General Trades Discussion

[Baam]

Seems like Robin Lopez is really on the block. Decent option if they want a true backup center.

[look_at_g_shred]

Seems like Robin Lopez is really on the block. Decent option if they want a true backup center.

I'm sure we can trade for him easily. A solid back-up C

[monkeypunk]

I'm sure we can trade for him easily. A solid back-up C

Side Show Bob would be a solid off season pickup.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

i like vasquez. i'm pretty shocked that the pelicans added holiday. if vasquez is available, i wouldn't mind the spurs moving decolo and pick(s) to get him.

hell, make it a sign and trade. they sign aminu and throw him in. spurs sign blair and throw him in.

[Captivus]

This has been discussed a little in other threads I've read, and I'm not sure if there’s a specific one regarding this, if it is, delete.

So...
Next season will be the last contract year of the following players (at least it looks like that now).
- Diaw ($4.7)
- Bonner ($4.0)
- Nando ($1.5)
- Mills ($1.1)

That’s around $11-12M, not a lot, but we are talking about 4 players.
There’s no Player Option, QO, nothing, so the Spurs have to do something.

I’m not an expert in NBA rules.

What do you think the Spurs should do, or would do during the next season regarding these players?
Will the Spurs try to increase their value and trade them? Or at least confirm if they can or can't play.
If so, will they play more minutes? Specially Nando and Mills.
Will the Spurs extend their contracts? Will the Spurs lose them?
Whats at satke here?

I assume the Spurs could extend Diaw's contract, Bonner may be gone. NDC and Mills?? Do the Spurs want those players? At the end these 2 players play minutes during RS.

I don’t want to make a long thread, just get the conversation started...if someone cares.

Abrazo de gol!

[pad300]

Does anyone think we could potentially get our sticky fingers on Marion from Dallas, if Cubes decides to blow it up after not getting Dwight?

[CGD]

If the Spurs strike out on AK, I think they should trade for Marvin Williams for the reserve SF role. Spurs get Marvin while Jazz receive Nando/Millsy + the TE which would be generated. Jazz can use the TE towards the cap space they need to sign Milspap.

Marvin is a solid role play who has improved his defense (http://weareutahjazz.com/2013/03/05/the-value-of-marvin-williams/) since entering the league. He's athletic (http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=kSWayhQvh00&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DkSWayhQvh00) and can play the stretch 4 role as needed. I like AK but I think this would be an very underrated move if the Spurs do it as a back up plan.

[CGD]

Does anyone think we could potentially get our sticky fingers on Marion from Dallas, if Cubes decides to blow it up after not getting Dwight?
Depends on how bad Cubes continues to strike out. He may need to keep in to mollify Dirk somewhat, plus Marion expires next year which would again help with their capspace pursuits.

im starting to feel bad for Dirk. Wasting the last of his best years tbh.

[Mel_13]

Does anyone think we could potentially get our sticky fingers on Marion from Dallas, if Cubes decides to blow it up after not getting Dwight?

He's a 9.3M expiring contract. Can't think of a deal between the two teams that makes any sense.

[Russo21]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=l3stjnl get a reliable backup PG and 3 point threat in Hinrich. And a descent backup SF in Butler who can play some D, rebound, and shoot the 3 adequately. Not great in any area but not shithouse either. By no means a home run for us but fills 2 needs.

[Bruno]

Random "I'm bored" trade idea of the day: Bonner and De Colo for Brandon Bass.

[Chinook]

I looked at this trade a couple of weeks ago, and It think Boston would love to get out from under that contract. Not a huge fan of Bass. I don't think he could start over Splitter, and I don't like the idea of a Diaw-Bass second-unit front court. I'm curious to see if Pendergraph plays the backup five.

[elemento]

I don't like Bass either, but I am sure Boston would entertain the idea to get rid of Bass' contract.

To me he is too expensive for what he provides. And my main concern is the fact that he is a poor rebounder. Timmy is carrying such a big load that it's unfair to him to bring another big that can't rebound.

[Chinook]

So trade idea from me: What about Rush and Mo Williams for Bonner, De Colo, Blair and Neal?

First off, I'm thinking a four-team trade with the Wizards sending Singleton and the Bucks sending a second-rounder or two.

The trade would have to take place in two steps:

First, would be a trade where the Spurs would S&T Blair and Neal to Washington and Milwaukee, respectively. Those two teams would send Singleton and the seconds to Utah, who would send Rush to the Spurs. In order for this trade to work, Neal and Blair would need to have a combined salary figure of $5.3 Million next season, which should be very doable.

Second, Utah would sign-and-trade Williams with a deal starting at about $6.4 Million (three years with final year completely non-guaranteed) to the Spurs for Bonner and De Colo. This has to occur separately for two reasons. One, the Jazz cannot package Rush in a trade until December. Two, the Jazz need cap space to S&T Williams, because they don't have his Bird Rights any longer.

So to recap:

-The Spurs get Rush and Williams (combined for $10.4 Million incoming) while sending out Bonner and De Colo ($5.4 Million out-going). That puts them at about $3 Million under the tax with one roster spot left open and the rest of the MLE and minimum deals to fill it.

-The Jazz get Bonner, De Colo, Singleton and one or two seconds while losing Rush.

-The Bucks get Neal for picks.

-The Wizards get Blair for Singleton.

[Baam]

^ would be nice but seems like a long shot with so many teams and players involved.

[Baam]

I think they need and are willing to at least trade a PF, Bonner had to be involved in the AK s&t talks and signing Pendergraph doesn't make much sense if they don't.

How about :

- Bonner and Boris for Jeremy Lin + pick(s)

Morey is supposedly trying hard to get rid of Lin and he'd be much better than Cojo. That also frees another spot on the roster so they can sign both Oden and a SF... Wed have too many PG and Houston too many PF so it probably makes sense to add Greg Smith and one of our scrub PG in the trade or something.

[Chinook]

Ew, no.

[Baam]

Then an alternative would be

Bonner + DeColo + Mills + Cojo for Lin

Spurs send virtually zero rotation player for as good a backup PG they can get.

Also Lin's contract expires at the right time with two years left.

[Chinook]

No. Lin's not that good, and he makes way too much money (not even counting that he gets paid $15 Million in 2014-2015). There's no way in hell I'd want the Spurs to blow their expirings on that contract. Whichever team is dumb enough to take Lin will be one that needs a starting point-guard. If Lin were slated to be a good backup, he'd be poised to remain in Houston.

[Russo21]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mkts76o Knicks get 2 expirings and some 3 point shooting, that's it. Spurs get Shumpert, an OK SF to back up Leonard. And Raymond Felton who averaged 14pts 6ast 1.4stl 36%3PT. If he came here behind Tony he'd probably be the best backup PG in the NBA after starting most years. Our backup PG problems would be over in an instant

[Russo21]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=m5s3zbh adding big baby to the frontcourt (if healed yet) and Beno Udrih returning to back Tony up

[Hoops Czar]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mkts76o Knicks get 2 expirings and some 3 point shooting, that's it. Spurs get Shumpert, an OK SF to back up Leonard. And Raymond Felton who averaged 14pts 6ast 1.4stl 36%3PT. If he came here behind Tony he'd probably be the best backup PG in the NBA after starting most years. Our backup PG problems would be over in an instant
Laughable that the Knicks would even consider that.

[Chinook]

Laughable that the Knicks would even consider that.

I actually agree with you wholeheartedly. The Knicks aren't giving up their starting back court for the Spurs' spare parts.

[Chinook]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=m5s3zbh adding big baby to the frontcourt (if healed yet) and Beno Udrih returning to back Tony up

Not horrible, but Udrih's not coming back. That'd definitely give the Spurs better bench, though.

[pad300]

Trade target of the day - Vince Carter. He's transformed his game with the Mavs into a 3&D SF, with a little bit more in his back pocket.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=jwh59qs

Obviously, SAS would have to add a sweetener - preferably a couple of 2nd rounders, but maybe a first?

It actually kind of makes sense for DAL - it's not real clear to me who the backup PF is behind Dirk. They have 4 C's - Wright, Dalembert, Blair and James none of whom have the skills to play PF. They have Marion, but he's their starting SF...

SAS gets a SF backup for Kawhi - who shot 40.6% from 3 last year, and who still commands a level of respect for his other offensive skills. He's still an athelete, even by NBA standards. According to 82games.com Vince played 80% of his minutes at SF last year, and held the opposing SF to a PER of 13.8, while putting up a 18.7 himself...

[td4mvp2k]

Lol picks for VC... F no! N def not to Fn Dallas!

[TD 21]

From a recent Lowe column: "Paul Allen has never wanted to rebuild," says Neil Olshey, Portland's GM. "He does not want to take three steps backward in order to take four steps forward. So we decided we were just going to have one foot in, and one foot out."

With that in mind . . .

To Hawks: Lopez, Freeland, Claver, one of Spurs 1st, rights to Bertans or Jean-Charles

To Trail Blazers: Splitter, Millsap, Antic, rights to Muscala, one of Spurs 1st, rights to Bertans or Jean-Charles

To Spurs: Aldridge

[Chinook]

That's too much for Aldridge, at least from a global perspective. Splitter and Millsap are both good enough to be centerpieces in a trade for him by themselves. Putting them together is just overkill. It's not a bad deal for the Hawks, as Millsap is essentially house money right now. I don't know enough about Freeland to say that he's the answer to their situation at the backup four, though.

For the Spurs, on one hand, they're only giving up Splitter now, so it's not a bad deal. On the other hand, they're losing pretty much every asset they have to rebuild. With Aldridge's health issues, I don't think he'd be that big of an upgrade to Splitter, especially in the long term. Speaking of LA's health, he'd probably be one of the Spurs whom Pop would baby during the regular season. With him replacing Splitter, the big rotation seems significantly weaker than before. Duncan would have no proven backup, and Aldridge wouldn't be able to play the 40 minutes that would be necessary to cover Duncan and start next to him. If this trade had happened early in the off-season, then the Spurs could have used their MLE to bring in another accomplished big instead of Pendergraph.

[elemento]

I feel it's way too good for SA actually. And bad for the rest.

Our 1st round picks are not appealing as long as Timmy is here. Both our prospects are coming from major knee injuries and even though Splitter is a decent Center, his value was much higher when his contract was a bargain. Now, not so much.

From the Hawks perspective, they're not getting anything exciting to give up Millsap so early. Lopez is a meh Center, Freeland is actually a bad contract (6m/2y) considering he isn't even a NBA material player (just ask any POR fan about him) and Claver is an end of the bench player.

From the Blazers perspective, they would rather have Aldridge and Lopez instead of Millsap and Splitter.

Lamarcus Aldridge would be a major upgrade over any BIG we have to pair with Timmy. If all it takes to get Aldridge is Splitter + late 1st picks and 2 prospects coming off major knee injuries, I am all over it.

[TD 21]

Chinook, Aldridge would probably play 4-5 mpg less in the regular season than he's accustomed to with the Spurs. Splitter is a better overall defender, but it's not as if he's a great defensive rebounder/rim protector either.

In terms of being a long term building block, he sure as hell beats Splitter and two middling prospects. His game should age well and a Parker/Aldridge/Leonard/Green core, with cap space to add to it, would keep the Spurs more than competitive post Duncan/Ginobili. Besides, it's not as if they have any hope of doing better than him.

elemento, given that Allen has essentially mandated that the Trail Blazers be Bucks West, this is a good trade for them. The Hawks would probably be the tougher sell; their level of interest would depend on if they were high on any of Freeland, Claver (both had awful rookie seasons, but have long been considered solid prospects) or whichever of the Spurs assets they came away with. But if it required giving them whichever was leftover among the 1st/Bertans/Jean-Charles, I'd do it in a second.

[Chinook]

I don't think he beats out Splitter directly, let alone Splitter and four mid-level prospects. Splitter has a better contract (Tiago will probably make half of what Aldridge will make in 2015-2017) and a better prognosis for success beyond the next two seasons, as Aldridge's injuries are very troublesome even in the short term. For right now, I think you guys might be overestimating the upgrade that Aldridge is to Splitter, or at least the upgrade that Duncan/Aldridge/Diaw/Pendergraph is to Duncan/Splitter/Diaw/Pendergraph. While LA would have been a tougher match-up for Miami due to his offense, Splitter's mobility was essential to even being able to attempt to stay big against the Heat. Splitter's defense the other three series definitely seems more valuable to me than Aldridge's potential offense, as the Spurs scored very well.

As I said, though, the biggest problem I have is the timing. This trade would have looked a lot better to me earlier, as the team would have been able to gear free agency toward replacing Splitter's role as the backup center. Now (or actually after January 15, as that's the earliest Splitter can be traded), there's no real opportunity to do that, and there's even less opportunity to work the pieces in mid-season. I don't think it would raise the team's ceiling unless Baynes or Pendergraph breaks out and proves to be capable to filling Splitter's current role.

[elemento]

Chinook, Aldridge would probably play 4-5 mpg less in the regular season than he's accustomed to with the Spurs. Splitter is a better overall defender, but it's not as if he's a great defensive rebounder/rim protector either.

In terms of being a long term building block, he sure as hell beats Splitter and two middling prospects. His game should age well and a Parker/Aldridge/Leonard/Green core, with cap space to add to it, would keep the Spurs more than competitive post Duncan/Ginobili. Besides, it's not as if they have any hope of doing better than him.

elemento, given that Allen has essentially mandated that the Trail Blazers be Bucks West, this is a good trade for them. The Hawks would probably be the tougher sell; their level of interest would depend on if they were high on any of Freeland, Claver (both had awful rookie seasons, but have long been considered solid prospects) or whichever of the Spurs assets they came away with. But if it required giving them whichever was leftover among the 1st/Bertans/Jean-Charles, I'd do it in a second.

I honestly think POR can do better than that. Splitter is massively overrated by some Spurs fans. Since day one I said he was a system player and he still is. Then I had to watch Spurs fans crying on ST because Splitter couldn't post up Derek Fisher in the playoffs. I don't even know who sold them the idea that Splitter was a good post up player.

Some SA fans actually underrate Pop's system and especially Duncan's impact on San Antonio's defense. SA's defense without Duncan wouldn't even sniff a place in the top10 defenses in the NBA. Splitter can complement Duncan in Pop's system, but without Duncan, Splitter is nothing more than an average Center in the NBA. I am Brazilian. I am the guy supposed to overrate Splitter like crazy, but I am not doing it for a reason. I'm not blind and I am not a homer.

Lamarcus Aldridge is an all-star PF in any kind of system, with any coach. One of the best PFs in the NBA. Not only SA would be better with Aldridge, but they would also be the favorites to win it all this season and I am including Miami here.

As I said before, I would do this trade in a heart-beat. Too bad Atlanta and Portland would hang up the phone in 5 seconds probably.

[Chinook]

No one should think Duncan isn't the anchor of the Spurs' defense. But he's not the complete defender he used to be. It's much more important for his front-court partner to be mobile and able to defend the pick-and-roll than it is for him to be an All-Star offensively. Splitter graded out as one of the best PnR defenders in the league last season, and his mobility was vital to the team's defensive effort in the playoffs. It's flat-out unfair to give Duncan credit for aspects of the Spurs' defense Splitter was responsible for. I agree, elemento, that without Duncan, the Spurs' defense would be below average. But without Splitter starting, the Spurs' defense WAS average. It's not overrating him at all to say he is a pretty high-level defender.

Instead of looking at it as a numbers thing or a talent thing, I think we should look at it in terms whom the acquisition of Aldridge for Splitter would help the Spurs beat. The answer from my point of view is not a whole lot definitively. It would definitely help if someone else would score in the post to allow Duncan to carry less of the load. But it's not like we're talking Al Jefferson in that regard. Duncan and Aldridge essentially play the same position on offense as jump-shooting bigs who can score inside.

But is Aldridge going to be able to switch on PnRs and hold his own like Splitter can? If he can't, then the Spurs are going to play right into the hands of the Thunder, Warriors and Clippers. Can Aldridge play post defense on physical bigs while also being able to stay with mobile fours? If not, then the Grizzlies and Pacers get an advantage. Lost in Splitter's Finals faux pas was the really solid effort he gave at guarding Bosh and James (through the first three games). Sure, Aldridge can score to make up for what the Spurs would lose defensively, but is offense really the starting unit's main problem?

[TD 21]

Chinook, Splitter is not in Aldridge's league and the odds of any of those prospects turning into anything of significance are slim. Even if one did, the team won't be near contention by the time they did anyway. Overall, this is a small price to pay for potentially winning a fifth championship and maybe even having an outside shot at a few years of contention post Duncan/Ginobili.

The Spurs couldn't stay big against the Heat because Splitter became unplayable. In fact, I'd argue the biggest reason they lost on a macro level (obviously they should have won in spite of this) was because of that. Aldridge had a poor year defensively last season, but he's usually a solid enough defender. He and Pendergraph would be more than fine as backup C options.

elemento, given their goal, I'm not sure they can do better. That would keep them both competitive and flexible. I definitely don't overrate Splitter, but he does have good value and we know the Trail Blazers were interested; they just knew the Spurs would match unless their offer was astronomical.

For the Hawks, like I said, it would come down to how they value the prospects involved. If they were high enough on any of the Spurs', they might do it.

[anakha]

Aldridge had a poor year defensively last season, but he's usually a solid enough defender.

I'm gonna have to disagree here.

I've been looking at Aldridge's defensive numbers (including the advanced stats) on BBR, and I'm seeing that:

a) I'm not seeing any dip in his defensive numbers that suggest he had a worse-than-usual defensive season last year;
b) his defensive numbers (especially Defensive Rating) have him ranked in the lower half on the league consistently since his rookie season.

I know stats aren't the be-all and end-all of analysis, but I'm just not seeing anything to back up your assertion.

[TD 21]

I'm gonna have to disagree here.

I've been looking at Aldridge's defensive numbers (including the advanced stats) on BBR, and I'm seeing that:

a) I'm not seeing any dip in his defensive numbers that suggest he had a worse-than-usual defensive season last year;
b) his defensive numbers (especially Defensive Rating) have him ranked in the lower half on the league consistently since his rookie season.

I know stats aren't the be-all and end-all of analysis, but I'm just not seeing anything to back up your assertion.

It's mostly a subjective opinion of mine and some of the most knowledgeable writers that cover the league.

[anakha]

Fair enough.

Personally, I question how well Aldridge would fit next to Duncan - this is less of a knock on Aldridge and more of acceptance that Duncan increasingly needs a frontcourt partner who can handle the defensive tasks he's not really capable of managing by himself anymore.

[TD 21]

Aldridge is no plodder; he's mobile. In theory, he'd be a nice fit defensively next to Duncan. Whether he'd be an optimal fit or not would be a small price to pay for the sheer upgrade in talent he'd provide.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

While Aldridge is clearly way more talented than Splitter, I don't see how he'd fit next to Duncan both offensively and defensively. On defense the Spurs would get killed by the PnR and on offense Duncan would have to play more under the ring during the regular season, which is something Pop has avoided for a good few seasons now. Another issue is his contract and health.

That said, if you can get an all star big for Splitter and spare parts you do it and worry about fits later.

[mountainballer]

That said, if you can get an all star big for Splitter and spare parts you do it and worry about fits later.

this.
(aside the fact, that the whole LMA speculation is a typical pipe dream by fans)

[rascal]

Splitter and Manu were the anchor weights that kept the Spurs from winning number 5.

[Mugen]

Dream trade for this season is a 3way trade for Jeff Green tbh.

[Cklbmk]

I think a more realistic person is Evan Turner. No extension talks, new Gm cleaning house trying to tank.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

I like the Morris twins potential in the Spurs system.

[Chinook]

I like Turner. I'm not sure they trade him. He's playing well in that system and he could be a great fit with Wiggins on the wings. He may get too big of a deal, though. He's playing out of his mind, and that could be fool's gold. For the right package, he's definitely not untouchable.

They need to trade Thad. He's just not a championship piece. Hawes like Turner is a keeper as he should fit in well with Noel. But if he doesn't want to stay, move him. I'm sure the Rockets would give up a pretty good haul for him.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

wes johnson from the lakers would fill the backup 3 spot just right. maybe he'll be a cheap trade option when kobe returns?

[DesignatedT]

I think Philly will trade Turner. Wish we could get our hands on him. He's obviously not in their long terms plans when they decided not to pick up his option. They aren't going to keep winning like they have and they are still in tank mode.

[DesignatedT]

I think Jameer Nelson will also end up being moved. An interesting possibility.

[Baam]

^ Google'd it and it comes from a decent source :

http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/14/jameer-nelson-next-big-name-to-be-dealt


The Magic, according to the latest rumbles, would surrender Nelson today if offered a future first-round pick for him. Orlando GM Rob Hennigan continues to chase draft picks and young assets above all else as he remakes the Magic.

The problem is that teams have never been more reluctant to surrender first-round picks -- and the cap-friendly contracts they carry -- than we see nowadays. Even a proven point guard like Nelson, who's making a reasonable $8.6 million this season and is owed only $2 million guaranteed next season, could struggle to command one in return.

Perhaps a contender will be willing to make that sacrifice as we get deeper into the season, needing that one final piece for a playoff push, but first-rounders and their precious rookie-scale contracts are, well, precious. Which is why Chicago never had a hope of acquiring a future first in exchange for young guard Marquis Teague (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/6626/marquis-teague) no matter how hard the Bulls tried to get one for Teague throughout October.

Now a first in the strongest draft of the last ten years for a backup PG sounds silly especially when we had plenty of capspace this summer... I like him but it doesn't make much sense and his numbers have declined accross the board the last few years...

I don't see any trade on the horizon tbh, the two players that could be parted with imo were Green at peak value or letting Splitter walk to make some moves this summer... Both are most likely as good as they ever gonna get... The summer moves have just been real bad...

I wonder if they're really considering trading Green tho... Beli is pretty much a Manu-lite and Green is the only trade bait left along with Diaw (who imo is too precious to part with especially when you look at Tiago's career in the PO)...

Regarding Faried I found this : http://www.denverstiffs.com/2013/10/25/5024388/trading-kenneth-faried-con
A trade would seem to make a lot of sense but they're asking for a LOT... Oladipo... I'm pretty sure they're weak on the wings, so Green could interest them... 2 first + Green doesn't seems like it'd get it done... I'd take Fournier as well, he has a negative PER right now but he had a great season last year and can be the backup PG and 3rd SG...

[Chinook]

Still think the buyout market could be fruitful. I don't see a trade this season. If Diaw stays aggressive, the team has no holes. What I'd like to see them do is trade Desk Colo and/or Bonner for a young player who's fallen out of favor like Williams or Singleton.

[Cklbmk]

I like Turner. I'm not sure they trade him. He's playing well in that system and he could be a great fit with Wiggins on the wings. He may get too big of a deal, though. He's playing out of his mind, and that could be fool's gold. For the right package, he's definitely not untouchable.

They need to trade Thad. He's just not a championship piece. Hawes like Turner is a keeper as he should fit in well with Noel. But if he doesn't want to stay, move him. I'm sure the Rockets would give up a pretty good haul for him.


I don't think Philly sees him in their plans at all. He wasn't even contacted about an extension to see what he'd accept, he has publicly admitted he expects to be traded(same with Hawes). Why would the Rockets give a good haul for Hawes? He's not worth anything close to Asik and they don't have anyone else except Lin close money wise. I think OKC is a lot more logical for Hawes than the Rockets. Philly isn't going to take Lin for him and nothing else makes sense. Even if its a 3 team deal Hawes isn't headlining a return for Asik.

Your post seems like you haven't read any new info on Philly this summer, and you hate the Rockets :P

[Chinook]

I don't think Philly sees him in their plans at all. He wasn't even contacted about an extension to see what he'd accept, he has publicly admitted he expects to be traded(same with Hawes). Why would the Rockets give a good haul for Hawes? He's not worth anything close to Asik and they don't have anyone else except Lin close money wise. I think OKC is a lot more logical for Hawes than the Rockets. Philly isn't going to take Lin for him and nothing else makes sense. Even if its a 3 team deal Hawes isn't headlining a return for Asik.

Your post seems like you haven't read any new info on Philly this summer, and you hate the Rockets :P

Turner said he expected to be traded in the off-season. He wasn't on a string of 20+ point games then. He looks worth his contract and draft status now. They could trade him, but they may keep him if he shows consistency. He's been arguably the best player even with MCW doing his thing.

Hawes fits the Rockets' system better than Asik does. He's a stretch-five, which is ultrarare. Houston will have to bench Asik in the playoffs. It's very possible that there's a trade where Asik goes to Atlanta, assets go to Philly and Hawes goes to Houston. In general that's the type of trade that it would take for the 76ers to move him if he keeps playing well.

I lived in Philly for five years. I may be incorrect in my analysis, but it won't be because I've ignored news on them.

[Baam]

The Sixers are too good right now and the Nuggets are too bad... Both team might be open to a move...

Also Glen Rice Jr and Vesely dont seem to be in the Wizards rotation... Like both... Not sure what Id sent back along with Bonner...

[exstatic]

I like Turner. I'm not sure they trade him. He's playing well in that system and he could be a great fit with Wiggins on the wings. He may get too big of a deal, though. He's playing out of his mind, and that could be fool's gold. For the right package, he's definitely not untouchable.

They need to trade Thad. He's just not a championship piece. Hawes like Turner is a keeper as he should fit in well with Noel. But if he doesn't want to stay, move him. I'm sure the Rockets would give up a pretty good haul for him.

Yeah, his 2014 QO as the #2 pick in his draft, just to keep him restricted next summer is $8.7M. They're not going to offer him that, so they're likely to lose him for nothing. I think they'll trade him if they can get a decent asset or pick.

[Chinook]

Yeah, his 2014 QO as the #2 pick in his draft, just to keep him restricted next summer is $8.7M. They're not going to offer him that, so they're likely to lose him for nothing. I think they'll trade him if they can get a decent asset or pick.

If Turner contines to average 22/7/4 he'll be worth more than that. If the team thinks he's turned the corner, they may well keep him. Teams don't like to let picks go if they still have potential. Turner will get a good defensive test from Kawhi Monday, but he's already put up good games on Trevor Ariza, Luol Deng and Lebron James.

[Chinook]

The Sixers are too good right now and the Nuggets are too bad... Both team might be open to a move...

Also Glen Rice Jr and Vesely dont seem to be in the Wizards rotation... Like both... Not sure what Id sent back along with Bonner...

I think Denver will tank if they can. I don't think they'll be a buyer this season. With the way Houston has started the season, they could be. Chicago, Detroit and New Orleans too.

Bonner for Vesely and De Colo for Singleton is about as fair as it gets.

[Baam]

Ayres and Belinelli are approaching the date that'll make them eligible for a trade... I know it's not the kind of move the Spurs usually make but it'll still open up more possibilities...

I'm not sure Belinelli would really be traded but Ayres on the other hand...

I know it's not popular and I talked about it already but I'd make a move for Lin, sure he's expensive but Parker need someone who could potentially play 20 minutes behind him this season even tho I'm not sure TP would be ok with playing less than 30min thus basically making it even harder to make the All Star team... But he got to do what he wanted this summer so it'd be hard for him to say no on that. The fact is he went to the Finals then played all summer and now he's basically carrying the team. A team almost exclusively led by a tired Parker come PO time? I don't like that idea (and I love TP)...

Lin has flaws (mainly being TO prone and having a hard time playing off the ball at least last season) but after being so overrated it feels like he's now kinda underrated...

Having said that :
Bonbon + scrubs for Lin

Now if all we're offering is cap relief maybe the scrubs have to be Mills and De Colo the other expirings, I don't know tbh, could be problematic to resign Diaw...

[Chinook]

Rather go for Nelson. He counts for the same cap hit, is much better and has an expiring contract.

[FireMicoHalili]

See anyone on the Washington or Toronto rosters that might be a good fit? Seems like Bonner has fallen out of the rotation, along with CoJo and NDC. We might be able to turn them into something for anyone on a team looking to shed salary. Alexey Shved (MIN) has also fallen out of the rotation, and can be packaged with Derrick Williams. I don't see Pop biting on Turner because Marco, Manu, and Green look solid so far.

[Baam]

A strategy could be to trade the 2014 first rounder.

They did it during the Anthony Davis draft that got quite a bit of hype (sure it was a bit different as they needed to unload RJeff), strong drafts at the top don't mean great in the 30s... So why not do it again...

Cleveland has several second round picks :


2014 second round draft pick from MemphisMemphis' 2014 2nd round pick to Cleveland [Cleveland-Memphis, 7/25/2012]
2014 second round draft pick from Orlando
Orlando's 2014 2nd round pick to Cleveland [Cleveland-Orlando, 6/23/2011]

So I'd send our first (+ eventually something else) for Karasev and a second... Will the Spurs really have any room to had a rookie next year anyway?

Karasev gets two years to learn from Turnobili before replacing him and becomes the backup SF in the mean time... Could get 10-12min behind Kawhi...

Lots of wishful thinking involved in that one I know but I bet Pop would love to get him as well...

The huge risk would be a Parker injury that could make the Spurs pick rise up to 15-20 but I'm not even sure that'd really be the case, teams who're trying to tank are failing right now, too many bad teams this year, with so many teams betting on having a bad record it seems like it'd be better to bet on being really good...

[Baam]

See anyone on the Washington or Toronto rosters that might be a good fit? Seems like Bonner has fallen out of the rotation, along with CoJo and NDC. We might be able to turn them into something for anyone on a team looking to shed salary. Alexey Shved (MIN) has also fallen out of the rotation, and can be packaged with Derrick Williams. I don't see Pop biting on Turner because Marco, Manu, and Green look solid so far.

There's the usual suspects on these teams : Derrick Williams, Amir Johnson, Vesely, Singleton... Shved looks too similar to De Colo imo...

[ace3g]

Alex Kennedy @AlexKennedyNBA
(http://twitter.com/AlexKennedyNBA)CLE and SAC have been working the phones and exploring possible trades, per source. Both teams are open to making a move after slow start.

[Chinook]

Thompson and Vasquez are targets from Sacramento. I'd also like Karasev, but I think Cleveland is looking for a vet. The Spurs have little to offer teams besides low-level prospects and cap relief.

[Baam]

Yeah it's too bad we can't spare what Cleveland really wants : a SF, because they look determined to make a bad trade to get a PO spot...

[Baam]

Don't understand why the Spurs didn't get this guy to come to training camp :

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=LHF

Had a good Eurobasket this summer, plus it gave him plenty of experience playing with Boris and he is now beasting in the Euroleague... Could beat both Ayers and Baynes for the forth big spot tbh... Maybe he wanted a guaranteed contract, that's the only explanation but even then he would probably have been better than Ayers...

[Baam]

TRob with a great game for the Blazers :



Wed 11/13


vs
PHX (http://espn.go.com/nba/team/_/name/phx/phoenix-suns)


W 90-89 (http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=400488993)
17min
6-9
.667
0-0
.000
3-9
.333
8
0
1
1
2
1
15pts



Could have been on our roster working with Chip on his FT shooting...

[HarlemHeat37]

See anyone on the Washington or Toronto rosters that might be a good fit? Seems like Bonner has fallen out of the rotation, along with CoJo and NDC. We might be able to turn them into something for anyone on a team looking to shed salary. Alexey Shved (MIN) has also fallen out of the rotation, and can be packaged with Derrick Williams. I don't see Pop biting on Turner because Marco, Manu, and Green look solid so far.

Amir Johnson has been the Raptors best player for the past 2 seasons, he would fit really well with the Spurs IMO, he even spent the off-season working on a 3-point shot..Raptors could be willing to move him once they initiate tank mode, which everybody here(in T.O) expects at some point, tbh..

Spurs don't really have any assets, though, unfortunately..Raptors would be interested in Cory Joseph as a throw-in since he still has a solid Canadian following, and Bonner is still very popular in Toronto, but they aren't really considered assets:lol..

From the Wiz, I'd love Ariza, he would fit well with the new Spurs philosophy IMO..Green/Leonard/Ariza would cause defensive havoc on opposing teams, and both Kawhi/Ariza can play small-ball 4, which allows the Spurs to match up against the Heat, Thunder and Warriors..


As for PGs, I agree with Chinook about Jameer, Spurs could use a PG that can create his own shot and has experience..if he's traded/bought out at some point, he would be an interesting option on this team..

[CGD]

Spurs can't really offer much, but boy does Ariza make sense.

I just don't see the Spurs willing to part ways with Bonner. Until Ayers or Baynes can show they can knock down that outside shot reliably, the Spurs need Bonner against teams like Memphis, GSW, and even Clippers in spectating situations.

[Baam]

Asik trade talks have to be heating up, they can't afford not to play him and not to trade him for long or his value will drop...

[Baam]

My Asik trade proposal :

Splitter (eligible on January 15) + 2014 1st for Asik

I know there's plenty of Tiago lovers that will call me stupid but Splitter's main value is post defense and Asik does it much better. I'm much more confident in Asik guarding Hibbert than Splitter and that seems like a pretty likely matchup...

Splitter is also nice for defending the PnR but with Boris current level I still think it's worth it... Splitter has started only one full series in his nba career and that was against the Grizz, I'd think that Asik would have done as good or better against their twin towers, other than that there's no PO evidence of Splitter being essential...

So I'd call Morey with that offer, timing is not optimal for us but if Morey the moneyballer likes Splitter then who knows, Asik could be willing to wait two month to start on a contender...

[Chinook]

Splitter was a top-15 player in both ORtg and DRtg last year. He's been worlds more productive that Asik. Omer being less mobile would be a HUGE issue. If he can't defend with Howard next to him, he'd get destroyed. I think switching out Asik for Splitter last year leads to a loss in the semis. Even if the Spurs made the Finals, how would Ask have helped them from the bench?

I wouldn't trade Splitter for Asik straight up. Its definitely not worth giving up a pick.

[Baam]

How you say that we would have lost with Asik against Memphis when it looked like we would have won with only Bonner...

With that said where we could agree (or not) is that Splitter is a great fit with a strong Duncan. But with a weak Duncan Id take Asik (stronger rebounder and better rim protector) and I see a weak Duncan so far.

Splitters speed was less than useless against Miami anyway so that match-up doesn't matter for this trade but if you tell me Splitter can defend Hibbert just as well as Asik then I would be happy to keep him.

But if he can't and at year 4 of Splitter being a non factor in the POs people finally wonder about him being the new Bonner I will say hello...

[Chinook]

I said the Spurs would have lost in the semis, meaning to Golden State. Splitter's mobility was invaluable in that series. The Warriors were teeing off on Duncan in the PnR the same way teams would do on both Duncan and Asik if they started together.

Post defense and rim protection are important but also deemphasized in today's NBA. Splitter will continue to be a more valuable big than Asik going forward not just for the Spurs but for most teams. And it's not like Asik made a difference in the playoffs, either. His defensive stats are worst than Splitter's despite facing inferior competition.

[HarlemHeat37]

Spurs don't need a defensive big, anyways..

Duncan, while struggling on offense, is still at least a "good" defender, and Splitter is a solid all-around defender..if the Spurs acquire another big, he needs to be competent on offense, tbh..if not able to create for himself, then at least have the capability of making a jump shot..

Asik is a great defensive player and easily a superior interior defender to Splitter, but his offense is worse than Tiago's in every facet..acquiring a better interior defender but a far worse offensive player makes absolutely no sense for this Spurs team, tbh:lol..Asik is essentially a zero on offense, opposing teams don't have to respect any facet of his offensive game..at least Splitter is a terrific passer and a very good pick&roll finisher..

The Spurs were an elite defensive team last year and they have looked the same so far this year..if they make a move, I'd say they need a backup guard that can create(Jameer Nelson, for instance) or a small-ball 4/athletic PF(although Kawhi + Diaw 2.0 is probably sufficient)..

[Baam]

I said the Spurs would have lost in the semis, meaning to Golden State. Splitter's mobility was invaluable in that series. The Warriors were teeing off on Duncan in the PnR the same way teams would do on both Duncan and Asik if they started together.

Ok my mistake about the series, yeah he helped against the W's but they didn't have a dominant post player.


Post defense and rim protection are important but also deemphasized in today's NBA. Splitter will continue to be a more valuable big than Asik going forward not just for the Spurs but for most teams. And it's not like Asik made a difference in the playoffs, either. His defensive stats are worst than Splitter's despite facing inferior competition.

Tell that to Roy Hibbert tbh... Maybe in the regular season but the post game is still ultra important in the POs, Lebron got his last two rings going in the post, Hibbert looked like the scariest monster in the league dominating in the post. The problem with Tiago is that he play like a center on offense, and no a dominant one. Boris is a successful pairing with both because he can do everything on O while still having decently quick feet to guard the PnR...

Now if to save Duncan you have to give him the low post (and he didn't look good even there but let's say that we play him closer to the basket or give him less touches). Then the "answer" would be a guy able to guard the bigger centers in the post (something Duncan shouldn't/can't do anymore) while spacing the floor for him or instead of him.

Well there's a guy that kinda fits that description, that had a great night against D12 and he can shoot... But you're gonna laugh at me if I say his name...

click there (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/knicks-insider-bargnani-best-howard-article-1.1518055)

And yeah I'm kinda serious.

Underrated post defender althought a really bad rebounder and team defender...

[Baam]

Spurs don't need a defensive big, anyways..

Duncan, while struggling on offense, is still at least a "good" defender, and Splitter is a solid all-around defender..if the Spurs acquire another big, he needs to be competent on offense, tbh..if not able to create for himself, then at least have the capability of making a jump shot..

Asik is a great defensive player and easily a superior interior defender to Splitter, but his offense is worse than Tiago's in every facet..acquiring a better interior defender but a far worse offensive player makes absolutely no sense for this Spurs team, tbh:lol..Asik is essentially a zero on offense, opposing teams don't have to respect any facet of his offensive game..at least Splitter is a terrific passer and a very good pick&roll finisher..

The Spurs were an elite defensive team last year and they have looked the same so far this year..if they make a move, I'd say they need a backup guard that can create(Jameer Nelson, for instance) or a small-ball 4/athletic PF(although Kawhi + Diaw 2.0 is probably sufficient)..

Imo what they could really use is a center, either more skilled than Tiago on the perimeter or stronger in the post. Gasol has quick feet AND a jumper, Tiago is missing something to be valuable with a declining Duncan...

Boris is one of the best small ball 4 in the nba and Beli was signed to create off the bench...

[Chinook]

Pretty much Asik can't start next to Duncan, since teams will PnR them to death. Dias isn't the solution, since if he starts in Asik's place to guard the PnR, then Asik will be upset to not be starting. Also, he's definitely so much better than Splitter that he is worth trading for as a backup. Not only is Splitter a serviceable post defender, but there is a major lack of dominant post bigs in the league today. We're talking Al Jefferson and Brook Lopez as the only two who are polished, and neither one is likely to be on a contender for the next two years. Hibbert is raw and only looks good against bad front courts. James is a combo-forward and can't be defended by centers anyway.

Finally, Duncan is a really good post defender and will have to play that role in the post-season. Simply put, if Tim can't defend the post, then he'll be a defensive liability. It's just not sustainable to have a big who can neither play inside nor outside on the court. He can't even offer weak-side help if he's not the one in the post to start with.

[Chinook]

So moving on from Asik, what do you guys think of Cleveland's power-forwards? Any interest you? It's true the Spurs don't have any instant help for them outside of maybe Green or Belinelli when he's eligible to be traded next month. But the Cavs also have to fix their logjam at the four as it's about as bad as the point-guard spot is for the Spurs. A decent package of picks/prospects and expirings may be able to get one.

I personally don't see any of them as being worth it unless the Spurs win the trade handedly. Thompson is Blair with a jumpshot, Bennett is a combo-forward in a bad way, Clark would probably be stuck on the bench and Varejao is Splitter on an expiring and more overrated.

[Brazil]

Varejao is no Splitter. They are quite different players tbh. Healthy, Varejao is a hustle kind of player with high rebounding capacity he can finish around the rim and hit occasionally some jumpers. His def is suspect at best IMHO. He is not a bad player but health is a concern, he is seriously injury prone.

Not worth the gamble especially if our guards make up for the lack of rebounding of our bigs. Team is apparently focusing guards to help on that department.

I dont like thompson that muc while I agree Bennett and Clark are not fitting too much.

[Baam]

So moving on from Asik, what do you guys think of Cleveland's power-forwards? Any interest you? It's true the Spurs don't have any instant help for them outside of maybe Green or Belinelli when he's eligible to be traded next month. But the Cavs also have to fix their logjam at the four as it's about as bad as the point-guard spot is for the Spurs. A decent package of picks/prospects and expirings may be able to get one.

I personally don't see any of them as being worth it unless the Spurs win the trade handedly. Thompson is Blair with a jumpshot, Bennett is a combo-forward in a bad way, Clark would probably be stuck on the bench and Varejao is Splitter on an expiring and more overrated.

Yeah we're often coming back to Cleveland, I agree that it's a very intriguing trade partner... Now I agree that I'm not impressed with their bigs, Bennett could be intriguing as a long term project if he learns from Boris but I don't think his value dropt enough quite yet that we could get a good deal...

Waiters apparently got into a fight during a players only meeting about the number of his touches or something... At least that's the rumour...

I think Green would be a compelling piece for them, guy can play off the ball when they have young guys with egos literally fighting for possessions over there... And he's basically the best three point shooter out there and the ideal partner for Kyrie (but that goes for TP as well)... Then again would they be ok with trading for someone they drafted...

I'd do Green + picks for Bennett + Karasev but I don't see it as realistic at this point.

Duncan Splitter
Diaw Bennett
Kawhi Gino
Karasev Beli
TP Mills

Cleveland gets someone who can play off the ball and a Lebron bait tbh. Having Green and Kyrie spreading the floor could make Lebron think, it's basically Curry/Thompson level of spacing...

[FireMicoHalili]

Just read some thoughts in the forum and in PtR. My reactions:

1. If, as one poster suggested, we'd need a good PF to give us a lift when Duncan is struggling, then Bennett might be a good answer.
2. According to PtR, the Spurs system needs shooters more than flashy ball handlers (Nando). Shved, who has fallen out of rotation, might be a good fit and a valuable addition to the UN Crew.

[CGD]

Not sure where to put this since it's early yet to start talking free agency....

if the mavs stink it up or even make it to the playoffs and have a first round loss, is there a chance Dirk leaves the mavs? Would you offer the 35 year old German a two year deal at the expense of a youth movement?

I feel bad for Dirk and how the past few years since the championship have shaped up for him.

[szkorhetz]

Not sure where to put this since it's early yet to start talking free agency....

if the mavs stink it up or even make it to the playoffs and have a first round loss, is there a chance Dirk leaves the mavs? Would you offer the 35 year old German a two year deal at the expense of a youth movement?

I feel bad for Dirk and how the past few years since the championship have shaped up for him.
Dirk on the Spurs paired with Tiago and Duncan would be crazy and deadly, but that just won't happen.

[CGD]

Dirk on the Spurs paired with Tiago and Duncan would be crazy and deadly, but that just won't happen.

I agree it would be hard for him to leave, but I'd be annoyed if I were him given Cubans blunders/gambles since the championship. I also think older players are bound to get low balled (except Manu) when they seek that last contract, so why not try the open market even if only for leverage against your long time team?

[99 Problems]

Spacing for Kyrie is an interesting topic as of yesterday. Coach Brown played rookie Dellavedova during last quarter and OT for 31 minutes in total. Kyrie with the right spacing scored a million points and was back in ASG form.

[jesterbobman]

I wouldn't trade for Bennett. While he was good in College, I don't think anyone other than the Cavs had him as the #1 pick, and he hasn't lit the NBA on fire since coming in. Don't think they give up on Bennett for a Bonner + pick package, and there's no way we should give up Green.

I think we should look at teams who will be out of the playoff chase in February, want to rebuild and want to save money/ Get future assets.

Options are either keep Bonner, play TD/Boris and Tiago/Bonner units(worked 2 years ago) and try to move Baynes/Ayres/Nando/Corey for a deep rotation player.

Or, Move Bonner+ Parts(above, +1st) for a starting level PF. Targets should be
Amir Johnson
Millsap(probably unattainable unless there's a Horford injury and they focus on future)
Jordan Hill
Derrick Williams(I wouldn't, Bonner is a better player)
Jason Thompson (contract duration probably rules him out)

I think Amir is the best target amongst that group. Other option is hope for buyout candidates(Okafor etc)

[Mugen]

"Kings Pushing Hard for Trades"

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2013/11/20/kings-3-7-pushing-hard-for-a-trade/

They've got some pieces that could make sense for the Spurs. Mbah a Moute would be a good target and could probably be had for Bonner's expiring tbh

[Godbama]

What about Patrick Patterson?

[Chinook]

What about Patrick Patterson?

Not a fan of trading for someone on an expiring.

[CGD]

^ he has one more year on his deal. Think he'd be exactly the type deal the spurs want: a one year preview and a right to match other teams offer sheets next summer or else let him walk.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

i'm beginning to smell a deal with the raptors or the sixers. expiring contract mills is playing himself into a big decision for the spurs. maybe cojo could be moved to the raptors with expiring bonner? maybe mills could moved with his expiring aussie big to the overachieving sixers? mills might be the player to keep, but the sixers roster and picks seem like the more plausible trade options.

[Chinook]

^ he has one more year on his deal.

No he doesn't. This is his final year of his rookie contract. It's not a good thing for the team to have to worry about re-signing anyone besides Diaw and Mills before 2015. Also, the main reason to trade for a big is insurance against Diaw leaving. Patterson would not provide that.

[Baam]

i'm beginning to smell a deal with the raptors or the sixers. expiring contract mills is playing himself into a big decision for the spurs. maybe cojo could be moved to the raptors with expiring bonner? maybe mills could moved with his expiring aussie big to the overachieving sixers? mills might be the player to keep, but the sixers roster and picks seem like the more plausible trade options.

Maybe... But then again what would they give up for Cojo + Bonner kind of package... Not much...

If Duncan doesn't get it together by the end of the year I could see a "big" move on draft night with Green being moved to move up in the draft in the hope of getting a big with potential...

This year moving Bonner and De Colo as expirings makes sense but I'm not sure we can get anything worth much, and I'm not sure the Spurs really want to take back salary, a deal getting us an early second round pick would be nice... They could get a project like Jaiteh as well as a more polished player with the first round pick which wouldn't be a luxury with the post Duncan era looming at the horizon...

Now the only teams that'd give up a pick would be teams trying to make the POs like Minny, Cleveland, the Wiz or the Pelicans...

Minny always seemed like the perfect destination for Bonner as Love's backup...

Për realgm, Minny has 2 second round picks and as well as their own :


2014 second round draft pick from Golden StateGolden State's 2014 2nd round pick to Minnesota [Golden State-Minnesota, 6/27/2013]
2014 second round draft pick from New Orleans

New Orleans' 2014 2nd round pick to Minnesota [Minnesota-New Orleans, 9/9/2009]

Bonner for Schved + Pelis and Wolves seconds

Schved is there to make the trade work and have someone to play one on one with De Colo...

[Chinook]

I think Duncan's done if he fails to have a good season--especially if that means the team flounders. Then you have the fact that at best, Green is worth about what Hill was worth three years ago. The Spurs will not find a great rookie big at 15+.

If Duncan leaves and the Spurs decide to blow it up next season (the latter is incredibly unlikely) they probably would try to move everyone besides Leonard. But I doubt they'd get much in the way of picks.

[Baam]

I think Duncan's done if he fails to have a good season--especially if that means the team flounders. Then you have the fact that at best, Green is worth about what Hill was worth three years ago. The Spurs will not find a great rookie big at 15+.

If Duncan leaves and the Spurs decide to blow it up next season (the latter is incredibly unlikely) they probably would try to move everyone besides Leonard. But I doubt they'd get much in the way of picks.

If ... major if... they blow it up :

I could easily see TP going to New York, they don't have a good PG and still have their 2015 first, plus TP almost signed there which could lead to believe that he wouldnt be unhappy to go there...

Green is easily worth a first rounder for any team with PO aspirations, 3.5M a year means that basically every team could try to trade for him...

Manu I don't know, if they want to tank they play him starting point guard tbh... Since he's the crowd favorite it will help with the attendance in a hard year...

[CGD]

No he doesn't. This is his final year of his rookie contract. It's not a good thing for the team to have to worry about re-signing anyone besides Diaw and Mills before 2015. Also, the main reason to trade for a big is insurance against Diaw leaving. Patterson would not provide that.

What am I missing? http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/kings.jsp

Wouldn't at worst the spurs extend a QO next summer? If someone really wants him they coul outbid.

[CGD]

Now that Manu resigned, I only really see Duncan leaving after this year if he DRobs and wins it all this June. I see them leaving together otherwise.

[Chinook]

What am I missing? http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/kings.jsp

Wouldn't at worst the spurs extend a QO next summer? If someone really wants him they coul outbid.

A QO is not a contract in most cases. It's just a way for a team to keep a player's right of first refusal So Patterson would need a new deal after this season, which would likely cut into 2015 cap space. Essentially, I'm speculating thst the team wants to find a player with exactly one year left on their deal after this one.

[CGD]

^
The spurs have three option though that don't impact the 2015 plan -- extend the QO and refuse to match another teams offer sheet next summer, extend the QO and not offer a contract extension, or retract the QO and let the dude walk. In either scenario they can get him for next year and not have to pay him in 2015.

Spurs really have two bigs they have to worry about resigning next summer, Boris and dare I say Bonner, each presently earning in the ballpark of what Paterson's last year is for. Boris is the priority, but Bonner will be addressed too, and some team is going to bid on the stretch four. Look no further than Houston for example as a team that needs a stretch 4 (Montiejunas has been a bust, and now they're rumored to be after Ryan Anderson).

[Chinook]

No. That's not how restricted free agency works. If the Spurs offer a QO, they then only have the option to match whatever contract Patterson gets. If he signs a four-year offer sheet, the team either has to match that exact offer or let him walk then. A QO is not really a contract. It's just a placeholder. Unless Patterson signs it, it never goes into effect. Also, it cannot be extended once signed. The same was true last summer with Splitter and the summer before with Green and Mills.

[TheyCallMePro]

I heard the Kings are shopping Jimmer Fredette. Words can't express how much I want him to be a Spur. I literally watched every BYU game (and I'm not a BYU fan) because he was the most exciting player in College I've ever seen. And it's not just his shooting. He's a very smart player who can drive, pass, and handle the ball.

We have Joseph, De Colo, and Banes to trade. Plus, I wouldn't mind adding in our first round draft pick in a deal for him, because it's going to be somewhere around the 26th-30th pick.

I think Jimmer would be like Gary Neal 2.0 if we could get him. It's not his fault he's been buried in the pit of despair known as the Sacramento Kings for these past couple years. The Spurs could fully utilize his talents. I'm just praying we express interest soon, because I've heard Minnesota and the Knicks are already vying for his services.

[Chinook]

Nope. Even I know Beli is worlds better. If the Spurs want him, they could probably get him for the min in the off-season. His stock hasn't been lower.

[Baam]

The Bulls have two 2014 first round picks, the rights of Mirotic and young assets like Butler...

TP grew up as a Bulls fan, his father is from the Chicago area...

Rose is done...

I'm just saying... Could be draft night move if Tim looks bad and the PO run is a failure.

[CGD]

No. That's not how restricted free agency works. If the Spurs offer a QO, they then only have the option to match whatever contract Patterson gets. If he signs a four-year offer sheet, the team either has to match that exact offer or let him walk then. A QO is not really a contract. It's just a placeholder. Unless Patterson signs it, it never goes into effect. Also, it cannot be extended once signed. The same was true last summer with Splitter and the summer before with Green and Mills.

I don't think we're saying different things. Sure the spurs could refuse to extend the QO and he walks, and sure they can extend the QO and refuse to match the other teams offers sheet or even retract the QO at the last moment. But If the QO is extended and not matched or retracted be the designated date, the player gains a year on the contract which expires at the end of the following year. In Patterson's case that would be summer of 2015 when Tim and Manu retire.

Really you've just identified a fourth way of how the spurs could avoid paying Patterson next year if they don't like what they see this year. If the concern is tying up money beyond summer of 2015, there are clearly many ways the spurs could avoid paying Patterson. That said he could be good insurance against filling slots left empty by both Diaw and Bonner leaving this summer, I think.

[Bruno]

FYI:

404065373818871808

Wonder if it was before or after the Ayres signing. Logic would be that is was before but who knows...

[Baam]

Wonder what they were willing to offer for that scrub... I don't think they'd want him after Ayres ... unless he was gonna replace Bonbon somehow...

[Chinook]

I don't think we're saying different things. Sure the spurs could refuse to extend the QO and he walks, and sure they can extend the QO and refuse to match the other teams offers sheet or even retract the QO at the last moment. But If the QO is extended and not matched or retracted be the designated date, the player gains a year on the contract which expires at the end of the following year. In Patterson's case that would be summer of 2015 when Tim and Manu retire.

Really you've just identified a fourth way of how the spurs could avoid paying Patterson next year if they don't like what they see this year. If the concern is tying up money beyond summer of 2015, there are clearly many ways the spurs could avoid paying Patterson. That said he could be good insurance against filling slots left empty by both Diaw and Bonner leaving this summer, I think.

I'm at a loss of what to tell you. We're talking about the Spurs trading for a big who is under contract for EXACTLY two years. In this scenario, the Spurs don't want to have to make a decision on Patterson. They'd be screwed either way. If he's good, they messes up their cap in 2015. If he's bad, they just wasted assets on him. The odds of him actually playing under a QO are extremely low. That just doesn't happen in the NBA.

Thus, the Spurs have no way to keep him for exactly two seasons, and that makes him a less desirable trade target.

Just to so I don't have to read it again: It's not up to the Spurs whether Patterson would play under his one-year QO. It's up to him to sign it rather than an offer sheet with another team or a new contract with his original team. Therefore, they cannot guarantee that he'd play in San Antonio for 2014-2015 only. If you're saying it's okay because they can just let him walk this summer, then that's irrelevant. The same is true for every player on an expiring contract. Patterson's RFA status makes no difference.

[Chinook]

FYI:

404065373818871808

Wonder if it was before or after the Ayres signing. Logic would be that is was before but who knows...

Cunningham? If so, I like him. Definitely will be happy if Ayres can play a similar role. I understand why he gets minutes over Williams.

[Chinook]

Wonder what they were willing to offer for that scrub... I don't think they'd want him after Ayres ... unless he was gonna replace Bonbon somehow...

If you mean trade wise, they probably only wanted him had the Wolves declined his option. If you mean salary, probably what Ayres got. Seems like they had that money earmarked already.

[NickiRasgo]

Travis Outlaw anyone?

[Baam]

If you mean trade wise, they probably only wanted him had the Wolves declined his option. If you mean salary, probably what Ayres got. Seems like they had that money earmarked already.

Yep meant trade wise.

[yavozerb]

Spurs need to trade Nando for tony snell of the bulls. They are in need of pg play now and the Snell could provide some back up time at the 3. make it happen

[Baam]

De Colo has no value, only value is as an expiring...

Cleveland is definitely gonna make a trade, they're just in a shitty position right now... Drafted badly and signed bad players like Jack.. Now it looks like Kyrie could walk and they'd be back at square one... What a mistake that was not trading Varejao at peak value... If they do make a trade all their assets are devalued right now tho so it's not smart but the question is if their GM has a choice.

[Chinook]

What helps De Colo's trade value is that he's played really well in garbage time this year. He honestly looks like he could help a team as a rotation player now. If the Spurs insist on moving him, I think they could get a better return than most assume.

[Baam]

^ I just looked at his stats and he currently has a PER of 19 lol.

But then again teams could just get him at the end of the year and while he has decent stats he has played less minutes than Cojo which doesn't inspire confidence at all... When you want an asset to have value you play him, that's why RJeff started until the end... Being behind the current version of Cojo is scary for the other teams' FOs...

Maybe a team like the Warriors that's in win now mode and has depth problems would consider giving a future protected second rounder for him but they don't even have one in 2014... But that kind of scenario seems like a long shot to me.

edit : per realgm they have traded all their 2nd rounders until 2018 :lol

[FireMicoHalili]

We are never trading Bonner. Too valuable to Pop's schemes. Like Blair last year, I don't see anyone biting in a trade for De Colo. Joseph yeah sure the Raptors will be a sensible trading partner, but for who, exactly? Nothing to see here unless the team suffers a meltdown midseason. It's either they wait on a valuable SF/C to be bought out (Salmons/Villanueva/Okafor, anyone?) or wait for J-Ho to get back into shape.

or you know, Andres Nocioni

[Bruno]

Nando is a fine player and it sucks for him that it doesn't get more playing time but it's logical given all the depth and quality Spurs have at guards spots. The best for him would be to be traded to a team where he would get more minutes or to negotiate a buyout and go back in Europe. A team like Barcelona could really use him.

[Bruno]

If Rose is out for the year, Bulls might be interested in salary dumping Dunleavy. A trade like De Colo and Baynes for Dunleavy sounds fine. However, it can only be done after December 15th when Dunleavy will be eligible to be traded.

[BackHome]

Two players who just don't have any hope of staying with us are Nando and CoJo if we could work out some kind of trade that would be good for us and for them.

[TheyCallMePro]

We have 2 good points guards that we're not using, and there are teams that are desperate for PG's right now. We should make a trade. And we shouldn't be worried if we have to throw in our late 1st round pick this upcoming year, because all of the talent in the draft class will be exhausted by then.

I'm pretty sure the Bulls would be willing to take one of our PG's and our late first rounder for Jimmy Butler. That, or we could swap our 1st rounder with theirs (they'll have a higher pick) and give them Joseph/De Colo along with it.

Or we could do the same deal with any other team. Depending on who and what we want. But I see no reason to keep Joseph or De Colo when were not going to use them and this is a veteran team that is trying to win now, so giving up draft picks shouldn't concern us.

[td4mvp2k]

Would be good to get decolo off the team and look to sign a vet who could be cut in mid season

[DrunkTXLabrat]

the spurs should cash in on the rose injury and give the bulls cojo or mills for a first rounder.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

With the Bulls about to crash down, wonder if they'd be open to trading Noah and/or Taj. Unfortunately the best the Spurs could offer are expirings and low draft picks, besides they may not want to commit to their contracts, which are huge and run past 2015.

[Godbama]

Zach Lowe did mention San Antonio as a possibility in his hypothetical Deng trade talks.
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/83641/deja-vu-in-chicago-plus-a-trip-through-the-nbas-emergency-room

[Baam]

Chicago would be the perfect trade partner for Cleveland, they can get rid of Jack immediately and fill their void at SF with defensive minded player who knows how to play off the ball...

Jack and Waiters for Deng

Cleveland get rid of their two most poisonous players.


edit : 3 teams scenario involving the Spurs :

SA gets : Karasev + Chicago's two 2014 first round picks
Chicago gets : Jack + Green
Cleveland gets : Deng + Cojo + Spurs first round pick

[Bruno]

I don't really see how Spurs could get Deng. They won't trade Leonard for him and it's not a very late 2014 first round pick or the rights to overseas players out because of ACL surgeries that could entice Bulls.

Dunleavy is pretty much the only realistic and interesting Bulls target. Snell could be another option if Bulls give up on him.

[szkorhetz]

Getting Taj could be huge. I can see them tank this year, get Melo and Randle and compete next year.
They are jut not good enough without Rose.

[jesterbobman]

I would keep one of those 2 PG's at the least. Having only 2 is bad management. Corey/Nando + Baynes for a better backup Centre would be a useful option, if they don't do a bigger trade. There isn't a huge list of players, but upgrading Ayres/Baynes is probably the biggest achievable upgrade. Shitty to decent is a cheaper move than average to good.

Cojo + Baynes only gets up to ~ 1.8m, so we can take in ~2.7m (150% of the 1.8) in a trade. Not many good bigs fall below that. Gustavo Ayon and Jason Smith are probably the best players in that window, but the Pels won't trade Smith. Would depend on how much Ferry and Bud like Corey and Baynes.

[Chinook]

Chicago would be the perfect trade partner for Cleveland, they can get rid of Jack immediately and fill their void at SF with defensive minded player who knows how to play off the ball...

Jack and Waiters for Deng

Cleveland get rid of their two most poisonous players.


edit : 3 teams scenario involving the Spurs :

SA gets : Karasev + Chicago's two 2014 first round picks
Chicago gets : Jack + Green
Cleveland gets : Deng + Cojo + Spurs first round pick

I think your pre-edit post is an extremely solid idea. But I wouldn't trade Green for Karasev this season. Danny is putting up great advanced stats despite being an up-and-down offensive player this year. Moving Beli to the starting two would be interesting, especially if the team this Karasev could back up Leonard, but that's a nice for the future. Last year showed that Green is pretty essential for a title run. Not a bad idea besides that, though. Value seems right.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

I don't really see how Spurs could get Deng. They won't trade Leonard for him and it's not a very late 2014 first round pick or the rights to overseas players out because of ACL surgeries that could entice Bulls.

Dunleavy is pretty much the only realistic and interesting Bulls target. Snell could be another option if Bulls give up on him.

cojo for snell straight up. the spurs give the backup pg keys to mills, and get a promising rook to add to sf depth. the bulls have some insurance for hinrich and teague. win, win.

[FireMicoHalili]

We want Snell because he has dreadlocks and looks like a Bizarro Kawhi?

[CGD]

cojo for snell straight up. the spurs give the backup pg keys to mills, and get a promising rook to add to sf depth. the bulls have some insurance for hinrich and teague. win, win.

Like

[Baam]

Last year showed that Green is pretty essential for a title run. Not a bad idea besides that, though. Value seems right.

I agree actually, trading Green would make a series like GS really dangerous... Even the Clippers, his best value being against star PGs. But it'd put the FO in a strong position for the future, they could rebuild almost seamlessly if all goes well with that kind of move... But then again the priority is to give Duncan a chance to win in his last year or two... They kind of did both with the George Hill trade tho...

The Spurs have 3 major blue chips (that could kickstart the rebuilding) :
- Kawhi
- Green on his current contract
- TP

Green kinda has time limit as he could walk, besides the great value of his deal is what makes him a blue chip.

If they don't want to tank, then I'd trade Green, it they want to tank in 2015, dealing TP alone could be enough.

Keep Leonard, keep Green, start Manu at point guard, Tim opts out (and retires on top with a ring lol), deal TP for picks and tank for Okafor... Then again the team would probably be too strong so they'd have to deal someone else...

If they don't do one or the other my personnal conviction is that they're gonna go back to being pretenders quite soon, TP is gonna really slow down at some point and betting on FA is extremely risky for a team like the Spurs...

[Chinook]

Trading any of the core six players next season slams shut the window, provided the trade is not for a star player. If the team wants to remain competitive, then trading Danny wouldn't be nearly enough. At the same time, he's not a good rebuilding piece, as the Cavs found out. So unless Green magically improves, he should get traded if Parker were to be. I don't think there's a trade with only Green going or that would improve the ten next year

[BackHome]

I think we are going to do the same thing next year that we did this year which is just small changes. The biggest issues will be what do we do with Diaw, Mills...do we sign them and for how much? To me I don't think Duncan is going to retire so I would like to make a run next year as well so I am all inf or signing these two players for decent contracts.

As far as Bonner I think he will be gone and I am praying that CoJo will be traded who knows him and Green could get us somebody pretty good or a one year player with a good draft pick. Will that happen probably not so we just have to replace Bonner and Nando.

[Chinook]

I am convinced Bonner will stay a Spur until he retires. He's almost as culturally fundamental to the team as the Big Three. He's part of the family. Provided he takes the appropriate salary cut, he'll be around until at least Duncan hangs them up.

[BackHome]

A lot can be said for family if you look at other teams some have more talented players then we do they just don't have they system/chemistry and good coach that we have. Forget about blowing things up and cap space I would try to win it until Duncan says enough but only he knows when that time will come.

People always want to tank but the chances of us finding another Duncan is about the same as you winning the jackpot. Added that now you need to find that type of player but then you also need to replace Pop who is probably also hanging up his spurs. So keep winning until the wheels fall off..............:downspin:

[Baam]

I am convinced Bonner will stay a Spur until he retires. He's almost as culturally fundamental to the team as the Big Three. He's part of the family. Provided he takes the appropriate salary cut, he'll be around until at least Duncan hangs them up.

Bonner is no Bowen, he's a good guy but if you don't part with Bonner you might as well not trade anyone ever again... Change the name to the San Antonio good guys and don't pretend you're trying to win a championship...

[DrunkTXLabrat]

We want Snell because he has dreadlocks and looks like a Bizarro Kawhi?

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-07-15/sports/ct-spt-0716-bulls-chicago-summer-league-20130716_1_tony-snell-scottie-pippen-famer

[ace3g]

SportsCenter @SportsCenter
(http://twitter.com/SportsCenter)Cavaliers are actively shopping SG Dion Waiters. Team has spoken with Knicks, Bulls and 76ers. (via @Chris_Broussard (http://twitter.com/Chris_Broussard/))

[Baam]

I hope they get a good deal, I'd like Mike Brown to do well, I like the guy.

That said Broussard is not the most reliable source iirc.

[ace3g]

Chris Broussard @Chris_Broussard
(http://twitter.com/Chris_Broussard)Sources: Cavs' targets 4 Waiters - Shumpert (NYK), Deng (Chi), Evan Turner (Philly)

[NickiRasgo]

Chris Broussard @Chris_Broussard
(http://twitter.com/Chris_Broussard)Sources: Cavs' targets 4 Waiters - Shumpert (NYK), Deng (Chi), Evan Turner (Philly)



Cavs should've drafted Oladipo before if that's the case.

[CGD]

Waiters would be a terrible with the Knicks. The whole reason he's failed in Clev is bc he needs the ball so damn much that it takes away from Irving and the flow of the system. Now Imagine him with Melo and JR. That said, the Knicks will acquire him.

[Chinook]

Turner would be intriguing for them. Him being an RFA means they can control him in the summer without officially committing money to him. He's also been playing really well. Waiters is from Philly so the local connection is there. If the Sixers like him, he'd make a decent compliment to MCW and potentially Wiggins.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Cavs should've drafted Oladipo before if that's the case.

bingo! bennett was such a terrible pick at number 1. if they draft oladipo or burke, they could trade down and get bennett+. the pistons are equally insane for trading for jennings over burke.

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/378800000598607486/3c5f948a2f05f5d16aabbb94f27e1df7_normal.jpeg Kevin Bryant ‏@KevinRashidi (https://twitter.com/KevinRashidi)

The Raptors are in talks with Sacramento for a Aaron Gray/Jimmer Fredette swap. Jimmer would help with 3pt shooting + assists for TOR.

Kevin Bryant ‏@KevinRashidi (https://twitter.com/KevinRashidi)
Just to be clear, both sides have interest but a deal is not imminent yet. Makes sense for TOR, not sure why SAC would though. Masai effect?

[ace3g]

Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine
(https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine)Hearing this strong: Rockets determined to trade Omer Asik by Dec. 19 at latest and have ramped up discussions with potential trade partners


Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine
(https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine)Reason Dec. 19 is significant is because anyone Rockets get would be eligible to be re-packaged in new deal on trade-deadline day (Feb. 20)

[Chinook]

Damn, Morey's already planning on getting rid of whoever he gets.

[BackHome]

Good Luck in trying to trade Asik!

[Cklbmk]

I floated the idea of Green for McCollum to Portland fans and a few seemed interested. I think that would be an interesting pick up

[mosdef17]

Brandon Rush for Bonner + 2nd? Listed as a SG but could play either wing position. Nice size, good defender, 3pt shooter.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Draymond Green is in a contract season next year.

[Chinook]

Draymond Green is in a contract season next year.

He's also a restricted FA after next season. He's not going anywhere unless Golden State is capped out. He would have been a great pick in 2012 had the Spurs kept their first-rounder. He's pretty much what the Spurs needed last off-season.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Curry, thompson, iggy, and lee should take up a pretty big chunk. I think green is gonna be in for a big contract. I smell a harden style trade in golden state.

[Chinook]

:lol I like Draymond a lot, but in no way is he in a similar position to Harden's a couple of years ago. He's in line to get less than the MLE unless a team is stupid. In any event, the Warriors aren't really capped out. They're projected to be under the cap the year Green becomes an RFA. They'd definitely be able to keep him and stay under the tax unless they hand out a big contract to anyone besides Thompson. It's not impossible for Green to go to another team, but it wouldn't be because Golden State can't afford him.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Draymonds development is gonna be hurt by the Jackson firing. He was headed for more than an mle deal.

[Baam]

If the Bulls really don't want to amnesty Boozer then :

Boozer + 2 first round picks for Beli + Splitter

Draft Capela and Anderson..

[Baam]

477825642017198081

when I saw this tweet, I couldn't help thinking "SPLITTER".

Splitter + 30 would give them both a SF (pick Glenn Robinson at 30) and a center.

Need a third team that wants Ryan Anderson pretty badly... Let's say the Suns who don't want to give up their stud guards for Love...

Something like that :

Suns get Ryan Anderson
Pelicans get Splitter + Spurs' 30
Spurs get Len or Frye + Sun's 14 and 27

TD Capela
Diaw Frye
Kawhi K.Anderson
Green Manu
TP Cojo

:wow

No need to look for an impossible signing in 2015 or 2016 and we can pay Green in 2015 that way.

[Richie]

Whyon earth wwould the Suns give up a player and 2 picks for Anderson?

[Baam]

Whyon earth wwould the Suns give up a player and 2 picks for Anderson?

The player is just there to make salaries match... Len is a complete bust and Frye is average and on the downside...

[Richie]

The player is just there to make salaries match... Len is a complete bust and Frye is average and on the downside...

Frye was good last year and it's way too early to give up on Len. Even ignoring that, Anderson isn't worth 2 first rounders.

[cjw]

Frye was good last year and it's way too early to give up on Len. Even ignoring that, Anderson isn't worth 2 first rounders.

Anderson just had back surgery too for good measure. At $8.5mm per year, he's also getting paid handsomely enough where New Orleans wouldn't get a big haul back for him. There's a reason a trade like Asik-Anderson hasn't happened yet.

The Suns fleeced the Pacers on the Scola deal, there's no reason to think they'd overpay for another offense only PF.

[Mel_13]

when I saw this tweet, I couldn't help thinking "SPLITTER".

:lol

Of course you couldn't.

Amusing fantasy trade scenario, btw.

[Chinook]

:lol

Of course you couldn't.

Amusing fantasy trade scenario, btw.

:lol I've missed the Think Tank being active. Present games excluded, the early off-season is my favorite time of the year.

[Chinook]

I'll throw one out here that I touched on in some random thread on the main forum: Who anyone trade Splitter and sweeteners to Atlanta for Horford? Apparently, Al was on the block at the deadline, and I imagine Bud would love Tiago.

[Mel_13]

:lol I've missed the Think Tank being active. Present games excluded, the early off-season is my favorite time of the year.

I agree. From the day after the Finals until July 15th or so.


I'll throw one out here that I touched on in some random thread on the main forum: Who anyone trade Splitter and sweeteners to Atlanta for Horford? Apparently, Al was on the block at the deadline, and I imagine Bud would love Tiago.

Splitter+ for Horford? Yes, please.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

why splitter hypotheticals? i think we need the good old fashioned "nobody wants spurs scraps" hypotheticals. spurs scrap playoffs clutch neal collects fat checks while fat attitude blair collects clutch playoff minutes. and to top it all off, the spurs on the brink of a chip.

stock is up on ayers, beli, and the joseph expiring... these are primo draftnight, preseason, trade deadline think tank hypothetical fodder.

raps have shown previous interest in joseph. i also bet the thunder have a certain respect for joseph. beli and ayers are a little tougher to speculate on... ayers is from cali and the lakers have a lot of open roster spots. plus a coaching vacancy. one that could be filled by jazz interviewee Jim Boylen. who could help fill an empty roster with familiar face beli. all for what cost? a decent 2nd or a future protected 1st/2nd?

[CGD]

I'll throw one out here that I touched on in some random thread on the main forum: Who anyone trade Splitter and sweeteners to Atlanta for Horford? Apparently, Al was on the block at the deadline, and I imagine Bud would love Tiago.

solid trade for both teams assuming no lingering knee issues for Hortford. The Hortford/Milsap pairing is terse/forced fit next year for ATL. The spurs would definitely lose an elite PnR defender, but at this point laying the pipe for the future is key and a Leonard/Hortford duo would be a solid foundation, to which the team can later add pieces like LJC and Bertans in the near future.

[Mal]

Who can Spurs get for CoJo, Ayers and 30th pick ? It`s 4 mil in salary.

[Mel_13]

Who can Spurs get for CoJo, Ayers and 30th pick ? It`s 4 mil in salary.

Look for players with salaries between 4 and 6 million and get back to us:

http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/index.jsp

[Chinook]

Who can Spurs get for CoJo, Ayers and 30th pick ? It`s 4 mil in salary.

You mean $3 Million. 2013-2014 salaries are the ones that count on draft night.

[Seventyniner]

You mean $3 Million. 2013-2014 salaries are the ones that count on draft night.

$3M plus 50% because the Spurs are below the tax, right?

Edit: you just meant the salary used for calculation, not the amount the Spurs could bring back

[Baam]

Im thinking that if they trade for another pick, Charlotte's 24th pick is the best target by far, they have 2 picks so they should be open to trades and at 24 you're pretty much assured to get one of Capela/Anderson.

Question is, what would the Spurs be able to offer ? I still think the only piece they can part with is Splitter...

So I propose a variation of my previous Pelican trade :

Pelicans get Splitter
Charlotte get Anderson to pair with big Al
Spurs get Henderson + 24th pick

Duncan Capela
Diaw Jokic
Kawhi Henderson/Beli
Green Manu
TP Mills/Cojo

:jack

[Mr. Body]

Yeeeeaaaaaahh, the Spurs aren't trading Splitter, especially for some unknowns.

[Baam]

Yeeeeaaaaaahh, the Spurs aren't trading Splitter, especially for some unknowns.

I want to believe :elephant

You keep starting Splitter you're basically limiting both Tim and more importantly Kawhi... You bench him and you have a very pricey bench guy that'd be best used as a trade asset to ensure the post Duncan era imo...

We're talking about a guy that played about 10min a game off the top of my head against the 2 best teams in the league, I think we could do ok without him...

[DPG21920]

I'll throw one out here that I touched on in some random thread on the main forum: Who anyone trade Splitter and sweeteners to Atlanta for Horford? Apparently, Al was on the block at the deadline, and I imagine Bud would love Tiago.

Why to all of it? What is your logic?

[Chinook]

Why to all of it? What is your logic?

Horford is younger and probably better. He supposedly hasn't bought into Atlanta to the point that they shopped him at the deadline. Splitter is a nice defensive center who's good as the PnR roll man, so he'd be a fit in Atlanta. Anything else you'd like to know?

[Baam]

Not Spurs related but could be in some way : Warriors are supposedly trying to send Klay in a package for Love... And Klay would be willing to go to get a max deal :wow.

479691537886871552

With a dramatic coaching upgrade and possibly Love that team could be scary...

[smaka]

Why on earth would you trade Splitter for unproved draft pick? Without Splitter Spurs might not get past Dallas this year.

[Baam]

479702245521371136

Seems absolutely ridiculous on paper but then again we're talking about the Wolves :downspin:...

[Chinook]

The Warriors would be just as easy to defend with Love instead of Thompson. I guess it would encourage the Spurs to play Diaw over Splitter, but it would also make Leonard's job easier.

[xmas1997]

The Warriors would be just as easy to defend with Love instead of Thompson. I guess it would encourage the Spurs to play Diaw over Splitter, but it would also make Leonard's job easier.

If some of these trades come to fruition, it would make me lean a lot stronger toward getting Frye in free agency.

[DPG21920]

Horford is younger and probably better. He supposedly hasn't bought into Atlanta to the point that they shopped him at the deadline. Splitter is a nice defensive center who's good as the PnR roll man, so he'd be a fit in Atlanta. Anything else you'd like to know?

Was just trying to see your train of thought on it. I am not sold at all that Horford would necessarily be better than Tiago with the Spurs so it seemed to me like a move just to make a move, especially with Al coming off of injury. Spurs don't need extra offense, they need that defense and to me Splitter > Horford on defense overall.

[Chinook]

Was just trying to see your train of thought on it. I am not sold at all that Horford would necessarily be better than Tiago with the Spurs so it seemed to me like a move just to make a move, especially with Al coming off of injury. Spurs don't need extra offense, they need that defense and to me Splitter > Horford on defense overall.

They do need offense after 2014. It would definitely be a trade looking toward the post-Duncan era. But it might be a worthy investment.

[DPG21920]

They do need offense after 2014. It would definitely be a trade looking toward the post-Duncan era. But it might be a worthy investment.

I see your process now. I guess I am still in the all in now mode. If Tim/Manu/TP are playing next year, the goal to me would be to 1) repeat 2) eye on future with number coming in first in order of importance by a long shot. If you can do both, sure.

[Kineto]

If the spurs want to improve their starting line-up, the only spot i can see is the SG position.
Don't you think it's time to sell high on green ?
i see 2 possible target :
- Wes Mathews for Green + Belinelli : the Blazzers have already a strong 5, and they need to improve their bench.
- Afflalo for Green+Joseph+Ayers+1st pick : Magic are still rebuilding, they don't really need a solid SG like afflalo who play on the natural spot of Oladipo. Green is younger, they get a young PG and Ayers is here just to make the salary matching.

I think Matthews is the most likely, maybe with some other asset like pick or stash player right for balancing the deal.

SA will lose some depth, but they have full MLE, BAE and the De Colo trade exception to bring some solid rotation player (and they probably never been so appealing for free agent than this years).

[Chinook]

Goddamn, no. It's not time to "sell high" on Green. Even if it were, the hell would you attempt to do so by getting worse players at a premium?

[Baam]

Green is younger than Splitter and has been better/more important the past 3 years... I'd rather move Splitter if they move anyone...

The reason you'd move Green is if you're afraid he walks for nothing next season... But then again the Spurs have no backup plan and it creates a real hole (that Beli can't fill). On the other hand Diaw can start for Splitter, hell even Bonner could in the Thunder series...

[Kineto]

Say that Green is more important than Splitter is having really short memory. Splitter was spur's best player against Dallas, and have been huge against Portland too. HIs hability to defend against Dirk or Aldridge is really valuable for this team, and the combo Duncan-Splitter will be much needed if we face up Memphis or Houston. And he is also one of the best pick&roll defender of the NBA.
He is just a bad matchup against Miami and OKC, but there are 27 other team in the NBA.
There is a reason why good 7 footer are "overpayed" in NBA, there is quite few of them.

Green is a very good defender ad a very good 3 pts shooter, but he is not a "unique" player. This skill-set is not so unusual for a SG. Green look pretty in spurs system, but a lot of other player could.

Mattews and Afflalo are some very good 3 pts shooter, very good defender, and they have a more complete offensive game than green. You can't hide a weak defender on them.
They are more expensive than green, but spurs are way under the luxury tax, it should not be an issue.
And in Mattews case, his contract end next year and will not impact 2015 salary cap.

[100%duncan]

Dg for matthews? Fuck no

[Chinook]

Another off-season, another case of amnesia from certain posters about how valuable Green is to the Spurs. Also, and another round of folks acting like pointing out a player's flaws somehow negates his importance to the team. Green is elite at what he does. He's not just competent or "very good." I wouldn't trade him for 20-25 of the starting twos in the league, even if salary weren't a consideration.

[Kineto]

Another off-season, another case of amnesia from certain posters about how valuable Green is to the Spurs. Also, and another round of folks acting like pointing out a player's flaws somehow negates his importance to the team. Green is elite at what he does. He's not just competent or "very good." I wouldn't trade him for 20-25 of the starting twos in the league, even if salary weren't a consideration.

Let's say that we agree to disagree so :)

For me, green is a good role player who shine in spurs system, and a player like mattews could bring the same outside shooting and defense abilities, plus a better ball handling and a capacity to attack the basket. I'm quite sure that if i post the same trade idea on the blazzers forum, they will argue that Mattews is way to good for green+Beli ;-)

I suppose that fan are always more or less biased concerning player of their team ;-)

[TheCerebral1]

Warriors Shopping Harrison Barnes For Pick (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/06/warriors-shopping-harrison.html) June 20 at 11:56am CDT By Chuck Myron

The Warriors are dangling Harrison Barnes (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/barneha02.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.hoopsrumors.com) in trade talks as they attempt to trade for a first-round pick in this year’s draft, as Chad Ford of ESPN.com (http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2014/story/_/id/11111803/how-far-joel-embiid-slide-2014-nba-draft?ex_cid=InsiderTwitter_Ford_DraftRumors) reports in an Insider-only piece. It’s unclear whether the conversations extend beyond their negotiations with the Timberwolves toward a Kevin Love (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/loveke01.html?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.hoopsrumors.com) deal, but it appears Warriors GM Bob Myers and company place a high value on acquiring a first-rounder to replace the one they traded to Utah last year. Golden State is without a pick in either round on Thursday.

The Timberwolves are reportedly interested (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/06/kevin-rumors-friday.html) in Barnes, though Wolves coach/executive Flip Saunders made it clear (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/06/nuggets-strong-kevin.html) Thursday that he had no intention of giving up the No. 13 pick in this year’s draft. That would seem to suggest that the Warriors will have to look elsewhere for a 2014 pick, assuming they haven’t already.

Barnes was in trade rumors (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/02/grizzlies-pursuing-harrison.html) leading up to the deadline, even though Warriors co-owner Joe Lacob said he wasn’t anxious (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/02/warriors-jackson-thompson.html) to move the player the team took seventh overall just two years ago. Still, it appeared the club was targeting (http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/03/warriors-rumors-jackson.html) a veteran big man who could provide short-term help in return for Barnes, indicating that either Golden State has doubts about his to fulfill his promise or that the team isn’t keen on waiting for him to do so.

http://www.hoopsrumors.com/

Barnes seems like the type of player that would be a great fit. But, hey I am wrong all the time. :D

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Trading Green is as crazy as trading Splitter. Those guys are playoff tested, proven championship contributors. Starters even. On par or higher than Diaw, Mills.

Worst case scenario, Green won't agree to an extension price. Maybe something like the Spitter deal? So trade him around the deadline, or at least after extension negotiations have broken down.

I still think Beli, Ayers are the most expendable trade assets. Along with the late 2nds. Maybe the Joseph expiring. The bucks and rockets are interesting trade partners. Both have history with the spurs. Bowen, Kurt Thomas, Neal, Anderson, Scola, and Gooden. And most interestingly, picks in the late 1st/early 2nd.

I think Diaw, Mills, Baynes, and Green need be extension priorities. Considering that, spurs need more young/rookie scale on the deep bench. Be it from stashers coming over or drafters being plugged in.

[Baam]

Trading Green is as crazy as trading Splitter. Those guys are playoff tested, proven championship contributors. Starters even. On par or higher than Diaw, Mills.

Worst case scenario, Green won't agree to an extension price. Maybe something like the Spitter deal? So trade him around the deadline, or at least after extension negotiations have broken down.

I still think Beli, Ayers are the most expendable trade assets. Along with the late 2nds. Maybe the Joseph expiring. The bucks and rockets are interesting trade partners. Both have history with the spurs. Bowen, Kurt Thomas, Neal, Anderson, Scola, and Gooden. And most interestingly, picks in the late 1st/early 2nd.

I think Diaw, Mills, Baynes, and Green need be extension priorities. Considering that, spurs need more young/rookie scale on the deep bench. Be it from stashers coming over or drafters being plugged in.

They're expendable all right but they also have negative value...

[Chinook]

Trading Green is as crazy as trading Splitter. Those guys are playoff tested, proven championship contributors. Starters even. On par or higher than Diaw, Mills.

Worst case scenario, Green won't agree to an extension price. Maybe something like the Spitter deal? So trade him around the deadline, or at least after extension negotiations have broken down.

I still think Beli, Ayers are the most expendable trade assets. Along with the late 2nds. Maybe the Joseph expiring. The bucks and rockets are interesting trade partners. Both have history with the spurs. Bowen, Kurt Thomas, Neal, Anderson, Scola, and Gooden. And most interestingly, picks in the late 1st/early 2nd.

I think Diaw, Mills, Baynes, and Green need be extension priorities. Considering that, spurs need more young/rookie scale on the deep bench. Be it from stashers coming over or drafters being plugged in.

Danny can't be extended under the CBA.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

they aren't ancient. and they're champions. the rockets especially, could use them to bring some of that high quality spurs character to a D12 and Harden led squad.

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Danny can't be extended under the CBA.

that's some bad news. maybe a green trade isn't the craziest idea then.

[Mr. Body]

What the fuck is wrong with some of you? Splitter and Green would only be traded for something ridiculous.

[DesignatedT]

Green shouldn't be traded as long as the spurs are true contenders. He's essential in the playoffs.

[Baam]

What the fuck is wrong with some of you? Splitter and Green would only be traded for something ridiculous.
You know what's ridiculous ? Bonner starting a WCF game while Splitter is turned into a cheerleader...

Also ridiculous : a center having negative impact against the weakest team in the league at the 5, talking about Miami of course...

[Mr. Body]

You know what's ridiculous ? Bonner starting a WCF game while Splitter is turned into a cheerleader...

Also ridiculous : a center having negative impact against the weakest team in the league at the 5, talking about Miami of course...

Uh... Eh...

Still don't think you understand basketball very much, much less this team.

[Chinook]

You know what's ridiculous ? Bonner starting a WCF game while Splitter is turned into a cheerleader...

Also ridiculous : a center having negative impact against the weakest team in the league at the 5, talking about Miami of course...

Tiago's block on Lebron was the third-coolest block of the Spurs' post-season.

[ace3g]

Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine
(https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine)Going online now: ESPN sources say Nets and Cavs are discussing Marcus Thornton-for-Jarrett Jack trade

[exstatic]

Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine
(https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine)Going online now: ESPN sources say Nets and Cavs are discussing Marcus Thornton-for-Jarrett Jack trade



Yawn.

[Chinook]

Means Livingston is gone. Brooklyn doesn't have full Bird rights for him, I think. So they can't pay him as much as he's likely to get somewhere else. Marcus Thornton is probably the most overpaid player in the NBA, and that's saying something, since his APY is a third of what Kobe makes.

I don't see it for the Cavs, though. Jack has more value to just a salary dump, especially ones that decrease their 2014 cap space. I was looking to see if they had some player whom they'd append to the deal, but they don't unless they've given up on Bennett and can't find a single taker for him.

[ace3g]

Jake Fischer ‏@JakeLFischer (https://twitter.com/JakeLFischer) 2h (https://twitter.com/JakeLFischer/status/481164320709959681) With Cavaliers trade talk, I'm told Thaddeus Young's name is very much involved. He's preparing for a move, reading all the rumors.

[mystargtr34]

I read Bulls are pitching Gibson, Snell, 16 and 19 picks for Love. Not sure that's enough given GSW offer.. But I would much prefer Love move out East - one, it would make the East somewhat watchable and interesting not to mention more competitive, and two, it would avoid any teams in the already tough West making the jump to contender level.

[mystargtr34]

Sorry I'm being lazy not embedding the source but I'm on the iPhone so cbf tbh :lol..

Utah offering Favors, Burks, pick 5 for Cavs first pick.. Seems like a lot to give up.

[exstatic]

I read Bulls are pitching Gibson, Snell, 16 and 19 picks for Love. Not sure that's enough given GSW offer.. But I would much prefer Love move out East - one, it would make the East somewhat watchable and interesting not to mention more competitive, and two, it would avoid any teams in the already tough West making the jump to contender level.

Those picks aren't even in the lottery. That won't be near enough.

[jesterbobman]

I would rather take that Chicago offer and grab 2(3 with their own pick) of Capela/Anderson/Adams/Payton/Harris than the Lee/Klay/Barnes deal. Lee is an overpaid, net average player, Klay is severely overrated(high usage, PER below 15 is not a good recipe, though RPM moving up to around 0 is a decent sign) and Barnes is terrible. Those guys are going to cost ~$30m in 15/16 when Klay inevitably gets a dumb contract.

It's not a good deal, and I'd reject both, but the GSW offer is a pile of dogshit that looks OK to casual fans because Lee and Klay score a lot. Gibson is better than Lee and 16+19 would be expected to combine for more value than Klay at way less cost.

[Richie]

The question is if Minni would be willing to pay Klay the max. Somebody is going to give it to him, so whoever holds his rights when he hits restricted free agency had better be willing to pay it or he basically holds no value.

[BlackSilver]

Mavericks trade for Tyson Chandler and Raymond Felton from the Knicks.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11135060/dallas-mavericks-talks-acquire-tyson-chandler-raymond-felton-new-york-knicks


The trade cost Dallas two starters -- point guard Jose Calderon (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2806/jose-calderon) and center Samuel Dalembert (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/991/samuel-dalembert) -- along with prized young point guard Shane Larkin (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2596158/shane-larkin), reserve guard Wayne Ellington (http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3981/wayne-ellington) and the 34th and 51st picks in Thursday's draft.

[BlackSilver]

Good pick up for the Mavs, but about 3 Dirk years too late.

[Prime Time]

After seeing the basketball guru that is Rick Carlisle last post-season, Chandler and Felton sound horrifying...

[Andthentherewas21]

Felton looks done, and Chandler's health is questionable at this point. Not saying they can't rebound, but assuming they stick with a Felton, Ellis, Marion, Dirk, Chandler line-up you've only got 2 players who can play D, with a hit to their offense from last season.

[DesignatedT]

Felton sucks

[yavozerb]

There guard situation went from below average to horrible. They now have Harris and Felton as there 2 pg's..good luck with that

[MaNu4Tres]

There guard situation went from below average to horrible. They now have Harris and Felton as there 2 pg's..good luck with that

It will improve w/ Free Agency. (Sessions, Vasquez, Hinrich)

I dont know why Dallas isn't exploring bringing in Lowry + Ariza. With Ellis and Dirk needing touches offensively, I believe those two fit in better than Melo.

[Seventyniner]

If the Mavs get Lowry, they might straight up cut Felton. He does more harm than good in a locker room.

[MI21]

Rockets just traded Asik to the Pelican's for there 2015 first rounder according to Woj on Twitter

[DrunkTXLabrat]

Mavericks trade for Tyson Chandler and Raymond Felton from the Knicks.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11135060/dallas-mavericks-talks-acquire-tyson-chandler-raymond-felton-new-york-knicks

i like this move a lot, for the knicks. I think Calderon is an outright plea for Pau Gasol.

Plus, 34 is darn close to a 1st. And 51 could sweeten any Smith offer.

Then, i think Larkin is quite possibly the best piece. He has major mojo. Now he's playing in the Mecca! That kid might be my new favorite fantasy sleeper. And they did it all by dumping stupid Felton and dodging a Chandler, Amare, Gasol logjam. If there's a bet online about where Gasol lands, my money is NYC.

[Chinook]

Would anyone do a Scola/Solomon Hill(/potential future first) for Beli/Ayres/30 trade?

I think I'd do it if the Pacers added a pick, but I'd be much more on the fence, otherwise. Scola is a good fit for the fourth-big role, and he'd obvious fit in like a dream, chemistry-wise. Solomon Hill is a good SF prospect who is developing three-point range. Hill doesn't get time with the Pacers, though, so he and Scola are pretty much on the outs in Indiana right now. Beli would be a really good wing for them, since he's a scorer, and they can finally and Ayres has experience playing the Finals, and that has to count for something.

If the Spurs did that trade and used their MLE wisely, I think they'd be a better team than they were last year. However, I think signing McRoberts and drafting a good player at 30 would also lead to that result. It just really depends if Hill would be better than anyone the team could draft at 30.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Would anyone do a Scola/Solomon Hill(/potential future first) for Beli/Ayres/30 trade?

I think I'd do it if the Pacers added a pick, but I'd be much more on the fence, otherwise. Scola is a good fit for the fourth-big role, and he'd obvious fit in like a dream, chemistry-wise. Solomon Hill is a good SF prospect who is developing three-point range. Hill doesn't get time with the Pacers, though, so he and Scola are pretty much on the outs in Indiana right now. Beli would be a really good wing for them, since he's a scorer, and they can finally and Ayres has experience playing the Finals, and that has to count for something.

If the Spurs did that trade and used their MLE wisely, I think they'd be a better team than they were last year. However, I think signing McRoberts and drafting a good player at 30 would also lead to that result. It just really depends if Hill would be better than anyone the team could draft at 30.

I'd do this trade instantly for several reasons - first of all I don't expect the Spurs to draft a player with 30, who'd be on the roster next season, and 2nd - I don't expect them to use the full MLE for 3 or 4 years to get a player, e.g. McRoberts ( due to dipping in the 2015, 2016 cap space ), so Scola as a 4th big would be OK. He's almost done, but definitely a better fit than Ayres. Beli could easily be replaced by Mills and thus giving CoJo some minutes to prove whether he could cut it or not, he's at that point already IMO. Then sign a veteran PG for the min who could eventually save CoJo's ass when needed.

Chinook, do you expect the Spurs to throw the full MLE at anyone? Wouldn't they value the capspace more in the next couple of summers?

[Richie]

Would anyone do a Scola/Solomon Hill(/potential future first) for Beli/Ayres/30 trade?

I think I'd do it if the Pacers added a pick, but I'd be much more on the fence, otherwise. Scola is a good fit for the fourth-big role, and he'd obvious fit in like a dream, chemistry-wise. Solomon Hill is a good SF prospect who is developing three-point range. Hill doesn't get time with the Pacers, though, so he and Scola are pretty much on the outs in Indiana right now. Beli would be a really good wing for them, since he's a scorer, and they can finally and Ayres has experience playing the Finals, and that has to count for something.

If the Spurs did that trade and used their MLE wisely, I think they'd be a better team than they were last year. However, I think signing McRoberts and drafting a good player at 30 would also lead to that result. It just really depends if Hill would be better than anyone the team could draft at 30.

I'm not taking this trade. Im convinced there will be at least one all star caliber player falling to us in this draft, we just need to identify him. Of course the draft is a total crapshoot, so even if we don't get the Millsap, Gasol, Dragic quality player that I expect will be there I think the draft is deep enough that we can find a rotation quality player for the future.

I like the Scola fit but if we're bringing back Diaw I don't think we need him enough to risk giving up the #30.

[CGD]

^ trying to pull off yet another heist on the Pacers.

[CGD]

I'm not touching belli until I know what Mills is doing. I'd rather move Cojo to the pacers who are in need of pg help.

Ayers had a crap year last year, yes. But if he sticks around, I think he'll show improvement. Really if he can just improve on pick and roll D it'd be a big.

[xmas1997]

Would anyone do a Scola/Solomon Hill(/potential future first) for Beli/Ayres/30 trade?

I think I'd do it if the Pacers added a pick, but I'd be much more on the fence, otherwise. Scola is a good fit for the fourth-big role, and he'd obvious fit in like a dream, chemistry-wise. Solomon Hill is a good SF prospect who is developing three-point range. Hill doesn't get time with the Pacers, though, so he and Scola are pretty much on the outs in Indiana right now. Beli would be a really good wing for them, since he's a scorer, and they can finally and Ayres has experience playing the Finals, and that has to count for something.

If the Spurs did that trade and used their MLE wisely, I think they'd be a better team than they were last year. However, I think signing McRoberts and drafting a good player at 30 would also lead to that result. It just really depends if Hill would be better than anyone the team could draft at 30.

It is intriguing, but I resist simply because it usually takes a year for a new player to the Spurs to become fully acquainted and familiar with the Spurs system. Beli in particular did reasonably well this year despite that and should improve greatly because of his high BB IQ. The same could be said for Ayers to a lessor extent and they are both younger. Scola is getting up there in age.

[Emperor]

Scola would only be worth it if taking over Ayers spot. He'd definitely be an upgrade even at his current age.

[elemento]

Personally, I would love to have Scola as SAS 4th BIG, but I would wait because there's a decent chance that Indy waives Scola. He is only 940k guaranteed.

Dream scenario would be : keeping Beli, signing Scola and still having the MLE to bring another piece or two.

[xmas1997]

I wouldn't mind Scola either especially with Manu still here, but not in a trade.

[Mr. Body]

Scola is practically done, but Ayres ain't shit. (Sorry, Ayres.) I wouldn't mind Scola at the end of the bench. Who knows, he could turn a game or two.

[DesignatedT]

I don't know how smart trading Beli would be. Sure he under-performed in the playoffs but with Manu playing international ball he's going to be counted upon to play heavy minutes next year. He played fantastic all season long this year. I would prefer to keep him with Manu about to turn 37.

[xmas1997]

Plus Beli will be in his second season with corporate knowledge this time.

[Baam]

I don't know how smart trading Beli would be. Sure he under-performed in the playoffs but with Manu playing international ball he's going to be counted upon to play heavy minutes next year. He played fantastic all season long this year. I would prefer to keep him with Manu about to turn 37.

Not sure what you watched but he has been bad since the all star break and had shitty advanced stats all season tbh...

[DesignatedT]

Not sure what you watched but he has been bad since the all star break and had shitty advanced stats all season tbh...

He had a great season off the bench. Teams started to pay more attention to him after the 3 pt contest but all in all he put together a solid season with solid numbers (49% from field, 43% from three)

For comparison Manu shot 47% from the field and 37% from three during the year.

I know Beli is nothing but a glorified regular season player but that's important for the Spurs. Especially with Manu playing international ball. Marco is going to be needed next year and him having a year in the system should help.

The Spurs plan next year is going to be "pile up as many wins while barely playing Manu and Duncan". Marco helps them do this.

[Mr. Body]

The Spurs plan next year is going to be "pile up as many wins while barely playing Manu and Duncan". Marco helps them do this.

Agree. They can put Ginobili on ice for 62 games and I'd be happy. Belinelli's really important here.

[Baam]

If nothing else I hope they dump Beli in some random deal now...

[DrunkTXLabrat]

i'm still holding out hope for a Bogdan trade. I think Beli, 58, and 60 shoulda been near value. Now, maybe Beli and a distant future 2nd. Future 2nds could be high value. Sell them on the "Duncan, Manu will be gone so we'll suck" possum strategy.

[Mr. Body]

i'm still holding out hope for a Bogdan trade. I think Beli, 58, and 60 shoulda been near value. Now, maybe Beli and a distant future 2nd. Future 2nds could be high value. Sell them on the "Duncan, Manu will be gone so we'll suck" possum strategy.

Belinelli is worth about 100 Bodgans.

[Baam]

Just for crackpot theories purposes, Capela can still be traded until the July 1st or did I get it wrong?

[Chinook]

Just for crackpot theories purposes, Capela can still be traded until the July 1st or did I get it wrong?

Yeah. He can also be traded in principle between July 1 and 10. There's a good chance of that happening.

[Raven]

if we could trade beli for a kick in the butt, that would be awesome

[ace3g]

Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine
(https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine)ESPN has learned that Toronto Raptors are in advanced trade discussions to deal John Salmons to Atlanta for Lou Williams. Story going online


Adrian Wojnarowski @WojYahooNBA
(https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA)Toronto has traded John Salmons to Atlanta for Lou Williams and Bebe Nugiera, source tells Yahoo.

[Chinook]

Great deal by the Raps, but a puzzling one for the Hawks. They don't need cap space. I don't see why they'd give up a prospect and a decent scorer to get it.

[elemento]

Bebe was very immature and cocky when was young. Maybe that hasn't changed.

Hawks are definitely selling him low here. They give up a young Center, former 1st round pick to save what ? 4m ?

[TD 21]

The Raptors have lacked an off the bench scorer for a while. If the Raptors can get Lowry re-signed, then Vasquez remains the backup PG and forms an ideal partnership off the bench with Williams, since Williams can defend PG's for Vasquez and Vasquez can allow Williams to play off the ball.

They also lack rim protection off the bench, which will remain a problem in the interim, as Noguiera may not yet come over and even if he does, isn't ready to be a rotation player, particularly for a playoff team. But long term, if he pans out, he'd be a nice fit next to Patterson.

I don't get it for the Hawks. I guess they deemed Noguiera expendable with Tavares in the pipeline, but James and/or Anthony and Bosh, are all pipe dreams and they already had enough for anyone in the next tier.

[elemento]

Maybe the Hawks just wanted to create cap space to target someone in the FA. Hayward or Parsons make sense.

[TD 21]

Maybe, but they're also a pipe dream. There's really no logical explanation for this.

Williams didn't look the same last season, but before his knee injury, he was an elite sixth man and it was year one coming off the injury, plus he's obviously heavily reliant on speed/quickness. Chances are, he bounces back at least somewhat, but if he doesn't, he's off the books next season anyway.

Him alone probably should have been enough for Salmons' contract, or maybe him and a 2nd. Not a 16th pick from a year ago, even if it was a terrible draft and he is a project.