Drew Gooden situation...

[bless1187]

I think going into this off-season, the only free agent on the team that i am kind of intrigued by is Drew Gooden.

Pros: size, mobility, rebounding, footwork, post game, and midrange game

Cons: shot selection, defense, concentration

There are not lots of big man out there who is only 27 years old, with his kind of skill set. To put this best, his game is highly similar to that of Carlos Boozer which is good offense, rebounding but poor defense and concentration. Drew Gooden gone through some stretches this year that he played pretty decent defense, i think he's main problem is team defense rather than individual defense; also his occasional lapse of concentration. But seriously, if Drew Gooden would have been a regular starter on the Spurs and playing about 30 mpg, i could see him averaging about 12-15 points per game with about 6-8 rebounds per game.

Personally i would much rather we resign Drew Gooden than go for Rasheed Wallace or Antonio McDyess. Both Wallace and McDyess are 34 years old, and with these old player, you just don't know how much they have left in the tank, injury issues, and minute management. And do you see them really making a significantly bigger contribution than Gooden given the same amount of playing time.

This really reminds me of a few years back when Turkuglo struggled in the playoff, and Spurs wanted to replace him with Brent Barry. I was one of the few that actually opposed it cause i felt the contribution we are going to get isn't going to be significantly different where as Turkuglo has a tremendous amount of upside "look at him today." And Barry while playing decently never was what some of the Spurs fan envisioned him to be when we signed him. "he was occasionally out of rotations, and constantly on the trading block."

i just don't hope this turns out to be another of these situation.

[SenorSpur]

At some point, the Spurs MUST get out of this thought process that the only players that can contribute to their success are on the north side of 30. This is a talented big, who is in the middle of his career. As offensively-challenged as the Spurs are, I would think they would look long and hard at him.

Of course, the question becomes can Gooden contribute more in the next year to help the team win now or can Rasheed Wallace?

[BlueShark#6]

A full pre-season camp would make him better in the spurs system.
Hey.. he may even ratchet up his D.

[K-State Spur]

if you can get a sheed (or even better) - i think you have to go in that direction.

gooden's not a bad back-up option to that, but he's always a guy whose numbers will be better than his actual impact on the game.

[Spursmania]

Speaking of concentration, just a side note. When I was at the first 2 home games in the playoff series, Pop would be in the huddle with the rest of the guys going over plays, and Gooden would be looking at the Coyote, the jumbotron or whatever else was going on. The bench players at the time like Hill or Mason, would be in the huddle too, trying to listen to what Pop was going over whether or not they were going to play. Just an observation, but I couldn't help but always think about his achilles heel, not enough focus or concentration, not smart enough, etc...

After 19 games and a couple of playoff games, do we really know how Gooden fits with the Spurs? The guys definitely athletic--I really liked some of the moves I saw from him. I just wonder if he's a good fit?

Plus, Gooden's agent is Fegan who is known as hard nosed and gets top dollar for his clients. If all he wants his money, I don't think the Spurs have enough to give him even if they wanted him.

[SenorSpur]

Speaking of concentration, just a side note. When I was at the first 2 home games in the playoff series, Pop would be in the huddle with the rest of the guys going over plays, and Gooden would be looking at the Coyote, the jumbotron or whatever else was going on. The bench players at the time like Hill or Mason, would be in the huddle too, trying to listen to what Pop was going over whether or not they were going to play. Just an observation, but I couldn't help but always think about his achilles heel, not enough focus or concentration, not smart enough, etc...

After 19 games and a couple of playoff games, do we really know how Gooden fits with the Spurs? The guys definitely athletic--I really liked some of the moves I saw from him. I just wonder if he's a good fit?

Plus, Gooden's agent is Fegan who is known as hard nosed and gets top dollar for his clients. If all he wants his money, I don't think the Spurs have enough to give him even if they wanted him.

Great observation. Thanks for sharing. Perhaps that's one reason why he's never been able to stay in one place too long. I'm sure those things will not figure in positively in his favor. Good luck getting big dollars.

[mingus]

Speaking of concentration, just a side note. When I was at the first 2 home games in the playoff series, Pop would be in the huddle with the rest of the guys going over plays, and Gooden would be looking at the Coyote, the jumbotron or whatever else was going on. The bench players at the time like Hill or Mason, would be in the huddle too, trying to listen to what Pop was going over whether or not they were going to play. Just an observation, but I couldn't help but always think about his achilles heel, not enough focus or concentration, not smart enough, etc...

After 19 games and a couple of playoff games, do we really know how Gooden fits with the Spurs? The guys definitely athletic--I really liked some of the moves I saw from him. I just wonder if he's a good fit?

Plus, Gooden's agent is Fegan who is known as hard nosed and gets top dollar for his clients. If all he wants his money, I don't think the Spurs have enough to give him even if they wanted him.

... i've seen those things too ... i also think that his body language when he's on the court isn't very good ... he moves out there like he just got out of bed out ; he looks unmotivated/lazy .

Spurs or sort of in a wierd situation . Gooden seems to have what the Spurs need with his offense , but he doesn't fit the description of most Spurs , which is intelligence , focus and effort ...

i say stick with what has worked so many times if i'm the Spurs ... get guys who are intelligent , focused and put in the effort , and let him walk .

[Manu-of-steel]

he is not a typical spurs player. his bball iq is low, and that's the reason why he's not paying attention to what pop ismsaying in the huddle. all he wants is to pad his stat for a bigger pay, imho.

[sananspursfan21]

he doesn't have too bad of defense. he's got a body like a tank for it, so he just needs a little work. i like him and will be dissapointed if he leaves

[K-State Spur]

he doesn't have too bad of defense. he's got a body like a tank for it, so he just needs a little work. i like him and will be dissapointed if he leaves

his defense on the ball isn't "too bad." in terms of team defense, he's flat out awful.

bringing him back isn't the worst option, but others should be explored first.

here's the way i look at it. if the spurs get a healthy manu next year and add an above average big (i.e. sheed) next to duncan, with just a minor tweak here and there, they are right back in the equation. if the spurs get a healthy manu and bring back gooden, they're still going to have to likely make a major tweak elsewhere to get back into the championship talk.

gooden's not terrible, but he doesn't threaten the balance of power in the west.

[Agloco]

At some point, the Spurs MUST get out of this thought process that the only players that can contribute to their success are on the north side of 30. This is a talented big, who is in the middle of his career. As offensively-challenged as the Spurs are, I would think they would look long and hard at him.

Of course, the question becomes can Gooden contribute more in the next year to help the team win now or can Rasheed Wallace?

That's a tough one...but from a defensive standpoint the answer is obvious. I think Sheed can give us enough offensively to offset the loss of Gooden.

If this year proved anything it's that the Spurs cannot win without solid defense. At the end of the day, it was the reason we lost to the Mavs. How many times have you seen the Spurs lose in years past when they shoot over 50%? I could probably count those games on one hand.

The quandry is that the Spurs don't have the luxury of waiting to see if Gooden will pan out. It's late in the shot clock so to speak. Sheed is proven. Get him.

[wildbill2u]

Gooden can do some things like bringing some offense to the court when we're stagnant.

I bet he was pissed that he didn't play in the last game. A guy like that will probably let his ego feed on that as a slight from Pop and he'll want to go somewhere else.

[exstatic]

Gooden can do some things like bringing some offense to the court when we're stagnant.

I bet he was pissed that he didn't play in the last game. A guy like that will probably let his ego feed on that as a slight from Pop and he'll want to go somewhere else.

1) Gooden causes a lot of stagnation. He's pretty much a black hole.

2) If he leaves, it will be for money. His agent is Dan Fegan. He's considered a "money agent" in the business. Read the "clean out" article on mysa.com. Gooden didn't sound pissed at all, and they specifically asked him about not playing in that game. If his ego were to "feed on that" then he has no fucking place on the Spurs anyway. If you can't check your ego, you can't play here. It's that simple.

[duncan228]

Read the "clean out" article on mysa.com.

Just for easy reference, it's here.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124842

[afireinside20]

We need to make sure we keep him.

[peskypesky]

You've seen the last of Gooden in a Spurs uniform.

[ronni 21]

You've seen the last of Gooden in a Spurs uniform.
i hope

[cheney212]

i want to keep him but pop ruined it with him playing bonner more and i dont blame him if he wants to leave cuz he didnt play in the last game at all and i would be pissed if bonner was starting over me

[SenorSpur]

Gooden can do some things like bringing some offense to the court when we're stagnant.

I bet he was pissed that he didn't play in the last game. A guy like that will probably let his ego feed on that as a slight from Pop and he'll want to go somewhere else.

I'll bet you're right on that. This isn't to say he's right feeling that way, but basketball is an ego sport. And the Spurs DID court him heavily, when they learned SACTO was going to let him go. I believe they were the first team to call. Therefore, if they had a hard-on for him then, I'm sure he's wondering why the fell out of love with him during the final game.

[mingus]

i want to keep him but pop ruined it with him playing bonner more and i dont blame him if he wants to leave cuz he didnt play in the last game at all and i would be pissed if bonner was starting over me

Gooden is fool's gold imo ... he's a guy that with his offensive ability can keep the Spurs in a lot of games , but he doesn't do any of the small things that help win championships (ie setting a good screen , passing the ball instead of forcing , getting a charge , being punctual on his rotations to prevent an easy score) . it's why he's been traded so many damn times ...

i mean just look at the guy :

http://www.nike.com/nikebasketball/emea/assets/images/family/nba/players/profile/drew_gooden.jpg

he's got "moron" basically written across his face .

this is a guy who once said , " I've overcome a lot of diversity . "

he's not a guy imo you want on the court when it matters most unless you hope for dissapointment ...

[mudyez]

dont want to see him back...he just isnt a winner...I dont like his defense and his offense just isnt spursstyle...I rather have mcdyess or even sheed

IMO

mcdyess>sheed>bonner>scalabrine>any hornets player>gooden

[The Franchise]

Gooden is fool's gold imo ... he's a guy that with his offensive ability can keep the Spurs in a lot of games , but he doesn't do any of the small things that help win championships (ie setting a good screen , passing the ball instead of forcing , getting a charge , being punctual on his rotations to prevent an easy score) . it's why he's been traded so many damn times ...

i mean just look at the guy :

http://www.nike.com/nikebasketball/emea/assets/images/family/nba/players/profile/drew_gooden.jpg

he's got "moron" basically written across his face .

this is a guy who once said , " I've overcome a lot of diversity . "

he's not a guy imo you want on the court when it matters most unless you hope for dissapointment ...

You must be a mind reader, because I swear I was about to say the same thing myself. I have followed Gooden since he first arrived in Orlando, and he is definitely fools gold. He is the type of player that does just enough to keep teams interested, but he never seems to turn the corner. I feel the Spurs can do better looking elsewhere.

[mingus]

You must be a mind reader, because I swear I was about to say the same thing myself. I have followed Gooden since he first arrived in Orlando, and he is definitely fools gold. He is the type of player that does just enough to keep teams interested, but he never seems to turn the corner. I feel the Spurs can do better looking elsewhere.

but

i question if teams will still be interested enough and willing to pay him 7 mil upwards per or if they're no longer going to ... i highly doubt he'll find any team willing to pay anywhere near his last contract in this ultra-conservative market ... if he can be resigned for real cheap , and it would still allow the Spurs to seriously persue a big like Wallace, McDyess or Bass ...then i say he's worth keeping ...

[SenorSpur]

Gooden is fool's gold imo ... he's a guy that with his offensive ability can keep the Spurs in a lot of games , but he doesn't do any of the small things that help win championships (ie setting a good screen , passing the ball instead of forcing , getting a charge , being punctual on his rotations to prevent an easy score) . it's why he's been traded so many damn times ...

i mean just look at the guy :

http://www.nike.com/nikebasketball/emea/assets/images/family/nba/players/profile/drew_gooden.jpg

he's got "moron" basically written across his face .

this is a guy who once said , " I've overcome a lot of diversity . "

he's not a guy imo you want on the court when it matters most unless you hope for dissapointment ...


He mya be fool's gold, and I can't argue with that, but I'm OK with a guy who is aggressive and can score in the post. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. It's not like Bonner, KT or Oberto are "bringing it" offensively and can score "at will". I'm OK with whatever the Spurs decide on him, but let's not act like they have better options at that spot.

[mingus]

He mya be fool's gold, and I can't argue with that, but I'm OK with a guy who is aggressive and can score in the post. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. It's not like Bonner, KT or Oberto are "bringing it" offensively and can score "at will". I'm OK with whatever the Spurs decide on him, but let's not act like they have better options at that spot.

the Spurs with him as a starting big will not get anywhere ... if there's a chance that the Spurs can retain him and still get one of Wallace , McDyess , or Bass then i'm all for keeping him ... he can definitely be a solid guy to have come off the bench to score some points ...

the Spurs should try and resign him , get Wallace or one of the other bigs i mentioned , and trade Bonner , Thomas , Finley , Oberto in some combination to get an SF ...

A rotation of Timmy , Rasheed , Gooden , and Mahinmi would be pretty good i think ...

[mingus]

btw , i don't know anything about the Spurs current cap situation , or how much flexibility they have etc. , so my suggestions could be very unreasonable and i wouldn't have any clue ...

[duncan228]

btw , i don't know anything about the Spurs current cap situation , or how much flexibility they have etc...

The 'Think Tank' has info if you're interested.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=37

[mingus]

The 'Think Tank' has info if you're interested.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=37

thanks ...

[ulosturedge]

Our defense is the most important thing that needs attention. As much as he can be another weapon on offense; he is just too much of a liability on defense. That 2nd big to solidify our interior defense is what we are after; and he's not it unfortunately. I wouldn't mind keeping him around for say the MLE, but no way we throw big dollars at him.