Demarcus Ware - MVP?

[dickface]

A defensive player hasn't won NFL MVP since Lawrence Taylor. And this year, no offensive player has really done anything to be a clear cut MVP candidate.

Should D-Ware start getting some serious consideration? He's 4 sacks away from breaking Strahan's record, and he does a whole lot more than just rush the passer.

[samikeyp]

He should but I don't think he would win. I do think he has a great shot at DPOY.

[ATRAIN]

During the Titans Texans game they were talking about Haynesworth for MVP.

[dickface]

I think the 3 best MVP candidates are Ware, Peterson, and Warner. And I don't really know if Peterson or Warner are dominating at their positions the way Ware dominates at his.

Ware dominates whether he's rushing the passer, stuffing the run, or going out into coverage. If he breaks Strahan's record, I think he's far and away the league's MVP.

[IronMexican]

Cowboys have to make the playoffs first. Right now, the front runner is Peterson, especially after yesterdays game.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Matt Ryan would get a nod before Ware. Although I think Ware is the best defensive player in the league hands down.

[Obstructed_View]

Nice that he's playing well. I'd like to see him win Super Bowl MVP, but otherwise I don't care.

[DBryant88]

Shawn Merriman who??

[stretch]

Matt Ryan would get a nod before Ware.

GTFO

[Horry For 3!]

BeWare of D Ware!

[Dr. Gonzo]

GTFO

Seriously. What player has made a bigger impact on a team than Ryan? Where were the Falcons without him last year?

[Obstructed_View]

Ryan definitely deserves consideration.

[monosylab1k]

I'd give Michael Turner consideration, but not Matt Ryan. Ryan's played well but his numbers aren't MVP-worthy.

7 out of 9 Falcons victories, Turner has rushed for over 100 yards. Another win he had 96 yards. I'd say he's made the biggest impact on the Falcons this season, not Matt Ryan.

[dirk4mvp]

Seriously. What player has made a bigger impact on a team than Ryan? Where were the Falcons without him last year?


If that's the case, Peyton is MVP. Without him, they're about 3-11 and he hasn't had a pro-bowl RB like the Falcons have.

[Spurtacus]

MVP of the Cowboys team.

Defensive player of the year is very likely.

[MajorMike]

Seriously. What player has made a bigger impact on a team than Ryan? Where were the Falcons without him last year?


I get your point of view, and agree about the impact, but team impact does not make an MVP.

Right now you don't WANT to be in the MVP talk:
Early MVP candidates -
Portis; "My coach hates me."
Warner; "Hello, comms? This is the SS Zona and we are taking on water fast."
Haynesworth; "Ouch!"

I think Peterman is a candiate simply because he has the most yards of anyone.
I also don't think you can count out Peyton, especially if they win out (which would be 8 in a row).
Another someone to consider (especially if you want to count in what he means to team) is Pennington, who will undoubtedly get the comeback award.
What about Big Ben?

[dirk4mvp]

I also don't think you can count out Peyton, especially if they win out (which would be 8 in a row).


Just a small correction. It'd be 9 :lol

[MajorMike]

Fox pox on me.

[101A]

If a defensive player is to win MVP this year; it seems the Steelers would have something to say about it...they have a historically good defense this year; Polamalu?

[I Love Me Some Me]

If a defensive player is to win MVP this year; it seems the Steelers would have something to say about it...they have a historically good defense this year; Polamalu?

Harrison's the more important player on that DEF.

[MajorMike]

Joey Porter leading the AFC in sacks on a team that won 1 game last year and looks to be headed for the playoffs in the most remarkable turnaround in NFL history.

Ware is leading the NFL in sacks on a team that most favored to win the SB and yet is fighting for a playoff spot.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Harrison, Haynesworth, Jenkins and Ware have been the best defensive players this year.

Ware will be hurt by the fact that there is a ton of talent on the Cowboys and they played like shit when Romo was hurt.

[monosylab1k]

Joey Porter leading the AFC in sacks on a team that won 1 game last year and looks to be headed for the playoffs in the most remarkable turnaround in NFL history.

Ware is leading the NFL in sacks on a team that most favored to win the SB and yet is fighting for a playoff spot.

Joey Porter isn't capable of doing anything but rushing the passer.

Demarcus Ware is the most complete linebacker in the NFL.

Big difference.

[MajorMike]

Joey Porter isn't capable of doing anything but rushing the passer.

Demarcus Ware is the most complete linebacker in the NFL.

Big difference.

That's odd, because on a better D (Pitt), Harrison has more tackles than Ware (94-74) including more solos, 4 less sacks yet 3 more forced fumbles (7-4) plus an interception returned for 33 yards and additionally more passes defended.

Seems like the stats say Harrison is the more complete LB, and I just picked the next guy on the list.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Not to mention all the wasted votes Brees and Favre will get.

[monosylab1k]

That's odd, because on a better D (Pitt), Harrison has more tackles than Ware (94-74) including more solos, 4 less sacks yet 3 more forced fumbles (7-4) plus an interception returned for 33 yards and additionally more passes defended.

Seems like the stats say Harrison is the more complete LB, and I just picked the next guy on the list.

I guess that's why watching the games helps. Harrison gets beat in coverage a lot. Ware doesn't.

Not one NFL GM would take Harrison over Ware.

[monosylab1k]

Not to mention all the wasted votes Brees and Favre will get.

So who exactly started the myth that Drew Brees was one of the best QB's playing? I'd really like to know.

[MajorMike]

I guess that's why watching the games helps. Not one NFL GM would take Harrison over Ware.

I guess that's why you aren't a GM and Matt Millen is ... or was. I'm sure not one would take Cassell over Vince Young, either. Not everyone has the big star shaped glasses.

http://www.taylors-shop.co.uk/acatalog/25202-300d.jpg

[monosylab1k]

I guess that's why you aren't a GM and Matt Millen is ... or was. I'm sure not one would take Cassell over Vince Young, either. Not everyone has the big star shaped glasses.

http://www.taylors-shop.co.uk/acatalog/25202-300d.jpg

I'd glad you can admit that you don't watch enough football to know that DeMarcus Ware is better than James Harrison.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I guess that's why watching the games helps. Harrison gets beat in coverage a lot. Ware doesn't.

Not one NFL GM would take Harrison over Ware.


Yeah, but GMs don't vote for the MVP, writers do.

And they're going to do exactly what the Capt. did; look up stats.

[monosylab1k]

Yeah, but GMs don't vote for the MVP, writers do.

And they're going to do exactly what the Capt. did; look up stats.

Yeah that's true. But the writers aren't going to vote for a defensive player as MVP anyways. I'm pretty sure Peterson or Warner will end up winning it.

[MajorMike]

I'd glad you can admit that you don't watch enough football to know that DeMarcus Ware is better than James Harrison.


I have NFL package so I'm not one of the poor slobs in the midwest that is forced to watch a cowgirls of irving game every damn week. And yes, I watch no football. I noes nuthin' bout them there fellas, yuck yuck.

Again, when you are just plain beaten you must resort to personal attacks. What a lonely existence you must lead.

Please follow with your 'living in the basement' tired line or the timmy mcv log in, you are so clever!

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

The funny thing about Ware is that he deserves all the hype usually reserved for Cowboys players, but somehow he doesn't get as much. An underrated Cowboy, who would have thunk it?

Without Ware, their pass rush goes AWOL and that defense would be severely exposed.

[monosylab1k]

Again, when you are just plain beaten you must resort to personal attacks.

Where was the personal attack? Oh, there was none. Thanks again for admitting you were wrong. It's good to know you can admit your own ignorance about football.

[ClingingMars]

Ware >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Harrison

-Mars

[samikeyp]

Nice that he's playing well. I'd like to see him win Super Bowl MVP, but otherwise I don't care.

I like the way you think!!:toast

[dirk4mvp]

:lol Where are you guys coming up with Ware is so much better than Harrison? It might be 1 ">", but not 28 of them.

[leemajors]

well, harrison is 30 and pretty damn good. ware's 26. i'll go with the younger guy, but it's damn close.

[kskonn]

If I was a gm and I had my choice between Dware and Harrison, my life would be easy. Props to both teams for their moves with these guys. I agree with Leemajors that I would take the younger guy in Ware. But seriously you can't go wrong with either both are studs. D ware doing what he is doing at his age, he has the chance to be a historically good player.

[IronMexican]

What if you played a 4-3? Wouldn't you want someone like Mario Williams or Jared Allen? Allen's 12.5 sacks is pretty good for playing 4-3.

[Obstructed_View]

I like the way you think!!:toast

Thank the Spurs for that. :lol

[DBryant88]

What if you played a 4-3? Wouldn't you want someone like Mario Williams or Jared Allen? Allen's 12.5 sacks is pretty good for playing 4-3.

agreed

[monosylab1k]

What if you played a 4-3? Wouldn't you want someone like Mario Williams or Jared Allen? Allen's 12.5 sacks is pretty good for playing 4-3.

Ware can do everything those guys can do, and he can defend the run from sideline to sideline, and go out into coverage. If you want him at defensive end in a 4-3, I'll take him over Mario or Allen any day. He's the most complete defensive player since Lawrence Taylor.

[IronMexican]

Ware can do everything those guys can do, and he can defend the run from sideline to sideline, and go out into coverage. If you want him at defensive end in a 4-3, I'll take him over Mario or Allen any day. He's the most complete defensive player since Lawrence Taylor.

I'd probably take Mario, but you couldn't go wrong with any of the four. Mario is in his early 20's, that's pretty damn impressive for what he's doing.

[MajorMike]

Ware can do everything those guys can do, and he can defend the run from sideline to sideline, and go out into coverage. If you want him at defensive end in a 4-3, I'll take him over Mario or Allen any day. He's the most complete defensive player since Lawrence Taylor.

I wish we could go back 3 years and find the threads where people called Roy Williams the best DB since Ronnie Lott.

[monosylab1k]

I wish we could go back 3 years and find the threads where people called Roy Williams the best DB since Ronnie Lott.

Maybe 5 years ago when Roy was good. 3 years ago, people who actually watched football all knew that Roy sucked. It's just taken a few years for the people who only look at stats to figure it out.

[MajorMike]

lol, you mean it took until the Washington game with the 2 4th q TDs for the star brigade to admit it.

But don't mind me, I know nothing about football.

[IronMexican]

That game was awesome! That will be the one game I never forget in Texas Stadium.

[monosylab1k]

lol, you mean it took until the Washington game with the 2 4th q TDs for the star brigade to admit it.

Roy was playing poorly well before that ever happened. Again, people who actually watch football know this.

But tell us how many interceptions he had! And how many tackles!

[MajorMike]

I love your posts, lol. Its like arguing with my 6-year old. She's never wrong and looks silly while she does it, too.

[ATRAIN]

I'd glad you can admit that you don't watch enough football to know that DeMarcus Ware is better than James Harrison.

Mono since you say you watch every football game. Does that mean you watch every green bay game?

[monosylab1k]

when you are just plain beaten you must resort to personal attacks.


I love your posts, lol. Its like arguing with my 6-year old. She's never wrong and looks silly while she does it, too.

[monosylab1k]

Mono since you say you watch every football game.

Yeah why don't you post that quote.

[ATRAIN]

I love your posts, lol. Its like arguing with my 6-year old. She's never wrong and looks silly while she does it, too.

http://media.podhoster.com/thatradio/images/bigstockphoto_hammer_striking_nail_w_sparks_333329 .jpg

[ATRAIN]

Mono when should we expect you on ESPN?

[monosylab1k]

:lmao ATRAIN looks like such a dumbass when he tries to debate me that all he does now is piggyback on someone smarter than him who tries to take me on. Unfortunately you picked CaptDouche to piggyback this time, and that guy is probably more retarded than you are. Next time just wait till someone like Sanity or JT or IronMexican or stretch or OV or DLF or someone else who knows what they're talking about gets into a debate with me.

[ATRAIN]

:lmao ATRAIN looks like such a dumbass when he tries to debate me that all he does now is piggyback on someone smarter than him who tries to take me on. Unfortunately you picked CaptDouche to piggyback this time, and that guy is probably more retarded than you are. Next time just wait till someone like Sanity or JT or IronMexican or stretch or OV or DLF or someone else who knows what they're talking about gets into a debate with me.

HA whatever bitch. You say the same shit so there is no point in arguing with you. I am piggybacking because whenever someone is arguing with you, I pretty much agree with them because its against you. Are you butt hurt cause I never back you up? Its ok Mono, I know your mom never hugged you as a kid but dont look for affection from me.

[IronMexican]

It's fun arguing with mono. He can piss people off, but it is very entertaining.

[monosylab1k]

Mono when should we expect you on ESPN?

I would never lower my standards that far. ESPN is the Larry The Cable Guy of sports analysis.

[ATRAIN]

I would never lower my standards that far. ESPN is the Larry The Cable Guy of sports analysis.

Ok since your the Sports Guru who do you have in the SB this year?

[IronMexican]

Yeah, I am cutting down on ESPN. You guys remember when Brandon Marshall was beasting, and I think Boomer said "You think anyone could cover that guy?" And Eric Allen said "I think maybe only that guy down there in San Diego" All I could do was laugh after I heard that.

[stretch]

That's odd, because on a better D (Pitt), Harrison has more tackles than Ware (94-74) including more solos, 4 less sacks yet 3 more forced fumbles (7-4) plus an interception returned for 33 yards and additionally more passes defended.

Seems like the stats say Harrison is the more complete LB, and I just picked the next guy on the list.

Having bigger defensive numbers such as defended passes and tackles isn't neccesarily a good thing for a defender. In fact, many times it means they are picked on more, so they have more opportunities for getting bigger numbers. Look at Nnamdi Asomugha. Best CB in the league by far, yet his stats are virtually non-exsistent, because no one really attacks him.

Ware cuts off open pass opportunities, and often opponents don't like running to his side because he covers the run so well too. Zach Thomas was talking about it the other day, how he doesn't get many runs to his side like in the past because opponents don't like running at DeMarcus Ware.

[dirk4mvp]

Yeah, I am cutting down on ESPN. You guys remember when Brandon Marshall was beasting, and I think Boomer said "You think anyone could cover that guy?" And Eric Allen said "I think maybe only that guy down there in San Diego" All I could do was laugh after I heard that.



There's nothing like watching an NFL show on ESPN when the camera closes up on Trent Dilfer or Mark Schlereth and they say something along the lines of "If you want to be a good football player in the national football league, you have to make good football plays at opportune times. It's as simple as that".

[ATRAIN]

There's nothing like watching an NFL show on ESPN when the camera closes up on Trent Dilfer or Mark Schlereth and they say something along the lines of "If you want to be a good football player in the national football league, you have to make good football plays at opportune times. It's as simple as that".

Its Ironic that Dilfer would say that considering he wasnt a good football player.

[IronMexican]

There's nothing like watching an NFL show on ESPN when the camera closes up on Trent Dilfer or Mark Schlereth and they say something along the lines of "If you want to be a good football player in the national football league, you have to make good football plays at opportune times. It's as simple as that".

LMAO. Kinda like the Uncle Sam picture is what you're saying? ESPN is pretty much not worth watching anymore. I get all my info from the internet now.

[MajorMike]

Mono would be the equivilant to Lou Holtz or Lee Corso. They too only have odd opinions for the sake of entertainment.

[stretch]

It's fun arguing with mono. He can piss people off, but it is very entertaining.

:lol agreed

[monosylab1k]

when you are just plain beaten you must resort to personal attacks.


Mono would be the equivilant to Lou Holtz or Lee Corso. They too only have odd opinions for the sake of entertainment.

[Obstructed_View]

Roy Williams sucked for a while before it caught up with him because at one point he was able to make big plays at critical times and he was able to hit people hard and knock them down. When he stopped making plays he just became a guy who gave up touchdowns and when he stopped being able to knock guys down he became a guy who missed tackles because he couldn't wrap anyone up. When he was recovering fumbles and getting interceptions it was WHEN he was getting them that made him great. Regardless, even then he was hugely overrated by ESPN and was underappreciated by the KFN.

[MajorMike]

Ware should get the MVP solely based upon the run-stopping ability he showed in the final 5 mins of that Ravens game; outstanding. The best LB in the game at work right there, I tells you. Made it even easier that Ware knew exactly what was coming so he knew exactly where to be.

[monosylab1k]

Ware should get the MVP solely based upon the run-stopping ability he showed in the final 5 mins of that Ravens game; outstanding. The best LB in the game at work right there, I tells you. Made it even easier that Ware knew exactly what was coming so he knew exactly where to be.

Yep, Ware is responsible for Ken Hamlin screwing up two routine tackles. And Ware got held on the 2nd run, otherwise he would have stuffed the guys 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage.

Watching the game would have helped you to not look like a complete moron here, but we all know you and your love of numbers and strawman arguments.

[johnsmith]

I'll take some shit for this, but I actually think sacks are an over-rated statistic.

[2centsworth]

I'll take some shit for this, but I actually think sacks are an over-rated statistic.

tell that to the patriots

[monosylab1k]

I'll take some shit for this, but I actually think sacks are an over-rated statistic.

Like any stat, there's cheap sacks that mean nothing. But I wouldn't call sacks overrated at all.

When a team goes back to pass, they're generally looking for a 10+ yard gain on that play. When you sack the QB for a 5-10 yard loss, that could potentially be a net loss of 20 yards or more, if the QB would have found the open man.

[MajorMike]

Yep, Ware is responsible for Ken Hamlin screwing up two routine tackles. And Ware got held on the 2nd run, otherwise he would have stuffed the guys 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage.

Watching the game would have helped you to not look like a complete moron here, but we all know you and your love of numbers and strawman arguments.


I love to watch with cowgirl of irving fans. Everytime there is a TD or big play against them, they get held. It must be a Ref conspiracy; is Donahey an NFL ref?

But then, you would know that if you watched anyone else but Dallas play.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

It's going to come down to Rivers and Manning.

[johnsmith]

tell that to the patriots

Don't get me wrong, I recognize that they can be game changers from time to time, but throughout a season how many of a players total sacks impacted a game dramatically?

Ware has 20 something sacks, how many propelled his team to victory?


Again, I realize people will disagree with this, but it's how I've always seen it. I also think YAC should be a statistic that is looked at more then it is.

[johnsmith]

Like any stat, there's cheap sacks that mean nothing. But I wouldn't call sacks overrated at all.

When a team goes back to pass, they're generally looking for a 10+ yard gain on that play. When you sack the QB for a 5-10 yard loss, that could potentially be a net loss of 20 yards or more, if the QB would have found the open man.

I guess I don't think sacks themselves are overrated, but judging a defensive players impact throughout a season on sacks seems overrated to me.

[MajorMike]

It's going to come down to Rivers and Manning.

Rivers didn't even make the PB. No, I didn't say he didn't deserve it, just that he didn't. Manning #2 will get more MVP votes than Rivers will.

Manning has this one in the bag. Top 4 will be Manning, Peterman, Manning and Warner - prolly in that order.

[monosylab1k]

I love to watch with cowgirl of irving fans. Everytime there is a TD or big play against them, they get held. It must be a Ref conspiracy; is Donahey an NFL ref?

But then, you would know that if you watched anyone else but Dallas play.

If you watched more football, or hell more sports in general, you'd know that the majority of fans of every sports team on earth thinks their team gets screwed whenever a big play happens.

So why exactly do you post on a sports message board when it's so clear that you pay no attention to sports whatsoever?

[monosylab1k]

Manning has this one in the bag.

Manning has thrown an interception and lost a football game. He clearly isn't MVP caliber.

[MajorMike]

If you watched more football, or hell more sports in general, you'd know that the majority of fans of every sports team on earth thinks their team gets screwed whenever a big play happens.

So why exactly do you post on a sports message board when it's so clear that you pay no attention to sports whatsoever?

Because watching yourself make an ass out of yourself as the eternal apologist, or excuse monkey may be a better term, is way more fun than working.

What is this fooseball of which you speak?

And you are right, I don't watch football; my team is the Raiders, we haven't played football in years.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Rivers didn't even make the PB. No, I didn't say he didn't deserve it, just that he didn't. Manning #2 will get more MVP votes than Rivers will.

Manning has this one in the bag. Top 4 will be Manning, Peterman, Manning and Warner - prolly in that order.

What does the PB have to do with MVP voting?

Eli doesn't do dick in most of the games. Peterson fumbled away a lot of MVP votes this past weekend. Warner has been a no-show the last month. Quietly, Rivers has kept his team alive and leads the league in passing.

If the Chargers make the playoffs, then he'll get serious consideration but come in second to Manning.

If they don't, then Manning takes it easily, IMO.

[monosylab1k]

Because watching yourself make an ass out of yourself

http://www.nerve.com/CS/blogs/nerveinsider/2008/04/08-15/Austin_Danger_Powers_Mike_Myers.jpg

[MajorMike]

What does the PB have to do with MVP voting?

Eli doesn't do dick in most of the games. Peterson fumbled away a lot of MVP votes this past weekend. Warner has been a no-show the last month. Quietly, Rivers has kept his team alive and leads the league in passing.

If the Chargers make the playoffs, then he'll get serious consideration but come in second to Manning.

If they don't, then Manning takes it easily, IMO.

Nothing, other than shows he won't win dick.

True; true; true; true.

False, zero way Rivers gets 2nd in the MVP. Zero. LT is seen as the player that the Chargers live and die with, I don't care if it isn't true, but LT is the face of the Charges and therefore gets the blame and the glory. I fully expect the to get into the playoffs and Rivers will still not be even close to 2nd in the MVP.

Already done.

[2centsworth]

Don't get me wrong, I recognize that they can be game changers from time to time, but throughout a season how many of a players total sacks impacted a game dramatically?

Ware has 20 something sacks, how many propelled his team to victory?


Again, I realize people will disagree with this, but it's how I've always seen it. I also think YAC should be a statistic that is looked at more then it is.

last sack he had put the cowboys on the scoreboard. I'm not sure if there's anything more important than putting pressure on the QB. From Charles Haley to Lawrence Taylor, putting pressure on the QB is winning football.

[johnsmith]

last sack he had put the cowboys on the scoreboard. I'm not sure if there's anything more important than putting pressure on the QB. From Charles Haley to Lawrence Taylor, putting pressure on the QB is winning football.

I totally agree with you, pressuring the quarterback is winning football, but they don't give a stat for "pressures" except for in game statistics.

[IronMexican]

Rivers didn't even make the PB. No, I didn't say he didn't deserve it, just that he didn't. Manning #2 will get more MVP votes than Rivers will.

Manning has this one in the bag. Top 4 will be Manning, Peterman, Manning and Warner - prolly in that order.

Do you remember Steve McNair?

[MajorMike]

Do you remember Steve McNair?


You mean the guy who started the season 9-2 then got hurt, limped into the playoffs and failed to win their division thereby completely losing sole ownership of the MVP having to share it with Manning?

Yeah, that is exactly how Rivers' season has been.

[MajorMike]

Manning has this one in the bag. Top 4 will be Manning, Peterman, Manning and Warner - prolly in that order.

It looks like Rivers will win tonite; I still standby my Top 4.