McDonald: Farmer Makes Cut

[duncan228]

Sorry, I just saw the Hairston waived thread. I would have put this there.

Jeff McDonald: Farmer makes cut (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/archives/2008/10/jeff_mcdonald_f_2.html)

To the surprise of nobody who watched the Spurs' preseason finale against Miami on Friday, Malik Hairston was not with the team when they returned to practice Sunday morning.

Hairston did not play against the Heat, ceding 20 minutes to Desmon Farmer, his competition for the Spurs' final roster spot. It doesn't take a soothsayer to surmise Hairston has been waived in favor of Farmer.

The team has not yet made an official announcement, but one is expected later this afternoon.

Farmer, a 27-year-old swingman, averaged 8.1 points in seven preseason games, and shot 46.4 percent from 3-point range.

Hairston, whom the Spurs acquired in a draft-day trade with Phoenix, enjoyed an impressive defensive camp.
This appears to be one time the Spurs chose offense over defense.

Farmer, who had an eight-game cup of coffee with Seattle in 2006, has drawn comparisons with a young Stephen Jackson in camp.

EDIT: Ask and ye shall receive ... The Spurs have just announced they've waived Hairston.

[Mavs<Spurs]

thank you for posting this.

[Ice009]

Hairston did not play against the Heat, ceding 20 minutes to Desmon Farmer, his competition for the Spurs' final roster spot. It doesn't take a soothsayer to surmise Hairston has been waived in favor of Farmer.

This guy is great. LOL most people here thought Farmer was gone. So is he reading Spurstalk, stealing information and now calling people in here dumb for not working it out?

Why the fuck didn't he publish this article earlier if it was so easy to work out?

[BronxCowboy]

Farmer, who had an eight-game cup of coffee with Seattle in 2006, has drawn comparisons with a young Stephen Jackson in camp.

Stephen Jackson? Really? Granted, I haven't been able to see any of the games, but Jackson wasn't really a high percentage shooter from 3, and was longer and a pretty decent defender. Can anyone who has been watching the games clarify this comparison?

[Ice009]

Stephen Jackson? Really? Granted, I haven't been able to see any of the games, but Jackson wasn't really a high percentage shooter from 3, and was longer and a pretty decent defender. Can anyone who has been watching the games clarify this comparison?

It's about attitude. Balls to take and make shots.

He's not comparing his overall game to Stephen. Farmer has that Sjax like attitude. We need both that and shooting on this team.

I hope Farmer can bring that stuff in the big league now.

[The Truth #6]

I'll eat crow. I didn't see this one coming. Hopefully we can look at this as the cup being half full. We got a decent player, even though we had to let another decent player get away. I hope that we can get Hairston overseas somewhere, although it's possible another team might pick him up.

[DPG21920]

It is a little surprising to me, I thought Farmer was gone for sure, for the main reason that Hairston was thought to be better offensively than defensively and it turned out to be the opposite. Not only that, usually teams that make draft picks tend to keep them because they do not want to look like they just wasted them. I bet it was a very hard decision but it came down to Pop deciding that offense was more important now.

[ChumpDumper]

Most teams aren't looking for project swingmen on the waiver wire at this time of the year, so if Hairston starts the season in Austin he'll probably be there for awhile.

[Obstructed_View]

I think I'm going to be sick to my stomach.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol Why would anyone be sick about spot #15?

[The Truth #6]

I think I'm going to be sick to my stomach.

Malik was your favorite out of the 3, I guess?

[tomtom]

Glad to see him make it. He's proved himself in the D League and the Preseason. Welcome aboard matey. On the other hand I wish we could have gotten Hairston too.

[Obstructed_View]

:lol Why would anyone be sick about spot #15?

Because it's preseason, and you haven't been reading the threads. Also, just because someone is the last cut doesn't mean they are going to be the last person on the roster. Hairston can contribute on defense on a team that has that exact job description coming open soon.

[tlongII]

Glad to see him make it. He's proved himself in the D League and the Preseason. Welcome aboard matey. On the other hand I wish we could have gotten Hairston too.

I thought you were a Blazers fan?

[ChumpDumper]

Because it's preseason, and you haven't been reading the threads.
I have been reading the threads. The usual overreaction about any little thing concerning players 13-18.

Anything else?

[Solid D]

:lol Why would anyone be sick about spot #15?

It's sort of a fun exercise to rank the players in order of significance. Pop doesn't really go by rankings. he looks at matchups, game by game. However, I might rank them sans-Manu:

1. Duncan
2. Parker
3. Bowen
4. Finley
5. Oberto
6. Udoka
7. Mason
8. Thomas
9. Vaughn
10. Hill
11. Bonner
12. Tolliver
13. Farmer

Manu and Mahinmi are physically unable to perform

[Obstructed_View]

I have been reading the threads. The usual overreaction about any little thing concerning players 13-18.

Anything else?

Hmm, if you've been reading the threads, then why would you ask a question I've answered a bunch of times, smartass? :lol

[ChumpDumper]

Your overreactions don't rise above the noise of all the others, sorry.

[Obstructed_View]

Your overreactions don't rise above the noise of all the others, sorry.

Yeah, I knew you weren't paying attention but wouldn't be man enough to admit it.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Your overreactions don't rise above the noise of all the others, sorry.

psst, I tried sending you a PM but it said you had maxed out your quota.

Someone's popular

[Gino2882]

I don't think its an overreaction at all. Hairston was a Spurs draft pick and a 21 year old 6'6 SG/SF who has really solid potential. Hairston showed very good defense and the ability to fill the stat sheet.

Farmer is a 27 year old d-leaguer who may just be on a hot 3 streak. I think Pop will regret this one if Hairston is signed by someone else.

This is what makes following Spurs young players and the draft so frustrating and wasteful. Splitter, Mahinmi, Hill, Hairston, Gist all out of the lineup for various reasons...

[ChumpDumper]

So tell me what's up. I didn't read the specific thread out of the dozens whining about IR players.

Please let me know about this specific post.

[Obstructed_View]

I don't think its an overreaction at all. Hairston was a Spurs draft pick and a 21 year old 6'6 SG/SF who has really solid potential. Hairston showed very good defense and the ability to fill the stat sheet.

Farmer is a 27 year old d-leaguer who may just be on a hot 3 streak. I think Pop will regret this one if Hairston is signed by someone else.

This is what makes following Spurs young players and the draft so frustrating and wasteful. Splitter, Mahinmi, Hill, Hairston, Gist all out of the lineup for various reasons...

To expand on that, Tolliver is a camp invitee because he hit some shots in summer league and then failed to draw iron as often as he made it in the preseason games. His lone highlight was missing two layups and then making one.

[SenorSpur]

Farmer sounds like a 2-guard only. His offfensive prowess aside, does anyone know what kind of defender he is?

I'm looking forward to getting a look at him. I just know that once Manu comes back, he'll be buried at the end of the bench.

[ChumpDumper]

Farmer sounds like a 2-guard only. His offfensive prowess aside, does anyone know what kind of defender he is?

I'm looking forward to getting a look at him. I just know that once Manu comes back, he'll be buried at the end of the bench.As would Hairston.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

If Farmer gets decent playing time, I'm willing to bet his FG% will be higher than Michael Finley's.

Book it.

[SenorSpur]

If Farmer gets decent playing time, I'm willing to bet his FG% will be higher than Michael Finley's.

Book it.

You know if that turns out to be true, I would that Farmer would move up in the regular rotation. I know that Pop's ongoing man-crush with Finley would never allow that to happen, but it's nice to think about.

[SenorSpur]

I wonder what Pop's intentions are with Farmer. Is this a long-term signing or a stop-gap signing to get the team through the dark Manu-less period?

[Amuseddaysleeper]

You know if that turns out to be true, I would that Farmer would move up in the regular rotation. I know that Pop's ongoing man-crush with Finley would never allow that to happen, but it's nice to think about.

That's what I'm afriad of. It's like you mentioned before about Pop's man-crush with NVE that was part of the Spurs undoing against the Mavs back in 2006.

If anything, I would love for Pop to experiment more than ever with the youth on this team early on in the season. Develop the bench now, because we already know what we're gonna get with the veterans (which outside the big 3 won't be very much but still :lol)

[SenorSpur]

That's what I'm afriad of. It's like you mentioned before about Pop's man-crush with NVE that was part of the Spurs undoing against the Mavs back in 2006.

If anything, I would love for Pop to experiment more than ever with the youth on this team early on in the season. Develop the bench now, because we already know what we're gonna get with the veterans (which outside the big 3 won't be very much but still :lol)

Exactly. I'm still convinced that the time to experiment is during those dog days of the regular season months of Dec, Jan and Feb. How are guys ever supposed to get experience if they cannot get court time?

[Obstructed_View]

Farmer sounds like a 2-guard only. His offfensive prowess aside, does anyone know what kind of defender he is?

I'm looking forward to getting a look at him. I just know that once Manu comes back, he'll be buried at the end of the bench.

They can probably hide him, but I'm looking forward to the Farmer/Finley/Bowen/Watkins/KT lineups for that extra offensive oomph. :)

[benefactor]

I just can't say I like this. I would rather spend the spot on a player that might be developed. Someday we have to think about that. Instead we have an end of the bench 27 yr old who can shoot but plays no defense and seems questionable as a system player. Outstanding.

[Obstructed_View]

So tell me what's up. I didn't read the specific thread out of the dozens whining about IR players.

Please let me know about this specific post.

Thank you for asking. Finally.

We've been beating this issue into the ground over the last week, and most all of us realize that the final choices, when viewed big picture, are six of one, half dozen of the other, but it's preseason and there's really nothing else going on to discuss. The debate has been brisk, but nobody takes it completely seriously. I've joked a couple of different times that I'm well aware that I'm in danger of getting too invested in the debate, and there was a post where I said I wouldn't be heartbroken if Hairston didn't make the team, and then said that yeah, I probably would. The guys that have been following that were expecting the "I'm sick to my stomach" post from me, and I was only happy to oblige. It was mainly an attempt to be funny and you decided to step in and ridicule me for it.

As to the specifics, I still think that Hairston is a legitimate NBA defender, and whether Manu is healthy or not has little to do with his value. I'm fairly sure that someone will pick him up, which is why I don't like the cut, but if he ends up getting to spend a year in Austin and come in next year, then I'm happy as can be.

[ChumpDumper]

So basically the choosing of IR players was overdiscussed.

Again.

I didn't miss anything at all.

[benefactor]

So basically the choosing of IR players was overdiscussed.

Again.

I didn't miss anything at all.
You saying this is actually the key to the discussion. If its only for IR players then why not use it on a player that actually has upside and can be developed in Austin and has the potential to be a key member of the rotation next year?

[wisnub]

cannot find farmer in youtube. Did anyone here got his highlights or any videos link about him at all?? I really want to see this guy scores though, Im happy finally Spurs want to upgrade offense, I know defense win championship but what we need is fuckin offense beside big 3

[Obstructed_View]

So basically the choosing of IR players was overdiscussed.

Again.

I didn't miss anything at all.

You just decided to leap in and act like a douchebag when you clearly didn't get the joke, and then lied about it when challenged. We didn't miss you either.

[ChumpDumper]

You saying this is actually the key to the discussion. If its only for IR players then why not use it on a player that actually has upside and can be developed in Austin and has the potential to be a key member of the rotation next year?I said there was a legitimate argument between having abilities needed now (Farmer's scoring) and potential upside (Hairston's D). I even argued for keeping Hairston for that very reason, but I just never felt it was a big enough difference to get upset if things went the other way.

Now I think it's just a matter of playing or trading Bonner. Then we can talk about what we'd like to get back or replace him with if he isn't played.

[ChumpDumper]

You just decided to leap in and act like a douchebag when you clearly didn't get the joke, and then lied about it when challenged. We didn't miss you either.Wow, this really does have you upset.

I do read the threads; I feel bad that I didn't commit everything posted to memory. I just don't think that highly of a lot of posters. That's my bad.

Sorry to ruin your day.

[Obstructed_View]

Now I think it's just a matter of playing or trading Bonner. Then we can talk about what we'd like to get back or replace him with if he isn't played.

Amen. I'm hoping that Pop's seeming fixation on Tolliver isn't so that he can have someone to take minutes away from Bonner while he rots away on the bench collecting his paycheck.

[ChumpDumper]

I just hope whoever is playing better plays.

[angelbelow]

congrats to farmer, dont waste it.

[DMX7]

Farmer is not good on defense but he is an amazingly athletic player who can stroke the 3-point ball. Like other people have said, if the Spurs can hide Brent Barry on defense, they can hide Farmer (who has the potential to become a better defender if they work with him on it).

[Obstructed_View]

Wow, this really does have you upset.

Sorry to ruin your day.

Not particularly, although I must say I'm not a big fan of being insulted and then having to explain it. If you don't like the reaction you got, maybe you should learn not to step into a discussion and immediately start talking down to people that might know more than you do about what's going on.

[benefactor]

I said there was a legitimate argument between having abilities needed now (Farmer's scoring) and potential upside (Hairston's D). I even argued for keeping Hairston for that very reason, but I just never felt it was a big enough difference to get upset if things went the other way.

Now I think it's just a matter of playing or trading Bonner. Then we can talk about what we'd like to get back or replace him with if he isn't played.
I am not upset about losing Hairston as much as I am upset about our FO's lack of concern about what is in store for the future beyond the TD/TP/Manu era. We are only looking at a 2 year window. We need to start getting the new cast ready now.

[tmtcsc]

Farmer sounds like a 2-guard only. His offfensive prowess aside, does anyone know what kind of defender he is?

I'm looking forward to getting a look at him. I just know that once Manu comes back, he'll be buried at the end of the bench.

Remember how Brent would pass up shots and so would Finley when they were obviously on the floor to shoot ? That's not Farmer. Farmer has Don Nelson in his blood. He has a "F*ck this ! Give me the ball, I'll take the shot and make it" mentality.

Now, actually being in the game and saying those things will be a whole different story. I think he's a good pick up.

As for the defense, he looks like he has the physical tools to do the job. Especially in our scheme where staying in front of your defender and leading them to the inside is key. I honestly didn't pay attention to his defense as much.

[duncan228]

I love it here. I can lurk in a conversation like this and listen to opinions and learn.

:corn:

[ChumpDumper]

I am not upset about losing Hairston as much as I am upset about our FO's lack of concern about what is in store for the future beyond the TD/TP/Manu era. We are only looking at a 2 year window. We need to start getting the new cast ready now.They know it's pretty much going to suck when Duncan is gone no matter what.

[SequSpur]

It's sort of a fun exercise to rank the players in order of significance. Pop doesn't really go by rankings. he looks at matchups, game by game. However, I might rank them sans-Manu:

1. Duncan
2. Parker
3. Bowen
4. Finley
5. Oberto
6. Udoka
7. Mason
8. Thomas
9. Vaughn
10. Hill
11. Bonner
12. Tolliver
13. Farmer

Manu and Mahinmi are physically unable to perform

Bowen has no statistics and didn't do shit in preseason.
He is the oldest and worst of all starting forwards in the Western Conference and you have him ranked 3rd. You're such a homer.

[DPG21920]

They know it's pretty much going to suck when Duncan is gone no matter what.

Well hopefully it won't suck that bad considering we do not know what the plan is for 2010 and the fact that although Duncan will be gone and you cannot replace him, his 22 million dollars will be around.

[ChumpDumper]

I think Duncan will be here past 2010, if only for a couple of years. The order of departure will be Manu/Duncan/Parker.

[duncan228]

Duncan is signed through 2012. His salary:

08-09: $20,598,703
09-10: $22,183,218
10-11: $18,700,000
11-12: $21,300,000

[DPG21920]

I think Duncan will be here past 2010, if only for a couple of years. The order of departure will be Manu/Duncan/Parker.

He better be, his contract goes until 2012

[ChumpDumper]

See? I was right!

[duncan228]

:lol

[DPG21920]

I was saying that we will have two events that are large unknowns that will determine things:

2010: who will we see as free agents, what money will we have and what to do with Manu?

2012: Duncan's contract expires, based on 2010, who can we target that is available if we assume Duncan will retire and his 21-22 million dollars is available to spend.

[Solid D]

Bowen has no statistics and didn't do shit in preseason.
He is the oldest and worst of all starting forwards in the Western Conference and you have him ranked 3rd. You're such a homer.

You make it too easy.


2007-08 NBA ALL-DEFENSIVE FIRST TEAM Position Player, Team 1st 2nd Points
Forward Kevin Garnett, Boston 24 4 52
Guard Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 24 4 52
Center Marcus Camby, Denver 14 9 37
Guard/Forward Bruce Bowen, San Antonio 13 10 36
Forward Tim Duncan, San Antonio 12 9 33

The voting panel consisted of the NBA’s 30 head coaches, who were asked to select NBA All-Defensive First and Second Teams by position.

[SenorSpur]

They know it's pretty much going to suck when Duncan is gone no matter what.

Sure it will. But the bottom doesn't totally have to completely fall out. I agree with Benefactor on this. I just don't think it's a smart strategy to keep forfeiting the future by casting your lot with "ring-chasing veterans", whose skills have diminished and are willing to play for the minimum.

A strategy of filling those voids via the draft and carefully selected mid-career free agents would be more appropriate. There never is any harm in "growing your own talent".

[Manufan909]

I wonder which superstar wants to go after the most. I personally hope he as his eyes on Dirk, then he'll have a shooting big even ST will agree with.
:king

And it's wishful thinking I know.

[SequSpur]

You make it too easy.


2007-08 NBA ALL-DEFENSIVE FIRST TEAM Position Player, Team 1st 2nd Points
Forward Kevin Garnett, Boston 24 4 52
Guard Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 24 4 52
Center Marcus Camby, Denver 14 9 37
Guard/Forward Bruce Bowen, San Antonio 13 10 36
Forward Tim Duncan, San Antonio 12 9 33

That was last year. Got damn spurs lost last year.. Bowen didn't do shit in the playoffs.

Frickin Homer....

[Spurs Brazil]

Congrats to Farmer. I was rooting for him but I'd like to keep Malik and waive Tolliver

I hope now Malik can go to Toros and improve there

[Amuseddaysleeper]

That was last year. Got damn spurs lost last year.. Bowen didn't do shit in the playoffs.

Frickin Homer....

Without Bowen, we woulda lost to the Hornets. His defense on Peja was solid.

[Manufan909]

Shit, he raped Peja on that court. When Bowen outscores you consistently, you know he owns you. Such is the case with Peja.

[Solid D]

That was last year. Got **** spurs lost last year.. Bowen didn't do **** in the playoffs.

Frickin Homer....

:lmao

Chris Paul lost last year too.

Bowen's jersey will hang in the rafters one day.

Anyways, Farmer is #13.

[tomtom]

I thought you were a Blazers fan?

What the hell man? I can like more than one team if I want to.

[galvatron3000]

Farmer should be more readily able to step in NOW if called upon than Malik. Malik was going to ride the pine all year not developing unless sent to the D league where as Farmer has been around a bit. Farmer is going to ride the pine too but as I stated would be more ready to step in and provide. Malik could possibly be on the Toros sometime this season or back in a Spurs uni if next season calls for it.

[SenorSpur]

This may be short-sighted, but any rook that has the skills and cahones to block a Tayshaun Prince shot, is a guy I want on my team.

[timtonymanu]

Welcome Desmon Farmer! Hopefully this isnt a bonehead move.

[SenorSpur]

Farmer should be more readily able to step in NOW if called upon than Malik. Malik was going to ride the pine all year not developing unless sent to the D league where as Farmer has been around a bit. Farmer is going to ride the pine too but as I stated would be more ready to step in and provide. Malik could possibly be on the Toros sometime this season or back in a Spurs uni if next season calls for it.


Assuming some team doesn't pick him up.

Just had a CIA conspirarcy theory. Perhaps the Spurs waited until the last minute to allow other teams to set their rosters. This way whoever they cut would be less likely to sign with another team. Long shot theory, but what the hell? I'm bored waiting on the start of the regular season.

[jjktkk]

:lol Why would anyone be sick about spot #15?

Exactly so many former members are ranting and raving over end of the bench guys (Farmer,Hairston). You'd think by ST, that the Spurs FO just waived a future hall of famer.

[urunobili]

Assuming some team doesn't pick him up.

Just had a CIA conspiracy theory. Perhaps the Spurs waited until the last minute to allow other teams to set their rosters. This way whoever they cut would be less likely to sign with another team. Long shot theory, but what the hell? I'm bored waiting on the start of the regular season.

yeah we don't actually know if any team has tried to lure him away from us still... and if he turns it up at the Toros and we could move a player or if Tolliver doesn't pan out we could call him up...

FIXED

[Buddy Holly]

Who's to say the Spurs didn't ask Malik if he were willing to play overseas for one season and he said yes?

[HarlemHeat37]

yeah we don't actually know if any team has tried to lure him away from us still... and if he turns it up at the Toros and we could move a player or when Tolliver doesn't pan out we could call him up...

[Chomag]

Exactly so many former members are ranting and raving over end of the bench guys (Farmer,Hairston). You'd think by ST, that the Spurs FO just waived a future hall of famer.

Don't you want the best possible player in every spot on our team? The way the competition is these days even the 15th spot might make some difference.

Putting that aside though. These players that are at the end of our bench today can be moved up later. Be it this season or the next few. OR Maybe that wont happen but many can argue that there is allot of potintual in our camp foder this year.

[Spurs Brazil]

To the surprise of nobody who watched the Spurs' preseason finale against Miami on Friday, Malik Hairston was not with the team when they returned to practice Sunday morning.

So why McDonald didn't report if after the game????

[manufor3]

I think I'm going to be sick to my stomach.

[AC#21_TD ERA]

Well done Desmond. Good signing he's exactly what we need scoring.

[xtremesteven33]

Hopefully he can become the next Stephen Jackson. Thats all i hope for. Jax wasnt a great athlete and wasnt a great "create your own shot" kinda guy but he was a fantastic role player who took a lot of burden off the superstars with the Spurs.

Although Jax was turnover prone he was still one of the most clutch spurs players we have ever seen....and for those who forgot how he was, check this out.....

HRieYTW3zkM

[duncan228]

Updated.

Farmer makes final Spurs cut, hopes it will be last (http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Farmer_makes_final_Spurs_cut_hopes_it_will_be_last .html)
By Jeff McDonald

There was no wild celebration when Desmon Farmer got the news. He didn't let out a whoop, didn't flash his soon-to-be-trademarked toothy grin, didn't dare offer his new head coach a commemorative fist bump.

It was late Friday night when Spurs coach Gregg Popovich informed Farmer that he'd survived what is likely to be the final cut of training camp. The best reaction Farmer could muster was stone silence.

“I didn't know if I was getting cut or if I was making it,” Farmer said Sunday. “It shocked me a little bit. It didn't really kick in until the next day.”

Farmer's measured response was understandable. When you've opened the door to Ed McMahon on more than one occasion, only to have him pull the Publisher's Clearinghouse check out of your hands at the last moment, you approach even good news with caution.

The Spurs made official Sunday a decision they'd actually rendered two nights earlier, waiving rookie Malik Hairston in favor of Farmer, a 27-year-old journeyman of a swingman who, in the mother of all backhanded compliments, rates as one of the all-time greats in the history of the NBA's Development League.

Barring some unforeseen development before today's 5 p.m. roster deadline, Farmer should start the season on the Spurs' 15-man roster. This marks a signpost in his journey back to the NBA, after an eight-game cup of Starbucks with Seattle in 2006.

“I'm just happy to be here, happy to be in the NBA again,” said Farmer, who came to camp as a nonroster invitee. “I'm just hoping to take advantage of it.”

It isn't quite accurate to consider Farmer a basketball version of Crash Davis — after all, he only spent part of three seasons in the NBA hinterlands. It only felt like three decades.

Farmer stands as the NBA Development League's career scoring leader with 2,238 points, which is a bit like being called the most musically talented Monkee. It's a designation worth bragging about, but only to a point.

Undrafted out of Southern California in 2004, Farmer played 48 games with the Tulsa 66ers in 2005-06, and returned for 32 the next season after Seattle waived him.

After being pink-slipped from Indiana Pacers camp last year, Farmer wound up with the Rio Grande Valley Vipers, a D-League outpost based in Hidalgo, 250 miles due south of San Antonio. He played 33 games there and averaged 24.7 points

All the while, Farmer wondered what he had to do to advance to a league in which the meal money would spring for a steak, instead of a fast-food hamburger.

“I didn't really know what (NBA scouts) were looking for out of me,” he said.

Heading to camp, Farmer was considered a marginal bet to make the Spurs' roster.

By the end, the rivalry for the 15th spot became a two-man tug-of-war between Farmer and Hairston, a guard the Spurs acquired in a draft-day swap with Phoenix for second-round pick Goran Dragic in June.

Hairston enjoyed a fine defensive camp and generally seemed to adapt well to the Spurs' system. One of the Spurs' fears going forward is that Hairston will land with another NBA team.

Farmer, however, played well enough to make the Spurs feel comfortable giving him another NBA shot. He averaged 8.1 points in seven preseason games, hitting on 13 of 28 3-pointers.

“He did exactly what he did when he played in the NBDL,” said Spurs forward Bruce Bowen, who earlier in his career spent time in the shoes of both Farmer and Hairston. “He scored, he shot the ball well from three. He stuck with what he does, and it paid off for him.”

Over the past three weeks, Spurs coaches have come to love Farmer's fearlessness.

Some compare him to Stephen Jackson, another take-no-prisoners gunner who made the Spurs out of camp in 2001 and has since blossomed into a bona fide NBA scorer.

Of course, Farmer didn't return to the NBA's doorstep by being Stephen Jackson.

“(The Spurs) basically just told me to be Desmon Farmer.”

[DMX7]

You make it too easy.


2007-08 NBA ALL-DEFENSIVE FIRST TEAM Position Player, Team 1st 2nd Points
Forward Kevin Garnett, Boston 24 4 52
Guard Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 24 4 52
Center Marcus Camby, Denver 14 9 37
Guard/Forward Bruce Bowen, San Antonio 13 10 36
Forward Tim Duncan, San Antonio 12 9 33

The voting panel consisted of the NBA’s 30 head coaches, who were asked to select NBA All-Defensive First and Second Teams by position.

If they saw the conference finals they wouldn't have voted that way again. He was abused so badly it was sad. His days of even being annoying to Kobe are over.

[Solid D]

If they saw the conference finals they wouldn't have voted that way again. He was abused so badly it was sad. His days of even being annoying to Kobe are over.

...or not.

[SenorSpur]

Updated.

Hairston enjoyed a fine defensive camp and generally seemed to adapt well to the Spurs' system. One of the Spurs' fears going forward is that Hairston will land with another NBA team.

Very interesting. I wonder if this means the Spurs are open to reacquiring Hairston at some point in the future?

[HarlemHeat37]

I would be surprised if he isn't picked it up..

the Spurs FO has made many questionable decisions the past few years, but there might not be a team that scouts better..somebody will pick him up, not only for his potential, but because he was scouted by a team with great history for picking out talent..

[timvp]

I'm pretty excited about Farmer making the team. (Well, about as excited as you could be for a 15th man who could very likely not play a meaningful minute this year.)

Farmer has been an intriguing player for a long while. While he's a flawed player, the one thing he can do is score the ball. He has a fearlessness about him that you don't find in many players. Like a lot of us have said, he has a Stephen Jackson quality about him in terms of toughness and never being afraid to shoot the rock.

The Spurs don't have a lot of offensive toughness on the perimeter outside of the Big Three. They have a lot of guys who can hit open shots but they don't have a lot of aggressive scorers who can create and aren't afraid to rock the boat. Farmer could potential fill that void.

I'll be interested to see how much of a shot Pop will give to Farmer. Honestly, Farmer could have very well played better than Mason during the preseason. And while Udoka had a strong finish to his preseason, Farmer was more consistent throughout.

I do wonder what the long term plans are for Farmer. As I've said previously, he could just be a stop gap until Manu is healthy and then could be released (likely in a move that would bring back Hairston or a similar young prospect to put on the Toros). As a stop gap, Farmer likely will be used as depth in case of another perimeter injury or he could be called upon if the Spurs find out they can't score without Manu.

If he isn't a stop gap, will the Spurs send him to Austin? Farmer doesn't have much left to prove on the D-League level so I'm not sure what good that will do. However, Farmer is an age where he could be kept around and then he could work himself into the Spurs rotation as an eventual replacement for Finley.

The thing I like best about Farmer is he is a player I can imagine who could thrive under the pressure of the playoffs. As a designated bench scorer, I think he could come in and light it up and help the team with his aggressiveness. He's never going to be a lockdown defender or a guard who can run the team but as we saw last season, there is something to be said about having a player who can end a team-wide offensive slump.

[Manufan909]

So(timvp), who do you think will join Ian and Manu in a suit come Wednesday?

[timvp]

So(timvp), who do you think will join Ian and Manu in a suit come Wednesday?Probably Tolliver. Not sure if Tolliver will even be with the team.

However, if Tolliver is with the team, he might be active considering the foul trouble Shaq can get the bigs in. If Tolliver isn't inactive, it'll be Farmer. Longshot would be Hill if he's still sick or the Spurs want to take their time with his thumb injury.

[mountainballer]

I'll be interested to see how much of a shot Pop will give to Farmer. Honestly, Farmer could have very well played better than Mason during the preseason. And while Udoka had a strong finish to his preseason, Farmer was more consistent throughout.


first off, I wasn't happy that the Spurs have chosen Farmer over Hairston, but since it's become a fact, I try to see the positive. what you said I was also thinking, Farmer looked a bit like the player Mason was supposed to be.
if we consider, that one year ago the then 27 years old Mason didn't have a that much better looking NBA history than Farmer (just one season with not impressive numbers), we are talking about somehow similar players. so, what if Farmer turns out to be the better player for the Spurs? will we have another 3 million making bench warmer in Mason?
(on a positive note: assuming that the Spurs are working on a deadline trade for a big, a contract like Mason's might be a nice filler piece. if another team wants it all all.)

[Slippy]

I do wonder what the long term plans are for Farmer. As I've said previously, he could just be a stop gap until Manu is healthy and then could be released (likely in a move that would bring back Hairston or a similar young prospect to put on the Toros). As a stop gap, Farmer likely will be used as depth in case of another perimeter injury or he could be called upon if the Spurs find out they can't score without Manu.

If he isn't a stop gap, will the Spurs send him to Austin? Farmer doesn't have much left to prove on the D-League level so I'm not sure what good that will do. However, Farmer is an age where he could be kept around and then he could work himself into the Spurs rotation as an eventual replacement for Finley.

The thing I like best about Farmer is he is a player I can imagine who could thrive under the pressure of the playoffs. As a designated bench scorer, I think he could come in and light it up and help the team with his aggressiveness. He's never going to be a lockdown defender or a guard who can run the team but as we saw last season, there is something to be said about having a player who can end a team-wide offensive slump.


If defense is not his staple then some of that pressure will come from not being part of the regular rotation. He gonna have to score with limited opportunities, mins and touches. I've yet to see the guy play so can't comment.. just hope for the best going into the season especially on those scoring droughts. If he can score on an instant with out much fuss and not go shy on the team like many other players do. Then he should help the Spurs long after Manu returns.

[The Truth #6]

I wonder if they'll ever put JV on the IR. If Hill is healthy, and we signed Farmer for scoring, JV doesn't seem as needed. I understand the desire to have him on the team but I'd prefer to keep him on the IR and let him mentor in practice.

[SenorSpur]

If he isn't a stop gap, will the Spurs send him to Austin? Farmer doesn't have much left to prove on the D-League level so I'm not sure what good that will do. However, Farmer is an age where he could be kept around and then he could work himself into the Spurs rotation as an eventual replacement for Finley.



In the McDonald post above, he references the fact that Farmer has played parts of two seasons in the D-League

Undrafted out of Southern California in 2004, Farmer played 48 games with the Tulsa 66ers in 2005-06, and returned for 32 the next season after Seattle waived him.

If that is true, wouldn't he no longer be eligible for D-League assignment?

[xtremesteven33]

the only problem i see with farmer is his height. S-Jax was a good 6'8'' so he could get his shot over most SG's or SF's.

Farmer is 6'5'' and seems to be a little short for most SG's.

[benefactor]

the only problem i see with farmer is his height. S-Jax was a good 6'8'' so he could get his shot over most SG's or SF's.

Farmer is 6'5'' and seems to be a little short for most SG's.
Not really. Manu and Kobe are both 6'6 and DWade is 6'4. Capt. Jack was actually closer to the size of a SF/PF tweener who played like a SG. Farmer's game is pure SG, so he will probably be guarded by players that are close to his size. If I remember correctly he had a nice high release, so he should not have and problems shooting over defenders.

[SenorSpur]

Since I didn't get the chance to see him during preseason, I'm looking forward to seeing this kid play. Hope he's not buried deep on the bench during Manu's absence.

[ducks]

Lets Hope Spurs Blow Out Suns And Portland And We Can See Him!

[xellos88330]

Well, I hope Farmer can bring in the offensive punch consistently. If he does, then I don't mind it one bit. :toast

[Bruno]

http://www.themonitor.com/sports/alum_19134___article.html/call_gets.html

Another Vipers alum gets call to NBA
Farmer makes Spurs' opening-day roster

October 27, 2008 - 7:49PM
Todd Mavreles
The Monitor

McALLEN - During the 2007-08 NBA Development League season, Desmon Farmer proved he had an NBA-ready game by averaging 24.7 points per game and throwing in shots from 25 feet and beyond. Like any D-League player, all he needed was the opportunity to prove he belonged. The San Antonio Spurs gave Farmer that chance by inviting him to training camp, and now he's in the NBA.

Farmer, 27, is the latest D-League alum to make it to the NBA as the former Rio Grande Valley Vipers shooting guard is on the Spurs' opening-day roster as the season tips off tonight.

Farmer was the Spurs' fourth-leading scorer during the preseason with 8.1 points per game and shot 46.4 percent on 3-point attempts.

Farmer's status could change once Manu Ginobili (ankle) returns from the injured list, but for the time being the Vipers will make plans to not have Farmer, despite holding out hope of keeping a spot for the 6-foot-5 Southern Cal product.

"(For the Spurs) it came down to (Farmer) and Malik Harrison. I talked to his agent (Monday), and at least for the short term until Ginobili comes back (he'll be there)," Vipers coach Clay Moser said. "It really goes back to the conversation we had when I had to send in my protected list, when I had to pick him or Jesse Smith to protect. I thought Desmon was worth the gamble. It didn't pay off but it'll help us attract guys in the future."

Farmer is the second Vipers player to be signed by the NBA. Guard C.J. Watson was claimed by the Golden State Warriors last year and was slated to be their starting point guard before suffering an elbow injury during the preseason. He is on Golden State's injured list. Smith, meanwhile, was chosen by Reno in the D-League expansion draft.

[benefactor]

I do wonder what the long term plans are for Farmer. As I've said previously, he could just be a stop gap until Manu is healthy and then could be released (likely in a move that would bring back Hairston or a similar young prospect to put on the Toros). As a stop gap, Farmer likely will be used as depth in case of another perimeter injury or he could be called upon if the Spurs find out they can't score without Manu.

Looks like you are right on this one. I wonder if he can get enough PT to showcase what he is capable of? If not then the options you suggested would be fine with me.

[DPG21920]

Well that is what most people have said on here. Looks like the Spurs are willing to gamble. Take the scorer until Gino comes back, then hopefully Hairston is still available and you then cut Farmer.

[Ice009]

hmm interesting. If the Spurs aren't planning on keeping Farmer after Manu comes back then they probably should have just signed Hairston.

Unless the Spurs are going to give him a real chance until Manu comes back to see what he does with it. What do the Spurs do if he gets court time and plays really well? Do the Spurs till cut him for Hairston?

[benefactor]

hmm interesting. If the Spurs aren't planning on keeping Farmer after Manu comes back then they probably should have just signed Hairston.

Unless the Spurs are going to give him a real chance until Manu comes back to see what he does with it. If he excels maybe they will keep him for the whole season?
It's possible. If this information is coming from the mouth of his agent then Farmer knows he is going to have to play balls out in every minute he gets. We'll see how it plays out.

[SenorSpur]

It's possible. If this information is coming from the mouth of his agent then Farmer knows he is going to have to play balls out in every minute he gets. We'll see how it plays out.

The question is will Pop give him some time to showcase his skills. And the risk is whether Hairston will be available, if and when they do cut Farmer?

[The Truth #6]

I think it's Farmer's spot to keep unless he regresses. The comment by his agent might be what the Spurs told him, it might not, but if so, it still could just be a statement intended to motivate Farmer to not slack off.

The common assumption is that Farmer's fate will be determined by how well Manu plays when he returns. I would look at it the opposite. I think Farmer's fate will be determined more by how well, or possibly, how poorly the rest of the wings play throughout the season.

If Finley disappoints (granted, a hard task to accomplish in Pop's eyes) or Udoka and Mason don't deliver, then I could see Farmer sticking it out until the playoffs, assuming he doesn't make his own mistakes. Jump shooting seems to be even more coveted in the playoffs when every team packs the paint and dares us to shoot from the outside. If Farmer has even modest success then I think it will be more difficult to bring in another wing player half-way through the season, well knowing they won't be able to contribute much. With our window closing every year, I don't see that being a direction to pursue.

The thing to remember is that last year, even with Manu playing at an extremely high level, there still was a desperate need for outside shooting. My opinion is that situation won't change unless Mason or Tolliver deliver. If those guys play at a high level then maybe Farmer is gone but Mason and Tolliver could easily have the first year adjustment blues. I suppose Farmer would just as easily have issues adapting to the system but he seems like a player that would be less likely to worry about fitting in and realize his longevity with the Spurs will be based almost solely on his shooting. He hasn't been bashful so far. If Pop now sees him as a shooter then he could even give him huge leeway in the same way Pop has allowed Tolliver a permanent green light.

Who knows if he even sniffs the court? There are a myriad of scenarios. We'll see what happens. I suppose it's silly to put much hopes into an unproven young player, but I'd rather follow that development than how our core ages and slowly starts to decline.

[Obstructed_View]

Pop has dreams of Hill and Farmer putting up 35 points a night. :)

[ChumpDumper]

In the McDonald post above, he references the fact that Farmer has played parts of two seasons in the D-League

Undrafted out of Southern California in 2004, Farmer played 48 games with the Tulsa 66ers in 2005-06, and returned for 32 the next season after Seattle waived him.

If that is true, wouldn't he no longer be eligible for D-League assignment?Farmer joined the D-League each year as a free agent; he was not assigned as a member of an NBA roster. He played regular season games for Seattle in 06-07. Therefore, he could be assigned by the Spurs for one season. The only thing he could really pick up there is the Spurs defensive system.

If Farmer is an immediate bust, he could be waived at any time for Hairston or possibly someone with more scoring potential like Luke Jackson. If he is at all effective, I can see his being kept all season.

[DPG21920]

Coby Karl would not be a bad option either now that he was waived by the Lakers.

[timvp]

Farmer joined the D-League each year as a free agent; he was not assigned as a member of an NBA roster. He played regular season games for Seattle in 06-07. Therefore, he could be assigned by the Spurs for one season. The only thing he could really pick up there is the Spurs defensive system.That's what I thought but Bruno pointed out in another thread that Farmer technically already has two years of NBA experience. He picked one up earlier in his career with the Pacers even though he didn't play a game.

So the Spurs actually can't send Farmer to the D-League. That makes me think that the plan to is to drop Farmer and pick up Hairston (or another prospect who has DLeague eligibility) once Manu comes back.

[ChumpDumper]

Yeah, Karl is probably better all around but not as prolific a scorer.

[ChumpDumper]

That's what I thought but Bruno pointed out in another thread that Farmer technically already has two years of NBA experience. He picked one up earlier in his career with the Pacers even though he didn't play a game.NBA.com says one year on his player file, so I don't know.


So the Spurs actually can't send Farmer to the D-League. That makes me think that the plan to is to drop Farmer and pick up Hairston (or another prospect who has DLeague eligibility) once Manu comes back.Like I said, if he plays decently at the NBA level, he'll probably be kept.

[Obstructed_View]

Hey Chump, what's the time frame and process by which Hairston does or does not end up in Austin? Any team can pick him up at any time, right? Isn't he a free agent as of this moment?

[ChumpDumper]

He can be claimed off waivers right now under whatever terms the Spurs signed him. It might be advantageous for a team to sign him to a different contract after he clears waivers and becomes a true free agent.

In short, yes, he can be picked up at any time.

[Obstructed_View]

Cool. Now we wait. I'm hoping Detroit doesn't have a roster spot open.

And until someone claims him, can he go to any D league team he wants?

[Ice009]

NBA.com says one year on his player file, so I don't know.

Like I said, if he plays decently at the NBA level, he'll probably be kept.

I agree if he plays well then he should be kept even when Manu comes back. You never know when we'll go into those scoring droughts.

[mountainballer]

Cool. Now we wait. I'm hoping Detroit doesn't have a roster spot open.


they don't have a spot.
but if I was Detroit, I would take Hairston over Acker anytime and I don't think Acker's contract is totally guaranteed.
from all teams I fear the Kings most. they have an open roster spot and a big need for a wing, who offers more than 120 lbs and can defend a bit.

[TheProfessor]

they don't have a spot.
but if I was Detroit, I would take Hairston over Acker anytime and I don't think Acker's contract is totally guaranteed.
from all teams I fear the Kings most. they have an open roster spot and a big need for a wing, who offers more than 120 lbs and can defend a bit.
At the same time, you're counting on the Sacramento Kings to make a sound personnel decision. I like our odds.

[urunobili]

i see the Spurs trading big in January to get a primer player... we shouldn't be very concerned about these guys since they won't play much... think about it? Bonner, JV. Mahimni and Fin are all expendable even maybe Oberto... can't wait for the season to roll out...

[mountainballer]

At the same time, you're counting on the Sacramento Kings to make a sound personnel decision. I like our odds.

yeah. right. forgot to factor in this. they will more likely give Bonzi Wells the contract he rejected 3 years ago.

[BWS-1994]

Any news on Farmer's contract?

[mountainballer]

Any news on Farmer's contract?

according to shamsport.com
08-09: $797,581
09-10: $855,189
not guaranteed.

[DROB4EVER]

Not impressed by this guy. He plays little D, is a poor mans version of Mason, Hes only 6-5 so not really big enough to give us mins at the 3. We could have used Hairstons D and all around game. He could play the 3, was a good shot blocker defender and use to playing against bigger guys as he often played the 4 for the Ducks.

I think we really needed to at a big and watkins would have been a much better fit than Tolliver. I like Tolliver but a 6-8 Center? We needed a shot blocker to go with Duncan, our fg% D has been awful, thats due to having non mobile, undersized bigs....so what do we do? sign another one.

I know Manu is out for a bit but Fin, Udoka, Mason and Hill are more than enough to pick up the slack. Why sign a guy who is 27 and is gonna be your 6th wing player? Our bigs are decrepit!!!!