The Cleveland Cavaliers

[Amuseddaysleeper]

They're off to a nice start, and their offense has improved greatly from last year.....but I still can't take them seriously to go all the way.

What do you guys make of the Cavs this year?

[Findog]

They're legit. This is the best LeBron-era Cavs team, better than the team that got anally violated by the Spurs in the Finals.

[dirk4mvp]

They should wear those jerseys from last night for the rest of the season. If I had any money, I'd buy one of those real quick.

[IronMexican]

They are definitely for real.

[hater]

from the usual help they get from the refs, they could easily win it all this year. easily....

[stretch]

they will be the 2009 NBA champions in my book.

[Kobe™]

Nope^.

[Armando]

The Cavs are still painful to watch. I rather watch the Thunder. Kobe that picture of Pierce just ain't right.

[Thunder Dan]

The Cavs are still painful to watch. I rather watch the Thunder. Kobe that picture of Pierce just ain't right.

people in Phoenix have trouble watching a team play defense

[tlongII]

LeBron is EASILY the best player in the league. Any team that has him is a legitimate threat.

[Lp26]

While it's impressive that they are drilling all the bad teams by 30 or so, they've lost to every good team they've played against; BOS,DET,NOH. I want to see them when they have a tougher schedule.

[Lp26]

While it's impressive that they are drilling all the bad teams by 30 or so, they've lost to every good team they've played against; BOS,DET,NOH. I want to see them when they have a tougher schedule. I'm still not sold on Mo Williams and their defense at guard.

[Bob Lanier]

Ben and Gimpy in the frontcourt shouldn't scare anyone. It remains to be seen whether trading Eric Snow's defense for Mo Williams' offense will pay dividends in the playoffs.

A team who starts a dude as ugly as Delonte West deserves credit, though. Or something.

[Killakobe81]

LeBron is EASILY the best player in the league. Any team that has him is a legitimate threat.

not easily Wade, Kobe duncan, and of course pierce says he is ...Dhoward and KG CP3 are all close and you can argue them ...
I say Kobe still barely over Lebron BUT he cant hold him off much longer ...and duncan was better as well in his MVP years ...I think Lebroin if healthy may challenge Jordan as GOAT

[Bob Lanier]

...I think Lebroin if healthy may challenge Jordan as GOAT
Tell us more.

[KidCongo]

Ferry can still pull off a big trade in the meantime. The team having a great chemistry is a big plus too.

[bostonguy]

They are off to a very nice start. However, they are a move away from taking it to that next level. That team as it currently stands, is still not good enough to win a championship. They need a good consistent scoring bigman then they will be truly set. Ben/Z/sideshow bob just isnt enough. They have some expiring and very very soon to be expiring contracts that are very tradeable. Delonte West or Gibson also need to be dealt. They have too many pgs. Lebron is amazing but he needs a scoring big by his side. No excuses on standing Pat. The Cavs have until Feb to do something about this and they have the pieces to make a trade.

[Reck]

They are definately much improve this year but they still wont go all the way. In fact, they'll probably get eliminated in the second round. Maybe could go to the Eastern Conference Finals..maybe.

[SpursDynasty]

Cleveland Cavs suck ass.

[mystargtr34]

Cavs are definately legit. That team is awesome defensively and grabs every single board. Z is playing like an All-Star, so is Mo Williams. Great bench.

And LeBron.

[E20]

Lebron James is a mother f'in regulator.

[KidCongo]

They are off to a very nice start. However, they are a move away from taking it to that next level. That team as it currently stands, is still not good enough to win a championship. They need a good consistent scoring bigman then they will be truly set. Ben/Z/sideshow bob just isnt enough. They have some expiring and very very soon to be expiring contracts that are very tradeable. Delonte West or Gibson also need to be dealt. They have too many pgs. Lebron is amazing but he needs a scoring big by his side. No excuses on standing Pat. The Cavs have until Feb to do something about this and they have the pieces to make a trade.

West is a combo. Boobie is a shooting guard in a point's body.

There fine with those guys rotating around the guard spots, but a solid defensive, jumpshot making 2 guard is needed. PS. at least 6'6

[ShoogarBear]

I had just come in here to start a thread like this.

I think the Cavs are legit. Somewhat Spur-like in you look at their roster and other than the obvious (LeBron), it's hard to believe that they're really that much better than last year. But the parts seem to fit really well. Yes, they're playing defense, but they are currently FIRST in the league in offensive efficiency (points per 100 possessions). So it's not just winning with ugly defense.

I'm surprised that Mo Williams seems to have made that much of a difference.

[Armando]

The East this year is alot better top to bottom. Granted it still comes down to Boston and Cavs. But Orlando,Detroit,Toronto,New Jersey and Miami and Atlanta won't be walks in the park in the playoffs.

[JoeTait75]

West is a combo. Boobie is a shooting guard in a point's body.

There fine with those guys rotating around the guard spots, but a solid defensive, jumpshot making 2 guard is needed. PS. at least 6'6

I think all they need is another veteran big. LeBron's D has improved to the point where Sasha is adequate as a 10-min cover on an opponent's top wing player. But J.J. Hickson won't cut it as the #4 big man. Neither will Wally stealing minutes at the 4. You need veterans to win championships.

No stud needed. Just someone like this guy (on the right):

http://blog.cleveland.com/andone/2008/04/large_LB%20and%20Joe%20Smith%20laughing.gif

(Like PJ Brown for the C's last year)

...and this team is ready to compete for a championship, as constituted. When you have the best player in the league and are sound defensively, with an array of solid, smart role players, you don't need a facelift. IMO.

[Warlord23]

The Cavs have quietly overtaken the Lakers in PPG differential (+12.9 to +12.2). Although they've dropped some games to the big boys, they've beaten everyone they were supposed to beat and are also undefeated at home.

If Lebron gets homecourt in the playoffs, they will get to the Finals at least. Boston will need homecourt at the very least to beat the Cavs, and I'm not sure if even that will be enough for Detroit (and they're already 4.5 games behind the Cavs).

[Thunder Dan]

The Cavs have quietly overtaken the Lakers in PPG differential (+12.9 to +12.2). Although they've dropped some games to the big boys, they've beaten everyone they were supposed to beat and are also undefeated at home.

If Lebron gets homecourt in the playoffs, they will get to the Finals at least. Boston will need homecourt at the very least to beat the Cavs, and I'm not sure if even that will be enough for Detroit (and they're already 4.5 games behind the Cavs).

The Boston game was unexplainable other than it was the first time Mo Williams played with the team, and the rotations were messed up. They were up 14 at one point

Detroit was a road 2nd half of a B2B which they lead by 11 or something at the half

New Orleans was their opening night, and they were leading by 11 going into the 4th

not making excuses, just saying that their 3 losses are not that bad of loses- they were in every game


Also, Lebron scored 11 last night and they still won by 24...so all the people that say the Cavs are only Lebron obviously do not watch the Cavs this year

[JoeTait75]

I'm surprised that Mo Williams seems to have made that much of a difference.

The most pleasant surprise about Mo has been his defensive tenacity. He came over from a club that didn't emphasize defense, so he was really an unknown quantity on that end of the floor, but he's bought in fully to what we do here, and he's doing a nice job so far.

[Kobe™]

That's what a "PG" can do for you.

[JoeTait75]

That's what a "PG" can do for you.

Yeah, we hadn't had a legitimate PG since Andre Miller. I'd damn near forgotten what one looked like.

[KidCongo]

I had just come in here to start a thread like this.

I think the Cavs are legit. Somewhat Spur-like in you look at their roster and other than the obvious (LeBron), it's hard to believe that they're really that much better than last year. But the parts seem to fit really well. Yes, they're playing defense, but they are currently FIRST in the league in offensive efficiency (points per 100 possessions). So it's not just winning with ugly defense.

I'm surprised that Mo Williams seems to have made that much of a difference.

Mike Brown is still developing as a coach, he is to be thanked for the greatly improved offense also.

[ShoogarBear]

Mike Brown is still developing as a coach, he is to be thanked for the greatly improved offense also.

Hmm, emphasizing defense first, improving the offense as the years go on . . . wonder where he got that pattern from?

[Allanon]

I think the Cavs are legit contenders but I don't think they can beat whoever comes out of the West.

[Thunder Dan]

I think the Cavs are legit contenders but I don't think they can beat whoever comes out of the West.

dude, have you got the memo yet...the West isn't the 2005 &2006 West anymore- It's one good team, a bunch of middle of the road teams, and about 4 terrible teams. The east has one really bad team, who are w/o their best player and were in the playoffs last year

[ShoogarBear]

dude, have you got the memo yet...the West isn't the 2005 &2006 West anymore- It's one good team, a bunch of middle of the road teams, and about 4 terrible teams. The east has one really bad team, who are w/o their best player and were in the playoffs last year

How come you didn't say 2007? :lol

[Thunder Dan]

How come you didn't say 2007? :lol

because the Celtics bitch slapped the Lakers in the Finals. My basketball years go from when the season starts

[JoeTait75]

I think the Cavs are legit contenders but I don't think they can beat whoever comes out of the West.

The Cavaliers will beat any team in the league if they have homecourt in a series, including the Lake Show.

[Thunder Dan]

The Cavaliers will beat any team in the league if they have homecourt in a series, including the Lake Show.

haven't the Cavs won 4 in a row vs. the Lakers? and that was the shitty Cavs

[DrHouse]

The Cavs won't be able to keep this up for a full NBA season. They aren't balanced enough and their bench isn't deep enough.

The top two teams in the league record wise will be LAL and BOS. The only way the Cavs beat BOS in the playoffs is with HCA. In fact if BOS has the best record in the league again they will win another ring. Nobody is beating them w/o HCA.

[sook]

The Cav's can not beat any team that comes out of the west...they matchup well with a lot of the east teams but that doesn't translate to the west. The only team i think they might be able to beat are the hornets, blazers, or suns.

And if the spurs come out in the finals once more, just give it up cleveland fans.
Will be another sweep.

[Allanon]

dude, have you got the memo yet...the West isn't the 2005 &2006 West anymore- It's one good team, a bunch of middle of the road teams, and about 4 terrible teams. The east has one really bad team, who are w/o their best player and were in the playoffs last year

Are you kidding me? The West had a major adjustment period due to injuries, new players and coaching changes.

The West is starting to come on strong again after they've adjusted. The East is still much weaker than the West although they're not as bad as last year.

Look at the Eastern Playoffs.

Chicago Bulls are 9-11. 45% wins and is in the 8th seed.

Phoenix Suns are 12-9. 57% wins and they are out of the Playoffs as of right now.

[DrHouse]

^This. The Cavs do well against the EC teams because they don't need to score much to win. Against the WC you need to be able to score as well as defend, which is why BOS was so dominant against the WC last season. They could do both effectively, I'm not sold that the Cavs can.

[sook]

Good chemistry + LeBron gives them the opportunity to blow out most mediocre teams they face. However, they still haven't shown the ability to beat elite teams or anyone with a very good defense.

Oct 28 at Boston L 85-90
Oct 30 vs Charlotte W 96-79
Nov 1 at New Orleans L 92-104
Nov 3 at Dallas W 100-81
Nov 5 vs Chicago W 107-93
Nov 7 vs Indiana W 111-107
Nov 8 at Chicago W 106-97
Nov 11 vs Milwaukee W 99-93
Nov 13 vs Denver W 110-99 (pre-Chauncey trade)
Nov 15 vs Utah W 105-93 (No Deron, Kirilenko, Harpring)
Nov 18 at New Jersey W 106-82
Nov 19 at Detroit L 89-96
Nov 22 vs Atlanta W 110-96
Nov 25 at New York W 119-101
Nov 26 vs Oklahoma City W 117-82
Nov 28 vs Golden State W 112-97
Nov 29 at Milwaukee W 97-85

They are 1-3 against good teams, and their victory against an injury-depleted Utah came after Utah had lost 3 straight. Don't see them being a threat to the West this year.

[SpurForLife]

Good chemistry + LeBron gives them the opportunity to blow out most mediocre teams they face. However, they still haven't shown the ability to beat elite teams or anyone with a very good defense.

Oct 28 at Boston L 85-90
Oct 30 vs Charlotte W 96-79
Nov 1 at New Orleans L 92-104
Nov 3 at Dallas W 100-81
Nov 5 vs Chicago W 107-93
Nov 7 vs Indiana W 111-107
Nov 8 at Chicago W 106-97
Nov 11 vs Milwaukee W 99-93
Nov 13 vs Denver W 110-99 (pre-Chauncey trade)
Nov 15 vs Utah W 105-93 (No Deron, Kirilenko, Harpring)
Nov 18 at New Jersey W 106-82
Nov 19 at Detroit L 89-96
Nov 22 vs Atlanta W 110-96
Nov 25 at New York W 119-101
Nov 26 vs Oklahoma City W 117-82
Nov 28 vs Golden State W 112-97
Nov 29 at Milwaukee W 97-85

They are 1-3 against good teams, and their victory against an injury-depleted Utah came after Utah had lost 3 straight. Don't see them being a threat to the West this year.

Chauncey was playing with Denver at the time they played the Cav's. With that said I don't think they are going to beat the West just yet. At least not without homecourt.

[Thunder Dan]

^This. The Cavs do well against the EC teams because they don't need to score much to win. Against the WC you need to be able to score as well as defend, which is why BOS was so dominant against the WC last season. They could do both effectively, I'm not sold that the Cavs can.

they are top 3 in the league in scoring and defense. Give it up bro, you don't know what your talking about

[Thunder Dan]

Chauncey was playing with Denver at the time they played the Cav's. With that said I don't think they are going to beat the West just yet. At least not without homecourt.

the West isn't what it used to be. Don't hate the Cavs becuase they beat teams they are supposed to beat. The Spurs (Bucks), Rockets (Pacers), Lakers (Pacers), Jazz (KNICKS, WASHINGTON WIZARDS (have 2 wins), Charlotte f'ing Bobcats, Bulls and Nets) and Suns (Bulls, Nets AND Heat) can't do the same

[m33p0]

they're still a one-man show. limit his contributions and the cavs will go down.

[Thunder Dan]

they're still a one-man show. limit his contributions and the cavs will go down.

yeah thats why he scored 11 points last night and they beat the pacers by like 30....the Pacers that beat the Celtics, Lakers and The Rockets. He has played the 4th quarter about 3 times this year.

Stop with the jealously, just because the Cavs are dominating teams the way you wish your teams would doesn't mean you need to hate or make judgements when you don't even watch them. They are top 3 in scoring, top 3 in defense, and lead the league in point differential which over the last 10 years, the leader of that has won the championship 8 times.

Cavs only belong on the court with the Celtics and Lakers...all you other haters, better luck next year

[Thunder Dan]

West scout on how many legit title contenders there are at the 20-game mark

"I can't give you more than three. I should probably reserve the right to include San Antonio, out of respect for all [the Spurs'] championship experience. Who's going to be surprised if they're a factor in the playoffs? But it's Boston, Cleveland and the Lakers. We're all looking up at Boston and L.A. and I can find too many flaws in everyone else."

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-081206-07

whats this, a West scout saying only one team from the West has a shot thus far?

[mystargtr34]

Cavs are looking damn good. They beat the Nuggets with Billups, and the Mavs, albeit when they were in their funk, and were right in games until the last minutes in all three of their losses.

I think they can beat the Celtics regardless of whether they have HCA or not, everybody saw how LeBron struggled individually against them in last years series, yet they were still 3 minutes from knocking them out on the road. Now that Mo is in town, they have 3 legitimate scoring threats and an awesome defense and some damn good role players.

Boston are still favourite, but Cavs are a close second.

They can compete with any team in the West, but i would put my money on LA, Houston and SA beating them provided everyone is healthy.

[KidCongo]

Go Cavs!

[JoeTait75]

they're still a one-man show. limit his contributions and the cavs will go down.

You make it sound easy to do.

[Findog]

The Cavs are a legit title contender, not title favorite. They're looking up at Boston and LA like everybody else. But they came within an inch of beating the Celtics last year and they're better now. They absolutely belong on the short list of contenders.

[DrHouse]

One man shows NEVER work. You need team balance and the Cavs simply don't have that on both ends of the floor. They are off to a great start, but lots of teams have gotten off to great starts. It's the truly balanced ones with great benches that are able to sustain it, and the Cavs don't have that.

I'm sorry Cav fan to burst your bubble. Your team is good, don't get me wrong. But you're not beating BOS for best record in the EC and you are going to lose to BOS because you won't have HCA in the playoffs. Wash, rinse, repeat of last season.

[Findog]

^ The Cavs have more balance than they did last year. As for being a one-man show, they beat Detroit two years ago because Gibson stepped up. Mo Williams isn't even an All Star, but he can create his own shot, and that's all LeBron needs, somebody who can help keep defenses honest.

And I don't know where you get the idea that the Cavs are not a good defensive team. As good as Boston? No way. But they've been modeled after the Spurs. Not as good as San Antonio, but that's the model. The Cavs are going to be as tough an out as there is. They came within an inch of beating the Celtics without HCA last year and they're an improved team this season. I agree it's early and we don't award trophies for November and December, but if they're playing like this in April, they're going to definitely make noise and be a factor in the playoffs.

[peskypesky]

they're still a one-man show. limit his contributions and the cavs will go down.

:toast

Aside from Lebron, they don't have another dependable scoring threat. Don't see how they can contend with teams like Spurs, Lakers, and Celtics who have multiple scoring threats.

That being said, the Cavs are looking great so far this season. No doubt.

[m33p0]

You make it sound easy to do.
truth be told, bruce made it look easy to do a couple of years ago.

[DrHouse]

There will always be at least one team in the NBA that has a truly balanced offensive and defensive attack. The 3-peat Lakers had what I would say was a more potent offense than defense, but their D was still pretty good. The Pistons had incredible defense and a good offense as did the Spurs. The Celtics followed suit. The Cavs have a good defense but their offense is not balanced. It's Lebron, Lebron, Lebron. 90% of teams may not be able to stop that, but the ones that win titles can and have and will.

[mystargtr34]

There will always be at least one team in the NBA that has a truly balanced offensive and defensive attack. The 3-peat Lakers had what I would say was a more potent offense than defense, but their D was still pretty good. The Pistons had incredible defense and a good offense as did the Spurs. The Celtics followed suit. The Cavs have a good defense but their offense is not balanced. It's Lebron, Lebron, Lebron. 90% of teams may not be able to stop that, but the ones that win titles can and have and will.

Mo Williams is a solid number 2 option. Averging nearly 16 PPG on a solid %. Not to mention 4.4 APG. That alone shows LeBron is not the only option when Williams is accounting for over 25 PPG.

Ilguaskas is averaging 15-8 in only 26 minutes. Thats probably top 5 production from the Center spot. Hes blocking shots this year too.

Delonte West has impoved immensley, hes capable of putting up 10-15 points a game. Also in the top 10 in 3 pt shooting.

Boobie Gibson has improved aswell.

That team has more than just LeBron

[manufor3]

from the usual help they get from the refs, they could easily win it all this year. easily....

i agree

[JoeTait75]

truth be told, bruce made it look easy to do a couple of years ago.

You think Bruce did it alone? lol.

Right now there are two teams with the scheme and the personnel to contain LeBron over a seven-game series: San Antonio and Boston. Maybe Houston, but they probably won't get a chance in that situation anyway. Any other team that talks about containing LeBron is just doing that- talking.

[PerforatedNeckline]

I think that anyone who says that the Cavs offense this year is just "Lebron, Lebron, Lebron" isn't watching the games. Or even giving the boxscores more than a cursory glance.

[DrHouse]

If CLE is right with LAL and BOS post All-Star break then we can have this discussion about them being an elite.

Look I sincerely hope CLE does beat BOS because I think Lakers can legitimately beat the Cavs in a 7 game series. They don't have the stifling defense BOS does and wouldn't be able to keep pace with us offensively.

[JoeTait75]

Look I sincerely hope CLE does beat BOS because I think Lakers can legitimately beat the Cavs in a 7 game series. They don't have the stifling defense BOS does and wouldn't be able to keep pace with us offensively.

The Cavaliers may not play defense at Boston's level- I'm not sure anyone does- but I can assure you that they are a very, very solid defensive ballclub, and they've shown as much in the postseason the last three years. I'd go as far as to say they're an elite defensive club when they're clicking. If you want to wait before buying in to the Cavaliers, that's fine, it's understandable, but if you think they'd just let the Lake Show run a track meet in a best-of-seven series, you've got another thing coming. Be great to find out either way.

[Armando]

The Cavs bore me to tears. I hope if the Suns don't make it I rather see the Lakers/Celtics round 2. Or

Celtics/Hornets
Spurs/Celtics

[JoeTait75]

The Cavs bore me to tears. I hope if the Suns don't make it I rather see the Lakers/Celtics round 2. Or

Celtics/Hornets
Spurs/Celtics

"If?" lol

[KidCongo]

I think that anyone who says that the Cavs offense this year is just "Lebron, Lebron, Lebron" isn't watching the games. Or even giving the boxscores more than a cursory glance.

+1

[Thunder Dan]

The Cavs bore me to tears. I hope if the Suns don't make it I rather see the Lakers/Celtics round 2. Or

Celtics/Hornets
Spurs/Celtics

you must not watch the Suns either- they suck, they aren't making the Finals