Kings waive Gooden; Spurs next?

[Marcus Bryant]

Tit for tat...Elson would have had to contend with Shaq, and Shaq would have had to chase Elson around.

ROFL. That's the drunken Jim Bob basketball take:

"Whut I don't git is why dey don't make, uh, that Shack chase someone 'round the kart and tire his ass out?"

[VI_Massive]

Gooden won't be pretty, but I think he's a risk we need to take if we want to beat LA. We need a big who can score and rebound inside who is not named Tim Duncan. His defense will make us shudder and might earn him a spot on Pop's shit list, but we need to take this chance. He's a pro who has put up good numbers for years and there's a good chance he can provide some help where we need it. And unlike PMB, Gooden could actually see some playing time in the playoffs. No way was Pop ever going to play PMB in a meaningful spot in the playoffs. With Gooden, there's a chance.

[Marcus Bryant]

Duncan
Thomas
Bonner
Oberto
Mikan-Unseld

The Spurs lack frontcourt depth. Their 3rd best big is Matt Bonner. And somehow they're supposed to pass on Gooden for the minimum?

[urunobili]

12th man = Udoka.

:pctoss

[MaNu4Tres]

Purely your opinion and not backed up by any stats or the W-L record.




And there is absolutely no evidence that statement is true.



Lets compare the two spurs teams: If im wrong anyone please feel free to highlight and correct me

Spurs 07 vs. Spurs 09

Spurs 07 Spurs 09
Duncan < Duncan
Elson < Thomas
Manu = Manu
Parker = Parker
Barry < Mason
Finley < Finley
Vaughn < Hill
Horry = Bonner
Oberto > Oberto
Beno = Vaughn
Bonner = Udoka
Ely = Pops/Tolliver


In my opinion This Spurs team is more talented than the 07' team. And yes replacing Elson for Thomas made us better even last year. We just weren't as healthy as we were in 07 plus other contenders made significant upgrades.

[Oink Oink]

Lets compare the two spurs teams: If im wrong anyone please feel free to highlight and correct me

Spurs 07 vs. Spurs 09

Spurs 07 Spurs 09
Duncan < Duncan
Elson < Thomas
Manu = Manu
Parker = Parker
Barry < Mason
Finley < Finley
Vaughn < Hill
Horry = Bonner
Oberto > Oberto
Beno = Vaughn
Bonner = Udoka
Ely = Pops/Tolliver


In my opinion This Spurs team is more talented than the 07' team. And yes replacing Elson for Thomas made us better even last year. We just weren't as healthy as we were in 07 plus other contenders made significant upgrades.

07 Manu >> 09 Manu

[whottt]

Spurs 07 vs. Spurs 09

Spurs 07 Spurs 09
Duncan < Duncan
Elson < Thomas
Manu = Manu
Parker = Parker
Barry < Mason
Finley < Finley
Vaughn < Hill
Horry = Bonner
Oberto > Oberto
Beno = Vaughn
Bonner = Udoka
Ely = Pops/Tolliver


Ok let me see...I disagree with every single one of your evaluations except Oberto > Oberto and Bonner = Udoka

[DPG21920]

Whott: what do you think is the best option then?

[MaNu4Tres]

07 Manu >> 09 Manu

I give 07' Manu a slight edge on this years Manu. His stats are nearly identical from 07 except he shot 40 percent from three and not 34 percent like this year. In the playoffs he wasn't nearly as efficient except in the Jazz series. Manu was actually very inconsistant that playoff run in 07'.

[whottt]

If I'd known the Scola trade was going to lead to giving up first rounders for Thomas to not win NBA titles and compounding that mistake by signing Drew Gooden...I'd have been against it.

Bonner>Elson>Scola>Thomas>A turd>Gooden

[xtremesteven33]

Bonner>Elson>Scola>Thomas>A turd>Gooden


:lmao

[MaNu4Tres]

Ok let me see...I disagree with every single one of your evaluations except Oberto > Oberto and Bonner = Udoka

I'm not asking you. I've realized we disagree with just about everything probably even the color of the sky. I say blue what do u think?

[DPG21920]

Is the 12th man on the Spurs better than Gooden?

[timvp]

Shocking whottt never got the link. I wonder what year he's going to be able to let go of the sacks of Barry and Elson.


If I'd known the Scola trade was going to lead to giving up first rounders for Thomas to not win NBA titles and compounding that mistake by signing Drew Gooden...I'd have been against it.

Bonner>Elson>Scola>Thomas>A turd>Goodenwhottt wrong about the Scola trade. Now there's a shocker.

[Spurs Brazil]

There's a good chance that money knocks out two other teams. Orlando is a possibility given its paucity of frontcourt reserves and Gooden's previous history there, but I'm not sure how seriously people take the Magic's chances of contending since Jameer Nelson went out. At any rate, the Magic have used their midlevel and biannual exceptions this summer so they can offer him only the veteran's minimum.

Denver offers similar pros and cons for Gooden. The Nuggets have a thin frontcourt where he'd almost certainly earn minutes, but are pinned against the tax line, making it unlikely they could offer more than the minimum.

Do the math and one destination emerges as the most likely: San Antonio. The Spurs can give him a piece of their midlevel exception (about $1.5 million through the end of the season), a realistic path to a conference finals appearance at the least, and a chance to earn big chunks of minutes (Kurt Thomas and Fabricio Oberto have been found wanting all season).

The only problem, it seems, is saying it out loud: Drew Gooden on the Spurs? Really? The guy who's known for mental errors and has a medusa beard, signing on with the league's must buttoned-down, no-nonsense outfit?

But the logic on every other level is too strong to dismiss it. The Spurs have done this dance before, remember -- think of Cap'n Jack in 2003 -- and no matter what it will be only the second-most eyebrow-raising waiver pickup this winter (take a bow, Starbury).

And in this case, the Last Chance Saloon metaphor couldn't be more fitting. For a San Antonio team trying to squeeze one more title before what will likely be a wholesale restructuring around the Duncan-Parker nucleus in 2010, there's really not much choice -- they need to belly up to the bar and drink whatever's on tap, so to speak, because this is the only way to match up in the playoffs with the L.A.s and Utahs of the West.


John Hollinger writes for ESPN Insider. To e-mail him, click here.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=PERDiem-090302

[Marcus Bryant]

If I'd known the Scola trade was going to lead to giving up first rounders for Thomas to not win NBA titles and compounding that mistake by signing Drew Gooden...I'd have been against it.

Bonner>Elson>Scola>Thomas>A turd>Gooden

The Spurs aren't the Suns.

[whottt]

I'm not asking you. I've realized we disagree with just about everything probably even the color of the sky. I say blue what do u think?

I disagree that I disagree with everything you think. And Blue's good :tu

[xtremesteven33]

Drew Gooden as a Spur doesnt sound good but hopefully it looks good

[Marcus Bryant]

And in this case, the Last Chance Saloon metaphor couldn't be more fitting. For a San Antonio team trying to squeeze one more title before what will likely be a wholesale restructuring around the Duncan-Parker nucleus in 2010, there's really not much choice -- they need to belly up to the bar and drink whatever's on tap, so to speak, because this is the only way to match up in the playoffs with the L.A.s and Utahs of the West.

Even Hollinger can figure it out.

[whottt]

Elson will pay for that owning he gave me, if it's the last thing I ever do.

[FromWayDowntown]

Whott: what do you think is the best option then?

In general, this sums up my sentiment.

I don't, by any means, think that Drew Gooden is the preferable option to any number of other big men in the NBA as a whole. But at this point, there's a market of, what, 3 guys: Gooden, Smith, and Swift; and Smith appears to have already committed to Cleveland.

The Spurs have a need for a big guy. Gooden rebounds better than any big man the Spurs have (other than the no-brainer Hall of Famer) and he would give the Spurs something they've lacked for a while -- a guy who is a beast on the offensive glass and can make something happen immediately with a rebound.

Is he ideal? Hell no. Is he better than nothing? Absolutely.

I see the point about an elevated opponent's shooting percentage, but I'd be curious about a few things that go along with that:

1. Does Duncan's shot blocking and interior defense improve if he's not being made to worry about every defensive board because he's the only guy who can board?

2. I'm not aware of where the Spurs rank in 2nd chance points allowed this season; while their defensive rebounding rate leads the league, it certainly wouldn't hurt to further limit 2nd chance opportunities by having still another guy who can rebound. If they just take away 2 or 3 second chances per game, the defensive difference (at worst) seems to come out in the wash.

I'd also agree with the concerns about Gooden's above-the-neck game and think he's a bit fragile. But, again, are the status quo Spurs good enough to win a title? If not, is taking a flier on a guy who can step right in and rebound the basketball (if nothing else) worth the risk.

I think it is at this point.

[DAF86]

The Spurs defenitely need to sign Gooden. Maybe in a well coached contender with three hall of famers at his side he may give a damn about defense. If not, his athletic and rebounding ability plus Spurs team defense may help hide Drew's defensive flaws. And if that doesn't work either just sit him. Really a no risk situation IMO.

[picnroll]

Roll the dice.

One area that has hurt the Spurs badly in many games is giving up offensive rebounds. Gooden can turn the tables on that. I was even started to warm up to Bonzai hoping to start seeing a few O boards.

[whottt]

Look at that gorgeous green grass!

[timvp]

The Spurs lost the championship last year because they didn't have Elson. They will lose it this year because they don't have Barry. timvp won't get his link. MB has returned to commence my owning. Let's see if I can steer threads towards Barry and then pretend I don't like Barry anymore. I hate Kurt Thomas. I love Kurt Thomas! I hate Kurt Thomas.

[Marcus Bryant]

At least Kersey for Rahim was entertaining and would have improved the Spurs.

[TheDarkSide.]

So let's narrow down the list. It's not hard, actually. Boston has a full roster, L.A. has little chance of meaningful playing time, and the Cavs would be off the list too once they added Smith.
That takes us to the league's second tier of contenders, which looks roughly like: San Antonio, Orlando, Houston, Utah and perhaps Denver.
Of those, we can safely eliminate Utah (which simply has no need for another power forward) and probably Houston too (it has several decent big men and is up against the luxury-tax line).
There's a good chance that money knocks out two other teams. Orlando is a possibility given its paucity of frontcourt reserves and Gooden's previous history there, but I'm not sure how seriously people take the Magic's chances of contending since Jameer Nelson (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2439) went out. At any rate, the Magic have used their midlevel and biannual exceptions this summer so they can offer him only the veteran's minimum.
Denver offers similar pros and cons for Gooden. The Nuggets have a thin frontcourt where he'd almost certainly earn minutes, but are pinned against the tax line, making it unlikely they could offer more than the minimum.
Do the math and one destination emerges as the most likely: San Antonio. The Spurs can give him a piece of their midlevel exception (about $1.5 million through the end of the season), a realistic path to a conference finals appearance at the least, and a chance to earn big chunks of minutes (Kurt Thomas (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=846) and Fabricio Oberto (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2805) have been found wanting all season).
The only problem, it seems, is saying it out loud: Drew Gooden on the Spurs? Really? The guy who's known for mental errors and has a medusa beard, signing on with the league's must buttoned-down, no-nonsense outfit?
But the logic on every other level is too strong to dismiss it. The Spurs have done this dance before, remember -- think of Cap'n Jack in 2003 -- and no matter what it will be only the second-most eyebrow-raising waiver pickup this winter (take a bow, Starbury).
And in this case, the Last Chance Saloon metaphor couldn't be more fitting. For a San Antonio team trying to squeeze one more title before what will likely be a wholesale restructuring around the Duncan-Parker nucleus in 2010, there's really not much choice -- they need to belly up to the bar and drink whatever's on tap, so to speak, because this is the only way to match up in the playoffs with the L.A.s and Utahs of the West.

[TheDarkSide.]

So let's narrow down the list. It's not hard, actually. Boston has a full roster, L.A. has little chance of meaningful playing time, and the Cavs would be off the list too once they added Smith.
That takes us to the league's second tier of contenders, which looks roughly like: San Antonio, Orlando, Houston, Utah and perhaps Denver.
Of those, we can safely eliminate Utah (which simply has no need for another power forward) and probably Houston too (it has several decent big men and is up against the luxury-tax line).
There's a good chance that money knocks out two other teams. Orlando is a possibility given its paucity of frontcourt reserves and Gooden's previous history there, but I'm not sure how seriously people take the Magic's chances of contending since Jameer Nelson (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2439) went out. At any rate, the Magic have used their midlevel and biannual exceptions this summer so they can offer him only the veteran's minimum.
Denver offers similar pros and cons for Gooden. The Nuggets have a thin frontcourt where he'd almost certainly earn minutes, but are pinned against the tax line, making it unlikely they could offer more than the minimum.
Do the math and one destination emerges as the most likely: San Antonio. The Spurs can give him a piece of their midlevel exception (about $1.5 million through the end of the season), a realistic path to a conference finals appearance at the least, and a chance to earn big chunks of minutes (Kurt Thomas (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=846) and Fabricio Oberto (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2805) have been found wanting all season).
The only problem, it seems, is saying it out loud: Drew Gooden on the Spurs? Really? The guy who's known for mental errors and has a medusa beard, signing on with the league's must buttoned-down, no-nonsense outfit?
But the logic on every other level is too strong to dismiss it. The Spurs have done this dance before, remember -- think of Cap'n Jack in 2003 -- and no matter what it will be only the second-most eyebrow-raising waiver pickup this winter (take a bow, Starbury).
And in this case, the Last Chance Saloon metaphor couldn't be more fitting. For a San Antonio team trying to squeeze one more title before what will likely be a wholesale restructuring around the Duncan-Parker nucleus in 2010, there's really not much choice -- they need to belly up to the bar and drink whatever's on tap, so to speak, because this is the only way to match up in the playoffs with the L.A.s and Utahs of the West.

[TwelveGs210]

please even if we dont get gooden, lets waive udoka anyways..he made 2 jumpers last night, and thats about all i can remember about him all season..

[Cry Havoc]

PLEASE sign Gooden.

Would he seriously be worse than Fabs has been playing?

How can you pass on a guy like this? Even if he doesn't start for us, he could provide us with some great minutes off the bench.

[timaios]

Lets compare the two spurs teams: If im wrong anyone please feel free to highlight and correct me

Spurs 07 vs. Spurs 09

Spurs 07 Spurs 09
Duncan < Duncan
Elson < Thomas
Manu = Manu
Parker = Parker
Barry < Mason
Finley < Finley
Vaughn < Hill
Horry = Bonner
Oberto > Oberto
Beno = Vaughn
Bonner = Udoka
Ely = Pops/Tolliver


In my opinion This Spurs team is more talented than the 07' team. And yes replacing Elson for Thomas made us better even last year. We just weren't as healthy as we were in 07 plus other contenders made significant upgrades.

Lakers 2009 >>> Lakers 2007
Cavs 2009 >>> Cavs 2007
Celtics 2009 >>>>>> Celtics 2007

[whottt]

Jeff MacDonald will get put together two sentences I don't take a huge wh!z on before anyone will get away with typing a single positive letter about Elson on my watch. Elson must pay for what he did! No one owns timvp like that on his own board! No one!

[timvp]

I don't like the idea of Gooden starting at all. I view him as someone to give the Spurs some offense and rebounding when Tim goes to bench, and as 'no Finey @ the PF' insurance. I think this team is much better off with Bonner spreading the floor or Thomas playing post D in our starting lineup, based on the matchup. I wouldn't trust Gooden to guard NBA first units and I certainly don't want to see Tim Duncan in foul trouble trying to cover Gooden's mistakes.Eh, I just can't agree. Bonner's ability to spread the floor is helpful for whoever he's on the court with. Same with Thomas' defense and rebound. Gooden, on the other hand, needs for his defense to be covered up and to get into a game flow.

He reminds me somewhat of Nazr in that he's not a player that's going to find his own flow. If he's in your rotation, you better start him and force feed production out of him. And then get him out of the game once the fourth quarter arrives.

Bench players need to be smart, especially in the Spurs system in which Pop doesn't have a set rotation. Expecting Gooden to pick up exactly what is needed from off the bench after the flow and tempo has been set is asking too much.

[timvp]

Who is Jeff MacDonald and what is whottt talking about?

[DPG21920]

...


Whott: what do you think is the best option then?


Is the 12th man on the Spurs better than Gooden?

[Tully365]

At this point, the Spurs have about six hours (9 PM Pacific time) to add a player who will be eligible for the playoffs. Gooden rebounds, he's experienced, and he has size. Sure, his defense is poor, but so is Bonner's. If nothing else, Gooden could sub in for Bonner 12 mpg. He's a good free throw shooter, which could be helpful at the end of games when opposing teams are looking to foul. The question isn't whether or not he's perfect or if he's an all-star. The only question we should be asking is: Is obtaining Gooden for practically nothing, with no contractual obligation beyond this season, better than doing nothing? I just don't see how anyone couldn't answer yes to that question.

[Kindergarten Cop]

At this point, the Spurs have about six hours (9 PM Pacific time) to add a player who will be eligible for the playoffs.

Why are they limited to the next six hours? I'm pretty sure they can sign a player up until the end of the season and still have that player eligible for the playoff roster - as long as the player wasn't on another team's roster as of last night. Those that were bought out last night won't even clear waivers until Wednesday.

[VI_Massive]

Does anyone know the latest on Gooden's health?

[objective]

Gooden is just a jumpshooter who plays under the rim and isn't really a better rebounder than Thomas. Check out the per 40 rebounding numbers last year when KT was in Seattle, better than Gooden in either Cleveland or Chicago.

The only difference between the two is that KT plays defense, Gooden doesn't. Neither gets out on fast breaks for dunks, neither is a shotblocker. And KT isn't young enough to play 30 minutes a game every night.

And yes, Gooden is a lot like Nazr without the size or the limited shotblocking skills.

[Tully365]

Why are they limited to the next six hours? I'm pretty sure they can sign a player up until the end of the season and still have that player eligible for the playoff roster - as long as the player wasn't on another team's roster as of last night. Those that were bought out last night won't even clear waivers until Wednesday.

:lol Good catch. My mistake.

[xtremesteven33]

Low risk, High reward


nuff said

[FromWayDowntown]

One question that I haven't seen answered: is there any suggestion (other than reports from those who are speculating that Gooden makes sense for the Spurs) that the Spurs are actually pursuing Gooden?

[Spursfan092120]

One question that I haven't seen answered: is there any suggestion (other than reports from those who are speculating that Gooden makes sense for the Spurs) that the Spurs are actually pursuing Gooden?

Yeah..kinda. I copied and pasted only the parts that matter.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Duncan_starts_against_Trail_Blazers.html

By Mike Monroe (http://www.mysanantonio.com/email_us?contentID=40519142) - Express-News
PORTLAND, Ore.

Looking for help: According to one Western Conference executive, the Spurs are one of several championship contenders interested in signing forward Drew Gooden.
Gooden, acquired on trade deadline day by Sacramento, was released by the Kings on Sunday night, beating the league deadline for eligibility on another team’s playoff roster.
Gooden, a 6-foot-10 power forward in his seventh season, has had problems with a groin injury this season. He played his first game for the Kings on Feb. 25, when he scored 12 points and had 13 rebounds against Charlotte. But he left the game in the fourth period after aggravating the injury. He did not play in Sacramento’s next two games.

[MarHill]

Don Harris of WOAI is on ESPN Radio 1250 talking with Chris Duel and Jason Minnix and he said it looks like the Spurs are on tap to sign Gooden on Thursday.

The Spurs are doing their due diligence about Gooden's injury. Don feels that the Kings might have held him out because they were going to buy him out and the injury isn't as serious right now.

Also, Don reported that Joe Smith is going to the Cavs and Stromile Swift to the Suns.

:flag:

[FromWayDowntown]

Yeah..kinda. I copied and pasted only the parts that matter.

:tu

Thanks.

[EricB]

Stromile Swift to the Suns is a decent move for the Suns only because they have no one else to fill in.

Smith to the Cavs was elementary.


We shall see how Gooden fits in, I have my questions and reservations however.

[MarHill]

Stromile Swift to the Suns is a decent move for the Suns only because they have no one else to fill in.

Smith to the Cavs was elementary.


We shall see how Gooden fits in, I have my questions and reservations however.

I'm with you, EricB!

But he is a starter and he can help the Spurs! Also, don't forget the money factor. He wants another contract for next season.

Pro athletes are always (mostly) motivated about getting more money. Look at Lamar Odom!!

:flag:

[EricB]

I'm with you, EricB!

But he is a starter and he can help the Spurs! Also, don't forget the money factor. He wants another contract for next season.

Pro athletes are always (mostly) motivated about getting more money. Look at Lamar Odom!!

:flag:

Contract motivation doesn't improve BB IQ unfortunately.

It definately can't hurt if he brings the right attitude.

[Marcus Bryant]

Don Harris of WOAI is on ESPN Radio 1250 talking with Chris Duel and Jason Minnix and he said it looks like the Spurs are on tap to sign Gooden on Thursday.

The Spurs are doing their due diligence about Gooden's injury. Don feels that the Kings might have held him out because they were going to buy him out and the injury isn't as serious right now.

Also, Don reported that Joe Smith is going to the Cavs and Stromile Swift to the Suns.

:flag:


Pops Kunta-Kinte it is.

[EricB]

That 10 day contract is almost up I believe....

[MarHill]

Contract motivation doesn't improve BB IQ unfortunately.

It definately can't hurt if he brings the right attitude.

Yes, that's probably true.

But if Gooden shows he can be a contributor to a playoff-tested, championship contending team...his value goes up in the offseason.

And if he gets a ring.....that's even better!

[MarHill]

Pops Kunta-Kinte it is.

Yeah, Marcus I believe Pops will be waived.

I will wait and see on Thursday..because you know things can change quickly!!!

[MaNu4Tres]

Wednesday night/ Thursday morning is when the 10 day contract to Pops Ali-Bonsu expires so signing Gooden thursday makes sense.

[silk]

I understand your reasoning, Timvp, but i like bonner with timmy and tony , and i think kurt thomas will also be solid come play off time, so there's only spot duty on the bench, scoring some point in the paint when timmy's out, a little time here, a litlle minutes heres

i see him more like a point burster off the bench


4th big

and i really hope we sign him, for the rest of the mle, we just can not not go after him

[MaNu4Tres]

I understand your reasoning, Timvp, but i like bonner with timmy and tony , and i think kurt thomas will also be solid come play off time, so there's only spot duty on the bench, scoring some point in the paint when timmy's out, a little time here, a litlle minutes heres

i see him more like a point burster off the bench


4th big

and i really hope we sign him, for the rest of the mle, we just can not not go after him

Gooden has the skills to take Bonner and Kurts minutes but it won't happen quickly. I see Pop bringing in gooden off the bench for maybe 15 -18 minutes a game for his first 5-10 games until he starts getting his assignments somewhat down and earns more minutes. Ultimately in the end, I see Gooden starting next to Tim and getting 25-28 mpg with Bonner and Kurt coming off the bench with Manu and Bruce.

[Spursfan092120]

:tu

Thanks.

Not a problem... :toast

[Marcus Bryant]

Yeah, Marcus I believe Pops will be waived.

I will wait and see on Thursday..because you know things can change quickly!!!

No, I mean Pops will be the Spurs' 5th big if that's what those knuckleheads are reporting.

[justinandimcool]

Is there a difference between waving Pops and sending him back down to Austin? Would they be one and the same thing?

[MateoNeygro]

So let's narrow down the list. It's not hard, actually. Boston has a full roster, L.A. has little chance of meaningful playing time, and the Cavs would be off the list too once they added Smith.
That takes us to the league's second tier of contenders, which looks roughly like: San Antonio, Orlando, Houston, Utah and perhaps Denver.
Of those, we can safely eliminate Utah (which simply has no need for another power forward) and probably Houston too (it has several decent big men and is up against the luxury-tax line).
There's a good chance that money knocks out two other teams. Orlando is a possibility given its paucity of frontcourt reserves and Gooden's previous history there, but I'm not sure how seriously people take the Magic's chances of contending since Jameer Nelson (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2439) went out. At any rate, the Magic have used their midlevel and biannual exceptions this summer so they can offer him only the veteran's minimum.
Denver offers similar pros and cons for Gooden. The Nuggets have a thin frontcourt where he'd almost certainly earn minutes, but are pinned against the tax line, making it unlikely they could offer more than the minimum.
Do the math and one destination emerges as the most likely: San Antonio. The Spurs can give him a piece of their midlevel exception (about $1.5 million through the end of the season), a realistic path to a conference finals appearance at the least, and a chance to earn big chunks of minutes (Kurt Thomas (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=846) and Fabricio Oberto (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=2805) have been found wanting all season).
The only problem, it seems, is saying it out loud: Drew Gooden on the Spurs? Really? The guy who's known for mental errors and has a medusa beard, signing on with the league's must buttoned-down, no-nonsense outfit?
But the logic on every other level is too strong to dismiss it. The Spurs have done this dance before, remember -- think of Cap'n Jack in 2003 -- and no matter what it will be only the second-most eyebrow-raising waiver pickup this winter (take a bow, Starbury).
And in this case, the Last Chance Saloon metaphor couldn't be more fitting. For a San Antonio team trying to squeeze one more title before what will likely be a wholesale restructuring around the Duncan-Parker nucleus in 2010, there's really not much choice -- they need to belly up to the bar and drink whatever's on tap, so to speak, because this is the only way to match up in the playoffs with the L.A.s and Utahs of the West.

That was so gangster!

[Marcus Bryant]

Is there a difference between waving Pops and sending him back down to Austin? Would they be one and the same thing?

If you need a roster spot, they would be different.

[FromWayDowntown]

Is there a difference between waving Pops and sending him back down to Austin? Would they be one and the same thing?

For the Spurs to send Pops to Austin directly and have him there exclusively for a call-up, he has to be one of the 15 players on their roster.

I can't imagine that a release by the Spurs would prohibit Pops from resigning with the Toros and continuing to play in something resembling the Spurs' system; but unless he's under contract with the Spurs, he can be called up by any team in the league if it so chooses.

[Spursfan092120]

If you need a roster spot, they would be different.

Yeah..and someone else could pick him and up store him...that would suck.

[Kindergarten Cop]

:lol Good catch. My mistake.

No problem.:toast

[Spursfan092120]

WOAI Channel 4..Don Harris is about to talk about Gooden.

[Spursfan092120]

Harris' sources say Gooden will wind up with the Spurs, and might be signed by Thursday.

[EricB]

Yeah it's pretty much a done deal.

[Spursfan092120]

Yeah it's pretty much a done deal.

What do you think about it?

[Russ]

Harris' sources say Gooden will wind up with the Spurs, and might be signed by Thursday.

In retrospect, I think we will be saying that this was a red-letter date.:flag:

[The Truth #6]

If they're smart they'll cut JV since he's the one who doesn't even play anyway. Gooden is only going to be around for the rest of this season. There is no way this guy ends up with us next year. I'd take a chance on Gooden, keep Pop as an investment for the future, and get rid of JV.

If JV has to play any minutes in the playoffs, then that implies something is seriously wrong anyway. Mason is a better option at the 1 then JV. Give JV a job next year as an asst. coach, if not this year for the remainder of this year.

[EricB]

What do you think about it?


I think for the money it's a great signing but I don't look for him to be the savior or anything.

[Marcus Bryant]

Let's face it, Matt Bonner is no defensive stalwart, yet somehow the Spurs have the 5th best record in the NBA with him as their starting center and with however many games lost between their big 3.

I think acquiring Camby for George Hill would have made for a red letter date. Getting a 27 year old big who can put up 12 and 8 for the minimum is not a bad deal, especially when your 3rd best bigman is Matt Bonner.

[Spursfan092120]

I think for the money it's a great signing but I don't look for him to be the savior or anything.
Agreed 100%. Question is..will he be a Spur next year? I doubt it.

[SenorSpur]

ESPN's Mark Stein was just on the local Mavs pregame show (his usual appearance) and he confirmed what we already know - Spurs are indeed the frontrunners for Gooden. He claimed it would be between Spurs and Cavs, yet because the Cavs are almost certainly going to sign Joe Smith, Gooden would be the logical choice for the Spurs. He claims the reason the Spurs are the frontrunners is because they have a portion of their mid-level exception still available, whereas other possible lower-tier suitors (Mavs, Hornets) do not.

Another interesting note that he pointed out was the Fakers actually did make an inquiry about Gooden. However, it was just a possible ploy attempt to keep him from the Spurs. However with the expectation that Bynum would be coming back soon, it didn't make a lot of sense for them.

[EricB]

Let's face it, Matt Bonner is no defensive stalwart, yet somehow the Spurs have the 5th best record in the NBA with him as their starting center and with however many games lost between their big 3.

I think acquiring Camby for George Hill would have made for a red letter date. Getting a 27 year old big who can put up 12 and 8 for the minimum is not a bad deal, especially when your 3rd best bigman is Matt Bonner.


Agreed although I have to disagree with the tone of your post regarding matt bonner.

[dbestpro]

Prediction: Gooden signs with the Spurs and becomes the darling new Spur to Spurs fans matching their same surprise they had in Mason. Gooden provides average defense which is enough along side Duncan. His real value shows as he averages double digit rebounds and provides inside offense when Duncan is on the bench. In the end it becomes apparent that Gooden has never played along the likes of Duncan and it helps him elevate his game. The play of Gooden and Duncan as they learn to work off of one another shocks the pundits and propels the Spurs to the NBA finals. The Lakers cry foul because they never played the Spurs, but got eliminated in the first round by another Texas team.
Let the insults begin.

[MarHill]

No, I mean Pops will be the Spurs' 5th big if that's what those knuckleheads are reporting.

My fault, Marcus!

I read your post wrong!!

[MarHill]

Prediction: Gooden signs with the Spurs and becomes the darling new Spur to Spurs fans matching their same surprise they had in Mason. Gooden provides average defense which is enough along side Duncan. His real value shows as he averages double digit rebounds and provides inside offense when Duncan is on the bench. In the end it becomes apparent that Gooden has never played along the likes of Duncan and it helps him elevate his game. The play of Gooden and Duncan as they learn to work off of one another shocks the pundits and propels the Spurs to the NBA finals. The Lakers cry foul because they never played the Spurs, but got eliminated in the first round by another Texas team.
Let the insults begin.

That would be the best scenario possible and another Christmas present in June!!!

:lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt: :lobt:(It's time for 5!!!!!)

[xtremesteven33]

People here are really not considering that Gooden does have the NBA Finals experience and the playoff savvy that will help him here on the Spurs.

A big that can create his own shot and rebound very well besides Duncan for the minimum???

You cant beat that guys.

[BlackSwordsMan]

this is just going to be another 35+ page rasheed thread and gooden will sign with some other team

[xtremesteven33]

this is just going to be another 35+ page rasheed thread and gooden will sign with some other team

:lol


it really wouldnt surprise me.

[dbestpro]

Of interest is that Parker is only 8 months younger than Gooden. He would be the second youngest veteran player on the team at 27. Younger than Mason and younger than Bonner.

[SenorSpur]

Does anyone here envision this potential Gooden acquisition as a possible fit beyond this season?

[MaNu4Tres]

Does anyone here envision this potential Gooden acquisition as a possible fit beyond this season?

It all depends what happens from here til hopefully June.

[SenorSpur]

The last time the Spurs brought aboard a 28 year-old, reserve, power forward (Ely), they walked off the court in June with their 4th championship. Even though Ely was a non-factor. :lol

I'll say this, if this Gooden acquisition does occur, I'll like our chances, versus the Fakers in a 7-game series, a helluva a lot more than I do now.

[benefactor]

Does anyone here envision this potential Gooden acquisition as a possible fit beyond this season?
Probably not. He is going to want a new deal this summer and will likely be asking for too much money...that is, if he is expecting a raise.

I would rather dangle the MLE in front of Rasheed Wallace.

[Spursfan092120]

Probably not. He is going to want a new deal this summer and will likely be asking for too much money...that is, if he is expecting a raise.

I would rather dangle the MLE in front of Rasheed Wallace.

ditto

[xtremesteven33]

The last time the Spurs brought aboard a 28 year-old, reserve, power forward (Ely), they walked off the court in June with their 4th championship. Even though Ely was a non-factor. :lol

I'll say this, if this Gooden acquisition does occur, I'll like our chances, versus the Fakers in a 7-game series, a helluva a lot more than I do now.



Hell yea man.

lets not forget that Gooden is quick on his feet and is 6'10''....guess who the Lakers have thats quick on his feet and is also 6'10''

Odom.

Lets see what he can do.

[MaNu4Tres]

The last time the Spurs brought aboard a 28 year-old, reserve, power forward (Ely), they walked off the court in June with their 4th championship. Even though Ely was a non-factor. :lol

I'll say this, if this Gooden acquisition does occur, I'll like our chances, versus the Fakers in a 7-game series, a helluva a lot more than I do now.

lol I'm pretty sure Gooden will be more of a factor than Ely.

[poop]

if we get gooden i hope we still keep POPS.

[HarlemHeat37]

meh, I'm not worried about Odom at all..

as for Gooden, the only way he'll be back with the team is if we make it to the finals..if he helps us get that far, I'll be happy to have him back for the right price..let's not get ahead of ourselves though, he might not even be a Spur this season..

there's no doubt that he would help us though, especially for the price..

interesting stat..

in 32 games played this season where he has played 944 minutes, Drew Gooden has been to the FT line 99 times..in 57 games/55 games/37 games where they've played 1361/930/576 minutes respectively, Bonner, Thomas, and Oberto have combined for 70 FT attempts..

[SenorSpur]

Probably not. He is going to want a new deal this summer and will likely be asking for too much money...that is, if he is expecting a raise.

I would rather dangle the MLE in front of Rasheed Wallace.

F*ck yeah! x 10.

[SenorSpur]

meh, I'm not worried about Odom at all..

as for Gooden, the only way he'll be back with the team is if we make it to the finals..if he helps us get that far, I'll be happy to have him back for the right price..let's not get ahead of ourselves though, he might not even be a Spur this season..

You're right. However, at this point, it would take some extraordinary circumstance for this acquisition to go "belly up". But you're right. I'm just glad the Spurs are in line to get some badly-needed frontline help.

[exstatic]

Gooden will be a piece for the stretch run, and that'll be it. There's a reason he is 27, in his 7th season, yet on his 7th team when he signs here or somewhere. He's been traded 4 times already, 3 times in the middle of the season. He'll score some and rebound some, and that's it. He doesn't block shots, or play even passable defense. He won't just blow his own assignments, he won't rotate to cover his teammates. He will seriously give Fin a run for the title of worst defender on the squad. I can't imagine Pop standing him for more than the balance of the season.

That being said, he'll be the best "other" big man scorer and rebounder since David hung up his kicks. His man's going to get 30 every night, though.

[whottt]

...



I answered your question about what I think the best option is...I just didn't quote you when I did it.

[lefty]

The last time the Spurs brought aboard a 28 year-old, reserve, power forward (Ely), they walked off the court in June with their 4th championship. Even though Ely was a non-factor. :lol

I'll say this, if this Gooden acquisition does occur, I'll like our chances, versus the Fakers in a 7-game series, a helluva a lot more than I do now.

To be fair, Gooden >>>> Ely

[whottt]

I don't think Ely's a good comparison...Nazr Mohammed without the high basketball IQ and great defense would be a better one.

Ely doesn't do anything paticularly well...offense, defense, or rebounding.


Mark my words...the guy bitching the loudest and saying Gooden sucks when he starts blowing defensive assignments will be one..

tim
v
p

And he is not as good of an offensive player as Bonner is...not this season, not on this team.

[MaNu4Tres]

I don't understand how people are bashing Gooden just because of the fact that hes played on 5 NBA teams.

Many good players in the NBA have played on multiple teams. IE Roger Mason

[xtremesteven33]

Shaq has played with 4 teams :lol

[whottt]

I don't understand how people are bashing Gooden just because of the fact that hes played on 5 NBA teams.

Many good players in the NBA have played on multiple teams. IE Roger Mason

As you saw, I bashed Gooden long before I ever had any inkling he'd a be a Spur. At some point people eople get smart and figure out there's more to the game that just stats...and that's all Gooden is is stats.

Any team that needs him to contribute significantly to win a title...is not going to win a title.

[exstatic]

Does anyone here envision this potential Gooden acquisition as a possible fit beyond this season?

No. Pop would be incarcerated for killing him for bad defense.

[MaNu4Tres]

As you saw, I bashed Gooden long before I ever had any inkling he'd a be a Spur. At some point people eople get smart and figure out there's more to the game that just stats...and that's all Gooden is is stats.

Any team that needs him to contribute significantly to win a title...is not going to win a title.

So i guess Pop and R.C don't know what their doing when they are going after him?

[xtremesteven33]

As you saw, I bashed Gooden long before I ever had any inkling he'd a be a Spur. At some point people eople get smart and figure out there's more to the game that just stats...and that's all Gooden is is stats.

Any team that needs him to contribute significantly to win a title...is not going to win a title.



We dont NEED him to win a title.:sleep

[exstatic]

I don't understand how people are bashing Gooden just because of the fact that hes played on 5 NBA teams.

Many good players in the NBA have played on multiple teams. IE Roger Mason

He played a game for Sacto, so that's 6, plus whatever team he signs with. That'll be 7 teams in not quite 7 seasons.

Teams keep getting rid of him, teams that aren't as particular about player personnel as SA is.

[Manu-of-steel]

gooden is a good player, compared to ely and nazr. he also has a jumpshot. if he's coachable, maybe he can be our primary defender against odom, nowitzki, or even boozer. i think we have a better chance of getting that 5th ring. according to a wojnarowski column, the spurs are in the best position to sign him. i say, go get him! we'll take it from there.

[whottt]

So i guess Pop and R.C don't know what their doing when they are going after him?

Pretty much...you hear timvp trashing Elson? Guess who signed him?

Yeap...Pop and RC.

Jackie Butler?

Pop and RC.

You know who drafted that guy named Leandro Barbosa that plays in Phoenix and gave him away for nothing? Pop and RC.

That guy Udoka who is the regining board bitch?

Pop and RC.

Beno Udrih?

Pop and RC.


You want I should go on or are you willing to stop acting like they are beyond questioning?

Because they most certainly aren't.

[whottt]

We dont NEED him to win a title.:sleep

Then what's the point of signing him? Why not sign someone that can help us win a title?

[024]

gooden will want a bigger paycheck in the summer but until then, he's gonna have to play his hardest to get a raise. players usually play their best during a contract year. see vujacic and odom (when he's starting). just don't look at udoka.

[MaNu4Tres]

He played a game for Sacto, so that's 6, plus whatever team he signs with. That'll be 7 teams in not quite 7 seasons.

Teams keep getting rid of him, teams that aren't as particular about player personnel as SA is.

No sacramento would make 5. I don't count sacramento. One of the main reasons cleveland got rid of him was to match salaries to get rid of Larry Hughes ridiculously overpaid contract. Sacramento got rid of him because of their youth movement/ financial situation/ and plus Gooden requested being bought out. So sacramento basically saved 1.8 million on a player thats not part of their future due to the gems in Spencer Hawes and Jason Thompson.

There's a reason why Pop and R.C elected to go after Gooden. Obviously they see more positives than negatives. And for you to say with Gooden out there opposing teams bigs will avg. 30 points a night is a very irrational and overreacting statement.

[MaNu4Tres]

Then what's the point of signing him? Why not sign someone that can help us win a title?

Who is out there thats better than Gooden that could help us win a title then?

[whottt]

Who is out there thats better than Gooden that could help us win a title then?

Well Joe Smith for one...

Oh wait, while you're sitting here talking about how bad the Cavs want Gooden, they went out and signed Smith.


Could it because they value defense on that team and Gooden is the worst bigman in the league at playing it?

I think so...

[picnroll]

Gooden is a fallback position after going after Rasheed, Camby, Mourning, probably Joe Smith, who knows maybe Miki Moore. Dreaming about Krstic. They know they need a big and that's what's left. Beggars can't be choosers.

[Creation88]

Joe Smith reportedly already scooped up by the Cavs.

[picnroll]

Well Joe Smith for one...

Oh wait, while you're sitting here talking about how bad the Cavs want Gooden, they went out and signed Smith.


Could it because they value defense on that team and Gooden is the worst bigman in the league at playing it?

I think so...
Did Smith want to sign with the Spurs over the Cavs? Do you know that the Spurs didn't try to get him and couldn't?

[whottt]

Um...Beggars can be choosers if one of their choices is shit. In fact you just Sacramento take a pass on shit.

[MaNu4Tres]

Well Joe Smith for one...

Oh wait, while you're sitting here talking about how bad the Cavs want Gooden, they went out and signed Smith.


Could it because they value defense on that team and Gooden is the worst bigman in the league at playing it?

I think so...


It was stated in multiple sites that Cleveland was interested in Gooden as well as Smith. I never had a hard on for how Cleveland was salivating on the idea of Gooden coming back.
So what if Gooden said no to the Cavs. You and I don't know who called who first. Gooden could have been butt hurt from being traded from Cleveland and had his mind made up from the get go that he's coming here. Fact is there's hundreds of big men out there via Dleague/ Free agency. And the Spurs obviously think Gooden can help this team win a title.

And please don't compare Jackie Butler or Elsons signing to Goodens. Gooden is a better player of both players you just mentioned and the rest of the bigs we have outside of Duncan.

[picnroll]

Um...Beggars can be choosers if one of their choices is shit. In fact you just Sacramento take a pass on shit.
Sac had no future use for Gooden, they're entirely in a rebuilding mode, going young and Gooden saved them a little money which, given the state of Vegas, I'm pretty sure the Maloofs can use. I'm not hot on Gooden but he can't hurt.

[whottt]

Did Smith want to sign with the Spurs over the Cavs? Do you know that the Spurs didn't try to get him and couldn't?

Next up Robert Horry. He knows the system...and will act as an enforcer if nothing else.



You know what you guys are doing?


You see food so you're eating...

You're not actually hungry, you don't even really like this kind of food...it's just food and it's in front of your face, so you eat it.

It does not matter that your not hungry now...because you will almost certainly be hungry later, even though eating this food now will not prevent you from being hungry later but you think the best course of action is to eat it anyway...when really there's absolutely no essential reason to eat it.

Then you sit around wondering why you're 20lbs overweight...

[picnroll]

Next up Robert Horry. He knows the system...and will act as an enforcer if nothing else.



You know what you guys are doing?


You see food so you're eating...

You're not actually hungry, you don't even really like this kind of food...it's just food and it's in front of your face, so you eat it. Then you sit around wondering why you're 20lbs overweight...
Not really. I personally think Spurs as stands have a 1 in 100 chance of the title and maybe Gooden would up it to 1 in 99, maybe 98.

Horry's done. He probably weighs 300 lbs by now.

[whottt]

Sac had no future use for Gooden

And that's saying something...because they consider Beno Udrih a savior...and he's about the same age Gooden is.



they're entirely in a rebuilding mode, going young and Gooden saved them a little money which, given the state of Vegas, I'm pretty sure the Maloofs can use.

So wait...they don't need Gooden's services but we do?

Hmmm...




I'm not hot on Gooden but he can't hurt.

Right...this might keep us from starving later. Best to not let it go to waste :tu

[Spursmania]

I'm not overweight and I still want Gooden.

[exstatic]

No sacramento would make 5. I don't count sacramento. One of the main reasons cleveland got rid of him was to match salaries to get rid of Larry Hughes ridiculously overpaid contract. Sacramento got rid of him because of their youth movement/ financial situation/ and plus Gooden requested being bought out. So sacramento basically saved 1.8 million on a player thats not part of their future due to the gems in Spencer Hawes and Jason Thompson.

There's a reason why Pop and R.C elected to go after Gooden. Obviously they see more positives than negatives. And for you to say with Gooden out there opposing teams bigs will avg. 30 points a night is a very irrational and overreacting statement.
I've SEEN him on the defensive side of the court. (Notice that I didn't say I'd seen him play defense, or even try to play defense. No one ever has) He's fucking awful. Sean was laughing at him on the telecast a few years ago, he's that bad. Saying he plays Ole' defense is an insult to all of the Ole' defenders of the NBA.

HE SUCKS ASS ON DEFENSE.

[MaNu4Tres]

So wait...they don't need Gooden's services but we do?

Hmmm...






Kind of like Seattle's situation last year. They had young pieces in place. They didn't need Barry to cut some of their young players minutes that they were trying to develop. So they decided to release him. It doesn't take anything away from Barry. Same for Gooden. But your too ignorant to understand that.

[MaNu4Tres]

I've SEEN him on the defensive side of the court. (Notice that I didn't say I'd seen him play defense, or even try to play defense. No one ever has) He's fucking awful. Sean was laughing at him on the telecast a few years ago, he's that bad. Saying he plays Ole' defense is an insult to all of the Ole' defenders of the NBA.

HE SUCKS ASS ON DEFENSE.

Saying he sucks ass on defense is like me saying we shouldn't play bowen because he SUCKS ASS ON offense or we shouldn't play mason because HE SUCKS ASS AT PENETRATING. OR how we shouldn't play finley because HE SUCKS ASS ON Defense. just stop it with the overreacting and nitpicking on one flaw he might have and exploiting it. Gooden is a superior rebounder and has the ability and skills to contribute in more ways than any other of our bigs outside of Duncan. If you disagree with that you are just a biased homer Bonner Oberto nut.

[picnroll]

And that's saying something...because they consider Beno Udrih a savior...and he's about the same age Gooden is.

There were reports they were trying to dump Beno and the mistake they made in signing him too.


So wait...they don't need Gooden's services but we do?

Hmmm...
They didn't need Salmons either. I guess he's crap too since Sac had no use for him. They don't need anybody that won't contribute 3- 5 years from now when they might be a contender.






Right...this might keep us from starving later. Best to not let it go to waste :tu
I'm not high on Gooden but apart from the mythical Joe Smith, Mourning that wouldn't come out of retirement, Krstic the Spurs couldn't afford, Camby that the Clippers wouldn't trade and Rasheed that the Pistons wouldn't release who you got? Horry that looked like shit last year and is probably a lot better now rested and completely out of shape?

[EricB]

Saying he sucks ass on defense is like me saying we shouldn't play bowen because he SUCKS ASS ON offense or we shouldn't play mason because HE SUCKS ASS AT PENETRATING. OR how we shouldn't play finley because HE SUCKS ASS ON Defense. just stop it with the overreacting and nitpicking on one flaw he might have and exploiting it.


He will become the worst defender on the team. Easily.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Gooden may not be the greatest defender but he is easily better than any of our bigs outside of TD.

Sorry, but with the makeup of this 2009 Spurs team a championship is going to take one hell of an effort. Why not ease the pressure by getting a servicable big that can actually score the ball inside of 3 feet.


I also pray that should this signing happen, that Pop waives Udoka who has regressed into one of the worst players in the NBA. I don't even know if Udoka would last in the D League if he was allowed to go back, much less the NBA.


But knowing Pop, he'll probably waive Pops instead.

[Marcus Bryant]

He rebounds better than defensive savants Matt Bonner and Fabricio Oberto.

[MaNu4Tres]

He will become the worst defender on the team. Easily.

That's your opinion. In my opinion Gooden has the skills and ability to contribute in more ways than any big we have if he buys into our system. And in my opinion compared to the defensive monsters in Bonner and Oberto, Gooden isn't much worse.

[Marcus Bryant]

He's an above average rebounder, average scorer with an average jumper and a below average defender. All in all, he'd be the 3rd best bigman on the team. Yes, that does say something about the decline in depth in the Spurs frontcourt, but at this point the answer is obvious if he will sign. I'm not sure what the opposing argument is here. He sucks so bad the Spurs should go into the playoffs with 4 experienced bigmen and only 2 who are really worth a damn? A few of you make no sense whatsoever.

[exstatic]

That's your opinion. In my opinion Gooden has the skills and ability to contribute in more ways than any big we have if he buys into our system. And in my opinion compared to the defensive monsters in Bonner and Oberto, Gooden isn't much worse.

Compared to Gooden, those guys ARE defensive monsters.

[whottt]

I'm not overweight and I still want Gooden.

Once your metabolism slows down you'll regret these sorts of bad habits and indulging them.

You heard it here first.

[MaNu4Tres]

Compared to Gooden, those guys ARE defensive monsters.

how much are bonner and oberto paying you? I want in on this.

[m33p0]

It should have happened already by this time?
he has to clear waivers first... which is on wednesday.

[picnroll]

General question:

Is Gooden's poor defense more lack of ability, lack of effort or a combination of the two? To me he seems to have the athleticism to be a decent defender if he made an effort.

[EricB]

General question:

Is Gooden's poor defense more lack of ability, lack of effort or a combination of the two? To me he seems to have the athleticism to be a decent defender if he made an effort.

Lack of effort and BBall IQ IMO.

[MaNu4Tres]

General question:

Is Gooden's poor defense more lack of ability, lack of effort or a combination of the two? To me he seems to have the athleticism to be a decent defender if he made an effort.

They claim its his basketball IQ. But the dude went to Kansas so I don't think his BB IQ is as low as they claim. Even though he may not be a dikembe defensive force from the mid 90's, I think he has the mobility to defend quicker 4's in the league.

[Chief]

I'm happy spurs are looking to pick someone up but Drew Gooden's a piece, but not the big tall bulky center we need. He's a scoring big man, we need defense and blocked shots.

[Manufan909]

As a Spurs fan apologist I blame the lack of fluoridation in San Antonio de Bexar's water system.

I guess you missed the thread asserting that Kunta-Kinte is the next Rodman?

Anyways, those who are madly in love with Kunta brought up the choice. Those of us who manage to inhabit reality for a small portion of the day made the obvious call.

Constantly putting Kunta-Kinte instead of his real name, or at the very least PMB, is fucking pathetic and racist. Since Mensah-Bonsu is too hard for you to spell out, just stick with the initials. I get your point, but using race to make fun of him is low, especially for you.

Getting back to the topic, what is Gooden offensive repertoire? Does he have a decent post game? I guess we wouldn't see it if he gets most of his minutes alongside Tim, but it'd be cool to see if he was paired with any of the other bigs. Or even with Tim, if he decides to set up for a bank, so there is always someone putting pressure on the opponents interior D.

[EricB]

I'm happy spurs are looking to pick someone up but Drew Gooden's a piece, but not the big tall bulky center we need. He's a scoring big man, we need defense and blocked shots.


No kidding!??!

Where is that bigman at?

I'm still waiting for someone to answer that.

[EricB]

Constantly putting Kunta-Kinte instead of his real name, or at the very least PMB, is fucking pathetic and racist. Since Mensah-Bonsu is too hard for you to spell out, just stick with the initials. I get your point, but using race to make fun of him is low, especially for you.

Getting back to the topic, what is Gooden offensive repertoire? Does he have a decent post game? I guess we wouldn't see it if he gets most of his minutes alongside Tim, but it'd be cool to see if he was paired with any of the other bigs. Or even with Tim, if he decides to set up for a bank, so there is always someone putting pressure on the opponents interior D.


:lmao

STFU

It isn't even close to racism.

learn what racism is first dumbass.

[Spursmania]

Compared to Gooden, those guys ARE defensive monsters.

:lmao:lmao:lmao
Please stop, you're killing me...

[EricB]

:lmao:lmao:lmao
Please stop, you're killing me...


Gooden = Bruce Bowen version of the bigman apparently.

[MaNu4Tres]

No kidding!??!

Where is that bigman at?

I'm still waiting for someone to answer that.

The great Robert Horry according to whott.

[Marcus Bryant]

Constantly putting Kunta-Kinte instead of his real name, or at the very least PMB, is fucking pathetic and racist. Since Mensah-Bonsu is too hard for you to spell out, just stick with the initials. I get your point, but using race to make fun of him is low, especially for you.

Oh fucking lighten up. The perpetually offended and humorless such as yourself offer all the more reason to do so.




Getting back to the topic, what is Gooden offensive repertoire? Does he have a decent post game? I guess we wouldn't see it if he gets most of his minutes alongside Tim, but it'd be cool to see if he was paired with any of the other bigs. Or even with Tim, if he decides to set up for a bank, so there is always someone putting pressure on the opponents interior D.

Garbage points and the occassional jumper.

[EricB]

The great Robert Horry according to whott.


I'd honestly still rather have Horry.

If you thought Elson was maddening, damn, you guys are gonna be pissed at Gooden.

[MaNu4Tres]

http://www2.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/players/Drew_Gooden/

Assets
A fluid and smooth post player. An above-average rebounder who can dominate on the boards. A solid mid-range scorer who has some decent post moves. Makes an effort on defense. Hits his free-throws.

http://hoopshype.com/players/drew_gooden.htm

Has great agility, athleticism and mobility... Great rebounding skills... Effective hook shot... A much more consistent player now than he was in the past... Understands his role as a hustle player.
Flaws
Inconsistency has dogged him throughout his career. Not the shot-blocker he could be. Can be a little passive on offense.
Career potential
Above-average post presence.

[MaNu4Tres]

I'd honestly still rather have Horry.

If you thought Elson was maddening, damn, you guys are gonna be pissed at Gooden.

Elson wasn't coached by Roy Williams at Kansas for 3 years was he? Putting Gooden's BBIQ in the same boat as Elson's isn't justifiable.

[tav1]

:lmao

STFU

It isn't even close to racism.

learn what racism is first dumbass.

Eric: humor me. What definition of racism are you working with?

And why would you choose the name Kunta Kinte in place of Mensah-Bonsu? Where is the tie in? What's the joke?

For the record, I don't think you are racist or intended to make a racist statement. But I'm also not surprised that some would take the Kunta Kinte name swap in a weird way because of the whole slave trade context. In other words, you're playing with euphemistic fire. Pops Mensah-Bonsu = Kunta Kinte = slave.

[EricB]

Elson wasn't coached by Roy Williams at Kansas for 3 years was he? Putting Gooden's BBIQ in the same boat as Elson's isn't justifiable.


So because he went to Kansas = smart?

:lmao

[EricB]

Eric: humor me. What definition of racism are you working with?

And why would you choose the name Kunta Kinte in place of Mensah-Bonsu? Where is the tie in? What's the joke?

For the record, I don't think you are racist or intended to make a racist statement. But I'm also not surprised that some would take the Kunta Kinte name swap in a weird way because of the whole slave trade context. In other words, you're playing with euphemistic fire. Pops Mensah-Bonsu = Kunta Kinte = slave.


:lmao

Wow, you really REALLY need to back the hell up and take a pill.


There is nothing racist at all about calling Pops that name. What. So. EVER.

[MaNu4Tres]

So because he went to Kansas = smart?

:lmao

More so than a player who didn't start playing basketball til his late teens in the Netherlands.

[EricB]

More so than a player who didn't start playing basketball til his late teens in the Netherlands.


Yeah ok.

Just remember that when your throwing the remote at the TV when he blows assignment after assignment.

[Marcus Bryant]

Actually, given his popularity in this forum perhaps 'Pops Barack-Obama' would have been more appropriate.

[MaNu4Tres]

Yeah ok.

Just remember that when your throwing the remote at the TV when he blows assignment after assignment.

I already do with Bonner/ Finley defensively and when Bowen or Mason put the ball on the floor.

I'm pretty sure Gooden will be able to bring other positive things to the table.

[THE SIXTH MAN]

Actually, given his popularity in this forum perhaps 'Pops Barack-Obama' would have been more appropriate.

lol

[FromWayDowntown]

Garbage points and the occassional jumper.

Agree with this. I'd be interested in seeing Gooden play pick and roll/pick and pop with Parker or Ginobili -- the sort of situation in which some expected Thomas to thrive (and he's shown flashes of late).

Gooden strikes me as the equivalent of the NFL back who will consistently get you 3 yards on 1st and 10 and 3 yards on 3rd and 5. But given that the Spurs current bigs are the equivalent of the guy who will either get you a 3 yard loss or a 3 yard gain in those situations, I think Gooden is something of a minor upgrade.

And, again, the bottom line here is that if Gooden can't fit in or doesn't provide anything worthwhile, he's easy to release. High end, he's a valuable contributor; low end, he's Damon Stoudemire -- most likely, he's Glenn Robinson, circa 2005 and offers a bit of help to a team that needs a little something.

Oh, and by the way, the notion that this is a choice between Joe Smith and Drew Gooden for the Spurs strikes me as nonsense. I'm not sure what Cleveland offered Smith, but they had substantially more to offer him than the Spurs had to offer him. Smith was always headed to the highest bidder and that wasn't ever likely to be the Spurs.

[EricB]

Actually, given his popularity in this forum perhaps 'Pops Barack-Obama' would have been more appropriate.

:lmao

Well played.

[EricB]

Agree with this. I'd be interested in seeing Gooden play pick and roll/pick and pop with Parker or Ginobili -- the sort of situation in which some expected Thomas to thrive (and he's shown flashes of late).

Gooden strikes me as the equivalent of the NFL back who will consistently get you 3 yards on 1st and 10 and 3 yards on 3rd and 5. But given that the Spurs current bigs are the equivalent of the guy who will either get you a 3 yard loss or a 3 yard gain in those situations, I think Gooden is something of a minor upgrade.

And, again, the bottom line here is that if Gooden can't fit in or doesn't provide anything worthwhile, he's easy to release. High end, he's a valuable contributor; low end, he's Damon Stoudemire -- most likely, he's Glenn Robinson, circa 2005 and offers a bit of help to a team that needs a little something.

Oh, and by the way, the notion that this is a choice between Joe Smith and Drew Gooden for the Spurs strikes me as nonsense. I'm not sure what Cleveland offered Smith, but they had substantially more to offer him than the Spurs had to offer him. Smith was always headed to the highest bidder and that wasn't ever likely to be the Spurs.


Given the choice, I'd rather have Gooden.


Joe Smith is fucking pathetic IMHO.

[EricB]

I'm not worked up about this at all. I'm just saying that I'm not sure why you are so dismissive that some could (mis)perceive your comment as racist. Why not err on the side of caution?

Someone took your statement as racist...rather than offer a counter to the claim you simply tossed out a catty blanket assertion. So, again, humor me. Why isn't it racist comment?


First off, I didn't make the comment.

Re read.

It isn't a racist comment because there is no intent nor basis for it to be racist, this comment, MADE BY SOMEONE ELSE.

[SequSpur]

got damn tpark, last night gooden sucked... make up your fuckin mind.... what did u order his jersey now so you're on the bandwagon officially... i'm so tired of you fucking flipfloppers in this fucking place.

[Agloco]

:lmao

Wow, you really REALLY need to back the hell up and take a pill.


There is nothing racist at all about calling Pops that name. What. So. EVER.

.........

Ignorance at it's finest.

[FromWayDowntown]

Given the choice, I'd rather have Gooden.


Joe Smith is fucking pathetic IMHO.

Just responding to an earlier assertion in this thread that Smith would have been a better choice than Gooden; it's a false premise, since I'm pretty sure Smith was never going to be available to the Spurs.

I'd agree generally with the notion that Smith was a better fit than Gooden is likely to be, and that's true in a lot of ways, I think. But, again, I don't think that was ever really a choice for the Spurs. The Spurs options were Gooden, Stromile Swift, an off-the-board choice, or the status quo. Of those options, Gooden seems like a reasonable and logical choice.

[EricB]

.........

Ignorance at it's finest.


Uptightness and hyprocisy at its finest.

[Marcus Bryant]

Agree with this. I'd be interested in seeing Gooden play pick and roll/pick and pop with Parker or Ginobili -- the sort of situation in which some expected Thomas to thrive (and he's shown flashes of late).

Gooden strikes me as the equivalent of the NFL back who will consistently get you 3 yards on 1st and 10 and 3 yards on 3rd and 5. But given that the Spurs current bigs are the equivalent of the guy who will either get you a 3 yard loss or a 3 yard gain in those situations, I think Gooden is something of a minor upgrade.

And, again, the bottom line here is that if Gooden can't fit in or doesn't provide anything worthwhile, he's easy to release. High end, he's a valuable contributor; low end, he's Damon Stoudemire -- most likely, he's Glenn Robinson, circa 2005 and offers a bit of help to a team that needs a little something.

Oh, and by the way, the notion that this is a choice between Joe Smith and Drew Gooden for the Spurs strikes me as nonsense. I'm not sure what Cleveland offered Smith, but they had substantially more to offer him than the Spurs had to offer him. Smith was always headed to the highest bidder and that wasn't ever likely to be the Spurs.


I think we as Spurs fans have forgotten what it was like to have someone who could pull down 10 boards a night lining up next to TD. Granted, that someone also could block shots and D up. *sniff*

Gooden isn't my ideal bigman for the Spurs, but I think he will be able to contribute moreso than the naysayers realize. All I know is that whenever the Spurs played the Cavs, he and Varejao ticked me off.

[Agloco]

:lmao

Wow, you really REALLY need to back the hell up and take a pill.


There is nothing racist at all about calling Pops that name. What. So. EVER.


First off, I didn't make the comment.

Re read.

It isn't a racist comment because there is no intent nor basis for it to be racist, this comment, MADE BY SOMEONE ELSE.


.........

Ignorance at it's finest.

[SequSpur]

tpark is a fuckin tool

[EricB]

Just responding to an earlier assertion in this thread that Smith would have been a better choice than Gooden; it's a false premise, since I'm pretty sure Smith was never going to be available to the Spurs.

I'd agree generally with the notion that Smith was a better fit than Gooden is likely to be, and that's true in a lot of ways, I think. But, again, I don't think that was ever really a choice for the Spurs. The Spurs options were Gooden, Stromile Swift, an off-the-board choice, or the status quo. Of those options, Gooden seems like a reasonable and logical choice.

Agreed.

Still though I have to humbly disagree about Joe Smith. There is nothing IMO anything remotely attractive about him.

[EricB]

got damn tpark, last night gooden sucked... make up your fuckin mind.... what did u order his jersey now so you're on the bandwagon officially... i'm so tired of you fucking flipfloppers in this fucking place.


Then leave.

All I said was that he is better than Joe Smith.

Get out the booster seat and see over the keyboard munchkin.

[EricB]

.........

Ignorance at it's finest.


So now Marcus Bryant is being a racist?

Awesome, you can interpret intent. Congrats on being the first human being EVER to be able to do that.

[MaNu4Tres]

All I know is that whenever the Spurs played the Cavs, he and Varejao ticked me off.

Gooden was probably the 2nd best performer for the Cavs during the Finals in 07'. Second to Bron Bron of course.

[FromWayDowntown]

I think we as Spurs fans have forgotten what it was like to have someone who could pull down 10 boards a night lining up next to TD. Granted, that someone also could block shots and D up. *sniff*

Gooden isn't my ideal bigman for the Spurs, but I think he will be able to contribute moreso than the naysayers realize. All I know is that whenever the Spurs played the Cavs, he and Varejao ticked me off.

Well, I think it's funny that a criticism of Gooden is that a team with title aspirations wouldn't want him, given that he's the only one of the recently-waived players who's played in an NBA Finals. And a guy who put up 13 and 8 while shooting .500 from the field in an extremely defensively-oriented Finals series.

[tav1]

First off, I didn't make the comment.

Re read.

It isn't a racist comment because there is no intent nor basis for it to be racist, this comment, MADE BY SOMEONE ELSE.

Sorry about attributing the comment to you.

[EricB]

Well, I think it's funny that a criticism of Gooden is that a team with title aspirations wouldn't want him, given that he's the only one of the recently-waived players who's played in an NBA Finals. And a guy who put up 13 and 8 while shooting .500 from the field in an extremely defensively-oriented Finals series.


I hope he does play well. I really do.

Cause if Gooden gives a crap on the defensive end and rebounds and disrupts things then IMO this team is close to unbeatable when healthy.

[Agloco]

So now Marcus Bryant is being a racist?

Awesome, you can interpret intent. Congrats on being the first human being EVER to be able to do that.

This is where your ignorance shines more with each passing moment.

Intent doesn't matter. It's all about the perception of the person receiving the message.

Your litmus test, and MB's for that matter: Walking into the Spurs locker room and testing your "intent" theory. I'm sure PMB would be quick to enlighten both of you.

I personally don't care what trash you care to spew, but it's a dangerous game to start playing.

[Manufan909]

.........

Ignorance at it's finest.

+1

No one gives a fuck about the intent, but I am assuming the intent was using Kunta-Kinte to make fun of Pops-hypers, but it was still racism. Tpark is still a shithead, despite the name change and hope of getting a different reputation. I'm cool with racism when it comes from equal oppurtunity people(ex. Carlos Mencia), but racism to help along a point is just lame.

And I have sequ on my side, I have no words...:wow

[FromWayDowntown]

I hope he does play well. I really do.

Cause if Gooden gives a crap on the defensive end and rebounds and disrupts things then IMO this team is close to unbeatable when healthy.

Assuming this comes to fruition, I think they've still got some problems in matching up with the elite of the elite, but they increase their margin for error a bit and that at least would seem to get them closer than they are now.

[EricB]

This is where your ignorance shines more with each passing moment.

Intent doesn't matter. It's all about the perception of the person receiving the message.

Your litmus test, and MB's for that matter: Walking into the Spurs locker room and testing your "intent" theory. I'm sure PMB would be quick to enlighten both of you.

I personally don't care what trash you care to spew, but it's a dangerous game to start playing.


I'm frightened...

[HarlemHeat37]

why are you guys fucking the thread up? stick to the subject..nobody is racist here, we're all Spurs fans here, get along..

[Manufan909]

So now Marcus Bryant is being a racist?

Awesome, you can interpret intent. Congrats on being the first human being EVER to be able to do that.

No one said that genius. What got me pissed was MB effortlessly using racism to make a point. You don't have to be racist to make racist comments.

[EricB]

Assuming this comes to fruition, I think they've still got some problems in matching up with the elite of the elite, but they increase their margin for error a bit and that at least would seem to get them closer than they are now.


Eh, I still think the elite of the elite are being a tad overrated.

[exstatic]

Gooden was probably the 2nd best performer for the Cavs during the Finals in 07'. Second to Bron Bron of course.

They got swept. Tony raped their bigs, Gooden included, in the paint. You're making my argument for me.

[EricB]

No one said that genius. What got me pissed was MB effortlessly using racism to make a point. You don't have to be racist to make racist comments.


Except that wasn't racist what he said.

Take a pill.

[EricB]

why are you guys fucking the thread up? stick to the subject..nobody is racist here, we're all Spurs fans here, get along..


Yes sir forum police!!!

[Manufan909]

why are you guys fucking the thread up? stick to the subject..nobody is racist here, we're all Spurs fans here, get along..

Sorry I'm not in denial. Not calling anyone racist, but several of MBs posts were racist. Doesn't automatically mean he is one.

[EricB]

They got swept. Tony raped their bigs, Gooden included, in the paint. You're making my argument for me.


To be fair, Tony rapes some of the best defensive bigs.

[Manufan909]

Except that wasn't racist what he said.

Take a pill.

Go drink some coffee so you can wake up and realize it was.

[Marcus Bryant]

Well, I think it's funny that a criticism of Gooden is that a team with title aspirations wouldn't want him, given that he's the only one of the recently-waived players who's played in an NBA Finals. And a guy who put up 13 and 8 while shooting .500 from the field in an extremely defensively-oriented Finals series.

Good point. IIRC, that Spurs team was among one of the best in in the league in both defensive and offensive execution that season.

[EricB]

Go drink some coffee so you can wake up and realize it was.

Learn what racist is, it wasn't.

[MaNu4Tres]

To be fair, Tony rapes some of the best defensive bigs.

Well put

[EricB]

Good point. IIRC, that Spurs team was among one of the best in in the league in both defensive and offensive execution that season.

Game 1 IIRC he dropped like 20 and 10.

Played well. Was one of their best players.

[Marcus Bryant]

Put a fucking cork in it, Shirley. (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3154267&postcount=224)

[Agloco]

Except that wasn't racist what he said.

Take a pill.


So now Marcus Bryant is being a racist?

Awesome, you can interpret intent. Congrats on being the first human being EVER to be able to do that.

It would appear you beat me to it.........

You should have stuck with your old screen name. At least everyone knew what a dick you were then.

[EricB]

It would appear you beat me to it.........

You should have stuck with your old screen name. At least everyone knew what a dick you were then.


:lol

Man you guys are soooo oversensitive.

[Agloco]

:lol

Man you guys are soooo oversensitive.

Or perhaps some of us have lived in the real world for too long. You gotta forgive me for having all of that life experience.......

I'm leaving this alone. One day you'll get it youngblood. :depressed

[baseline bum]

Eh, I just can't agree. Bonner's ability to spread the floor is helpful for whoever he's on the court with. Same with Thomas' defense and rebound. Gooden, on the other hand, needs for his defense to be covered up and to get into a game flow.

He reminds me somewhat of Nazr in that he's not a player that's going to find his own flow. If he's in your rotation, you better start him and force feed production out of him. And then get him out of the game once the fourth quarter arrives.

Bench players need to be smart, especially in the Spurs system in which Pop doesn't have a set rotation. Expecting Gooden to pick up exactly what is needed from off the bench after the flow and tempo has been set is asking too much.

I'd rather not pick him up period if that's the only way to get any production out of him. I guess I'd rather sign him for the minimum, tell him he's playing off the bench, and see if it works. If not, no biggie.. don't give him minutes and cut him if he starts pulling drama queen crap.

[EricB]

I'd rather not pick him up period if that's the only way to get any production out of him.


Now you understand me being against it :lol

[EricB]

Or perhaps some of us have lived in the real world for too long. You gotta forgive me for having all of that life experience.......

I'm leaving this alone. One day you'll get it youngblood. :depressed


You make sense about as much as a drunken bum's rantings on a street corner.

[Yorae]

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/08Nz0tE44fajh/340x.jpg

This guy could really help...

[Spursfan092120]

And at Power Forward...for your San Antonio Spurs

http://images.ballhype.com/media/uploads/ballhype/story_large/2008/12/04/potc_goodenv4.jpg

[Mugen]

ive never liked gooden's game, but at a cheap price why the hell not.

[EricB]

It will be interesting to have a 90 on the team thats for sure.

[Joe Schmoogins]

I don't get why so many are against signing this guy...

No, he's not known for being a solid defender, he certainly has flaws as all players do.

However, the bottom line is that he is highly talented, crashes boards with the best of them, a skilled offensive player, still young, has experience, and is an upgrade to any current big not named Duncan.

In the past week two of the best defensive performances came against the Mavs and Blazers when Duncan was out. This highlights the fact that Spurs defense is about trusting the system and not individual personnel. If Bonner can learn to defend then certainly Gooden can.

Sure, there is not much time left in the season to integrate him, but I'd say the positives of this experiment certainly outweigh the negatives.

[ace3g]

luckily he is clean cut now

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/f8/fullj.038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2/038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2-getty-83693102rw002_kings.jpg
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/42/fullj.e901bab29ca35e9c2e0c391729b7fce2/e901bab29ca35e9c2e0c391729b7fce2-getty-82990664rw004_bobcats_kings.jpg
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/8e/fullj.cac6c46c80d51e74fb07cf4347ffb813/cac6c46c80d51e74fb07cf4347ffb813-getty-82990664rw020_bobcats_kings.jpg

[Joe Schmoogins]

Now you understand me being against it :lol

why are you against it? Just curious... (I'm too lazy to read all 18 pages.)

[EricB]

why are you against it? Just curious... (I'm too lazy to read all 18 pages.)

I'm too lazy to repost what i've posted already about 15 times.

[Spurs9]

I really want to see him become a spurs, I hope these rumors are true.

[Mugen]

Gooden has asked the media to refer to him as, "The Big Drizzle."

haha, ok now i kinda like him.

[Spursmania]

I don't get why so many are against signing this guy...

No, he's not known for being a solid defender, he certainly has flaws as all players do.

However, the bottom line is that he is highly talented, crashes boards with the best of them, a skilled offensive player, still young, has experience, and is an upgrade to any current big not named Duncan.

In the past week two of the best defensive performances came against the Mavs and Blazers when Duncan was out. This highlights the fact that Spurs defense is about trusting the system and not individual personnel. If Bonner can learn to defend then certainly Gooden can.

Sure, there is not much time left in the season to integrate him, but I'd say the positives of this experiment certainly outweigh the negatives.

You're right-this is just a positive move for us. Can't wait until he is signed. Not because I think he's perfect but he's the best we're going to get now. And, the Spurs NEED some help right now.
:wakeup

[Spursmania]

Gooden has asked the media to refer to him as, "The Big Drizzle."

haha, ok now i kinda like him.

What's the "big drizzle" mean?

[Mr. Body]

What's the "big drizzle" mean?

It's a drizzle. But a lot of it.

[Mugen]

What's the "big drizzle" mean?

Drew-izzle.

or when gooden starts drizzzzzzling them 18ft jumpers for the spurs!

[Joe Schmoogins]

I'm too lazy to repost what i've posted already about 15 times.

fair enough...

[Spursmania]

Oh, I see. Yeah, I kind like that name. Welcome, "big drizzle":hat

[m33p0]

you're right-this is just a positive move for us. Can't wait until he is signed. Not because i think he's perfect but he's the best we're going to get now. And, the spurs need some help right now.
:wakeup
qfft

[Joe Schmoogins]

If he does join, he will definitely make things interesting.

I think the Manu-Gooden pick and roll could be quite effective. Also, it will be nice having a legit post scorer in the second unit. For those who are still hurting over the loss of the nameless Rocket, Gooden plays a comparable game. Maybe he doesn't have as high of an iq, but he is more athletic, and a better post scorer.

[m33p0]

luckily he is clean cut now

http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/f8/fullj.038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2/038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2-getty-83693102rw002_kings.jpg

thank goodness he got rid of that stupid beard and wacky ducktail.

[Manufan909]

If only he played solid d, but then, the spurs wouldn't have gotten him. At least he looks presentable now.

[HarlemHeat37]

another thing that people are ignoring about Gooden..as I pointed out earlier, he gets to the line at a much better rate than anybody outside of the big 3..that's going to be very helpful..

[rayray2k8]

Well there's not much that can be said right now about the spurs acquisition of Gooden
till Wednesday when he clears waivers..
So for now, we play the waiting game...

[024]

gooden will come at no cost to the spurs. spurs aren't giving up a future piece like mason, hill, mahinmi, or even rights to gist or splitter. they aren't even giving up a second round pick. they aren't disrupting team chemistry by shipping another player out. usually acquiring a starter like gooden would mean taking in a large contract or trading away players with future potential. but none of that will happen. i don't think the spurs will even reach the luxury tax threshold by signing gooden.

where is the risk? at the worst, popovich will bury gooden on the bench during the playoffs. there are no other plausible PFs or Cs available. swift is going to the suns, smith is heading to the cavs, and the trade deadline has passed.

[Toni61]

+1

I think it`s not risk.

Let him bring on to the Spurs !!!

[Manufan909]

another thing that people are ignoring about Gooden..as I pointed out earlier, he gets to the line at a much better rate than anybody outside of the big 3..that's going to be very helpful..

So he's big on low post scoring?

[mystargtr34]

I havent read much of the first 15 pages. But are people still saying they would prefer to keep Pops Mensah Bonsu over signing Gooden :lol ?

[spurspokesman]

Just reading some of the posts about gooden this week( Some funny ones) makes me think. I'm gonna step out and support him if he's signed. I dont give A damn what nobody thinks. He has defensive issues(Pop timmy and kurt can help him with that) but I think a lot of people forget the fact that he does very well what we need him for. REBOUNDING. And he gets more of those in A game than our supporting frontcourt(excluding Tim) gets in A week(Exaggerating LOL) and he also does something well that we havent seen . SCORE POINTS IN THE POST. IF they sign em I"M wit it. He's superior to any other big outside of duncan. And his previous teams were not as good as SA. Maybe this breathes life into his weaknesses . Who knows.

[objective]

I havent read much of the first 15 pages. But are people still saying they would prefer to keep Pops Mensah Bonsu over signing Gooden :lol ?

I don't know about other posters, but I brought up PMB in comparison that Gooden's defense wouldn't be much better if at all. Based of course on how poor a defender he seemed to be naturally/low iq and the lack of a training camp and the lack of practices during a season.

For some reason stating how horrible PMB's defense is and Gooden's in comparison to that might have been read by people as some sort of support for PMB, a bizarre bit of forum logic if that conclusion was reached.

I'm fine with the Spurs cutting PMB and not even signing Gooden, PMB won't play anyway and is just a shorter, non-glass substitute for Mahinmi (who also won't play when his 8 weeks is up).

I would simply argue that the idea that Gooden is some saviour or even greatly improves the Spurs chances seems dubious to me.

1. The bad defense. Compounded with joining a new team with less than 30% of the season remaining and very few practices for a player who isn't well regarded for his b-ball iq, unlike Kurt Thomas.

2. The deceptive rebounding numbers. His rebounding isn't really any better than KT was averaging when he wasn't next to Duncan in his time in Seattle or in PHX. The reasoning for him upgrading the Spurs rebounding is flawed.

The numbers aren't there. The talk of Gooden getting 13 boards in 26 minutes in his Sac game? Well, KT got 15 rebounds without Duncan next to him against Dallas. Hell KT averaged 10.3 rpg in a little under 28 minutes a game in the 3 game stretch of starts in place of TD against playoff teams.

3. His offensive game isn't that much different than KT either. Some more dunks, but not as much as people might think. He's a jump shooter also.

So other than fatigue, why would he play over KT under Pop? Rebounding isn't better. Defense sure isn't better. Jumpshot? Maybe, maybe not. Knoweledge of the system on defense and offense isn't better. Rapport with teammates isn't better.

Is there any downside to adding him? Not really, other than possible luxury tax issues. Are there great reasons to think he puts them in a decidedly better position against the Lakers/Celtics/Cavs? Not really, other than KT maybe getting fatigued or in foul trouble.

[TDMVPDPOY]

I think some of you clowns in here are expecting too much from GOODEN, we are not expecting BILL FKN RUSSELL type of defense from him, just the avg big defense and rebounding will be fine.

[m33p0]

I think some of you clowns in here are expecting too much from GOODEN, we are not expecting BILL FKN RUSSELL type of defense from him, just the avg big defense and rebounding will be fine.
:lol i'm actually just looking for someone to spell thomas and bonner if the spurs need someone to cover a mobile forward. maybe even the first big off the bench to sub for TD when kt is starting.

[FromWayDowntown]

I would simply argue that the idea that Gooden is some saviour or even greatly improves the Spurs chances seems dubious to me.

1. The bad defense. Compounded with joining a new team with less than 30% of the season remaining and very few practices for a player who isn't well regarded for his b-ball iq, unlike Kurt Thomas.

2. The deceptive rebounding numbers. His rebounding isn't really any better than KT was averaging when he wasn't next to Duncan in his time in Seattle or in PHX. The reasoning for him upgrading the Spurs rebounding is flawed.

The numbers aren't there. The talk of Gooden getting 13 boards in 26 minutes in his Sac game? Well, KT got 15 rebounds without Duncan next to him against Dallas. Hell KT averaged 10.3 rpg in a little under 28 minutes a game in the 3 game stretch of starts in place of TD against playoff teams.

3. His offensive game isn't that much different than KT either. Some more dunks, but not as much as people might think. He's a jump shooter also.

So other than fatigue, why would he play over KT under Pop? Rebounding isn't better. Defense sure isn't better. Jumpshot? Maybe, maybe not. Knoweledge of the system on defense and offense isn't better. Rapport with teammates isn't better.

Wrong comparison. This isn't about whether Gooden is better than Thomas; Thomas is going to play no matter what. The question is whether Gooden is an upgrade -- particularly as a rebounder and an offensive player -- over either Bonner or Oberto. Frankly, I think your argument that Gooden isn't any better than Thomas is a ringing endorsement for his signing, because he's going to do things that a guy like Fab can't. Having the Spurs 3 "rugged" bigs as Duncan, Thomas, and Gooden instead of Duncan, Thomas, and Oberto strikes me as an upgrade on the offensive end as well as on the glass. And that seems like a positive to me.

I don't think anyone's considering Gooden a savior. I think most who look at things fairly objectively would still consider the Spurs to be unlikely to beat LA or Cleveland or Boston over the course of a 7 game series. But, again, Gooden seems to make the margin for error a bit wider than it was before. And I, for one, think that's a positive.

[MaNu4Tres]

I find it funny when pop was asked about the waiver wire he stated, "" “So when there's a trade deadline, or waiver wires, we pay attention to it, like any other team would, because you're always trying to upgrade your team if you think you can. It's just logic that the later in a season a team might add a player, the more difficult it could be, but that depends on the player's intelligence and experience,” he said.

So i guess its logical that if we sign Gooden then some of y'alls over exaggerating comments are spot on over Pops analysis of the idea of adding Gooden :lol. Obviously if we sign him he doesn't think his BBIQ is that much of a liability and he must believe Gooden would improve our team.

[Marcus Bryant]

Wrong comparison. This isn't about whether Gooden is better than Thomas; Thomas is going to play no matter what. The question is whether Gooden is an upgrade -- particularly as a rebounder and an offensive player -- over either Bonner or Oberto. Frankly, I think your argument that Gooden isn't any better than Thomas is a ringing endorsement for his signing, because he's going to do things that a guy like Fab can't. Having the Spurs 3 "rugged" bigs as Duncan, Thomas, and Gooden instead of Duncan, Thomas, and Oberto strikes me as an upgrade on the offensive end as well as on the glass. And that seems like a positive to me.

I don't think anyone's considering Gooden a savior. I think most who look at things fairly objectively would still consider the Spurs to be unlikely to beat LA or Cleveland or Boston over the course of a 7 game series. But, again, Gooden seems to make the margin for error a bit wider than it was before. And I, for one, think that's a positive.

Exactly. Though I'm not sure the gap is that big, especially with a healthy Ginobili.

You hit on the main issues with respect to the frontcourt. Those are lack of depth and the drop off in quality of depth between the 2nd and 3rd best bigs on the roster. Gooden would add to depth, but more importantly add some quality to the rotation. Yeah, he's not a candidate for DPOY, but is Bonner or Oberto?

As always in this forum, the negatives of certain players grow a bit out of proportion, while the positives are overlooked. Yes, Gooden is one of the better rebounders in the league, but why is that? It's because he's fairly mobile. If I'm wondering how this helps against LA, Cleveland and Boston, having a more mobile big who can board is rather significant. The Spurs don't have that much in the way of mobility and length in the frontcourt, even when you define that more broadly to include the 3 spot.

Yes, Gooden did not come to mind when I thought of bigs the Spurs could target to improve the rotation. Trying to land Camby made a lot of sense before the deadline...and probably still will this summer. But, Gooden's now available, and I think he could have a positive impact on a frontcourt that at full strength is not that deep.

[MarHill]

Exactly. Though I'm not sure the gap is that big, especially with a healthy Ginobili.

You hit on the main issues with respect to the frontcourt. Those are lack of depth and the drop off in quality of depth between the 2nd and 3rd best bigs on the roster. Gooden would add to depth, but more importantly add some quality to the rotation. Yeah, he's not a candidate for DPOY, but is Bonner or Oberto?

As always in this forum, the negatives of certain players grow a bit out of proportion, while the positives are overlooked. Yes, Gooden is one of the better rebounders in the league, but why is that? It's because he's fairly mobile. If I'm wondering how this helps against LA, Cleveland and Boston, having a more mobile big who can board is rather significant. The Spurs don't have that much in the way of mobility and length in the frontcourt, even when you define that more broadly to include the 3 spot.

Yes, Gooden did not come to mind when I thought of bigs the Spurs could target to improve the rotation. Trying to land Camby made a lot of sense before the deadline...and probably still will this summer. But, Gooden's now available, and I think he could have a positive impact on a frontcourt that at full strength is not that deep.

Thanks, Marcus for some common sense!!

:toast

[GervinGirl]

If Gooden gives the Spurs that extra "oomph" and help the team win then I'm all for it.

But Lordy it is going to be difficult looking at the 'thing' on his chin. And wondering how it migrated from the back of his head (2007 Cleveland) to the front and if that is a good thing. And why wondering about it makes me write run-on sentences.

[Spurs9]

He doesn't have the serpent thing on his chin anymore. He had a bet with Stevenson about who could go the longest without shaving. I think he has just a normal beard now.

[Marcus Bryant]

He's still a douchebag and I'm not sure I'd be for giving him a long term deal, but in this scenario, sign him up.

[Chomag]

I know this guy has good talent and that we could use. But I saw a few games of him in while he was on Chicago and I'm not sure if he cares about anything anymore, other then maybe padding stats so he can get a large contract. Wouldn't you guys think that might be very risky for the team chemistry?

At the moment I'm pretty torn on us getting him.

[FromWayDowntown]

I know this guy has good talent and that we could use. But I saw a few games of him in while he was on Chicago and I'm not sure if he cares about anything anymore, other then maybe padding stats so he can get a large contract. Wouldn't you guys think that might be very risky for the team chemistry?

At the moment I'm pretty torn on us getting him.

For a guy like Gooden, who was starting for a Cleveland team that had just won the East in '07 and was on its way to taking the Celtics to 7 in '08, a trade to a non-contending Chicago team had to be deflating and the business end of the NBA had to be appealing.

I would hope that a chance to find himself back with a contender and a chance to play well (not just be a stat hound) deep into the playoffs again would be enticing in his quest to get a new deal. Putting up good numbers in Chicago is one thing when it comes to contract time; playing a significant role for a true contender for several rounds of playoffs in April, May, and June is very much a different thing.

[m33p0]

If Gooden gives the Spurs that extra "oomph" and help the team win then I'm all for it.

But Lordy it is going to be difficult looking at the 'thing' on his chin. And wondering how it migrated from the back of his head (2007 Cleveland) to the front and if that is a good thing. And why wondering about it makes me write run-on sentences.
the thing on his chin is gone.
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/f8/fullj.038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2/038911660f561024381b17d3e1461cc2-getty-83693102rw002_kings.jpg

[Galaxy Convoy]

i like the Spurs to sign him. i know he's a risk, but it is better than nothing. i rather have him in the roster than Jacque Vaughn. atleast this guy can do things, can be an option.
if he fails to do what we need him to do or try to overdo things, Pop is smart enough to just bench him.

[timvp]

Time to order up the number 90 jersey ...................

[Marcus Bryant]

For a guy like Gooden, who was starting for a Cleveland team that had just won the East in '07 and was on its way to taking the Celtics to 7 in '08, a trade to a non-contending Chicago team had to be deflating and the business end of the NBA had to be appealing.

I would hope that a chance to find himself back with a contender and a chance to play well (not just be a stat hound) deep into the playoffs again would be enticing in his quest to get a new deal. Putting up good numbers in Chicago is one thing when it comes to contract time; playing a significant role for a true contender for several rounds of playoffs in April, May, and June is very much a different thing.

Well, he did give up his Bird Rights with Sacto to become a free agent and presumably to join a playoff team. He could just as easily stayed with the Kings and racked up big stats on a sucky team. There's a bit of a risk he's taken with agreeing to the buyout, especially for a bigman at his age. His next long term contract could very well be his last in the NBA. Even with the economy and the outlook for the cap where it is at, teams will still spend somewhat to improve this summer.

[Marcus Bryant]

Time to order up the number 90 jersey ...................

Nice. Now Manu needs to get back and Bowen needs more PT.

[timvp]

Well, he did give up his Bird Rights with Sacto to become a free agent and presumably to join a playoff team. He could just as easily stayed with the Kings and racked up big stats on a sucky team. There's a bit of a risk he's taken with agreeing to the buyout, especially for a bigman at his age. His next long term contract could very well be his last in the NBA. Even with the economy and the outlook for the cap where it is at, teams will still spend somewhat to improve this summer.Yeah, gotta give props to Gooden for likely giving up money to join a contender. Even though the Kings weren't going to re-sign him, he could have stayed in Sacramento and had more options in the offseason.

Hopefully he can get and stay healthy and earn himself a big contract this summer. If he's matured, takes the game more seriously and plays well next to Duncan, there are worse ways for the Spurs to spend the MLE.

[FromWayDowntown]

Ultimately, this appears to be a win-win for both sides in a number of ways.

The Spurs immediately improve their depth at the 4/5, improve their rebounding on both ends, add a guy who can score in double digits while offering the possibility of playing well in 2-man games, and a guy who's endured the rigors of a deep playoff run and won't be awed by the big stages of the later playoff rounds. They get all of that on the cheap and they get it without having surrendered any significant assets.

Meanwhile, Gooden gets the chance to play on the big stage again and show the league that he can be a useful player to a team with championship aspirations. On top of that, if he succeeds to any degree, his desireability as a free agent is enhanced if only by virtue of the fact that other Western contenders might be willing to up the bid for him in an effort to keep him out of San Antonio (whether the Spurs consider keeping him or not). This is a positive perception move for Gooden on a lot of fronts. It's up to him to maximize the benefits that the situation creates. I'm going to remain optimistic that if this thing happens, he'll seize the opportunity and make the most of it -- for himself and the Spurs.

[Marcus Bryant]

Yeah, gotta give props to Gooden for likely giving up money to join a contender. Even though the Kings weren't going to re-sign him, he could have stayed in Sacramento and had more options in the offseason.

Hopefully he can get and stay healthy and earn himself a big contract this summer. If he's matured, takes the game more seriously and plays well next to Duncan, there are worse ways for the Spurs to spend the MLE.

Well, that move definitely went against what you would expect from his public persona. I would still be hesitant to commit to him long term. Of course, the larger issue is who could the Spurs find that's better? Hill for Camby was obvious, so obvious that the Clippers figured out they shouldn't do it.

Oh well, that's for future threads.

[Marcus Bryant]

Ultimately, this appears to be a win-win for both sides in a number of ways.

The Spurs immediately improve their depth at the 4/5, improve their rebounding on both ends, add a guy who can score in double digits while offering the possibility of playing well in 2-man games, and a guy who's endured the rigors of a deep playoff run and won't be awed by the big stages of the later playoff rounds. They get all of that on the cheap and they get it without having surrendered any significant assets.

Meanwhile, Gooden gets the chance to play on the big stage again and show the league that he can be a useful player to a team with championship aspirations. On top of that, if he succeeds to any degree, his desireability as a free agent is enhanced if only by virtue of the fact that other Western contenders might be willing to up the bid for him in an effort to keep him out of San Antonio (whether the Spurs consider keeping him or not). This is a positive perception move for Gooden on a lot of fronts. It's up to him to maximize the benefits that the situation creates. I'm going to remain optimistic that if this thing happens, he'll seize the opportunity and make the most of it -- for himself and the Spurs.

Indeed. Definitely a mutual marriage of convenience.

[Old Loaf]

I am speaking purely from a Cavs fan perspective right now. I've watched the guy play for a few years and I think I can put some input here.

To be brutally honest, I hate the guy's game. I really do. All of the people who say he "isn't the best defender, but he can play" need to realize that he may not be the best defender; he may be the worst.

He is capable of putting up good numbers, but does so outside of the flow of the game. He is a "me-first" player, never looks to pass and is too stupid to understand the team game offensively and defensively.

Pop is the best coach in the NBA, but he isn't a miracle worker. Gooden has had opportunity after opportunity with different teams and coaches to prove that he isn't an empty calorie player who puts up good numbers on bad teams outside of the flow of the game. I can't possibly see a Pop/Gooden tandem working out.

Having said that, the Spurs should pick him up. When he is your starting PF, has a large role and is making serious money, his bone-headed play is too much to handle. However, you guys can get him for free and can pretty much have him at no expense. I don't think he is a team cancer in the locker room and genuinely tries.

All I am saying is that if you guys do go down this road, be ready to have some very frustrating nights and possessions. He has all the talent in the world, but for some reason cannot put it together.

[Manufan909]

Well, that move definitely went against what you would expect from his public persona. I would still be hesitant to commit to him long term. Of course, the larger issue is who could the Spurs find that's better? Hill for Camby was obvious, so obvious that the Clippers figured out they shouldn't do it.

Oh well, that's for future threads.

I think Sheed is a relatively sure thing, especially if he feels the same after the POs as he did when he made his famous quote. The only good thing about not geting #5 would be Sheed seeing he is what the Spurs need to get over the top, and a refresher on how great Timmy is. Dice might also be an option, if the Spurs somehow got both, I would be amazed.

[timvp]

I am speaking purely from a Cavs fan perspective right now. I've watched the guy play for a few years and I think I can put some input here.

To be brutally honest, I hate the guy's game. I really do. All of the people who say he "isn't the best defender, but he can play" need to realize that he may not be the best defender; he may be the worst.

He is capable of putting up good numbers, but does so outside of the flow of the game. He is a "me-first" player, never looks to pass and is too stupid to understand the team game offensively and defensively.

Pop is the best coach in the NBA, but he isn't a miracle worker. Gooden has had opportunity after opportunity with different teams and coaches to prove that he isn't an empty calorie player who puts up good numbers on bad teams outside of the flow of the game. I can't possibly see a Pop/Gooden tandem working out.

Having said that, the Spurs should pick him up. When he is your starting PF, has a large role and is making serious money, his bone-headed play is too much to handle. However, you guys can get him for free and can pretty much have him at no expense. I don't think he is a team cancer in the locker room and genuinely tries.

All I am saying is that if you guys do go down this road, be ready to have some very frustrating nights and possessions. He has all the talent in the world, but for some reason cannot put it together.Good post and welcome to the forum :tu

I think a lot of what you said is accurate. The best news is the Spurs won a championship with Nazr Mohammed, who is almost the exact same type of player. In other words a low IQ, no rhythm, no flow, empty stats type of player.

Hopefully that experience will help Pop understand how to milk production from Gooden but not lean on him as an integral part of the team.

[coachmac87]

So when are the Spurs gonna sign this guy?

[tp2021]

I am speaking purely from a Cavs fan perspective right now. I've watched the guy play for a few years and I think I can put some input here.

To be brutally honest, I hate the guy's game. I really do. All of the people who say he "isn't the best defender, but he can play" need to realize that he may not be the best defender; he may be the worst.

He is capable of putting up good numbers, but does so outside of the flow of the game. He is a "me-first" player, never looks to pass and is too stupid to understand the team game offensively and defensively.

Pop is the best coach in the NBA, but he isn't a miracle worker. Gooden has had opportunity after opportunity with different teams and coaches to prove that he isn't an empty calorie player who puts up good numbers on bad teams outside of the flow of the game. I can't possibly see a Pop/Gooden tandem working out.

Having said that, the Spurs should pick him up. When he is your starting PF, has a large role and is making serious money, his bone-headed play is too much to handle. However, you guys can get him for free and can pretty much have him at no expense. I don't think he is a team cancer in the locker room and genuinely tries.

All I am saying is that if you guys do go down this road, be ready to have some very frustrating nights and possessions. He has all the talent in the world, but for some reason cannot put it together.

Great post. Thanks for sharing a helpful perspective.