best defender in spurs history

[mabrignani]

is it easy to say that bruce bowen deserves that title? idk if anyone remembers this but derek anderson used to d up on kobe pretty well, def not the best but he was pretty crucial

[ChumpDumper]

Pops Mensah-Bonsu.

[lefty]

Michael Finley

[TwelveGs210]

is it easy to say that bruce bowen deserves that title? idk if anyone remembers this but derek anderson used to d up on kobe pretty well, def not the best but he was pretty crucial

yeah but he played what? One season?

[Nathan Explosion]

We used to have this guy named David Robinson. I seem to remember he was a hell of a shot blocker and rebounder. Guy could jump out of the building to block shots.

Duncan's not too shabby either.

As for perimeter defender, there's Bowen of course, but Sean was a great on the ball defender himself.

[DespЏrado]

Bowen and Robinson. No one else really comes close, not even Duncan, who I think gets more credit than he actually deserves.

[Nathan Explosion]

Oh, and as much of a head case as he was, Rodman could D up too.

[Nathan Explosion]

Robinson was a beast of a defender, as long as the offensive player's name was Hakeem.

Still hurts all these years later. It was THAT BAD.

[Chomag]

Alven Robertson ,but it's so very close with Bowen and Robinson right behind him.

[DespЏrado]

Rodman could d-up but he never did it with the Spurs. Hakeem never owned Robinson the way history seems to remember. Hakeem just had a better team by far.

[iilluzioN]

Robinson
duncan
bowen
manu
hill

best defense

[DespЏrado]

Robinson
duncan
bowen
manu
hill

best defense

I'd put Elliott instead of Manu, just because I think Manu takes too many risks. Hill is still too early to call but he looks like the best defender @ the pg position.

[Nathan Explosion]

Rodman could d-up but he never did it with the Spurs. Hakeem never owned Robinson the way history seems to remember. Hakeem just had a better team by far.

Career wise maybe, but that one season was enough to forever cement that thought.

Consider the stakes (WCF), motivation (Hakeem saying during the MVP ceremony that Robinson was holding HIS trophy), and the nature of the beat down, and what you get is one of the greatest offensive displays by a Spurs opponent EVER.

It hurts to say it, but on the strength of that one playoff series, Hakeem will forever own Robinson head to head.

Of course, in the ring department, they're even as can be. :king

[SenorSpur]

Robinson was the superior defender; with Alvin Robertson a very close second. People who never seen him play before probably don't realize that he was every bit the perimeter player Bowen was and more. Except he was far more athletic, had quicker hands and an uncanny knack for on-court theivery. He could pressure the ball 94 feet.

[Brodels]

Ron Mercer.

[HarlemHeat37]

individual defenders: 1.Robinson 2.Robertson 3.Bowen

team defenders: 1.Robinson 2.Duncan 3.Bowen

[The Truth #6]

Alvin averaged something like 3.6 steals per game one year - unbelievable. David had incredible stats also, but I think for overall team defense Duncan has been the best anchor to build around.

[Spursfan092120]

We used to have this guy named David Robinson. I seem to remember he was a hell of a shot blocker and rebounder. Guy could jump out of the building to block shots.

Duncan's not too shabby either.

As for perimeter defender, there's Bowen of course, but Sean was a great on the ball defender himself.
I was gonna go with Sean too...he was phenomenal.

[cherylsteele]

Robinson was the superior defender; with Alvin Robertson a very close second. People who never seen him play before probably don't realize that he was every bit the perimeter player Bowen was and more. Except he was far more athletic, had quicker hands and an uncanny knack for on-court theivery. He could pressure the ball 94 feet.
Before Johnny Moore got sick he and Alvin were developing a serious defensive backcourt, there were rumblings from teams that they were begining to fear playing us with them as the starting backcourt.

[senorglory]

Sean Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Lu ck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_ was a great individual defender?

[timvp]

is it easy to say that bruce bowen deserves that title? idk if anyone remembers this but derek anderson used to d up on kobe pretty well, def not the best but he was pretty crucial

F

DA was a below average defender at best. He wouldn't make my list of top 200 Spurs defenders.

[Old School 44]

1. Tim Duncan
2. David Robinson
3. Bruce Bowen/Alvin Robertson

[timvp]

To answer the question, I'd say it's pretty easily David Robinson. The next three are Duncan, Bowen and Robertson ... not necessarily in that order.

[senorglory]

Let's try this again.

Sean Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Lu ck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_?

[senorglory]

HaHa. Sean "Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Lu ck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_" is filtered out?

[senorglory]

E-l-l-i-o-t can't be named?

[duncan228]

Let's try this again.

Sean Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Lu ck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_?

Try two t's in Elliott.

[senorglory]

Well, at least Dirk is [no longer] my daddy.

[senorglory]

2 t's (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96997&highlight=sean+Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luc k_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_The_Fakers_Luck_ The_Fakers_), gotcha.

[Jmoney]

Omg I have that skybox card too! Go UWE!

Alot of you guys seem to be young and only remember the winning years :P.

David R did not start his career being a great defender he morphed into it as the years went on.

Alvin Robertson had the annoying prowess of Bruce and the speed agility of Manu. He was an absolute demon on defense. Anyone who watched the Spurs back in the mid 80's could tell you we've never seen that combo before or since. He's also the ONLY Spur to ever have a quad double and the only player not a center to do so. He won defensive player of the YEAR AS SG. Only 1 other Sg has ever done that and his name is MJ. On the ball defending we have never had any better. I would argue he is one of the best on the ball defenders in the NBA all time.

[senorglory]

Sean Elliott was a great individual defender?

[baseline bum]

is it easy to say that bruce bowen deserves that title? idk if anyone remembers this but derek anderson used to d up on kobe pretty well, def not the best but he was pretty crucial

Um what? :rollin

In the three games the Spurs played against the Lakers in the regular season, with DA guarding Kobe, Bryant scored 32, 43, and 38. Kobe owned Derek Anderson worse than any Spurs player in franchise history not named Antonio Daniels. Anderson was the worst defender to start on the Spurs since Del Negro. Every single game in that 2000-01 season the Spurs would get ripped a new cornhole by whatever borderline star the other team had at shooting guard. Anderson could throw down some great dunks, penetrate well, and was a monster on the break, but his defense cost the Spurs big every single night, and had to have been the reason Pop had such a hard-on for Bruce in the summer.

[baseline bum]

<--------- The correct answer

[timvp]

Um what? :rollin

In the three games the Spurs played against the Lakers in the regular season, with DA guarding Kobe, Bryant scored 32, 43, and 38. Kobe owned Derek Anderson worse than any Spurs player in franchise history not named Antonio Daniels. Anderson was the worst defender to start on the Spurs since Del Negro. Every single game in that 2000-01 season the Spurs would get ripped a new cornhole by whatever borderline star the other team had at shooting guard. Anderson could throw down some great dunks, penetrate well, and was a monster on the break, but his defense cost the Spurs big every single night, and had to have been the reason Pop had such a hard-on for Bruce in the summer.
Amen.

The only good thing about DA's defense was that it was so bad that the Spurs figured out that they weren't going to win anything without getting a perimeter stopper. Enter Bruce Bowen.

[sheriee84]

http://www.rotoevil.com/images/schintzius_med.jpg This guy was even better simply b/c he has a killer mullet.

My boss still sports a mullet... rather successfully i might add

[mudyez]

david has to win it with alvin and timmy comming right behind

nice defensive-lineup:
Robinson
Duncan
Rodman
Bowen
Robertson

[Dave McNulla]

george freaking johnson



http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A01E5D61739F936A15751C0A9679482 60

George Gervin scored 26 points and George Johnson blocked a team-record 13 shots as the Spurs beat Golden State.

The 13 blocks by Johnson also were the most in the league this season.
Behind a 16-point spree by Bernard King, who finished with 42 points, the Warriors took a 34-32 first-period lead. But Ron Brewer came off the bench and got 16 points in the second period to lead a 44-point San Antonio explosion, a team high for the season. San Antonio took command, 76-68, at the half.

[Brutalis]

I like the guys timvp mentioned. DRob first, Bowen over TD and Razorback Alvin Robertson (cough AR) at four.

[Brutalis]

george freaking johnson

Ron Brewer's son Ronnie plays for the Jazz. Go Hogs.

[Thomas82]

Omg I have that skybox card too! Go UWE!

Alot of you guys seem to be young and only remember the winning years :P.

David R did not start his career being a great defender he morphed into it as the years went on.

Alvin Robertson had the annoying prowess of Bruce and the speed agility of Manu. He was an absolute demon on defense. Anyone who watched the Spurs back in the mid 80's could tell you we've never seen that combo before or since. He's also the ONLY Spur to ever have a quad double and the only player not a center to do so. He won defensive player of the YEAR AS SG. Only 1 other Sg has ever done that and his name is MJ. On the ball defending we have never had any better. I would argue he is one of the best on the ball defenders in the NBA all time.


Actually, David Robinson had a quad double too.

[SenorSpur]

Alvin Robertson was a perennial all-defensive team member, DPOY winner and still holds the NBA record for avg steals per game for a career.

[kace]

DRob was a great defensor, and a Big has always an advantage since he can really anchor a defense compared to a perimeter defensor, and rebounds and blocks .....

but i've never seen the same commitment to defend as i saw with Bruce.
it probably has to do with bruce lack of offensive skills. Bruce knows the only reason why he has seen playing time in one of the two or three best team of the league each year. because he defends.

and i don't think anyone come close to bruce when you talk about winning thanks to the defense. What he did to LBJ, Dirk, sometimes Kobe, Peja and almost every opponent's perimeter star has been amazing. He's by far the most clutch defensive player.

[TampaDude]

<===== This guy over here.

[sananspursfan21]

...but Sean was a great on the ball defender himself.

Sean Elliott?

[sananspursfan21]

Omg I have that skybox card too! Go UWE!

Alot of you guys seem to be young and only remember the winning years :P.

David R did not start his career being a great defender he morphed into it as the years went on.

Alvin Robertson had the annoying prowess of Bruce and the speed agility of Manu. He was an absolute demon on defense. Anyone who watched the Spurs back in the mid 80's could tell you we've never seen that combo before or since. He's also the ONLY Spur to ever have a quad double and the only player not a center to do so. He won defensive player of the YEAR AS SG. Only 1 other Sg has ever done that and his name is MJ. On the ball defending we have never had any better. I would argue he is one of the best on the ball defenders in the NBA all time.

it'd really impress me if you could name the other five in nba history to ever have a quadruple double...

[Duncan2177]

The all defensive spurs team

1.David Robinson
2.Bruce Bowen
3.Dennis Rodman
4.Tim Duncan
5.Terry Cummings

[coyotes_geek]

it'd really impress me if you could name the other five in nba history to ever have a quadruple double...

There have only been 4 guys to do it. Alvin, DRob, Hakeem, Nate Thurmond.

Well, officially that is. Blocks weren't kept as a stat back when Russell and Wilt played. Don't think steals were either. So there's a chance a couple more guys might have done it.

[exstatic]

Robinson
Bowen
Robertson
Elliott
Rodman
Duncan

In that order..

[whottt]

Drob is the best of course...man on man or team D he's on the short list of the greatest defensive players in NBA history, realize it Spursfans.

Duncan believe it or not is under-rated by Spurfans defensively because he's not that great of a man to man defender. It's true he's not that great of a man on man defender...but when you are the only common denominator on what is, at worst, the 3rd greatest defensive run by a team in NBA history, you must be doing something seriously right. Duncan is the only common denominator...man on man, you know, Pop didn't even want to put him on Dirk and Drob took the toughest defensive assignment even when he could barely take the court...but Duncan erases the mistakes of other players and does what he's supposed to with a machine like efficiency.

He's easily the second best defensive player in Spurs history.

So really what it comes down to is Bowen VS Alvin Robertson VS Sean Elliott...Alvin was probably the greatest ball thief to ever step foot on NBA court, and he was a solid defender...but his career with the Spurs wasn't that long. If you are talking about a burst of dominance over a 2 or 3 year period...well Alvin is the conversation for the greatest defensive player in team history...but this is about a career, and he falls short in the career department.

Bruce otoh has a tenacity unmatched by just about anyone and extremely quick feed and that's pretty much every there is to Bruce.

Elliott was a fantastic defensive player in his prime with the Spurs. The Spurs used to whup the early 90's Bulls with regularity, even as they racked up the titles, and Elliott's defense on Michael Jordan as a primary reason for this. He contested every shot with everything he had during that era. If we'd had an inprime Elliott in 2001 we probably win 1 more title. Then again..the same could be said if we had Bowen That said...for whatever reasons health or desire, he didn't maintain his level of defensive play.

If push comes to shove I go with Bruce because he did it better for longer, not only in a Spurs uniform but overall.....there's pretty much nobody that Bruce hasn't defended in the course of this championship era that he hasn't put on his bitch list at least once.

The 2007 NBA finals pretty much locked up Bruce's place as the 3rd greatest defensive player in team history...IMO, he was the true MVP of that series. And the reason was because of his D on a player that is easily going to go down as one of the greatest in history. And you know...you look back at 2005 and Bruce made some pretty key plays in that title clincher as well.

I go
Drob
Duncan
Bruce
Elliott
Robertson

[whottt]

There have only been 4 guys to do it. Alvin, DRob, Hakeem, Nate Thurmond.

Well, officially that is. Blocks weren't kept as a stat back when Russell and Wilt played. Don't think steals were either. So there's a chance a couple more guys might have done it.

Johnny Moore was 1 steal short of doing it as well.

Wilt is also a guy that probably had a few of them...he lead the league in assists one year and from everything I've heard he blocked a lot of shots every game.

Guy had a couple of games of 20 points, 20 rebounds and 20 assists...without a doubt he had what would have been some 10 block games in that era as well.

[timvp]

Robinson
Bowen
Robertson
Elliott
Rodman
Duncan

In that order..Can't agree with Rodman over Duncan. Rodman wouldn't defend his man outside of the paint.

[timvp]

I go
Drob
Duncan
Bruce
Elliott
RobertsonI'd probably switch Robertson and Elliott. Although Elliott is no doubt the most underrated defender in Spurs history. During his prime, no one outside of San Antonio realized how good he was on D.

[SenorSpur]

Johnny Moore was 1 steal short of doing it as well.


Wow! Didn't know that. That would've been something to have had 3 Spurs accomplish such an improbably statistical feat.

[SenorSpur]

DRob was a great defensor, and a Big has always an advantage since he can really anchor a defense compared to a perimeter defensor, and rebounds and blocks .....

but i've never seen the same commitment to defend as i saw with Bruce.
it probably has to do with bruce lack of offensive skills. Bruce knows the only reason why he has seen playing time in one of the two or three best team of the league each year. because he defends.


You've obviously missed the greatness of Alvin Robertson.

[whottt]

Wow! Didn't know that. That would've been something to have had 3 Spurs accomplish such an improbably statistical feat.


Sure would have...and Duncan was 2 blocks short of one in game 6 of the 2003 NBA finals.

IIRC he had 20 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists and 8 blocks. So really they've almost had 4 of them.

I think the only other person that's come close since Drob did it was Chris Paul earlier this year and he had 8 steals.

I think Alvin's is the most impressive of them all though...it's tough to pull off a quad with steals, that's why he's the only one that's done it. He's also the only one to have a triple double with steals.

[ploto]

Elliott is no doubt the most underrated defender in Spurs history. During his prime, no one outside of San Antonio realized how good he was on D.

People forget what a great defender Sean was- even when he was ill that season.

[LakerHater]

I'd say Alvin Robertson & Sean Elliott

[Obstructed_View]

He's also the only one to have a triple double with steals.

The only Spur to do it. I remember Drexler getting 25 points, 10 rebounds, 10 steals and 9 assists in the season opener one year when he was with the Rockets.

[whottt]

The only Spur to do it. I remember Drexler getting 25 points, 10 rebounds, 10 steals and 9 assists in the season opener one year when he was with the Rockets.

Seriously? I thought there were only 3 10+ steal games in NBA history...Larry Kenon, Kendall Gill, and Alvin Robertson. I'll have to check it out.

Edit: LOL I just checked it out...Kendall Gill had a triple double the night he tied Kenon's record...so Alvin Robertson definitely wasn't the only one to do it even if Drexler didn't...I don't remember that game by Drexler though and that's a pretty impressive game. I don't even see 9 steals that much other than Paul doing it recently...I know Dirk did it a few years ago but other than that I can't think of it happening at all other than Gill.

[Obstructed_View]

Seriously? I thought there were only 3 10+ steal games in NBA history...Larry Kenon, Kendall Gill, and Alvin Robertson. I'll have to check it out.

I found Drexler's line on BR (http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199611010HOU.html).

MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
42 8 21 .381 2 5 .400 7 10 .700 4 6 10 9 10 0 7 2 25

He had 7 turnovers, so he was close to the quintuple.

[whottt]

I found Drexler's line on BR (http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199611010HOU.html).

MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
42 8 21 .381 2 5 .400 7 10 .700 4 6 10 9 10 0 7 2 25

He had 7 turnovers, so he was close to the quintuple.

:tu that's a pretty good game by Drexler. I guess there might have been a few more 10 steal games than I thought. I wonder if there are any others...I mean that mark of 11 has stood for a loooooong time so you wouldn't think there would be many.

[Obstructed_View]

:tu that's a pretty good game by Drexler. I guess there might have been a few more 10 steal games than I thought. I wonder if there are any others...I mean that mark of 11 has stood for a loooooong time so you wouldn't think there would be many.

Yeah, that's funny that someone hasn't gone off for one of those flukey Scott Skiles - Rony Seikally type nights in the steal department.

Iverson got 10 steals in a playoff game in '99, and it looks like KJ did it once as well. I suck at researching basketball stats.

[whottt]

Players with 10 steals in a game:

Rank Player STL Date
1. Kendall Gill 11 1999-04-03
2. Brandon Roy 10 2009-01-24
Michael Finley 10 2001-01-23
Mookie Blaylock 10 1998-04-14
Clyde Drexler 10 1996-11-01
Kevin Johnson 10 1993-12-09
Alvin Robertson 10 1990-11-19
Alvin Robertson 10 1989-01-11
Darrell Walker 10 1988-12-01
Michael Jordan 10 1988-01-29
Ron Harper 10 1987-03-10
Alvin Robertson 10 1986-11-22


Damn...Alvin Robertson had 3 of them all by himself. Finley pulled it off...jeez.

Brandon Roy did it this year...in fact he did it about a month and a half ago :lmao.

You'd think they'd make a bigger deal about it when it happens so people would know these sorts of things.

Way more players have done it than I thought...

[whottt]

Hmmm...that list sucks because Larry Kenon, the record holder for 33 years and counting, isn't on it.

Edit: And I just looked and that list only goes back to 1986...so it's possible many more players have pulled it off.


I'm still gonna say it''s tougher to pull off a quad double or a tripl double with steals than it is with blocks though and Robertson's is stll the most impressive to me.

[whottt]

Yeah, that's funny that someone hasn't gone off for one of those flukey Scott Skiles - Rony Seikally type nights in the steal department.

Iverson got 10 steals in a playoff game in '99, and it looks like KJ did it once as well. I suck at researching basketball stats.

Evidentally I suck at it too...

[Nathan Explosion]

People talking about how cool it would be to have 3 Spurs on the list are forgetting that it could have been 4 if New Jersey was dumb enough to keep driving the lane.

Game 6 2003 Finals

Tim Duncan 21 pts 20 reb 10 ast 8 blks

That is arguably one of the greatest (and most underrated) performances in Finals history.

No one talks about how dominant Duncan was in the game, or series for that matter.

[whottt]

People talking about how cool it would be to have 3 Spurs on the list are forgetting that it could have been 4 if New Jersey was dumb enough to keep driving the lane.

Game 6 2003 Finals

Tim Duncan 21 pts 20 reb 10 ast 8 blks

That is arguably one of the greatest (and most underrated) performances in Finals history.

No one talks about how dominant Duncan was in the game, or series for that matter.

Has been mentioned:


Sure would have...and Duncan was 2 blocks short of one in game 6 of the 2003 NBA finals.

IIRC he had 20 points, 20 rebounds, 10 assists and 8 blocks. So really they've almost had 4 of them.

I think the only other person that's come close since Drob did it was Chris Paul earlier this year and he had 8 steals.

I think Alvin's is the most impressive of them all though...it's tough to pull off a quad with steals, that's why he's the only one that's done it. He's also the only one to have a triple double with steals.

[Horse]

Career wise maybe, but that one season was enough to forever cement that thought.

Consider the stakes (WCF), motivation (Hakeem saying during the MVP ceremony that Robinson was holding HIS trophy), and the nature of the beat down, and what you get is one of the greatest offensive displays by a Spurs opponent EVER.

It hurts to say it, but on the strength of that one playoff series, Hakeem will forever own Robinson head to head.

Of course, in the ring department, they're even as can be. :king
Non-sense for one series yes he got him, But that does'nt mean he owns him. Their head to head records strongly favor Drob. And let's not forget hakeem owned everyone that year and the rockets beat like 3 60 win teams on the way to the championship.

[21_Blessings]

Bowen and Robinson. No one else really comes close, not even Duncan, who I think gets more credit than he actually deserves.

You mean Bowen gets more credit than he actually deserves. Bowen would have been a nobody without Duncan anchoring the paint all those years.

[wildbill2u]

is it easy to say that bruce bowen deserves that title? idk if anyone remembers this but derek anderson used to d up on kobe pretty well, def not the best but he was pretty crucial

Most of you won't remember Larry Kenon, but he was a hell of a defender and a stealing machine. He had to defend against the likes of Dr. J.

don't mean to take away from Bowen or DROB, but Kennon often gets overlooked.

[ambchang]

It would easily be David Robinson. People don't realize how good Robinson was not only on the ball, but in team defense. He once averaged 4.5 blocks a game, that is more than 6 TEAMS did that year. He was also the only player to rank in top 5 in 3 categories in the same season in steals, rebounds and blocks.

He defended Shaq as the primary defender, and limited him to 22.5 ppg for a whole series during Shaq's prime. That was nothing short of incredible.

Even for the Rockets series so often mentioned. Robinson had to defend Hakeem, and still cover Rodman leaving Horry for rebounds the whole series. Hakeem averaged 35 ppg , which was an incredible performance, but people don't realize that Hakeem hung 33ppg on constant Shaq and Ho Grant double teams the next series. Hakeem was just on fire and couldn't miss.

Finally, I have always thought that Robertson was a little overrated on defense. He was quick and strong, and can guard anyone on the perimeter, but he doesn't do it all the time. He gambles sometimes, and didn't have the discipline that Bowen or Elliott did.

My top:

Robinson
Bowen
Duncan
Eliott

[timvp]

Speaking of quadruple-doubles, it's only a matter of time before Chris Paul gets one. He's already getting triple-doubles and with the way he steals the ball, the quad will come sooner or later.