Game Thoughts: Spurs @ Mavericks Dec. 9

[timvp]

The San Antonio Spurs traveled to Dallas for a basketball game. Instead, a good ol’ wild west double overtime shootout took place. When the smoke cleared, the Spurs were the ones left standing with a 133-126 victory in hand.

The game-winning basket in the second overtime was authored by Bruce Bowen, who scored his only points of the game on a three-pointer to put the Spurs up by two points with under two minutes to go in the game. After Erick Dampier split a pair of free throws, Tim Duncan scored off of a Manu Ginobili assist to put the Spurs up by three points. Roger Mason, Jr. then rebounded a JJ Barea miss and hit two free throws to ice the game.

Although the Mavs lost, they put up an outstanding fight. With Josh Howard sidelined, their dynamic foursome of Dirk Nowitzki, Jason Kidd, Jason Terry and Barea was extremely difficult to contain. The Spurs could do little to slow down Nowitzki (as per usual), Kidd was dominant on and off the ball and Terry hit a number of big shots. Barea, a small guard out of Puerto Rico, continually shredded San Antonio’s defense while doing his best Steve Nash impersonation.

Overall, this was an impressive win for the Spurs. They went out on the road and got a victory against a team playing at a high level. That said, the Mavs once again proved that they match up extremely well against the Spurs. Dallas is exceptionally confident when playing against San Antonio and unless the Spurs find someone who can even halfway defend Nowitzki, a playoff series between these two teams in 2009 would most likely play out like the epic battle we saw in 2006.

Tim Duncan
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3173.jpg
50 minutes, 32 points, 14 rebounds, four assists, two steals
12-for-20 from the field, 8-for-9 at the line

Tim Duncan was a monster against the Mavs. Offensively, his moves were especially fluid and he was able to score from a variety of spots. When the Mavs sent help, Duncan repeatedly made the right pass. Despite all the attention he received on the offensive end, he played 50 minutes without turning the ball over. Defensively, Duncan made a number of very good rotations and rebounded the ball well. There’s not much negative to say about Duncan’s performance on Tuesday night. If anything, the Spurs didn’t give him the ball nearly enough with as well as he was rolling.
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Manu Ginobili
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3380.jpg
42 minutes, 18 points, eight assists, six rebounds
7-for-21 from the field, 2-for-9 on three-pointers

Although Manu Ginobili had some good moments and some bad moments, on the whole this game had to be considered a positive outing. His passing was exceptional and he did a very good job of not trying to force too many passes. Ginobili also played acceptable defense and showed quality hops when skying for rebounds. His overall movement was a bit stiffer than usual and his speed wasn’t quite up to his typical level. Thankfully it appears he made it through 42 minutes so hopefully this is another step in him working his way back into shape. Ginobili finished with a team low plus/minus of -11 but his problems can be narrowed down to his stints with George Hill. He was a -11 in four minutes with Hill at point guard and even par in his 38 minutes with Tony Parker at point guard.
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Tony Parker
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3527.jpg
48 minutes, 29 points, ten assists, three steals
12-for-25 from the field, 5-for-8 at the line

To start off the ballgame, Tony Parker missed seven of his first eight attempts from the field. Once he realized Devin Harris wasn’t in the building, his shots started to drop. Throughout the game he illustrated good shot selection and did a good job of tiptoeing the line between very aggressive and overly aggressive. After his woeful start, Parker helped carry the team offensively the rest of the way. On defense, Parker had a few good individual plays but he struggled mightily when trying to defend Barea. He obviously wasn’t aware of Barea’s strengths and weaknesses and allowed the miniature Mavs guard to torment the Spurs. Overall, it was an above average showing for Parker but he still has areas of his game he can clean up.
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Michael Finley
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3023.jpg
37 minutes, 13 points, five rebounds, three assists, three turnovers
5-for-15 from the field, 3-for-7 on three-pointers

Michael Finley had a few good stretches but I’m not exactly sure how he was able to earn 37 minutes of playing time. The Spurs had six turnovers as a team – and Finley had three of them. His 15 field goal attempts were too much for a player who is supposed to be the fifth option in the starting lineup. His defense, especially when he was assigned to guard Nowitzki, was nothing to write home to Chicago about. The good news is that he had hit only seven of his previous 31 field goal attempts when playing at Dallas, so comparatively he shot very well.
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Matt Bonner
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3748.jpg
30 minutes, 13 points, four rebounds
5-for-5 from the field, 3-for-3 on three-pointers

Whatever you do, do not wake up Matt Bonner. His 5-for-5 shooting display wasn’t overly surprisingly, especially considering that he’s now shooting 67.6% from the field in his last five games. On two-pointers alone, he’s shooting a blazing 78.9% over that time span. Against the Mavs, he once again shot with tons of confidence and didn’t even need an abundance of daylight to get his shot off. Defensively, while he was overmatched against Nowitzki, he played hard and made the German superstar work for his points. The only downside to Bonner’s night was his rebounding, although that can be somewhat written off due to the fact that he was out on the perimeter guarding Nowitzki for much of the night.
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Bruce Bowen
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3167.jpg
27 minutes, three points
1-for-2 from the field, 1-for-2 on three-pointers

If you just look at Bruce Bowen’s stats, you’d think he didn’t do much. But he was a beast defensively, in addition to hitting the biggest bucket of the game at the other end of the court. At different points in the game, Bowen was asked to guard Barea, Terry and Nowitzki – and did a very good job in each matchup. Specifically, his defense on Nowitzki down the stretch was simply vintage. Bowen led the team with a plus/minus of +21. To fully comprehend how dominant he was defensively, consider that the Spurs gave up 88.8 points per 48 minutes while Bowen was on the court and 117.7 points per 48 minutes when he was on the bench.
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Roger Mason, Jr.
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3628.jpg
27 minutes, 12 points, two rebounds
3-for-7 from the field, 1-for-4 on three-pointers, 5-for-5 at the line

Roger Mason, Jr. played decently well throughout. The highlight of his night came at the end when he grabbed the final two rebounds of the game and hit all four of his free throws to put the game away. Mason didn’t shoot the ball particularly well but he moved well without the ball to free himself up for opportunities. Defensively, it was overall a sub par night as he struggled defending against penetration, although he did better as the game progressed. Mason is still trying to figure out his sixth man role but he’s discovering ways to help out along the way.
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George Hill
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/4488.jpg
12 minutes, seven points, two assists
2-for-3 from the field, 3-for-3 at the line

In George Hill’s first stint, he didn’t do much of anything. Thankfully, Pop gave him another shot in the second half and he played much better. He still has the tendency to play too passively, especially when paired with Ginobili, but he’s doing a better job of recognizing that fact and upping his level of aggression. Against the Mavs, all seven of his points and both of his assists came in a two minutes span at the end of the third quarter. An amazing stat regarding Hill is how much better he plays at home than on the road. At home he averages 13 points per game on 47% shooting. On the road, his numbers drop to 6.6 points per game on 30.7% shooting. Even more dramatically, Hill has a team-best plus/minus at home for the season (+59) and a team-worst plus/minus on the road (-34).
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Fabricio Oberto
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3988.jpg
Eight minutes, six points, two rebounds
2-for-2 from the field, 2-for-2 at the line

Even though Fabricio Oberto only played eight minutes, he gave quality production. Offensively, Oberto had his second straight good showing. In his last 32 minutes, he has scored 18 points. In his previous 124 minutes, he had scored just 17 points. On Tuesday night, it was also good to see him pull down two defensive rebounds considering how much he’s struggled in that area this season.
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Kurt Thomas
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3012.jpg
Eight minutes, three rebounds, one steal, one block

Kurt Thomas had the impossible task of defending Nowitzki in the first half. I’m not sure if Thomas was mobile enough to guard him in 1998 but he certainly isn’t mobile enough to guard him in 2008. Outside of his inability to guard Nowitzki, Thomas actually gave very good defensive effort, rebounded the ball and even altered a few shots.
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Ime Udoka
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3501.jpg
One minute

Ime Udoka’s only minutes came when Pop got mad at Bowen for committing two consecutive fouls against Terry. In his one minute and 29 seconds on the floor, he was unable to dent the stat sheet.
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Gregg Popovich
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/topstory/sports/popovich_gregg030428.jpg

Even though the Spurs won, I wasn’t too thrilled with Pop’s coaching. Playing Finley 37 minutes is highly questionable, especially when he had Bonner and Mason available for more playing time. Putting Thomas on Nowitzki was just crazy. You could equip Thomas with a jet pack and he still wouldn’t be able to keep up. Playing Bowen just 27 minutes in a double overtime game with the way he was defending was also mysterious. I didn’t like the minutes the Big Three played but then again without those minutes the Spurs probably don’t win. Overall though, I thought that the players bailed Pop out after a number of iffy decisions.
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Offense

The offense was clicking rather well, especially after the first quarter. In the final 46 minutes of action, the Spurs scored 116 points. For the game, San Antonio shot 49% from the field, hit 10-of-25 three-pointers, got to the line 29 times and outscored the Mavs in fast break points 24-13. The Spurs also had 28 assists and, most impressively, only six turnovers in 58 minutes. The ball movement was stagnant to begin the game but became crisp as the game wore on.

Defense

The defense for the Spurs was sometimes decent but there were also large stretches of porous defense. Without Bowen’s defensive play off the bench, there’s no telling how many points the Mavs would have scored. On the night, the Mavs shot 51.6% from the floor and made 9-of-24 three-pointers. As has been the case more often than not over the last half decade, the Mavs outrebounded the Spurs 48-42. Thankfully San Antonio’s offense saved the day because the defense wasn’t getting it done on Tuesday night.

Drive to Five

Good win but now the Spurs face a difficult back-to-back game against the Atlanta Hawks. San Antonio’s role players are going to have to come ready to contribute a night after the Big Three combined to play 140 minutes. The Hawks are currently the fourth seed in the Eastern Conference and they have the athleticism to cause problems for a tired Spurs squad. Hopefully the Spurs can summon the needed energy and extend their current win streak to four games.

Believe.

[bigfan]

Another excellent recap TimVP. Im very interested in tonights game myself and believe it will tell alot about our team.

[MoSpur]

Bonner!!!!!!!!

[Kamnik]

great read

[Chris]

Interesting that Pop refused to play a center for the majority of the game. Bonner was playing lights out. Even with Bonner's production Pop doesn't trust him in the clutch. Prepare for more small ball in close games like these for the future.

I think Finley earned his minutes with a great defensive effort, but his shot selection is questionable. Finley is not a power forward and never will be.

[T Park]

Agreed on the assesment of pop. I don't understand his sudden reluctance to play Mason in those big minutes. I'm hoping he held Bowen back a tad due to wanting to save him for joe Johnson tonight

[T Park]

Interesting that Pop refused to play a center for the majority of the game. Bonner was playing lights out. Even with Bonner's production Pop doesn't trust him in the clutch. Prepare for more small ball in close games like these for the future.

I think Finley earned his minutes with a great defensive effort, but his shot selection is questionable. Finley is not a power forward and never will be.


Yeah while bonner didn't defend nowitzki the best at least give him a chance at figuring it out and at least staying in there to bust ass on boards and keep nailing daggers.

[usckk]

timvp,

Why do you think Pop is still benching Bowen? I just there's too much offense in the starting lineup, especially for Mike who needs more touches to be effective. Furthermore, as a defensive-specialist, Bowen just now as valuable coming off the bench. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Furthermore, I'm disappointed the Coach Pop has decided to start Manu. I wanted him to start Mason instead. Mason fit perfectly playing with Parker and Timmy, and also Manu is already used to coming off the bench.

I also,

[T Park]

Ginobili will be horrible tonight you can almost gaurantee it. I think you'll see slot of bonner mason hill and oberto tonight. If mahinmi wasn't such a GD china doll he could help tonight.

[T Park]

timvp,

Why do you think Pop is still benching Bowen? I just there's too much offense in the starting lineup, especially for Mike who needs more touches to be effective. Furthermore, as a defensive-specialist, Bowen just now as valuable coming off the bench. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Furthermore, I'm disappointed the Coach Pop has decided to start Manu. I wanted him to start Mason instead. Mason fit perfectly playing with Parker and Timmy, and also Manu is already used to coming off the bench.

I also,




agreed 1000% I thought Mason was perfect as a starter and could get into an early rythum. Ginobili and finley both need to come off the bench and I think eventually bonner as well

[Fabbs]

Michael Finley
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3023.jpg
37 minutes, 13 points, five rebounds, three assists, three turnovers
5-for-15 from the field, 3-for-7 on three-pointers

Michael Finley had a few good stretches but I’m not exactly sure how he was able to earn 37 minutes of playing time. The Spurs had six turnovers as a team – and Finley had three of them. His 15 field goal attempts were too much for a player who is supposed to be the fifth option in the starting lineup. His defense, especially when he was assigned to guard Nowitzki, was nothing to write home to Chicago about. The good news is that he had hit only seven of his previous 31 field goal attempts when playing at Dallas, so comparatively he shot very well.
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:married::married:
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Gregg Popovich
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/topstory/sports/popovich_gregg030428.jpg

Even though the Spurs won, I wasn’t too thrilled with Pop’s coaching. Playing Finley 37 minutes is highly questionable, especially when he had Bonner and Mason available for more playing time. Putting Thomas on Nowitzki was just crazy. You could equip Thomas with a jet pack and he still wouldn’t be able to keep up. Playing Bowen just 27 minutes in a double overtime game with the way he was defending was also mysterious. I didn’t like the minutes the Big Three played but then again without those minutes the Spurs probably don’t win. Overall though, I thought that the players bailed Pop out after a number of iffy decisions.-------------------------------

Thank you. The myth that "one has to play defense to earn minutes with Popped" is so old and tired (and debunked). timvp while i know this subject has been beaten to death, is there any stated real reason why Pop continues to play Finley/bench others (Mason, Bowen etc) in a situation as last night. I really believe Pop n Finley are dating.

[timvp]

Interesting that Pop refused to play a center for the majority of the game. Bonner was playing lights out. Even with Bonner's production Pop doesn't trust him in the clutch. Prepare for more small ball in close games like these for the future. Pop has actually given Bonner a fair amount of end of game minutes. When he's gone small to end games, he's usually at least had Udoka on the court. His small ball lineup to end the Mavs game was surprising. The return of Michael Finley the Power Forward wasn't something I wanted to see this season :depressed

[Findog]

Dallas is exceptionally confident when playing against San Antonio and unless the Spurs find someone who can even halfway defend Nowitzki, a playoff series between these two teams in 2009 would most likely play out like the epic battle we saw in 2006.

So you think Dallas won't be the 9th seed?

[timvp]

timvp,

Why do you think Pop is still benching Bowen? I just there's too much offense in the starting lineup, especially for Mike who needs more touches to be effective. Furthermore, as a defensive-specialist, Bowen just now as valuable coming off the bench. It just doesn't make sense to me.I don't really agree with it either but I think that Pop's rationale is:

1) Bowen eventually will have to become a bench player. At 37, perhaps it's time to make the transition now. It also allows him to play fewer minutes which can hopefully make him that much more lively in the playoffs.

2) The NBA landscape has changed and you need offense to win. Last season, the Spurs actually did a pretty good job against the Lakers defensively. It was their offense that let them down. So if by starting Finley and Bonner, I think Pop is hoping this team can average ~100 points per game. That type of fire power will be needed to beat teams like the Lakers and Celtics. The Lakers have too many weapons to solely rely on defense to win and the Celtics play such stifling defense that your offense better be good or else you can't compete.


Furthermore, I'm disappointed the Coach Pop has decided to start Manu. I wanted him to start Mason instead. Mason fit perfectly playing with Parker and Timmy, and also Manu is already used to coming off the bench. Agreed. I guess theoretically if Mason can become that sixth man spark plug, it'd make the team even deeper. But we'll see how it works out. Keeping Mason in the starting lineup made a lot of sense to me because he plays well off of TP and Duncan ... while Manu doesn't usually need help to be successful.

[timvp]

Thank you. The myth that "one has to play defense to earn minutes with Popped" is so old and tired (and debunked). timvp while i know this subject has been beaten to death, is there any stated real reason why Pop continues to play Finley/bench others (Mason, Bowen etc) in a situation as last night. I really believe Pop n Finley are dating.You jest but Pop loves Finley. I'm not sure exactly why but I'm guessing because Finley has now turned into the ultimate pro who works harder than anybody, cares on a daily basis as much as anybody and does whatever Pop tells him to do without ever complaining. For those reasons, Pop gives Finley as much rope as anyone he's ever coached.

[MarHill]

Overall, this was an impressive win for the Spurs. They went out on the road and got a victory against a team playing at a high level. That said, the Mavs once again proved that they match up extremely well against the Spurs. Dallas is exceptionally confident when playing against San Antonio and unless the Spurs find someone who can even halfway defend Nowitzki, a playoff series between these two teams in 2009 would most likely play out like the epic battle we saw in 2006.


Timvp,

You wrote a great overview about last night's game.

However, I disagree with your analysis in the above paragraph. I believe last night's game was one of the those games in a 82 game season where both teams played excellent offense and they are rivals and want to beat each other every time they get a chance.

I believe Spurs would beat the Mavs in at least 5 or 6 games in a playoff series (even in early December). So while the Mavs do play the Spurs well...but in a series you can make adjustments and that's one of Pop's strengths.

But in early December....where is he tinkering with the roster, and adjust to new players (Mason & Hill), and deciding how to play defense I believe making an assumption like you did in the paragraph is a little premature.

Also, the Mavs have no match for Duncan. Not Dampier or Diop (the alleged Duncan stopper..LOL!!!) Likewise the Spurs have no match for Dirk...but they can make getting his shots much more difficult in a playoff series with Bruce, Ime, and other defenders. Yes, he will gets his points and he's a tough cover.

Plus, the Mavs have a new system with a new coach and the Spurs have only seen it twice...so I believe two next games they play the Spurs will make adjustments to it.

Moreover, you saw the championship-level competitiveness of the Spurs last night. And that's a huge difference..that the Mavs don't have.

I believe the Spurs had a little revenge on their minds from the first game in November and were determined to win last night's game.

So while the Mavs do play the Spurs well....there is still a distinct difference between the two teams.

[dougp]

Just wanna point out that 2 of RR's rebounds were offensive - when the Spurs were down by under four each time. One of them resulted in Finley scoring, and the play by play doesn't show if there was a turn over the second time - either way, he was doing his best to keep us in the game.

Also, I think we should bring Hill off the bench first and let him play SG until we sub Mason for Parker - see if we can get Hill going, and then let him run point. Mostly to see if he can pick up his shot on the road.

[smeagol]

Thanks timvp.

Finally I was able to watch a game from start to finish, and even though it finished after 2AM Buenos Aires time, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

[ploto]

This game simply showed that Dallas and San Antonio are again pretty equal teams- unfortunately for both that is not the best news this season.

[ploto]

Plus, the Mavs have a new system with a new coach and the Spurs have only seen it twice...so I believe two next games they play the Spurs will make adjustments to it.
Would not this mean that Dallas is still getting used to a new system and coach and they will be better themselves as the season goes on?

[duncan228]

Thanks as always timvp. Your thoughts give me the depth I usually don't get until I re-watch a game. Appreciate the time and effort you put into these for us, and I especially love the humor. It's always a great read.

[xtremesteven33]

Pop is a God in the NBA. Whatever he does in the starting lineup for now i agree with.

i just see the playoffs starting off with:

Parker
Ginobili
Bowen
Duncan
Oberto

[dougp]

Would not this mean that Dallas is still getting used to a new system and coach and they will be better themselves as the season goes on?

Not necessarily, because you could say the same thing about the Rockets with Adelmann. What it comes to is they have everyday to work with each other, whereas we play them 4 times a year - you can watch tapes, but there's not many on what Carlisle is going to be doing with his team, particularly against the Spurs.

Oh, and I just want to note: Oberto was pissing Dampier & Dirk off, depending who he was guarding ... he'd get them wrapped up, and they'd start whining to the refs. :lol

[timvp]

Also, the Mavs have no match for Duncan. Not Dampier or Diop (the alleged Duncan stopper..LOL!!!) Likewise the Spurs have no match for Dirk...but they can make getting his shots much more difficult in a playoff series with Bruce, Ime, and other defenders. Yes, he will gets his points and he's a tough cover.I think the fundamental problem with the Mavs matchup remains -- the Mavs have better options to put on Duncan than the Spurs have to put on Dirk. Dampier and Diop are probably two of the top 25 players as far as guarding Duncan. The Spurs don't have anyone in the top 100 when it comes to guarding Dirk.

Bowen is the closest thing the Spurs have to a Dirk stopper but he's far from perfect because Bowen on Dirk opens up offensive rebounds galore for the Mavs. It was somewhat apparent this game but the player who usually crashes the boards when Bowen is on Dirk is Josh Howard. Howard usually is guarded by someone like Finley or Ginobili and he can attack the offensive glass at will.

Overall I still don't like the matchup against the Mavs. The Spurs could beat them in the playoffs but it'd be another war. Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.

[sonic21]

thanks as always, timvp

[z0sa]

Overall I still don't like the matchup against the Mavs. The Spurs could beat them in the playoffs but it'd be another war. Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.

If Bonner fronted Dirk more, he'd be one of the most solid dirkstoppers we've had in ages. I love Bonner's Don Dirk, but he's got to do more ball denial. Dirk always catching it in his sweet spots and no one can stop him there.

[dougp]

I think the fundamental problem with the Mavs matchup remains -- the Mavs have better options to put on Duncan than the Spurs have to put on Dirk. Dampier and Diop are probably two of the top 25 players as far as guarding Duncan. The Spurs don't have anyone in the top 100 when it comes to guarding Dirk.

Bowen is the closest thing the Spurs have to a Dirk stopper but he's far from perfect because Bowen on Dirk opens up offensive rebounds galore for the Mavs. It was somewhat apparent this game but the player who usually crashes the boards when Bowen is on Dirk is Josh Howard. Howard usually is guarded by someone like Finley or Ginobili and he can attack the offensive glass at will.

Overall I still don't like the matchup against the Mavs. The Spurs could beat them in the playoffs but it'd be another war. Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.

I love watching Parker & Hill guard him - mostly because they frustrate the crap out of him. Granted he has a head difference on them, but he still has to be careful putting the ball down. Unfortunately this leaves Barea or Kidd open.

[MarHill]

I think the fundamental problem with the Mavs matchup remains -- the Mavs have better options to put on Duncan than the Spurs have to put on Dirk. Dampier and Diop are probably two of the top 25 players as far as guarding Duncan. The Spurs don't have anyone in the top 100 when it comes to guarding Dirk.

Bowen is the closest thing the Spurs have to a Dirk stopper but he's far from perfect because Bowen on Dirk opens up offensive rebounds galore for the Mavs. It was somewhat apparent this game but the player who usually crashes the boards when Bowen is on Dirk is Josh Howard. Howard usually is guarded by someone like Finley or Ginobili and he can attack the offensive glass at will.

Overall I still don't like the matchup against the Mavs. The Spurs could beat them in the playoffs but it'd be another war. Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.

Again, Timvp....I have to disagree with you.

Duncan has abused the Mavs over the years...Dampier is no match Duncan and Diop is decent as the best. You can go back to the 2006 WC Semi Finals....Duncan dominated their frontline even though the Spurs lost the series in 7 games.

Look at last night..Dampier was in foul trouble and Diop didn't do much at all. Also, I agree that Dirk is a tough cover. He is one of the top 10 offensive players in the league. But in a 7 game series..you can make where he gets his shots from difficult and pressure him.

I will grant you that the Mavs do play the Spurs well....probably more than any other team in the last 5 years except the Pistons.

But you are forgetting the championship-level competitiveness and intangibles that the Spurs have. This is such an underrated part of their success. Last night showed a glimpse of it.....the Spurs were determined to win that game. Just like they did against Houston and Minnesota (and Denver last week) earlier in the season. Just like they did with the Hornets last year in Game 7 on the road...when many experts though they were going to lose.

They have that "it" quality that most championship squads have and the Mavs don't.

I look at the Spurs/Mavs rivary like the Bulls/Knicks and Bulls/Pacers of the 90's. While, the Knicks and Pacers could matchup with the Bulls and played them very well....they didn't have the "it" factor (Yes....MJ had a lot to do with that) and couldn't beat the Bulls in a playoff series.

I feel the same way about the Spurs and Mavs. And that's where the distinct difference between the two teams!!

A good debate!! :flag:

[timvp]

But you are forgetting the championship-level competitiveness and intangibles that the Spurs have. This is such an underrated part of their success. Last night showed a glimpse of it.....the Spurs were determined to win that game. Just like they did against Houston and Minnesota (and Denver last week) earlier in the season. Just like they did with the Hornets last year in Game 7 on the road...when many experts though they were going to lose.

They have that "it" quality that most championship squads have and the Mavs don't.In 2006, do you think the Spurs lacked it?

[td4mvp21]

Duncan may abuse Dampier and Diop but it's not like they are pushovers. They make him work and Duncan just scores anyway.

All I know is that Finley on Dirk isn't an option but of course Pop would come to that conclusion after he decided Finley is a powerforward.

[T Park]

I think Ginobili lacked brains in 2006.

[MarHill]

In 2006, do you think the Spurs lacked it?

No...but you are going to lose some playoff series and win some.

The Lakers lost to the Spurs in 2003.

It happens!!

[ManuTastic]

I don't really agree with it either but I think that Pop's rationale is:
...
I guess theoretically if Mason can become that sixth man spark plug, it'd make the team even deeper. But we'll see how it works out. Keeping Mason in the starting lineup made a lot of sense to me because he plays well off of TP and Duncan ... while Manu doesn't usually need help to be successful.

Amen. I too would switch Mason into the starting lineup; if not, then start Bowen and bring Finley off the bench. When you start the Big 3, why do you need an extra SG who a) is not a forward, b) is not a great defender, and c) needs lots of shots to be effective? :huh

[dougp]

Duncan may abuse Dampier and Diop but it's not like they are pushovers. They make him work and Duncan just scores anyway.

All I know is that Finley on Dirk isn't an option but of course Pop would come to that conclusion after he decided Finley is a powerforward.

Mostly because Dirk is going to hit his shot, one way or another. The objective is to frustrate him when he puts the ball down to drive, or coming off setting a screen - but Finley isn't fast enough in the hand department for that. Big reason why Parker is on Dirk coming off a screen ... Either force the pass or to pull up before the big rolls back over. It's effective, and can put him in quite a slump.

[MarHill]

Duncan may abuse Dampier and Diop but it's not like they are pushovers. They make him work and Duncan just scores anyway.

All I know is that Finley on Dirk isn't an option but of course Pop would come to that conclusion after he decided Finley is a powerforward.

There are a lot of players that can make Duncan work for his points.

But they can't stop him..period! And that's the big disadvantage the Mavs have against the Spurs.

Plus Manu & Tony..as well!!

[MarHill]

I think Ginobili lacked brains in 2006.

:lol

That's funny!!!

[honestfool84]

[Tim Duncan] he played 50 minutes without turning the ball over.

:downspin:


impressive.
well, more like awesome.

[xtremesteven33]

In 2006, do you think the Spurs lacked it?



Manu did "it"

[urunobili]

thanks timvp was really looking forward to reading this :tu

[timvp]

So you think Dallas won't be the 9th seed?I think the Mavs make the playoffs. Too much talent not to.

I'm just hoping it's not Spurs vs. Mavs in the first round.

[MarHill]

Manu did "it"


:lmao :lmao

Yes he was a big reason...unfortunately in Game 7. I'm a huge Manu fan..though.

It happens...you win some and you lose some.

[Baseline]

Bowen is a better clutch three-point shooter than Finley. Period.

Yes, Finley has hit a couple of big shots for us, but that's because he takes a ton of them. He takes far too many of them for a guy who is the 4th option. Now he should be the fifth option behind Mason, or perhaps even behind Bonner.

So I see no reason that Finley should play crunch time minutes against Dallas, especially since 1) Bowen can guard Nowitzki much better than Finley, 2) Bowen is a better clutch three-point shooter, and 3) Bowen doesn't turn the ball over as much as Finley.

Finley is a guy we should roll out there for a stretch or two during the first three quarters to see if he has it or not. If he does, give him minutes. If he's not hitting his shots, we all know he's worthless on the court.

[SpursFanFirst]

Good win but now the Spurs face a difficult back-to-back game against the Atlanta Hawks.

At least the Hawks are playing the 2nd of a b-2-b (against the Rockets) as well. Perhaps that will put this game on a more even playing field.

[Bruno]

I don't care if Spurs lose the game against Hawks. A win would be great, a lose would be quite logical.

And as long as Dirk plays great, Dallas will be a bad matchup for this current Spurs team. Even if Oberto or Bonner defends him a s hard as they can, they are just to slow against him. Mahinmi and Tolliver are both quite fast players and I hope one will emerge as a decent Dirk defender. If not, this lack of players to stick on quick bigs could really hurt Spurs.

And yes, I'm saying the same thing for the 68357th time...

[Spurs Brazil]

Great read timvp

I slept only 3 hours last night but it was worthy. It was a fantastic game

Bruce is playing great. I'd like to see him back in the starting unit

[timvp]

And as long as Dirk plays great, Dallas will be a bad matchup for this current Spurs team. Even if Oberto or Bonner defends him a s hard as they can, they are just to slow against him. Mahinmi and Tolliver are both quite fast players and I hope one will emerge as a decent Dirk defender. If not, this lack of players to stick on quick bigs could really hurt Spurs.

And yes, I'm saying the same thing for the 68357th time...Exactly. Tolliver is an interesting option. The Toros playing him out on the perimeter defensively could help down the line if they have to put him on players like Dirk, West and Odom.

The good thing about Tolliver is that not only is he slightly quicker than Oberto and Bonner, he has longer arms and could actually contest a Dirk jumper. I don't think the Spurs have contested a Dirk jumper since they traded away Rose in 2005.

But yeah, it's amazing that even after the Mavs loss in 2006 and Don Nelson teaching the world how to guard Dirk in 2007 that the Spurs have never made a move to fix that glaring weakness on their roster.

Mind boggling.

[wildbill2u]

I think the fundamental problem with the Mavs matchup remains -- the Mavs have better options to put on Duncan than the Spurs have to put on Dirk. Dampier and Diop are probably two of the top 25 players as far as guarding Duncan. The Spurs don't have anyone in the top 100 when it comes to guarding Dirk.

Bowen is the closest thing the Spurs have to a Dirk stopper but he's far from perfect because Bowen on Dirk opens up offensive rebounds galore for the Mavs. It was somewhat apparent this game but the player who usually crashes the boards when Bowen is on Dirk is Josh Howard. Howard usually is guarded by someone like Finley or Ginobili and he can attack the offensive glass at will.

Overall I still don't like the matchup against the Mavs. The Spurs could beat them in the playoffs but it'd be another war. Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.

Good points. I don't see the Spurs matching up well with the Mavs, but they CAN beat them. Dirk is a problem for any team that doesn't have a long mobile SF with some heft who can both muscle and play the perimeter. And not many teams have that player.

Unfortunately, the Mavs have a better team this year. Barrea is proving to be a great addition as a role player for a rookie, averaging about 20 points over the past few games.

[Findog]

:lmao :lmao

Yes he was a big reason...unfortunately in Game 7. I'm a huge Manu fan..though.

It happens...you win some and you lose some.

If you want to play the "If" game....


If JET weren't so gay for Finley's junk, that series ends in 6.

[Findog]

Good points. I don't see the Spurs matching up well with the Mavs, but they CAN beat them. Dirk is a problem for any team that doesn't have a long mobile SF with some heft who can both muscle and play the perimeter. And not many teams have that player.

Unfortunately, the Mavs have a better team this year. Barrea is proving to be a great addition as a role player for a rookie, averaging about 20 points over the past few games.

minor nitpick: Barea isn't a rookie.

[td4mvp21]

Manu's foul was stupid but no one seems to remember the Spurs going down 3-1 and having to fight back the entire series.

[SenorSpur]

I guess theoretically if Mason can become that sixth man spark plug, it'd make the team even deeper. But we'll see how it works out. Keeping Mason in the starting lineup made a lot of sense to me because he plays well off of TP and Duncan ... while Manu doesn't usually need help to be successful.

Also agree. I've said it from the jump that Pop is making a mistake inserting Manu back into the starting lineup. I'd really like to know exactly what his rationale is. It's so obvious that Mason was very comfortable and far more effective as a starter than he's been coming off the bench. While Manu's impact is immediate whether he's a starter or 6th man.

In the meantime, Pop's man-crush with Finley remains the unjustified mystery of Pop's coaching tactics. Finley's terrible passing and questionable decision-making are only exemplified the more minutes he plays. However, it doesn't appear that Pop sees this as diminishing returns.

I was also a bit surprised that Pop didn't try to counter the Mavs 3-guard lineup with one that featured Hill, TP and Manu.

Great review, Timvp.

[SenorSpur]

Exactly. Tolliver is an interesting option. The Toros playing him out on the perimeter defensively could help down the line if they have to put him on players like Dirk, West and Odom.

The good thing about Tolliver is that not only is he slightly quicker than Oberto and Bonner, he has longer arms and could actually contest a Dirk jumper. I don't think the Spurs have contested a Dirk jumper since they traded away Rose in 2005.

But yeah, it's amazing that even after the Mavs loss in 2006 and Don Nelson teaching the world how to guard Dirk in 2007 that the Spurs have never made a move to fix that glaring weakness on their roster.

Mind boggling.

Personally I've longed for the Spurs to identify a long defender that could matchup with Dirk. I was hoping elson would've been the answer, but not to be. I'm hoping to see Tolliver or Ian on Dirk at some point this season.

[DarrinS]

Bruce needs more minutes. That is my only game thought.

[Baseline]

We all know that we don't match up well with Dirk, unfortunately. But we also don't match up well with Terry - he has always torched us. And for that matter, we don't match up that well with Howard either. At least they traded away Harris so we don't have to wrry about that matchup headache.

I'll never understand why the Mavs shoot lights out against us every single time we play. It's unreal.

For example, has Jason Kidd ever shot 10-15 in his life? Even on a Nerf hoop at point blank range?

[T Park]

Pop will never put Tolliver on Dirk.

Wayyy too outside the box thinking.

[Solid D]

timvp, that is some excellent stat-work to augment your very fine game report. Top shelf, LJ.

[Mark in Austin]

But yeah, it's amazing that even after the Mavs loss in 2006 and Don Nelson teaching the world how to guard Dirk in 2007 that the Spurs have never made a move to fix that glaring weakness on their roster.

Mind boggling.

Maybe RC could call Presti for advice?

WWPD?

[Mark in Austin]

Perhaps Tolliver or Mahinmi can become decent options on Dirk but I'm not holding my breath.


Good lord, at this point if all Mahinmi does in his NBA career is do an above average job defending Dirk then he will be a sucessful 1st round draft pick in my book.

[Fingaroll44]

There are a lot of players that can make Duncan work for his points.

But they can't stop him..period! And that's the big disadvantage the Mavs have against the Spurs.

Plus Manu & Tony..as well!!

exactly. the spurs r just better in my eyes

[Fingaroll44]

In 2006, do you think the Spurs lacked it?

No.

[homer]

Duncan may abuse Dampier and Diop but it's not like they are pushovers. They make him work and Duncan just scores anyway.

All I know is that Finley on Dirk isn't an option but of course Pop would come to that conclusion after he decided Finley is a powerforward.

Finley is a PF when he's got JJ Barea guarding him.:wow :hat

[homer]

I think the Mavs make the playoffs. Too much talent not to.

I'm just hoping it's not Spurs vs. Mavs in the first round.

mavs vs lakers in 1st round :hat

[Fingaroll44]

We all know that we don't match up well with Dirk, unfortunately. But we also don't match up well with Terry - he has always torched us. And for that matter, we don't match up that well with Howard either. At least they traded away Harris so we don't have to wrry about that matchup headache.

I'll never understand why the Mavs shoot lights out against us every single time we play. It's unreal.

For example, has Jason Kidd ever shot 10-15 in his life? Even on a Nerf hoop at point blank range?

its because they play harder against us than they do against other teams. most teams do that against us because theyre jealous of the success and hate the spurs organization. just like texas tech played harder against the longhorns than they did anybody else. texas is better but lost. emotions play a big part

[Fingaroll44]

Dirk is a great player but he doesnt scare me. Why? Because he's a jump shooter. Avery had him being a real man, going to the bucket and getting to the line. Now he's reverted back to his ol' soft outside shooting self. I would rather face an opponent that shoots from the outside rather than one doing damage in the paint, anyday of the week

[Southwest Texas Fan]

Manu's foul was stupid but no one seems to remember the Spurs going down 3-1 and having to fight back the entire series.

And that Manu was the main reason the Spurs cut into the lead and tied the game after being down 20.

[T Park]

Maybe RC could call Presti for advice?

WWPD?

Seeing as Presti is proving himself to not be exactly a genius himself, then I doubt it.

[polandprzem]

You can say want you want but that game was absolutely awesome.

Amazing how in December games could look like a playoffs games esp. in the intesity area.

It was fantastic to watch that game even though I was looking it at work in the middle of the night (2:30 - 5:something am).
Yet again I was not sleeping 25 hours before hitting the bed, more important was that I was happy to see spurs in action and them hit some great shots.

You can talk about this game for hours, about the forncourt about the backcourt about starters, reserves and minutes played. That is meaningles as far as a fighting aspect comes.
Spurs are looking realy motivated and hungry this season as a whole.
And not to make season comments I just want to add that it's great to see them progress in a right direction.

At the begining I was like damn Parker could not hit a jack Manu could not hit a jack and Timmay was off. Shit more then that Terry and his company were shooting great and [now] I was like they gonna kick our butts !!!

Fricking damn. They are too relaxed after that win against the Worriors and The Mavs are the real deal.

More then that, we had only Tim on the froncourt. Bonner doing what he can but he is not a post guy [he is playing great recently hopefully he can stay that for 90 or so more games]. I said ti myslef once again - now carlisle will go big at us, and Pop have no choice but keep Tim on the floor.
There were ups and downs.

But what was impressive?
Bowen's D was. He made a team defense way much better when being on the court. Sometimes I was WTF Pop bring Bowen in! Good to have him in spurs uniform.
Tim - I was mad at him through moments when he was unable to hit open J's from the long mid-range. But his D and esp. his rebounding which was phenomenal, made his show.
TP- guy played great and if he could hit that jumper and erase that 5 mnutes from players legs he would be a hero.


Gino i lacking his explosiveness, but that is good. He still got way to go.
I like him off the bench better as many in here. We will see if Pop will decide to move him back there. But I have not much prblem with that.

Hill - the rookie was lost when he entered game for the first time, and Pop pointed to the bench, saying take a seat. Hill did just taht as he is well behaved young man.
And I was hoping that pop will bring him in the 2nd half.
He did. And George answered with agressiveness and helped Tony with catching hi breath.

I like that old fashioned new element in spurs playbook - Mason and GHill looking for a clen spot on the floor creating some havoc.
All spurs need is to catch a balance between playing inside and outside ball. They still do not have enough slashers, but you play with what you have, all in all spurs do not have a rebounding monster and a guy that can do some harm inside ofensivly and defensivly.

Wow that was a show.
Now if anyone ever tells me that '90 was more exciting I will show him this emote :jack


I may sound excited and stuff but I know spurs got a long way to go. Esp. Pop and him choosing the main rotation.


btw. wtf Finley did not hit a 10footer jumper on a clean look?
we had those Mavs and we let them catch us :cuss:


I wanted to bring more basketball to my post but blahh I don't care. It's all for fun !

[ManuRLZ]

Hi guys, sorry for the offtopic, but i want to know if there's a chance of getting the yesterdays win vid, can someone help me? Thanks in advance

PD: Great OT win though, go manu !

[lurker23]

Even though the Spurs won, I wasn’t too thrilled with Pop’s coaching. Playing Finley 37 minutes is highly questionable, especially when he had Bonner and Mason available for more playing time. Putting Thomas on Nowitzki was just crazy. You could equip Thomas with a jet pack and he still wouldn’t be able to keep up. Playing Bowen just 27 minutes in a double overtime game with the way he was defending was also mysterious. I didn’t like the minutes the Big Three played but then again without those minutes the Spurs probably don’t win. Overall though, I thought that the players bailed Pop out after a number of iffy decisions.


timvp, while I certainly agree that I'd like to see more playing time for Mason and Bonner in the long run (as well as fewer minutes for Finley), do you think perhaps Pop was just using this early season game to be in "mad scientist mode"? While giving other players minutes over Bowen or putting Thomas on Dirk may seem slightly insane on the surface, maybe he was just trying to throw 10 crazy things at the wall and seeing if just one of them sticks. For example, looking at the pure surface of the equation, who would have ever guessed that Malik Rose would have been one of our best defenders against Shaq around the turn of the century?

[Capt Bringdown]

I find Manu's play worrisome. He seems to be trying to overcompensate for his injuries and attempting too many "home run" plays. Similar to last year's Laker series...

[Mark in Austin]

Seeing as Presti is proving himself to not be exactly a genius himself, then I doubt it.


so because he had to fire a coach he never wanted in the first place he's lost the lustre he had in SA?

[polandprzem]

Ginobili will be horrible tonight you can almost gaurantee it. I think you'll see slot of bonner mason hill and oberto tonight. If mahinmi wasn't such a GD china doll he could help tonight.

:lmao

[peskypesky]

Dirk is a great player but he doesnt scare me. Why? Because he's a jump shooter. Avery had him being a real man, going to the bucket and getting to the line. Now he's reverted back to his ol' soft outside shooting self. I would rather face an opponent that shoots from the outside rather than one doing damage in the paint, anyday of the week

:toast

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

[raspsa]

I guess the question then is what to do about the Dirks of the world. And the Odoms, Artests other mobile bigs that the Spurs will face. Tolliver and Mahinmi bring youth and athleticism and not much else. Should the FO make a serious effort to trade for a possible stopper or just accept the current situation and address it with team defense?

[timvp]

Ginobili will be horrible tonight you can almost gaurantee it.For future reference, Ginobili is money in back-to-back games. Over the last three years, he scores more points in back-to-back games than any other situation. He's actually least effective when he has multiple days to rest.

It's somewhat surprising considering the fatigue factor but Manu is such a rhythm player that he's best with as little a break as possible.

[024]

yeah the spurs need an athletic center. ideally, it would be someone who defenders have to respect and can't just leave him alone to double duncan or switch rotations (oberto). the offense completely goes into disarray when duncan is on the bench because there is no interior presence. defensively it will help as well. i think popovich recognizes the problem because last year he made the trade for kurt thomas in response to gasol and shaq trades. however good kurt thomas may become in the playoffs, i think the spurs are still one good center away from being a contender. kurt thomas and bonner aren't really centers and oberto seems to have created a new position in the NBA as a passer forward. this team cannot turn into a jump shooting team whenever duncan is struggling.

[Ginobilirules]

hey i understand your points, and some are good, but i have to disagree with your analysis, that it would still be epic, especially because a fair portion of our spurs mainstays, with some great firepower in youngblood added this yr to the spurs, plus the way we took the hornets, 4=3 in a great battle of closely leveled teams, except the spurs proved to be 1 notch better than NO, and the that the hornets beat the mavs 4=1, the spurs, no doubt when the stakes are high in the playoffs," the spurs always take their level of toughness , to the highest level therefore, there's no doubt, in my mind if this had been in a best of seven the Spurs will beat the Mavs more like 4-1 much the way the hornets did. you have to remember the mo"" for the spurs is, they don't peak until the playoffs begin and climb from there, they do this every yr too"". the mavs give each team that's huge a good match especially at home, they're similiar to hous, Mil, who do the same thing to great teams, they play up, or down to their competitions strength. the spurs will dominate the mavs in series, make no mistake about it"' 4-1 we beat the hornets in 7 who beat the mavs in 5, do the math"" and it would most definitely work like too"" the spurs have also, beaten the mavs now in 4 of 6 of the last meetings. think of how the spurs would dominate, and destroy the mavs, in series. i know the mavs would be competitive no doubt, they just wouldn't be enough defense, smarts, coaching, or firepower to stay with the spurs in a best of seven to make it more than a 5 game series loss to the spurs. they have zero answers for Manu, timmy, or tony, and we have 3 lockdown guys who make dirk struggle on clutch, shots, and give dirk fits"" in mason, bowen, and udoka, even duncan at times will switch to bother dirk with great results, as witnessed in duncan forcing dirk into a 28 foot airball in the second overtime.

[Dex]

hey i understand your points, and some are good, but i have to disagree with your analysis, that it would still be epic, especially because a fair portion of our spurs mainstays, with some great firepower in youngblood added this yr to the spurs, plus the way we took the hornets, 4=3 in a great battle of closely leveled teams, except the spurs proved to be 1 notch better than NO, and the that the hornets beat the mavs 4=1, the spurs, no doubt when the stakes are high in the playoffs," the spurs always take their level of toughness , to the highest level therefore, there's no doubt, in my mind if this had been in a best of seven the Spurs will beat the Mavs more like 4-1 much the way the hornets did. you have to remember the mo"" for the spurs is, they don't peak until the playoffs begin and climb from there, they do this every yr too"". the mavs give each team that's huge a good match especially at home, they're similiar to hous, Mil, who do the same thing to great teams, they play up, or down to their competitions strength. the spurs will dominate the mavs in series, make no mistake about it"' 4-1 we beat the hornets in 7 who beat the mavs in 5, do the math"" and it would most definitely work like too"" the spurs have also, beaten the mavs now in 4 of 6 of the last meetings. think of how the spurs would dominate, and destroy the mavs, in series. i know the mavs would be competitive no doubt, they just wouldn't be enough defense, smarts, coaching, or firepower to stay with the spurs in a best of seven to make it more than a 5 game series loss to the spurs. they have zero answers for Manu, timmy, or tony, and we have 3 lockdown guys who make dirk struggle on clutch, shots, and give dirk fits"" in mason, bowen, and udoka, even duncan at times will switch to bother dirk with great results, as witnessed in duncan forcing dirk into a 28 foot airball in the second overtime.

Spacing, capitalization, and punctuation are you friends.

[Ginobilirules]

This isn't English class, this is a sports post remember that also, you didn't pay attention to the facts i posted. don't get distracted by small things, i know how to use my english writing so many of you so-called spurs fans are so very ignorant to true facts, not just opinions here. how pathetic'".

[dougp]

This isn't English class, this is a sports post remember that also, you didn't pay attention to the facts i posted. don't get distracted by small things, i know how to use my english writing so many of you so-called spurs fans are so very ignorant to true facts, not just opinions here. how pathetic'".

Hard to pay attention to something that makes your eyes bleed. :wakeup

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

This isn't English class, this is a sports post remember that also, you didn't pay attention to the facts i posted. don't get distracted by small things, i know how to use my english writing so many of you so-called spurs fans are so very ignorant to true facts, not just opinions here. how pathetic'".


Hard to pay attention to something that makes your eyes bleed. :wakeup

What he said.

[dougp]

What he said.

Fixed, Mr.Applebottom

[Darkwaters]

Seeing as Presti is proving himself to not be exactly a genius himself, then I doubt it.

Maybe the trick is to combine the two, Presti and Buford, in the old vulcan mind-meld. Perhaps that where the Ginobili and Parker picks came from.

My guess is that the Marcus Williams pick was a result of mistaken identity when Buford accidently mind-melded with Beno.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Fixed, Mr.Applebottom

:lol Whoops, my fault.

[Dex]

This isn't English class, this is a sports post remember that also, you didn't pay attention to the facts i posted. don't get distracted by small things, i know how to use my english writing so many of you so-called spurs fans are so very ignorant to true facts, not just opinions here. how pathetic'".

I didn't even get to the facts you posted because I got one line in and realized you couldn't tell where one sentence starts and the next sentence stops. It's like trying to read one big run-on sentence.

So I, on the other handed, decided to post a random quip and be along my merry way. Thus is the internet.

I'm not here to grade your homework or anything, but you'll be amazed by the better responses you'll get when people can stand to get through your post. The shift key is right there.

[The Truth #6]

I think the only way for Tolliver to play in the playoffs against the Mavs if he's on our roster for several months before that point so Pop can do his mad science experiments with lineup changes to prove what is usually obvious to everyone but him, or maybe he's just bored, who knows.

That said, I'm still not sure Tolliver is good enough to see quality playoff minutes. At this point I'd still rather go with Bonner until Tolliver can prove himself on our roster. I suppose it doesn't matter if Pop is going to go with Finley no matter what.

One possible rationale for starting Manu might be that he doesn't have to be the focus of the offense and penetrate as much with Tony dominating the ball. In that sense, Manu isn't sacrificing his body as much and can play on the outside more. Just a thought.

[Manufan909]

Hard to pay attention to something that makes your eyes bleed. :wakeup

Raped.

[roycrikside]

For future reference, Ginobili is money in back-to-back games. Over the last three years, he scores more points in back-to-back games than any other situation. He's actually least effective when he has multiple days to rest.

It's somewhat surprising considering the fatigue factor but Manu is such a rhythm player that he's best with as little a break as possible.

I've pointed out the same thing to Ducks before, LJ. They don't listen. We have two regular posters on this board who never, ever bother to look up any facts before talking out of their ass, especially in regards to Manu...

TPark is so ignorant of new school basketball analysis that he'll see a game where Kobe gets 30 points on something like 11/29 shooting and he'll think, "Man Kobe had a great night, 30 points."

[T Park]

I've pointed out the same thing to Ducks before, LJ. They don't listen. We have two regular posters on this board who never, ever bother to look up any facts before talking out of their ass, especially in regards to Manu...

TPark is so ignorant of new school basketball analysis that he'll see a game where Kobe gets 30 points on something like 11/29 shooting and he'll think, "Man Kobe had a great night, 30 points."

:lol

Way to talk out of your ass jackass.

I'm an old school Bruce Bowen homer who constantly points at the shots and points being equal as a showing that said player did a great job defensively on that player.


Fail as always.

[roycrikside]

:lol

Way to talk out of your ass jackass.

I'm an old school Bruce Bowen homer who constantly points at the shots and points being equal as a showing that said player did a great job defensively on that player.


Fail as always.

Oh please. I don't know how many games I've seen you drool about Tony when he's got his customary 22 points on like 10/19 from the field and 2-4 from the line. Meanwhile Manu will have like 18 on 6/13 and 5-5 from the stripe and we'll be seeing the usual "but he was crap until the 4th quarter" posts.

Manu had 27 pts on 12 shots and you said he was as crappy as Tony for most of the game.

The only defense you'll notice is from Bruce because he literally has no other purpose.

[mystargtr34]

I agree with timvp here. The Mavs, especially with Josh Howard, remain the worst matchup in the league for the Spurs, probably outside of LA.

Dirk turns into Michael Jordan against the Spurs, and Josh Howard into Scottie Pippen and Terry looks like an All-Star. Then against every other team in the league they choke like "amatuer porn stars on a 12-inch cock".

I would rather avoid the Mavs in the playoffs, i think we would win that series more times than not, but id say it would go to 7 - the teams are just so evenly matched when they play each other.