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View Full Version : Game Thoughts: Spurs @ Suns - Jan. 29



timvp
01-30-2009, 06:06 PM
The San Antonio Spurs went into Phoenix and did what they usually do against the Suns. Keeping the game close throughout, the Spurs executed better and played smarter down the stretch to pull out a win by a final score of 114-104.

The key basket for San Antonio came courtesy of Tony Parker. Following a three-point play by Grant Hill that cut Phoenix’s deficit to three points with 1:06 to go in the final stanza, Parker’s 22-footer from straightaway was the final nail the Spurs needed on the night. Manu Ginobili hammered that nail into the Suns’ coffin with five more free throws before the buzzer sounded.

The Suns undoubtedly looked forward to this game and the loss has to be demoralizing. However, there were a few bright spots for Phoenix. Steve Nash and Grant Hill played well, while Amare Stoudemire scored easily against the Spurs. Their two major weaknesses for the Suns remain defense, especially against dribble penetration, and clutch offensive execution.

As for the Spurs, this was a second very impressive win on the road. After dropping that game against the Lakers, the Spurs have responded well. Although their defense against the Suns certainly could have been better, overall it’s difficult to fault any aspect of their effort.

Tim Duncan
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3173.jpg
41 minutes, 20 points, 15 rebounds, four assists, three turnovers
6-for-16 from the field, 8-for-12 from the line

Tim Duncan wasn’t spectacular but he was the foundation of what the Spurs did on the night. Defensively, he guarded Shaquille O’Neal well for a majority of the game. He also was active in the pick-and-roll defense and clogged the middle relatively well. On offense, he struggled a bit on his own shot but he made up for it by getting to the line a dozen times and passing the ball very well. Perhaps the most dominating aspect of his game was his rebounding on both ends. Many of his six offensive rebounds were momentum-changers and he pulled down a number of contested boards on the defensive glass.
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Manu Ginobili
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3380.jpg
32 minutes, 30 points, nine rebounds, three assists, two steals
6-for-13 from the field, 0-for-4 on three-pointers, 18-for-18 at the line

In scoring a season-high 30 points, Manu Ginobili was stubbornly relentlessness. His 18-for-18 showing at the line was arguably the most important stat in the game. Ginobili’s attacking of the basket was vintage and hopefully a preview of what is to come. Part of the reason why Ginobili was so effective on the offensive end was his patience. He waited for the perfect time to attack against the Suns’ vulnerable defense instead of forcing the action when he saw a glimpse of open space. The patience also allowed him to not turn the ball over in his 32 minutes. When Ginobili wasn't hitting free throws, he mixed in acrobatic scores and a number of crisp passes, including the assist on Parker’s 22-foot clincher. Defensively, he didn’t make many mistakes and especially helped out with his nine defensive boards. A good sign for Ginobili is that he was so effective on offense despite not connecting on a three-pointer. In fact, the 30 points he scored was a career-high in a game in which he was held without a three-point make.
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Tony Parker
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3527.jpg
34 minutes, 26 points, five assists, three rebounds, two steals
12-for-21 from the field, 2-for-2 at the line

Tony Parker played a very smooth game and was instrumental in the victory. His ten points in the first ten minutes really set the tone for the Spurs and kept the Suns on their heels from the opening tip. In the pick-and-roll action, he was equally as deadly going all the way to the basket and shooting the midrange jumper. Defensively, Parker stayed within the game plan but his overall aggressiveness was low on that end – likely due to early foul trouble. On the whole, the Spurs have to be happy with the consistent and seemingly effortless performance they got from their point guard.
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Roger Mason, Jr.
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3628.jpg
32 minutes, 12 points
3-for-9 from the field, 2-for-5 on three-pointers, 4-for-4 at the line

Roger Mason, Jr. had a game of spurts. The two three-pointers he hit came in a span of 35 seconds in the second quarter. He also started the game off poor defensively before picking it up on that end of the court in the second half. Consistency from quarter to quarter and game to game seems to be an issue with Mason right now but it’s to be expected, all things considered. The good news is that he seems to be progressing and Pop continues to show trust in him.
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Michael Finley
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3023.jpg
20 minutes, six points, three rebounds, two assists
2-for-5 from the field, 2-for-5 on three-pointers

Although Michael Finley didn’t have a particularly good game, he looked livelier than he’s been in the last couple of weeks. He had good arc on his shot, he was jumping better and he even drove the ball to the basket. However, Finley still struggled on defense – especially when he tried to move laterally. In January, Finley’s numbers are down across the board but being the streaky player that he is, he’ll probably start trending back the other way before too much longer.
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Matt Bonner
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3748.jpg
26 minutes, three points, three rebounds
1-for-3 from the field, 1-for-1 on three-pointers

Matt Bonner found it difficult to be much of a help against the Suns. On defense, he practically begged Stoudemire to take the perimeter jumper rather have him drive it into the lane. The problem is Stoudemire is a very good outside shooter and he proved that once again. Bonner also didn’t help much on the boards on the defensive end. Offensively, the Suns paid extra attention to him and limited his attempts, although Bonner helped out by passing up a few shots.
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Kurt Thomas
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3012.jpg
21 minutes, six points, eight rebounds
3-for-5 from the field

If Kurt Thomas played the Suns every night, he could have a case to return to Phoenix in a few weeks for the All-Star game. His defense was dominant at times and he did a wonderful job against O’Neal. Thomas also contested shots and stepped out on the perimeter when it was needed. Offensively, he knocked down a few jumpers to spread the defense and he was a beast on the offensive boards. All in all, the Spurs couldn’t hope from much more out of Thomas.
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Bruce Bowen
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3167.jpg
19 minutes, nine points
1-for-3 from the field, 1-for-3 on three-pointers, 6-for-8 at the line

Bruce Bowen added another chapter to his Suns slaying legacy. With the game tied at 79 late in the third quarter, Suns coach Terry Porter opted to employ Hack-a-Bowen. After missing his first free throw, he subsequently connected on five straight to doom the strategy. Prior to this game, Bowen was 2-for-8 on the season at the line, so he ended up doubling his attempts and tripling his makes in this one contest. While Bowen’s destruction of Porter’s strategy was a humorous side note, it was Bowen’s defense that really stood out. The defense for the Spurs looked much better with Bowen in the game and the numbers back it. The Suns scored 90.8 points per 48 minutes when Bowen was on the court. When he was on the bench, the Suns scored 112.3 points per 48 minutes.
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George Hill
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/4488.jpg
14 minutes, two points, two rebounds
1-for-1 from the field

Though his play was far from flawless, George Hill gave good effort and provided a lot of energy. Defensively, he applied pressure on the ball and helped out on the boards. On offense, he wasn’t as successful but he didn’t back down and a good job of kept the team in rhythm. Hill’s best moments came at the end of the first half when he helped the team weather Parker’s foul trouble.
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Gregg Popovich
http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/topstory/sports/popovich_gregg030428.jpg

Pop had a standard rotation but his gameplan shined. He drew up plays that had the Suns rotating on defense while at the same time trying to stop penetration from Parker and Ginobili. The amount of movement in the sets really helped the Spurs to have one of the better offensive showings of the season. On defense, not much was working but Pop smartly went to Bowen and Thomas when he needed stops.
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Offense

The 114 points scored by the Spurs were the most they’ve put on the board since scoring 133 against Dallas on Dec. 9. Why did the Spurs score so well? Getting to the line 44 times, a season-high, obviously helped. For the night, the Spurs shot 46.1% from the floor and turned the ball over only six times. It was a rare game in which the Spurs shot poorly from three-point land (6-of-19), didn’t get many assists (16) and still had a very successful offensive outing. If the Spurs ever wonder why getting to the line is important, they should pop in a tape of this game.

Defense

Defensively, the Spurs again weren’t very good. They followed the same pattern as the Jazz game – three ugly defensive quarters and then a strong fourth period. Overall, the Suns shot 49.4% from the field, handed out 22 assists and only turned the ball over seven times. It should be noted that all seven of the turnovers were committed in the second half by the Suns when the Spurs began picking up their defensive pressure. Perhaps the only consistent thing San Antonio did on the defensive end was to keep Phoenix off the three-point line (4-of-7). The 45-37 advantage on the glass was also a bright spot for the Spurs.

Drive to Five

The difficult games keep coming as the Spurs take on the New Orleans Hornets on Saturday night in their final game at home before the Rodeo Road Trip. Although it will be tough contest, a win would give the Spurs a good amount of momentum before they embark on their annual journey.

Believe.

tomtom
01-30-2009, 06:24 PM
:tu

DannyT
01-30-2009, 06:34 PM
good read homie and it was a great game to watch and the mens club....

Manufan909
01-30-2009, 06:43 PM
Glad to see Manu attack like we all know he can. Even with 4-4 3 misses, he still played smart, and set a season high in pts and tied a season low in turnovers.:hat

sonic21
01-30-2009, 06:44 PM
thanks

024
01-30-2009, 07:24 PM
this is the kind of game kurt thomas needs to play against the lakers. if he can guard shaq, he can guard bynum/gasol. making shots to spread the floor makes him valuable offensively. working with duncan to effectively box out and grab rebounds also prevents lakers' frontline from gathering offensive rebounds.

Solid D
01-30-2009, 08:05 PM
Beautiful recap, timvp. That game and the Lakers game in San Antonio were similar in that both games were played at an extremely high offensive efficiency by both teams. For offensive appreciation, those two nationally televised games take top marks.

The zero turnovers for Ginobili was a nice surprise but PHX did little to create them. They rank 28th in the league in creating TOs (only Houston and SA are worse). Several teams, such as Orlando and Phily have really made it tough on Manu by employing a trap on the wing when he gets the ball off the screen, using the sideline as a third defender.

The Big 3 were all very good in this game but it was a solid team win and very exciting to watch. I LOL'd at Porter's Hack-a-Rash. The tempo was benefiting PHX and the stoppage of play was just what the Spurs want when they employ the same. It was a self-pwnage, if you will.

lurker23
01-30-2009, 09:44 PM
Obviously the Spurs need Manu to be at his best if they're going to be a championship team, but when the pundits are finally right and Manu becomes "over the hill," can we please keep him around just to make key free throws down the stretch? His performance in the clutch in the last two games has been beyond impressive.

SequSpur
01-30-2009, 10:43 PM
Ginobili is a spurstalk poster.

Solid D
01-30-2009, 10:44 PM
Maybe you gave him a complex and now he makes too many mistakes.

DAF86
01-30-2009, 11:57 PM
Ginobili is a spurstalk poster.

Who that would be?



When Ginobili wasn't scoring, he mixed in acrobatic scores...

:wtf

m33p0
01-31-2009, 12:09 AM
George Hill
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/4488.jpg
14 minutes, two points, two rebounds
1-for-1 from the field

Though his play was far from flawless, George Hill gave good effort and provided a lot of energy. Defensively, he applied pressure on the ball and helped out on the boards. On offense, he wasn’t as successful but he didn’t back down and a good job of kept the team in rhythm. Hill’s best moments came at the end of the first half when he helped the team weather Parker’s foul trouble.
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for those who claimed he can't finish: he made a layup, IN TRAFFIC!

YODA
01-31-2009, 01:57 AM
Yodas observations....

One of Manus better games as far as Im concerned. Ive been harping that he has been a jump shooter and this game he decided to drive. I wish I had the stats from last year, but I bet 30-35% of his points last year were off free throws. Would love to know the difference in freethrowing between last year and this year.

Bonners D is really bad. I do give him credit for effort, but gosh, its really bad. His rotations are slow and his weak side help is bad.

On over all D, the team concept is for the wings to funnel the drivers into the bigs, but this year, I think ther wings have lost confidence that there will BE help D coming from the interior D. This really needs to be addressed.

Minutes....I kinda liked what i saw in the minutes given out this game. I like seeing Thomas get 20 min and 8 Rb. his games of getting 12-14 min gives him no confidecne in his game. Then even distribution between fin and bowen was also nice.
MY only concern once again was the amount of min that Timmy getting. I wish we could limit him a little but more.

the plus+ the mount of driving and freethrow attempts.

the negatives- interior D is horrible, Timmy's minutes

Slippy
01-31-2009, 04:24 AM
Manu Ginobili
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/ba...ayers/3380.jpg
32 minutes, 30 points, nine rebounds, three assists, two steals
6-for-13 from the field, 0-for-4 on three-pointers, 18-for-18 at the line

In scoring a season-high 30 points, Manu Ginobili was stubbornly relentlessness. His 18-for-18 showing at the line was arguably the most important stat in the game. Ginobili’s attacking of the basket was vintage and hopefully a preview of what is to come. Part of the reason why Ginobili was so effective on the offensive end was his patience. He waited for the perfect time to attack against the Suns’ vulnerable defense instead of forcing the action when he saw a glimpse of open space. The patience also allowed him to not turn the ball over in his 32 minutes. When Ginobili wasn't hitting free throws, he mixed in acrobatic scores and a number of crisp passes, including the assist on Parker’s 22-foot clincher. Defensively, he didn’t make many mistakes and especially helped out with his nine defensive boards. A good sign for Ginobili is that he was so effective on offense despite not connecting on a three-pointer. In fact, the 30 points he scored was a career-high in a game in which he was held without a three-point make.
-------------------------------



that indeed was vintage Manu even if he didn't hit a three.

Tough win by the spurs.

NFGIII
01-31-2009, 02:04 PM
Thanks. Great recap.

Manu hopefully seems to be turning the corner and this bodes well for us. With the RRT about to commence I think the D will tighten up and start to resemble what we've all been accustomed to.

de Soto
01-31-2009, 02:59 PM
The Suns suck but not as bad as the hapless mavs who are setting a new standard for sucking for the amount of money wasted. :rollin:rollin:rollin


The Spurs continue to be the clear #2 in the West behind the Lakers. Hope that will change by playoffs. :flag:

exstatic
01-31-2009, 03:08 PM
The funny thing about this game is that Pop said they were going to run zero plays for Manu. Everything he got was off another play that caused the initial defensive rotation, mostly Parker penetrations. Once the defense was in flux, Manu attacked relentlessly, and was Manu effective. That may be the secret: have him play off Parker or Tim, and get the defense rotating at least once before he attacks.

timvp
01-31-2009, 03:19 PM
The funny thing about this game is that Pop said they were going to run zero plays for Manu. Everything he got was off another play that caused the initial defensive rotation, mostly Parker penetrations. Once the defense was in flux, Manu attacked relentlessly, and was Manu effective. That may be the secret: have him play off Parker or Tim, and get the defense rotating at least once before he attacks.Very good point and well said.

I noticed that every time Manu was on the court, he was joined by either Duncan or Parker. We almost always see Manu spend some time on the court without the other two but Pop altered his rotation to make sure that wasn't the case. He took out Duncan early so that he could come back in by the time Parker got his first rest.

The result? Manu never had to carry the burden by himself and could instead concentrate on attacking off the ball. Even though he was scoring a lot, it was almost always off of movement and after TD or TP drew the attention of the Suns defense.

It'll be interesting to see if Pop will go to that strategy again or if he was doing it as some sort of Manu jumpstart. By making sure he had another star by his side and never calling any direct plays for him, Pop turned Manu into more of a finisher than a creator. And not only did it destroy the Suns, it might be a blueprint that could work going forward . . .

Killakobe81
01-31-2009, 03:35 PM
Great win but to be expected they own the Suns ...i think hornets game should be better ...but we'll see ...

Solid D
01-31-2009, 03:54 PM
Very good point and well said.

I noticed that every time Manu was on the court, he was joined by either Duncan or Parker. We almost always see Manu spend some time on the court without the other two but Pop altered his rotation to make sure that wasn't the case. He took out Duncan early so that he could come back in by the time Parker got his first rest.

The result? Manu never had to carry the burden by himself and could instead concentrate on attacking off the ball. Even though he was scoring a lot, it was almost always off of movement and after TD or TP drew the attention of the Suns defense.

It'll be interesting to see if Pop will go to that strategy again or if he was doing it as some sort of Manu jumpstart. By making sure he had another star by his side and never calling any direct plays for him, Pop turned Manu into more of a finisher than a creator. And not only did it destroy the Suns, it might be a blueprint that could work going forward . . .

Several teams had success doubling Manu whenever he got the ball. With Tim and Tony out there too, it is more difficult to do that without paying for it.

Hemotivo
01-31-2009, 03:55 PM
The funny thing about this game is that Pop said they were going to run zero plays for Manu



Well, that's not true; the most important play of the game was a play for Manu but everyone in the NBA knows that play... so it worked perfectly when he make that pass to Tony for the jumpshot.

Solid D
01-31-2009, 04:03 PM
Well, that's not true; the most important play of the game was a play for Manu but everyone in the NBA knows that play... so it worked perfectly when he make that pass to Tony for the jumpshot.

Yeah, but to exstatic's point, it was after Parker brought the ball up and made an entry to the high post to Timmy. Parker set a screen for Manu and then popped out inside the arc. It wasn't the usual give the ball to Manu for the high screen roll at the top.

Hemotivo
01-31-2009, 04:05 PM
c'mon solid, it's the same play; they always run that play
but now manu pass the ball to tony

timvp
01-31-2009, 04:15 PM
Several teams had success doubling Manu whenever he got the ball. With Tim and Tony out there too, it is more difficult to do that without paying for it.True. Plus blitzing a secondary pick-and-roll is much harder than blitzing a pick-and-roll you know is coming.

We'll see tonight if Pop keeps it up and how it works against a sturdier defense. The Hornets had a lot of success in the playoffs last year pressuring Manu and getting him to turn the ball over.

ducks
01-31-2009, 06:35 PM
Several teams had success doubling Manu but not DUNCAN!

roycrikside
01-31-2009, 06:41 PM
True. Plus blitzing a secondary pick-and-roll is much harder than blitzing a pick-and-roll you know is coming.

We'll see tonight if Pop keeps it up and how it works against a sturdier defense. The Hornets had a lot of success in the playoffs last year pressuring Manu and getting him to turn the ball over.

uh, he led the team in points and assists.

timvp
01-31-2009, 06:55 PM
uh, he led the team in points and assists.I was specifically talking about success in blitzing Ginobili's pick-and-rolls, especially early in the series. When the Spurs figured out that Ginobili had a massive advantage against anyone who guarded him, Pop went away from the picks and let Ginobili dominate from the perimeter on one leg.

But comparatively speaking, this game will be more of a test because the Hornets actually know how to execute a pick-and-roll blitz. The Suns aren't evolved enough defensively to pull it off.

If Pop stays with the same strategy of keeping Manu on the court with either Duncan or Parker and turning Manu into the ultimate finisher and it works again, the Spurs may be on to something . . .

Slippy
01-31-2009, 07:18 PM
If Pop stays with the same strategy of keeping Manu on the court with either Duncan or Parker and turning Manu into the ultimate finisher and it works again, the Spurs may be on to something . . .

I believe the last time POP put Manu on his own was the laker game. Tony feeds of Tim, Tim feeds off Tony, now Manu gets to feast off both and it's all in the flow of the offense. Good on POp for making the adjustment. :toast

roycrikside
02-01-2009, 02:52 PM
If Pop stays with the same strategy of keeping Manu on the court with either Duncan or Parker and turning Manu into the ultimate finisher and it works again, the Spurs may be on to something . . .

Postscript: Pop left Manu bareass nekkid for stretches in the second, third, and fourth quarters and it worked out fine.

timvp
02-01-2009, 03:06 PM
Postscript: Pop left Manu bareass nekkid for stretches in the second, third, and fourth quartersTrue.


and it worked out fine.
"Bareass nekkid" Manu had a plus/minus of -7 in eight minutes. "Clothed" Manu had a plus/minus of +21 in 18 minutes.

But yeah, Pop apparently only went with his "I'm going to keep clothes on Manu and not call plays for him" strategy for only the Suns game. It was back to the regularly scheduled broadcast against the Hornets.

Manufan909
02-01-2009, 03:40 PM
Manu Ginobili
http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/images/basketball/nba/players/3380.jpg
32 minutes, 30 points, nine rebounds, three assists, two steals
6-for-13 from the field, 0-for-4 on three-pointers, 18-for-18 at the line

In scoring a season-high 30 points, Manu Ginobili was stubbornly relentlessness. His 18-for-18 showing at the line was arguably the most important stat in the game. Ginobili’s attacking of the basket was vintage and hopefully a preview of what is to come. Part of the reason why Ginobili was so effective on the offensive end was his patience. He waited for the perfect time to attack against the Suns’ vulnerable defense instead of forcing the action when he saw a glimpse of open space. The patience also allowed him to not turn the ball over in his 32 minutes. When Ginobili wasn't hitting free throws, he mixed in acrobatic scores and a number of crisp passes, including the assist on Parker’s 22-foot clincher. Defensively, he didn’t make many mistakes and especially helped out with his nine defensive boards. A good sign for Ginobili is that he was so effective on offense despite not connecting on a three-pointer. In fact, the 30 points he scored was a career-high in a game in which he was held without a three-point make.
-------------------------------


How do you find this shit out? 82games.com???

And more improtantly, how did you have the insight to look that up?

timvp
02-01-2009, 04:08 PM
How do you find this shit out? 82games.com???

And more improtantly, how did you have the insight to look that up?

Game logs.

Figured it was the case because Manu's big games usually involve at least a few threes.

Slippy
02-02-2009, 07:09 AM
"Bareass nekkid" Manu had a plus/minus of -7 in eight minutes. "Clothed" Manu had a plus/minus of +21 in 18 minutes.

But yeah, Pop apparently only went with his "I'm going to keep clothes on Manu and not call plays for him" strategy for only the Suns game. It was back to the regularly scheduled broadcast against the Hornets.

Next time im gonna go re-check the game log before going by what i remember. He did play a 3min span in the Utah game. My mistake. Sitll think it's too soon in reverting back to Manu on his own. Yah the confidence is growing and we've seeing the Manu of old the last couple of games but playing with Tim or Tony has more benefits. The main one being not having the pressure to make things happen as the only creator. Also most his scores are coming from the flow of the offense and playing to his strengths.

Hopefully POP wont set it stone and make the adjustments when necessary.

TMTTRIO
02-02-2009, 09:17 AM
So if Manu has to play with Tim and Tony why don't they just start him instead of adjusting around him. Even Manu has said before that it would be easier to start to let his game come to him where when he comes off the bench he feels like he has to rush it and produce right away which can be bad for us. Mason can do just as well coming off the bench and bringing it.