Ignignokt
04-05-2009, 05:25 PM
There's a book about david i. rudel "The gospel you've never heard: Who really goes to Heaven".
If you want to read the website info before addressing these points so that one can seehwere where he's coming from, then here it is.. http://www.whoreallygoestohell.com/index.html
Anyway i want to know what you think about all this.
anyway here's the meat, prey or pray?
The modern gospel states
• All people, having sinned, are unrighteous. Hence, due to God’s perfect sense of justice, no one is
naturally qualiVed for heaven.
• To address this, God sent Jesus as a sacriVce to grant forgiveness of sins to all believers.
• Those who have faith in Christ, and only those who believe in Christ, can thus enter heaven as their
sins have been forgiven.
• God has no choice but to consign all others to hell for their unforgiven sin.
Throughout this work, I have discussed several reasons why the above is biblically unacceptable. A
summary of these is given below:
1. It presupposes the Judgment has the format of a court of law where only our oUenses are relevant.
Christs’ teachings on the Judgment indicate godly deeds (which Jesus and others say can be done even
by those who have no knowledge of Christ) are as relevant as our failings.
2. The Bible depicts many people, including those who never knew of Jesus, as righteous. The idea that
a single sin makes someone unrighteous in God’s eyes is thoroughly destroyed by any reasonable
reading of scripture.
3. The modern gospel claims faith in Christ is the only means by which sins can be forgiven, but scripture
gives at least six diUerent routes to forgiveness, most available to non-believers.
4. It fails to make any sense of why the original apostles only spread the gospel of Christ to other Jews
during the decade after Christ’s death. These men were full of the Holy Spirit and had been given
a complete teaching of God’s work through Jesus [Luke 24:27]. To suggest they believed Christ’s
purpose was to save believers from hell would indicate they wanted all non-Jews to be consigned to
eternal torment.
5. It indicates God holds every person to the same standard of conduct, a claim without any biblical
support. Dozens of passages demonstrate the opposite.
6. It fails to show the relevance of Christ’s life and resurrection in God’s salvic plan. If we are saved
through Christ’s sacriVce, then the resurrection itself is rather unneeded. Yet the early apostles and
church fathers based their theories of salvation squarely upon the resurrection rather than the sacri-
Vcial aspect of Christ’s death. Jesus is never referred to as a sacriVce or propitiation anywhere in all
the evangelism captured in Acts (the most comprehensive repository of the apostle’s actual teachings
to unbelievers), and very rarely is He so described elsewhere.
Draft: February 12, 2009 1 ©David I Rudel
7. It declares Jesus’ sacriVce grants forgiveness of all sins to believers when the Bible speciVcally says
otherwise.
8. It is not consistent with the context and purpose of the Messiah as found in the later prophets.
9. Jesus’ own disciples did not know of His coming death and resurrection even though He attempted to
tell them privately about it. Thus, it is impossible for the modern gospel to have had any real place in
the general message Jesus and His apostles proclaimed to the crowds during Christ’s earthly ministry.
10. Jesus, Paul, and many others indicate believers and unbelievers are both in danger of hell due to their
sins.
11. The modern gospel cannot explain how Enoch and Elijah were allowed to ascend to God’s presence
before Christ’s sacriVce. Suggesting God forgave people before Jesus by looking forward to Christ’s
sacriVce would render nonsensical much of the Old Testament.
12. It is impossible to read Matthew, Mark, or Luke in isolation and come away with any semblance of
the modern Gospel. Thus, we must reject the modern gospel or else claim these writers cruelly and
willfully misled their readers, for they could not assume their audience had access to any other speciVc
commentary on Christ’s purpose.
13. It violates Jesus’ own teachings regarding how those who came before Him are judged. In particular
it fails to explain how those who never knew of a coming Christ (much less that Jesus was He) could
possibly be saved from hell.
14. It claims forgiveness of sins is the prevailing aspect of the Judgment while most descriptions of the
Judgment found in the Bible make no mention of forgiveness at all.
15. It does not explain how the entire creation, including animals and God’s angels, were reconciled to
God through Christ’s blood, for we do not generally believe either these creatures are guilty of sin.
16. Jesus was sent to mediate the New Covenant, so it is unnatural to suggest His sacriVce was aimed at
the Judgment (which transcends covenant, for all are judged).
17. The Bible proclaims the entire world and all people have been saved through Christ. If salvation is
derived from forgiveness of individuals’ sins, such would imply that all have been forgiven of their
sins, not just those who believe in Christ.
18. All the original apostles, and all Jewish Christians of the Vrst century, continued to obey the cultural
Jewish laws. The modern gospel has trouble explaining why Peter, nine years after Christ’s death, still
believed he could not enter a Gentile’s house. It also leaves one bewildered as to why Paul was just as
ardent about keeping the Mosaic laws after his conversion as before.
19. It does not respect the Jewish understanding of salvation, a rather serious issue given that all the books
of the Bible were written by Jews, the original Christian church was entirely Jewish, and the gospels
relate Jesus’ interactions with the Jews.
©David I Rudel 2 Draft: February 12, 2009
If you want to read the website info before addressing these points so that one can seehwere where he's coming from, then here it is.. http://www.whoreallygoestohell.com/index.html
Anyway i want to know what you think about all this.
anyway here's the meat, prey or pray?
The modern gospel states
• All people, having sinned, are unrighteous. Hence, due to God’s perfect sense of justice, no one is
naturally qualiVed for heaven.
• To address this, God sent Jesus as a sacriVce to grant forgiveness of sins to all believers.
• Those who have faith in Christ, and only those who believe in Christ, can thus enter heaven as their
sins have been forgiven.
• God has no choice but to consign all others to hell for their unforgiven sin.
Throughout this work, I have discussed several reasons why the above is biblically unacceptable. A
summary of these is given below:
1. It presupposes the Judgment has the format of a court of law where only our oUenses are relevant.
Christs’ teachings on the Judgment indicate godly deeds (which Jesus and others say can be done even
by those who have no knowledge of Christ) are as relevant as our failings.
2. The Bible depicts many people, including those who never knew of Jesus, as righteous. The idea that
a single sin makes someone unrighteous in God’s eyes is thoroughly destroyed by any reasonable
reading of scripture.
3. The modern gospel claims faith in Christ is the only means by which sins can be forgiven, but scripture
gives at least six diUerent routes to forgiveness, most available to non-believers.
4. It fails to make any sense of why the original apostles only spread the gospel of Christ to other Jews
during the decade after Christ’s death. These men were full of the Holy Spirit and had been given
a complete teaching of God’s work through Jesus [Luke 24:27]. To suggest they believed Christ’s
purpose was to save believers from hell would indicate they wanted all non-Jews to be consigned to
eternal torment.
5. It indicates God holds every person to the same standard of conduct, a claim without any biblical
support. Dozens of passages demonstrate the opposite.
6. It fails to show the relevance of Christ’s life and resurrection in God’s salvic plan. If we are saved
through Christ’s sacriVce, then the resurrection itself is rather unneeded. Yet the early apostles and
church fathers based their theories of salvation squarely upon the resurrection rather than the sacri-
Vcial aspect of Christ’s death. Jesus is never referred to as a sacriVce or propitiation anywhere in all
the evangelism captured in Acts (the most comprehensive repository of the apostle’s actual teachings
to unbelievers), and very rarely is He so described elsewhere.
Draft: February 12, 2009 1 ©David I Rudel
7. It declares Jesus’ sacriVce grants forgiveness of all sins to believers when the Bible speciVcally says
otherwise.
8. It is not consistent with the context and purpose of the Messiah as found in the later prophets.
9. Jesus’ own disciples did not know of His coming death and resurrection even though He attempted to
tell them privately about it. Thus, it is impossible for the modern gospel to have had any real place in
the general message Jesus and His apostles proclaimed to the crowds during Christ’s earthly ministry.
10. Jesus, Paul, and many others indicate believers and unbelievers are both in danger of hell due to their
sins.
11. The modern gospel cannot explain how Enoch and Elijah were allowed to ascend to God’s presence
before Christ’s sacriVce. Suggesting God forgave people before Jesus by looking forward to Christ’s
sacriVce would render nonsensical much of the Old Testament.
12. It is impossible to read Matthew, Mark, or Luke in isolation and come away with any semblance of
the modern Gospel. Thus, we must reject the modern gospel or else claim these writers cruelly and
willfully misled their readers, for they could not assume their audience had access to any other speciVc
commentary on Christ’s purpose.
13. It violates Jesus’ own teachings regarding how those who came before Him are judged. In particular
it fails to explain how those who never knew of a coming Christ (much less that Jesus was He) could
possibly be saved from hell.
14. It claims forgiveness of sins is the prevailing aspect of the Judgment while most descriptions of the
Judgment found in the Bible make no mention of forgiveness at all.
15. It does not explain how the entire creation, including animals and God’s angels, were reconciled to
God through Christ’s blood, for we do not generally believe either these creatures are guilty of sin.
16. Jesus was sent to mediate the New Covenant, so it is unnatural to suggest His sacriVce was aimed at
the Judgment (which transcends covenant, for all are judged).
17. The Bible proclaims the entire world and all people have been saved through Christ. If salvation is
derived from forgiveness of individuals’ sins, such would imply that all have been forgiven of their
sins, not just those who believe in Christ.
18. All the original apostles, and all Jewish Christians of the Vrst century, continued to obey the cultural
Jewish laws. The modern gospel has trouble explaining why Peter, nine years after Christ’s death, still
believed he could not enter a Gentile’s house. It also leaves one bewildered as to why Paul was just as
ardent about keeping the Mosaic laws after his conversion as before.
19. It does not respect the Jewish understanding of salvation, a rather serious issue given that all the books
of the Bible were written by Jews, the original Christian church was entirely Jewish, and the gospels
relate Jesus’ interactions with the Jews.
©David I Rudel 2 Draft: February 12, 2009