Is it Bonner's fault?

[spursfan1000]

last year bonner was just a scrub that came on in blowout games and this year POP started to start him, is it pops fault for trying this expirement and failing?

[SA210]

:pop: <--------------His fault 150%

[mexicanjunior]

It's both of their faults...

[Avitus1]

it's both of their faults...

+1

[spursfan1000]

It's both of their faults...

If you think about it if POP tried to put Vaughn as starter and Vaughn did terribly which he would do it would be POPS fault for puting him in starting lineup.

[NewJerSpur]

If he plays like he did in game 2, he helps us. If he plays like he's played throughout most of the series, he hurts us. Stay in front of Dirk, rotate on defense, take shots when you're open instead of deferring to someone else to take the pressure off yourself, and secure rebounds when the ball is in your area.

[spursfan1000]

If he plays like he did in game 2, he helps us. If he plays like he's played throughout most of the series, he hurts us. Stay in front of Dirk, rotate on defense, take shots when you're open instead of deferring to someone else to take the pressure off yourself, and secure rebounds when the ball is in your area.


IMO I don't think he will ever be a better than average defender. I would rather much have Kurt Thomas start.

[Avitus1]

I would say below average defender... but yea I'd like to see KT start or Oberto.

[NewJerSpur]

Definitely feel Kurt is the overall better defender, but I think Bonner can do a decent job of moving his feet enough to stay with Dirk enough to buy time for help to come and stand him up. Kurt is best when he's guarding physical bigs, but with the way Dirk flops he might not stand a chance.....even Gooden is a better option IMO. Bonner's not an all-world defender but he hasn't made things totally easy for DW.

[Spursone]

:downspin:

Of course it's not Bonner's fault, he's a 1 dimensional player, His Coach is the one that keeps him a starter even if he totally Blows!

[Spursmania]

It's Pop's fault for putting him in a no win situation.

He is meant to come off the bench and play a limited role. Bonner will never be what Pop wants him to be. But, one can also criticize Bonner's playing abilities in the playoffs. He has no business starting for a Spurs team, unless we're playing the Wizards. He had an opportunity of a lifetime to hit some shots or make some type of dent in the games. A+ for effort. D for execution. Bonner has certainly lived up to what I thought he would do in the playoffs. Nothing special. It's not his fault he is not a great player or a a go to guy. One can only do so much with their God given talents.

[xtremesteven33]

Pop is just hoping Bonner finds his shot as soon as possible....Once he does the offense will run much smoother....right now Bonner is a liability as much as Oberto....

[Road Warrior]

I just wish Matt played with more confidence. I mean a guy that can shoot like he does shouldn't be so hesitant when he gets good looks. If he had more confidence in himself plus the way he can shoot, those shots would have no choice but to start going in at some point.

[hater]

Bonner is no better than Briant Scalabrini. actually scalabrini has better defense

Blame it on the idiot that thought he could be a starter in the playoffs

[Solid D]

They are truly losing as a team in every category except financially. Coaches, players, FO and injuries to players all have played a role.

Parker has been fantastic, but let's face it...he has been fantastic for the French NT too. He can't do it by himself every game and see real team success.

[RedRaider]

Mostly Pop's fault. I would never start Bonner... he's just simply not an athlete. I wouldn't mind seeing him if they need a 3 or in mop up but I just don't see why he starts, especially after his showing in the playoffs this year.

[Bruno]

I find the whole "it's Pop fault" theory just plain ridiculous.

Bonner has been a starter for the whole year. In the RS, his FG% was 50%. In the playoffs, his FG% is 21%. It's hard to blame Pop for Bonner not being able to shoot in these playoffs.

Same thing for Mason. His main trouble in this series is that his defense has been atrocious. It's hard to link that Pop giving him some time at the PG spot is the reason why his defense is so bad.

Pop has made some mistake but you can't put everything wrong with Spurs on him.

[diego]

bonner has been overachieving all year. and bruno is right in the sense that its not pop's fault that he cant continue with that, though many did notice that bonner tended to play his worst in big games and/or in the clutch so maybe pop should have prepared a plan for that.

but I still think its pop's fault, especially since he is president of bball ops, and even with the injuries, that this team doesnt have an identity or set rotations. The situation with hill and mason not being used properly, and relying on duncan make up for bonner on D and kurt on O... maybe its easier to say it now that Tim looks old and hurt, but i think deep down we all knew that duncan, even if healthy, was going to need more than kurt thomas and matt bonner to help him man the paint, especially if finley is going to be playing big minutes letting slashers right into the paint. Gooden can be an asset, but simply isnt enough. our frontcourt has two wasted spots with oberto and mahimi, and we have a glaring need for a bigman who can help tim man the paint. the spurs rebounded like pussies saturday night.

A lot of people say the spurs were too proud after winning in 07, not making moves... but I feel like since we didnt make those moves, why are we benching bruce bowen for matt bonner and ime udoka? Even if he failed miserably, I'd rather see bruce out there, just because he earned that spot. to a lesser degree I feel the same about oberto. the problem was not that they didnt make moves, its that they made the wrong ones.

saturday night in the 4th I was thinking, if bonner is only out there to shoot 3s and defend dirk, then why isn't bruce out there? with hill out there playing great (even though pop said he wasnt ready), you have to come to the conclusion that pop has really lost it and should have never given up D for O. the same with all the quick 3s the spurs launched, its like pop forgot to pound the rock and win with D and half court interior scoring. Bonner is playing well, he's shown improvement and he has a niche. defending the other team's best player and taking the final shots of a practically must win playoff game aren't in that niche.

If it werent the mavs it wouldnt bother me so much to see this team lose, given all the injuries and whatnot. but next year I'm very curious to see if pop will continue the madness or try to recover the slow-paced, half court, inside out, take away the three and transition and make them hit contested mid range shots team that dominated a few years back. maybe the personnel wont be as good to dominate. but i'd rather lose seeing them play like that, then with pop's small ball and now, a team that rushes shots and gets beaten up inside.

[alchemist]

I find the whole "it's Pop fault" theory just plain ridiculous.

Bonner has been a starter for the whole year. In the RS, his FG% was 50%. In the playoffs, his FG% is 21%. It's hard to blame Pop for Bonner not being able to shoot in these playoffs.

Same thing for Mason. His main trouble in this series is that his defense has been atrocious. It's hard to link that Pop giving him some time at the PG spot is the reason why his defense is so bad.

Pop has made some mistake but you can't put everything wrong with Spurs on him.
according to most on this forum it's Pop's fault for World War 1 & 2, HIV, Cancer and the current epidemic Swine-Flu. Vinny Del Negro could've gotten 50 wins out of this Spurs team this season :downspin:

[Spursmania]

I thought Pop set the rotations and called the shots of who plays and who sits on the bench?

If Pop takes credit for winning Championships, he also has to take the brunt of not having his rotations set. I think Pop is a great coach, and I hope he remains in SA for quite awhile. But he does have to bear the responsibility of what the team has become now. It's part of his job.

[ElNono]

I find the whole "it's Pop fault" theory just plain ridiculous.

Bonner has been a starter for the whole year. In the RS, his FG% was 50%. In the playoffs, his FG% is 21%. It's hard to blame Pop for Bonner not being able to shoot in these playoffs.

You could see after Game 1 shooters were not going to be effective. And we have players on the bench that both have a post game or can play the pick and roll a lot better than Bonner. Not only that, they rebound better than him. This is not rocket science. We have a 4 game sample now, and he's only been partially effective on only one game. And I say partially, because he started to shot the ball when we already had a 20+ point lead, and Dallas was gambling left and right to try to catch up. Why not try something else? I mean, it's not like he's guarding Dirk one on one either. But you know what? I bet dollars to donuts he's going to start tomorrow, and play the bulk of the time at his position. So, is it Bonner's fault he can't get an easy shot or is put on a position where he can't contribute? Or is it Pop's fault for being stubborn?


Same thing for Mason. His main trouble in this series is that his defense has been atrocious. It's hard to link that Pop giving him some time at the PG spot is the reason why his defense is so bad.


Please Bruno. Mason, and for that matter, Finley too have been sucking on defense for a long time now. In Mason's case, he used to be able to offset it with his scoring. But not in this series. And if you see he's sucking on defense, why wait until the 4th game of the series, when we're already in a hole, to give Hill a chance? Whose fault is that? Mason's?


Pop has made some mistake but you can't put everything wrong with Spurs on him.

I can't certainly blame him for things like players going through the motions, instead of playing with heart. But you can't tell me he's blameless being stubborn in his ways when his scheme is clearly not working. He's hoping Duncan will start to dominate anytime soon to open up the shooters, and if he doesn't then he'll happily see the season end without actually trying anything else. And that, I can put squarely on him.

[weebo]

No team with Matt Bonner as starting center will ever win an NBA title.

[peskypesky]

:pop: <--------------his fault 150%

+1

[peskypesky]

No team with Matt Bonner as starting center will ever win dick.

fixed

[completely deck]

No team with Matt Bonner as starting center will ever win an NBA title.

And you'd think one with Zydrunas Ilgauskas wouldn't have a shot either but what do I know.

[S4Spur21]

sooooooooo MANY members on here actually sucked up to the idea that Matt Bonner would be a legit center for us in the playoffs.


Guess what? He's fucking WEAK as shit.


There is a reason our interior defense looks like shit.

There is a reason why we give up so many offensive rebounds which = more points for Dallas.

Tim Duncan absolutely has ZERO help when Bonner is in the game. I don't give a shit if he can stretch the defense.

He's pure garbage. He wouldn't start on any other playoff team, in the entire NBA.

[peskypesky]

And you'd think one with Zydrunas Ilgauskas wouldn't have a shot either but what do I know.

you're not really comparing Bonner to Ilgauskas, are you? If you are you're a know-nothing. Ilgauskas is a former All-Star, Bonner is a scrub. Big big difference.

[itzsoweezee]

I find the whole "it's Pop fault" theory just plain ridiculous.

Bonner has been a starter for the whole year. In the RS, his FG% was 50%. In the playoffs, his FG% is 21%. It's hard to blame Pop for Bonner not being able to shoot in these playoffs.

Same thing for Mason. His main trouble in this series is that his defense has been atrocious. It's hard to link that Pop giving him some time at the PG spot is the reason why his defense is so bad.

Pop has made some mistake but you can't put everything wrong with Spurs on him.


pop is giving bonner the minutes. boner isn't putting himself in the lineup. it's 100% pop's fault. if boner gets major minutes again in game 5, what will the excuse be then? it's pretty freaking obvious now that boner has nothing to offer.

[weebo]

And you'd think one with Zydrunas Ilgauskas wouldn't have a shot either but what do I know.

Big Z > Matt Bonehead

[completely deck]

you're not really comparing Bonner to Ilgauskas, are you? If you are you're a know-nothing. Ilgauskas is a former All-Star, Bonner is a scrub. Big big difference.

take a look at the numbers if you don't believe me.

[Borosai]

Matt Bonner!

[tmtcsc]

Mason should take some of the blame. Pop can't go out and play for these guys. When they have open looks they need to shoot the ball and they need to attack the glass when they don't shoot.

This is all on the role players. We've counted on them a lot this season and the playoffs is no time to role up in a ball and disappear.

A little home cooking is what we need to get our mojo back. Winning in Dallas is inevitable. We just need take care of tomorrow first.

[Sean Cagney]

Not all THIS CLOWNS FAULT, but he is utter garbage out there on O and D.

[Bruno]

You could see after Game 1 shooters were not going to be effective. And we have players on the bench that both have a post game or can play the pick and roll a lot better than Bonner. Not only that, they rebound better than him. This is not rocket science. We have a 4 game sample now, and he's only been partially effective on only one game. And I say partially, because he started to shot the ball when we already had a 20+ point lead, and Dallas was gambling left and right to try to catch up. Why not try something else? I mean, it's not like he's guarding Dirk one on one either. But you know what? I bet dollars to donuts he's going to start tomorrow, and play the bulk of the time at his position. So, is it Bonner's fault he can't get an easy shot or is put on a position where he can't contribute? Or is it Pop's fault for being stubborn?
Please Bruno. Mason, and for that matter, Finley too have been sucking on defense for a long time now. In Mason's case, he used to be able to offset it with his scoring. But not in this series. And if you see he's sucking on defense, why wait until the 4th game of the series, when we're already in a hole, to give Hill a chance? Whose fault is that? Mason's?

I was saying "If Bonner and Mason sucks, it's on them".
You answer is "If they get playing time, it's on Pop."

Do you realize that there is no oppositions between both things ?




I can't certainly blame him for things like players going through the motions, instead of playing with heart. But you can't tell me he's blameless being stubborn in his ways when his scheme is clearly not working. He's hoping Duncan will start to dominate anytime soon to open up the shooters, and if he doesn't then he'll happily see the season end without actually trying anything else. And that, I can put squarely on him.

Well I said "Pop has made some mistake", I don't know why I consider him as "blameless".

Not playing Hill, is to me, Pop's biggest mistake in this series. Mavs have a small and offensively oriented backcourt. They are a good matchup for Hill.

And I'm not sold by your assumption that Pop is giving too much playing time to Bonner and Mason. Both sucks but the alternate solutions suck.
Parker has been great in this series, Duncan has do what he can do with his knee(s), Bowen has been quite solid, Hill has show good things but was in the doghouse and the rest of the team sucks.
When you have only 4 decent players including one who is in the doghouse, it's just impossible to put a good team on the floor. I have a hard time saying who deserves the more playing time between Mason, Finley, Udoka, Bonner, Gooden and Thomas.

[portnoy1]

This will sound kinda funny;but actually alot of the spurs problems offensively are Tony Parkers fault.

[ElNono]

I was saying "If Bonner and Mason sucks, it's on them".
You answer is "If they get playing time, it's on Pop."

Do you realize that there is no oppositions between both things ?


The problem is that, offensively speaking, I don't necessarily see them sucking. I see that they can't play their role, and you have to give Dallas props for that. They're just innefective under the scheme our coach is using. They're being set up to fail. And Pop is not doing a thing to change that. He's hoping they'll figure it out, instead of him being hands on and doing something about it.
This stubbornness and lack of adjusting reminds me of the 2004 playoffs. We win the first 2 games handily, then PJ adjusts and makes us beat them from the 3 pt line. Pop never countered. He sit pat and we lost the next 4 games.



Well I said "Pop has made some mistake", I don't know why I consider him as "blameless".

Not playing Hill, is to me, Pop's biggest mistake in this series. Mavs have a small and offensively oriented backcourt. They are a good matchup for Hill.

And I'm not sold by your assumption that Pop is giving too much playing time to Bonner and Mason. Both sucks but the alternate solutions suck.
Parker has been great in this series, Duncan has do what he can do with his knee(s), Bowen has been quite solid, Hill has show good things but was in the doghouse and the rest of the team sucks.
When you have only 4 decent players including one who is in the doghouse, it's just impossible to put a good team on the floor. I have a hard time saying who deserves the more playing time between Mason, Finley, Udoka, Bonner, Gooden and Thomas.

The only obvious change he made in the lineup was pretty much forced on him, and it was playing Bowen more, after sitting his ass all season long. We're very fortunate that Bruce is a hard worker and stays in shape, otherwise this would have been very, very ugly.
Hill needed to play more since Game 1, when Barea was doing whatever he wanted.
As far as the rest of the role players sucking, well, if after 20 minutes you only have 1 rebound collected, you're taking no shots, you might aswell give somebody else a chance. You really have nothing to lose there. But why keep rewarding a guy that obviously doesn't work against this opponent by giving him 30+ minutes a game? Just try somebody else already.
Even if it's not in scoring, anybody that can help you grab rebounds and cut down on the second chance points could have won the last game for us.

But Bonner will be starting tonight. And he will be playing the bulk of the minutes again. And Hill will probably be glued to the bench until it's desperation time once more. And frankly, we've seen this movie before. :depressed