Initial Reaction: Spurs @ Pacers - Apr. 3

[timvp]

http://www.spurstalk.com/box1apr3.jpg
http://www.spurstalk.com/box2apr3.jpg

Riding into Indianapolis with a two-game losing streak, the Spurs were able to escape with a shootout victory. Led by Tony Parker's 31 points and ten assists, San Antonio survived a furious rally by the Pacers in the fourth quarter and put just enough point on the board to leave Indiana with the W.

Overall, this isn't a victory to be too thrilled about if you are a Spurs fan. The defense was poor, especially in the second and fourth quarters, and the Spurs needed a heroic five-point flurry from Parker late in the fourth to get on top for good.

As for the Pacers, they deserve a good amount of credit for making life tough on San Antonio's defense. They can go small and put perimeter threats at each position. Indiana also has a number of players who can create off the dribble. If they get hot from the perimeter, there aren't many teams that have the defense that can slow their roll.

The most important aspect of this game was just getting the win. It wasn't pretty and it wasn't Spurs Basketball, but it was a victory. Plus, seeing the offense flowing after the recent struggles was good to see.

-Tim Duncan only played 28 minutes but I thought he looked healthier in his time out on the court. He got a key tip-in late in the game that extended the lead to five points. Duncan's passing was once again very good. However, when isolated against a smaller player on defense, it's still obvious that he has a ways to go before he's back to his usual mobility level. Duncan's speed up and down the court and his side-to-side quickness are still lacking.

-Well, I guess Manu Ginobili is no longer seeing his minutes limited. He led the Spurs with 36 minutes and stuffed the stat sheet with 16 points, seven rebounds and seven assists. Ginobili also finished the game without a turnover. Offensively, I thought he did well. He picked his spots and his patience was better than we've seen since his return. Defensively, he started off really bad and slowly worked his way up to below average.

-In the last three games, Tony Parker had been tiptoeing his way around the offense. With the Big Three back, he had lost most of his aggressiveness and wasn't creating as much for himself or others. Tonight, he was back to the Parker who has carried the Spurs since the All-Star break. He got a little loose with the ball at times but on the whole I thought he did a very fine job on the offensive end. With the Spurs down by two points and under two minutes to go, Parker hit a three-pointer and then followed it up with a long jumper to put the Spurs up by three. Defensively, while his effort was consistent, the results were often lacking.

-On offense, Michael Finley showed why Pop has seemingly elevated him into the Big Four. Playing 34 minutes, Finley knocked won 7-of-11 shots from the field and his scoring was key to help build the lead in the first three quarters. However, he missed both of his shots in the fourth quarter. Defensive was an entirely different story. Finley got destroyed by Danny Granger repeatedly. Even with foul trouble, Granger put up 35 points. The fact that Finley is being used by Pop as the perimeter stopper right now is perhaps the biggest reason to be concerned about the championship hopes.

-Matt Bonner had a quality performance. He hit his shots offensively and that forced the Pacers to thin out their defense. Bonner also did a good job when defending against smaller players. His rebounding left a lot to be desired but that's been a reoccurring theme for much of the season. After struggling a bit after the signing of Drew Gooden, Bonner now seemingly has his rhythm back. In his last eight games, he's shooting better than 55% from the field.

-Roger Mason, Jr. was once again coming off the bench and might have had his quietest game of the season. I would say he struggled but he didn't do enough in his 22 minutes to classify his game one way or another. He played some point guard in the second half and didn't do a bad job. His defense was a little bit above average. But the Spurs will need him to provide some sort of scoring punch no matter if he's starting or coming off the bench. The team doesn't have enough scoring depth for Mason to dry up at this point.

-Kurt Thomas had a difficult time converting on the offensive end but the rest of his game was really good. He drew a handful of fouls because the undersized Pacers found it impossible to box him out. His seven boards in 21 minutes don't even give the full story of how much he dominated on the glass. It was a good sign to get a quality performance out of Thomas after a pair of quiet affairs.

-Drew Gooden once again showed that he doesn't have a shy bone in his body. In 13 minutes, Gooden poured in 17 points. His scoring came in a variety of ways including jump shots, hooks, moves to the bucket and at the free throw line. I also thought his defense was better than we've seen. All in all, this perhaps Gooden's most promising game to date.

-George Hill didn't play at all in the first half but ended up playing much of the second half. Although he didn't do much, I liked the way he played under control offensively and the pressure he applied defensively. He made a few mistakes but he didn't let it affect his aggression level.

-Jacque Vaughn was the backup point guard in the first half and he didn't do anything out of the ordinary. He ran the team decently well offensively and he provided his usual effort on the defensive end. I am still highly skeptical that his skill level at this point of his career would allow him to be in the rotation on a team with championship aspirations.

-Bruce Bowen got six minutes in the first half and did decent work. Assigned to try to slow Granger, Bowen made life difficult for him. Granger got a bucket after Bowen flopped and another one in transition but otherwise Bowen actually made him work for his positioning on the court.

-Pop had a mixed bag of results. First of all, I liked that he was able to rest Duncan. I thought that he used Gooden wisely. I also thought it was the right move to remove Ime Udoka from the rotation. Giving Ginobili 36 minutes was somewhat risky but at this point Ginobili needs all the minutes he can get until the real season begins. I don't agree with his use of Vaughn as the backup point and I agree even less with Pop splitting the backup point guard minutes. I'm also still baffled by why Finley is the perimeter stopper and why Pop seemingly doesn't care that he gets toasted on that end repeatedly. Oh well, I'll take the win.

Next up, is an afternoon match with the Cavs in Cleveland. It'd be nice to shake off this feeling of uneasiness within Spurs Nation by handing the Cavaliers their second home loss of the season.

Believe.

[duncan228]

timvp, did Pop sub Duncan out in one of the last defensive possessions, then put him back on offense?

I think that's what I saw, I haven't re-watched it. Can you confirm?

[Spurs Brazil]

-In the last three games, Tony Parker had been tiptoeing his way around the offense. With the Big Three back, he had lost most of his aggressiveness and wasn't creating as much for himself or others. Tonight, he was back to the Parker who has carried the Spurs since the All-Star break. He got a little loose with the ball at times but on the whole I thought he did a very fine job on the offensive end. With the Spurs down by two points and under two minutes to go, Parker hit a three-pointer and then followed it up with a long jumper to put the Spurs up by three. Defensively, while his effort was consistent, the results were often lacking.

This is the Parker I like to see and I hope he keep playing like tonight

[Spurs Brazil]

timvp, did Pop sub Duncan out in one of the last defensive possessions, then put him back on offense?

I think that's what I saw, I haven't re-watched it. Can you confirm?

Pop did that. A lineup with no bigs, Granger got past Finley and got a easy layup

[ducks]

pop had to tell tp you are the key
we need your points
most of the double digits assist come for tp when he scores more then 22

[timvp]

timvp, did Pop sub Duncan out in one of the last defensive possessions, then put him back on offense?

I think that's what I saw, I haven't re-watched it. Can you confirm?Yeah, down the stretch Pop was using five smalls on defense so they could switch every pick. Then he'd put Duncan back in the game for offense. Since Duncan's tendonosis flair up, Pop has been sitting Duncan a lot more than usual in end of games defensive situations -- usually to go with five smalls or use Thomas.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

timvp, are you still concerned with the lack of minutes Bowen has been getting?

I was really hoping Pop would slowly work him back in for 20 MPG or so, because we need him

[duncan228]

Thanks Spurs Brazil and timvp.

If Duncan is pulled on defensive possessions, isn't that a scary statement about his knees?

[timvp]

This is the Parker I like to see and I hope he keep playing like tonightYeah, I'm starting to think the Spurs will need this level of Parker if they are going to make noise. The last few years, the Big Three have split the opportunities almost 33/33/33. Since Parker is the healthiest, it might have to be 40/30/30.

[ducks]

tp will have to go for 30 and 10 assist

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Pop had a mixed bag of results. First of all, I liked that he was able to rest Duncan. I thought that he used Gooden wisely. I also thought it was the right move to remove Ime Udoka from the rotation. Giving Ginobili 36 minutes was somewhat risky but at this point Ginobili needs all the minutes he can get until the real season begins. I don't agree with his use of Vaughn as the backup point and I agree even less with Pop splitting the backup point guard minutes. I'm also still baffled by why Finley is the perimeter stopper and why Pop seemingly doesn't care that he gets toasted on that end repeatedly. Oh well, I'll take the win.

Next up, is an afternoon match with the Cavs in Cleveland. It'd be nice to shake off this feeling of uneasiness within Spurs Nation by handing the Cavaliers their second home loss of the season.

:tu

And if ever there was a statement game, the Cavs is it. If this year's Spurs team is to have any championship aspirations they need to go in there and grit out a close game. They don't even need to win it, a close loss might be enough to change the fortune of the team.

[Borosai]

Finley over Barry in last year's playoffs was questionable. Now Finley defending the opposing team's best player?

I guess we'll have to wait a bit longer to see if Pop has really lost his mind.

[SpursFan0728]

I guess the question remains after tonight's game. Pop is testing to see if Finley's offense could offset his liabilities on the defensive end. The answer was quite obvious pop We DON"T need offense. We need D!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Yeah, down the stretch Pop was using five smalls on defense so they could switch every pick. Then he'd put Duncan back in the game for offense. Since Duncan's tendonosis flair up, Pop has been sitting Duncan a lot more than usual in end of games defensive situations -- usually to go with five smalls or use Thomas.


Thanks Spurs Brazil and timvp.

If Duncan is pulled on defensive possessions, isn't that a scary statement about his knees?

Tim got burned repeatedly late in the game by the Indiana smalls, particularly Jack, and then those 3s by Murphy. His lateral movement near the basket was non-existent, and he wasn't closing out on the perimeter. I think Pop recognised that he couldn't stop the little guys, and that he couldn't stay close to Murphy, so he pulled him.

[ducks]

Tim got burned repeatedly late in the game by the Indiana smalls, particularly Jack, and then those 3s by murphy. His lateral movement was non-existent. I think Pop recognised that he couldn't stop the little guys, and that he couldn't stay close to Murphy, so he pulled him.

so why not mike finley?

mason lost all confidence because mike can do know wrong
but if mason blows d he is on bench

[timvp]

timvp, are you still concerned with the lack of minutes Bowen has been getting?

I was really hoping Pop would slowly work him back in for 20 MPG or so, because we need himYeah, I still don't understand it. Although at least there were baby steps in the right direction in terms of actually letting Bowen and Hill play.

But we should get a good idea of what's to come with this game on Sunday. If Pop allows Finley to defend LeBron as much as he let Finley defend Durant and Granger, LeBron will easily score 50. Easily.

If Bowen doesn't play at least 20 minutes on Sunday, it'd be safe to turn the page on the hope that Bowen will be used this year.

[timvp]

Thanks Spurs Brazil and timvp.

If Duncan is pulled on defensive possessions, isn't that a scary statement about his knees?Somewhat scary but Duncan has been pulled in similar situations in the past. Plus if you are trying to save Duncan from wear and tear, taking him out when the Pacers' gameplan was to attack Duncan makes sense.

But yeah, if Duncan can't guard players like Brandon Rush even halfway decently come playoff time, the playoffs won't be including the Spurs for very long.

[duncan228]

Somewhat scary but Duncan has been pulled in similar situations in the past. Plus if you are trying to save Duncan from wear and tear, taking him out when the Pacers' gameplan was to attack Duncan makes sense.

But yeah, if Duncan can't guard players like Brandon Rush even halfway decently come playoff time, the playoffs won't be including the Spurs for very long.

Taking him out to save wear and tear is fine. It's beginning to look like more than that.

I went from concerned about Duncan's left knee to worried when he was diagnosed with the tendonosis in his right. I'm moving to the next level. If he can't defend...:(

[G-Nob]

There are some key indicators when the spurs championship dreams are done. I think we are seeing these signs unfold and either we are having a hard time coming to grips with a strong reality or Popovich is making unfathomable mistakes in his coaching decisions.

1. Offense will not take this team far. This team wasn't built for offense.
2. Continuity or lack thereof. Are rotations are set by now even in a year we know we can't compete for a title. You can throw defensive continuity in there as well.
3. Injuries. Lets face it. This was a cripled year once Manu fell to the floor in Beijing. Tim knees are only going to deteriorate the rest of his career. And depending on Tony to carry this team is not enough.
4. Luck. We can honestly say the only luck we've seen this year is a string of early season wins that gave the spurs a strong position in the standings. Right now, the spurs are not the 2nd or 3rd best team in the west.

I am very thankful of the success of my basketball team the past decade or so and it would be inhuman of me to still not have hope for this year. But the frustrations of no longer being able to shut a team down as our bread and butter is a hard pill to swallow. And Pop may have come to that reality well before it started showing in the past month or so.

[spurster]

The Spurs defense is s**t. They might win a playoff series or two, but not against any elite team.

[ducks]

The Spurs defense is s**t. They might win a playoff series or two, but not against any elite team.

who is an elite team?

[SpursFan0728]

But we should get a good idea of what's to come with this game on Sunday. If Pop allows Finley to defend LeBron as much as he let Finley defend Durant and Granger, LeBron will easily score 50. Easily.

It would be INSANE for Pop to let Finley defend Leborn for more than 30mins. How could pop not see how Granger torture Finley on the defensive end? Just freaking click on nba.com and there are at least 5 times (in that 2 min clip) where Granger just blew past Finely with his dribble or off screens.
:bang is it that hard for Pop to figure this out?

[ducks]

you put hill on james boy

[lefty]

Finley over Barry in last year's playoffs was questionable. Now Finley defending the opposing team's best player?

I guess we'll have to wait a bit longer to see if Pop has really lost his mind.

+1

:bang

[mogrovejo]

That charge on Duncan that turned into a Parker triple...the refs would have called it on the Pacers. Just saying...

Good game, but you need to get Bowen and Mason going, you need them to throw at Kobe.

[spurster]

who is an elite team?

At this point, I would include Lakers, Cavs, Magic, and Celtics. Until the current dive, I would have put the Spurs in there, too.

[kace]

At this point, I would include Lakers, Cavs, Magic, and Celtics. Until the current dive, I would have put the Spurs in there, too.

yes, and when we beat the cavs sunday after they were destroyed tonight, you will put them out and us in.

[ducks]

At this point, I would include Lakers, Cavs, Magic, and Celtics. Until the current dive, I would have put the Spurs in there, too.

so cavs lose to wizzards and then get whipped by magic
and are starting to look like tired players


cavs are not elite

[ElNono]

you put hill on james boy

Hill would last 10 minutes... besides of James being unequivocally bigger, stronger and more athletic he gets every whistle under the sun, especially when pitched against a rookie who still hasn't earned the refs' respect.
Bowen is the right answer here to attempt to slow Lebron a bit. However, I bet Finley and/or Udoka are going to take turns at him and he will drop 50+ on us.
Prove me wrong Pop!

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I think it's funny how noone has mentioned how literally every team's gameplan since the week of Duncan restage after his tendenosis diagnosis has been to attack him relentlessly. Every team's coach has been telling their slashers to attack Duncan without fear--and I think they've been having pretty damn good success.

Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

so cavs lose to wizzards and then get whipped by magic
and are starting to look like tired players

cavs are not elite

They lost a b2b on the road, so what? You say some stupid things, but that's about the dumbest. They've lost one game at home, and they lead the league at 61-15, but they are not elite. GTFOH.

And yeah, I like Hill a lot, but LBJ would SLAUGHTER him. He has 7 inches and 100lbs on the rook. We don't have anyone who can slow down LBJ, unless Pop is holding SuperBowen back in a CIA move for the playoffs (which I very much doubt). :lol

[td4mvp21]

They lost a b2b on the road, so what? You say some stupid things, but that's about the dumbest. They've lost one game at home, and they lead the league at 61-15, but they are not elite. GTFOH.


:lol

[LaMarcus Bryant]

I love the big guy, but lately on defense Duncan is like Rasho out there. Only difference is Rasho would hold his arms straight up like a retard while getting scored on, while Duncan holds his arms at a 25 degree angle.

[HarlemHeat37]

Duncan's defense has been solid lately..I didn't watch this game, but if he had a bad defensive game, it would be his first one in a little while IMO..

the last game vs. OKC, he blocked a few shots, altered many, and made Jeff Green miss 2 dunks..

I haven't seen it..

other teams strategy has been to attack us ALL year..even when Duncan was healthy..it's because they realize Duncan is the only big near the basket, and that our perimeter D is weak with Parker/Mason/Finley..they'll either get beat and put Timmy in a bad position, or Timmy will go alter/block the shot, leaving Bonner as the only other guy around the basket for the put-back..

this game wouldn't be a concern though..Duncan has trouble guarding guys like Murphy, even when healthy..he had the same troubles with Bargnani earlier..jump shooting bigs give him trouble, because Duncan is obviously a C playing PF..he's never been an elite man defender..he's known for being the anchor in the paint..he isn't mobile enough to guard 3-point shooting mobile bigs, even when healthy..

[VI_Massive]

I think it's funny how noone has mentioned how literally every team's gameplan since the week of Duncan restage after his tendenosis diagnosis has been to attack him relentlessly. Every team's coach has been telling their slashers to attack Duncan without fear--and I think they've been having pretty damn good success.

Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Shhh. Please don't bring this up.

We're all terrified about Timmy. We're clinging to semi-rational hopes that he can turn it on in the playoffs. We know what the end of his dominance means for our team and we'd rather not think about it.

[Pentagruel]

People are giving up to early on this season and on the team in general. The last couple of games have not been encouraging but they have been through rough patches before. This late in the season is obviously not the time to be struggling but I don't think its unfathomable that we manage to right the ship in these last eight games. I'm not quite sold on the Spurs are beat scenario yet. If Tim Duncan can fight through that Tendonosis like a number of injuries he's had in the past and if Tony Parker plays some incredible basketball we can still make some noise (meaning WCF at the least and a shiny new ring at the best). Ultimately, i'll reserve my judgement till the post season has come and gone.

With all that said, even a depressing first round exit to a mediocre team such as the Jazz or the Blazers wouldn't mean the end for the Spurs. They have a lot of great players still, some young ones who will only get better, some veterans to stabalize the team and a Superstar. It would simply signify a shift in their style of play. I think Tony Parker can truly be a franchise player for the Spurs if Tim Duncan is finally past his prime. The Spurs will need to adjust their playsyle and the pieces to fit with Parker but I think they could realisticaly build another sucessful team around him and that should be the next course of action if the worst has come and the window around Timmy has finally closed.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Duncan's defense has been solid lately..I didn't watch this game, but if he had a bad defensive game, it would be his first one in a little while IMO..

the last game vs. OKC, he blocked a few shots, altered many, and made Jeff Green miss 2 dunks..

I haven't seen it..

other teams strategy has been to attack us ALL year..even when Duncan was healthy..it's because they realize Duncan is the only big near the basket, and that our perimeter D is weak with Parker/Mason/Finley..they'll either get beat and put Timmy in a bad position, or Timmy will go alter/block the shot, leaving Bonner as the only other guy around the basket for the put-back..

this game wouldn't be a concern though..Duncan has trouble guarding guys like Murphy, even when healthy..he had the same troubles with Bargnani earlier..jump shooting bigs give him trouble, because Duncan is obviously a C playing PF..he's never been an elite man defender..he's known for being the anchor in the paint..he isn't mobile enough to guard 3-point shooting mobile bigs, even when healthy..

Yup, he was excellent on D against OKC. I think his quality of play at the moment is highly dependent on the pain in his knees, and today they were hurting him (thus the lazy D in the 4th).

However, I'd say he IS an elite man-on-man defender as long as his man doesn't stray more than 15ft from the basket. He has trouble when he has to go out to 3pt land, as you said.

[ElNono]

Pop keeps on toying with the rotation... today he played Hill and Bowen, and sat Udoka.
Manu played more, and I noticed that he cut a bit on Finley and Mason minutes.
I haven't looked at the stat sheet, but it felt we were hitting our treys today. If that's the case, this game was too close for comfort. Tony had a great game, pretty much as usual when he finds a lane to the basket with no shot blockers in sight.
All in all, I'll take the win because we needed it, and coupled with the games dropped by Dallas, Utah, New Orleans and Houston it gives a little extra margin for error.
But I wish Pop would just settle down on a rotation...

[The Truth #6]

Tim's defense right now is the worst of his career. The last few years he's still been solid and has been able to cover for the gross deficiencies of players like Barry, Finley, Elson and others. I thought his quickness and mobility were poor tonight. Obviously, he's doing everything he can but his knees are giving him problems. It's not surprising that as Tim's defense suffers our team defense suffers.

[ElNono]

Tim's defense right now is the worst of his career. The last few years he's still been solid and has been able to cover for the gross deficiencies of players like Barry, Finley, Elson and others. I thought his quickness and mobility were poor tonight. Obviously, he's doing everything he can but his knees are giving him problems. It's not surprising that as Tim's defense suffers our team defense suffers.

It would help if Bowen was out there to lend a hand... otherwise, every perimeter guy ends up coming at full speed at Timmy, and there's only so much you can do at that point... But if we keep putting Finley on Durant, Granger, etc we're just gonna see more of that... :depressed

[Trimble87]

Taking him out to save wear and tear is fine. It's beginning to look like more than that.

I went from concerned about Duncan's left knee to worried when he was diagnosed with the tendonosis in his right. I'm moving to the next level. If he can't defend...:(

Tim looked fine on defense, the announcers commented on the subbing by saying Pop was taking away the three ball. Playing 5 smalls allowed us to switch every pick and chase guys off the line. With a 5 point lead and less then a minute to play they were willing to give up the layup.

I wouldn't worry.

[HarlemHeat37]

Tim's defense is OBVIOUSLY the worst of his career, regardless of his knees..every year Duncan is going to get older, and his D is going to get worse..it's natural decline with age, there's nothing you can do..

we're the 5th ranked D in the NBA, and we jumped about 8 spots in the rankings of FG% allowed in the past month and half to 2 months..this is with starting an average defender in Parker, along with below average defenders in Mason, Finley, and Bonner..you guys don't think Tim has anything to do with that?..

[Obstructed_View]

Pop keeps on toying with the rotation... today he played Hill and Bowen, and sat Udoka.

Proof that he doesn't have a CLUE about what he's doing. How nobody in that entire organization can see what's going on is just baffling.

[temujin]

I watched the game.
My impressions.

1) Duncan. Physically better than 2 weeks ago, but just anybody could score OVER him. He still got the winning basket. There were stretches without Duncan in which the Spurs played some good basketball.

2) Parker. The guy is just unstoppable. he's evolved in an MVP candidate. Spurs are tuning into Parker's team. That will probably require some philosophical adjustments.

3) Manu. Terrible on defense, slow/non existent lateral movements, burnt in a backdoor in the first half! When did you see that happen? Pretty good on offense, except that he still lacks confidence and speed in penetration. However he is so freaking intelligent and winner that he always contributes.

4) Finley. Let's make things clear: if this veteran has to play more than panick-button or garbage time roles from the bench, the team is doomed. His defense was worst than terrible. Anybody could penetrate. And this is being said on a great offensive night.

5) Bonner. Copy-paste from Finley. having a big who can't rebound, sets soft picks and has a lateral mobility of an obelisk, is like having a shooter that can't score or a PG who can't dribble. I don't care how many points he scores.

6) Gooden. Played a great game, perfect on offense and actually quite decent on defense. This guy is a great acquisition and he is not nearly as dumb as somebody thinks (and wrote here). Playing him 13' is pure nonsense.

7) Mason. He is quickly becoming an irrelevant player. He seems to have a Manu problem. I wonder whether these "rotations" changes have affected his confidence.

8) Thomas. A big that rebounds, intimidates, sets picks that are rock solid, hits his jumpers and sink his FTs.

9) Vaughn. He is inexplicably the back-up PG. Does nothing but passing the ball. The defender helps out in the paint 3 meters from him, as he has no offensive game whatsoever.

10) Hill. Drafted as back-up PG. Started as such many games (mostly won). He is obviously a gem. He now plays 2 and only in clutch times. Good effort on offense and defense. Bad mistake on that last foul on the +1. I just dont' get what his role is supposed to be.

11) Bowen. Hard to judge, but he made Granger work for his points.

Popovich. The notion of "rotation" -whatever that means- is getting everybody sick. He needs to play the BEST players in the CORRECT positions. He needs to KEEP the hot players in. Benchin Gooden -as for original gameplan- no matter how ridiculously unstoppable he is, makes no sense. He needs to bench those that play no defense.
Start Mason.
Start Thomas.
Start Bowen.
Manu 6th man.
Duncan and Gooden compete for minutes.
Hill back-up PG.

Go back to basics.

[HarlemHeat37]

compete for minutes?..

[quentin_compson]

We desperately needed this win and got it, so this a plus. Timmy and Manu looked pretty decent for most of the night. But it was devastating to watch Finley getting abused by Granger (or any other decent perimeter player in countless other games this season). Well, at least Bowen and Hill got some minutes - hopefully, this is a good sign.

[sonic21]

They lost a b2b on the road, so what? You say some stupid things, but that's about the dumbest. They've lost one game at home, and they lead the league at 61-15, but they are not elite. GTFOH.


:lol

[temujin]

compete for minutes?..

Duncan is 33, slower and appears to have chronic health issues.
Even if he's still a great player, and will be for a few years ahead,
there is competition, expecially because Gooden looks like a legitimate back-up.
Moreover, this is clearly Parker's team.

I know Spurs' fans don't want to read this, but this is road ahead.

[quentin_compson]

Duncan is 33, slower and appears to have chronic health issues.
Even if he's still a great player, and will be for a few years ahead,
there is competition, expecially because Gooden looks like a legitimate back-up.
Moreover, this is clearly Parker's team.

I know Spurs' fans don't want to read this, but this is road ahead.

So you're saying that Duncan is comepting for back-up minutes? You can't be serious.

[de Soto]

Meaningless win --and barely one--because Pacers are nothing these days.

[de Soto]

Parker still carries the Spurs. Without him they are currently nothing.

[Bigzax]

Spurs need someone to carry the defense.

Timvp said it. This is not Spurs basketball.

This is .500 ball vs the league and a likely 2nd round exit in the West.

Is Gooden the only current big man that has any hops worth a damn to block a shot?

[LEONARD]

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[benefactor]

Overall, this isn't a victory to be too thrilled about if you are a Spurs fan. The defense was poor, especially in the second and fourth quarters, and the Spurs needed a heroic five-point flurry from Parker late in the fourth to get on top for good.
I pretty much felt the same way. We got away with a win but we looked nowhere close to what we should be for the playoffs. We needed 18 from Finley and 17 from Gooden and still barely got it done.

The issue is still the same. If Bowen doesn't start getting minutes to help out with our perimeter D then we might not even see the WCF.

[Manufan909]

First of all, I liked that he was able to rest Duncan. I thought that he used Gooden wisely.
Believe.

Hey timvp, why do you think Gooden was played the least out of all the bigs, when he was the hottest offensively? Was he getting in the way on both sides again?

And did Hill play any PG?

[Manufan909]

I watched the game.
My impressions.

1) Duncan. Physically better than 2 weeks ago, but just anybody could score OVER him. He still got the winning basket. There were stretches without Duncan in which the Spurs played some good basketball.

2) Parker. The guy is just unstoppable. he's evolved in an MVP candidate. Spurs are tuning into Parker's team. That will probably require some philosophical adjustments.

3) Manu. Terrible on defense, slow/non existent lateral movements, burnt in a backdoor in the first half! When did you see that happen? Pretty good on offense, except that he still lacks confidence and speed in penetration. However he is so freaking intelligent and winner that he always contributes.

4) Finley. Let's make things clear: if this veteran has to play more than panick-button or garbage time roles from the bench, the team is doomed. His defense was worst than terrible. Anybody could penetrate. And this is being said on a great offensive night.

5) Bonner. Copy-paste from Finley. having a big who can't rebound, sets soft picks and has a lateral mobility of an obelisk, is like having a shooter that can't score or a PG who can't dribble. I don't care how many points he scores.

6) Gooden. Played a great game, perfect on offense and actually quite decent on defense. This guy is a great acquisition and he is not nearly as dumb as somebody thinks (and wrote here). Playing him 13' is pure nonsense.

7) Mason. He is quickly becoming an irrelevant player. He seems to have a Manu problem. I wonder whether these "rotations" changes have affected his confidence.

8) Thomas. A big that rebounds, intimidates, sets picks that are rock solid, hits his jumpers and sink his FTs.

9) Vaughn. He is inexplicably the back-up PG. Does nothing but passing the ball. The defender helps out in the paint 3 meters from him, as he has no offensive game whatsoever.

10) Hill. Drafted as back-up PG. Started as such many games (mostly won). He is obviously a gem. He now plays 2 and only in clutch times. Good effort on offense and defense. Bad mistake on that last foul on the +1. I just dont' get what his role is supposed to be.

11) Bowen. Hard to judge, but he made Granger work for his points.

Popovich. The notion of "rotation" -whatever that means- is getting everybody sick. He needs to play the BEST players in the CORRECT positions. He needs to KEEP the hot players in. Benchin Gooden -as for original gameplan- no matter how ridiculously unstoppable he is, makes no sense. He needs to bench those that play no defense.
Start Mason.
Start Thomas.
Start Bowen.
Manu 6th man.
Duncan and Gooden compete for minutes.
Hill back-up PG.

Go back to basics.

Duncan at 50% is still twice the player Gooden is. That's as fucking a retarded statement as Ime getting more minutes than Bowen. So maybe Pop will do it, he's been Bizarro for awhile now.

[The Truth #6]

Duncan at 50% is still twice the player Gooden is. That's as fucking a retarded statement as Ime getting more minutes than Bowen. So maybe Pop will do it, he's been Bizarro for awhile now.

I think Tem went too far if he was indeed suggesting "benching" Tim. However, I don't think that was his point. I read it more as if Gooden is playing well then he deserves minutes -same for Bowen and Kurt.

Otherwise, I thought his overall points were basically correct. Last night, it became clear that this is Tony's team now and for the future, unless Manu or Tim are able to regain their previous form.

[anonoftheinternets]

That charge on Duncan that turned into a Parker triple...the refs would have called it on the Pacers. Just saying...

Good game, but you need to get Bowen and Mason going, you need them to throw at Kobe.

was a flop, thats why no call, plus he had passed the ball long before the flop ..... no call was the correct call, the officials were certainly not shy about calling moving screens on spurs and ticky tack fouls for granger so i dont know where you are going with this.

[EricB]

A guy who puts up 18 points and grabs 4 rebounds from the small forward position now is classified as "garbage minutes only"?

:lol

Unreal.

[Kori Ellis]

A guy who puts up 18 points and grabs 4 rebounds from the small forward position now is classified as "garbage minutes only"?

:lol

Unreal.

Well he also thinks that Duncan should have to COMPETE with Gooden to get minutes. :downspin:

[VI_Massive]

I think he meant "compete for minutes" in a different sense, like they'd play essentially the same position and switch out for each other. Not that their would be a competition per se between the two of them for playing time. I think there was a language confusion there.

[The Truth #6]

I think he meant "compete for minutes" in a different sense, like they'd play essentially the same position and switch out for each other. Not that their would be a competition per se between the two of them for playing time. I think there was a language confusion there.

I agree on the potential language issue, and I thought he raised multiple valid points.

Whether or not the poster has a complete command of the language, I'm more surprised how others (who most likely use English as a first language) completely misinterpreted what he said. As Timvp has been writing for the last week, if the team relies on Finley to be a major role in the playoffs, then the team is not going to do very well.

I don't see the issue here.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Nice game thoughts, Timvp. :tu


I'm lost on Pop's Finley love, and his trying to work Vaughn into the rotation. He seems to be confused on the fact that Bruce was instrumental in a couple of championship runs if memory serves. Leaving him out of the rotation is mind boggling. I thought for the longest time the sitting Bruce was his tactic to hide his "A" lineup until close to the playoffs, but now I'm just convinced Pop spends too much time reading old Ghostwriter threads.

[Morg1411]

Meaningless win --and barely one--because Pacers are nothing these days.

Nothing apart from one of the best spoiler teams out there.

Beat the Celtics. Beat the Magic. Beat the Lakers. Didn't beat the Spurs.

It was an ugly win, but it was a fucking win, so I'll take it.

[crc21209]

Simple equation. More Bowen, Thomas, Gooden, and Hill....and less or no Vaughn, Udoka, and Bonner. Bonner is only good when he is hitting shots...for defensive purposes please put Thomas out there.

[TheSpursFNRule]

You're slacking. More spacing and bold the names. ;)
stop. these posts are fine.