THE TP's HATE

[kace]

well, i try to start this thread to understand things: why is Tony so hated by some members. Obviously, a lot of you are older members and live in SA. it's not a thread to complain about it (i've done that enough in others threads) or to ask to show some love to TP. I don't give a fuck if he's loved or not since i'm a spurs fan before a tony's fan. but i can't say that i don't find all this bullshit on him stupid and amazing and that maybe my nationality makes it a little bit harder to swallow.

so, i'd want to know if this thing is only from SOME (but there are a lot of them) manu's blind fans. i mean the ones who don't really give a fuck about the spurs and only watch them to see manu win and think that tony can overshadow him. Or is there another reason for it ?? i mean his nationality ?? or maybe his way of life ( wife who is a star ? rap thing ? even if he's rather humble and not trash talking or things like that)

i'm not trying to argue here. I mean it's so obvious that the dislike on him is pathetic and unfair that i don't want to hear the same points that i see every thread. OK, everyone has the right to like or not a player.

but why hate someone who gave and brought so much to the spurs ? who is our best player with tim and manu ?

Because if there the are usual haters who are very active on the forum, you can't deny that there are a lot of people throwing their dislike of him.

I'd just want to know if it's only on internet forums or also in all the "real" fanbase. is it just from south american or more than that because when i read things about him from US papers (local or national), TV, there's obviously no problem and tony is praised as he deserves.

so, what's the problem ?? (Once again, for those who'd want to argue about how he's bad for this team, it's not the place to do that: you have the billions of bashing threads for that. i'd only want the answers of people understanding that TP is unfairly and continuously bashed. thanks)

[naico]

Hate is a big word. I don't think anybody "hates" him on this forum. Maybe he's just not the prefered player to some people.
And people just like to vent, which can be understood, we're all passionate fans and hate to see the Spurs lose.
Only a few dislike him for whatever reason.
Him being criticized, shows you how special a player he is and how much we excpect from him. We've come to take that shit for granted.

I personaly love the guy for his heart, demeanor, confidence. Oh and he has mad skills. But i'm not afraid to criticize. Whether its TP, TD, Manu, Bowen etc..Everybody can have a bad game once in a while.
It's a forum ain't it?
But in the end you have to show lots a respect for him and what he does.

[hater]

didn't france treat mexicans like shit before the Mexican revolution. that's probably why.

I do notice not a lot of ppl love TP the way they should, in other forums, he would be considered a God.

but on the other hand a lot of ppl call me a hater when I say TP is a little one dimensional and does not get the team involved. but unless he is traded for a top 10 player, I want him in the Spurs.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

There's a lot of little reasons that contribute to it. There are some blind Manu backers who seem to think that tearing Parker down builds their guy up. Those people are far fewer than they once were but in my book they are the most annoying of the bunch.

I think part of the hate on him is that the Spurs have such an identity as a "hard work" team. It's ingrained in every facet of their image. And there's no doubt that Tony works hard. Nobody's jumper improves that drastically in one offseason by luck. The problem that impacts his image is that his game is so smooth that he makes it look easy. Too easy. From that comes a belief for some that any time that he doesn't play well it's because he's lazy or not trying. But it's hard to look like a tough guy when you're playing along side guys like Manu and Tim who come out of games looking like they were in a rugby match rather than a basketball game.

Some people see the letters "PG" next to his name and can't seem to shake the idea that he should be passing 90% of the time and because he doesn't he's a ball hog. The current system doesn't lend itself to a lot guard assists either. Nevermind the fact that in every damn interview I've ever seen him give during or after a game he always says, "Weh, yoo nuh Pup, eee wuz tellin me to be mur aggrezzive, yoo nuh?" He's only playing the way he's being told.

And there is still a belief by some that he's not clutch, or in some minds an out right choker. Now it's true that he doesn't have the catalogue of big game winning shots that Tim or Manu do. Part of the problem with that argument is that could run down the list of players in the league and be lucky to come up with more than a handful of guys that match their clutchness. The other issue is that his jumper was so streaky during his early years. Even though he can get to the hoop with ease on the last play of the game the likelihood in the NBA is that a ref will swallow his whistle when a guard gets mugged. And with a team armed with a variety of jumpshooters, it was no huge surprise that Tony's number didn't get called a lot. The biggest feather in the hat that some haters still cling to is the legend that Tony choked in the 2005 finals and Speedy Claxton swooped in from the rafters and saved the day. Never mind that Parker was what? 19? 20? And Claxton suddenly played what may have been his best game in a Spurs uni.

I think there's maybe a little bit of hating on him for being "Hollywood" on a small market team, but I really think it's the smallest of the reasons.

[Indazone]

yeah lot of haters or better yet hypocrits around here.

He was a basketball God a few weeks ago. Does anyone remember???

Parker scores 55 points, leads Spurs to 1st win

[kace]

of course TP can be criticized and sometimes deserves it without a doubt.
of course he can play poorly sometimes and i'm the first to recognize it without any difficulty.
of course anyone can prefer another player or kind of player.

but we all know that's not what i'm talking about.


I do notice not a lot of ppl love TP the way they should, in other forums, he would be considered a God.

that's what i'm talking about

[naico]

I think another big reason why people might dislike him is the fact that some of his Homers are far too protective. Not excepting any kind of criticism and bashing others for doing so. That tends to piss some guys off. It's a far fetched reason but a reason nontheless.

[kace]

There's a lot of little reasons that contribute to it. There are some blind Manu backers who seem to think that tearing Parker down builds their guy up. Those people are far fewer than they once were but in my book they are the most annoying of the bunch.

I think part of the hate on him is that the Spurs have such an identity as a "hard work" team. It's ingrained in every facet of their image. And there's no doubt that Tony works hard. Nobody's jumper improves that drastically in one offseason by luck. The problem that impacts his image is that his game is so smooth that he makes it look easy. Too easy. From that comes a belief for some that any time that he doesn't play well it's because he's lazy or not trying. But it's hard to look like a tough guy when you're playing along side guys like Manu and Tim who come out of games looking like they were in a rugby match rather than a basketball game.

Some people see the letters "PG" next to his name and can't seem to shake the idea that he should be passing 90% of the time and because he doesn't he's a ball hog. The current system doesn't lend itself to a lot guard assists either. Nevermind the fact that in every damn interview I've ever seen him give during or after a game he always says, "Weh, yoo nuh Pup, eee wuz tellin me to be mur aggrezzive, yoo nuh?" He's only playing the way he's being told.

And there is still a belief by some that he's not clutch, or in some minds an out right choker. Now it's true that he doesn't have the catalogue of big game winning shots that Tim or Manu do. Part of the problem with that argument is that could run down the list of players in the league and be lucky to come up with more than a handful of guys that match their clutchness. The other issue is that his jumper was so streaky during his early years. Even though he can get to the hoop with ease on the last play of the game the likelihood in the NBA is that a ref will swallow his whistle when a guard gets mugged. And with a team armed with a variety of jumpshooters, it was no huge surprise that Tony's number didn't get called a lot. The biggest feather in the hat that some haters still cling to is the legend that Tony choked in the 2005 finals and Speedy Claxton swooped in from the rafters and saved the day. Never mind that Parker was what? 19? 20? And Claxton suddenly played what may have been his best game in a Spurs uni.

I think there's maybe a little bit of hating on him for being "Hollywood" on a small market team, but I really think it's the smallest of the reasons.

yeah, i think all your reasons sounds "good". i mean that's unfair but that could be some explanations.

except for the clutch thing: i think that if tony wasn't till 2006, he has proven so clearly these 2/3 past years that he's as good as any go to player in this aspect. the last two PO have proven that and even from his "haters" i didn't see too much bash about it.

[Brazil]

The funny thing is that TP has absolutely no love in France, the reasons are well known:
- French people like nobody except Zinédine Zidane and David Douillet, don't ask me why.
- Basketball is not a popular sport in France so basically nobody cares about the spurs and TP and the NBA, Lebron who ? Ah the NBA Jordan coool
- French hates the self confidence, if you say I'm fucking good and I'm going to win it all you're dead.
- French also don't like successful people and the blingbling stuff and if you add a glamorous desperate housewife it's worst.

Now why he has no love here ? it's quite weird for me, spurfaninexile has given some elements. it could be a beginning of explanation.

I'm over reacting a lot on the subject for nothing it's like the story of Don Quichote. I should be happy that TP has the respect of the wise people of this forum and the respect of the other team fans. For the others go to hell.

[diego]

There's a lot of little reasons that contribute to it. ...

agree with the general sentiment of this post, but also would add:

1) starting PG for a champ contender, let alone dynastic team, is a position that carries a lot of responsibility and scrutiny. it is normal in this sense that TP gets a lot of criticism when things are going "bad".

2) IMO, tony the past 3 years >>>>>>>>>>> tony pre 05-06. I dont know if the stats back me up but in my mind he greatly improved around that time, especially in decision making.

3) before it seemed like any team that crowded the paint could make him a non-factor. Of course, 90% of the reason for that was other spurs not hitting their 3s to space the floor, but it made tony look bad- his improved jumper will help him control that perception better. manu and tim have bad games, but generally speaking they can contribute in ways other than offense better than tony (playmaking, defense, leadership). that gap is also narrowing.

but hey what do i know, Im just a south american right? its not like any US born posters ever talk shit about tony (or anyone else on the team), nor is it the case that french/tony fans ever get insecure about manu's big games. It is only the bad south americans who do that :downspin:

[kace]

but hey what do i know, Im just a south american right? its not like any US born posters ever talk shit about tony (or anyone else on the team), nor is it the case that french/tony fans ever get insecure about manu's big games. It is only the bad south americans who do that :downspin:

hey man, please, i never said that. but you can't ignore that some manu's fans like to bash TP, and i said they're not the only ones. if some tp's fans do the same with manu (but it's clearly less obvious), they're just stupid assholes.

[sam1617]

I personally don't like him for a couple of reasons. He has always struck me as being arrogant, especially back 3-4 years ago (he has gotten better). He also tends to dominate the ball offensively, and bogs down the offense on occasion (also gotten way better). He also tends to not be the most vigorous defender, which annoys me, because with his quickness, no one should ever blow by him.

Of course thats just me. I have no clue why others don't like him.

[diego]

i know you didnt say it quite like that, but theres just no need to resort to nationality- with saying "manu-fan" or "tony-fan" its more than enough, they both have fans from everywhere and there are idiots from everywhere

[spursfan09]

Because he's better looking than most, is married to a TV star, and makes millions. I think thats why he gets alot of hate. I think people are actually jealous of him for whatever reason. he does not appear as humble as duncan or ginobili.

[m33p0]

he's French... which is to some, is reason enough. :lol

for others, coz he doesn't do HEB commercials. :lmao

[Biernutz]

well, i try to start this thread to understand things: why is Tony so hated by some members. Obviously, a lot of you are older members and live in SA. it's not a thread to complain about it (i've done that enough in others threads) or to ask to show some love to TP. I don't give a fuck if he's loved or not since i'm a spurs fan before a tony's fan. but i can't say that i don't find all this bullshit on him stupid and amazing and that maybe my nationality makes it a little bit harder to swallow.

so, i'd want to know if this thing is only from SOME (but there are a lot of them) manu's blind fans. i mean the ones who don't really give a fuck about the spurs and only watch them to see manu win and think that tony can overshadow him. Or is there another reason for it ?? i mean his nationality ?? or maybe his way of life ( wife who is a star ? rap thing ? even if he's rather humble and not trash talking or things like that)

i'm not trying to argue here. I mean it's so obvious that the dislike on him is pathetic and unfair that i don't want to hear the same points that i see every thread. OK, everyone has the right to like or not a player.

but why hate someone who gave and brought so much to the spurs ? who is our best player with tim and manu ?

Because if there the are usual haters who are very active on the forum, you can't deny that there are a lot of people throwing their dislike of him.

I'd just want to know if it's only on internet forums or also in all the "real" fanbase. is it just from south american or more than that because when i read things about him from US papers (local or national), TV, there's obviously no problem and tony is praised as he deserves.

so, what's the problem ?? (Once again, for those who'd want to argue about how he's bad for this team, it's not the place to do that: you have the billions of bashing threads for that. i'd only want the answers of people understanding that TP is unfairly and continuously bashed. thanks)

Is there anyone else here who thinks this post is stupid? "Most old guys in San Antonio hate Tony" What a crock of shit. Did you take a poll? All teams have their favorites and Manu and Tim are probably the choice of most fans . I go to the games a I see more Manu ,Tim and Tony jerseys than any others. The posters at ST would turn on Mother Teresa if she had 6 turnovers in a game. The Trolls are very active here.

Get over it!http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb270/systime/nomoretears.jpg

[dbestpro]

Parker has been a critical part of our success in the past. Times are changing. For the Spurs to continue their run we need TP to take his game to the next level. That would be 20 ppg an 10 assists per game. Many have said that Tony can't do this. If he is only to be a scoring point in the future then the end of the run may soon be at hand. It is not like we are hating on Tony its just that we hate losing.

[Fernando TD21]

Get over it!
:toast

[pjjrfan]

I think Tony dribbles the ball too much and sometimes, well, a lot of times runs the shot clock out looking for his shot, and from watching the NBA game since the 60's I would prefer a playmaking point guard, than a scoring point guard. But having said all this, I love Parker because he is a hard worker who loves the game he has to love the game to have put up with all crap Pop layed on him his first 3 seasons in the league, for all the abuse he has taken because the refs don't protect him like they do Paul, Nash, or Davis. I admire his courage on a basketball court, coming in at 19 and taking over a team of vets and helping them win a title, for keeping his mouth shut during the 03 season when Kidd was going around telling everyone how much he wanted to play with tim and Tony having to answer all dumb questions reporter put to him during the whole season, playoffs and into the finals where they guarded each other. He never rocked the boat, towed the company lne, and helped the team win its 2nd tltle and then when he did say something in the offseason he got torched by Pop and a lot of people in the forums, forgetting how he kept his mouth shut at a vital period in the Spurs franchise history. And although I have my own ideas of what the perfect point guard should be Tony is an amazing talent and I am very happy to have him be a spur. I would love to see him become a better playmaker, but before the injury his game was getting unstoppable, he took a step back and the whole team willhave to adjust to having everyone back, but I don't hate Tony, never have. But that doesn't mean I can't be critial of the guy if I think he wasn't playing well or had a bad game or made a bad decision or could improve his game in other areas besides scoring. There's a difference.

[ECZ]

:toast

:toast to your sig

:flag:

[Brodels]

I fail to understand why it seems to always come down to a Manu vs. Tony thing. Who fuckin' cares? The Spurs aren't going to win a title unless both are playing at a high level, so everyone better be rooting for them both to succeed.

[TDMVPDPOY]

I fail to understand why it seems to always come down to a Manu vs. Tony thing. Who fuckin' cares? The Spurs aren't going to win a title unless both are playing at a high level, so everyone better be rooting for them both to succeed.

GEORGE HILL has come....the saviour

[kaji157]

I was a great TP hater back in 2002-03 season, it was my first NBA season i watched, and it was mainly because of Manu, by this you have to understand that being Argentine as i am i am more used to a FIBA type of PG, i mean a PG that has usually 3 times the assists of his turnovers thing that Tony rarely does. Still i kind of like him now, it bothers me when he runs the clock down looking for his shot but many players do that, even Mason did it during the last game a couple of times.

Now there are two thing that bother me that are also the things that i consider will make the spur fail as a franchise with him as a cornerstone.

He has absolutely NO IMPACT on the game when he is not scoring. Something that a leader HAS TO HAVE the way Tim and Manu do.

And he is, to my eyes only, not humble enough to be a Spurs leader, i have, during the last 5 years, embraced the spurs filosophy, because it is much like the soccer filosophy we have here in argentina, be humble, play hard, believe in yourself, have courage on court, i think Tony lacks in some of this deppartments compared to other players on the team (not only Manu and TD).

About his ego, i have to say that i have the feel that if he had the will to became a better passer he could perform much better than he is performing now, but he has focused in improving his scoring, i have to say that i see that as being a little more concerned about yourself than the team, because he is the PG of a of a champion must know how to pass effectively at all times, and not only sometimes (kick out, non risk pass). Some say his descicion making has improved, i say only his shooting has improved, wheather in the past he would brick a bad shot, now he sinks a "contested jumper" but the descitions are the same, just are better executions.

Tony could easily be a 7-8 apg PG if he wanted to, and it would also raise his FG% by avoiding low percentage shots. yes, his scoring might drop, but he could also be a factor when his shot is not falling, something he cannot do now days.

[timaios]

Tony could easily be a 7-8 apg PG if he wanted to, and it would also raise his FG% by avoiding low percentage shots. yes, his scoring might drop, but he could also be a factor when his shot is not falling, something he cannot do now days.

Last 3 games 7ast 7ast 5ast... with low minutes in the 2 first games.

NBA Field-Goal Shooting Leaders at PG position

1 J. Crittenton, MEM 3.2 ppg FG% .538 (doesn't count, only 3.2 ppg)

2 T. Parker, SAS 23.1 ppg FG% .537
3 C. Paul, NOR 20.3 ppg FG% .522
4 R. Rondo, BOS 9.8 ppg FG%.514
5 S. Nash, PHO 15.1 ppg FG% .512

So Parker has the higher FG% and the most ppg among PGs and it's not enough.
You want him to shoot at .600 ?
And besides Oberto, Parker has the higher FG% of the Spurs.

[mathbzh]

+1
TP can't improve his FG% except marginally. He already avoids low% shots.

[SpurSupremacist]

I think the reason people dislike Parker is because he has the biggest ego on the Spurs. Don't tell me this team doesn't have egos because Parker has one and Manu has one also, to a lesser extent. If he didn't, he wouldn't try to be the damn hero all the time. It fucks things up, too. Against the Mavs, that stupid ass foul. One of the worst basketball plays I've ever seen. Last year against the Lakers, chucking repeatedly and turning the ball over -- when he shouldn't have even been playing at all. Then, he plays in the olympics, hurt, after the team told him they wished he wouldn't. Who does he think he is? He has a lucrative contract with the Spurs. Is he bigger than the team? This isn't Michael Jordan we're talking about.

[spurs4real]

why the hate or dislike? Cause hes an average PG who still averages 5.5 Assists for his career, its no wonder he never gets mentioned with, CP3, Kidd, Deron, Davis, etc. haha even Starbury avgs 7 assists for his career and we all know how much we dont want Starbury.

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/5267/tpru8.jpg

[mathbzh]

I do not disagree with everything you say, but this:


He has a lucrative contract with the Spurs.
Is not fair...
Of course he has a rather big contract, but he could have had much more somewhere else...

[mathbzh]

why the hate or dislike? Cause hes an average PG who still averages 5.5 Assists for his career, its no wonder he never gets mentioned with, CP3, Kidd, Deron, Davis, etc. haha even Starbury avgs 7 assists for his career and we all know how much we dont want Starbury.


Nash:
- Playing the Run&Gun for Dantoni: 3469 assists in 10831 minutes 15.3 ap48m
- Rest of his career (without his four first seasons to be fair):
2557 assists in 11087 minutes.... 11.0 ap48m

I don't say TP is a great passer... but looking at raw numbers without looking at the system you play is stupid.

[colargol]

WRONG!!

It's really an old fashion France point of vue...

:depressed




The funny thing is that TP has absolutely no love in France, the reasons are well known:
- French people like nobody except Zinédine Zidane and David Douillet, don't ask me why.
- Basketball is not a popular sport in France so basically nobody cares about the spurs and TP and the NBA, Lebron who ? Ah the NBA Jordan coool
- French hates the self confidence, if you say I'm fucking good and I'm going to win it all you're dead.
- French also don't like successful people and the blingbling stuff and if you add a glamorous desperate housewife it's worst.

Now why he has no love here ? it's quite weird for me, spurfaninexile has given some elements. it could be a beginning of explanation.

I'm over reacting a lot on the subject for nothing it's like the story of Don Quichote. I should be happy that TP has the respect of the wise people of this forum and the respect of the other team fans. For the others go to hell.

[Brazil]

WRONG!!

It's really an old fashion France point of vue...

:depressed

Wrong what ? You don't believe he has no love in France ?
It's old fashion still right.

[naico]

Most Popular French Athletes in France (2008)

1. Thierry Henry 42,0%
2. Franck Ribéry 38,7%
3. Laure Manaudou 34,3%
4. Tony Parker 33,5%
5. Sébastien Chabal 28,0%
6. Sébastien Loeb 27,5%
7. Jeannie Longo 27,1 %
8. Amélie Mauresmo 26,4%
9. David Trézéguet 25,3%
10. Nicolas Anelka 21,6%
22. Joakim Noah 14,1% :lmao

[Brazil]

It's a quite weird poll ! Jeannie Longo at 7 noah at 22 :) mauresmo at 6 :)
If you make the poll for the fan of sports you will see o total different picture. For TP just look at the french sports forum you will see that actually spurstalk loves TP.

[naico]

It's a quite weird poll ! Jeannie Longo at 7 noah at 22 :) mauresmo at 6 :)
If you make the poll for the fan of sports you will see o total different picture. For TP just look at the french sports forum you will see that actually spurstalk loves TP.

Good point. It's actually: Les sportifs préférés des français. It doesn't say if the people questioned are real sports fans. Especially Noah at 22, makes me wonder if people don't have his dad in mind when voting (obviously; the guy was a national hero back in the day, and is now popular again as a singer).

People in France tend to vote for sportsmen who have a difficult background like Ribéry or warriors like rugbyman Chabal and veteran Longo.

[sonic21]

Wrong what ? You don't believe he has no love in France ?
It's old fashion still right.

how can you say he has no love in france, he's one of the most popular player with iverson, kobe, lebron and tim duncan.

And for the " tp has a huge ego" thing, it's BS.
I think it's Kori who said he was very humble, so please explain why many of you are saying he's arrogant or have a huge ego.(maybe the fact that he's french which seems to be the main reason).

[Brazil]

Good point. It's actually: Les sportifs préférés des français. It doesn't say if the people questioned are real sports fans. Especially Noah at 22, makes me wonder if people don't have his dad in mind when voting (obviously; the guy was a national hero back in the day, and is now popular again as a singer).

People in France tend to vote for sportsmen who have a difficult background like Ribéry or warriors like rugbyman Chabal and veteran Longo.

Absolutely ! I think it's like Les sportifs préférés by les ménagères de -50 ans.

[Indazone]

Eva is gonna come in here and beat all your butts!

[TMTTRIO]

I think the reason people dislike Parker is because he has the biggest ego on the Spurs. Don't tell me this team doesn't have egos because Parker has one and Manu has one also, to a lesser extent. If he didn't, he wouldn't try to be the damn hero all the time. It fucks things up, too. Against the Mavs, that stupid ass foul. One of the worst basketball plays I've ever seen. Last year against the Lakers, chucking repeatedly and turning the ball over -- when he shouldn't have even been playing at all. Then, he plays in the olympics, hurt, after the team told him they wished he wouldn't. Who does he think he is? He has a lucrative contract with the Spurs. Is he bigger than the team? This isn't Michael Jordan we're talking about.

then aren't we glad he hasn't complained and cried about having to come off the bench after six years of doing it when he could've been a starter and a star on any other team. Now for Tony I really love Tony and glad he's a Spur. It's great to really see him grow up and get better and he's a very important piece to our team, he's just not my favorite player.

[Andy25]

he's French... which is to some, is reason enough. :lol

for others, coz he doesn't do HEB commercials. :lmao


With Brent Barry gone.. who is going to tell Manu he can't be a mango tree?:depressed

[mrspurs]

Without TP this team would fall apart quicker than its falling apart already. Teams are already spreading apart. And thou we have all our players back(still finding their roles), it easy to see just how far back we are compared to those teams that are just starting to pull away. To be battling Dallas or Portland for the last seed isnt a great sign. Now of course with our week schedule and if Manu had been ready to play. Our record would be alot better. But like most of yall say(that i feel is a cop out excuse), Manu would have been injured anyways. Their last game against the Pistons showed me just how far back this team is. And like and many have said. It all starts in the paint. Against the Pistons this early in the season, we couldnt make a stop if we tried. And it was the usual missing to many 3s that lost our game. Even if we make the playoffs, we will get thrown out quite quickly. Unless we find Timmy some help.

[Indazone]

Your team is solid like it is every year. Last year you were one game of making to the finals if it weren't for the Lakers. Now if there's anything that the Spurs can do to prepare for the Lakers, it's to get big or get some long range bombers. Anyone who says that they don't need bigs, needs to keep the LA Lakers in mind.

[kace]

Is there anyone else here who thinks this post is stupid? "Most old guys in San Antonio hate Tony" What a crock of shit. Did you take a poll? All teams have their favorites and Manu and Tim are probably the choice of most fans . I go to the games a I see more Manu ,Tim and Tony jerseys than any others. The posters at ST would turn on Mother Teresa if she had 6 turnovers in a game. The Trolls are very active here.

Get over it!http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb270/systime/nomoretears.jpg

obvioulsy you didn't understand a thing of my post. it's probably because you prefer to bash, even in a lame way, and because my english isn't always correct.

when i say old members, i'm not talking about age but about members of this forum who've been there for a long time and who live in SA and have a best knowledge of how tony is perceived there. it doesn't have anything with saying "old guys in SA hate tony", which is just stupid.


I go to the games and I see more Manu ,Tim and Tony jerseys than any others. The posters at ST would turn on Mother Teresa if she had 6 turnovers in a game.

this is exactly the kind of answer that i was talking about. i mean something that only people getting to the games in SA and knowing well this forum can know. so, i guess you can understand what i ask when you want it.

[kace]

anyway, most of you are arguing why they think TP isn't good enough and blablabla, which isn't the topic.

i think he's great and anyway much better than the treatment he gets there. for me, it's obvious and unquestionable so i just want to know why.

and i don't give a fuck if he's loved or ignored in france or anywhere else. i'm not a groupie of the man but a fan of the sportman and the spur. and it's as a spur and a basketball player that i find that he's unfairly disliked here. i don't care about the star thing.

[spurs4real]

Nash:
- Playing the Run&Gun for Dantoni: 3469 assists in 10831 minutes 15.3 ap48m
- Rest of his career (without his four first seasons to be fair):
2557 assists in 11087 minutes.... 11.0 ap48m

I don't say TP is a great passer... but looking at raw numbers without looking at the system you play is stupid.


Chris Paul career 9.6, apg this yr averaging 11.8
Steve Nash career 7.9, this yr averaging 8.1 apg
Deron Williams career 8.2, apg this yr averaging 10.2
Baron Davis career 7.3, apg this yr averaging 8.1
Tony Parker career 5.5, apg this yr averaging 6 (has never averaged more than 6.1 apg EVER) Once he averages 9 apg this team would be dangerous.

Didnt TP need 4 QTRS and 2 OTs to get 10 assists? WOW

Forget the Assists per 48 mins crap, thats for homers.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1914/tpapgkv1.jpg

[sonic21]

Chris Paul career 9.6, apg this yr averaging 11.8
Steve Nash career 7.9, this yr averaging 8.1 apg
Deron Williams career 8.2, apg this yr averaging 10.2
Baron Davis career 7.3, apg this yr averaging 8.1
Tony Parker career 5.5, apg this yr averaging 6 (has never averaged more than 6.1 apg EVER) Once he averages 9 apg this team would be dangerous.

Didnt TP need 4 QTRS and 2 OTs to get 10 assists? WOW

Forget the Assists per 48 mins crap, thats for homers.



motion offense , that's why.

[spurs4real]

motion offense , that's why.

LOL Please, all motion for the offense comes from the PG dont give me that. See its very quiet simple, When there is passing there is motion, when there is no passing there are people just standing around.

And tonight when ur watching TP, take off the Homer Glasses and watch how he doesnt pass the ball. Watch him get his usual 5 assists and attempt to get his 20 points. And also watch how we will struggle offensively again. Oh Oh also watch when he sits on the bench for a rest as out backup PG does way better with your "motion offense".

[kace]

Chris Paul career 9.6, apg this yr averaging 11.8
Steve Nash career 7.9, this yr averaging 8.1 apg
Deron Williams career 8.2, apg this yr averaging 10.2
Baron Davis career 7.3, apg this yr averaging 8.1
Tony Parker career 5.5, apg this yr averaging 6 (has never averaged more than 6.1 apg EVER) Once he averages 9 apg this team would be dangerous.

Didnt TP need 4 QTRS and 2 OTs to get 10 assists? WOW

Forget the Assists per 48 mins crap, thats for homers.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1914/tpapgkv1.jpg

Tony isn't a "passing first" kind of PG, that's for sure.

but spurs had this past years three offensive options: Tim at the post ; tony on the drive and PnR ; Manu drives and PnR. any of them give assists to the PG.

are you arguing that the style of basketball a team plays has nothing to do with the number of assists his PG has ? look at the kind of basketball played by nash, CP3 and Baron's teams ? is it just a coïncidence ?? who would take the alley oop pass that cp3 throw to chandler and west ? => rasho ? KT ? Oberto ?????

[spurs4real]

Tony isn't a "passing first" kingof PG, that's for sure.
but spurs had this past years three offensive options: Tim at the post ; tony on the drive and PnR ; Manu drives and PnR. any of them give assists to the PG.
are you arguing that the style of basketball a team plays has nothing to do with the number of assists his PG has ?

The style of basketball has nothing to do with anything, it all starts with the PG and his decisions on who gets the ball where. Slow paced, fast paced, there are assists to be made and TP doesnt want to make em. Hed rather score and get his, than get his teammates easy baskets.

[sonic21]

The style of basketball has nothing to do with anything, it all starts with the PG and his decisions on who gets the ball where. Slow paced, fast paced, there are assists to be made and TP doesnt want to make em. Hed rather score and get his, than get his teammates easy baskets.

Tony does what pop tell him to do.

[kace]

The style of basketball has nothing to do with anything,

:rolleyes



Slow paced, fast paced, there are assists to be made and TP doesnt want to make em. Hed rather score and get his, than get his teammates easy baskets.

firstly, it's easier to have great numbers when your team plays fast pace, with more possessions, so you begin being false.
and if you think that it's tony, or manu, or tim, that decide what they have to do with the ball, you don't understand anything at the spurs. tony takes as many shot as Pop allows him to take. that's all.

[spurs4real]

Tony does what pop tell him to do.

Yes he does, but being a ball hog isnt one. Why cant Spurs (homers) Fans see it. Being naive about TP and Passing is like being naive about having Pancakes for Thankgiving Dinner.

:toast
enjoy the game

[mrspurs]

Im married to the French. I have French relatives. I have half French Kids. And let me tell ya. They're not the easiest people to get along with. They love themselves and what they do. They could careless who you are or what your do. Thats why all the people with money who have problems in the USA goto France. In France you can walk around anywhere you want basically and noone cares who you are. You can shop and walk in parks and noone will stop you for your autograph etc. They have a smile all to their own. Maybe some people just cant get pasted that. And let me tell ya. The French and Tony could careless. And yes I got permission from my wife to say this. hahahaha

[spursfan09]

Im married to the French. I have French relatives. I have half French Kids. And let me tell ya. They're not the easiest people to get along with. They love themselves and what they do. They could careless who you are or what your do. Thats why all the people with money who have problems in the USA goto France. In France you can walk around anywhere you want basically and noone cares who you are. You can shop and walk in parks and noone will stop you for your autograph etc. They have a smile all to their own. Maybe some people just cant get pasted that. And let me tell ya. The French and Tony could careless. And yes I got permission from my wife to say this. hahahaha

You serious?

The complete opposite of Americans' obsessions with celebrities.

[Brazil]

Im married to the French. I have French relatives. I have half French Kids. And let me tell ya. They're not the easiest people to get along with. They love themselves and what they do. They could careless who you are or what your do. Thats why all the people with money who have problems in the USA goto France. In France you can walk around anywhere you want basically and noone cares who you are. You can shop and walk in parks and noone will stop you for your autograph etc. They have a smile all to their own. Maybe some people just cant get pasted that. And let me tell ya. The French and Tony could careless. And yes I got permission from my wife to say this. hahahaha

:toast to your wife then. Mine is half american and she loves TP. :)

[Brazil]

The style of basketball has nothing to do with anything, it all starts with the PG and his decisions on who gets the ball where. Slow paced, fast paced, there are assists to be made and TP doesnt want to make em. Hed rather score and get his, than get his teammates easy baskets.

So now TO doesn't want to make them ??? I could understand if you have said even if it's wrong he has not enough talent to be a regular PG at +10 apg but he doesn't want ? :lol

[Fingaroll44]

The biggest feather in the hat that some haters still cling to is the legend that Tony choked in the 2005 finals and Speedy Claxton swooped in from the rafters and saved the day.

it was in '03 and Parker was still barely out of his teen years so I gave him a pass. A lot of young guys couldnt have held up under Pops pressure the way Tony did over the years.

[spursfan09]

it was in '03 and Parker was still barely out of his teen years so I gave him a pass. A lot of young guys couldnt have held up under Pops pressure the way Tony did over the years.

Yup! example being Beno.

[hater]

You serious?

The complete opposite of Americans' obsessions with celebrities.

I would not call the complete opposite. the complete opposite is in china, where they grab them, take their clothes and pretty much violate them

[mathbzh]

Chris Paul career 9.6, apg this yr averaging 11.8
Steve Nash career 7.9, this yr averaging 8.1 apg
Deron Williams career 8.2, apg this yr averaging 10.2
Baron Davis career 7.3, apg this yr averaging 8.1
Tony Parker career 5.5, apg this yr averaging 6 (has never averaged more than 6.1 apg EVER) Once he averages 9 apg this team would be dangerous.

Didnt TP need 4 QTRS and 2 OTs to get 10 assists? WOW

Forget the Assists per 48 mins crap, thats for homers.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1914/tpapgkv1.jpg

You didn't see my point... I just told you to take care with raw numbers... Nash being the living proof that the assist number highly depends on the game style. I didn't even mention Parker numbers.

If you want statistics, you should also have a look to team statistics.
How do you explain, that with a 6 apg PG, the Spurs Assisted FG % is better than the Hornets one for 2007-2008?

[spursfan09]

I would not call the complete opposite. the complete opposite is in china, where they grab them, take their clothes and pretty much violate them

I don't know... what comes to mind is paparrazi when you say that. Ofcourse maybe not as bad, but those people will stop at nothing it seems like to get that picture.