Does RC get a pat on the back for picking GHill?

[honestfool84]

i know alot of y'all were hating on him in the first round for passing up chalmers, greene (donte), and white (dj), to name a few.


now that the season has panned out a bit, how do you feel about the FO's pick of george hill?

i just read this:
San Antonio coach Gregg Popovich couldn't have scripted those words any better or found a better fit for his team that deep into the draft. The Spurs were the only team that had Hill on their radar in the first round, but this franchise knew what it was doing ... again. San Antonio hit on Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker when everyone else passed.


and it made me realize, man, this FO isn't as stupid as some of us said they were..

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

At the time I was disappointed we didn't draft Darrel Arthur cuz I thought a guy like him was a much more pressing need than a back-up PG, but then I hadn't watched Hill at all, like most people, and knew next to nothing about him.

I'm glad Hill is proving all his doubters wrong and long may it continue.I'm happy to say I was wrong about him.

[raspsa]

If Batum was available when the Spurs turn came up, would they really have stuck with Hill?

[ginobilized]

George Hill is obviously working out really well (understatement).
I believe the FO has a real knack of picking the right talent for their system.
This involves a lot of variables and excludes some extremely talented players
who don't have the requisite character, tenacity, Bball IQ, maturity etc. As great as
Hill is playing for the Spurs, I'm not sure he'd fit this well on just any NBA roster. Pop
obviously has a vision for where Hill fits and now we are starting to see it too.

And yes, RC does deserve a pat on the back as well as Pop and GHill.

Happy Thanksgiving!

[Kobayagi]

Premature ejaculation board


Beno had a couple of good games too. Hey, he even played in Rookie-sophomore all star game and look how that went down...


I'm just saying...let's not get ahead of ourselves

[TDMVPDPOY]

the question with batum, had the spurs drafted him, would they even put him on the roster? or send him to euro for 1 year?

[tav1]

If Batum was available when the Spurs turn came up, would they really have stuck with Hill?

This question is discussed here (http://48minutesofhell.blogspot.com/2008/11/george-hills-strange-start.html).

[exstatic]

I think people just don't understand the FO. If they think there isn't someone at their pick that can contribute to the team, they trade it. Other than 2003, I don't think any of them have been outright salary dumps. There just wasn't anyone there at 28 or 29 or wherever they were picking. They must have been jumping up and down like little kids before Houston's pick when they knew they were either getting Batum or Hill this year.

First rounders the Spurs used for themselves this decade:
2001 Tony
2004 Beno
2005 Ian
2007 Splitter
2008 Hill

That's not a bad haul. Beno has talent, they just didn't know he was mentally weak. This list is what is making me patient with Mahinmi's development.

[T Park]

Just imagine if Splitter had come over.

The Spurs would have had the offseason that we would be talking about in 5 years how "It extended the championship window 8 more years"

Fing Tau.

[Dark Matter]

Premature ejaculation board


Beno had a couple of good games too. Hey, he even played in Rookie-sophomore all star game and look how that went down...


I'm just saying...let's not get ahead of ourselves

Nice wish:wakeup. Your only looking at one dimension of his game. Beno is thin skin and vain in the head. That is simply NOT SPUR BALL.

[ducks]

Just imagine if Splitter had come over.

The Spurs would have had the offseason that we would be talking about in 5 years how "It extended the championship window 8 more years"

Fing Tau.

no one knows how good splitter is

[T Park]

no one knows how good splitter is

Yeah they do. Splitter is a damn damn good player who at times looks better than Scola.

Tiago Splitter, along side Oberto, Bonner and Thomas would've been fantastic and the Spurs could've not had to be tied soooo darn tied to Ian making or breaking their season.

[Kobayagi]

Beno is thin skin and vain in the head.


I agree, but who knew that after preseason and a couple of games?

[Tully365]

It's refreshing to log on to spurstalk each morning and see that all of those ridiculous RC must go and Pop is over-rated types of threads and posts have dried up and blown away. Pop & RC are masters at what they do, and routinely outperform everybody in the business, especially those with much more money to spend.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Splitter's worst case scenario would be Joel Przbilla, which is not bad I think. I suppose he'd have a production similar to Scola's, maybe a bit less points, but more rebs and blocks. He has a fairly good BB IQ too. Would have been great next to Tim, esp on defense.

[jbspurs]

Premature ejaculation board


Beno had a couple of good games too. Hey, he even played in Rookie-sophomore all star game and look how that went down...


I'm just saying...let's not get ahead of ourselves


He's not scared of Lindsey Hunter... Hill >>>>> Beno!

[TheProfessor]

Yeah they do. Splitter is a damn damn good player who at times looks better than Scola.

Tiago Splitter, along side Oberto, Bonner and Thomas would've been fantastic and the Spurs could've not had to be tied soooo darn tied to Ian making or breaking their season.
Getting someone like Hill makes Splitter all the more frustrating. He would have nicely rounded out an incredible young core of Spurs' players. It's not impossible that he still comes over, but the timing was perfect before. Just one of those things.

[exstatic]

He's not scared of Lindsey Hunter... Hill >>>>> Beno!

+1 Hill, after a handful of games, did something Beno never did: bring the ball up effectively against Hunter, who timvp says is one of the best defensive PGs of the last 20 years. I'm waiting for Tony to come back to see if he spanks Beno in another way: being effective in limited minutes. Beno never was.

[honestfool84]

It's refreshing to log on to spurstalk each morning and see that all of those ridiculous RC must go and Pop is over-rated types of threads and posts have dried up and blown away. Pop & RC are masters at what they do, and routinely outperform everybody in the business, especially those with much more money to spend.


i personally always thought Pop and RC knew what they were doing..

i had never heard of GHill before the draft, but once i read that the spurs had been looking at him for along while now, i knew that we'd made the right choice when they drafted him.

+Pops
+RC
:toast

[exstatic]

What some of the asshats don't acknowledge is that EVERY team passed on Chalmers in the first round, so they aren't just arrogant enough to think they are smarter than Pop/RC, they fucking think they are smarter than each and every GM in the NBA. Losers.

[Russ]

Just imagine if Splitter had come over.

The Spurs would have had the offseason that we would be talking about in 5 years how "It extended the championship window 8 more years".

Agreed. Splitter was a great pick at that spot, the Spurs just got unlucky.

Beno and Scola were also excellent picks that the Spurs might have sold too low.

Hill tops the list as a late first round gem.

The only possibly bad pick the last few years is Mahinmi. They had the physical attributes right but its hard to judge the drive and heart of someone so young. And he may still work out, anyway.

[m33p0]

*back patted*

[montgod]

I do like the pick of G. Hill, but a question does come to mind that I am sure has been covered a million and one times. With the Spurs being most weak at the SF/PF position, would it have been better served if they had picked Arthur or Batum (if he was there... which he wasn't)?

So looking back, if they had drafted Arthur first, who would have been available after he was picked? It's a possibility that G. Hill would have still been out there. Or they could have tried to trade up in the second round to get Chalmers (since he was a pothead, I don't think they would have though in which I have no problem with not having him at all). And if anything else, they could have stayed where they were and picked up M. Taylor who they already knew about since he was in their own D-League.

Now seeing as so many injuries have occured, it was a Godsend that Hill was around to pick up the slack for TP. No one would have predicted the injury to him, so in hindsight, Hill was the perfect pick but I do wonder what the results would have been if the draft had turned out another way.

Which Spurs team additions look better to you:

D. Arthur - A SF who can rebound, block, and score decently.
M. Taylor - A very capable PG who has done very well with the Clippers when given minutes

or

G. Hill - A very capable PG who has done very well when given minutes
Hairston - N/A cut

Of course, this is knowing after seeing how these players perform in the league so it's not realistic, but the Spurs have needed and searched for a capable SF since S. Elliott. I think Arthur would have been a perfect fit imo but am happy with G. Hill since he is at least a player in this league and he isn't a weedhead. :D

[T Park]

George Hill was gone to the Celtics. Thats a fact.

Chalmers is OK, but is no George hill.

The Spurs will be fine.

[Avitus1]

I'll give it to them it was a good pick

[montgod]

George Hill was gone to the Celtics. Thats a fact.

Chalmers is OK, but is no George hill.

The Spurs will be fine.

So you think that the Celts wanted another Rondo clone? Interesting...

I wouldn't have wanted Chalmers anyways...

[T Park]

So you think that the Celts wanted another Rondo clone? Interesting...I wouldn't have wanted Chalmers anyways...

There were reports all over the place that had Hill gotten to the Celtics at the end of the first, they were picking him.

[montgod]

There were reports all over the place that had Hill gotten to the Celtics at the end of the first, they were picking him.

Maybe... you never know.

There were a lot of rumors going around about everyone.

Like I said, I am happy with G. Hill, but I would have been curious how the Spurs would have responded early this year if they had the combo of M. Taylor and D. Arthur instead of G. Hill. I think Arthur doomed himself with this health reports and probably had rumors going around about him being a weedhead. Stupid is what stupid does...

Off the subject, I wonder why the Spurs weren't interested in their own product in M. Taylor?

[Spur-Addict]

I think it goes equally all around, RC and Pop, along with the staff, scouting etc. Pop's hand in this off season cannot be ignored.

[timvp]

Does RC get a pat on the back for picking GHill?Hill was Pop's pick. He scouted him in the predraft camps. He scouted him when the Spurs brought in groups of point guards to work out. And he obviously made the final call to draft him.

RC's job was to do the background check to see if he would fit in with the team concept.

[ChumpDumper]

Maybe... you never know.

There were a lot of rumors going around about everyone.

Like I said, I am happy with G. Hill, but I would have been curious how the Spurs would have responded early this year if they had the combo of M. Taylor and D. Arthur instead of G. Hill. I think Arthur doomed himself with this health reports and probably had rumors going around about him being a weedhead. Stupid is what stupid does...He isn't a small forward either. Maybe someday.


Off the subject, I wonder why the Spurs weren't interested in their own product in M. Taylor?What does that mean? Mike Taylor played for Idaho last season.

[honestfool84]

Hill was Pop's pick. He scouted him in the predraft camps. He scouted him when the Spurs brought in groups of point guards to work out. And he obviously made the final call to draft him.

RC's job was to do the background check to see if he would fit in with the team concept.



oops.
i guess you're right.
i just wanted to know if people thought different of the FO i guess, after this pick.
but i think it would be more appropriate to ask this after we've won our fifth :lobt:.

[baseline bum]

Hill was Pop's pick. He scouted him in the predraft camps. He scouted him when the Spurs brought in groups of point guards to work out. And he obviously made the final call to draft him.

RC's job was to do the background check to see if he would fit in with the team concept.

So basically, we should promote Pop back to GM then and downsize RC?

[honestfool84]

So basically, we should promote Pop back to GM then and downsize RC?

make RC head coach..

[DrHouse]

The Lakers were heavily interested in Hill and were considering doing a trade to move up in the draft to get him.

[rascal]

The spurs should have taken Arthur and made a trade to get Hill at a later pick.

[SpurSupremacist]

There's a lot of season left.

[MarHill]

The spurs should have taken Arthur and made a trade to get Hill at a later pick.

Hill would have been gone by then. They have to get him at their pick of 26.

I agree let's give RC & Pop credit. They have stuck with their system and found the players over the years to build around TD. Three championships in the last six years is great return on that investment.

That's all you can ask for as a fan of a team. To have the FO build as program around a superstar and that superstar is willing to work with that FO.

We have so much to be thankful as Spurs fans in the Golden Age of the franchise. And RC & Pop are a part of it.

:flag:

[honestfool84]

we do have so much to be thankful for.

now i hope there won't be any more 'fire Pop/RC' threads the rest of the season..

[montgod]

He isn't a small forward either. Maybe someday.

What does that mean? Mike Taylor played for Idaho last season.

Oops, for some reason, I thought he played for San Antonio's D-League team. My bad...

[BlackBellamy]

He gets a hand job. Lube up those mitts Spurs fans.

[Tully365]

Another thing to remember: The results of the 3 draft picks are not yet final. If Hairston makes the team next year, and Gist comes back from Italy and also makes the team, that'll be 3 players from the draft, none of them even remotely near the lottery, that turned out to be nba level players.

[m33p0]

we do have so much to be thankful for.

now i hope there won't be any more 'fire Pop/RC' threads the rest of the season..
mrs purs hasn't been banned yet so don't count on it.

[montgod]

Another thing to remember: The results of the 3 draft picks are not yet final. If Hairston makes the team next year, and Gist comes back from Italy and also makes the team, that'll be 3 players from the draft, none of them even remotely near the lottery, that turned out to be nba level players.

What's this fascination with Hairston that some posters have? He won't be back just like all the other failed second round SFs drafted by the Spurs. There is no need to latch yourselves onto every SF that comes through camp because we have seen what happens. A second rounder sometimes... is just a second rounder in talent. I am still shocked that Tolliver made the team, but I guess it's like Survivor, he wasn't the very worse... so he gets to stay on the island for a little while longer.

[K-State Spur]

Premature ejaculation board


Beno had a couple of good games too. Hey, he even played in Rookie-sophomore all star game and look how that went down...


I'm just saying...let's not get ahead of ourselves

Well, if he turns out to have Beno's mental make-up (looks unlikely at this point), he could quite possibly fade away.

But this much is clear - he's a much better NBA talent than most teams realized, otherwise he wouldn't have lasted to 26.

If you re-drafted today, he'd likely go much much higher.

[Tully365]

What's this fascination with Hairston that some posters have? He won't be back just like all the other failed second round SFs drafted by the Spurs. There is no need to latch yourselves onto every SF that comes through camp because we have seen what happens. A second rounder sometimes... is just a second rounder in talent. I am still shocked that Tolliver made the team, but I guess it's like Survivor, he wasn't the very worse... so he gets to stay on the island for a little while longer.

I wouldn't call it a fascination, but rather a belief that he has a decent all-around game and could develop into an nba player. He is already being named by some scouts as a candidate for an early D-league call up. We'll see.

Finding late first round and second round draft picks is a lot like playing poker, or playing the stock market-- even the best, most focused, and most informed players are not going to win every time. But the difference between good talent evaluation and not-so-good talent evaluation will be much easier to see when we step back and look at performance over a certain period of time. Many Spur fans may be tired of hearing about what amazing picks Tony and Manu were, but let's not forget that there are teams out there that have never struck gold with a late first round or second round pick, while the Spurs have found two all-stars. Manu is, in my opinion, the single best second round player in the NBA. That is a pretty incredible accomplishment. Think of all the scouts, GMs, presidents, coaches, assistant coaches, advisors, players, ex-players, and owners that exist in the NBA, and consider how hard they've worked to find players in the draft, and from this very large and very talented pool of decision-making people over the past decade, the Spurs managed to emerge with the single best second round pick.... that is no small accomplishment. And now it appears that George Hill will be yet another winner. I have no problem with fans disagreeing over single and specific moves.... but when people come on to spurstalk and say things like Pop doesn't know what he's doing or RC is totally clueless I think it just shows a complete disregard and total lack of understanding for the monumental success that they've both been instrumental in engineering for a decade, a success all the more magnificent because it has been accomplished in a small market/small revenue environment with an owner who can't possibly hope to outspend his rivals in NY, LA, Chicago, or Dallas.

[K-State Spur]

D. Arthur - A SF who can rebound, block, and score decently.
M. Taylor - A very capable PG who has done very well with the Clippers when given minutes

or

G. Hill - A very capable PG who has done very well when given minutes
Hairston - N/A cut



Don't let a couple of solid games for Arthur fool you-

Offensively - Arthur is only shooting 39% and scoring 6 ppg (that's not "decent"). He's had a bad habit ever since his KU days of missing some chippies. He doesn't have the range to help spread the floor that the Spurs require out of a SF.

Defensively - He's a tweener in every sense of the word. He's not big enough to hold up against the better posts in the league. And he's not quick enough to hang with most wings.

Rebounding - His rebounding rate is quite good, although it's dropped off during the past month. After totaling double digit rebounds in his first two games, he is averaging just 5 rpg since (and only 1 double digit rebound game in that span).

I'd much rather have the rights to Gist in Europe than Arthur on the roster right now. Even if the Spurs had taken Arthur, he'd almost certainly be in Austin.

[2centsworth]

I would have given most the blame to RC is Hill didn't work out, so I have to give him most of the credit. That's the outsider perspective. Eventhough, according to Timvp, Hill was Pop's pick.

[The Truth #6]

Trying to sign Pargo and waiting to sign Hill were mysterious actions on the part of the FO. I thought it showed they didn't have complete confidence with Hill after Summer League. Luckily, they kept him (for whatever reason) and things worked out.

[tav1]

There were reports all over the place that had Hill gotten to the Celtics at the end of the first, they were picking him.

I remember someone saying this, but I don't remember the reports being all over the place. There is a strong chance it's true. But we'll never know for sure.

[honestfool84]

mrs purs hasn't been banned yet so don't count on it.

haha.
i guess im not the only person who can't stand his/her annoying posts.

[JWest596]

The Lakers were heavily interested in Hill and were considering doing a trade to move up in the draft to get him.

A remember that there was a lot of talk about picking Hill on the Laker fan sites.

[lefty]

Premature ejaculation board


Beno had a couple of good games too. Hey, he even played in Rookie-sophomore all star game and look how that went down...


I'm just saying...let's not get ahead of ourselves

Hill looks wayyyyyyyy better than Beno.

Beno is nowehere near Hill when it comes to athleticism, agressiveness and defense

[BOHOLANO#21]

I wouldn't call it a fascination, but rather a belief that he has a decent all-around game and could develop into an nba player. He is already being named by some scouts as a candidate for an early D-league call up. We'll see.

Finding late first round and second round draft picks is a lot like playing poker, or playing the stock market-- even the best, most focused, and most informed players are not going to win every time. But the difference between good talent evaluation and not-so-good talent evaluation will be much easier to see when we step back and look at performance over a certain period of time. Many Spur fans may be tired of hearing about what amazing picks Tony and Manu were, but let's not forget that there are teams out there that have never struck gold with a late first round or second round pick, while the Spurs have found two all-stars. Manu is, in my opinion, the single best second round player in the NBA. That is a pretty incredible accomplishment. Think of all the scouts, GMs, presidents, coaches, assistant coaches, advisors, players, ex-players, and owners that exist in the NBA, and consider how hard they've worked to find players in the draft, and from this very large and very talented pool of decision-making people over the past decade, the Spurs managed to emerge with the single best second round pick.... that is no small accomplishment. And now it appears that George Hill will be yet another winner. I have no problem with fans disagreeing over single and specific moves.... but when people come on to spurstalk and say things like Pop doesn't know what he's doing or RC is totally clueless I think it just shows a complete disregard and total lack of understanding for the monumental success that they've both been instrumental in engineering for a decade, a success all the more magnificent because it has been accomplished in a small market/small revenue environment with an owner who can't possibly hope to outspend his rivals in NY, LA, Chicago, or Dallas.

well, too bad hairston is playing in a position were our team is loaded with talents...i'm still amazed how many posters here are fascinated with hairston...

[Tully365]

well, too bad hairston is playing in a position were our team is loaded with talents...i'm still amazed how many posters here are fascinated with hairston...

Again, I'm not fascinated with him. I simply think that he might be a decent back-up swing player in the future. Bowen is 37 and Finley is 35. There will be room for a young swing player in the next year or two, and most likely the Spurs will make a play for a big star like Bosh in 2010, meaning they will be looking for bargains elsewhere. I'm actually much more interested in Gist than Hairston, just to let you know...

[K-State Spur]

The spurs should have taken Arthur and made a trade to get Hill at a later pick.

:lol Arthur, 6 min, 0-4 (and a couple of those were bunnies), 0 pts - it's his 4th goose egg of the year, now shooting 38% from the floor on the season.

[Tully365]

What's this fascination with Hairston that some posters have?


I wouldn't call it a fascination, but rather a belief that he has a decent all-around game and could develop into an nba player. He is already being named by some scouts as a candidate for an early D-league call up. We'll see.

Hairston's numbers from last night in Austin's season opener:

17 pts
12 rebounds
5 assists
2 steals
1 block

[Fabbs]

Hill was Pop's pick. He scouted him in the predraft camps. He scouted him when the Spurs brought in groups of point guards to work out. And he obviously made the final call to draft him.

RC's job was to do the background check to see if he would fit in with the team concept.
LJ bottom line fantastic, any other tidbits about Pops involvment to go along with this?
Great news. I'll admit i thought Popped was just gonna continue to let the sink ship and then scurry off Coatail style.

[BOHOLANO#21]

Hairston's numbers from last night in Austin's season opener:

17 pts
12 rebounds
5 assists
2 steals
1 block
who cares about hairston? our pg,sg,sf spot already much set. it's amazing some posters have too much love for hairston.

[honestfool84]

Hairston's numbers from last night in Austin's season opener:

17 pts
12 rebounds
5 assists
2 steals
1 block


i've heard the DLeague sucks.
or so i've heard.

[phxspurfan]

Hill looks wayyyyyyyy better than Beno.

Beno is nowehere near Hill when it comes to athleticism, agressiveness and defense

Agreed. I have no idea how Beno got the label as an athletic player. Just b/c he's 6'3" doesn't mean he's at all athletic. I think he has decent court vision and is a good shooter (made better by the fact that he's left-handed so this fools most defensive players' instincts). But he;s slow and probably below average in NBA PG quickness.

[SenorSpur]

who cares about hairston? our pg,sg,sf spot already much set. it's amazing some posters have too much love for hairston.

It's not like Hairston is Marcus Williams of last year. Hairston was easily one of the Spurs better individual defenders in both summer league and in preseason. More importantly, his all around game and attitude really fit in well with this team. So let's not criticize the guy like he's trash.

While he needs to develop a more consistent outside shot, he still could be a viable SF option for this team going forward. After all, only Bowen and Finley are the truest forms of SF types on the roster and they aren't getting any younger.

[SenorSpur]

I admit, I was one of the more vocal supporters for the Spurs drafting of Batum, had he been available. I also admit to being somewhat initially disappointed in the selection of Hill simply because I hadn't heard anything about him. That said, he's looking more and more like one of the better rookies of his class. A surprisingly solid draft pick and the potential for being a key contributor to this team for many seasons to come.

To the question at hand, yes Pop and RC should both be roundly commended for scouting and drafting Hill at #26. Especially when it appeared, at the time, that they had reached for him at that pick.

[Obstructed_View]

who cares about hairston? our pg,sg,sf spot already much set. it's amazing some posters have too much love for hairston.

Really. Who exactly is the rotation at small forward?

[honestfool84]

Really. Who exactly is the rotation at small forward?

i wouldn't say set necessarily, but i think we have it covered, especially if we play small ball with duncan.

[K-State Spur]

Really. Who exactly is the rotation at small forward?

finley, manu, mason, bowen, and udoka are pretty much interchangeable at SG & SF.

what does the spurs' SF do that the spurs' SG doesn't do? or vice-versa?

[Tully365]

i've heard the DLeague sucks.
or so i've heard.

Tell that to Kelenna Azubuike.

[Tully365]

who cares about hairston? our pg,sg,sf spot already much set. it's amazing some posters have too much love for hairston.

The Spurs care about Hairston-- that's why they drafted him.
His numbers tonight for the Toros: 33 points, 7 rebounds, 6 assists.

There's this thing that occasionally occurs in the nba... it's called an injury... ever heard of it? Bowen and Udoka are human, and therefore vulnerable to it. That's why the Spurs will continue to keep a close eye on Hairston.

[Ice009]

2 awesome games for Hairston in the D-League.

I'd get rid of Hearn or Tolliver to get him back on the team.

I don't want another team grabbing him early.

Hairston was probably my second pick after Farmer, Watkins 3rd and Tolliver 4th.

Tolliver really hasn't done much at all. btw Didn't Hairston dunk on Ming in the preseason or was Yao just in the vicinity?

Question : If we cut Hearn and sign Hairston then send him back the the D-League is that counted as another stint? I thought I remember reading something about a limit to the amount of times you can assign a player to the D-League in one season. Is that correct? Is there a limit?