll save you the time from googling the bill of rights.

Oops... what happened?
Posts disappear!
:lol

[LnGrrrR]

Hard, but not impossible.

Example: Bruce Bowen is a Christian and he is also quite rich.





You can HAVE money and serve God, you just cannot serve Money and serve God


And how do you know which one Bruce Bowen serves? :)

[Trainwreck2100]

I think I've asked at least 5 times in this forum and several times in this thread about the Sabbath being on Sunday vs Saturday. Still no replies.

I took a shower this morning

[Shastafarian]

I took a shower this morning

Congratulations.

[Trainwreck2100]

Oops... what happened?
Posts disappear!
:lol
I didn't want to distract you from answering this




you are saying they have the right to flag piss (which i'm not arguing) but you are also saying its not disrespectful, which i am arguing.

[angel_luv]

I think I've asked at least 5 times in this forum and several times in this thread about the Sabbath being on Sunday vs Saturday. Still no replies.

Are you trying to figure it out so you know which day to go?
:)

[ElNono]

you are saying they have the right to flag piss (which i'm not arguing) but you are also saying its not disrespectful, which i am arguing.

Listen... I respect your right to choose and exercise your religious beliefs, whatever they might be. That doesn't automatically implies that I respect your religion as a whole or any part of it. So I couldn't care less what believers of your religion call your deity. Now when you tell me I should refer to your deity as this or that, you're telling me how i should express myself, and i really couldn't care less.

[Trainwreck2100]

Congratulations.

same to you

[Trainwreck2100]

Listen... I respect your right to choose and exercise your religious beliefs, whatever they might be. That doesn't automatically implies that I respect your religion as a whole or any part of it. So I couldn't care less what believers of your religion call your deity. Now when you tell me I should refer to your deity as this or that, you're telling me how i should express myself, and i really couldn't care less.

so is pissing on the flag disrespectful or not?

[Shastafarian]

Are you trying to figure it out so you know which day to go?
:)

Now who's mocking who? :p:

Seriously, where does it say the Sabbath is on Sunday?

[Shastafarian]

same to you

Can you answer the question about the Sabbath? Which day is correct and why?

[angel_luv]

And how do you know which one Bruce Bowen serves? :)

Only God knows the heart.

But I have heard Bruce Bowen give his testimony at the Spurs' annual faith nights and my faith in God was strengthened by Bruce's testimony.

[Trainwreck2100]

Can you answer the question about the Sabbath? Which day is correct and why?

Your fights with her

[Shastafarian]

Your fights with her

Come on you're the one that got all mad I didn't capitalize a word. Do you know why there is a difference between jews and christians on the day of the sabbath?

[ElNono]

so is pissing on the flag disrespectful or not?

I already answered this question... want to get back to the original topic now?

[Trainwreck2100]

I am respecting your belief. I didn't tell you not to believe, did I?


Listen... I respect your right to choose and exercise your religious beliefs, whatever they might be. That doesn't automatically implies that I respect your religion as a whole or any part of it. So I couldn't care less what believers of your religion call your deity. Now when you tell me I should refer to your deity as this or that, you're telling me how i should express myself, and i really couldn't care less.


Originally you said you respected my beliefs. When in actuality all you respect is our RIGHT to believe what we want. That's not the same as respecting our beliefs cause if you respected it you wouldn't talk shit about it. what i'm trying to get through to you is that you don't respect our beliefs but our right. which is fine but don't go saying you respect our belief when obviously you don't. what i've been trying to get at is that you don't respect our beliefs


That doesn't automatically implies that I respect your religion as a whole or any part of it.

I never assumed that you respected any part of my beliefs, but you said


I am respecting your belief.

when you are not respecting my beliefs, just that i have the right to believe.

Honesty you saying that you respect my beliefs was the most infuriating thing i read from you in all this cause its so blatantly not true.

[Trainwreck2100]

Come on you're the one that got all mad I didn't capitalize a word. Do you know why there is a difference between jews and christians on the day of the sabbath?

Actually i got all mad that ElNono didn't capitalize a word, you just jumped in

[Trainwreck2100]

I already answered this question... want to get back to the original topic now?

I just wanted to make sure that you really said pissing on a flag wasn't disrespectful. Which you did.

[angel_luv]

Now who's mocking who? :p:

Seriously, where does it say the Sabbath is on Sunday?

:)

I was hoping you wanted to come to church so I could invite you to mine.
We have two services on Sunday mornings and also one on Wednesday nights.

Traditionally, I believe Jewish people celebrate their Sabbath on Saturday.
I don't know how or why so many Christian denomination formed the tradition of attending church on Sunday.
Maybe someone else can shed light on that.
As for me, I believe what matters to God is you set aside time to go to church to worship God, be taught the Scripture, and fellowship with and encourage other Christians.



They devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.
Everyone was filled with awe, and many wonders and miraculous signs were done by the apostles.

All the believers were together and had everything in common.
Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need. Every day they continued to meet together in the temple courts. They broke bread in their homes and ate together with glad and sincere hearts,
praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved



Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.



A specific day is not specified other than the Day, by which the author means the Day when Christ returns.

I attend church every week on Sunday mornings ( sometimes both the 9 and 11 o'clock service; always at 11,) Wednesday night ( mid week service), Saturday ( youth service) and every other Monday ( Womens' Bible study).


I do this because I love God and absolutely love my church.

In my whole life, I have never encountered a more faith filled, loving, supportive, and joy filled group than my fellow church members.
It is not to say that we all don't have bad days- we do. But we all help each other out like a family would.
I plan my life around my church's services... I love going that much.

[ElNono]

I just wanted to make sure that you really said pissing on a flag wasn't disrespectful. Which you did.

I didn't say it's not disrespectful. I said *I* personally don't think it is. I don't generalize. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

[Trainwreck2100]

I didn't say it's not disrespectful. I said *I* personally don't think it is. I don't generalize. Everybody is entitled to their opinion.

Si the cliff notes to this are
:It's not disrespectful to piss on the flag

[ElNono]

Originally you said you respected my beliefs. When in actuality all you respect is our RIGHT to believe what we want. That's not the same as respecting our beliefs cause if you respected it you wouldn't talk shit about it. what i'm trying to get through to you is that you don't respect our beliefs but our right. which is fine but don't go saying you respect our belief when obviously you don't. what i've been trying to get at is that you don't respect our beliefs


I meant your right to believe from the get go. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough.


I never assumed that you respected any part of my beliefs, but you said when you are not respecting my beliefs, just that i have the right to believe.

I respect your right to believe and exercise your religion. I couldn't care less about whatever your religion is.

[ElNono]

Fine then to you pissing on the flag isn't direspectful.

I don't think I would personally use it as a means to protest, but I won't be offended if somebody does that.

[Trainwreck2100]

I meant your right to believe from the get go. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough.



so then we're both right

[ElNono]

Si the cliff notes to this are
:It's not disrespectful to piss on the flag

You keep on editing your posts... think before you post...
The cliff notes to this are: ElNono doesn't think that pissing on the flag is disrespectful

[ElNono]

so then we're both right

You ask me to spell god with an uppercase g, and you tell me it's disrespectful if I don't. I tell you I respect your right to believe, but not your religion, thus I'll write god whichever way I please.

How are we both right again?

[Trainwreck2100]

You ask me to spell god with an uppercase g, and you tell me it's disrespectful if I don't. I tell you I respect your right to believe, but not your religion, thus I'll write god whichever way I please.

How are we both right again?

you didn't tell me "I respect you're right to believe" Your words were "I respect your belief" you were arguing that you respected my right to belief which i acknowledged and I was arguing you didn't respect my beliefs, which you acknowledged.

Maybe if you went and edited your post before you made it we wouldn't have gone around like that

[ElNono]

you didn't tell me "I respect you're right to believe" Your words were "I respect your belief" you were arguing that you respected my right to belief which i acknowledged and I was arguing you didn't respect my beliefs, which you acknowledged.

I see... yes, we're on the same page on that now.

[Trainwreck2100]

I see... yes, we're on the same page on that now.

so then we're both right

[ElNono]

so then we're both right

both right on what dude?

[Shastafarian]

:lmao this back and forth is pretty funny

[ploto]

Think of how people are as parents- they want their kids to have food, education and get good jobs but also delight in buying their kids cars, clothes, electronics.

If a parent desires all the best for his/ her offspring, how much more our benevolent God!
But see that is the thing- the best for my child has little to do with material things. Of course I desire adequate food, shelter, housing, etc. but beyond that the joys I have in giving to my child are rarely the things that cost money- like a car or electronics. Doing the best for my child does not usually involve handing him things- but teaching him how to do it himself and have the personal satisfaction of his own accomplishments. When I am patient with my child on a tough day that is a far greater gift that a video game. When I am understanding about issues with which he deals as he gets older, that is far more important that clothes. Likewise., I am not intent on asking God to give me stuff but to forgive me when I am weak.

[angel_luv]

But see that is the thing- the best for my child has little to do with material things. Of course I desire adequate food, shelter, housing, etc. but beyond that the joys I have in giving to my child are rarely the things that cost money- like a car or electronics. Doing the best for my child does not usually involve handing him things- but teaching him how to do it himself and have the personal satisfaction of his own accomplishments. When I am patient with my child on a tough day that is a far greater gift that a video game. When I am understanding about issues with which he deals as he gets older, that is far more important that clothes. Likewise., I am not intent on asking God to give me stuff but to forgive me when I am weak.

I agree with you, and would add this to it.

I believe God loves you so very much and so not want only to forgive and instruct you, but also desires to exceedingly and abundantly bless- because you are God's child and generosity is in His character.
Also, I believes God blesses us with abundance both to give us an example of how as well as the ability to bless others.

[ratm1221]

God has been very gracious to me. He has answered all my prayers, even the ones I said once and then shoved to the back of my mind.

So if you lost your job, got your legs chopped off, and you had to live in the street where people would spit on you on a daily basis... who's fault would it be? God, or the devil?

And the scripture you post doesn't mean much to me. It's poetry that could be interpreted a dozen, maybe even 100, different ways.

If I say "your heart is a flower," am I saying that your heart is physically a flower?

[LnGrrrR]

Only God knows the heart.

But I have heard Bruce Bowen give his testimony at the Spurs' annual faith nights and my faith in God was strengthened by Bruce's testimony.

Good for you then. Again, I have no problem with faith that gives people strength. All I ask is that you choose wisely when you vote, and reflect that your choice will have an effect on all of us, even those who don't follow God. Prayer is fine, but also, researching other positions the candidates hold is not bad either.

[rascal]

angel_luv: Have you reconsidered your assertion that Obama may be the anti-Christ?

What are some of the attributes that the anti-Christ will have? I heard somewhere I don't know where but he was suppose to be alive today and come from a middle eastern country. Come across as good in the beginning and be in power for 7 years. Fits right in with a two term president, the years that is.

Does he come from a middle eastern country? Does it have to be a man or can it be a woman?

[SnakeBoy]

Obama IS the antichrist. I saw it on youtube.

http://www.qubetv.tv/photos/54856/Obama._The_OFFICIAL__Antichrist_..JPG?1216955327

[CuckingFunt]

Good stuff. (http://blog.indecision2008.com/2009/02/25/jason-jones-barack-obama-may-be-the-next-antichrist-hitler-or-both/)
(http://blog.indecision2008.com/2009/02/25/jason-jones-barack-obama-may-be-the-next-antichrist-hitler-or-both/)

[Winehole23]

Vid at link did not load. brb.

[Winehole23]

Recheck yielded ya no sirve. Researching.

[Bartleby]

Good stuff. (http://blog.indecision2008.com/2009/02/25/jason-jones-barack-obama-may-be-the-next-antichrist-hitler-or-both/)
(http://blog.indecision2008.com/2009/02/25/jason-jones-barack-obama-may-be-the-next-antichrist-hitler-or-both/)

I thought about this thread during that segment last night. angel_luv is in good company.

[Winehole23]

Fixed for now. (http://minor-ripper.blogspot.com/2009/02/video-jon-stewart-shows-jason-jones.html)

via minor ripper.

[Winehole23]

Hilarious.

"If the MSM reports on it, maybe it's worth another look."

[RandomGuy]

This thread has THE highest "read" count of any politics thread.

Random bump of the day #2.

I will stop there, and beg apologies for bumping threads of no real import.

Back to the regularly scheduled boutons/bizarro_boutons ranting. :lol

[CuckingFunt]

This thread contains even more win than I remembered.

[sook]

bump.

Wow.

Read.

All.

56.

Pages.


Not really, but I read a lot of them.

[LnGrrrR]

I voted for Obama because I absolutely loathe the idea of the unitary executive, and hope he'll dismantle some of the Patriot Act bills. (Of course, his vote for FISA/telecom immunity doesn't give me lots of hope, but moreso than McCain.)

Hahahaha. Stupid me.

[DarkReign]

Hahahaha. Stupid me.

I ended up voting Bob Barr based solely on my disgust with the system of elections.

I will say however, this thread was incredibly entertaining to read (again). Remember sane Extra Stout? Yeah...

[ElNono]

epic back and forth with Trainwreck2100 at the end there :lol

[Drachen]

Ok DarrinS, I give you a pass on having two accounts. I read about half of the thread and you were funny (and surprisingly reasonable when posting as yourself).

[Drachen]

Oh and BTW, I am glad I read it. I have been trying to find the video of that lady who "should have her ovaries scraped and hunted for sport" for a long time. Now I know where to find it if ever I need it (I could never get the search terms right).

[FYM]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Bartleby (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2838623#post2838623)
You're not one of those "Obama is the anti-Christ" people, are you?


I don't know. Maybe.

I have not rulled out the possibility, but I don't have enough information yet to be certain one way or the other.

If Senator Obama has addressed the anti Christ accusations, I would be greatly interested to hear what he had to say.
Have any articles/ quotes?

:lmao who the fuck is this angel_luv ????

[FYM]

I didn't say Obama was the anti Christ- only that he COULD be and that time would prove it one way or the other.

I am just saying that I am watching Senator Obama- very carefully.


The Anti Christ is going to be someone that is well spoken, well liked, charismatic, impressive and likely handsome.
The Anti Christ will be convincing and a humanitarian.
Not until later in his reign will the Anti Christ show his true colors and prove to be the villian that he is.

What concerns me about Obama is 1) how he appears to be so easily and widespread received as a political savior
and 2) the instances in which Obama subtly undermines the Truth of the Bible while appearing to embrace it.

I offer this example of the latter:



You cannot pick and choose portions of the Scripture to embrace. Either God's Word is ALL true or it is a lie.

In the above referenced verses, we are not even talking about Old Testament vs New Testament.
Senator Obama does not even have the faith to take the entire New Testament as it is written.

Yet Senator Obama is willing to reference to parts of it such as the Sermon on the Mount that he knows most everyone will find palatable.

You may all think I am crazy.
But at least you can know I am not a liar because I tell you EXACTLY what I believe, regardless of how popular or unpopular my view is.

Someone, someday WILL be the anti christ, so I am not sure why you find so shocking the fact that I am open to Obama proving to be he.
Again, I admit nothing has been absolutely proven- yet.

:lmao really ??? Too bad this poster doesn't post anymore, this is comedy gold !!!!!!!!

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTEewMZv5pftBgPbkCRaLeWkb9uVbIdb UAX0lw0y1HpHHj2y-44dA

[DarrinS]

Ok DarrinS, I give you a pass on having two accounts. I read about half of the thread and you were funny (and surprisingly reasonable when posting as yourself).


I can still be reasonable when I'm not attacked by a group of shin-kicking children (you know who you are).

[ChumpDumper]

Too sensitive tbh.

[DarrinS]

I lost track of thread along time ago and never read all 56 pages.

So, was it ever proven conclusively that Obama is not the antichrist?

[HI-FI]

I ended up voting Bob Barr based solely on my disgust with the system of elections.

I will say however, this thread was incredibly entertaining to read (again). Remember sane Extra Stout? Yeah...
reading through some of Stout's stuff, it's too bad he went crazy and splintered off into various guises. He had some really good takes, very intelligent and thoughtful. Maybe he was bored of being serious on here since so many are full of shit.

[Drachen]

I lost track of thread along time ago and never read all 56 pages.

So, was it ever proven conclusively that Obama is not the antichrist?

By Angel_luv's own litmus test? Yes it was conclusively proven (within the first several pages, I believe). If she ever conceded that he passed her own test with flying colors, I don't know. (I didn't read the whole thing).

[Stringer_Bell]

I lost track of thread along time ago and never read all 56 pages.

So, was it ever proven conclusively that Obama is not the antichrist?

The jury is still out, we need to see if he allows Iran to get teh n00ks. If he does, it's 100% super-duper true that Obama is the antichrist. It just hasn't happened - yet.

Tbqh, if I was the Devil, I would choose the form of a well-educated black man so that if anyone in this PC modern society criticized me - I and my surrogates could cry "RACISM!! RACISTSSSS!" and just go about my business. I mean, isn't it kind of funny that nobody in Hawaii remembers Barry as a child and no one remembers him from high school or college? It's just like he appeared out of nowhere, AMIRIGHT???!

[LnGrrrR]

Funny fact actually... there's probably a reason this is the most viewed thread.

http://www.theatlantic.com/daily-dish/archive/2008/10/a-sports-fans-take/209859/

So, DarkReign, I guess I can thank you for bringing me to Spurstalk in the first place. :toast

[Wild Cobra]

I lost track of thread along time ago and never read all 56 pages.

So, was it ever proven conclusively that Obama is not the antichrist?
Haven't you heard?

That's the Devil's greatest feat. Convincing people he doesn't exist!

[Jacob1983]

Obama isn't the anti-Christ. He's Bush on steroids.

[Wild Cobra]

Obama isn't the anti-Christ. He's Bush on steroids.
Really?

You mean he wants to reduce regulations, increase energy production, and cut taxes?

[clambake]

I didn't say Obama was the anti Christ- only that he COULD be and that time would prove it one way or the other.

I am just saying that I am watching Senator Obama- very carefully.


The Anti Christ is going to be someone that is well spoken, well liked, charismatic, impressive and likely handsome.
The Anti Christ will be convincing and a humanitarian.
Not until later in his reign will the Anti Christ show his true colors and prove to be the villian that he is.

What concerns me about Obama is 1) how he appears to be so easily and widespread received as a political savior
and 2) the instances in which Obama subtly undermines the Truth of the Bible while appearing to embrace it.

I offer this example of the latter:



You cannot pick and choose portions of the Scripture to embrace. Either God's Word is ALL true or it is a lie.

In the above referenced verses, we are not even talking about Old Testament vs New Testament.
Senator Obama does not even have the faith to take the entire New Testament as it is written.

Yet Senator Obama is willing to reference to parts of it such as the Sermon on the Mount that he knows most everyone will find palatable.

You may all think I am crazy.
But at least you can know I am not a liar because I tell you EXACTLY what I believe, regardless of how popular or unpopular my view is.

Someone, someday WILL be the anti christ, so I am not sure why you find so shocking the fact that I am open to Obama proving to be he.
Again, I admit nothing has been absolutely proven- yet.

thats right honey. all of the bible or none.

[ElNono]

If Clinton is visible, and audible, she's lying and - losing.

It is biblically certain that a God-blessed country that has, in its history, looked upward to God and pleased Him with its sending of help, protection, food and missionaries into a dark, despotic world would become a prominent target for Satan's demonic attacks.

These attacks over the last two generations have been effective - as America, in her prosperity, has turned away from God in a comfortable, rising standard of living and [abused] self-government that was the envy of the world.

The blessings and hedge of protection that America once enjoyed, even without conscious thought, are being withheld and withdrawn by God.

As Clinton supporters (below) defend yet another impending attack from the devil, in the form of an elected evildoer in the White House as president, it is clear that another period of darkness, not seen since The Civil War, is looming.

Clinton is a very bad person. The rate at which our indifference to this type of menace taking over, is breathtaking. So is the ignorance - and blindness.

[ducks]

anyone but clinton
clinton is a proven bad person in office