Jones Jr. VS. Calzaghe

[Yogurt210]

Jones will win this by KO, if he sticks and moves.

[DBryant88]

No way, Calzaghe will get the unaimous decision

[BacktoBasics]

I would go with Calzaghe but then again I picked Pavlik to handle Hopkins. Hard to picture Jones winning this fight though. I doubt I'll buy it.

I was hoping this economic slide would keep some of these fights from going on PPV but it doesn't seem to make a difference.

[I. Hustle]

I am a Calzaghe fan so I am going with him. RJ was pound for pound THE best fighter in his prime. Problem is... he's not in his prime anymore.

[mexicanjunior]

I think Calzaghe wins a decision but expect RJJ to make it harder than expected and land some really good shots. Eventhough RJJ is not in his prime anymore, I think he still has enough hand speed and power to make things difficult for Calzaghe. Plus, keep in mind, the age difference between the 2 fighters is only a few years, Calzaghe is no spring chicken. His last fight with Hopkins showed he can get caught (1st round knockdown)...

[BacktoBasics]

Jones in my opinion pissed away his legacy over money by refusing to fight guys in their prime. It was his way or no way and I have a hard time calling him one of the best of the best considering how many times he ducked big time fights over 10-20% splits.

[johnsmith]

Calzaghe by KO.

RJ was my favorite athlete of all time but he isn't as quick as he once was but he hasn't figured that out. He sticks his chin out and thinks he can still dodge a hook without blocking but he's not fast enough to do that anymore. And anyone that has watched what happens to him when he catches a hook on the chin, knows that Calzaghe just needs one punch to win.

[2centsworth]

Jones is washed up. boxing is almost dead.

[BacktoBasics]

boxing is almost dead.
As much as I would like to agree with that the PPV numbers say its alive and doing quite well.

I don't see how but I guess if you charge enough and have just enough fans willing to pay for it you can get by.

[dbreiden83080]

I was hoping this economic slide would keep some of these fights from going on PPV but it doesn't seem to make a difference.

You would think it would and Hopkins and Pavlick did reportedly only 190 thousand PPV buys. UFC events routinely do 600 thousand or more. Ortiz and Liddell 2 did over a mil buys. UFC 91 Brock and Randy is projecting to do about the same. Fighters won't be getting any huge chunks of PPV buys with the buy rates this poor.. Calzaghe and Jones years ago would have done bg numbers.

[2centsworth]

As much as I would like to agree with that the PPV numbers say its alive and doing quite well.

I don't see how but I guess if you charge enough and have just enough fans willing to pay for it you can get by.

i'm a huge supporter of the sport and don't have any alterior motive for wishing the sport any failure. PPV numbers are still good because the old vets like hopkins, jones & oscar can still draw numbers. Once the 'ol vets retire the sport is going to have some trouble.

[mexicanjunior]

Jones is washed up. boxing is almost dead.

Almost but not quite...the buys from Pacqiou-Delahoya in December could sustain it for years.

[mexicanjunior]

i'm a huge supporter of the sport and don't have any alterior motive for wishing the sport any failure. PPV numbers are still good because the old vets like hopkins, jones & oscar can still draw numbers. Once the 'ol vets retire the sport is going to have some trouble.

Margerito-Cotto had huge numbers as well...people were probably saying the same thing when Ali retired, Tyson went to jail and the middleweight era ended (Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Leonard). New superstars are always stepping up to take the place of the old vets. I wouldn't be suprised to see Chris Arreola end up being the next big thing...

[mexicanjunior]

Jones in my opinion pissed away his legacy over money by refusing to fight guys in their prime. It was his way or no way and I have a hard time calling him one of the best of the best considering how many times he ducked big time fights over 10-20% splits.

Agreed, had he fought and beat Hopkins while Hopkins was still middleweight champion, before he ballooned up to fight Ruiz for the heavyweight title, his legacy would be cemented. Although the heavyweight title was a remarkable accomplishment, it pretty much ruined him. Antonio Tarver and Glenn Johnson exposed it within 5 fights after...

[2centsworth]

You would think it would and Hopkins and Pavlick did reportedly only 190 thousand PPV buys. UFC events routinely do 600 thousand or more. Ortiz and Liddell 2 did over a mil buys. UFC 91 Brock and Randy is projecting to do about the same. Fighters won't be getting any huge chunks of PPV buys with the buy rates this poor.. Calzaghe and Jones years ago would have done bg numbers.

Ortiz Liddell didn't do no 2mil and brock and randy won't do that either. Only boxing has surpased the 2mil figure and at much higher prices.

Oscar vs Pacman will blow away Randy vs Brock.

me criticizing boxing doesn't give jerkoff mma fans room to ejaculate.

[2centsworth]

Margerito-Cotto had huge numbers as well...people were probably saying the same thing when Ali retired, Tyson went to jail and the middleweight era ended (Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Leonard). New superstars are always stepping up to take the place of the old vets. I wouldn't be suprised to see Chris Arreola end up being the next big thing...

here are the remaining guys who can pull numbers in the US:

Oscar
Hopkins
Jones
Cotto
Margaritto when facing a good opponent
Pavlik
Calzaghe
Pacman

Of those guys, 50% of them will retire soon.

[I. Hustle]

We need to start doing some Vbookie stuff on these fights.

[dbreiden83080]

Ortiz Liddell didn't do no 2mil and brock and randy won't do that either. Only boxing has surpased the 2mil figure and at much higher prices.

No it did over a million buys and Brock and Randy will do maybe about the same.. Wasn't the point of my argument, NEXT....



Oscar vs Pacman will blow away Randy vs Brock

Probably will, that is the star power of Oscar but that is also the problem, there are no more Oscars left in Boxing. He's saying this might be his last fight. My point was boxing doesn't have the consistancy of PPV buy-rates anymore, the star power is dwindling. something you ignored in favor of another temper tantrum...



me criticizing boxing doesn't give jerkoff mma fans room to ejaculate.

How is this about you, jerk-off? And my comments in the Pavlick and Hopkins thread, clearly show i am a fan of the sport and know a shit load about the sport and it's history. So take your "I am just a jerk-off MMA fan garbage somewhere else", Okay....

[mexicanjunior]

here are the remaining guys who can pull numbers in the US:

Oscar
Hopkins
Jones
Cotto
Margaritto when facing a good opponent
Pavlik
Calzaghe
Pacman

Of those guys, 50% of them will retire soon.

I would add Ricky Hatton, Israel Vasquez, both Marquez brothers, Paul Williams, Juan Diaz, and the Klitschko brothers...assuming they are fighting legit competitiion.

[mexicanjunior]

Also, there are fighters coming up that could be future stars like Yuriokis Gamboa, Andre Berto, JCC Jr, Ronald Hearns, Joel Julio...it only takes 1 great fight from any of them to spark interest in the boxing world.

[dbreiden83080]

here are the remaining guys who can pull numbers in the US:

"Oscar" Biggest star in Boxing money in the bank until he retires


"Hopkins" Depends who he is fighting, Pavlick and Hopkins did mediocre PPV buys...

"Jones" I don't expect big PPV buys for his fight with Calzaghe either, Roy is way past his day..

"Cotto" Yes but he needs a big name opponent..

"Margaritto when facing a good opponent" Agreed he, needs a great opponent since he is still largely unknown to the masses even after his last fight...

"Pavlik" Will be fighting on HBO for the forseeable future after the beating he got from Bernard. His future is bleak right now as there is nobody with sex appeal at 160 for him to fight.. No Superfights coming for Kelly anytime soon.

"Calzaghe" Not really, he is not a big star in the US. He needs a big name opponent to sell the fight. Calzaghe spent waaaay too many years not fighting in the US, it cost him a large chunk of his legacy..

"Pacman" Yes Manny is a star, people love watching his fights..

[2centsworth]

I would add Ricky Hatton, Israel Vasquez, both Marquez brothers, Paul Williams, Juan Diaz, and the Klitschko brothers...assuming they are fighting legit competitiion.

I said interest in the US because fighters like Hatton and the Klitschko will generate interest outside the states. However, I get your point there are more boxers out there with potential. Chad Dawson is another potential star.

[2centsworth]

Also, there are fighters coming up that could be future stars like Yuriokis Gamboa, Andre Berto, JCC Jr, Ronald Hearns, Joel Julio...it only takes 1 great fight from any of them to spark interest in the boxing world.

not big ppv draws because they are not getting the exposure.

[2centsworth]

"Oscar" Biggest star in Boxing money in the bank until he retires


"Hopkins" Depends who he is fighting, Pavlick and Hopkins did mediocre PPV buys...

"Jones" I don't expect big PPV buys for his fight with Calzaghe either, Roy is way past his day..

"Cotto" Yes but he needs a big name opponent..

"Margaritto when facing a good opponent" Agreed he, needs a great opponent since he is still largely unknown to the masses even after his last fight...

"Pavlik" Will be fighting on HBO for the forseeable future after the beating he got from Bernard. His future is bleak right now as there is nobody with sex appeal at 160 for him to fight.. No Superfights coming for Kelly anytime soon.

"Calzaghe" Not really, he is not a big star in the US. He needs a big name opponent to sell the fight. Calzaghe spent waaaay too many years not fighting in the US, it cost him a large chunk of his legacy..

"Pacman" Yes Manny is a star, people love watching his fights..

200 to 300 ppv buys is still very good coin for boxers.

[2centsworth]

I would add Ricky Hatton, Israel Vasquez, both Marquez brothers, Paul Williams, Juan Diaz, and the Klitschko brothers...assuming they are fighting legit competitiion.

Can't believe I forgot Marquez and Diaz.

[dbreiden83080]

200 to 300 ppv buys is still very good coin for boxers.

Well Pavlick and Hopkins are suppsoed to be stars, so 200 thousand buys for that fight is downright terrible. Manny and Oscar will be money in the bank though..

[2centsworth]

Well Pavlick and Hopkins are suppsoed to be stars, so 200 thousand buys for that fight is downright terrible. Manny and Oscar will be money in the bank though..

$12 mil while being the only "paid" fighters. Not great, but a mil each is still good money.

[Heath Ledger]

Im watching this fight for freee.....

[BacktoBasics]

There is no shortage of big names in their prime capable of pulling in big PPV numbers. I honestly hope it sours so we can get boxing back on fucking TV again. Unless you pay for premium movie channels or PPV you essentially can't watch boxing outside of Friday Night Fights and the occasion cable bout.

[2centsworth]

There is no shortage of big names in their prime capable of pulling in big PPV numbers. I honestly hope it sours so we can get boxing back on fucking TV again. Unless you pay for premium movie channels or PPV you essentially can't watch boxing outside of Friday Night Fights and the occasion cable bout.

boxing fans require HBO and Showtime. It has been that way since early 80s

[I. Hustle]

boxing fans require HBO and Showtime. It has been that way since early 80s

It's the only reason I have those F'n channels. Then I got hooked on Dexter anf True Blood :lol

[BacktoBasics]

It's the only reason I have those F'n channels. Then I got hooked on Dexter anf True Blood :lolI love both those shows.

[mexicanjunior]

boxing fans require HBO and Showtime. It has been that way since early 80s

It was the only reason I had those channels until I got into some of their original programming (like Curb Your Enthusiasm, Life and Times of Tim, True Blood, etc...).

[SAtoDallas]

Boxing is the reason I ordered Showtime.

[mystargtr34]

Lets go Calzaghe.

[mystargtr34]

Damn i love Calzaghe

[MrChug]

Joe Calzaghe will go down as the most brilliant "figure it out" fighter of all time. He figured out the "cagey" Hopkins as dirty as he fights, and will slowly figure out the "slick, super" Roy Jones.

[dbreiden83080]

Joe Calzaghe will go down as the most brilliant "figure it out" fighter of all time. He figured out the "cagey" Hopkins as dirty as he fights, and will slowly figure out the "slick, super" Roy Jones.

Uh he is beating up 40 year old Roy Jones here, his legacy is maybe half what Jone's is, lets not go nuts. Ali got his ass kicked late in his career by guys he would have murdered in his prime.. Roy is much better all time than Joe, this fight won't change that..

It's easy to figure someone out when their skills are half what they used to be..

[MrChug]

Uh he is beating up 40 year old Roy Jones here, his legacy is maybe half what Jone's is, lets not go nuts. Ali got his ass kicked late in his career by guys he would have murdered in his prime.. Roy is much better all time than Joe, this fight won't change that..

It's easy to figure someone out when their skills are half what they used to be..

Yes...well said, except that Jones' legacy will clearly state that he didn't fight anyone worth a turtle shit until it was too late. Fuck Roy Jones and everything he stands for.






...wait STOOD for.

[MrChug]

Uh he is beating up 40 year old Roy Jones here, his legacy is maybe half what Jone's is, lets not go nuts. Ali got his ass kicked late in his career by guys he would have murdered in his prime.. Roy is much better all time than Joe, this fight won't change that..

It's easy to figure someone out when their skills are half what they used to be..

...and Calzaghe is only 3 years younger and just made Jonesie look 10 years older...give it up-give the Italiano/Welshman some props and just admit that Jones is a bitch.

[dbreiden83080]

Yes...well said, except that Jones' legacy will clearly state that he didn't fight anyone worth a turtle shit until it was too late. Fuck Roy Jones and everything he stands for.






...wait STOOD for.

And Joe spent his whole career hiding in his homeland, refusing fights in the U.S. and taking no chances. Roy bulked up and won the Heavyweight Title.. He also destroyed Hopkins when Bernard was young and in his prime.. Joe won a split decision against a 43 year old Hopkins.. Roy was the best combo of speed and skill almost anyone had ever seen. This is why i hate watching boxing anymore. The former legends are fighting WAY past their prime and losing fights in their hey-day they never would have..

[dallaskd]

more ppv buys......this or couture vs lesnar next saturday?

[dbreiden83080]

...and Calzaghe is only 3 years younger and just made Jonesie look 10 years older...give it up-give the Italiano/Welshman some props and just admit that Jones is a bitch.

That means nothing at all

Age is a number, the level of decline is a different story..

I get the sense you have been watching boxing for about 5 minutes..

Joe is still close to his prime, Roy is so far past his prime it is insane... Roy is a better all time fighter than Joe, like i said this is like Ali losing to Larry Holmes, when he was old and done...

[dbreiden83080]

more ppv buys......this or couture vs lesnar next saturday?


For sure UFC 91, Manny and Oscar will top it though..

[dbreiden83080]

Actually, boxers have always fought past their primes.

Yes which is why proper perspective needs to take effect here.. A legacy is not measured by what you do at the end of your hall of fame career way past your pime..



if you know anything about boxing, you would know that Joe would have given Roy a tough fight even in Roys prime.

What edges does he have on Roy in his prime?? Hand speed? Nope. Power? No, Was he a better athlete? No. Did he fight better competiton? No.. I don't see your point at all..



Name one boxer Roy fought in his prime that has the skills of Joe. There are none. Hopkins and Toney are great fighters, but not on the level of Joe.


I already did, Hopkins is an all time legend. Hopkins legacy is so far ahead of Joe it is a God-Damn Joke.. Roy kicked his ass when he was young.. Joe beat Hopkins in a razor close fight when he was 43 years old.. The same Hopkins that got beat twice by Taylor, who was exposed by Pavlick.. Toney another fighter Roy dessimated in his prime would have given Joe fits. He was so hard to hit and elusive it was insane. Awkward style with great combinations.. Could Joe have bulked up to Heavyweight and destroyed John Ruiz?? Bringing Roy down a notch at this point in his career is just not fair the way i see it..

[Whisky Dog]

Great fight by Calzaghe, I really like this fighter and am happy for him to have this success. That said, this isn't any kind of landmark victory because of when it happened. I can't say that one guy would have beaten the other if they were in their primes, and that's because this fight didnt take place 8 to 10 years ago like it should have. Its still a good win, but not anything to proclaim to be the best about. Joe missed that chance and will never get it again.

[Yogurt210]

deng my prediction was right, until after the first round, o well...time for jones to retire.

[dbreiden83080]

Side note: After Jones got knocked out by Tarver, I was in Vegas and he and a buddy walked up and started shooting craps at the table I was at, and he seemed like a real cool guy, so I asked him... "hey man, you going to get your title back," he laughed and said, "you now it, and you can bet on it too," so I did, and lost a nice chunk of change.


Wait you bet on Roy for the 3rd fight with Tarver after he got smoked by Johnson, why?? He had shown himself to be a shot fighter by that point. Jones would have murdered Tarver so bad in his prime, nobody would even know who the hell Tarver is. Whatever name he has, he got thanks to beating a shot Roy Jones twice..

[MrChug]

That means nothing at all

Age is a number, the level of decline is a different story..

I get the sense you have been watching boxing for about 5 minutes..

Joe is still close to his prime, Roy is so far past his prime it is insane... Roy is a better all time fighter than Joe, like i said this is like Ali losing to Larry Holmes, when he was old and done...

I'm considered an historian, so you can suck my balls and swallow the hair after that stupid comment. If you think a quick knockout, showboating, and ducking the big fights while he was in his "prime" makes him a legend...well you know nothing about boxing. Let's take a gander at even CONTEMPORARY fighters who will go down as far as greater fighters than rj:

Calzaghe
Oscar
Pacqiao
Erik Morales
Bernard Hopkins

Calzaghe has been doing this since '93 and has never lost...just FYI.

[dbreiden83080]

I'm considered an historian, so you can suck my balls and swallow the hair after that stupid comment.
Oscar :lmao:lmao
Pacqiao
Erik Morales:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao
Bernard Hopkins




Erik Morales, is going down with a better legend, oh man, my sides hurt from that shit, how about Winky Wright while your at it.. Jermaine Taylor, yeah he is better than Roy, not too mention, Zab Judah and Tarver, they all are ahead of Roy right, Mr Douche-bag, uh i mean Historian, LOL what a joke... You truly have been watching boxing for 5 min if you think Erik Morales is on anyones top list of fighters pd for pd ahead of Roy, i mean shit on a stick that is funny... You realize everyone on that list Roy either beat or would be dessimated in a fight with Roy and none of them fought and beat better fighters. Oscar lost every Superfight he ever had practically.. you are badly underrating everything about Roy..

[2centsworth]

Erik Morales, is going down with a better legend, oh man, my sides hurt from that shit, how about Winky Wright while your at it.. Jermaine Taylor, yeah he is better than Roy, not too mention, Zab Judah and Tarver, they all are ahead of Roy right, Mr Douche-bag, uh i mean Hostorian, LOL what a joke... You truly have been watching boxing for 5 min if you think Erik Morales is on anyones top list of fighters pd for pd ahead of Roy, i mean shit on a stick that is funny... You realize everyone on that list Roy either beat or would be dessimated in a fight with Roy and none of them fought and beat better fighters. Oscar lost every Superfight he ever had practically.. you are badly underrating everything about Roy..

being a legend of boxing doesn't necessarily mean you were the best pd for pd. Oscar will be a legend in boxing and will be held in much higher esteem than Roy. An argument can be made for Eric Morales from the latino perspective, which is a huge market for boxing, because Eric produced more memorable moments. Arturo Gatti is another who will be hard to forget.

Roy's career has been forgettable for the most part. All the talent in the world, but never made the mega fight.

[dbreiden83080]

An argument can be made for Eric Morales from the latino perspective.

Is that the same as saying the retarded perspective??? Because i don't give a damn, if you are black, White or fucking purple, to even suggest that Morales is in the same ballpark as Roy all time is a mother-fucking joke.. And anyone who agrees with that is in need of either footage on Roy in his prime or a fucking cat-scan....

I don't get why everyone is crapping all over Roy here, Pd for Pd he was regarded as one of the best ever for years. He also was in a spot of not having many guys that would fight him or where from a weight point of view it wasn't reasonable for him to fight them.. Some of the bigger fights for Roy he would have had to move way down in weight to get them and that would have put him at a disadvantage. He was too small to have an extended run at Heavyweight but he still dominated Ruiz in that title fight.. Oscar moved up too much in weight and got it handed to him by Hopkins.. And lets not act like nobody ever ducked Roy, he made everyone he fought look like shit in his prime.. And memorable moments are just that moments, scrub fighters can do that, someone like Gatti is remembered mainly because he wasn't good enough to dominate anyone so he got in a lot of wars....

[dbreiden83080]

Oscar will be a legend in boxing and will be held in much higher esteem than Roy.

BTW Oscar's record in Superfights with Trinidad, Mosley, Hopkins and Mayweather is a combined 0-5..

His best win is probably Pernell Whitaker and that was a close fight..

[2centsworth]

BTW Oscar's record in Superfights with Trinidad, Mosley, Hopkins and Mayweather is a combined 0-5..

His best win is probably Pernell Whitaker and that was a close fight..

Again, if you're going off of pure record guys like Ricardo Lopez should be at the top of the list. One of the best pound for pound fighters I ever saw was Jemal Hinton back in the 80s. He retired undefeated too, but most people have never heard of the guy. Boxers are remembered for the entertainment value they brought to the sport. Hence, guys like Morales, Barrera, Gatti, and Oscar will be held in higher regard than will Roy. I'm sure boxing historians who try to gauge who were the best pound for pound fighters will mention Roy before the fighters I just mentioned, but the fans won't.

[SAtoDallas]

I liked Roy early on in his career, then he started hand picking opponents and that is why he will be forgotten. Like Mayweather Jr they had so much natural talent but were afraid to risk losing. I believe that is why Jones has recently taken risky fights late in his career Tarver/Glen Johnson he realizes his legacy is in danger. Anyways props to Calzaghe.

Oh and if I remember correctly didn't JoeCal try to get Jones to fight him in England about 7 years ago, but that's when Roy had that HBO contract and didn't want to fight outside the US?

[mexicanjunior]

BTW Oscar's record in Superfights with Trinidad, Mosley, Hopkins and Mayweather is a combined 0-5..

His best win is probably Pernell Whitaker and that was a close fight..

He also had solid wins against JC Chavez (twice), Vargas, Gatti and Ike Quartey (in his prime). He was jobbed in the Trinidad (although he brought it on himself) and 2nd Mosley fight.

As for RJJ and Calzaghe, I was glad to see Joe beat him so convincingly and showboat his way thru it. I saw RJJ do that to countless opponents, it was nice to see him get a taste of his own medicine. That said, Calzaghe is lucky that he hasn't fought anyone that stays busy enough to make him defend. RJJ has a good punch but he didn't throw enough of them to make Calzaghe worry about covering up (outside of round 1). If Calzaghe were to fight Dawson, I think his "hands down, chin sticking out" antics would bite him in the ass. That is especially true now that I think his chin has come under suspicion (2 early knockdowns in last 2 fights)...

[dbreiden83080]

He also had solid wins against JC Chavez (twice), Vargas, Gatti and Ike Quartey (in his prime). He was jobbed in the Trinidad (although he brought it on himself) and 2nd Mosley fight.


Lets be fair though, Chavez was basically done at that point, his best years were behind him. I think Oscar beats him nomatter what, i'm just saying. His win against Quartey was also razor close and some thought he lost that fight.. Vargas was a great fight, he was a beast for a few years there, Gatti is not a big win for Oscar, someone like Oscar is supposed to walk through someone like Gatti.. He was jobbed in the 2nd Mosley fight, that was a bad decision..

[mexicanjunior]

Lets be fair though, Chavez was basically done at that point, his best years were behind him. I think Oscar beats him nomatter what, i'm just saying...

I would say Chavez was about done in the 2nd fight but, in the first, Chavez was only 33 and still in good shape. That fight was stopped due to cuts, so we will never know if Delahoya could have beaten him without the stoppage but he looked poised to do it up until that point. Keep in mind also, alot of fights Delahoya had were megafights at the time but, since the other fighter didn't stay on top, are kind of forgotten. Examples of this were his fights against Rafael Rueles, Miguel Angel Gonzales, John John Molina and the local boy (Jesse James Leija)...