Paglia on Modern Liberalism

[101A]

From her Salon Piece. (http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2009/04/08/bow/index1.html)



Regarding your observations about the rehabilitation of Sarah Palin and the insufferable snottiness of Dick Cavett and other good liberals: Is it possible that there might be something really ugly at the core of contemporary liberalism? You call yourself a liberal, and you vote liberal, yet you are under constant attack by your liberal compatriots. Why? Because of your open-mindedness and your "real feminism" (as opposed to faux leftist feminism).
In the meantime, the torching of Sarah Palin's church in Alaska (children were inside when the fire with accelerant was set) evokes a collective shrug in the mainstream media and other liberal precincts (if you can find any reference to the event at all). Why the all-too-frequent and downright nasty face of contemporary liberalism?


Timothy Condon
Campton, Fl

Yes, something very ugly has surfaced in contemporary American liberalism, as evidenced by the irrational and sometimes infantile abuse directed toward anyone who strays from a strict party line. Liberalism, like second-wave feminism, seems to have become a new religion for those who profess contempt for religion. It has been reduced to an elitist set of rhetorical formulas, which posit the working class as passive, mindless victims in desperate need of salvation by the state. Individual rights and free expression, which used to be liberal values, are being gradually subsumed to worship of government power.
The problems on the American left were already manifest by the late 1960s, as college-educated liberals began to lose contact with the working class for whom they claimed to speak. (A superb 1990 documentary, "Berkeley in the Sixties," chronicles the arguments and misjudgments about tactics that alienated the national electorate and led to the election of Richard Nixon.) For the past 25 years, liberalism has gradually sunk into a soft, soggy, white upper-middle-class style that I often find preposterous and repellent. The nut cases on the right are on the uneducated fringe, but on the left they sport Ivy League degrees. I'm not kidding -- there are some real fruitcakes out there, and some of them are writing for major magazines. It's a comfortable, urban, messianic liberalism befogged by psychiatric pharmaceuticals. Conservatives these days are more geared to facts than emotions, and as individuals they seem to have a more ethical, perhaps sports-based sense of fair play.
Probably the main reason for my unorthodox view of politics (as in my instant approval of Sarah Palin) is that I had much more childhood contact with working-class life than appears to be the norm among current American columnists. One of my grandfathers was a barber, and the other was a leather worker at the Endicott-Johnson shoe factory in upstate New York. Thanks to the G.I. Bill, my father was able to attend college, the only one in his large family to do so. I was born while he was still in college and mopping floors in the cafeteria. Years later, he became a high-school teacher and then a professor at a Jesuit college, but we never left our immigrant family roots in industrial Endicott. To this day, I have more rapport with campus infrastructure staffers (maintenance, security) than I do with other professors or, for that matter, writers. Don't get me started on the hermetic bourgeois arrogance of American literati!


As a person who hangs with professors regularly (going for a brunch of poached salmon with dill sauce, asparagus and White Wine for Easter - with a bunch of atheists), Paglia is pretty accurate in her description of elite liberalism - including their relative intolerance. They put up with my brand of conservatism, I think, because I'm from Texas and they figure it's genetic.

[Oh, Gee!!]

libtards

[LnGrrrR]

Paglia is an idiot. That's why liberals make fun of her. I'd say she's the Thomas Sowell of the left, but Thomas Sowell is actually liked by the Right.

[LnGrrrR]

Also, while it's not the thing I hate most, it's gotta be up there... why is the Left and Right both dominated by what happened in the 60's? Vietnam, civil rights, etc etc... I can only hope we get most of these boomers out of office, and soon. Paglia is just another who views all politics from this perspective/prism.

[JoeChalupa]

the 60's were a very important part of the growth of America and thank God for that.

[Winehole23]

I love Paglia. She's a political independent who's not afraid to spit in your eye -- if you're liberal. She's a culture warrior who wants to keep things stirred up, so she mollycoddles hurtin' pup conservatives stung by the vicious barbs of the cultural elite, while patting herself on the back for the cultural authenticity conferred by her *working class* upbringing.

Joe the Plumber she ain't.

pwLB2Vei6tE

[JoeChalupa]

I can live with it.

[Joe the plumber]

I love Paglia. She's a political independent who's not afraid to spit in your eye -- if you're liberal. She's a culture warrior who wants to keep things stirred up, so she mollycoddles hurtin' pup conservatives stung by the vicious barbs of the cultural elite, while patting herself on the back for the cultural authenticity conferred by her *working class* upbringing.

Joe the Plumber she ain't.

pwLB2Vei6tE

:flipoff

[LnGrrrR]

the 60's were a very important part of the growth of America and thank God for that.

Agreed, but they were 50 years ago. Politicians nowadays who lived through that are obviously affected by it, and that's normal. However, they don't recognize we're in a different era.

How many lefties are proclaiming the greatness of socialism nowadays, for instance?

[JoeChalupa]

Agreed, but they were 50 years ago. Politicians nowadays who lived through that are obviously affected by it, and that's normal. However, they don't recognize we're in a different era.

How many lefties are proclaiming the greatness of socialism nowadays, for instance?

I'm not. The limbaughites are spouting all this "socialism' talk and so is Joe Pags and other conservatives. Of course we are in a different era but that doesn't mean the ideas and views of the 60's need to forgotten.

[LnGrrrR]

I'm not. The limbaughites are spouting all this "socialism' talk and so is Joe Pags and other conservatives. Of course we are in a different era but that doesn't mean the ideas and views of the 60's need to forgotten.

Forgotten, no. Moved past, yes. Iraq gets compared to Vietnam, people with liberal views are considered 'hippies' and 'socialists', legalization of marijuana still gets (mostly) demonized... things of that nature.

If it makes you feel better, that 60's gloss is all over the music genre too. Who are almost always considered the best bands/singers of all time? Beatles, Rolling Stones, Elvis, Buddy Holly, Jimi Hendrix, etc etc. Don't get me wrong, they all were influential, and all pretty amazing, but the viewpoint of most music writers is from that era as well.

[FaithInOne]

Individual rights and free expression, which used to be liberal values, are being gradually subsumed to worship of government power.

[JoeChalupa]

Forgotten, no. Moved past, yes. Iraq gets compared to Vietnam, people with liberal views are considered 'hippies' and 'socialists', legalization of marijuana still gets (mostly) demonized... things of that nature.

If it makes you feel better, that 60's gloss is all over the music genre too. Who are almost always considered the best bands/singers of all time? Beatles, Rolling Stones, Elvis, Buddy Holly, Jimi Hendrix, etc etc. Don't get me wrong, they all were influential, and all pretty amazing, but the viewpoint of most music writers is from that era as well.

I agree. The 60's is an era that was very historical in what occured politically and socially. I think today's youth are going to be very influential in the years to come. The changing of the guard politically will happen soon as the older members retire or are voted out.

[Winehole23]

Individual rights and free expression, which used to be liberal values, are being gradually subsumed to worship of government power.

http://www.ifc.com/news/images/10282008_beneaththeplanetoftheapes.jpg

[PixelPusher]

Yes, something very ugly has surfaced in contemporary American liberalism, as evidenced by the irrational and sometimes infantile abuse directed toward anyone who strays from a strict party line.
Yeah, liberals are oh-so lockstep, uniform and disciplined - not like those carefree, loose, big-tent conservatives.

:rolleyes

...and are all liberals equivalent to a couple of cloistered baby-boomer professors now? Does this mean all conservatives are equivalent to bloviating reactionaries on talk radio?

[FaithInOne]

According to many on Spurstalk, apparently so.

Both the left and right have gotten away from the ideals they once were respected for. The left-right paradigm traps potentially intelligent political minds in a dead-end game; which is what the puppet masters want.

A recent example of this can be viewed in Barney Frank's recent interaction with the Harvard Law Student.

[angrydude]

Yeah, liberals are oh-so lockstep, uniform and disciplined - not like those carefree, loose, big-tent conservatives.

:rolleyes

...and are all liberals equivalent to a couple of cloistered baby-boomer professors now? Does this mean all conservatives are equivalent to bloviating reactionaries on talk radio?


I think he was referring to the left's blogosphere. I'd say that is a pretty accurate characterization of places like democraticundergound.com.

[Winehole23]

I think he was referring to the left's blogosphere. I'd say that is a pretty accurate characterization of places like democraticundergound.com.Both Left- and Right- blogistans have a preponderance of orclike figures. Fear and misinformation are their scions; fake triumph and petty grievance is the approved style.


http://sial.org/blog/images/X-Orc-Status.jpg

[hope4dopes]

According to many on Spurstalk, apparently so.

Both the left and right have gotten away from the ideals they once were respected for. The left-right paradigm traps potentially intelligent political minds in a dead-end game; which is what the puppet masters want.

A recent example of this can be viewed in Barney Frank's recent interaction with the Harvard Law Student.


Yeah I agree. Pagalia is cool I love her celebration of sexuality,her iconaclastic mind, and the way she eviscerates the limp dicked sophists of the "radical chic".

[clambake]

who are the "radical chic"?

[Winehole23]

who are the "radical chic"?Radical Chic and Mau-Mauing the Flak Catchers, by Tom Wolfe


Radical Chic & Mau-Mauing the Flak Catchers was a 1970 book by Tom Wolfe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Wolfe). The book, Wolfe's fourth, is composed of two articles by Wolfe, "These Radical Chic Evenings," first published in June of 1970 in New York Magazine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_Magazine), about a gathering Leonard Bernstein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonard_Bernstein) held for the Black Panther Party (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Panther_Party) and "Mau-Mauing the Flak Catchers," about the response of many minorities to San Francisco (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco)'s poverty programs. Both essays looked at the conflict between black rage (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_rage_%28law%29) and white guilt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_guilt).[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_Chic_&_Mau-Mauing_the_Flak_Catchers#cite_note-Time-0)j[/URL]


[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:RadicalChic.jpg"]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/98/RadicalChic.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_Chic_&_Mau-Mauing_the_Flak_Catchers#cite_note-Time-0)

[Winehole23]

http://nymag.com/news/features/46170/

http://images.nymag.com/news/features/1970-0806-cover-250.jpg

[spurster]

Individual rights and free expression, which used to be liberal values, are being gradually subsumed to worship of government power.

Good thing that the conservatives never did anything like this when they were in power.

[LnGrrrR]

Radical Chic and Mau-Mauing the Flak Catchers, by Tom Wolfe

j


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/98/RadicalChic.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:RadicalChic.jpg)

1970.... like I said, I'm tired of these old ass people viewing everything through the lens of 30 to 40 years ago :)

[hope4dopes]

1970.... like I said, I'm tired of these old ass people viewing everything through the lens of 30 to 40 years ago :)


Obama's mother is part of the radical chic, his view have been shaped by that same padagrim of reality

[LnGrrrR]

Obama's mother is part of the radical chic, his view have been shaped by that same padagrim of reality

Hope, you know, you're pretty obsessed with Obama. Do you have a poster of him on your ceiling? :D

[Winehole23]

Obama's mother is part of the radical chic, his view have been shaped by that same padagrim of realityHello, micca (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3151479&postcount=20).


his wife whose only crime is she threatens the islamic padagrim of women as chattel, but I'm sure it's not germane to you.You can knock on deaf man's door forever.

[LnGrrrR]

Hello, micca (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3151479&postcount=20).

Nice catch WH23. :toast

[Winehole23]

It was a very distinctive misspelling, in a conversation with me. God bless the search function.

[hope4dopes]

Hello, micca (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3151479&postcount=20).

Wow your far more chicken shit than even I gave you credit for. you and I both know that was what I wrote about an Islamic activists who murdered his wife after she requested a divorce.

[hope4dopes]

1970.... like I said, I'm tired of these old ass people viewing everything through the lens of 30 to 40 years ago :)


Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains. - Winston Churchill

[Winehole23]

Wow your far more chicken shit than even I gave you credit for. Using the search function is chicken shit?


you and I both know that was what I wrote about an Islamic activists who murdered his wife after she requested a divorce.So you admit you're a troll. Nice.

[hope4dopes]

It was a very distinctive misspelling, in a conversation with me. God bless the search function.

Ah precious boy....... did your grade school teacher lock you in a closet to long when you kid, gotta get those gold stars...gotta get those gold stars, dontcha precious.

[Winehole23]

You're just mad your balloon got popped.

[LnGrrrR]

Using the search function is chicken shit?

So you admit you're a troll. Nice.

At least he admits it, even if unintentionally. lol

The intelligence factor there explains the poor spelling/grammar.

[ChumpDumper]

Wow your far more chicken shit than even I gave you credit for. you and I both know that was what I wrote about an Islamic activists who murdered his wife after she requested a divorce.Yeah, this is a completely different pandagrime.

[LnGrrrR]

Ah precious boy....... did your grade school teacher lock you in a closet to long when you kid, gotta get those gold stars...gotta get those gold stars, dontcha precious.

Why don't you just post as micca? Why the need to sockpuppet? Did you think your views would make more sense with a different screen name?

[ChumpDumper]

Show me a young Conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old Liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains. - Winston ChurchillHe greatly respected FDR's intelligence.

[ChumpDumper]

Why don't you just post as micca? Why the need to sockpuppet? Did you think your views would make more sense with a different screen name?It's funny, he did it in the middle of an exchange in a thread. Just go back to the first post under the new name.

[hope4dopes]

Why don't you just post as micca? Why the need to sockpuppet? Did you think your views would make more sense with a different screen name?
it express my feelings about our president

[Winehole23]

Ah precious boy....... did your grade school teacher lock you in a closet to long when you kid, gotta get those gold stars...gotta get those gold stars, dontcha precious.That's inappropriately and creepily familiar.

I'm a 40 year old man, micca. Your faintly epicene (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicene) charm is totally lost on me.

[LnGrrrR]

it express my feelings about our president

.... right....

[hope4dopes]

It's funny, he did it in the middle of an exchange in a thread. Just go back to the first post under the new name.

SO let me get this straight.... whinehole is the organ grinder with ananal retentive preoccupation with cleanliness and spelling and your the monkey that follows him around?

[Winehole23]

At least he admits it, even if unintentionally. lol

The intelligence factor there explains the poor spelling/grammar.Hmm, not sure I'd put it down to a lack of intelligence.

My PFA guess is English is not micca's first language.

[hope4dopes]

That's inappropriately and creepily familiar.

I'm a 40 year old man, micca. Your faintly epicene (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicene) charm is totally lost on me.

[ChumpDumper]

SO let me get this straight.... whinehole is the organ grinder with ananal retentive preoccupation with cleanliness and spelling and your the monkey that follows him around?No, I just remembered your changing your name in the middle of a thread. It was funny.

It's getting funnier.

[hope4dopes]

That's inappropriately and creepily familiar.

I'm a 40 year old man, micca. Your faintly epicene (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicene) charm is totally lost on me.
what's familiar the closet or the gold star thing

[Winehole23]

SO let me get this straight.... whinehole is the organ grinder with ananal retentive preoccupation with cleanliness and spelling and your the monkey that follows him around?Please stop. You're just making it worse for yourself.

[hope4dopes]

Please stop. You're just making it worse for yourself.
Ah hell and I thought you wanted to play

[LnGrrrR]

Hmm, not sure I'd put it down to a lack of intelligence.

My PFA guess is English is not micca's first language.

I asked that earlier with no response. But how do you explain your amazingly easy attempt at unmasking his trollishness?

[Winehole23]

what's familiar the closet or the gold star thingNeither really. I was a middling student and have always disliked gold stars.

As for the insinuation that I am gay, go ask my wife how she likes it. The answer may surprise you.

[ChumpDumper]

She likes that you are gay?

[Winehole23]

I asked that earlier with no response. But how do you explain your amazingly easy attempt at unmasking his trollishness?micca unmasked himself. He gets all the credit really.

[Winehole23]

She likes that you are gay?She loves how gay I am.

I don't date men -- never have, never wanted to -- but I'm pretty sure she'd let me if I asked.

[Winehole23]

Lucky me, she likes smart weirdos.

[hope4dopes]

Neither really. I was a middling student and have always disliked gold stars.

As for the insinuation that I am gay, go ask my wife how she likes it. The answer may surprise you.

Oh I didn't think you were gay....just that they may not have dropped yet

[ChumpDumper]

How does one drop multiple closets?

[Winehole23]

Oh I didn't think you were gay....just that they may not have dropped yetVulgar. Yet typical.

Go measure your own junk and stop obsessing on mine, please.

[CuckingFunt]

How does one drop multiple closets?

I imagine it would require a crane of some sort.

[clambake]

why are conservatives so fixated with cock?

[hope4dopes]

Vulgar. Yet typical.

Go measure your own junk and stop obsessing on mine, please.

Junk?...... wow haven't heard that one in a while . anyway asshole why don't you stop obsessing on my spelling and I'll stop obsessing on your lack of ...junk.

[CuckingFunt]

Junk?...... wow haven't heard that one in a while . anyway asshole why don't you stop obsessing on my spelling and I'll stop obsessing on your lack of ...junk.

So, then, you are obsessed with Winehole's general junkal region?

[clambake]

now he's visualizing the size of another guys cock.

[Winehole23]

why are conservatives so fixated with cock?The spurstalk Uruk-Hai seem to favor ostentatious displays of sexual crudity on both sides of the political aisle from what I see.

Nothing to see here. It's par for the course.

[ChumpDumper]

So, then, you are obsessed with Winehole's general junkal region?Maybe he fancies himself a crane operator.

[Winehole23]

Junk?...... wow haven't heard that one in a while . anyway asshole why don't you stop obsessing on my spelling and I'll stop obsessing on your lack of ...junk.I already did. You were too obsessed with my junk to notice.

[Winehole23]

Maybe he fancies himself a crane operator.:lol

[CuckingFunt]

Maybe he fancies himself a crane operator.

It would explain the interest in levers.

[hope4dopes]

Maybe he fancies himself a crane operator.

Sorry chump whinehole has the banannas off you go.

[clambake]

bananas? i just have to ask.

is that a metaphor?

[hope4dopes]

now he's visualizing the size of another guys cock.

Wow you suburbanites really like to titillate your selves with homoerotic images alot.

[Winehole23]

Wow you suburbanites really like to titillate your selves with homoerotic images alot.You started it, Dirty Uncle Ernie.

PkEAS_eySw4

[ChumpDumper]

bananas? i just have to ask.

is that a metaphor?Well, if anything, we can track any of his new sock puppets if he uses that word again.

[clambake]

Well, if anything, we can track any of his new sock puppets if he uses that word again.

he should run from this thread as fast as he can.

[hope4dopes]

You started it, Dirty Uncle Ernie.

PkEAS_eySw4

from your private collection ?

[hope4dopes]

You started it, Dirty Uncle Ernie.

PkEAS_eySw4




Yes, something very ugly has surfaced in contemporary American liberalism, as evidenced by the irrational and sometimes infantile abuse directed toward anyone who strays from a strict party line.




Thank you all I think you proved the writers point very well. ciao

[LnGrrrR]

Yes, something very ugly has surfaced in contemporary American liberalism, as evidenced by the irrational and sometimes infantile abuse directed toward anyone who strays from a strict party line.

Thank you all I think you proved the writers point very well. ciao

:rollin

Coming from the man who keeps insinuating that people are gay and/or have small penises.

[ChumpDumper]

What party line has anything to do with micca's internets sock puppet?

[CuckingFunt]

What party line has anything to do with micca's internets sock puppet?

The banana.

It's always the banana.

[Ignignokt]

This proves me all along. Cuckoldfart is a dude!!!!!!!!

[ChumpDumper]

How's that?

[Ignignokt]

How's that?

don't ruin my trollage.