Kurt Thomas

[Spurs Brazil]

Great to see him finally playing well.

The last 8-10 game he's playing solid and tonight he played great D and did a great job on the boards

He's moving much better after that terrible start in november

[urunobili]

i am so pleased with his performance tonight... props to him and his believers :tu

[Spurs Brazil]

12rebs 3blks

[HarlemHeat37]

I've believed in him the entire time, I always defend him on this board..

Thomas isn't a starter-caliber player anymore, but he's a solid bench big man..one of the better ones in the NBA IMO..

[Austin_Toros]

about time!

[benefactor]

I knew he would be ok. He had the injury in the preseason and as the season started it was obvious that it was still bothering him as evidenced by his lack of mobility. He looks to be fully recovered now.

[pawe]

12rebs 3blks

Plus ball slaps

[timtonymanu]

Props to him. Better him than Oberto.

[angelbelow]

yea i thought he might have still been injured or out of shape, hes definitely looking good now!

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

How many times did I say it, KT always starts extremely slow in November and needs 20+ games to get back into game shape. He might not be athletic but I'd take a Timmy KT front court over Gasol Bynum or KG Perkins any day of the week. Veteran savvy and fundamental basketball, efficiency > flash.

[HarlemHeat37]

well people are exaggerating our need to matchup with the Lakers frontcourt..Bynum is just an average player..he looked great the 1st 2 weeks of the season, but he's looked average since then..recently, he's actually looked horrible..he's not going to make as much of a difference as the media made him out to be..

[timvp]

Eight blocks in the last five games. :tu

[raspsa]

Well with Oberto out this will be KT's time to shine with lots of playing time.. i

[T Park]

Like i said, i never count out kurt thomas

dudes a stud.

[Oh, Gee!!]

Kurt Thomas equals not the answer.

[galvatron3000]

let him get his legs back, he's quality and a good big for the Spurs. He's a matchup player, meaning he will be very useful for half court match ups. He is quality off the pine.

[exstatic]

He just needed to get healthy. When he is, his rebounding rate is probably in the top 25% of the league for C/PF, and he shoots the jumper well enough to space the floor for Tim. He's making less than the league average salary, and cost us exactly one late first round pick. I don't know what you people expect. You can't have a roster of 12-15 stars. Portland proved that didn't work. You need lunch bucket guys like Kurt and Bruce who are willing to do the physical, demanding things that so many younger players haven't a clue about, and do them without complaint. I really think that if he hadn't had SO many foot and ankle problems and surgeries early in his career, he would have been a Rodman-class rebounder, with a jumper.

[Bender]

Plus ball slaps
I always wondered if slapping the ball to a teammate counts for a rebound or not... or does the teammate get the rebound stat?

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

well said exstatic, the blue collar players are important. Not only do Bowen and KT know they earn their paycheck with physical tenacious defense, they don't need to be involved on offense in order to play defense. That's why my favorite Sun is Grant Hill because he takes whatever defensive assignment Porter gives him and doesn't care if he doesn't score a lot on offense, he's the one Sun who's #1 concern is winning or losing.

[T Park]

He just needed to get healthy. When he is, his rebounding rate is probably in the top 25% of the league for C/PF, and he shoots the jumper well enough to space the floor for Tim. He's making less than the league average salary, and cost us exactly one late first round pick. I don't know what you people expect. You can't have a roster of 12-15 stars. Portland proved that didn't work. You need lunch bucket guys like Kurt and Bruce who are willing to do the physical, demanding things that so many younger players haven't a clue about, and do them without complaint. I really think that if he hadn't had SO many foot and ankle problems and surgeries early in his career, he would have been a Rodman-class rebounder, with a jumper.

Agreed. Had he been able to stay healthier, with his BBall IQ level, he would've been one of the better power forwards this game has ever seen.

[DPG21920]

Eight blocks in the last five games. :tu

Didn't you say he would not be playing in "certain" games that I said he would be? He has gotten more than his normal minutes in a few of the games you said he would not and done well.

It is possible that the Oberto injury played a role, but does not change the fact that he was effective against the teams with "perimeter bigs" as you called them.

[timvp]

Didn't you say he would not be playing in "certain" games that I said he would be? He has gotten more than his normal minutes in a few of the games you said he would not and done well.

It is possible that the Oberto injury played a role, but does not change the fact that he was effective against the teams with "perimeter bigs" as you called them.:lmao @ it being "possible" Oberto's injury played a role in Thomas getting increased minutes. That's hilarious.

How is your boy Bustnani doing?

[DPG21920]

:lmao @ it being "possible" Oberto's injury played a role in Thomas getting increased minutes. That's hilarious.

How is your boy Bustnani doing?

Resort to changing the topic much? How did Kurt do against the "bigs" you said he would see no time against because he would be ineffective?


Bargs started out the year very well, but has slumped now. But ask the resident Toronto native and he will tell you how Bargs has played so far. You always make it seem like I said Bargs is an all-star, I said he can be solid and if not for the number 1 tag, would be doing ok with much more room to grow.

[timvp]

Resort to changing the topic much? How did Kurt do against the "bigs" you said he would see no time against because he would be ineffective?That's a lie. I didn't say he'd see no time because he'd be ineffective.

This is what I said.


The key to KT playing substantial minutes is the other team has to have two post threats. None of those combos above = two post threats.
Oberto's injury obviously changed the minutes equation. Well, I guess obviously to everyone but you.

Keep it honest.


Bargs started out the year very well, but has slumped now.Well is an overstatement. He was doing the same crap. And slump is an understatement. He's been even more horrible lately.


But ask the resident Toronto native and he will tell you how Bargs has played so far.Read a Raptors forum. There's a new thread calling for his head each game.


You always make it seem like I said Bargs is an all-star, I said he can be solid and if not for the number 1 tag, would be doing ok with much more room to grow.Bustnani is just a bad basketball player. Only thing he can sometimes do is score but he can't even do that right now. Last night Pop specifically went right at him because he's such a bad and lazy defender.

If you still don't think Bustnani is a bust ..... that's a bad sign.

[DPG21920]

That's a lie. I didn't say he'd see no time because he'd be ineffective.

This is what I said.


Oberto's injury obviously changed the minutes equation. Well, I guess obviously to everyone but you.

Keep it honest.

Well is an overstatement. He was doing the same crap. And slump is an understatement. He's been even more horrible lately.

Read a Raptors forum. There's a new thread calling for his head each game.

Bustnani is just a bad basketball player. Only thing he can sometimes do is score but he can't even do that right now. Last night Pop specifically went right at him because he's such a bad and lazy defender.

If you still don't think Bustnani is a bust ..... that's a bad sign.

LMAO...Saying he will not play because the other teams cannot have bigs that play on the perimeter is the same thing as saying he will be ineffective in those games. What did you mean when you said that? How else can anyone interpret that?

Just because his minutes were forced upon him does not mean that he would automatically be effective by default. You said he would not play in those games not because of any thing but effectiveness against the other teams bigs. So he got minutes and did a good job, why is that so hard for you to admit?

Please state what you meant then when you said he would not play in those games. Why would he not play?

Bargs is a bust with regards to #1 status. He is not a bust with regards to basketball.....yet. Bargs was also blocking shots at his highest rate ever, but you fail to notice that.

[timvp]

LMAO...Saying he will not play because the other teams cannot have bigs that play on the perimeter is the same thing as saying he will be ineffective in those games. What did you mean when you said that? How else can anyone interpret that?

Just because his minutes where forced upon him does not mean that he would automatically be effective by default. You said he would not play in those games not because of any thing but effectiveness against the other teams bigs. So he got minutes and did a good job, why is that so hard for you to admit?

Please state what you meant then when you said he would not play in those games. Why would he not play?Um, it's called matchups. Thomas plays against interior bigs and Oberto plays against perimeter bigs. Have you been watching the Spurs this year?

Oberto can have success against interior bigs, too. However, Pop usually decides which of the them plays based on who they will be guarding. It's not exactly rocket science . . .


Bargs is a bust with regards to #1 status.At least you finally admit that. This summer you insisted he was doing fine and wasn't a bust.

[DPG21920]

Um, it's called matchups. Thomas plays against interior bigs and Oberto plays against perimeter bigs. Have you been watching the Spurs this year?

Oberto can have success against interior bigs, too. However, Pop usually decides which of the them plays based on who they will be guarding. It's not exactly rocket science . . .

At least you finally admit that. This summer you insisted he was doing fine and wasn't a bust.

You said that Kurt would see no time in the aforementioned games because of match-ups. That was because he was a match-up problem correct? Well, I said I disagree on some of the games specifically the Raps game. He got the minutes because Oberto was out, but that does not change the fact he did well in a game you said he would not do well in because of match-ups.

I think you are underestimating what Kurt can do. I am not saying he is the best perimeter big defender, but he is capable of doing it in some of these 2 big match-ups. He has done pretty well in all of the recent games, considering you said none of the last few games he would get any PT because he was to slow to be out there.

[timvp]

You said that Kurt would see no time in the aforementioned games because of match-ups. That was because he was a match-up problem correct?Incorrect. I never said he'd get no time. The original question that sparked my response was asking when would Thomas get extended playing time. I said it'd be when the Spurs played a team with interior bigs because that's when Pop trots Thomas out for extra time.


Well, I said I disagree on some of the games specifically the Raps game.1. The Oberto injury.

2. Bustnani got so bad that the Raptors signed Voskuhl to take some of his minutes ... which put another interior player in the rotation.


He got the minutes because Oberto was out, but that does not change the fact he did well in a game you said he would not do well in because of match-ups.WTF? I never said he wouldn't do well. I said he wouldn't get extended playing time because the minutes would instead go to Oberto. Oberto is injured so the minutes went to Thomas.

What part are you not understanding?

[timvp]

considering you said none of the last few games he would get any PT because he was to slow to be out there.Nice edit. Actually, no, horrible edit because I said nothing like that.

Fundamental, reading is.

[DPG21920]

Incorrect. I never said he'd get no time. The original question that sparked my response was asking when would Thomas get extended playing time. I said it'd be when the Spurs played a team with interior bigs because that's when Pop trots Thomas out for extra time.

1. The Oberto injury.

2. Bustnani got so bad that the Raptors signed Voskuhl to take some of his minutes ... which put another interior player in the rotation.

WTF? I never said he wouldn't do well. I said he wouldn't get extended playing time because the minutes would instead go to Oberto. Oberto is injured so the minutes went to Thomas.

What part are you not understanding?

Why would the minutes go to Oberto? That is saying that Oberto would have done better because of the match-ups, or saying Kurt would be ineffective. I don't think that is to big of a stretch. So, you are saying Oberto would have done better than Kurt did?

[DPG21920]

Nice edit. Actually, no, horrible edit because I said nothing like that.

Fundamental, reading is.

You are being so dishonest it is not even funny. When that poster asked: "in the next 7 or 8 games" do you think KT would play. Then you gave your logic about Kurt and said none of those next 7 or 8 games qualify. None = 0 so wtf are you on about. Be honest.

[timvp]

Why would the minutes go to Oberto?
:bang

The minutes would have gone to Oberto because that's the rotation Pop was using all year. Against bigger bigs, Thomas plays more. Against perimeter bigs, Oberto plays more.


That is saying that Oberto would have done better because of the match-ups, or saying Kurt would be ineffective.:lol :shootme

No it's not. It's explaining Pop's rotation to someone who asked when Thomas would play extended minutes.


I don't think that is to big of a stretch. So, you are saying Oberto would have done better than Kurt did?:bang

[timvp]

You are being so dishonest it is not even funny. When that poster asked: "in the next 7 or 8 games" do you think KT would play. Then you gave your logic about Kurt and said none of those next 7 or 8 games qualify. None = 0 so wtf are you on about. Be honest.

More blatant lying.


Hey timvp, this isn't related to the post I quoted, but whatever. Out of the next 7 games, how many have a big center/PF that Pop would need more of KT for?

More of KT. Keyword being more. As in more than usual. As in extended minutes. As in KT playing more than he typically plays.

Nowhere in the conversation was it stated that KT would start getting DNP-CD's. You are either totally confused or trying to lie your way to pretend to know what you are talking about.

[DPG21920]

:bang

The minutes would have gone to Oberto because that's the rotation Pop was using all year. Against bigger bigs, Thomas plays more. Against perimeter bigs, Oberto plays more.

:lol :shootme

No it's not. It's explaining Pop's rotation to someone who asked when Thomas would play extended minutes.

:bang

I get what you are saying. I know you are saying the normal rotations this year have gone to Oberto with perimeter bigs. I was saying that was not entirely true in light of KT's injury. I thought that with KT fully healthy he would steal some minutes that normally have gone to Oberto so far.

A wrench got thrown into this when Oberto got hurt so KT had to have those minutes. Now we do not know if KT would have gotten more minutes anyways. Does not change the fact that my opinion that KT would steal some minutes when healthy in this scenario bc he can do well in place of Oberto has been somewhat true, bc he has done well in places where you say the minutes normally go to Oberto.

[DPG21920]

More blatant lying.



More of KT. Keyword being more. As in more than usual. As in extended minutes. As in KT playing more than he typically plays.

Nowhere in the conversation was it stated that KT would start getting DNP-CD's. You are either totally confused or trying to lie your way to pretend to know what you are talking about.

How is saying that KT would not get anymore minutes in those games than normal and me saying he would make me a liar? He did get "more" minutes. Even in the very next game KT got 18 minutes when he has only been playing 14 when we were arguing about Craig Smith. I said he is a low post player, you said no.

You said he would not get anymore minutes as in he would not be needed. I said I disagree and I expected in some of those games (Wolves, Raps) that he would get more PT. Oberto got hurt so we we cannot know if that is the only reason considering how well he played against them.

[timvp]

Does not change the fact that my opinion that KT would steal some minutes when healthy in this scenario bc he can do well in place of Oberto has been somewhat trueProps on taking credit for KT stealing minutes from an injured player :tu

[timvp]

How is saying that KT would not get anymore minutes in those games than normal and me saying he would make me a liar?You are lying by saying that I said somewhere that KT wouldn't play. You've said that about a dozen times in this thread ... including that post I just quoted calling you a liar.

[DPG21920]

You are lying by saying that I said somewhere that KT wouldn't play. You've said that about a dozen times in this thread ... including that post I just quoted calling you a liar.

You know exactly what I meant. I was referencing what you said in the other thread. Knowing that you knew what you said and so did I. I did not think I had to spell it out for you. Quit crying about nitpicky little things and focus on the main point.


(cue the "what is the point" comment)

[DPG21920]

I get what you are saying. I know you are saying the normal rotations this year have gone to Oberto with perimeter bigs. I was saying that was not entirely true in light of KT's injury. I thought that with KT fully healthy he would steal some minutes that normally have gone to Oberto so far.

A wrench got thrown into this when Oberto got hurt so KT had to have those minutes. Now we do not know if KT would have gotten more minutes anyways. Does not change the fact that my opinion that KT would steal some minutes when healthy in this scenario bc he can do well in place of Oberto has been somewhat true, bc he has done well in places where you say the minutes normally go to Oberto.


Props on taking credit for KT stealing minutes from an injured player :tu

I was debating you before the injury that the reason for some of the rotations was not match-ups, but health. Just bc Oberto got injured does not mean I was wrong. You should try quoting in context. It looks like I was somewhat right bc I thought KT would get some of those minutes anyways from Oberto bc he could be effective, and he WAS.

[timvp]

You said that Kurt would see no time in the aforementioned games because of match-ups.


You know exactly what I meant.You don't even seem to understand what you mean.

[DPG21920]

You don't even seem to understand what you mean.

No time = no extended time. That is what you said in the other thread, that is what I was referencing. No where did I say you said he would get DNP's.

[timvp]

No time = no extended time. That is what you said in the other thread, that is what I was referencing. No where did I say you said he would get DNP's.


You said he would not play in those games

Yeah, and I'm sure "he would not play" = no extended time, right?

[DPG21920]

Yeah, and I'm sure "he would not play" = no extended time, right?

Actually yes. Isn't that what you said in the other thread that we are discussing?

[timvp]

Actually yes. Isn't that what you said in the other thread that we are discussing?Riiiiiight. :lol

Link to me saying KT wouldn't play?

[DPG21920]

I said I thought KT would see a bump in minutes in the Wolves game and the Raps game bc he can do well. I never said I thought you literally meant he would not play, the whole argument is that he would not get extended PT bc Pop had "no use" for him in those match-ups.

[DPG21920]

Riiiiiight. :lol

Link to me saying KT wouldn't play?

You just quoted it. You said he would not get any more minutes than normal in the games we are discussing. I said he would in the Raps/Wolves game. How hard is this to understand:bang

[timvp]

I said I thought KT would see a bump in minutes in the Wolves game and the Raps game bc he can do well. I never said I thought you literally meant he would not play, the whole argument is that he would not get extended PT bc Pop had "no use" for him in those match-ups.No the argument was that Oberto would play against perimeter bigs, per usual. Who said "no use"?

[DPG21920]

No the argument was that Oberto would play against perimeter bigs, per usual. Who said "no use"?

Did you not say that KT would not get extended time in "that 7-8 game" stretch?

[timvp]

You just quoted it. You said he would not get any more minutes than normal in the games we are discussing. I said he would in the Raps/Wolves game. How hard is this to understand:bangWhat kind of f'ed up language equates "not playing" and "not extended minutes"? If you tell me George Hill will not play next game should I assume that means he won't play more than usual.

Make sense, please.

[timvp]

Did you not say that KT would not get extended time in "that 7-8 game" stretch?Did the light finally turn on?

[DPG21920]

What kind of f'ed up language equates "not playing" and "not extended minutes"? If you tell me George Hill will not play next game should I assume that means he won't play more than usual.

Make sense, please.

If we had a discussion where it was clearly stated that I thought Hill would not see more than normal minutes, yes it would be acceptable to assume when you talk to me and say no minutes that I would use my brain and understand what you mean by it.

[DPG21920]

Did the light finally turn on?

answer the question please.

[timvp]

If we had a discussion where it was clearly stated that I thought Hill would not see more than normal minutes, yes it would be acceptable to assume when you talk to me and say no minutes that I would use my brain and understand what you mean by it.:lol I don't assume when the person I'm arguing with constantly lies and goes back and changes the meaning of his words mid thread.


answer the question please.Yes, I said the matchups would indicate that KT would not get extended minutes. The equation obviously changed when Oberto came up lame.

[DPG21920]

:lol I don't assume when the person I'm arguing with constantly lies and goes back and changes the meaning of his words mid thread.

Yes, I said the matchups would indicate that KT would not get extended minutes. The equation obviously changed when Oberto came up lame.

You are the one being dishonest, not me. You keep quoting only little parts and then acting like you do not understand how some can think that the person they are talking to understands things without having to use flash-cards to help illustrate.

Did I not say that KT would see time against the Wolves and Raps?

[T Park]

DPG, for the good of the thread, drop it :lol

You've lost, get over it. When TIMVP is right, just accept it. Trust me, I've argued with him in the past and have learned, if takes over 3 posts to explain something to you, your wrong.

[DPG21920]

DPG, for the good of the thread, drop it :lol

You've lost, get over it. When TIMVP is right, just accept it. Trust me, I've argued with him in the past and have learned, if takes over 3 posts to explain something to you, your wrong.

How am I wrong???? I said KT would get minutes against the Raps and Wolves because he is healthy and can do well. Oberto got hurt so he got the minutes anyways, but since he did so well it leads me to believe that 1) he is healthy and 2) he would be taking some of the normal rotational minutes from Oberto even if he is healthy.

His shooting really helps and so does his rebounding. How does this make me wrong?

[timvp]

Did I not say that KT would see time against the Wolves and Raps?:lmao I give up. I can't argue with someone who calls scoreboard on 18 minutes being classified as extended playing time and who also calls scoreboard for KT playing more with Oberto was out. Especially since said person had already retracted his scoreboard claims during the same thread.

Congrats you win perhaps the most jumbled argument I've ever read. Amazing job changing the meaning of "not playing" and "will not play" to somehow reference extended minutes. Well done, especially since it took you a couple pages to make that switch :tu



P.S.

Quick, claim that KT is going to play more minutes next game than Oberto. You have a good chance because Oberto will not play due to injury. And when I say will not play, I mean he won't play. As in his minutes will not be measurable because there will be none. :tu

[DPG21920]

I guess we will just have to see when Oberto is fully healthy along with Kurt who Pop goes with in certain situations. I just think that Kurt is better for the Spurs in most situations.

[DPG21920]

:lmao I give up. I can't argue with someone who calls scoreboard on 18 minutes being classified as extended playing time and who also calls scoreboard for KT playing more with Oberto was out. Especially since said person had already retracted his scoreboard claims during the same thread.

Congrats you win perhaps the most jumbled argument I've ever read. Amazing job changing the meaning of "not playing" and "will not play" to somehow reference extended minutes. Well done, especially since it took you a couple pages to make that switch :tu



P.S.

Quick, claim that KT is going to play more minutes next game than Oberto. You have a good chance because Oberto will not play due to injury. And when I say will not play, I mean you won't play. As in his minutes will not be measurable because there will be none. :tu


Why do you try and take away from what I am saying by making dishonest claims. The minutes part is part of it (although you act like I threw 18 minutes in your face as certified proof that I no doubt won the argument), but we were talking effectiveness. KT has been effective in games where Oberto has normally gotten the minutes.

I does not matter if Oberto is hurt. Look at how KT is playing in the games. If he would of sucked ass against the Raps, then I would of said you were 100% right. But he did well which leads me to believe that he can take some minutes from Oberto even when he is healthy in the situations we discussed.

[timvp]

but we were talking effectiveness. KT has been effective in games where Oberto has normally gotten the minutes. *sigh*

No we were talking minutes. I never talked about KT's effectiveness.


I does not matter if Oberto is hurt. Look at how KT is playing in the games. If he would of sucked ass against the Raps, then I would of said you were 100% right. Minutes. Not effectiveness.

For the thousandth time.

[DPG21920]

*sigh*

No we were talking minutes. I never talked about KT's effectiveness.

Minutes. Not effectiveness.

For the thousandth time.

If KT was effective, why then would he not get the minutes?

[timvp]

If KT was effective, why then would he not get the minutes?

:yield

I can only explain that Oberto usually plays against perimeter bigs 20 times per thread. I've reached my limit.

You win. Congrats.

[DPG21920]

:yield

I can only explain that Oberto usually plays against perimeter bigs 20 times per thread. I've reached my limit.

You win. Congrats.

LOL, the thing is I completely get what you are saying, I am just disagreeing with it. Maybe I just really suck at explaining what I think?

I know that Oberto usually gets the minutes against the perimeter bigs. My thinking was that this is KT's first full year, he is fully healthy and his tools will allow him to take some of those minutes from Oberto in certain situations. Like the Wolves/Raps. That is all. *handshake*

[Darrin]

Washed-up has-been living on a reptation as the best and hardest-working player on a bad Knicks team.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Washed-up has-been living on a reptation as the best and hardest-working player on a bad Knicks team.

He hasn't been on the Knicks since 2005. David Robinson said18 months ago KT defended Duncan just as good as or better than anyone else he has seen. I don't think David Robinson would say that about a washed up has been. Just because he doesn't put up great numbers doesn't mean he is a has been, when he and Timmy are on the floor they never give up offensive rebounds.


If the Suns still had KT last year and Duncan had to defend Shaq, Suns win that series. If the Suns don't have KT in 2007, the Spurs sweep that series. KT makes a big impact. When you see him frustrate Bynum this year you'll know why I said that.

[tav1]

now, now kids. can't we play nice?