Malicious whore, or just clueless and oblivious

[Findog]

So about a year ago I met this woman through mutual friends at a bar and we ended up hitting it off. We slept together a few times in the spring. It's been and on and off again thing. She broke up with her fiancee two months before we met and has said she didn't want a serious rel'ship right away. Whatever.

I hit her up for a booty call back in November. Anyways, in the meantime, I moved 3 blocks away from her since it's close to my job. She also broke her arm, was off work and was staying with her mom and friends since she couldn't dress herself, etc...So we both go to a birthday party right before Christmas for a mutual friend. She shows up late with her best friend and some dude. I figured out soon enough that the dude was just a friend. Anyways, we're chatting at the party, getting along well, since we have good chemistry. She left with the people she came with, since they drove her and she's got this cast on her arm and can't drive herself. While we're talking, she's giving me some horror stories about guys she's been on dates with, how they're all clowns, won't stop calling her every day, and how since she broke up with her fiancee, I'm the best guy she's met and I'm the closest she's come to really dating anybody, I give her her space, etc...

She leaves and our mutual friend Bob is pumping me up: "Dude! You and Laura really should be a couple! You have such good chemistry..."

I go home after last call and get a text at 4 in the morning from her: "It was so good to see you again! Now that we're neighbours we need to get together soon..." So I texted back something like "yeah, that sounds good. Good to see you too..." I played it cool this time unlike my last text message that I chronicled here.

Christmas Eve I called her to wish a Merry Christmas and got her voicemail. Then she never fucking called me back...EVER. Fine, whatever. Today at work she IMs me on facebook and is telling me she's home again. I'm pissed at her over the never returned call, but I decided to play it cool and not raise a stink over IM about it. So we're making chitchat, and I inquired about her well-being and her arm, and asked her if she had been cleared for all her usual activities, and she's like "what do you mean by that? ;) Are you being a perv?"


Then she writes this:

Her: "i have a date this weekend with this funny dude. he was all, "well, what do you want to do on saturday? i can think of a few things you can do with only one hand. what a shithead. haha.

"you should have seen me trying to do that stuff with a cast on! it was totally hilarious.

not that i do much of that..."

me: "giving handjobs?"

Her: "well, not that specifically, but you know. that nature of things."

Okay, what I want to know is why is she telling me about this stuff? We're not an exclusive couple, she owes me nothing, certainly not a returned phone call, and she's telling me about guys she's going out on dates with and messing around with? I have two other prospects right now, one of whom I've fooled around with, but do I tell her about them? FUCK NO.

I kinda have feelings for her, and I was kinda pumped after that Christmas party, but what the fuck am I supposed to do? Calls don't get returned, then she messages me on facebook to tell me about other guys? Is she worth the trouble at this point? Is she being malicious, or just generally oblivious about how I might not want to hear about her going on dates with other guys and fooling around?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

looks like you're just acting on what she's throwing at you. quit being "nice"

[I Love Me Some Me]

If you havin' girl problems, I feel bad for you son.
I got 99 problems but a bitch ain't one.

[Findog]

looks like you're just acting on what she's throwing at you. quit being "nice"

I'm not being anything. I understand don't be a wussy nice guy, but how are you supposed to handle this?

[ChumpDumper]

Stay away. Women who are into you won't tell you about sex with other guys.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I'm not being anything. there lies your problem.

[Findog]

Stay away. Women who are into you won't tell you about sex with other guys.

That's what I figured. I guess she's not into me anymore, because she certainly was at one time in the recent past.

[Bitch]

You like girls? :wtf

[2Blonde]

I'm not being anything. I understand don't be a wussy nice guy, but how are you supposed to handle this?
You say "NEXT"!!! Seriously, we only get a certain amount of time on earth, do you really want to spend it trying figure out what some spaced-out slut is trying to accomplish by screwing with your head? :nope

[Findog]

You say "NEXT"!!! Seriously, we only get a certain amount of time on earth, do you really want to spend it trying figure out what some spaced-out slut is trying to accomplish by screwing with your head? :nope

I guess not. Would you agree that is not classy behavior?

[I Love Me Some Me]

I guess not. Would you agree that is not classy behavior?

Wasn't this girl screwing around with you when she was still engaged?

[Darrin]

You sound emotionally invested. She sounds like she's worried about her reputation (and with good reason since Spurstalk is weighing in). If I'm completely wrong, then you want her to shut up, do what you do to her when she talks in bed--tell her to shut up.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

You moved into the friend zone without even knowing it.

You handle it by not talking to her ever again unless she has her mouth firmly wrapped around your cack.

[Findog]

Wasn't this girl screwing around with you when she was still engaged?

No. She broke up with him in November 2007. We didn't meet until January 2008.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

i think BackToBS may need to weigh in on this one.

[mrsmaalox]

Ooh good one! :) I think you know what the problem is: "We're not an exclusive couple, she owes me nothing". She probably feels the same way or at least believes that you are seeing it only as sex, booty calls, etc. It sounds like you want something more---so you need to tell her. If she feels the same she will stop doing it. I'm afraid you are going to have to take a risk and bring it up or just forget about any type of relationship with her. Is she clueless and oblivious? It's possible. I know guys who have sometimes felt that I want them to read my mind about things; but I'm (women) the same way. I can't read minds and unless they tell me what's on their mids I just have to go with what I think. I don't think she's a malicious whore :)

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

And doesn't it go: A whore fucks everybody and a bitch fucks everybody except you...?

EDIT: Missed the first part, it's answer A.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

:lmao

i just realized you were wanting an opinion if you should have a relationship with a "malicious whore" or not.

:lmao

[I Love Me Some Me]

No. She broke up with him in November 2007. We didn't meet until January 2008.

Gotca...

Ok, based on what I've seen I think (based on the fact that you mentioned it), the turning point at which this became something more emotional on your end was after the party. She said to you that night that one of the things she liked about you was that you "give her space". After the party, Third-Party-Bob said he thought you guys should be together.

Seems to me like you forgot what she said about space, and took to heart what someone else said about a relationship. She never wanted anything more from you than casual, non-committed, no-strings-attached sex.

Your bad.

[jack sommerset]

I say she is a straight up whore. She wants cock. Give the whore what she wants findog. You sound like a nice guy. Go fuck that whore and treat her like a whore. She will love it. You deserve it.

[mrsmaalox]

:lmao

i just realized you were wanting an opinion if you should have a relationship with a "malicious whore" or not.

:lmao

Hey! Bad love is better than no love. Or so I've been told! ;)

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

On second thought, serenade her.

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:roT4oXyABAQvoM:http://www.jfxonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/john-cusack.jpg

[Spurminator]

Tell her you don't want to hear about it. If she's into you, she'll think it's sweet that you don't want to think of her with other men. Maybe that's what she's been trying to get you to say all along.

If she's not into you, well... she's not into you, so what did you lose?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Hey! Bad love is better than no love. Or so I've been told! ;)
well you gotta have some sort of respect for the woman if he wants a relationship. even though i think disgruntled nailed it with the friendzone comment. shoulda. woulda. coulda.

[2centsworth]

Move on Findog.

God Bless.

[clambake]

it sounds like she was great in the beginning................brought her game to the table..............then she decided to play when she felt like it.

are you sure she's not Josh Howard?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

somewhere, findog is crying in a corner.


Findog http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/Style_Templates/DefaultStyle/statusicon/user_online.gif
Where KFC Happens.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=4387&dateline=1195483974&type=profile http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=4387&dateline=1230441956 Last Activity: Today 01:40 PM
Viewing Thread Malicious whore, or just clueless and oblivious (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114013) @ 01:40 PM


:lmao

[IronMexican]

Forget about her. I don't even respond to girls I'm not into on Myspace. "Go waste someone elses time" is what you should tell her.

[jack sommerset]

Tell her you don't want to hear about it. If she's into you, she'll think it's sweet that you don't want to think of her with other men. Maybe that's what she's been trying to get you to say all along.

If she's not into you, well... she's not into you, so what did you lose?

To me its pretty obvious she is a whore. So you think its possible she told the dog she whacked some guy off to get him to be sweet to her. If that indeed is the case stay the fuck away from that crazy bitch.

[jack sommerset]

Crazy bitch : Findog I had my tongue in this guys ass while jerking him off. He was going apeshit. When I pulled my finger out I had a lil shit on it. It was crazy....(crazy bitch is thinking the whole time" I hope findog ask me out, that would be so sweet. I really like him!)

[Findog]

somewhere, findog is crying in a corner.


Findog http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/Style_Templates/DefaultStyle/statusicon/user_online.gif
Where KFC Happens.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=4387&dateline=1195483974&type=profile http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=4387&dateline=1230441956 Last Activity: Today 01:40 PM
Viewing Thread Malicious whore, or just clueless and oblivious (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114013) @ 01:40 PM


:lmao

Had to run a ticket.

[Findog]

Seems to me like you forgot what she said about space, and took to heart what someone else said about a relationship. She never wanted anything more from you than casual, non-committed, no-strings-attached sex.

Your bad.

Okay, I called her ONCE and left a message. I didn't call 18 million times and act all possessive. You tell me all that stuff, you text me the same night at 4 in the morning, and then you ignore me when I call to wish you a Merry Christmas? I just want to know, what gives?

I totally understand why women get turned off when men act like wussy "nice" guys, and when they get all possessive, but how did I do either of those things here? I didn't follow her around like a puppy dog, and I called her once and she ignored me. I can't control what others think or do, but what should I have done differently here?

[I Love Me Some Me]

Okay, I called her ONCE and left a message. I didn't call 18 million times and act all possessive. You tell me all that stuff, you text me the same night at 4 in the morning, and then you ignore me when I call to wish you a Merry Christmas? I just want to know, what gives?

I totally understand why women get turned off when men act like wussy "nice" guys, and when they get all possessive, but how did I do either of those things here? I didn't follow her around like a puppy dog, and I called her once and she ignored me. I can't control what others think or do, but what should I have done differently here?

I'm not saying you came across as emotional to her...I'm saying YOU became emotionally invested at that point (whether she knew it or not).

Bottomline, it (you and her) means more to you than it does to her. You'll have to deal with that in your own way.

[IronMexican]

We expect updates in the coming weeks, Fin.

[Findog]

Okay, plenty of votes to walk away. But if I am going to double down, just ask her out for a date?

[clambake]

I didn't follow her around like a puppy dog, and I called her once and she ignored me. I can't control what others think or do, but what should I have done differently here?

you invested your feelings.

take a step back and ask if it's worth it.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

http://www.softwaremag.com/archive/2001feb/images/ChasingItsTail.jpeg

[IronMexican]

That's sick, bro. If a girl ever talked about banging other guys, I wouldnt even ask her on a date. Unless you know you are getting some.

[Findog]

you invested your feelings.

take a step back and ask if it's worth it.

I'm guessing no. It's just frustrating.

[clambake]

I'm guessing no. It's just frustrating.

she sure peaked you interest, though.

i haven't been on a "date" in a million years.

is it kosher for either of you to describe the sex you're having with others?

if so, i'm way out of the loop.

[Findog]

she sure peaked you interest, though.

i haven't been on a "date" in a million years.

is it kosher for either of you to describe the sex you're having with others?

if so, i'm way out of the loop.

I don't think it is kosher. I think it's not classy and bad form.

[ChumpDumper]

Okay, plenty of votes to walk away. But if I am going to double down, just ask her out for a date?Bang some other chick first and brag about it.

[CuckingFunt]

I guess not. Would you agree that is not classy behavior?

Is the problem that she's fucking around, or that she's telling you about it?

If it's the former, you should be the one to broach the subject of becoming more exclusive. Either she's into it or she's not, in which case you can cleanly walk away.

Unless, of course, you don't want exclusivity, but just want to be the only one fucking around. In which case, that's not how things work.

If the problem is that she's blatantly telling you about it, I'd say get her back by sharing some of the stories of your own conquests. It will likely shut her up.

[ChumpDumper]

And to answer the OP, she's a clueless and oblivious whore.

[Findog]

Is the problem that she's fucking around, or that she's telling you about it?

If it's the former, you should be the one to broach the subject of becoming more exclusive. Either she's into it or she's not, in which case you can cleanly walk away.

Unless, of course, you don't want exclusivity, but just want to be the only one fucking around. In which case, that's not how things work.

If the problem is that she's blatantly telling you about it, I'd say get her back by sharing some of the stories of your own conquests. It will likely shut her up.

The lack of exclusivity does not bother me, because it's a two-way street like you said. More than anything else I feel disrespected - not returning my call and then IM'ing me out of the blue to tell me about her dating escapades. I'm not a door mat.

[mrsmaalox]

But she didn't really say what she did. She said some guy mentioned the handjob and she thought he was a jerk. Then when you asked about handjos she said "not specifically, you know the nature of things"! She didn't describe tugging or blowing or rimming anybody! :lol I think she's probably well aware that you have dated other people and probably figures you have played around too, so what's the big deal?? Anyway if you ask her for a date, make sure you make it clear that it's a DATE--and go ahead and say something like "So let's not talk about our outside adventures tonight, okay?"

[clambake]

that phone call thing is a real bug up your ass. huh?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

The lack of exclusivity does not bother me, because it's a two-way street like you said. More than anything else I feel disrespected - not returning my call and then IM'ing me out of the blue to tell me about her dating escapades. I'm not a door mat.

man, who has the penis in this situation?

[Findog]

that phone call thing is a real bug up your ass. huh?

It's not the worst thing in the world, but if somebody you liked never returned a phone call, and then when you finally do hear from them, they make sure to specifically tell you they're out there fooling around with other guys when that is something that is understood, how are you supposed to take it?

[CuckingFunt]

The lack of exclusivity does not bother me, because it's a two-way street like you said. More than anything else I feel disrespected - not returning my call and then IM'ing me out of the blue to tell me about her dating escapades. I'm not a door mat.

Let her know that, then. If she thinks it's a free and easy non-exclusive fuck-buddy thing, she may be completely unaware that you don't want to swap stories.

I've experienced, both as participant and ventee, several friends-with-benefits situations, and have noticed that there seems to be a problem when people don't realize that type of relationship still needs established parameters. People often have vastly different ideas of how a FWB relationship is meant to work and, even though it's not as strict or structured as an actual relationship relationship, it's important to figure out what your comfort zones are. I would not be at all surprised if she were 100% oblivious to the fact you were bothered by her actions.

[Findog]

man, who has the penis in this situation?

Fine, I'm a wrist-slitting emo fag over this. I should just completely shrug it off. Thanks for the advice.

[clambake]

It's not the worst thing in the world, but if somebody you liked never returned a phone call, and then when you finally do hear from them, they make sure to specifically tell you they're out there fooling around with other guys when that is something that is understood, how are you supposed to take it?

ok, i get it. you care more for her than she does for you.

look, i think it's possible that she doesn't have any serious feelings for anybody, and doesn't actually acknowledge anyone's feelings. it may not even occur to her that she might be hurting someone's feelings.

[Winehole23]

Let her know that, then. If she thinks it's a free and easy non-exclusive fuck-buddy thing, she may be completely unaware that you don't want to swap stories.

I've experienced, both as participant and ventee, several friends-with-benefits situations, and have noticed that there seems to be a problem when people don't realize that type of relationship still needs established parameters. People often have vastly different ideas of how a FWB relationship is meant to work and, even though it's not as strict or structured as an actual relationship relationship, it's important to figure out what your comfort zones are.Strongly agree. Communication -- preferably in meatspace -- is key if you want a solution, findog.

It sounds like there's a crucial difference in the expectations each of you have, that could point to a problem of suitability.

If so, the smart thing to do might be to walk away. There's plenty of fish in the sea, even -- no, especially! -- for wrist slitting emo fags. :fishing

[mexicanjunior]

Sounds like she sees you as just a friend...I think it is time to move on unless you are willing to just be friends with her also...

[Texas_Ranger]

I've got the same problem.... FUCK!!:madrun

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

More than anything else I feel disrespected - not returning my call and then IM'ing me out of the blue to tell me about her dating escapades. I'm not a door mat.

Then don't act like one. Asking her out on a date after she's telling you about the difficulties of accessing some other dude's cack with a cast on? For real?

Walk away if you're looking for something other than an occasional post-midnight hookup. This girly could give two shits about you.

[tlongII]

Basically she's telling you that you've been kicked to the curb. Happens to all of us.

[Dr. Gonzo]

I'm not a door mat.

Apparently you are.

And be sure to let us now how the other's guy dick tastes after your goodnight kiss.

[jack sommerset]

Apparently you are.

And be sure to let us now how the other's guy dick tastes after your goodnight kiss.

I once got a bj from a married women at a party and not 5 minutes later I saw her kissing on her husband. Thats pretty gross. Noway she had a chance to brush her teeth.

[Findog]

Then don't act like one. Asking her out on a date after she's telling you about the difficulties of accessing some other dude's cack with a cast on? For real?


This is pretty much the response I was looking for. Thanks. :tu

[DannyT]

move on to the next catch....you cant make a ho a housewife....so stop trying to get married and just keep banging em out!!!!

[Mark in Austin]

seems a little silly.

1. Your questions to her lead the the handjob disclosure. If you don't want her to tell, don't ask.

2. All this over one unreturned phonecall over Christmas? It is possible that she had a shit ton of stuff going on - it was Christmas after all - and missed/forgot it.

3. Ask her if she ever thought about something more serious. You'll find out where you stand pretty quickly and then can move on, one way or the other.

4. We're all whores to a certain degree.

Good luck, man. Either way this turns out, you come out ahead. Worst case: you got to spend some quality time with somebody you enjoyed being around.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I once got a bj from a married women at a party and not 5 minutes later I saw her kissing on her husband. Thats pretty gross. Noway she had a chance to brush her teeth.wow. now that's a straight up whore.

[timvp]

Chances are you accidentally landed in her friend zone. Not sure where you went wrong but perhaps she was looking for something more during this exchange:


I go home after last call and get a text at 4 in the morning from her: "It was so good to see you again! Now that we're neighbours we need to get together soon..." So I texted back something like "yeah, that sounds good. Good to see you too..."

That sounded like she may have wanted something more concrete than your general answer. But whatever, can't really blame yourself for getting friend zoned.

However, there's a small chance you aren't in the friend zone and her latest move is an attempt to make you jealous. It's a slutty way to go at it but it's a classic move. She might be hoping that listening to her exploits jolts whatever emotions you have for her to the surface.

Either way, if you are still interested, you should act fast. Either you can verify your friend zone membership or she'll be happy that her plan to make you jealous worked. If you wait she will know without a doubt to move on and really start loosening up that arm. . .

[clambake]

yeah, right. then you can find out how she fucks with your head over other topics.

[Findog]

Chances are you accidentally landed in her friend zone. Not sure where you went wrong but perhaps she was looking for something more during this exchange:


That sounded like she may have wanted something more concrete than your general answer. But whatever, can't really blame yourself for getting friend zoned.

Yeah, I thought I made it explicitly clear we were on the same page. I mean, it was 4 am and it wasn't a booty call bc she was spending the night with a friend. I figured there was plenty of time to get together in the near future and I called her a few days later on Christmas Eve. It's not like I was dragging my feet.



However, there's a small chance you aren't in the friend zone and her latest move is an attempt to make you jealous. It's a slutty way to go at it but it's a classic move. She might be hoping that listening to her exploits jolts whatever emotions you have for her to the surface.

Either way, if you are still interested, you should act fast. Either you can verify your friend zone membership or she'll be happy that her plan to make you jealous worked. If you wait she will know without a doubt to move on and really start loosening up that arm. . .


Yeah, I have to hurry up and shit or get off the pot.

[CuckingFunt]

Then don't act like one. Asking her out on a date after she's telling you about the difficulties of accessing some other dude's cack with a cast on? For real?

Walk away if you're looking for something other than an occasional post-midnight hookup. This girly could give two shits about you.

Don't agree that you can assume the last part. It's certainly possible that she doesn't care about him. Maybe even probable. But not automatic.

Shocking as it may be, us girls sometimes have a fear of appearing too vulnerable or fragile. Especially with the stigma of being emotional wrecks to worry about. If her suggestion to get together was meant to fish for a specific response and she didn't get it, maybe she's worried about appearing too clingy or too needy by going any farther?

I've got a friend who is locked in a tremendous batch of dysfunctional goodness for exactly that reason -- she's head over heels for him, has convinced herself he doesn't feel the same way, so instead brags to him about her sex life as thoroughly and as often as she can.

[Findog]

Actually, the more I think about it, Cucking and timvp have fished the needle out of the haystack. My reply back via text was really brief, like "yeah that sounds good." I didn't think there was any ambiguity and we were on the same page but it looks like there was. So I'm guessing my text back came across as lukewarm.

[Winehole23]

Actually, the more I think about it, Cucking and timvp have fished the needle out of the haystack. My reply back via text was really brief, like "yeah that sounds good." I didn't think there was any ambiguity and we were on the same page but it looks like there was. So I'm guessing my text back came across as lukewarm.And I guess it just makes me look old-fashioned to say that if you want to court someone, you should try to do it in person. At least sometimes.

[E20]

I think you should whistle for a cab and head towards Bel-Air.

[Findog]

And I guess it just makes me look old-fashioned to say that if you want to court someone, you should try to do it in person. At least sometimes.

I have a piece of shit cheap-ass factory phone. I don't generally text, so I don't know the etiquette of it.

[jack sommerset]

I bet the next time she will tell you how she went ass to mouth.

[IronMexican]

You should try the popcorn trick:tu

[Winehole23]

I have a piece of shit cheap-ass factory phone. I don't generally text, so I don't know the etiquette of it.Touche', Fin. :lol

[CuckingFunt]

You should try the popcorn trick:tu

I don't think the popcorn trick is necessary if they've already slept together.

[jack sommerset]

You should try the popcorn trick:tu

I don't think u need to trick this one.

[IronMexican]

I know. I was just wondering, though, wouldn't the popcorn be really hot. Anyone have first hand expirience.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Don't agree that you can assume the last part. It's certainly possible that she doesn't care about him. Maybe even probable. But not automatic.

In this scenario? It's is close to automatic as you can get from the intraweb and not actually meeting her.

Was engaged and throwing down with FD (unless I read that wrong), continued that type of relationship while trolling for new every day dick, thought she found said dick, now is wondering if it is of the every day variety, hits up FD(emergency dick) to see if he's still willing despite her talking about new guy, etc etc.

She's going to drop him once she upgrades to a dude she thinks she can domesticate.

[Findog]

In this scenario? It's is close to automatic as you can get from the intraweb and not actually meeting her.

Was engaged and throwing down with FD (unless I read that wrong), continued that type of relationship while trolling for new every day dick, thought she found said dick, now is wondering if it is of the every day variety, hits up FD(emergency dick) to see if he's still willing despite her talking about new guy, etc etc.

She's going to drop him once she upgrades to a dude she thinks she can domesticate.

You read that wrong. We met two months after her engagement ended. She's not a cheater when she's in a rel'ship. She never cheated on her fiancee, and that's not why they broke up.

[dirk4mvp]

I know. I was just wondering, though, wouldn't the popcorn be really hot. Anyone have first hand expirience.


The idea of it sounds good, but who wants butter and salt on their cawk?

[DPG21920]

She doesn't believe in God :cry

[mrsmaalox]

The idea of it sounds good, but who wants butter and salt on their cawk?

:hungry:

[dirk4mvp]

:hungry:



:eyebrows

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

You read that wrong. We met two months after her engagement ended. She's not a cheater when she's in a rel'ship. She never cheated on her fiancee, and that's not why they broke up.

Figured.

And it's just my opinion but remember, you aren't traveling in fresh snow.

Honestly, the best advice I can give you is to trust your first instinct. Our minds can con us into rationalizing anything.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

She never cheated on her fiancee, she told you that, huh?

[IronMexican]

You should buy her knee-pads and a bib and maybe she would give you dome.

[CuckingFunt]

I just don't understand the immediate jump to assume this girl is either a slut or playing games. I'm not naive enough to assume that she isn't, or that she couldn't be, but based on the few details we've gotten here, it's not crazy to think that Findog may be (perhaps unintentionally) sending mixed messages.

[Findog]

she told you that, huh?

We have a lot of mutual friends and I have a pretty good feel for the type of person that she is.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I just don't understand the immediate jump to assume this girl is either a slut or playing games. I'm not naive enough to assume that she isn't, or that she couldn't be, but based on the few details we've gotten here, it's not crazy to think that Findog may be (perhaps unintentionally) sending mixed messages.

Of course it isn't. Anything is possible and every situation is different.

I don't like his odds, though.

[50 cent]

She sounds like a cucking funt.

[whottt]

Sounds like she already knocked your ego down a peg, and not in a joking fashion...that right there tells you you don't really want to take her seriously.

Basically 2blonde and Chump gave you the best advice.

I will say that you were out of line to get upset when you she didn't call you back...I mean if it's casual that means you call when you want...no expectation. That is the rule.


I would disregard the advice of Cucking and timvp primarily on the basis that you didn't say anything wrong in that reply IMHO...if she wants more from you and she's incabapble of flat out asking for it...well that's a head game.


Yes I know that is the way 75% of women are...and that's also why so many marriages end in divorce. Never get serious with someone you can't communicate with and have to guess....if the chick can't or won't talk openly and is instead uses all the passive agressive methods of communication, either learn to love the head game or tell her to fuck off.


Right now it sounds like you are sinking down into one of those holes where you feel the need to compete or play her game ...and you should already know the only way to win that game is to just walk away. The only way to beat any woman in a head game is to flat out not care...if you care and they want games, you will lose.


I mena face it dude...it is easier for a woman to get laid than a man(who isn't in a rockband). It's just the way it is.


If I were you I'd walk away because you are wanting something from her now and you are unlikely to get it, in fact more than likely you will get exactly the opposite...2blonde nailed it exactly, she's going flake on you.


Personally if I were you...next time she IM's you just say you don't have time to talk and you aren't interested in any conversation that doesn't end up with your dick in her mouth.

[whottt]

We have a lot of mutual friends and I have a pretty good feel for the type of person that she is.



The type that talks to you about giving guys handjobs?


I can already tell you are fucked because you are defending her honor and talking about what kind of person she is...while she's talking about guys she's dating and handjobs.

Look...you wouldn't give a shit about her talking about other guys if she was fucking you...so obviously she's not. It's her or your ego slick...when you meet the rigth chick you'll know it...if it's something you have to analyze...then she's not the one and what you really want is steady sex.

[MiamiHeat]

the girl is a slut and you are wondering about classy behavior?

how can you even possibly think of a serious relationship with a slut?

[whottt]

the girl is a slut and you are wondering about classy behavior?

how can you even possibly think of a serious relationship with a slut?

Ego...it's not so much that he likes her, it's more that if she's going to be giving onearmed handjobs, where's his? It's the principle of the thing.


Truth is...he's not really that into her, if he was it wouldn't take her talking about giving other guys handjobs to get his attention. It's entirely about his ego...

She knows it too...even the flakiest of women can pick that sort of thing off instantly.

[timvp]

I would disregard the advice of Cucking and timvp primarily on the basis that you didn't say anything wrong in that reply IMHO...if she wants more from you and she's incabapble of flat out asking for it...well that's a head game.

Yes I know that is the way 75% of women are...and that's also why so many marriages end in divorce. Never get serious with someone you can't communicate with and have to guess....if the chick can't or won't talk openly and is instead uses all the passive agressive methods of communication, either learn to love the head game or tell her to fuck off. Where you're wrong is your 75% number. I'd say it's nearly 100%. If Findog or anyone else sat around waiting for a chick to fall in their lap that absolutely never uses a head game ...... that is going to be one long wait. And really, it's best to figure out the head games early on and get over that phase rather than to be surprised down the road.

The easy advice to give Findog would be to tell him to stay away but obviously by his reactions to the circumstances, that's not the angle he wants to take. Sure this one seems somewhat complicated and conniving but I disagree that should make him run for the hills. As long as he knows what he's doing and going about it the right way, he can overcome.


P.S.

And all your talk about the supposed HJ tells me you don't realize she very well could be making that up to see if he gets jealous.

[marini martini]

Ego...

It's entirely about his ego...

She knows it too...even the flakiest of women can pick that sort of thing off instantly.

You got that right, Whott! It's all about ego, both his and hers! Flaky and/or hard up chicks want to know that they are desired by as many guys as possible. In her case, she "has" to throw out the hand job bait. Sad!!! Even sadder, the guys that bite!:toast

[jack sommerset]

Where you're wrong is your 75% number. I'd say it's nearly 100%. If Findog or anyone else sat around waiting for a chick to fall in their lap that absolutely never uses a head game ...... that is going to be one long wait. And really, it's best to figure out the head games early on and get over that phase rather than to be surprised down the road.

The easy advice to give Findog would be to tell him to stay away but obviously by his reactions to the circumstances, that's not the angle he wants to take. Sure this one seems somewhat complicated and conniving but I disagree that should make him run for the hills. As long as he knows what he's doing and going about it the right way, he can overcome.


P.S.

And all your talk about the supposed HJ tells me you don't realize she very well could be making that up to see if he gets jealous.



Making up the hand job to get him jealous. If thats the case Findog better snatch this one up quickly. She is a keeper:lmao

[Findog]

Look, if it were only about fucking, I wouldn't care enough to post a thread in the club section. I had a similar piece on the side around the same time, and she called it off because we both knew it was about fucking and fucking only, and pretty soon she didn't like that.

The thing about Laura is that when we met, she had just walked away from an engagement and a rel'ship that had lasted 5 years. I had been in a rel'ship for the better part of 2 years. I think I understand what "rebound guy" and "rebound girl" means better now. After being chained up for so long, you really do cherish your new-found freedom. And in our case, we had a lot in common and really hit it off, but didn't quite want to do something so committed so soon. timvp is right that it's the guys that have to do the pursuing, not the other way around, and you can't sit around and wait for the perfect girl to fall into your lap because that's not going to happen. Nobody's perfect, and nobody's going to be beating down your door. I don't think anything she said was idle chatter, she was sending me a message.

[whottt]

Where you're wrong is your 75% number. I'd say it's nearly 100%. If Findog or anyone else sat around waiting for a chick to fall in their lap that absolutely never uses a head game ...... that is going to be one long wait.

Just depends...there are cute and harmless headgames and then there are the seriously fucked up ones.

And I disagree that the number is 100%.

There's that PCT of people(usually they are weird) that just click. I know this one couple they are Rocky Horror Picture show freaks...I think they got married during the movie....no head games that I know of.

Granted, she looks like an extra from Rocky Horror when she's not even wearing a costume...but still.




And really, it's best to figure out the head games early on and get over that phase rather than to be surprised down the road.

Again depends on the head games...if you can figure out the head game, then it really isn't a head game now is it?

BTW, the PCT of men that actually understand all female headgames is even smaller than the number of women that don't play them ever.




The easy advice to give Findog would be to tell him to stay away but obviously by his reactions to the circumstances, that's not the angle he wants to take.

It's almost never the angle you want to take when some chick does something like that...that's hardly unique. That's why they do it.



Sure this one seems somewhat complicated and conniving but I disagree that should make him run for the hills. As long as he knows what he's doing and going about it the right way, he can overcome.


Overcome what? Her giving other guys handjobs and talking to him about it?






P.S.

And all your talk about the supposed HJ tells me you don't realize she very well could be making that up to see if he gets jealous.

I realize she could be making it up...but going straight to the head game stage straight out of the casual stage doesn't sound like a good omen to me...then again, I have a lot of ex girlfriends that hate my guts because I dump them and stop talking to them when I think they are starting to play games...so I very well could be wrong.

But that doesn't take into account that Findog is not that into it...it's about the handjob IMHO.

[whottt]

Look, if it were only about fucking, I wouldn't care enough to post a thread in the club section. I had a similar piece on the side around the same time, and she called it off because we both knew it was about fucking and fucking only, and pretty soon she didn't like that.


I bet she never talked to you about giving other guys handjobs now did she?

Hence your ego was not damaged...therefore you did not need her to fix what she broke. Because there was nothing broken...


This time you do...






The thing about Laura is that when we met, she had just walked away from an engagement and a rel'ship that had lasted 5 years. I had been in a rel'ship for the better part of 2 years. I think I understand what "rebound guy" and "rebound girl" means better now. After being chained up for so long, you really do cherish your new-found freedom. And in our case, we had a lot in common and really hit it off, but didn't quite want to do something so committed so soon. timvp is right that it's the guys that have to do the pursuing, not the other way around, and you can't sit around and wait for the perfect girl to fall into your lap because that's not going to happen. Nobody's perfect, and nobody's going to be beating down your door. I don't think anything she said was idle chatter, she was sending me a message.


And I bet the handjob recipient was that guy you deemed only a friend at the Christmas Party....

Well message or not...she got under your skin enough to post about it on a message board.

Her 1
Findog 0

[CuckingFunt]

I still don't think it's a given that this chick is playing games.

If Findog has given the impression that he wants to keep it casual and non-exclusive, then, shit, maybe this is just her being casual. As someone pointed out earlier in this thread (maalox, maybe? I don't remember who), it's no more fair for guys to expect us to read their minds than it is for us to expect guys to read ours.

If it is a head fuck, and it's entirely possible that it is, it should become pretty obvious once you're direct about what you're looking for from her. And, again, if it's a head fuck, walk away. Quickly.

I can't stand the girls who play mind games, though. Not only because they're a pain in the ass, but because the games have made guys so fucking gun shy that they're constantly looking for an angle from those of us who don't play them.

[whottt]

timvp is right that it's the guys that have to do the pursuing.


<<<<<< Proposed after third date...and it wasn't desperation or anything of the sort, it was a without a doubt this was the girl I wanted to marry.

BTW, I don't disagree with this...in fact I pretty much want no part of any chick that comes on to me strong, the agressive ones are usually the crazy ones.

[CuckingFunt]

I bet she never talked to you about giving other guys handjobs now did she?

Is it her responsibility to ask whether or not it's cool for her to give someone else a handjob, though? Or is it Findog's responsibility to let her know that it's not? Or is it both?

If I'm in a casual, non-exclusive, friends with benefits relationship, I'm going to assume it's okay for me to do whatever I please until the other party tells me that it's not. Or until I begin to develop stronger feelings, in which case I would let that be known. If it's mutually casual, and I've been given no indication that's changed, though, a handjob wouldn't seem at all against the rules. Nor would talking about it, frankly, though I don't know that I would go there, personally.

[whottt]

I still don't think it's a given that this chick is playing games.

If Findog has given the impression that he wants to keep it casual and non-exclusive, then, shit, maybe this is just her being casual. As someone pointed out earlier in this thread (maalox, maybe? I don't remember who), it's no more fair for guys to expect us to read their minds than it is for us to expect guys to read ours.

If it is a head fuck, and it's entirely possible that it is, it should become pretty obvious once you're direct about what you're looking for from her. And, again, if it's a head fuck, walk away. Quickly.

I can't stand the girls who play mind games, though. Not only because they're a pain in the ass, but because the games have made guys so fucking gun shy that they're constantly looking for an angle from those of us who don't play them.


Ah well a lot of guys play games too...


The recent peeve I have with women is the ones that get pissed off at you and turn into a bitch if you don't come on to them right off the bat. I'm just not in that big of a hurry anymore.

Actually...if this chick isn't playing games with Findog...then she's that type. He's not moving fast enough for her so she's still fucking with his head...at some point I hope people outgrow that shit.

One could argue that since she's the one who mainly wasn't lookin for anything serious since she just got out of an egagement...it's up to her to suggest the next stage, not Findog.

Findog, you said waiting for a woman to fall into your lap isn't going to happen...well you aren't likely to develop ESP any time soon either so if ahostile handjob is the type of signal you are gonna get...

[whottt]

Is it her responsibility to ask whether or not it's cool for her to give someone else a handjob, though? Or is it Findog's responsibility to let her know that it's not? Or is it both?

If I'm in a casual, non-exclusive, friends with benefits relationship, I'm going to assume it's okay for me to do whatever I please until the other party tells me that it's not. Or until I begin to develop stronger feelings, in which case I would let that be known. If it's mutually casual, and I've been given no indication that's changed, though, a handjob wouldn't seem at all against the rules. Nor would talking about it, frankly, though I don't know that I would go there, personally.


Yeah but she hasn't been talking about giving other guys handjobs from the get go...


Hey I agree if it's casual then he's really got no cause to get upset about...at the same time, if she's just starting this out of the blue, she's either going bitch on him...or she is trying to send a message she wants to get serious in a really fucked up way.

One could easily argue it sends the wrong message on Findog's part for him to pursue her more strongly if this is the way she sends messages.

[JoeChalupa]

I sure don't miss my single days at all and I went through those kind of scenarios. Getting confused between booty calls and real feelings. Do I or don't I...does she or doesn't she...will she or won't she..should I or shouldn't I.....I'm so confused. I usually just went with the flow.

[SpursFanFirst]

Stay away. Women who are into you won't tell you about sex with other guys.

...unless she's trying to get a reaction from you.

I'm not into playing games, but I've seen it plenty of times.

It sounds to me like you need to be honest with each other.
If you have feelings for her, you need to put it out there and find out once and for all where you stand.

If you truly are just a casual booty call for her, at least you'll know and you can move on...or not. whatever.

But I'm all for honesty.

[SpursFanFirst]

You should try the popcorn trick:tu


the what? :huh

[florige]

the what? :huh


:lol

[MiamiHeat]

it doesnt matter if she is playing games or not

who the F wants to have a serious relationship with a woman like that

mother of your kids? yuck

[Rogue]

you are fooled by a prostitute, dear findog. they are so despicable that they never consider your feelings. Don't be serious with a whore like her in future but you have already been badly harmed by that bitch. believe me my brother you are not alone. those whores have been cheating these casualties in millions since before you were born. I think watching some movies may help you a little bit. I'm so sad about your experience that it seems it also happened to me. Watch "perfect stragner" and you are gonna have a clear picture of what a real whore should be.
http://www.watch-movies.net/movies/perfect_stranger/

[leemajors]

go henry miller on her the next time she calls. cock and cunt should be your key words.

[Findog]

...unless she's trying to get a reaction from you.

I'm not into playing games, but I've seen it plenty of times.

It sounds to me like you need to be honest with each other.
If you have feelings for her, you need to put it out there and find out once and for all where you stand.

If you truly are just a casual booty call for her, at least you'll know and you can move on...or not. whatever.

But I'm all for honesty.

Right after college, I had a job in Austin working for the Texas Legislative Council. There was this girl right out of college as well, her name was Angela. The first time Angela met me, she pretty much threw herself at me. It was very, very strong. I was a lot more awkward then, and didn't typically receive that kind of attention from females at the time, so I thought something was up. Sure enough, I saw her interact with every single guy in the Agency the same way, just way over the top flirtation.

She started dating my buddy Patrick, but even he wasn't the true object of her desire. She was really after this guy Joel. She and Patrick had been an exclusive item for like one week when he caught a plane to go home to California for the Christmas holidays. The night he left, she went to a work party and ended up making out with Joel. Patrick comes back and without prompting she fessed up to what had happened. He figured anybody that would be making out with other dudes so soon into a rel'ship was only trouble, so he kicked her to the curb. She and Joel were an item almost immediately afterward. They got married this year, so I guess it was meant to be, but the point is that I've seen women go as far as to date guys in order to get the attention of another.

[velik_m]

It is clear that you're on the wrong ladder (http://www.laddertheory.com/ladderconstruction.htm).

[ChumpDumper]

...unless she's trying to get a reaction from you.Especially if she's trying to get a reaction from you.

You don't need this bullshit.

[Whisky Dog]

Here's the guideline for guys to follow:

Always assume attraction. Train your mind to assume attraction so you aren't worried over whether or not she likes you. You'll find that out through your interactions with how she reacts to sexual tension and kino (physical contact).

Develop a strong, playful physical rapport from the get go.

Never pay too much attention to what a woman says. Always look at what she does and how she says things. Women are masters of double speak and non-verbal communication, and you need to learn to be too. Just knowing body language and how to interpret actions will get you very far. Women constantly test you to see how you react. If you pass, instant attraction. If you fail... Attraction decreases.

Forget the old mindset of attraction being something that either is there or isn't. Attraction is more like a meter that increases or decreases based on your interactions. Just because she's into you today doesn't mean you have a free pass to act like a clingy, needy girly man.

At all cost... Work on your inner emotional and mental self to remove limiting beliefs and all insecurity. This is the big one, once you develop an almost complete lack of insecurity your entire physical and mental outlook will change to the positive and you will attract women like crazy.

Always remember that women are security seeking creatures. Be honest and up front with her even if you think it will push her away. Be honest about your sexual interest through action, not words. If a woman feels safe and secure with you and you create that sexual tension then she will follow you to the ends of the earth to please you in return.

Just some pointers to consider, things that have always helped me develop a very successful and fulfilling dating life.

[Heath Ledger]

Keep that whore as a whore with benefits until you find someone that you truly care about that recipricates.

[MiamiHeat]

Keep that whore as a whore with benefits until you find someone that you truly care about that recipricates.

it's spelled reciprocate, heath

maybe if you spent more time learning and less time eating cheeseburgers you wouldn't stomp around and break your treadmills

[Bigzax]

why would you move 3 blocks from a booty call...coincidence?

[RonPopeil]

Just hit it....and forget it.

[ploto]

Seems to me that you got some notion of wanting more attachment based upon what a third party told you, and there was never any discussion actually with her. Tell her- not just us.

[mrsmaalox]

Here's the guideline for guys to follow:

Always assume attraction. Train your mind to assume attraction so you aren't worried over whether or not she likes you. You'll find that out through your interactions with how she reacts to sexual tension and kino (physical contact).

Develop a strong, playful physical rapport from the get go.

Never pay too much attention to what a woman says. Always look at what she does and how she says things. Women are masters of double speak and non-verbal communication, and you need to learn to be too. Just knowing body language and how to interpret actions will get you very far. Women constantly test you to see how you react. If you pass, instant attraction. If you fail... Attraction decreases.

Forget the old mindset of attraction being something that either is there or isn't. Attraction is more like a meter that increases or decreases based on your interactions. Just because she's into you today doesn't mean you have a free pass to act like a clingy, needy girly man.

At all cost... Work on your inner emotional and mental self to remove limiting beliefs and all insecurity. This is the big one, once you develop an almost complete lack of insecurity your entire physical and mental outlook will change to the positive and you will attract women like crazy.

Always remember that women are security seeking creatures. Be honest and up front with her even if you think it will push her away. Be honest about your sexual interest through action, not words. If a woman feels safe and secure with you and you create that sexual tension then she will follow you to the ends of the earth to please you in return.

Just some pointers to consider, things that have always helped me develop a very successful and fulfilling dating life.

Whiskey Dog you possess a unique insight and have much good advice to offer ;), I have to vehemently disagree with the above noted comment. It's best to discuss all aspects of the relationship. And looking thru this thread, every female who has commented has said the same thing: Tell her!



Seems to me that you got some notion of wanting more attachment based upon what a third party told you, and there was never any discussion actually with her. Tell her- not just us.

+1

[Whisky Dog]

Whiskey Dog you possess a unique insight and have much good advice to offer ;), I have to vehemently disagree with the above noted comment. It's best to discuss all aspects of the relationship. And looking thru this thread, every female who has commented has said the same thing: Tell her!




+1

Thanks for the comment, but I think you and I were thinking of two different things. I agree with you that while in a relationship it's essential to communicate and discuss all aspects, and both people need to be secure and mature enough to handle it without getting too emotionally unstable. When I was younger I screwed up some good relationships with good women I wanted to be with because I was sneaky and kept talking to other women due to a personal insecurity and fear of committing to only one woman and losing my options. That led to a horrible mental and emotional focus that the women could easily sense and that shaped their behavior towards me. Instead of being happy and secure with me they were suspicious and jealous and that in turn made me suspicious and it all went to shit. After screwing up relationship after relationship my goofy ass finally connected that personal insecurity with the results I was getting. I corrected that insecurity in my mind for my current relationship and I've found that the lack of insecurity draws her to me like a magnet and there aren't those trust issues, it's great.

What I was talking about in my original quote was directed to that time before there really is a strong sexual relationship between the two people. Most guys I know and have worked with like to verbalize everything to women early on. They like to ask women if they would go out with them instead of assuming attraction and inviting her along with them while they did something. They sometimes even explicitly ask women they're seeing for sex or for sexual favors instead of building the sexual tension through touch, foreplay, and sensual (not sexual) conversation to the point where she gets turned on and sex naturally happens. That's what I meant about not displaying sexual intent with words but with actions. You don't tell a woman you want to have sex with her, you run your hands through the back of her hair, kiss her on the neck and earlobes, use a lot of slow gentle touch strokes on areas nearing but not touching her zones, etc.

[tlongII]

My personal opinion is that you will not be able to hit it with that skank any more. Let me know if I'm wrong, but I think you're DONE.

[jack sommerset]

Just whip out the cock. That way you don't have to talk and you won't get rejected from physical advancements. Sit in ur car with ur cock hanging out and see what happens. If you do this make sure u are smiling.

edit: Thats not for findog, thats general information for those who don't know what do.

[JoeChalupa]

I never assumed attraction before asking a girl out because I'm an acquired taste. I've always dated women after they go to know me so I've only had a few one night stands. I found out that most women pick up on the "he likes me" vibe pretty easily, but that could be because I unknowinlgy make it so obvious. On the other hand my attraction to a woman was instantanious and they became unattactive after they opened their mouths or I got to know them better. But you do need to tell or show them you are interested in more than friendship and as Harry said to Sally..I always thought of sleeping with them at one time or another. That is just natural. Do women think that way too? I don't know.
But hearing about her actions with another guy did make me fantasize about being that other guy when we were just friends.

[BlackSwordsMan]

Give her ONE RING FAGGOT!!

[Lt.Col. J. Hawthorne]

I must say it sounds like this bird could use a good rogering!

[MiamiHeat]

lol

[50 cent]

Man, so this chick is named Laura and she lives in Dallas? Her exes name wasn't Byron was it?

This sounds a hell of a lot like my ex-gf. She is a master of mind games and fucked around on him like crazy.

Regardless, chicks have an incredible ability to discern a guys "caring meter". The more you care, the less they want you. The less you care, the crazier they are about wanting to be with you and satisfy you.

Clearly, you care about this one way too much and she knows it and isn't that interested in you. Sometimes us guys can't help it in certain cases because a chick just knows how to push our buttons and we end up caring about her and the relationship a lot more than we ever should. She soon realizes and the guy can almost see it falling apart in front of his eyes.

On the other hand, I have been in many relationships where I really didn't give a fuck whether I was with the chick or not. In those cases, you give off the vibe that "if you go fuck some other dude, I'm out - I don't care if this works one way or the other." Chicks pick up on this shit as well and that's when they go crazy over you.

Simply put, you always have to make sure that the chick cares more about the relationship than you do. It's not always easy, but it is an absolute fact.

[MANGINA]

Too much drama

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

So near, so far away
We pass each other by cause we don't know what to say
Its so clear, I'm sorry to say
But if you wanna win you gotta learn how to play

[Heath Ledger]

Next time you see her give her the shocker and then kick her to the curb. She will be at your doorstep begging you to marry her within a week.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

http://www.corruptfibers.com/images/products/shocker_tshirt.jpg

[RashoFan]

redecorate her house and car...
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c333/RashoFan/hohouse.jpg

[50 cent]

http://www.corruptfibers.com/images/products/shocker_tshirt.jpg

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

[MannyIsGod]

Whiskey Dog made some quality posts that all passive aggressive fuckers should read.

[Insomniac]

WD probably never gets laid.

[JoeChalupa]

Whiskey Dog made some quality posts that all passive aggressive fuckers should read.

Maybe my passive aggressive nature was the reason I was a virgin for so long? Oh, well, it lead me to find the love of my life so I guess it paid off in the long run. Women are so hard to understand and is an area a man will never stop learning about because just when you think you've figured it out you are thrown a curve ball and we all know how much we swing and miss.

[50 cent]

Peter Bretter: How are things going with the lady?
Darald: Not awesome. She's complicated, like the Da Vinci Code, except harder to crack.

[ploto]

Women are so hard to understand and is an area a man will never stop learning about...

Every woman is different, and attempts to classify all women as "anything" are where men go wrong. You would think that the men in here have read enough posts from the various women to know that they run the full spectrum from Angel to CF. We do not all want the same things, and we do not all have the same hopes, dreams, and desires. Some of us are career women and some stay home. Some wish they had more of a career, and some wish they could have more time at home. Some have kids; some wish they did; some may wish they didn't; and some may never want them. Some are more dependent and some are very independent. We are Democrats and Republicans and everything in between. We are vegetarians and we are steak-lovers. We are individuals and our tastes, actions, and lives are reflective of that- each unique in and of itself.

Men themselves have wondered
What they see in me.
They try so much
But they can't touch
My inner mystery.
When I try to show them
They say they still can't see.
I say,
It's in the arch of my back,
The sun of my smile,
The ride of my breasts,
The grace of my style.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

[whottt]

I don't really like Whiskey Dog's guidelines...seems like a pain in the ass to me. If it ever gets that tough for me, I'll just go get a hooker before attempting to become one with the Universe.

[Chief]

Have revenge on her

Cum on her cast when she's not looking.

[manufor3]

You like girls? :wtf

:lol

[TDMVPDPOY]

is it true, any dick's a lick?