Parents, your kids aren't that special

[phyzik]

good article.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/03/03/cafferty.excerpt.2/index.html

I never presumed to have any more answers about being a parent than anybody else.

There are no perfect parents, perfect kids, perfect families -- only degrees of dysfunction.

You get up in the morning and do the best you can. At the end of the day you say, "Okay, that wasn't so bad, let's try it again tomorrow." Some of my instincts were pretty good and some of them were awful.

I did stay engaged and didn't say to hell with being a father when my first marriage ended. With the younger girls, I eventually made the choice to clean up my alcoholism before I pushed things to the point of no return. But most of the credit does to my second wife Carol; to the girls; and to God Almighty. Ultimately, I've just been very fortunate.

I don't know the status of parenting in America. But I know a little about the status of education in America. Parents' growing inability to impose manners and limits on their kids when the kids are in school is reflected in record dropout rates, as well as teen drug and alcohol abuse, teen sex, and unwed pregnancies. Maybe it's parenting that's on the decline, more than the schools.

Exhibit A: My wife and I have just been seated for dinner when the maitre d' walks over and seats a young family at the table next to us and the kids start carrying on like orangutans on a leash.

The parents are going, "Timmy, that's not nice, don't throw your food, stop stuffing your mashed potatoes up your nose." Are mom and dad having fun yet, picking food up off the floor, apologizing to people like us, and wiping food flung across the table off their faces?

Some parents still have this attitude that their kids are too special to be burdened by discipline. And the rest of us are supposed to put up with their little mutants. That attitude really pisses me off.

I hate to break it to them, but the kids aren't special, and I don't have to put up with their behavior. If you can't control your obnoxious little brats, leave them home.

They don't belong out in public annoying other people, period. I don't remember a generation of kids ever so indulged and enabled to behave so badly. What's going on?

I remember as a kid I was expected to behave myself out in public or suffer the wrath of one very angry father. And of all the things that used to piss him off, those expectations didn't seem unreasonable. Something's gone terribly wrong here. My guess is it has to do with the breakdown of authority, the collapse of strong family structure, and the abdication of parental responsibility, dictated in part by the necessity that both parents work.

Plus, we have a whole generation of Baby Boomers who are too busy feeling entitled to prolong their own self-indulgent, self-absorbed adolescences to rein in their own kids.

[BacktoBasics]

I went to lunch the other day and two booths down this fucking kid was kicking the booth with the back of his foot.

bang, bang, bang. It just went on and on for more than the proverbial 15 seconds of attention deficient disorder.

I looked over with a curious look not an angry one just so the parents would see that someone was wondering what all the racket was about. She just whispered to him. He stopped and then about 2 minutes later he went at it again. Continued to bang it out while they ordered all the way up until their appetizers arrived. I couldn't take it anymore.

I sized the guy up just to make sure that if I mouthed off I wouldn't have too much of problem. Guy looked like a real vagina so I walked over.

Me: You need to tell him to stop or take him outside. I don't get many days off. 2 a month to be exact. I want to enjoy my lunch in a reasonable amount of peace and quiet. I don't mean to be offensive I just want it to stop.

Guy: FINE. WE JUST WON'T EAT HERE.

He then drops some money on the table and leaves all pissed off. As if this was some how my fault. Before he left....

Me: You don't have to get all pissed off about it. Just ask him to stop.

The guy: Fuck you.

He left and that was that. Totally fucking ridiculous. Even worse how he reacted to it.

[CubanMustGo]

Plus, we have a whole generation of Baby Boomers who are too busy feeling entitled to prolong their own self-indulgent, self-absorbed adolescences to rein in their own kids.

While not disagreeing that this is an accurate description, the Boomer generation is, at its youngest, 44 this year. Most parents of young children are Generation X (ages 28-43) or young Gen Y.

[resistanze]

I went to lunch the other day and two booths down this fucking kid was kicking the booth with the back of his foot.

bang, bang, bang. It just went on and on for more than the proverbial 15 seconds of attention deficient disorder.

I looked over with a curious look not an angry one just so the parents would see that someone was wondering what all the racket was about. She just whispered to him. He stopped and then about 2 minutes later he went at it again. Continued to bang it out while they ordered all the way up until their appetizers arrived. I couldn't take it anymore.

I sized the guy up just to make sure that if I mouthed off I wouldn't have too much of problem. Guy looked like a real vagina so I walked over.

Me: You need to tell him to stop or take him outside. I don't get many days off. 2 a month to be exact. I want to enjoy my lunch in a reasonable amount of peace and quiet. I don't mean to be offensive I just want it to stop.

Guy: FINE. WE JUST WON'T EAT HERE.

He then drops some money on the table and leaves all pissed off. As if this was some how my fault. Before he left....

Me: You don't have to get all pissed off about it. Just ask him to stop.

The guy: Fuck you.

He left and that was that. Totally fucking ridiculous. Even worse how he reacted to it.

My mother would've smacked me in public, removed me from the diner, then slapped the shit outta me in the car. That kind of behavior didn't even cross my mind as a kid.

[JoeChalupa]

If that were my child all it would have taken is one look and it would have stopped.

[BacktoBasics]

If that were my child all it would have taken is one look and it would have stopped.Right before I had my son I thought to myself and even discussed with my wife how we were going to parent him. Spankings, talking, timeout etc... I had planned to be more verbal than physical but ultimately I've relegated myself to giving the verbal talk and if it continues I go right to the bare ass spanking. It took about a year of good solid physical spankings to make an impact. So now about 70% of the time the verbal with the threat of the spanking seems to yield results.

[DarkReign]

My mother would've smacked me in public, removed me from the diner, then slapped the shit outta me in the car. That kind of behavior didn't even cross my mind as a kid.


If that were my child all it would have taken is one look and it would have stopped.

Same here, but in reverse order.

My father never took us out to eat as a family. Not because of my bothers and I, but because of other families.

He couldnt stand undisciplined children and the weak willed parents who allowed it.

[SpursStalker]

If that were my child all it would have taken is one look and it would have stopped.

+1

To this day ... I still get my girls with the look.

For the record ... so does my mom.

:lol

[I Love Me Some Me]

While not disagreeing that this is an accurate description, the Boomer generation is, at its youngest, 44 this year. Most parents of young children are Generation X (ages 28-43) or young Gen Y.

Hmm....I wonder what landmark decision about our public school system was made about 40 years ago?

[Blake]

Same here, but in reverse order.

My father never took us out to eat as a family. Not because of my bothers and I, but because of other families.

He couldnt stand undisciplined children and the weak willed parents who allowed it.

sucks for you

I find this to be a problem maybe once out of every 100 trips to a restaurant.

I find this to be a problem at movie theaters every time.

[RandomGuy]

Right before I had my son I thought to myself and even discussed with my wife how we were going to parent him. Spankings, talking, timeout etc... I had planned to be more verbal than physical but ultimately I've relegated myself to giving the verbal talk and if it continues I go right to the bare ass spanking. It took about a year of good solid physical spankings to make an impact. So now about 70% of the time the verbal with the threat of the spanking seems to yield results.

Ditto.

We still do the timeout thing for relatively minor things, but save the butt whoopin' for really bad things like deliberately hitting their siblings, or outright angry and disrespectful behavior.

One GREAT way to discipline kids is to simply threaten to take their favorite toys away. If they throw a toy while being in an angry fit, that toy will 50% of the time end up in the dumpster or Goodwill (depending on how beat-up/cheap it is) the next day, depending on how really attached they are to the toy.

They know that if they throw things those toys go away.

Same thing for toys that they fight over. I will tell them to work it out, and suggest a reasonable alternative, but if they still can't work it out, the toy goes into "toy timeout" for the day. If that doesn't work then that toy ends up at Goodwill too. Better to have peace and a willingness to work out a sharing routine than a toy that they endlessly fight over.

The thing to remember is to ALWAYS make them understand why they are being punished, that it is the behavior we don't like, and that we still love them 100%.

[Dex]

I went to lunch the other day and two booths down this fucking kid was kicking the booth with the back of his foot.

bang, bang, bang. It just went on and on for more than the proverbial 15 seconds of attention deficient disorder.

I looked over with a curious look not an angry one just so the parents would see that someone was wondering what all the racket was about. She just whispered to him. He stopped and then about 2 minutes later he went at it again. Continued to bang it out while they ordered all the way up until their appetizers arrived. I couldn't take it anymore.

I sized the guy up just to make sure that if I mouthed off I wouldn't have too much of problem. Guy looked like a real vagina so I walked over.

Me: You need to tell him to stop or take him outside. I don't get many days off. 2 a month to be exact. I want to enjoy my lunch in a reasonable amount of peace and quiet. I don't mean to be offensive I just want it to stop.

Guy: FINE. WE JUST WON'T EAT HERE.

He then drops some money on the table and leaves all pissed off. As if this was some how my fault. Before he left....

Me: You don't have to get all pissed off about it. Just ask him to stop.

The guy: Fuck you.

He left and that was that. Totally fucking ridiculous. Even worse how he reacted to it.

I guess we know why his kid acts like a big baby. Like father, like son.

[RandomGuy]

Same here, but in reverse order.

My father never took us out to eat as a family. Not because of my bothers and I, but because of other families.

He couldnt stand undisciplined children and the weak willed parents who allowed it.

On the rare occasions that we go out to the store/restaurant with the whole family, we actually use that as a teaching tool.

"Little RG jr., is that child being good?"

"Should they be screaming like that?"

"Would you get the toy you wanted if you acted like that?"

"What would happen if you did that?"

It makes them aware of how their actions seem to others, and I think makes a good impression that sticks with them.

[ploto]

save the butt whoopin' for really bad things like deliberately hitting their siblings
?

[RandomGuy]

I guess we know why his kid acts like a big baby. Like father, like son.

Kids learn what you teach them, and you teach them every minute of everyday, whether you are aware of it or not.

You ALWAYS have to be asking yourself "What am I teaching them right now?"

If the answer isn't something you want to teach them, you need to change what you are doing.

My worst habit:

Zoning out on the computer with a game or something when they want to play. I am teaching them that the computer is more important than they are. I have had to shake myself loose and make sure I don't do this. This has to be balanced with some "me" time, as they should learn that Daddy loves them, even if he doesn't always play hide and seek every time they want to.

[RandomGuy]

?

A bit hypocritical, yes. "you shouldn't hit your brother and if you do, you will get a spanking".

It really depends on if they hurt their sibling or not. No real harm, time out. Deliberately knocking them in the head with a solid toy: spanking.

[JoeChalupa]

Right before I had my son I thought to myself and even discussed with my wife how we were going to parent him. Spankings, talking, timeout etc... I had planned to be more verbal than physical but ultimately I've relegated myself to giving the verbal talk and if it continues I go right to the bare ass spanking. It took about a year of good solid physical spankings to make an impact. So now about 70% of the time the verbal with the threat of the spanking seems to yield results.

I only had to spank mine a few times to get the message across and while I received an old fashioned spanking mine were firm hand swats to the buttocks. Spanking has worked for us but now the losing of their perks works as great motivation for them to behave.

[CuckingFunt]

I used to have endless problems with this at my old job. So many times people would come in with their kids, who would immediately run to the back desks and start poking at the computers or the copiers or something, and I had to be the one to go grab them by the hand and walk them up to the front of the office while their parent(s) (happened with mothers as often as fathers) was weakly repeating "Michael, honey, come up here with me." Drove me crazy. Holding onto your brat shouldn't be that tough to figure out when you're going into someone's office.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Looking back on it now I don't know how they instilled it in us, but somehow the five kids in my family realized that if one of us pissed off our parents we'd all have to contend with them being in a shitty mood, so if one of us started acting up in public there were usually four people putting a stop to it before my parents had to do anything.

[Dex]

According to Mom, I'd taken my 'last trip to the store' about 637 times. But she still knew how to shut me up when I needed to be shut up.

As for misbehaving around Dad, well....that just didn't happen a whole lot. You know he didn't have any qualms calling you out about it.

Some people don't seem to understand the fine line between disciplining your child, and 'being the bad guy.' Sometimes, the two pretty much go hand in hand, but that's the value of teaching a child right from wrong.

When I worked at Academy, some parents would let their kids run amok. Throwing balls around, riding the bikes, knocking over shelves. The sort of stuff kids do, but you'd expect them to get punished for. Instead, these parents would almost act indignant when you so much as insinuate that they watch after their kids.

America's going to Hell in a handbasket, and these kids will be driving the train. And to think, people were scared of my generation taking charge...

[desflood]

I find this to be a problem at movie theaters every time.
We must be doing something right; my kids constantly shush other (wilder) kids in theaters :lol

[Ballcox]

Too many parents out there want to be 'friends' with their kids all the time, just have fun and not impose any consequences or expectations. I call bullshit on that, you can't be a friend to your kids all the time, there are times you HAVE to be a parent. That means you might impose a restriction or a consequence on your kid and he/she might not like you very much for the next hour (or in the case of my 15yr. old daughter 2-3 days) or so.

Get over it, your kids will benefit in the long run when they learn at home that the world has consequences, that you have to be accountable for your actions. Parenting to me, at this time in history, is on the brink of extinction.

[mrsmaalox]

Every time I see a parent with a kid in melt down mode, I smile sweetly to them and think "Hahaha I'm glad it's you and not me!"

[Blake]

too many parents out there want to be 'friends' with their kids all the time, just have fun and not impose any consequences or expectations. I call bullshit on that, you can't be a friend to your kids all the time, there are times you have to be a parent. That means you might impose a restriction or a consequence on your kid and he/she might not like you very much for the next hour (or in the case of my 15yr. Old daughter 2-3 days) or so.

Get over it, your kids will benefit in the long run when they learn at home that the world has consequences, that you have to be accountable for your actions. Parenting to me, at this time in history, is on the brink of extinction.

+1000

[Drachen]

Ditto.

We still do the timeout thing for relatively minor things, but save the butt whoopin' for really bad things like deliberately hitting their siblings, or outright angry and disrespectful behavior.

One GREAT way to discipline kids is to simply threaten to take their favorite toys away. If they throw a toy while being in an angry fit, that toy will 50% of the time end up in the dumpster or Goodwill (depending on how beat-up/cheap it is) the next day, depending on how really attached they are to the toy.

They know that if they throw things those toys go away.

Same thing for toys that they fight over. I will tell them to work it out, and suggest a reasonable alternative, but if they still can't work it out, the toy goes into "toy timeout" for the day. If that doesn't work then that toy ends up at Goodwill too. Better to have peace and a willingness to work out a sharing routine than a toy that they endlessly fight over.

The thing to remember is to ALWAYS make them understand why they are being punished, that it is the behavior we don't like, and that we still love them 100%.

Ok, so I have to ask yall, since we are on the subject. Maybe you have some ideas to help me out. I have never met anyone like my fiance's daughter. She is 11 and she is diagnosed with a whole host of letters (OCD, ADHD, ODD, etc). I have NO, literally ZERO ideas left on how to make her behave. It is literally a daily battle. She is fine unless you ask her to do something, ANYTHING. She doesn't care about anything but herself. Take her toys away, and she will cry and complain at the moment they are taken, but that really only lasts about 10 minutes, after that, she doesn't care. Threaten to take more, same deal. She literally has no attachment to anything. Try to put her in her room able to do nothing, and it doesn't affect her. I have literally taken EVERYTHING, all the way down to her sheets away from her (trying to make it like jail because I caught her stealing), and it didn't matter after the first 10 minutes. Yes, I have tried spanking and the threat works about 3% of the time, and yes, I follow through. I was raised much like yall were, if you acted up, it progressed from the look all the way through the butt-whoopin (I actually got ringworm when I was 6 and couldn't go to the doctory because my mom had whooped my butt a day earlier and I had the thigh bruises). I have tried everything that was done to me as a child, even if my parents did it only once (kneel up on the brick in front of the fireplace for 1.5 hours, etc). Yes she is in therapy, meds, all that. The worst part about all this is that she doesn't think right. I am of the analytical/logical persuation in my thought process, and she is the exact opposite (irrational/tripping?). when she gets punished (after warnings times infinity) she always asks "why are you doing this?" then as we explain AGAIN, she says "why are you doing this?" I get very frustrated because she can't think right. I am a very patient person and always thought that I would be the laid back type parent, but I cannot be. It is frustrating because I know there are a lot of you out there that ask eachother "why won't these people discipline their child" when you see her in a store, but the point of the matter is that we do, there is just nothing that works.

So there is my rant, any ideas?

[easjer]

Drachen - traditional punishments are unlikely to work, as you've discovered, because she doesn't think the same way another child without her issues might think. Most children get the reward/consequences thing, but she doesn't seem to have that attention span.

The best advice I can give (and I am a non-parent) is to talk with her psychiatrist and a child behavior specialist to give you better insight into what the best parenting (and therefore punishment) strategies would be and why they think that would work.

[Kriz-Maxima]

I was never hit as a child, one stare from my mother was enough to keep me in line. Although I always knew that the threat of me getting hit was there, it was never necessary. My brother and sisters did get hit, but very rarely. My mother was really intimidating.

[RandomGuy]

Hmm.

Not really. If this is some kind of genuinely biological malfunction, then I don't know if there is anything that would work.

I have learned a great deal from watching the Nanny 9-11 and Supernanny shows. The nannies there tend to have advanced degrees in child development, so they know a thing or two.

You could try giving them a call for some real professional help. I think the answers you need are probably within the realm of specialists.

[Blake]

Ok, so I have to ask yall, since we are on the subject. Maybe you have some ideas to help me out. I have never met anyone like my fiance's daughter. She is 11 and she is diagnosed with a whole host of letters (OCD, ADHD, ODD, etc). I have NO, literally ZERO ideas left on how to make her behave. It is literally a daily battle. She is fine unless you ask her to do something, ANYTHING. She doesn't care about anything but herself. Take her toys away, and she will cry and complain at the moment they are taken, but that really only lasts about 10 minutes, after that, she doesn't care. Threaten to take more, same deal. She literally has no attachment to anything. Try to put her in her room able to do nothing, and it doesn't affect her. I have literally taken EVERYTHING, all the way down to her sheets away from her (trying to make it like jail because I caught her stealing), and it didn't matter after the first 10 minutes. Yes, I have tried spanking and the threat works about 3% of the time, and yes, I follow through. I was raised much like yall were, if you acted up, it progressed from the look all the way through the butt-whoopin (I actually got ringworm when I was 6 and couldn't go to the doctory because my mom had whooped my butt a day earlier and I had the thigh bruises). I have tried everything that was done to me as a child, even if my parents did it only once (kneel up on the brick in front of the fireplace for 1.5 hours, etc). Yes she is in therapy, meds, all that. The worst part about all this is that she doesn't think right. I am of the analytical/logical persuation in my thought process, and she is the exact opposite (irrational/tripping?). when she gets punished (after warnings times infinity) she always asks "why are you doing this?" then as we explain AGAIN, she says "why are you doing this?" I get very frustrated because she can't think right. I am a very patient person and always thought that I would be the laid back type parent, but I cannot be. It is frustrating because I know there are a lot of you out there that ask eachother "why won't these people discipline their child" when you see her in a store, but the point of the matter is that we do, there is just nothing that works.

So there is my rant, any ideas?

just curious,

why are you the one dishing out punishment to her daughter and how long have you been doing this?

[Blake]

Hmm.

Not really. If this is some kind of genuinely biological malfunction, then I don't know if there is anything that would work.

I have learned a great deal from watching the Nanny 9-11 and Supernanny shows. The nannies there tend to have advanced degrees in child development, so they know a thing or two.

You could try giving them a call for some real professional help. I think the answers you need are probably within the realm of specialists.

you watch supernanny?

[Extra Stout]

1. Society works hard and becomes prosperous.
2. There is so much prosperity that it becomes possible to be comfortable without working hard.
3. The kids of these prosperous hard workers don't work as hard because they don't have to.
4. They are prosperous anyway.
5. Their kids work even less hard.
6. They are still pretty prosperous.
7. Society stops thinking there is a connection between working hard and prospering. Prosperity is taken as a given.
8. Society becomes so committed to not working hard that it finds new ways not to work, such as not committing to families, and not raising its children.
9. Children become undisciplined and stupid.
10. Society blames somebody else for its undisciplined, stupid children.
11. The undisciplined, stupid children grow to become undisciplined, stupid adults.
12. Prosperity fades.
13. Society blames someone else for the fading prosperity.
14. The undisciplined, stupid adults have children they don't raise, who become even more undisciplined and stupid.
15. Cycle repeates for several generations.
16. Prosperity disappears.
17. Society becomes feral and ceases to be society.
18. Collapse.

[desflood]

1. Society works hard and becomes prosperous.
2. There is so much prosperity that it becomes possible to be comfortable without working hard.
3. The kids of these prosperous hard workers don't work as hard because they don't have to.
4. They are prosperous anyway.
5. Their kids work even less hard.
6. They are still pretty prosperous.
7. Society stops thinking there is a connection between working hard and prospering. Prosperity is taken as a given.
8. Society becomes so committed to not working hard that it finds new ways not to work, such as not committing to families, and not raising its children.
9. Children become undisciplined and stupid.
10. Society blames somebody else for its undisciplined, stupid children.
11. The undisciplined, stupid children grow to become undisciplined, stupid adults.
12. Prosperity fades.
13. Society blames someone else for the fading prosperity.
14. The undisciplined, stupid adults have children they don't raise, who become even more undisciplined and stupid.
15. Cycle repeates for several generations.
16. Prosperity disappears.
17. Society becomes feral and ceases to be society.
18. Collapse.
:lol

I tried to sig this the first time you put it up, but unfortunately it's too long.

[MiamiHeat]

Hmm....I wonder what landmark decision about our public school system was made about 40 years ago?

desegregating schools?

[Blake]

1. Society works hard and becomes prosperous.
2. There is so much prosperity that it becomes possible to be comfortable without working hard.
3. The kids of these prosperous hard workers don't work as hard because they don't have to.
4. They are prosperous anyway.
5. Their kids work even less hard.
6. They are still pretty prosperous.
7. Society stops thinking there is a connection between working hard and prospering. Prosperity is taken as a given.
8. Society becomes so committed to not working hard that it finds new ways not to work, such as not committing to families, and not raising its children.
9. Children become undisciplined and stupid.
10. Society blames somebody else for its undisciplined, stupid children.
11. The undisciplined, stupid children grow to become undisciplined, stupid adults.
12. Prosperity fades.
13. Society blames someone else for the fading prosperity.
14. The undisciplined, stupid adults have children they don't raise, who become even more undisciplined and stupid.
15. Cycle repeates for several generations.
16. Prosperity disappears.
17. Society becomes feral and ceases to be society.
18. Collapse.

I like it, but it's got too many underlying assumptions that aren't realistic.

[desflood]

Hmm....I wonder what landmark decision about our public school system was made about 40 years ago?
There was this one...

http://www.scrollpublishing.com/store/Abingdon-School-District.html

[I Love Me Some Me]

There was this one...

http://www.scrollpublishing.com/store/Abingdon-School-District.html

Winner winner, chicken dinner.

[RandomGuy]

you watch supernanny?

I am guessing that you are being a bit sarcastic/joking, but on the off chance it isn't:

Every once in a while. Once you watch a few episodes, they kinda all are pretty much the same.

99% of the time, it isn't really the kids' fault, it is shitty parents who never follow through or provide real consequences for mishavior.

For me it is kinda like watching a trainwreck or some similar tragedy.

I will say that I have learned a few very useful techniques from the shows, and they really do work.

[Drachen]

just curious,

why are you the one dishing out punishment to her daughter and how long have you been doing this?

Sorry, I should clarify this. We dish out the punishment, it is just that I am the one with (formerly) fresh ideas. We have been together for about 3 years and I have been a part of the discipline cycle for about 2.

[Strike]

good article.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/03/03/cafferty.excerpt.2/index.html

So glad I don't have kids.

[Blake]

Sorry, I should clarify this. We dish out the punishment, it is just that I am the one with (formerly) fresh ideas. We have been together for about 3 years and I have been a part of the discipline cycle for about 2.

Ive got a brother in law in the same boat.

His wife's kid is a freakin tasmanian devil that he has no chance of controlling. He met her when the kid was about 6....

By this age it's almost too late. The kid has gotten used to doing things and getting away with things for a few years already. Now all of a sudden the rules are getting stricter and the kid is confused and is retaliating.

I don't know you or your fiancee obviously, but I can't help but think she was too easy going on her when she was younger and now it's made it tough on you when you try to bring the hammer down.

[Vinnie_Johnson]

If that was one of my boys I would have just said stop at once or no Wii when you get home. That does it every time they know I mean it and they don't push me. Now when they turn into teens I am screwed this won't work I will have to come up with a new one.

[phyzik]

Ok, so I have to ask yall, since we are on the subject. Maybe you have some ideas to help me out. I have never met anyone like my fiance's daughter. She is 11 and she is diagnosed with a whole host of letters (OCD, ADHD, ODD, etc). I have NO, literally ZERO ideas left on how to make her behave. It is literally a daily battle. She is fine unless you ask her to do something, ANYTHING. She doesn't care about anything but herself. Take her toys away, and she will cry and complain at the moment they are taken, but that really only lasts about 10 minutes, after that, she doesn't care. Threaten to take more, same deal. She literally has no attachment to anything. Try to put her in her room able to do nothing, and it doesn't affect her. I have literally taken EVERYTHING, all the way down to her sheets away from her (trying to make it like jail because I caught her stealing), and it didn't matter after the first 10 minutes. Yes, I have tried spanking and the threat works about 3% of the time, and yes, I follow through. I was raised much like yall were, if you acted up, it progressed from the look all the way through the butt-whoopin (I actually got ringworm when I was 6 and couldn't go to the doctory because my mom had whooped my butt a day earlier and I had the thigh bruises). I have tried everything that was done to me as a child, even if my parents did it only once (kneel up on the brick in front of the fireplace for 1.5 hours, etc). Yes she is in therapy, meds, all that. The worst part about all this is that she doesn't think right. I am of the analytical/logical persuation in my thought process, and she is the exact opposite (irrational/tripping?). when she gets punished (after warnings times infinity) she always asks "why are you doing this?" then as we explain AGAIN, she says "why are you doing this?" I get very frustrated because she can't think right. I am a very patient person and always thought that I would be the laid back type parent, but I cannot be. It is frustrating because I know there are a lot of you out there that ask eachother "why won't these people discipline their child" when you see her in a store, but the point of the matter is that we do, there is just nothing that works.

So there is my rant, any ideas?

Take it to the next level. Enrole her ass in boot camp. If you cant control her short of abuse, put her unruely ass in a boot camp. Trust me. Your significant other might not like it, but its the best thing.

If you have gone to counseling and tried everything else besides duct taping her ass and leaving her in a corner, send her to boot camp.

SEND HER TO BOOT CAMP!

If that doesnt do it... SEND HER AGAIN!

You, and her mother, have to be prepared though. She will say they are beating her and torturing her. she will say ANYTHING to get out of there. Tell her she should have thought about that before it came to this point.... AND SEND HER ASS AGAIN!!!

Oh yes, she will learn.... You will see. You cant beat her.... but IF its necessary... they can.

It may sound cruel but if she is that bad, then she deserves an old fashioned ass kicking.

I talked a friend of mine and his new chic and had them send her daughter to boot camp because she was the same way.... now she is practically an angel when they ask her to do something.

Boot camp isnt all about beating them until they listen though, thats probably only 5% of it. They teach them discipline, self respect and, above all, respect for others. If you know anyone in the military, ask them how boot camp changed them.

At the very least, she will realize how easy she has it with you and her mother.

Im sorry, but Im tired of the ADD excuse... fuck that shit. I had the same problems when I was a kid and didnt have to take any medication. I just got my ass beat the fuck out of me. I turned out all right.

I had a counselor as well. My parents where told I would be dead by 18 because I was so crazy. Im 29 now. I have 2 vehicles of my own and a project vehicle with a friend of mine, not to mention my own house thats paid off. Im not singling you out but parents as a whole need to stop being such fucking pussies, its a misconception that cops are going to take you in for spanking your kid. For the most part, if its warranted, cops will agree with the parents.

(I keep adding to this post :lol )

If anything, if the kid threatens to call in on child abuse, you go ahead and call the police (make sure its the non-emergency number) and call the kids bluff, ask to speak to an officer and calmly explain what happened and then hand the phone to your kid and have them explain to the officer why they got spanked. They will break down and wont talk, and if they do, the cop will take your side. Guaranteed.

[Spur-Addict]

tmQH5PrvN-Q

[Blake]

Take it to the next level. Enrole her ass in boot camp. If you cant control her short of abuse, put her unruely ass in a boot camp. Trust me. Your significant other might not like it, but its the best thing.

If you have gone to counseling and tried everything else besides duct taping her ass and leaving her in a corner, send her to boot camp.

SEND HER TO BOOT CAMP!

If that doesnt do it... SEND HER AGAIN!

You, and her mother, have to be prepared though. She will say they are beating her and torturing her. she will say ANYTHING to get out of there. Tell her she should have thought about that before it came to this point.... AND SEND HER ASS AGAIN!!!

Oh yes, she will learn.... You will see. You cant beat her.... but IF its necessary... they can.

It may sound cruel but if she is that bad, then she deserves an old fashioned ass kicking.

I talked a friend of mine and his new chic and had them send her daughter to boot camp because she was the same way.... now she is practically an angel when they ask her to do something.

Boot camp isnt all about beating them until they listen though, thats probably only 5% of it. They teach them discipline, self respect and, above all, respect for others. If you know anyone in the military, ask them how boot camp changed them.

At the very least, she will realize how easy she has it with you and her mother.

Im sorry, but Im tired of the ADD excuse... fuck that shit. I had the same problems when I was a kid and didnt have to take any medication. I just got my ass beat the fuck out of me. I turned out all right.

I had a counselor as well. My parents where told I would be dead by 18 because I was so crazy. Im 29 now. I have 2 vehicles of my own and a project vehicle with a friend of mine, not to mention my own house thats paid off. Im not singling you out but parents as a whole need to stop being such fucking pussies, its a misconception that cops are going to take you in for spanking your kid. For the most part, if its warranted, cops will agree with the parents.

(I keep adding to this post :lol )

If anything, if the kid threatens to call in on child abuse, you go ahead and call the police (make sure its the non-emergency number) and call the kids bluff, ask to speak to an officer and calmly explain what happened and then hand the phone to your kid and have them explain to the officer why they got spanked. They will break down and wont talk, and if they do, the cop will take your side. Guaranteed.

so where exactly are you saying to send her? I'm not getting it.

[Drachen]

so where exactly are you saying to send her? I'm not getting it.

If you don't like ADD, I have to ask, do you know what ODD is? Look it up, it will blow you away what the classify as a mental health issue. I will wait until you look it up to discuss my thoughts on the matter. Just know that my jaw almost dropped to the floor.

[DarkReign]

If you don't like ADD, I have to ask, do you know what ODD is?

http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_for_families/children_with_oppositional_defiant_disorder

WTF?! Thats a mental disorder now?!

I hate this world, I really do. Humans are dangerously close to not really deserving to live anymore.

[Blake]

If you don't like ADD, I have to ask, do you know what ODD is? Look it up, it will blow you away what the classify as a mental health issue. I will wait until you look it up to discuss my thoughts on the matter. Just know that my jaw almost dropped to the floor.

oh wow.......I thought you made up "ODD"....

.....any excuse for doctors and pharms to make a few extra bucks

[phyzik]

so where exactly are you saying to send her? I'm not getting it.

http://www.boot-camp-boot-camps.com/

Lots of information there.


Boot Camp Overview
Started as an alternative to jail for juvenile adolescents, there are serveral types of teen boot camps from state run to privately run where the teen will be mentally and physically challenged. These facilities can be a starting place for getting your teen help. In both the state and private environment the camps goal is to scare kids straight generally only giving a good short-term solution. Parents often seek out boot camps with the assumption that a "wake up call" is all that is needed for their troubled teen.

Boot camps for troubled teens Boot Camps are often short-term, however, long-term boot camps have increased in popularity for their ability to help defiant adolescents improve their behavior at home and school. They are modeled after military-style, military exercises, and intense physical training focusing on reality, respect and responsibility. Many teens lack these qualities, yet they desperately need them in order to successfully transition into adulthood. This experience can help teens replace destructive attitudes and behaviors with new perspectives and direction in their lives. The theology behind a short-term camp being that a "quick reality check" will turn a child around who has been acting out. These boot camp style programs are usually ineffective for teens that have developed bad habits over a long period of time and are in need of long term change.

[Drachen]

oh wow.......I thought you made up "ODD"....

.....any excuse for doctors and pharms to make a few extra bucks

When I was a little kid, ODD was called BAB. Being a Brat, and meds were not the cure. Anyway, just thought I would enlighten you.

[Blake]

http://www.boot-camp-boot-camps.com/

Lots of information there.

so......where exactly are you suggesting to send them?

[desflood]

My husband has a friend whose son has been diagnosed with ODD - I read the list of symptoms and told him, "Your buddy's kids sounds like a spoiled brat to me."

[phyzik]

so......where exactly are you suggesting to send them?

Look, Im not going to do all the work for you.... There are lots of military schools in Texas and other states. Its up to you and her mother to take the initiative to do something about it.

Here's another link specific to San Antonio (which I presume you live in). If your serious about fixing the problem, just do some research. If she is REALLY seeing a counselor then ask them, I guarantee they have some recommendations.

http://www.thefamilycompass.com/militaryschoolsinsanantonio.htm

Because you keep questioning me about it makes me think either your full of shit or you are too scared to propose the idea to the mother. Either way, I've provided enough information to help you out. All you have to do is contact someone from one of those sites if you have more questions about their programs.

I wont name a specific school because some are better than others for certain "problem childs". Its up to you and the mother to figure out which one would be best. I dont know the girl and wont presume that I know whats best for her, its up to you to decide.

[MrChug]

Can we put it more plainly? Listen to a genious, the late great George Carlin:

f3XeRCAAkZY

[Drachen]

Look, Im not going to do all the work for you.... There are lots of military schools in Texas and other states. Its up to you and her mother to take the initiative to do something about it.

Here's another link specific to San Antonio (which I presume you live in). If your serious about fixing the problem, just do some research. If she is REALLY seeing a counselor then ask them, I guarantee they have some recommendations.

http://www.thefamilycompass.com/militaryschoolsinsanantonio.htm

Because you keep questioning me about it makes me think either your full of shit or you are too scared to propose the idea to the mother. Either way, I've provided enough information to help you out. All you have to do is contact someone from one of those sites if you have more questions about their programs.

I wont name a specific school because some are better than others for certain "problem childs". Its up to you and the mother to figure out which one would be best. I dont know the girl and wont presume that I know whats best for her, its up to you to decide.

Ha Ha, I think you are getting a little mixed up. I am the one who was discussing the problem child. I have a sneaking suspicion that the poster who is repeatedly asking you "but where would you send her?" is just being facetious since you repeated "send her to boot camp" about 6 times in 3 lines of your first post. I do appreciate the information, thanks. (read poster's names next time, don't worry though, happens to the best of us)

[Homeland Security]

I could waterboard her. I bet that would fix the behavior.

[Cry Havoc]

Look, Im not going to do all the work for you.... There are lots of military schools in Texas and other states. Its up to you and her mother to take the initiative to do something about it.

Here's another link specific to San Antonio (which I presume you live in). If your serious about fixing the problem, just do some research. If she is REALLY seeing a counselor then ask them, I guarantee they have some recommendations.

http://www.thefamilycompass.com/militaryschoolsinsanantonio.htm

Because you keep questioning me about it makes me think either your full of shit or you are too scared to propose the idea to the mother. Either way, I've provided enough information to help you out. All you have to do is contact someone from one of those sites if you have more questions about their programs.

I wont name a specific school because some are better than others for certain "problem childs". Its up to you and the mother to figure out which one would be best. I dont know the girl and wont presume that I know whats best for her, its up to you to decide.

Military schools will not work for children with such behaviors. You cannot beat them into submission. They will die or become so deranged that they are put into a mental institution.

I suggest you do a little research or have a background in Psychology before giving out such heavy-handed advice.