PDA

View Full Version : Michael Jordan: ‘The Best There Ever Was.’



duncan228
04-06-2009, 05:28 PM
Michael Jordan: ‘The best there ever was.’ (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=ap-jimlitke-040609&prov=ap&type=lgns)
By Jim Litke


Most people go into the Hall of Fame first.

Then they get the statue.

Not Michael Jordan.

Even as he stood in the ballroom of a downtown Detroit hotel Monday for the announcement of his election to the Hall class of 2009, the same snowstorm that swirled outside blanketed a statue erected almost 15 years ago in front of the United Center in Chicago—The House That Jordan Built—a few hundred miles to the south.

The figure cast in bronze atop a granite base soars toward the sky, a basketball at the end of its outstretched arm. The pose captures almost perfectly the illusion of Jordan: that he could fly. But down near the bottom, where the statue is affixed to the earth, is an inscription that captures the reality: “The best there ever was. The best there ever will be.”

What made Jordan that, and more, was not the string of NBA scoring titles, regular-season and finals MVP awards, not even all the championships he won. A few members of the exclusive club he will formally join upon induction into the Hall come September boast accomplishments just as outsized.

No, the real wonder of Jordan is that he always kept score. Not just in his head, not just on a basketball court, and not just some nights, but every minute of every day.

In his front yard, against an older brother on a makeshift court of caked dirt … at North Carolina, where he banked in a last- second jump shot to win an NCAA championship … in Barcelona, Spain, where he led the Dream Team to a second Olympic gold medal … on the team bus playing, gambling in casinos, even wagering with teammates whose suitcase would come down the baggage carousel at the airport first … in corporate boardrooms, where he helped sell more of everything—hot dogs and hamburgers, Wheaties, sunglasses, calling cards, underwear and the Internet … in Salt Lake City, where one last heart-stopping jumper swished through the net, securing his sixth title and sucking every last bit of air out of the state of Utah … even when he came out of retirement the second time in Washington, age having diminished everything but his desire.

He is keeping score still.

“This is not fun for me,” Jordan said during a brief news conference. “I don’t like being up here for the Hall of Fame, because at that time, your basketball career is completely over. That’s the way I look at it. I was hoping this day was coming in 20 more years, or that I’d actually go in when I’m dead and done.

“Because the way you always look at it,”—or at the least way Jordan did — “you can always go and put on shorts on and play. Now you get into the Hall of Fame, what else is there to do?

“Look,” Jordan continued. “It’s a great accomplishment, it’s great the respect everyone is paying. But for me, I always want to have you thinking that I can always go back and play the game of basketball. As long as you have that thought you never know what can happen. You never know what my abilities can do.

“Am I?” Jordan paused.

“No,” he quickly added. “But I’d like for you to think that way.”

His father, the late James Jordan, once said that obsession was what marked his son as special, even as a child. From the moment he started playing games, Michael had to win, and just as important, there had to be something riding on the outcome.

“He doesn’t have a gambling problem,” James Jordan said.

“What he does have is a competition problem. He was born with that. And if he didn’t have a competition problem,” his father added, “you guys wouldn’t be writing about him. The person he tries to outdo most of the time is himself.”

Once, Jordan traveled everywhere and anywhere to feed that competitive jones, a modern-day Ulysses roaming the world in sneakers and baggy shorts, Atlas holding up a globe with seams stretched across it. But Jordan knows his day has passed and that desire is not like a gene that can be passed from one generation to the next, no matter how hard he tries.

He recounted how after his younger son’s basketball team won an Illinois state high school championship last month, “My kid comes back to me and says, ‘Dad, I did something that you never did. You never won a state championship.’

“And my reply to him,” Jordan said, “is that everybody that won a state championship didn’t always win after that.”

The room cracked up, but Jordan barely cracked a smile. His eyes were red and focused on something in the distance.

And it was in that moment, after chronicling nearly everything Jordan has done from the day he first turned up at practice 25 years ago in Chicago that I was reminded for better or worse, that whether it was a sublime gift or the cruelest sort of curse, he is still restless in a way the rest of us will never be.

IronMexican
04-06-2009, 05:29 PM
Let me get this out the way right now.


MJ > Kobe


MJ is the GOAT.

LakeShow
04-06-2009, 05:32 PM
Let me get this out the way right now.


MJ > Kobe


MJ is the GOAT.

For now but when it's all said and done, Kobe will be the GOAT!

stretch
04-06-2009, 06:12 PM
For now but when it's all said and done, Kobe will be the GOAT!

lol rockets

scanry
04-06-2009, 06:13 PM
For now but when it's all said and done, Kobe will be the GOAT!

Don't even start..

BTW Magic>>>Kobe:hat

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 07:16 PM
For now but when it's all said and done, Kobe will be the GOAT!
I have a lot of respect for you..but you're way off on this one. Kobe will never be Mike. Jordan has 6 titles. He won rings with much less talent than Kobe, back before guards were given an easier time. With all the rule changes, guards have it EASY now, and get away with a lot more. Back then, all the rules focused on helping the big man, and the guard was not given any love at all. Jordan in his prime is twice Kobe in his prime...and then some.

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 07:18 PM
Don't even start..

BTW Magic>>>Kobe:hat
:tu Kobe couldn't play Center even if he wanted to.

dirk4mvp
04-06-2009, 07:24 PM
I think we should have a Jordan > Kobe thread. I don't think there's been one before :tu

The TroutBum
04-06-2009, 07:51 PM
http://www.realclearsports.com/Jordan%20baseball.jpg
LMAO.

http://newlevelsports.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/michael-jordan-wizards.jpg
Nice comeback, ass face.

http://www.nbarefssuck.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/93_ainge_jordan.jpg
Jordan is lucky Ainge didn't kick his ass.


http://bossip.com/906/cheating-michael-jordan-just-cant-call-timeout-with-the-ladies/
http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2007/04/13/0413webstory_jordan.jpg

Call me a hater if you want, but Jordan was, and and always will be, a puke.








(yes, I'm still bitter about the push off on Bryon Russel. Blow me.)

The Franchise
04-06-2009, 08:14 PM
For now but when it's all said and done, Kobe will be the GOAT!

What does GOAT mean?

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 08:16 PM
What does GOAT mean?
http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/goats/boer/BOER5.jpg

scanry
04-06-2009, 08:43 PM
I'm a bitter white adulterator...



=http://pictopia.com/perl/get_image?provider_id=202&size=550x550_mb&ptp_photo_id=84282

duncan228
04-06-2009, 09:12 PM
What does GOAT mean?

Greatest Of All Time.

lefty
04-06-2009, 09:14 PM
http://www.nba.com/media/dleague/colorado/williamtgoat2.jpg

The Franchise
04-06-2009, 09:28 PM
Greatest Of All Time.

No I mean in Kobes' case?

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 09:30 PM
No I mean in Kobes' case?
In Kobe's case?

http://www.sassygoatmilksoap.com/SassyGoatMilkSoap.jpg

baseline bum
04-06-2009, 09:31 PM
For JizzFan

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/3453/jordanzu3.png

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/4422/stealjc0.png

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/8933/ohnoesfr1.png

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/7617/ohshitli9.png

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/8876/saveusna8.png

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/5741/noooooohv2.png

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4549/noringdh2.png

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7198/fvckpb8.png

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 09:32 PM
For JizzFan

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/3453/jordanzu3.png

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/4422/stealjc0.png

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/8933/ohnoesfr1.png

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/7617/ohshitli9.png

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/8876/saveusna8.png

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/5741/noooooohv2.png

http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4549/noringdh2.png

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7198/fvckpb8.png
:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

sook
04-06-2009, 09:34 PM
http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/goats/boer/BOER5.jpg

wtf??? hahahaha :lol

Spursfan092120
04-06-2009, 09:40 PM
wtf??? hahahaha :lol
http://www.perhapanauts.com/blog/uploaded_images/goat3a-796204.jpg

The Franchise
04-06-2009, 09:41 PM
In Kobe's case?

http://www.sassygoatmilksoap.com/SassyGoatMilkSoap.jpg

:lmao:lmao

IronMexican
04-07-2009, 12:33 AM
According to Rockfan: Clyde = Jordan > Kobe

monosylab1k
04-07-2009, 02:19 AM
http://www.nbarefssuck.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/93_ainge_jordan.jpg
Jordan is lucky Ainge didn't kick his ass.

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :tu

The Franchise
04-07-2009, 08:46 AM
According to Rockfan: Clyde = Jordan > Kobe

Clyde = Kobe

LakeShow
04-07-2009, 10:55 AM
I have a lot of respect for you..but you're way off on this one. Kobe will never be Mike. Jordan has 6 titles. He won rings with much less talent than Kobe, back before guards were given an easier time. With all the rule changes, guards have it EASY now, and get away with a lot more. Back then, all the rules focused on helping the big man, and the guard was not given any love at all. Jordan in his prime is twice Kobe in his prime...and then some.

Respect! :toast

I don't know where this Jordan won with less talent came from. Jordan had plenty of talent around him. Phil Jackson built those teams around MJ, a very nice group of talented role players. Jordan leads on titles and I believe it will take Kobe a couple of titles to make that a wash. The rule changes has its pros and cons both ways. Can you imagine what kobe would have done if he faced one on one defenders nightly? What about an Iso for Kobe with the rest of the players off to the side? Kobe would have had a field day.

They have both done things that the other has not achieved. Just like Kobe never won a title without Shaq, MJ never won a title without Pippen or Jackson. I think it's ridiculous to penalize Kobe for having Shaq as a team mate. Kobe did the same things now that he did when Shaq was a Lakers. When the game is on the line, the Lakers put the ball in Kobe's hands, not shaq's. Much like what is going on now with the Lakers. The Lakers never looked to Shaq in a situation like that. Why? Because Kobe was clutch and you could depend on him to make the plays. Whether thats scoring or setting a team mate up for a good look, the ball was in Kobe's hands.

The Finals MVP's are misleading as well. During the Lakers 3 peat the eastern conference had no answer for Shaq. It was just force feed Shaq in the finals. No one could even come close to stopping him but If they gave MVP's for the Western Conference Playoffs, Kobe would have 3 MVP's. The Lakers don't make it to the finals without Kobe Jellybean Bryant.

That said, MJ is the GOAT but if Kobe wins a couple of more titles he will be considered the GOAT and well deserved.

stretch
04-07-2009, 12:02 PM
I don't know where this Jordan won with less talent came from. Jordan had plenty of talent around him. Phil Jackson built those teams around MJ, a very nice group of talented role players. Jordan leads on titles and I believe it will take Kobe a couple of titles to make that a wash. The rule changes has its pros and cons both ways. Can you imagine what kobe would have done if he faced one on one defenders nightly? What about an Iso for Kobe with the rest of the players off to the side? Kobe would have had a field day.

They have both done things that the other has not achieved. Just like Kobe never won a title without Shaq, MJ never won a title without Pippen or Jackson. I think it's ridiculous to penalize Kobe for having Shaq as a team mate. Kobe did the same things now that he did when Shaq was a Lakers. When the game is on the line, the Lakers put the ball in Kobe's hands, not shaq's. Much like what is going on now with the Lakers. The Lakers never looked to Shaq in a situation like that. Why? Because Kobe was clutch and you could depend on him to make the plays. Whether thats scoring or setting a team mate up for a good look, the ball was in Kobe's hands.

The Finals MVP's are misleading as well. During the Lakers 3 peat the eastern conference had no answer for Shaq. It was just force feed Shaq in the finals. No one could even come close to stopping him but If they gave MVP's for the Western Conference Playoffs, Kobe would have 3 MVP's. The Lakers don't make it to the finals without Kobe Jellybean Bryant.

That said, MJ is the GOAT but if Kobe wins a couple of more titles he will be considered the GOAT and well deserved.

Kobe would need to win AT LEAST 3 more, not a couple.

Second, you act as if Pippen is remotely close to the player Shaq was. He's not. Sure, Jordan needed a good second option, but fact is, that was Jordan's team, no questions asked. On the other hand, Kobe was Shaq's second option. That was Shaq's team. And you said it yourself in the whole Finals MVP stuff... all the Lakers had to do was throw it down low to Shaq, and he would take care of it. MJ NEVER had that luxury, as he was the one calling and taking the shots. Why? Because it was HIS team. Just like the Lakers were SHAQ'S team.

Also, you act like all Kobe sees are zone defenses, when in fact, all the best teams, play man defense most, if not all the time. :rolleyes

mavs>spurs2
04-07-2009, 12:05 PM
Also, you act like all Kobe sees are zone defenses, when in fact, all the best teams, play man defense most, if not all the time. :rolleyes

True, zone defenses should be a joke to someone with a shot like Kobe's. Zone defense is bad defense, it's just a crutch to fall back on when a team absolutely cannot stop the drive.

resistanze
04-07-2009, 12:36 PM
The Finals MVP's are misleading as well. During the Lakers 3 peat the eastern conference had no answer for Shaq. It was just force feed Shaq in the finals. No one could even come close to stopping him but If they gave MVP's for the Western Conference Playoffs, Kobe would have 3 MVP's.

2002 WCF
Shaq: 30PPG/14RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 27PPG on 42% shooting

2001 WCF
Shaq: 27PPG/13RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 34PPG/7APG/7RPG on 51% shooting

2000 WCF
Shaq: 26PPG/12RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 20PPG/6APG/5RPG on 41% shooting

No.

kingmalaki
04-07-2009, 02:02 PM
I'm not sure where this "MJ didn't have help" argument comes from. Pippen was arguably the best SF in basketball when they were winning. Grant was an All-Star caliber PF. Rodman should be in the HOF. Kukoc was great off the bench. They had tons of dependable shooters as well. Hell, the team won 50+ games without Jordan in 95 and almost got to the ECF, and all they really added was Kukoc (rookie) and Pete freaking Myers. MJ had tons of help....

With that being said, I don't see how Kobe can be in the GOAT convo when he clearly isn't even the best player in his generation (Shaq or Duncan....pick one).

LakeShow
04-07-2009, 04:48 PM
2002 WCF
Shaq: 30PPG/14RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 27PPG on 42% shooting

2001 WCF
Shaq: 27PPG/13RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 34PPG/7APG/7RPG on 51% shooting

2000 WCF
Shaq: 26PPG/12RPG on 54% Shooting
Kobe: 20PPG/6APG/5RPG on 41% shooting

No.

I said western conference playoffs not finals. Even with that,

in 2000 the lakers don't get to the finals without Kobe's play against Portland in game 7, down 15. Kobe lead the lakers to victory.

2001 western conference playoffs you should remember quite well. Kobe abused Timmie and Drob and the whole SA team that season in the playoffs. That was the season when Shaq called Kobe, Phenomenal. Nuff said.

2002 western conference playoffs. Shaq was hurt and out of shape that year. Kobe carried the lakers in the playoffs.

bdubya
04-07-2009, 04:54 PM
yes, I'm still bitter about the push off on Bryon Russel.

As you should be. But maybe it won't hurt so much if you think of it as payback for every cheap elbow Malone ever threw.

samikeyp
04-07-2009, 04:58 PM
As you should be. But maybe it won't hurt so much if you think of it as payback for every cheap elbow Malone ever threw.

"But..but...that elbow against Robinson was legal"

-just about every Jazz fan I have ever met.

cobbler
04-07-2009, 05:15 PM
For gosh sakes... how many times does the Kobe =,>,< Jordan thing need to be brought up? All the arguments are subjective. You are comparing different eras, rules, competition levels. Everyone has their opinions. I happen to think neither is the GOAT as I put Oscar and Wilt above them both. You have different positions. You have different criteria. Blah blah blah. Example: People bring up the rings all the time... well then I guess that means Russell is the GOAT. MVPs... then I guess the nod goes to Kareem. Scoring Avg... Wilt.

...and so on and so on and so on.

Give it a rest already.... How about remembering Jordan for all the skills, highlights, and memories he gave us and enjoy Kobe for what he brings to the table in the present.

IronMexican
04-07-2009, 05:50 PM
Lol, cobbler is old.

Spursmania
04-07-2009, 05:52 PM
In Kobe's case?

http://www.sassygoatmilksoap.com/SassyGoatMilkSoap.jpg

Thank you for another great laugh!:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao