General Trades Discussion

[DesignatedT]

:lol mo

[ace3g]

WojYahooNBA

Heat and Thunder are seriously discussing a trade sending Daequan Cook and 18th pick to OKC for 32nd, source says. More cap space for Heat.

[jesterbobman]

Just a thought compised of Several rumours:
Rumour of Minn-Memphis Al for Z-Bo trade. Apparently Minn offered Al to Indy for troy Murphy(Both Zach and Murphy are in last year of their deals).
If Indy rejected that deal, but would accept a TP for Murphy, Rush 10 deal, Could we combine the deals?(Parker to Indy, Murphy to Minnesota, Jefferson, 10, Rush to SA).
Would people be more open to that deal than the Murphy package?

Again, just a hypothetical combo of rumours, not suggesting it's on the table.

[RiverwalkParade]

why not send the d-leaguers and the 49th to Miami for the same package? They can waive the non-guaranteed contracts (keep someone if they want), fall out of the first and make a draft and stash pick at 49.

We get the 18th and 20th then move Hill and the 20th to Indiana for the 10th and Rush

Draft Paul George at 10

Trade the 18th and a future 1st to Memphis for their 25th and 28th picks and take Brackins and Pliess

PG: Parker
SG: Manu, Cook
SF: RJ, George, Rush
PF: Duncan, Blair, Brackins
C: Splitter, McDyess

Fill in back up PG with the LLE

It could happen.

[ace3g]

WojYahooNBA

The Heat has agreed in principle to trade Daequan Cook and 18th pick in Thursday's draft to Thunder for 32nd pick, a league source tells Y!

[ace3g]

WojYahooNBA

Y! Sources: Heat, Thunder agree to trade http://tinyurl.com/38azwdx

[DPG21920]

Spurs, WTF? That is a super cheap way to move up and nothing?

[TimmehC]

Spurs, WTF? That is a super cheap way to move up and nothing?

Salary dump on Miami's part - because it was done before July 1st, it lowers their team salary and lux tax payment for 2009-10. Spurs would have had to return something to make it work, but OKC is under the cap and can simply absorb Cook's salary.

[RiverwalkParade]

think Presti will do us a solid ala the Barry with KT trade?

[mountainballer]

that's a damn steal by Presti. they can even use Cook and his shooting.

[ace3g]

chadfordinsider

Trade Chatter (free): Chris Paul staying put; Favors back in favor in NJ; Raptors-Blazers talking trade more ... http://es.pn/bZWzwX

[ace3g]

WojYahooNBA

Thunder holding serious talks with Pacers to trade Eric Maynor, 18th and 21st picks for Indy's 10th pick, sources tell Y!

[ace3g]

chadfordinsider

Per ESPN's Chris Broussard: Clipps-Bulls talking Deng trade. Would be huge for Bulls' chances to land 'Bron http://es.pn/9daLMA

[TD 21]

If I were the Pacers, I'd do that deal. They need to accumulate as many quality assets as they can. Unlike a lot of other terrible teams, who have a cadre of young, quality assets, the Pacers don't. Their young core currently consists of un-athletic, low ceiling players, such as Hibbert, Rush (he's a decent athlete) and Hansbrough.

They also need star power, but they're not going to get that at ten. Their only hope would be to draft George, play him primarily at SG (because their only star caliber player plays SF) and hope he maxes out on his potential or comes close to it.

Short of that, they're getting a role player at ten. They can get two lesser role players at eighteen and twenty-one and a decent, young backup point guard.

[ace3g]

daldridgetnt

Blazers talking with several teams about Rudy Fernandez: Toronto, Houston, Chicago, Miami, Washington...http://bit.ly/bEipn2

[TD 21]

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/category/_/name/draft-reports

NEW YORK – Boston is considering two offers for its No. 19 pick, one from Memphis and one from New Jersey, a source with knowledge of the selection told ESPN.com Wednesday night.

The Celtics are mulling over an offer from Memphis for the Grizzlies No. 25 and 28 picks while the Nets are looking at shipping the No. 27 pick in the first round and No. 31 in the second round to the Celtics for No. 19.

A source close to the Celtics said earlier Wednesday that general manager Danny Ainge was looking to move No. 19 because he wasn’t enamored with the possible selections at that position.

Meanwhile, the Minnesota Timberwolves are also continuing to talk to Memphis about sending the No. 16 pick for the No. 25 and 28 selections. A source with knowledge of the T-Wolves draft process told ESPN.com that they would keep the No. 4 selection and choose either Syracuse’s Wesley Johnson if he were available or Georgia Tech’s Derrick Favors if the New Jersey Nets select Johnson at No. 3. The Timberwolves, who have the most picks in the draft with five, are looking to move at least one or two of the picks and are listening to multiple deals. One deal that multiple sources said won’t happen is shipping Al Jefferson to Memphis for Zach Randolph. Jefferson is on the trade block, but his camp has been assured that he wouldn’t go to Memphis. Jefferson’s camp, according to sources, is hoping he lands with a playoff team or one that is getting closer.



Unless the Spurs specifically want Williams and fear that the Trail Blazers will take him at 22 (watch them end up moving in front of the Spurs) if they don't take him at 20, the Spurs should offer 20 to the loser of the Celtics pick. If it's the Grizzlies, it's 25 and 28; if it's the Nets, it's 27 and 31.

At this range in the draft (20-30), the players are mostly comparable. It comes down to preference. So basically, the Spurs could get a similar player later in the 20s to the one they could get at 20 and then pick up a second player. Using my example from yesterday, they could potentially net Williams and Brackins. Assuming Splitter is signed, that would complete the back court and big situation and give them good depth of young players going forward.

[Duncan21kid]

http://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/16879900726


NBA source: There's a firesale in Golden State & everyone's available except Curry. Owner trying to make team more attractive for new buyer.

Warriors having a firesale ...

Could the spurs pickup Anthony Morrow by any chance ?

[tdunk21]

future 2nd and cash for micheal beasley?anyone?miami is just about so desperate to dump his contract....maybe he will improve under pop

[EricD]

Trade R.J for Gay

Trade Parker for Lee

= Championship...

Check out what the guy from ESPN said..not me..

Why hasn't anyone thought of this?

[Stump]

future 2nd and cash for micheal beasley?anyone?miami is just about so desperate to dump his contract....maybe he will improve under pop
We can't trade for Beasley without sending a contract back.


Trade R.J for Gay

Trade Parker for Lee

= Championship...

Check out what the guy from ESPN said..not me..

Why hasn't anyone thought of this?
Jefferson can probably only be traded to teams trying to get rid of long contracts, and Gay is a currently a free agent. There is no reason for Memphis to make that trade. Parker is better than Lee and fills a bigger need.

Don't listen to guys on ESPN. They're usually idiots.

[venitian navigator]

anyone think the rockets could be interested in a :

Battier/Jeffries + Ariza for RJ (plus, in case, Hairston or Gee) ?

Given their actual game style, all about up tempo with Brooks pg and Martin g, Jefferson could be their ideal kind of a small forward...(and likely to be re-signed at a smaller price).
On the opposite side, Ariza didn't play too well for them, just trying to do too much while he's more an athletic defender and good three point shooter (and I think that with Budinger they are already well equipped with that), and Jeffries is an expiring next year while Battier is already 32 years old.

For us, Ariza should fit very well in our system, and is the athletic three (defender, three point shooter) that the doctor ordered, Jeffries and Battier are both good defenders (long three) and have a good baskettball IQ.

Imho the trade could be beneficial for both teams...

[Mel_13]

anyone think the rockets could be interested in a :

Battier/Jeffries + Ariza for RJ (plus, in case, Hairston or Gee) ?

Given their actual game style, all about up tempo with Brooks pg and Martin g, Jefferson could be their ideal kind of a small forward...(and likely to be re-signed at a smaller price).
On the opposite side, Ariza didn't play too well for them, just trying to do too much while he's more an athletic defender and good three point shooter (and I think that with Budinger they are already well equipped with that), and Jeffries is an expiring next year while Battier is already 32 years old.

For us, Ariza should fit very well in our system, and is the athletic three (defender, three point shooter) that the doctor ordered, Jeffries and Battier are both good defenders (long three) and have a good baskettball IQ.

Imho the trade could be beneficial for both teams...

I don't know how Houston regards Ariza as a long-term fit, but a trade structured like this is what I would expect from any RJ trade. I can't see the Spurs rolling RJ's contract for a huge contract like Iguodala's. A trade like this for a smaller long-term contract plus an expiring contract seems much more likely.



Jeffries and Battier are both good defenders (long three) and have a good baskettball IQ.

Battier is a good defender with a high BBIQ.

Jeffries is a 6.8M expiring contract who is often regarded as a good defender only because his offense is so terrible that people assume there must be some reason he gets paid so much.

[Bruno]

anyone think the rockets could be interested in a :

Battier/Jeffries + Ariza for RJ (plus, in case, Hairston or Gee) ?


It's a trade I've suggested weeks ago so i like it and I think there is a chance Rockets do it.
To make the trade fair, the filler should be Jeffries and not Battier

[Bruno]

So I had the chance to fill in on some of the gaps in the draft, and apperently the Hawks believe that Pape Sy is a great talent that no one will see coming.

Anyone know anything on this guy? All my Hawks source told me was that he tore up Grivis Vasques in workouts.

Even if Pape Sy is French and plays in French league, everybody in France is surprised the he is drafted. He did nothing special with his team and wasn't selected for youth NT.

[Blackjack]

It's a trade I've suggested weeks ago so i like it and I think there is a chance Rockets do it.
To make the trade fair, the filler should be Jeffries and not Battier

You really think the Rockets would do that, Bruno?

That'd be a phenomenal trade for the Spurs. It's something that could be the final piece to the puzzle if Tiago comes over and plays the way he's capable . . .

[DPG21920]

I just don't see why Houston does that because Ariza's contract is very good. If you think you can build a contender, you will need a piece like Ariza on a reasonable contract. Houston unfairly put Ariza in a bad role last year because they lost T-Mac & Yao. Next year, Ariza should be in his actual role.


Now, if he fails next year, then they might be open to it, but I think they give it at least 1 more year minimum. Not to mention, it is Houston & the Spurs doing business.

I know they did the Scola trade, but that was a little different imo.

[Blackjack]

That's what I was getting at. Ariza'a got roughly $27M left on his contract over the next four years (if he picks up the final year player-option), which is a reasonable contract for a 25-year-old player of his ability.

So to exchange two expirings (RJ and Jefferies) in order to get of the hook from that contract doesn't seem all that prudent -- Unless their intention is to be a real player in next year's free-agent class and they're very optimistic about landing someone, I just don't see how this is something I would do if I were in the Rockets shoes.

But if they're willing, I ain't gonna complain. :D

[DPG21920]

Oh yeah, no doubt. I would cry tears of joy if the Spurs did that trade. It would be the most perfect situation in an RJ trade. I want the Spurs to move RJ no matter what, I don't really care what they get back, but if they could land Ariza, I would be thrilled.

[Blackjack]

There'd be a lot of pink elephants up in this mug . . .

[Bruno]

You really think the Rockets would do that, Bruno?

That'd be a phenomenal trade for the Spurs. It's something that could be the final piece to the puzzle if Tiago comes over and plays the way he's capable . . .

It depends on how the value Ariza who has had a bad year in Rockets. I'm not sure they still want him.

[Blackjack]

They do owe the Spurs a solid after Scola. :smokin

[TD 21]

Can't see the Rockets doing that. Ariza is a nice compliment to Martin on the wings.

One trade they might consider is Jefferson for Battier, Jeffries and Anderson. The Spurs would actually add about $1.4 million in payroll, so they could send back either Temple or Gee or have the Rockets pay the difference.

Problem is, they're all expiring contracts. Anderson has a player option for next season, but there's, at minimum, a realistic chance that the Spurs would decline it and the Rockets almost certainly will.

So, what's the incentive for the Rockets to make this trade? It's not financial and they've always been very fond of Battier, which leaves probably one scenario where this is feasible: Martin, who's injury prone, goes down with a long term injury, Ariza, Budinger and Taylor can't fill the void offensively on the wings and in a desperate attempt to avoid missing the playoffs again, after first looking around for a better player, they grudgingly accept this offer.

[TD 21]

Bucher reports that the Bulls "can and will" trade Johnson, while the Chicago Tribune reports that the Bulls failed in their attempt to move Johnson at the draft. His salary brakes down as follows: $1,713,600 in 10-11, $1,833,120 11-12, $2,812,006 in 12-13 and $3,950,868 in 13-14. 11-12 and 12-13 are team options and 13-14 is his qualifying offer.

Temple, Gee and Jerrells all make $762,195 in 10-11, but, as we know, they're all on non-guaranteed contracts. So the Spurs could offer, say, Gee, Jerrells and a future 2nd round pick to the Bulls for Johnson and potentially pry away a future 1st round pick in the process (can't be in '11 because the Bulls just dealt their '10 1st round pick).

Like the Heat (as evidenced by the Cook and and a 1st round pick for a 2nd round pick trade), the Bulls are desperate to clear as much space as possible and doing this would (I'm not 100%, but fairly certain) allow them to offer two max contracts. They might just be desperate enough to sacrifice a future 1st round pick (it would almost certainly have provisions, but still), in addition to a decent prospect.

Speaking of said prospect, Johnson wouldn't be a bad fit. He's not a stretch four or a stopper, but he is a combo forward and he can score inside-and-out. He could fill the big three/fifth big role and add to the Spurs ever growing stable of quality prospects. In the event they didn't like what they saw from him next season or deemed him too expensive, they could decline his option for the following season.

[Biggems]

Jefferson/Gee for Ariza/Jeffries...we then buy out Jeffries.

We also sign UDFAs Mac Koshwal, Mikhail Torrance, and Marqus Blakely.

We re-sign Ian and Temple. We bring Splitter over.

C - Splitter, Ian, McDyess/Richards
PF - Duncan, Blair, Koshwal
SF - Ariza, Hairston, Blakely
SG - Manu, Anderson, Torrance
PG - Parker, Hill, Temple

aside from the Big 3, we would see tons of youth.

[kobyz]

anyone think the rockets could be interested in a :

Battier/Jeffries + Ariza for RJ (plus, in case, Hairston or Gee)

i would love this trade to happen, i even will throw a 2011 first round pick if it necessary, i doubt Rockets do it tho, i think they high on Ariza.

[mountainballer]

It depends on how the value Ariza who has had a bad year in Rockets. I'm not sure they still want him.

I think it's totally impossible to predict which direction the Rockets go, the only save bet IMO is, that they will do a lot of dealing this summer.
first question will be, does Yao opt out. if yes and if they don't want to max out him for years, they will try to push the already started youth path and probably even don't re sign Scola (who will get MLE offers around the league).
remember, they traded for Jordan Hill last deadline and now drafted Patterson. in case of the youth thing they will keep Ariza IMO (who will turn just 25 this week), but they might try to trade Battier.
can't see a trade the Rockets would want though.
(outside the obvious trade for the Splitter rights)

EDIT: totally ignored the impact of a Yao opt out. Rockets would have about 10 million in cap space. (considering cap holds for roster and picks). not enough th become a player in the free agency. they will try to increase this cap space by trading for unguaranteed contracts and/or TEs.
Spurs could assemble something with their gray contracts.

[RiverwalkParade]

It's being reported that the Bucks are looking for veteran help. Would they take on a guy like McDyess.

Was think of a trade like this:

Dice, Hairston, Temple, Jerrels (looks like they could use another ball handler, perhaps a Summer League try-out considering they are non-guaranteed contracts)

For

Delfino, Mbah a Moute, and the rights to Tiny Gallon

[tp2021]

So if the Spurs do a S&T with RJ to a team like the Nets, and get a TE in return, who could the Spurs possibly target with the trade exception?

[kobyz]

we could gamble on Mike Beasley for the SF position, he still has big potential and Miami will give him for cheap.

[marcflynn2009]

There has been no report of this but it could totally work...

Parker has already showed that he does not want to be a part of the spurs after the season. He is tired of our trade talks.

That means we will have a lot of money from him. And a lot of money from jefferson's contract. We will be able to afford him

He would be interested in us because of money, championship potential, and because we are one of the best organizations in all of sports.

And nuggets are going down hill.... Billups won't have a lot of quality years left. Karl will probably be gone... and this years free agency frenzy has been crazy and has put big name players under the spot light... he will want that and he will want to see his options

Our main threat or competitor would be the knicks

[RiverwalkParade]

Kapono is on the block

McDyess plus any Hairston/Gee/Temple/Jerrels would work out in that trade.

Would give us a proven shooter at the 3 spot. Any interest?

[coyotes_geek]

Kapono is on the block

McDyess plus any Hairston/Gee/Temple/Jerrels would work out in that trade.

Would give us a proven shooter at the 3 spot. Any interest?

Not from Philly.

[TDMVPDPOY]

james johnson from the bulls is on the board, bulls thinkn of trading him...

[mountainballer]

seems as if Denver is getting closer to finally blow the whole team.



http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=At5q4_F7Aq8m7B6QJmp1tb05nYcB?slug=aw-anthonynuggets082610
Denver is willing to trade Anthony, J.R. Smith(notes) and Kenyon Martin(notes), and start over again, sources said.

if the Nuggets in fact start a fire sale this summer, it could bring back some movement to this meanwhile lame duck off season.
not sure how this could also affect the Spurs, but it would of course be nice to get into some deals, if some 3 or 4 team blockbusters are worked out.
I'm sure they will need a pretty big scenario around Melo. Nuggets currently pay a boatload of tax, immediately dumping salary in the process will be a priority. (will be even more complicated, if Melo gets his 3years/65 million before the trade). only Nets might be able to offer a straight salary dump scenario.
but if a team like Houston wants Melo (reportedly Melo likes this option), they will need to involve other teams. (best candidate will be Bobcats and their Dampier contract).

would be nice, if the Spurs could sneak into such a blockbuster. (other teams might have better assets though). especially a Houston scenario could produce some nice spin offs. (Battier?)

[Bruno]

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/21203/bulls-hold-off-signing-third-pg



Sources close to the situation told ESPN.com that a trade sending James Johnson to Charlotte has emerged one option, but it remains to be seen if such talks get serious … or if Johnson remains as available as he was in the offseason after seizing a rotation spot under new coach Tom Thibodeau.

Gee + Temple for Johnson :stirpot:

Spurs could add a little something like second round picks or the rights to De Colo.

[venitian navigator]

I don't know if we're already over the lux tax limit or not...and if we're not for how much.
I thought about that 'cause, imho, if we can still sign one/two players at the minimum without exceeding the lux tax, we should do it now that some intersting names looks to be available in the posistions we stil need...
Two names that comes to my mind are Williams (recently cut by Cavs; he played in some of our summer leagues and i think we were interested in him this season) and Barron (recently cut by Phoenix after the Gortat trade; maybe not the smartest of players but with good phisical skills in a role we need...good for 7/8 minutes more of resting for our old bigs).

[Darkwaters]

I don't know if we're already over the lux tax limit or not...and if we're not for how much.
I thought about that 'cause, imho, if we can still sign one/two players at the minimum without exceeding the lux tax, we should do it now that some intersting names looks to be available in the posistions we stil need...
Two names that comes to my mind are Williams (recently cut by Cavs; he played in some of our summer leagues and i think we were interested in him this season) and Barron (recently cut by Phoenix after the Gortat trade; maybe not the smartest of players but with good phisical skills in a role we need...good for 7/8 minutes more of resting for our old bigs).

Speaking of Earl Barron....I found this absolutely awesome article regarding him.

Wed Dec 22 11:00am EST
Earl Barron responds to his banishment from Phoenix

By Eric Freeman

Dearest Sister Candace,

It has now been seven winters since I left our home at Clarksdale Hall and ventured to the Colonies to reclaim our family's fortune following father's unfortunate accident on a pheasant hunt. Blessed with tall stature and broad shoulders, I sought out a career in hooped sport to bring honor back to our family's name and perhaps earn our scions a spot for the next form at Eton. It has been an arduous road, taking me all across this infernal nation of louts and traitors to the monarchy.

Verily, you have heard the news by now by way of Mr. Morse's code-- the moneylender Mr. Sarver has released me from my contract with the Suns of Phoenix in order to clear the way for a foreigner called "Marcin Gortat" and one Vincent Carter, rumored to be a half-man, half-monster figure on the order of the protagonist in R.L. Stevenson's masterly Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde. (I hope you have had a chance to read this volume in your studies. Do not waver -- Mistress Haversham is a stern but learned woman.) Gortat is to pair with Don Robin Lopez(notes) to create what they tell me is a most imposing duo.

I fear the writing was on the wall as to my dismissal. Mr. Gortat and Mr. Carter were acquired only by letting go of my good friend the Earl Clark(notes), another nobleman of strong stock who was consigned to the oaken bench in favor of lesser souls. By all accounts, Mr. Sarver has fallen victim to the new populist movement sweeping this country's farmers, no doubt spurred along by the local prefect Lord McCain. I fear there is no room for our kind in this land, though my friends inform me that the latest tax reduction suggests otherwise.

I know not what my next step shall be. Yesterday eve, I supped with my appointed barrister Mr. Derrick Powell, Esq. at an establishment of the restaurateur Mr. Denny. (I requested the "Grand Slam," thinking it fit for a man of my pedigree, but it was queerly damp and tasted of saddle soap.) Mr. Powell has informed me that my options are sadly limited, but good fortune may smile upon me yet. Men of the centered position are often liable to injure their femurs and patella ligaments, and another club may seek my services before long. (Hast thou seen Dr. Woolsley recently? How I long for a good bloodletting. Visiting the physician in this country often requires consultation with an anatomy textbook simply to understand their diagnoses.)

You may wish to sit down to read the following news so as to not catch the dreaded vapors. Mr. Powell informs me that should a basketballing troupe not inquire after my services over the next fortnight, I may have to return to the League of Development, that lowly repository for street urchins and beggars. How I fear a return to those lackluster carriage rides and frigid changing rooms. Yet I must remind myself it is all for the good of our family crest and all for which it stands.

Do not worry after me. In spite of these misgivings, I remain committed as ever to my task. I know in the depths of my heart that all our futures and the names of our forebears depend on it. Anon, I will stand at the throne of this profession, and we will be reunited at Clarksdale Hall, our bellies plump from a feast of roast goose and elderberry wine.

Until then, I shall think wistfully of home and grasp at any piece of information that comes my way. Are the reports true that our fair Prince William has claimed himself an angelic princess? Do not fret, young swan -- soon you will find a suitable husband. With any luck, my victories in America shall provide a sizable dowry.

Please give my best to our loving Mother Jeraldean, feed my hound Tristan his favorite treat, and verify that Billingsley has not let the stables fall into disorder in my absence.

Like the namesake of my last employer's township, I shall rise from the ashes to best all challenges set before me.

Your Humble Servant,

The Earl Barron

[Bito Corleone]

Knicks getting ready to waive Mason, whats the chance he comes back to SA now that he is healthy for playoff run. I cant see Pop trusting Niel and Anderson come playoff time.

Was his health ever the problem?

[admiralsnackbar]

Knicks getting ready to waive Mason, whats the chance he comes back to SA now that he is healthy for playoff run. I cant see Pop trusting Niel and Anderson come playoff time.
Good one.

[senorglory]

Knicks getting ready to waive Mason, whats the chance he comes back to SA now that he is healthy for playoff run. I cant see Pop trusting Niel and Anderson come playoff time.

Anthony Mason? I thought he retired.
http://grownandsexynyc.com/gossip/wp-content/uploads/image0015.jpg

[vander]

Howard going to bolt in 2012 right? Orlando going to want to get something for him before he bolts right? like maybe getting out of Arenas's contract?

RJ + TD* + 3 first round draft picks for Arenas + Howard?

*agreement that they buy out TD and we bring him back

:downspin:



edit: or 5 first rounders, OR 7! WHATEVER IT TAKES!! GIVE THEM MANU!!

[Chomag]

What about Roy Hibbert? I know he wasn't before but I noticed that he was only playing a bit over 20 minutes a game in the playoffs. Has he fallen out of favor for the Pacers, if so maybe he might be obtainable now?

[yavozerb]

One player I have always liked is Andris Biedrins..He currently has 2 yrs guranteed left on his contract for a total of 18mil and a 3rd season with team option also for 9 mil. His play has steadily gotten worse over the past 3 seasons and his free throw shooting is the worst in the NBA. With all that said the guy is still 25 years old, great size, good defender, and good rebounder. Not sure with all the labor issues going on if mcdyess contract is still tradable with him set to retire..

[yavozerb]

What about Roy Hibbert? I know he wasn't before but I noticed that he was only playing a bit over 20 minutes a game in the playoffs. Has he fallen out of favor for the Pacers, if so maybe he might be obtainable now?

I like Roy alot, but with a cheap contract and still pretty young these kind of players are really hard to come by with trades..Indiana has no incentive to trade him since he does hurt them salary wise.

[yavozerb]

Can a team trade for player if they are below the salary cap without giving equal salary compensation? An example of this would be minnesota trading the spurs there 1st rd pick along with the rights to Rubio for TP. With the Wolves cap numbers looking like they would be at around 43 mil., they do not have to match salaries, correct? Just wondering

[Chieflion]

Can a team trade for player if they are below the salary cap without giving equal salary compensation? An example of this would be minnesota trading the spurs there 1st rd pick along with the rights to Rubio for TP. With the Wolves cap numbers looking like they would be at around 43 mil., they do not have to match salaries, correct? Just wondering

This is correct. The Spurs can deal Parker for Rubio's rights if the Wolves have the cap space to absorb a player's contract, in this case, Tony Parker, and still remain under the cap. This, just being an example though as the Wolves have no incentive to trade away Rubio's rights + their 1st round pick for Tony Parker who don't fit into their schemes. The Spurs would also receive a trade exception worth Tony Parker's salary for that year for the next 12 months to be used as a trade asset.

[yavozerb]

This is correct. The Spurs can deal Parker for Rubio's rights if the Wolves have the cap space to absorb a player's contract, in this case, Tony Parker, and still remain under the cap. This, just being an example though as the Wolves have no incentive to trade away Rubio's rights + their 1st round pick for Tony Parker who don't fit into their schemes. The Spurs would also receive a trade exception worth Tony Parker's salary for that year for the next 12 months to be used as a trade asset.

Thanks...I only mentioned the wolves cause they should be feeling some pressure to put together a winning team ASAP to give some kind of reasoning for Love to resign next season.

[TDMVPDPOY]

wtf u wanna trade for that clown rubio who wants to play for a contender or get paid?

[elemento]

i don't want Rubio

This boy is the most overrated international player ever !

[yavozerb]

wtf u wanna trade for that clown rubio who wants to play for a contender or get paid?


i don't want Rubio

This boy is the most overrated international player ever !

:lol, easy..Was just using that as example...However, if Rubio was accompanied by the 1st rd pick say derrick williams and a big trade exemption then .......

[venitian navigator]

A trade I'd like to try is the following.
Considering Dice is going to retire, but in case could play justt in another team with nba title ambitions.
Considering it's a long time we desired a long three with defensive abilities and they took him away from us (Brewer)
Considering we developed Mahinmi for some years, sop he knows our system, and he showed also in Dallas flashes of being a potential decent big (He didn't play more 'cause Haywood and Chandler are superior in experience and till now still better players)
Considering we're trying to rejouvanete our team and the best way to do that is by young players at a decent price
Considering Dallas has already to re-sign two of his actual long three that have more value than Brewer (I mean Stojakovic, that's playing very well for them, and Butler);
Considering they're gonna re-sign at a more than decent price their actual bestt fit at center (Chandler)
Considering that with the folowing trade, at worst, they're gonna cut Dice paying just a little amount of his contract


well.....all this considered, a trade Brewer+Mahinmi+ something more (draft choices) for Dice contract could be a good thing for both teams...

[admiralsnackbar]

Why would Dallas trade Brewer? He's been an outstanding addition for them. As for Mahinmi... that ship has sunk, folks.

[justinandimcool]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/213564/Report_Sixers_Will_Look_To_Trade_Iguodala

Iguodala on the market. One of the best defenders in the league.

[elemento]

Yeah too bad we are paying 30M to Dick Jefferson

[Bruno]

Spurs best offer for Iguodala should be RJ+Blair+Dice+1st.
The first round pick could the 2012 first round pick because it has more value than the 29th pick of 2011.

Sadly, I don't think it will be enough.

[jesterbobman]

I doubt we have enough also. The best chance we have is offering cap relief and players, because Indy could trump our offer by just taking in Iggy to their cap space, Giving the 76ers a giant ass trade exception at the same time.

[yavozerb]

Spurs best offer for Iguodala should be RJ+Blair+Dice+1st.
The first round pick could the 2012 first round pick because it has more value than the 29th pick of 2011.

Sadly, I don't think it will be enough.

ya think...

[outmap]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3jggt6y

[Bruno]

And even if 76ers agrees with that kind of deal, I'm not sure Spurs should do it.

Spurs biggest need is to improve their PF and C spots. If you spent all your money and trade assets on a SF, the team still has a big hole inside.

[TJastal]

Parker / Bonner / McDyess exception

for

Gasol / Blake

[venitian navigator]

Nocioni + Iguodala for Bonner, Jefferson, Dice expiring works.
Good for Sixers 'cause, cutting Dice, they spare more than 6 millions bucks and they get rid of Nocioni (that's the other contract they don't want).
In case, maybe we could add Blair...
The only way to fix our needing for a legitimate big, IMHO, is via playing Splitter, developing Richards and acquiring a veteran with the exceptions (Foster, Arthur, Chandler...).

[Chieflion]

Nocioni + Iguodala for Bonner, Jefferson, Dice expiring works.
Good for Sixers 'cause, cutting Dice, they spare more than 6 millions bucks and they get rid of Nocioni (that's the other contract they don't want).
In case, maybe we could add Blair...
The only way to fix our needing for a legitimate big, IMHO, is via playing Splitter, developing Richards and acquiring a veteran with the exceptions (Foster, Arthur, Chandler...).

Uh no. Trading trash for treasure is not fair. 76ers will not trade their best player for crap.

[mountainballer]

just posted it on the other thread.
Tony for Odom, with the lakers adding some teaser, however this trade is designed. (teaser could be they take Bonner as well and they send us Brown and Ebanks)
this would allow the Spurs to become a player in the 2012 free agency. doesn't solve all problems and would produce some holes, but it gives us a starter quality big, who still has likely two good years and can play 30+ minutes. Tim and Tiago share the Center minutes, Odom and Blair the PF. Odom should fit well alongside either Tim or Tiago.

[TJastal]

just posted it on the other thread.
Tony for Odom, with the lakers adding some teaser, however this trade is designed. (teaser could be they take Bonner as well and they send us Brown and Ebanks)
this would allow the Spurs to become a player in the 2012 free agency. doesn't solve all problems and would produce some holes, but it gives us a starter quality big, who still has likely two good years and can play 30+ minutes. Tim and Tiago share the Center minutes, Odom and Blair the PF. Odom should fit well alongside either Tim or Tiago.

Odom is a cheap shotting crybaby jackass who would loaf around and probably get Pop angry enough to put him in the doghouse.

I'd much prefer to have the better passing big in Gasol. I think we'd see a revitilization of Gasol's career playing as the #1 banana again. Gasol and his passing would fit seamlessly into the team whereas Odom's selfish idiocy would be a terrible fit.

[mountainballer]

Odom is a cheap shotting crybaby jackass who would loaf around and probably get Pop angry enough to put him in the doghouse.

I'd much prefer to have the better passing big in Gasol. I think we'd see a revitilization of Gasol's career playing as the #1 banana again. Gasol and his passing would fit seamlessly into the team whereas Odom's selfish idiocy would be a terrible fit.

Gasol makes 18.7 M next season, Odom makes 8.9.
Gasol has 57 million guaranteed $ till 2014, Odom 11.3 till 2012.
Spurs will rebuild from 2012, when Tim retires.
Gasol is the better player overall, Odom is the better defender.
Lakers would not trade Gasol for Parker, but they would trade Odom for Parker.

[TJastal]

Gasol makes 18.7 M next season, Odom makes 8.9.
Gasol has 57 million guaranteed $ till 2014, Odom 11.3 till 2012.
Spurs will rebuild from 2012, when Tim retires.
Gasol is the better player overall, Odom is the better defender.
Lakers would not trade Gasol for Parker, but they would trade Odom for Parker.

Who says Duncan has to retire in 2012? He could sign on for another two years if the team was still competitive and run his contract concurrently with Gasol's. Gasol is still relatively young and could easily handle being the #1 option which is what the team needs, not a knucklehead like Odom.

And after watching Gasol's uninspiring performance for the lakers in the playoffs which suggests a change of scenery is in order, and the shortage of top tier point guards in the league, I'd say its a real possibility.

[dbestpro]

Parker for LA Bynum.

[DPG21920]

Gasol makes 18.7 M next season, Odom makes 8.9.
Gasol has 57 million guaranteed $ till 2014, Odom 11.3 till 2012.
Spurs will rebuild from 2012, when Tim retires.
Gasol is the better player overall, Odom is the better defender.
Lakers would not trade Gasol for Parker, but they would trade Odom for Parker.

If you are going to trade TP, you have to get better younger talent for him. Ebanks and/or some other Laker young guy is not enough or smart, especially when the Spurs have plenty of young wings already.

Essentially you would be trading TP for just cap space because Odom doesn't change anything from a title standpoint if you don't add him to the big 3.

[DPG21920]

There isn't a lot of feasible trading partners out there for TP IMO.

[yavozerb]

There isn't a lot of feasible trading partners out there for TP IMO.

The only team that interests me is portland if TP is going get traded...Batum+Miller (last yr of contract) + another fill in would be who I would want in return if I were the spurs. Blazers already have wallce to start at SF and TP at the point would make that team crazy good.

[Chieflion]

Spurs' title hopes hinges on one guy and that man is Tim Duncan, contract included. If the man decides he wants to keep that 22 million for the final year and not negotiate a far cheaper contract, the Spurs might not have the financial capacity (trades, MLE signing or otherwise) to want to absorb bigger contracts to improve the team tremendously.

With previous extensions to Parker and Ginobili not paying off, one might think that the window has been shut, locked and all of that. If the Big 3's decline hasn't served to tell the Spurs FO that this team just doesn't cut it, next season would be a futile season.

To add on, with upcoming "extensions" to perhaps George Hill, where is the cap flexibility for the Spurs? Bound by contractual obligations to the Big 3 and Richard Jefferson, I highly doubt big changes could be made in San Antonio unless one of the Big 3 is traded or retires.

Spurs' future assets are also not worthy enough to get the Spurs a decent enough player, draft picks and all. None of the Spurs' players' rights are also intriguing enough, potential, talent or otherwise, to make any significant contributions to the Spurs or other teams to demand assets which has a positive value.

I dare the Spurs FO has a tough job ahead of them to make this team a contender once again.

[DPG21920]

The only team that interests me is portland if TP is going get traded...Batum+Miller (last yr of contract) + another fill in would be who I would want in return if I were the spurs. Blazers already have wallce to start at SF and TP at the point would make that team crazy good.

There are plenty of teams that would interest me (at least theoretically, and if I thought trading TP was the right move), the problem is I don't see a situation that is acceptable using what is perceived to be common logic:

1) Both teams benefit

2) TP only makes sense to go to a contending team that needs a PG

3) That contending team would have to have young talent + draft picks for the Spurs

There just aren't many teams on the surface that meet all that criteria and not many of them even meet two of the 3.

[elemento]

In the end, I think we wont have major changes

Tony Parker/George Hill
Manu Ginobili/Gary Neal/Danny Green
Richard Jefferson/James Anderson/DaSean Butler
Tiago Splitter/Dejuan Blair/Matt Bonner
Tim Duncan/Vet min

The biggest change will be: to pair Splitter with Duncan and develop James Anderson.

It might change a bit depending on the guy that we draft with the 29th pick. I dont think we are going to keep both DaSean and Green.

[yavozerb]

There are plenty of teams that would interest me (at least theoretically, and if I thought trading TP was the right move), the problem is I don't see a situation that is acceptable using what is perceived to be common logic:

1) Both teams benefit

2) TP only makes sense to go to a contending team that needs a PG

3) That contending team would have to have young talent + draft picks for the Spurs

There just aren't many teams on the surface that meet all that criteria and not many of them even meet two of the 3.

1. Portland gets a top 5-7 pg in the NBA in his prime. Batum provides good young talent and Miller provides expiring contract and can hold down the pg spot for 1 more season.

2. I think 99% of the NBA would agree that TP is > than Miller. TP is also 6 yrs younger and in his prime. Miller is also in his final year of his contract. Blazers also have wallace to fill in for Batum at the sf position.

3. Batum and an expiring contract are even better than an unproven draft pick.

4. All just a fictional moves on my part and yes I know more salaries is needed from portand , but I think both teams would benefit.

[Spurtacus]

Any way we can get Troy Murphy? I don't understand why he's not seeing much time in Boston.

[Bruno]

Any way we can get Troy Murphy? I don't understand why he's not seeing much time in Boston.

Murphy is a free agent this summer. If Spurs want him, they just need to sign him.

[Bruno]

Random trade idea of the day: McDyess and Bonner to Minny for Darko and Tolliver

[DPG21920]

I have been thinking of realistic trade partners and Minny makes some sense no matter which direction you want to go (basic trade like yours or something bigger like TP). They have some young talent and room to work with.

I wouldn't do the trade you proposed without getting a younger more talented piece, especially if the Spurs are saving them money upfront.

I could see something like Dice/Bonner/Hill for Darko/Tolliver/Randolph and that would be something I would consider for sure.

[yavozerb]

I have been thinking of realistic trade partners and Minny makes some sense no matter which direction you want to go (basic trade like yours or something bigger like TP). They have some young talent and room to work with.

I wouldn't do the trade you proposed without getting a younger more talented piece, especially if the Spurs are saving them money upfront.

I could see something like Dice/Bonner/Hill for Darko/Tolliver/Randolph and that would be something I would consider for sure.

Not bad really...Minny is in dire need of quality guards and they are over crowded at the forward position. Spurs could then draft a pg with there pick and many holes would be filled. Like it..

[Spurtacus]

I have been thinking of realistic trade partners and Minny makes some sense no matter which direction you want to go (basic trade like yours or something bigger like TP). They have some young talent and room to work with.

I wouldn't do the trade you proposed without getting a younger more talented piece, especially if the Spurs are saving them money upfront.

I could see something like Dice/Bonner/Hill for Darko/Tolliver/Randolph and that would be something I would consider for sure.

Our frontcourt need would be immediately filled with that trade. I definitely like it. Minny is currently loaded at PG with Ridnour, Flynn, and Telfair. Rubio might be coming over too. Hill has more talent and upside then any of those guys.

[portnoy1]

Spurs can do a sign an trade with Utah For Krilenko and give them RJ. Krilenko is coming off a with $17million from last seasons contract. Paying him the same as RJ would be a good deal. Krilenko is taller, a better defender,passer, all around ball player. RJ shoots the 3 better but Krilenko last season shot around 37%.

[elemento]

Yeah it would be great to have AK-47 instead of RJ

You just forgot the part that the Jazz does not want any part of Dick Jefferson.

[venitian navigator]

The thing to know is if Pop has given up on Jefferson like our "big 4".
In case, we'll have to package him with Dice expiring...for something supposedly better than him.

I say that 'cause in his interwiew Pop doesn't seem to have a rebuilding wiew for next season and, regarding the "changes" for next season, is pointing just to the Dice retirement ... (and to that we can add Jefferson chence of a trade considering is play off minutes in the last game).

The two salaries amount to near 15 millions dollars... that's more than enough for one or two pieces.

I like the Idea of a Mervin Williams + Pachulia trade (but in case also just RJ for M. Wiliams could work...)

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

a possible trade idea with Toronto

Toronto get: Matt Bonner & George Hill

Spurs get: Ed Davis & Jerryd Bayless

dont want to see hill leave but not nearly as much as i wanna see bonner leave so see ya hill.

[elemento]

Bonner is not so hard to move like RJ

He has 7m guaranteed in the next 2 years and his last year is only 1m guaranteed. The Raps would love to see him back there. He is a fan favorite in Toronto.

But the Raps will not move Ed Davis any time soon. They are high on him and think they are right. He is a great prospect and was easily a top3 rookie among the bigs.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Bonner is not so hard to move like RJ

He has 7m guaranteed in the next 2 years and his last year is only 1m guaranteed. The Raps would love to see him back there. He is a fan favorite in Toronto.

But the Raps will not move Ed Davis any time soon. They are high on him and think they are right. He is a great prospect and was easily a top3 rookie among the bigs.

They have some other bigs who are pretty good in Bargnani and Amir Johnson and like you said he was a fan favorite, but thats where Hill comes into the equation. he would give a huge boost to there backcourt.

[TD 21]

After reading Pop's comments about Blair today, it's clear they're not happy with him. Even if they were, it's obvious this front court doesn't fit well together. One of Blair or Bonner has to go and Blair has better trade value.

A name to consider: Blatche. McDyess, Blair and the 29th pick, might be enough, depending on how desperate the Wizards are to get rid of him. I know he's about as un-Spurs like as they come. But consider this: he doesn't turn 25 until August, he's 6-11, athletic (when in shape), fairly skilled and unlike the other Spurs bigs not named Duncan, has the potential to not be a liability on either end. He's in the Bosh/Aldridge mold. Theoretically, he'd make the front court fit together better.

Going forward, he could be the long term compliment to Splitter. No, neither is going to be an All-Star, but it's San Antonio. Either they get lucky without picking near the top, plummet to the bottom so they can get a pick near the top or they gut their roster, in order to obtain a big who is All-Star caliber (the latter two, they don't seem inclined to do, at least not in the near future). Short of that, they're not getting a big who's raw talent is close to All-Star caliber. He makes $6.4, $7.1, $7.7 and $8.4 million per season over the next four years. If he grows up and plays to his potential, that could turn into a bargain.

It's risky and the Spurs would have to do significant background work to make sure they're comfortable enough with him personally to do it. But the way I see it, he's probably the highest upside big they can acquire, who doesn't gut their roster and not only has the capacity to make them better in the short term, but to be a key piece going forward, too.

[elemento]

They have some other bigs who are pretty good in Bargnani and Amir Johnson and like you said he was a fan favorite, but thats where Hill comes into the equation. he would give a huge boost to there backcourt.

Bargnani is a 7 footer that cannot play defense and rebound. Rap fans have had enough of him. They are in love with Derozan and Ed Davis and they will not trade them.

Unfortunately for us, because Davis is a good prospect.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Bargnani is a 7 footer that cannot play defense and rebound. Rap fans have had enough of him. They are in love with Derozan and Ed Davis and they will not trade them.

Unfortunately for us, because Davis is a good prospect.

they gonna have to do something. bargnani contract is like rj's. horrible and hard to move. i dont know much about 3 team trades so maybe there could be a deal with a 3rd team involving blair and/or mcdyess. the reason why im not just leaving this trade alone is because this is one of only a few trades where we can move unwanted players and fix many problems at once. plus its realistic.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

ok i messed around on the trade machine and i came up with a 3 team trade adding in the Bobcats.

Toronto gets: Matt bonner, George Hill, D.J White

Spurs get: Ed Davis, Jerryd Bayless, DeSagana Diop

Bobcats get: Blair & McDyess

i think it could work. we take a contract Charlotte doesnt want with Diop(who can be a big help for us). Toronto gets a young bigman in white. charlotte gets a much better big in return in blair and gets cap space back with mcdyess. im sure it could go thru with a draft pick or 2 going to Toronto.

[yavozerb]

ok i messed around on the trade machine and i came up with a 3 team trade adding in the Bobcats.

Toronto gets: Matt bonner, George Hill, D.J White

Spurs get: Ed Davis, Jerryd Bayless, DeSagana Diop

Bobcats get: Blair & McDyess

i think it could work. we take a contract Charlotte doesnt want with Diop(who can be a big help for us). Toronto gets a young bigman in white. charlotte gets a much better big in return in blair and gets cap space back with mcdyess. im sure it could go thru with a draft pick or 2 going to Toronto.

Sounds good, go ahead and pass it on to the spurs front office. Keep up the good work. :toast

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Sounds good, go ahead and pass it on to the spurs front office. Keep up the good work. :toast

lol ty. i would but im sure once pop reads toronto gets bonner he would just stop reading. :bang

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Huge blockbuster trade involving toronto and 76ers.


Toronto gets: Matt Bonner, Blair, jodie meeks

76ers get: Hill, RJ, McDyess, James Johnson. 2012 2nd round pick(turned into 1st round pick if needed to complete trade. weak draft anyways)

Spurs get: Ed Davis, Andre Iguodala, Marreese Speights, Solomon Alabi


Spurs line up

C: Splitter, Speights, Alabi
PF: TD, Davis
SF: Iguodala, Anderson, Green, Butler
SG: Manu, Neal
PG: TP, MLE pickup

anyone know how to get a hold of RC. i have a couple of ideas to pitch.

[outmap]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3w79mtw

[TDMVPDPOY]

bobcats has 2 first round picks, they wanna trade up, if they cant i think they are offloading them...

top10 pick and one pick at 19 i think...

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

ok realistic and perfect offseason


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6zpf5lc

Spurs get: jason thompson and omri casspi

Kings get: RJ and blair


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3wysftq

Spurs get: Tyrus Thomas & D.J Augustin

Bobcats get: Bonner, McDyess, & Hill

Bobcats want to draft a PF with there 9th pick but are currently loaded at the position so they might be willing to unload thomas. they are also trying to free up space for CP3 so mcdyess could get it done.

sign a vet min big (Tont Battie, Kwame Brown, Etan Thomas)

use MLE to sign either Prince, Battier, Young(pipe dream signing i know but phillys offer is only 4 mil. mine as well try).

[TDMVPDPOY]

kwame brown is going to cost more then vet imo

[TDMVPDPOY]

taj gibson :(

how about james johnson of the bulls?

or that busts hawks player marvin williams?

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

kwame brown is going to cost more then vet imo

dont see what he has done in his career to deserve more than the vet min, but your right. some team will prob severly overpay him. most likely the celtics or Heat.

[Ditty]

Richard Jefferson for Mike Miller and Joel Anthony

Miami gets a player more fitted for there system

Spurs get a 3 point shooter to fit in our system, and get a shot blocker and big body

salaries match

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Richard Jefferson for Mike Miller and Joel Anthony

Miami gets a player more fitted for there system

Spurs get a 3 point shooter to fit in our system, and get a shot blocker and big body

salaries match

pretty good. these are the kind of trades we need to think of. everyones trying to blow up the team.

[Vic Petro]

TP/RJ to Utah for Devin Harris/Al Jefferson/#3

[elemento]

This is terrible for Utah

They would never do it !

[Bruno]

Spurs won't trade Parker.

[Anonymous Cowherd]

Richard Jefferson for Mike Miller and Joel Anthony

Miami gets a player more fitted for there system

Spurs get a 3 point shooter to fit in our system, and get a shot blocker and big body

salaries match

Yeah. Miami are going to trade their best Center, and a Small Forward, for an equally good Small Forward.

Because they are really lacking a good Small Forward.

[Vic Petro]

This is terrible for Utah

They would never do it !

Harris/Jefferson/12?


Spurs won't trade Parker.

I know this. Just distracting myself with fantasy scenarios. Watching the WCF is painful.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Harris/Jefferson/12?

Why would they do this? Or the trade before?

[objective]

Trades involving Jefferson getting back anything remotely useful are fantasies.

Jefferson has negative value. He can only be traded for other players of negative value. Or by adding a piece of some positive value like Hill or maybe Blair, maybe then you can get back players of only minor negative value or perhaps neutral value.

[Ditty]

Yeah. Miami are going to trade their best Center, and a Small Forward, for an equally good Small Forward.

Because they are really lacking a good Small Forward.

Miami is trying to rid of miller, hasn't really fit in well. Jefferson can help out a lot more as a 6th man then in a starting row and miami likes to run a little more. Joel anthony is just a filler they could give us pittman or they can start pittman next year or go after someone with the in free ageny for maimi.

[dbestpro]

I still think the RJ for Outlaw and Petro may have the most legs.

[objective]

most legs as in good odds?

Can't see it. NJ told RJ to go away when he opted out last summer thinking he'd get a bigger deal from them.

He then went on to have an even worse year and decline further except regular season 3pt %.

He didn't do anything to make New Jersey change their minds on him, regardless of how awful their other choices were.

[cdcast]

TDMVPDPOY mentioned Taj Gibson.

Hill for Taj.

Bulls need a SG but Bulls could probably get someone better with their MLE or another trade.

[Spurs da champs]

It might not be bad for them since RJ thrives in a losing environment with a true PG.

[Bruno]

I'm hopping almost every day that Spurs are able to dump RJ. He hurts the franchise in so many ways. I don't remember me wanting that bad to see a Spur being traded.

[dbestpro]

I'm hopping almost every day that Spurs are able to dump RJ. He hurts the franchise in so many ways. I don't remember me wanting that bad to see a Spur being traded.

More than Bonner? In other words if you had a chance to get rid of one of the two and salary not be a consideration who would you get rid of?

[Bruno]

More than Bonner? In other words if you had a chance to get rid of one of the two and salary not be a consideration who would you get rid of?

My main problem with RJ is that he is paid way too much. His big contract hurts Spurs by taking away their limited financial resources. If Spurs had basically unlimited financial resources like few teams in the league, RJ wouldn't be a that big problem.

[Ditty]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=4x8vb5r

would be nice..veteran help I guess, the twolves can bring over rubio, without giving up there pick, RJ was good as a number 2 option, and the twolves can use there pick to get a one of those Centers, or bring those 2 other centers they have stashed in Europe.

RJ's contract is the same length as 2 of the contracts, plus Twolves save about $2.5 million even with Mcdyess's Contract.

[UnWantedTheory]

ok realistic and perfect offseason


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6zpf5lc

Spurs get: jason thompson and omri casspi

Kings get: RJ and blair


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3wysftq

Spurs get: Tyrus Thomas & D.J Augustin

Bobcats get: Bonner, McDyess, & Hill

Bobcats want to draft a PF with there 9th pick but are currently loaded at the position so they might be willing to unload thomas. they are also trying to free up space for CP3 so mcdyess could get it done.

sign a vet min big (Tont Battie, Kwame Brown, Etan Thomas)

use MLE to sign either Prince, Battier, Young(pipe dream signing i know but phillys offer is only 4 mil. mine as well try).
How is that realistic?

[Chomag]

ok realistic and perfect offseason


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6zpf5lc

Spurs get: jason thompson and omri casspi

Kings get: RJ and blair


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3wysftq

Spurs get: Tyrus Thomas & D.J Augustin

Bobcats get: Bonner, McDyess, & Hill

Bobcats want to draft a PF with there 9th pick but are currently loaded at the position so they might be willing to unload thomas. they are also trying to free up space for CP3 so mcdyess could get it done.

sign a vet min big (Tont Battie, Kwame Brown, Etan Thomas)

use MLE to sign either Prince, Battier, Young(pipe dream signing i know but phillys offer is only 4 mil. mine as well try).

Would be great trade for the Spurs but non of those players you mentioned have enough trade value to get it done. Remember the other team has got to want to make the deal as well.

[yavozerb]

Spurs get: trade exemption
Cavs get: RJ and probably a pick of some sort

If cavs offered this to the spurs would want this to go down?

[lmbebo]

for the 1 or 4 pick, sure :)

Hell, even for the last pick in this years draft I'd do this trade.

[yavozerb]

for the 1 or 4 pick, sure :)

Hell, even for the last pick in this years draft I'd do this trade.

No, I think you misread what I wrote..To get rid of RJ's contract there must some kind of sweetner to go along with him, i suggested a 1st or 2nd rd pick from the spurs not the cavs..nice try though

[elemento]

As i said, i would focus on Minny

They have too many bigs and every single one of them would be available (expept for Love). And if they take Kanter with the 2nd pick, I am sure that one of Darko or Pekovic would be available for cheap. A guy like Pekovic would help us tremendously.

[rascal]

Sounds good, go ahead and pass it on to the spurs front office. Keep up the good work. :toast

Better yet try to get a job in the front office because the guys there never seem to pull off anything.

[pad300]

Spurs get: trade exemption
Cavs get: RJ and probably a pick of some sort

If cavs offered this to the spurs would want this to go down?

I certainly would contemplate it. I think we desperately need to move both Bonner and Jefferson. They simply don't have the mental toughness to play playoff ball. Therefore they MUST go for whatever we can get...

[TD 21]

Spurs get: trade exemption
Cavs get: RJ and probably a pick of some sort

If cavs offered this to the spurs would want this to go down?

I've thought about this.

Unfortunately, what it would likely take is what the Clippers gave up to get the Cavs to take Davis' contract; an unprotected lottery pick. Obviously, the Spurs don't have that. So it would have be an unprotected pick at some point in the next few years. But even then, would the Cavs do it? It was a no brainer with the Clippers, because it was a guaranteed top ten pick.

I'm fairly certain Scott has a good relationship with Jefferson, having coached him with the Nets. With their cap space, Gilbert's willingness to spend and gaping hole at SF, they're probably the Spurs best bet when it comes to ridding themselves of Jefferson, without taking back bad contract(s).

[Tyrone Jenkins]

Why not just trade TP, RJ and Dejuan Blair to the Cavs for Antawn Jamison and the 4th pick overall? That allows the Spurs to start rebuilding w/ youth (Hill gets more time as the starting PG), gets rid of RJ and, although I like Blair, he's too short to fit into Pop's defensive scheme. Plus, the Spurs shed some salary. The Cavs get rid of an aging PF who's due $15m next year, gain a great Final MVP caliber PG in his prime and still get to draft Derrick Williams that they've stated they want to do.

The Spurs just might have enough $ to attract Tayshaun Prince to play here. Also, Jamison (and Duncan's) contracts both would come off the books at the end of 12.

[dbestpro]

I know Manu is pretty much untouchable till he retires, but the following trade has crossed my mind. Would you make a trade whose core players are Manu for Roy?

Discuss.

[JonNOKC]

Why not just trade TP, RJ and Dejuan Blair to the Cavs for Antawn Jamison and the 4th pick overall? That allows the Spurs to start rebuilding w/ youth (Hill gets more time as the starting PG), gets rid of RJ and, although I like Blair, he's too short to fit into Pop's defensive scheme. Plus, the Spurs shed some salary. The Cavs get rid of an aging PF who's due $15m next year, gain a great Final MVP caliber PG in his prime and still get to draft Derrick Williams that they've stated they want to do.

The Spurs just might have enough $ to attract Tayshaun Prince to play here. Also, Jamison (and Duncan's) contracts both would come off the books at the end of 12.

I do think if the Spurs are serious about moving RJ (not sure they are) then the Cavs are the team to get on the phone - there are several possible scenarios - the above scenario isn't a bad one for the Spurs IMO assuming we go get a vet PG - not sure what the Cavs would think but they are one of the few teams where there are circumstances that may be favorable to unloading RJ

[outmap]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3u68ppl

Everybody wins:

Portland gets size.
C - Oden, Diop
PF - Aldridge, White
SF - Wallace, Jefferson
SG - Roy, Matthews
PG - Miller, Mills

Charlotte gets even talent:
C - Camby, Pryzbilla
PF - Blair, Diaw
SF - Jackson, Livingston
SG - Fernandez, Anderson
PG - Agustin, Henderson

Spurs get athletic:
C - Duncan, Splitter, Richards
PF - Thomas, Bonner, Richards
SF - Batum, Butler, Green
SG - Manu, Neal, Green
PG - Parker, Hill, Neal

Every team's gonna be happy. :)

[Ditty]

I believe a Jefferson, and our 1st round pick for Stephen Jackson could gain some attention from the bobcats, but that 4th year player option really is the kicker, but I hope the Jordan, and the bobcats front office have had enough of Jackson, both there contracts are similiar, and Jefferson is younger.

[tdunk21]

just wondering if this works......


scenario 1:
1) tony parker and jefferson for josh smith and marvin williams
2) Draft a true PG with the 29th pick and let hill be the starting PG....of course hill sucks but the trade could make the spurs a lot better in interior and perimeter D
3) Draft a backup center with the 59th

scenario 2:
1) tony parker and jefferson for josh smith and marvin williams
2) Draft a PF/C with the 29th pick
3) sign a PG for a portion of MLE or full MLE and let hill share minutes at PG
4) draft backup PG with 59th

[Jess]

I'm curious what the tank thinks of the trade proposed on Russilo's podcast today. Bonner/Parker for Pau Gasol. The Lakers fill their huge hole at point guard and get someone to run Mike Brown's system. Bonner, Odom, and Bynum divvy up Gasol's minutes.

The Spurs' frontcourt instantly become lengthy and elite defensively (Duncan/Gasol/Splitter), with a potent low post scorer. Their backcourt is deep enough to lose Parker when this is the tradeoff.

It all depends on how disenchanted the Lakers are with Gasol after the flameout, but I think the Spurs do it in a heartbeat.

[tdunk21]

I'm curious what the tank thinks of the trade proposed on Russilo's podcast today. Bonner/Parker for Pau Gasol. The Lakers fill their huge hole at point guard and get someone to run Mike Brown's system. Bonner, Odom, and Bynum divvy up Gasol's minutes.

The Spurs' frontcourt instantly become lengthy and elite defensively (Duncan/Gasol/Splitter), with a potent low post scorer. Their backcourt is deep enough to lose Parker when this is the tradeoff.

It all depends on how disenchanted the Lakers are with Gasol after the flameout, but I think the Spurs do it in a heartbeat.

do it in a heartbeat.....benefits both teams....

[Tyrone Jenkins]

do it in a heartbeat.....benefits both teams....

Hate that trade. Splitter and Gasol are both finesse European players. Essentially, they're both softer Power Forwards. SA needs a CENTER (there is a difference). Nene or Tyson Chandler will both be FAs but don't know of the possibility of a sign and trade (SA doesn't have the cap room to sign outright).

Personnally, I'd be happier w/ a Parker, Jefferson, Splitter (or Blair) trade for Dwight Howard, Brandon Bass and Chris Duhon. Since Howard will be leaving after the upcoming year, Orlando can land some additional offense in TP and RJ and perhaps develop Splitter into something. They could trade Jameer Nelson to someone else for a backup PG and a 1st round draft pick (since they have none). SA gets the best center in the league, gets rid of RJ and a defensive SF in Bass. Duhon is thrown in to make the #s work and provide a backup PG for Hill.

[TimDunkem]

Bass is a PF.

[Thompson]

Is there a theoretical limit to how many picks you can get for 1 player? If we decide to blow it up, go long-term: trade Parker for multiple distant (unprotected) draft picks to a team in win-now mode. Maybe the 2018, 2020 picks. Do the same with other players if they want to go (Ginobili [2022, 2024], Duncan if he wants to [2026]).

We'd suck for a while, but imagine the juggernaut we could build with 4-5 years of lousy seasons/great draft picks, and then to have that team supplemented every other year with a lottery pick (delaying the inevitable decline from successful seasons/low draft picks).

I know it's far-fetched, I'm just curious if it's even possible in theory. The prospect of a middling level of success for an indefinite period of time unnerves me.

[nickdaquick]

With Rubio going to Minnasota finally, I really think the Spurs need to take advantage of the situation. They have two PG's that would serve as good back up's and they would be willing to part with Darko to cut some salary. Here's what I propose

Spurs get:
Darko
Wes Johnson or Webster
Ridnour or Flynn

Timberwolves get:
McDyss
Hill
Jefferson

You could also through in Blar for Randolph too.

[yavozerb]

With Rubio going to Minnasota finally, I really think the Spurs need to take advantage of the situation. They have two PG's that would serve as good back up's and they would be willing to part with Darko to cut some salary. Here's what I propose

Spurs get:
Darko
Wes Johnson or Webster
Ridnour or Flynn

Timberwolves get:
McDyss
Hill
Jefferson

You could also through in Blar for Randolph too.
Ridnour>Hill at the pg position
Johnson or Webster > RJ
Darko is there only true center..

This makes sense for minny why....

[nickdaquick]

Ridnour>Hill at the pg position
Johnson or Webster > RJ
Darko is there only true center..

This makes sense for minny why....

Hill is moved to SG with Rubio coming in.

They take it for the young cheap talent in Hill and the cap space with Dyss.

[Mel_13]

With Rubio going to Minnasota finally, I really think the Spurs need to take advantage of the situation. They have two PG's that would serve as good back up's and they would be willing to part with Darko to cut some salary. Here's what I propose

Spurs get:
Darko
Wes Johnson or Webster
Ridnour or Flynn

Timberwolves get:
McDyss
Hill
Jefferson

You could also through in Blar for Randolph too.

Cutting salary and acquiring RJ are mutually exclusive. RJ has as much guaranteed money remaining on his contract as Darko, Webster, and Ridnour combined.

[TimmehC]

Dice/Hill for Randolph/Ridnour would work. With Beas, Love and Derrick Williams likely on the roster, they have no need for Randoph.

[elemento]

I think Minny would rather keep Randolph and Ridnour. The only reason they helped the Knicks in the Melo trade was Randolph.

At this point, I think we could get Flynn, Darko or Pekovic really cheap and if what Bruno said is true (we have a gentleman agreement with Dice to pay his guaranteed money and after that he retires) , the Spurs FO have to find a way to trade him in order to be below the lux tax, even if we have to pay for his buyout.

[Tyrone Jenkins]

The missing piece of the Spurs is an athletic, defensive, rebounding BIG w/ some length to handle the likes of Aldridge, Zach Randolph, Gasol and Dirk.

Only problem, when was the last time a BIG man (read that as PF or C) was drafted beyond the 20th pick that ended up scoring more than 15 pts and grabbing more the 8 boards a game? Carlos Boozer was actually a 35th overall and is an exception. If you think Mehmet Okur is good, then he might be included (38th pick).

TD was a 1st overall pick. So was Dwight Howard, Andrew Bogut, Shaq, Chris Weber, Larry Johnson, Danny Manning, Pervis Ellison, Patrick Ewing, Hakeem Olajuwon, Elton Brand, Derrick Coleman, Kenyon Martin and Yao Ming. About 95% of all the centers and power forwards that ended up being halfway decent were all drafted w/in the 1st 15 picks. Guards (both point and shooting) drafted later have a far higher probability of success than big men drafted later.

Good big men are just harder to fine. The Spurs lucked up w/ Blair but even as good as he is, his length (or lack thereof) prevents him from seeing the floor during the playoffs in Popovich's scheme.

If the Spurs are serious about drafting a quality big man, their best course of action is to either wait til next year (when the draft will hopefully be stronger) or trade up into the lottery area. The possibility exists (I think) to trade w/ the Cavs to their 4th pick or even w/ Minnesota for their 2nd. Perhaps we can trade TP and Blair and/or Splitter to Toronto @ 5, Milwaukee @ 10 (rumored to want to get rid of Jennings) or Houston @ 14.

Personally, I think that if TP is traded, then the Spurs are officially rebuilding and every attempt to get the BEST BIG MAN they can right now is imperative. Why now? Couple of reasons: getting someone skilled now while Tim Duncan is still playing is best opportunity for him to teach the rookie (who know what Tim will want to do after retiring); having a marquee PF or C will help attract other players that will be free agents next year (such as CP3, Dwight Howard, etc.); most important, the current structure of the West necessitates it.

[jcutter13]

Parker to Phoenix

Lopez and Nash to San Antonio any thoughts?

Pick up Free agent Josh Howard or Grant Hill.

[Bruno]

There were a rumor yesterday about Clippers wanting to sign Tayshaun Prince. If their plan is to add an old SF, RJ can be their guy. RJ for Ryan Gomes works salary wise.

[BackHome]

I certainly would contemplate it. I think we desperately need to move both Bonner and Jefferson. They simply don't have the mental toughness to play playoff ball. Therefore they MUST go for whatever we can get...

You forgot Hill....but yeah all three need to go.....don't go away mad just go away!

[pad300]

You forgot Hill....but yeah all three need to go.....don't go away mad just go away!

I don't tag Hill in with RJ and Bonner. While he is inconsistent, and I am not opposed to trading him, I look at last year's Dallas series and cannot damn him as permanently mentally weak. Don't forget, both Tony and Manu were inconsistent during their first couple of years in the league. Hill has lots of growing to do, but I can't hold him to a higher standard than those two...

[Ditty]

Manu,George Hill for Danny Granger,Brandon Rush, and the 15th pick would be my ideal trade

[objective]

I'd be happy if they could trade Hill to get a higher pick to grab Singleton.

Grab another point guard later. I'd be happy with Mack at 29 in that case. It might seem high for Mack, but he's going to be a solid back-up point in the league, all he has to do is spot up and play defense, which gives him one skill more than the likes of Chris Quinn who has managed a career in the NBA. Ginobili handles the ball when Parker is out anyway.

[Tyrone Jenkins]

Perhaps a better perspective for trades would be to look at contracts AND potential for the next 3-5 years, not just production for next year.

In 2014, Duncan, McDyess and Manu will probably be gone and Parker will be 32/33. The $21 million that went to Duncan, the $5 million that went to Dyse and the $8-9 million for Manu will all be re-allocated to other veterans that will HAVE to be picked up in free agency as the team won't have enough draft pics to fill the team w/ them alone.

So how should the Spurs best position themselves to remain competitive to the level of vying for a championship while watching the Big 3 leave? There will never be another Duncan - even if there was, he probably wouldn't play for San Antonio. His former production will have to come from TWO or maybe even THREE players. Splitter, I think is one. If he can give 15 pts and 8 rebs a game, then the Spurs are halfway there. All they need is an athletic, long, physical center to that can get 6-8 pts, 12 rebs and 3 blocks a game (and be a major deterent to opposing penetrators). Probably need a 3rd player to get 8-10 pts and 4-5 rebs off the bench.

Next, we'll need to replace Manu w/ some capable shooting guards. The Spurs are in luck there as Da'Sean Butler and James Anderson both have potential. Between them, Gary Neal and Matt Bonner, points from 3s and midrange should be covered.

Lastly, they'll need someone who can penetrate and finish (or dish to open players) like TP. Hill isn't the answer but does have some abilities - plus, he plays better defense. TP's replacement, though, should be easier to find than the others as good PGs are always available. Look at the past 5 drafts...John Wall, Derrick Rose, Tyreke Evans, Stephen Curry, Brandon Jennings, Ty Lawson, Russell Westbrook, Eric Gordon, Jerryd Bayless... there are more.

So, I say if there's a deal out there that helps get the Spurs to the next era, then let's get it done. TP, Manu, whoever...only non-tradeable asset is Duncan. He should ALWAYS be a Spur.

[Ditty]

I'd be happy if they could trade Hill to get a higher pick to grab Singleton.

Grab another point guard later. I'd be happy with Mack at 29 in that case. It might seem high for Mack, but he's going to be a solid back-up point in the league, all he has to do is spot up and play defense, which gives him one skill more than the likes of Chris Quinn who has managed a career in the NBA. Ginobili handles the ball when Parker is out anyway.

+1

Hill is still young, and has value if a one of those teams around the 20 pick want a combo guard.. Hill would be a good choice. I would prefer Nogueria with the 29th pick, and go for those pg's in the 2nd round who aren't bad, or go after one in free agency, along with a big man.

[BackHome]

Re: General 2011 NBA Draft Discussion
Trade Hill and Blair and get two additional picks and get these kids:

Malcom Thomas SF/PF San Diego - 6'9, 225 pds, 11 Pts, FG. 53%, Rebounds 8.1, Blocks 2.0 (A tough kid who can rebound/block shots and will be able to guard SF he has very good lateral quickness - the opposite of Bonner, Blair and RJ)

Keith Benson PF/C Oakland - 6'11 223 pds, 17.9 Pts, FG. 54%, Rebounds 10.0, Blocks 3.6 (Great rebounder/blocks shots just needs to juice up for about six months to add bulk)

Lucas Nogureria C - 7'0 225 pds, NA STATS (D Leauge just one year and hire a great weight coach for him)

Darrius Morris PG Michigan - 6'5, 190 pds - 15.0 Pts, Assist. 6.7, Rebounds 4.0 (Will easily be our second best pg and could replace Tony if traded in 2012)

[Big P]

Perhaps a better perspective for trades would be to look at contracts AND potential for the next 3-5 years, not just production for next year.

In 2014, Duncan, McDyess and Manu will probably be gone and Parker will be 32/33. The $21 million that went to Duncan, the $5 million that went to Dyse and the $8-9 million for Manu will all be re-allocated to other veterans that will HAVE to be picked up in free agency as the team won't have enough draft pics to fill the team w/ them alone.

So how should the Spurs best position themselves to remain competitive to the level of vying for a championship while watching the Big 3 leave? There will never be another Duncan - even if there was, he probably wouldn't play for San Antonio. His former production will have to come from TWO or maybe even THREE players. Splitter, I think is one. If he can give 15 pts and 8 rebs a game, then the Spurs are halfway there. All they need is an athletic, long, physical center to that can get 6-8 pts, 12 rebs and 3 blocks a game (and be a major deterent to opposing penetrators). Probably need a 3rd player to get 8-10 pts and 4-5 rebs off the bench.

Next, we'll need to replace Manu w/ some capable shooting guards. The Spurs are in luck there as Da'Sean Butler and James Anderson both have potential. Between them, Gary Neal and Matt Bonner, points from 3s and midrange should be covered.

Lastly, they'll need someone who can penetrate and finish (or dish to open players) like TP. Hill isn't the answer but does have some abilities - plus, he plays better defense. TP's replacement, though, should be easier to find than the others as good PGs are always available. Look at the past 5 drafts...John Wall, Derrick Rose, Tyreke Evans, Stephen Curry, Brandon Jennings, Ty Lawson, Russell Westbrook, Eric Gordon, Jerryd Bayless... there are more.

So, I say if there's a deal out there that helps get the Spurs to the next era, then let's get it done. TP, Manu, whoever...only non-tradeable asset is Duncan. He should ALWAYS be a Spur.

Really?

[ChuckD]

Perhaps a better perspective for trades would be to look at contracts AND potential for the next 3-5 years, not just production for next year.

In 2014, Duncan, McDyess and Manu will probably be gone and Parker will be 32/33. The $21 million that went to Duncan, the $5 million that went to Dyse and the $8-9 million for Manu will all be re-allocated to other veterans that will HAVE to be picked up in free agency as the team won't have enough draft pics to fill the team w/ them alone.

So how should the Spurs best position themselves to remain competitive to the level of vying for a championship while watching the Big 3 leave? There will never be another Duncan - even if there was, he probably wouldn't play for San Antonio. His former production will have to come from TWO or maybe even THREE players. Splitter, I think is one. If he can give 15 pts and 8 rebs a game, then the Spurs are halfway there. All they need is an athletic, long, physical center to that can get 6-8 pts, 12 rebs and 3 blocks a game (and be a major deterent to opposing penetrators). Probably need a 3rd player to get 8-10 pts and 4-5 rebs off the bench.

Next, we'll need to replace Manu w/ some capable shooting guards. The Spurs are in luck there as Da'Sean Butler and James Anderson both have potential. Between them, Gary Neal and Matt Bonner, points from 3s and midrange should be covered.

Lastly, they'll need someone who can penetrate and finish (or dish to open players) like TP. Hill isn't the answer but does have some abilities - plus, he plays better defense. TP's replacement, though, should be easier to find than the others as good PGs are always available. Look at the past 5 drafts...John Wall, Derrick Rose, Tyreke Evans, Stephen Curry, Brandon Jennings, Ty Lawson, Russell Westbrook, Eric Gordon, Jerryd Bayless... there are more.

So, I say if there's a deal out there that helps get the Spurs to the next era, then let's get it done. TP, Manu, whoever...only non-tradeable asset is Duncan. He should ALWAYS be a Spur.

You can't "reload" a team that ages out and be any good. You get stuck in a loop where you either just barely make or just barely miss the playoffs, constantly drafting in the mid-teens, and can't ever get good enough to compete or bad enough to draft stars. SA has NEVER been able to sign top FAs, so that's out.

The only model to follow is OKC's. You wait for Tim to decide to hang them up, trade EVERY asset you have for picks, crash to the cellar, and be so bad that you pick in the top 5 for 3 straight years. Young players are also cheap, so that you can stockpile them from other sources than the draft if your cap is clear, much like OKC stole players like Maynor and Cook from teams desperate to either clear cap (MIA - Cook) or avoid the tax (UTH - Maynor).

[tdunk21]

just came across this trade idea with the knicks on bleacher report...want to know what everyone thinks of it...

chauncey billups and landry fields for tony parker

[ChuckD]

just came across this trade idea with the knicks on bleacher report...want to know what everyone thinks of it...

chauncey billups and landry fields for tony parker

Since Billups has a fork in him, this is essentially Parker for Fields. Major fail.

[Tyrone Jenkins]

You can't "reload" a team that ages out and be any good. You get stuck in a loop where you either just barely make or just barely miss the playoffs, constantly drafting in the mid-teens, and can't ever get good enough to compete or bad enough to draft stars. SA has NEVER been able to sign top FAs, so that's out.
(UTH - Maynor).


That's kinda my point. The last time the Spurs drafted someone before pick 20 was Tim Duncan in 1997. And that was because the happened to win the lottery. Yet, they've been to 4 championships since then. How?

By drafting complementary PGs and SGs and picking up defensive minded role players. Bruce Bowen wasn't an original spurs draft pick. Neither was McDyess, Bonner, Avery Johnson...

Drafting guards and to some degree small forwards late in the draft can be profitable - but every once in a while, a team has to bite the bullet and either secure that expensive free agent big man or do some excellent scouting (like a year in advance) and position themselves to be able to draft a PF or C who can carry the franchise for years. Yes, it's a crapshoot but that's how it goes. SA has been lucky w/ David Robinson and TD. Now, it's time to try it again - either this year or next year - because, as so many have already pointed out, expensive free agent big men don't come to Texas.

[Tyrone Jenkins]

I do like the Billups and Fields for TP only if their 17th pick is included.

I'd much rather trade RJ, Blair and Hill for Billups and Fields.

[venitian navigator]

I've red somewhere that the Sixers are intersted in shopping Iguodala for Turkoglu just to save money.
I doubt it, but If that's their state of mind, we should inquire and offer a better proposal for them, like Iguodala for RJ + Dice expiring contract...
For that, they're gonna save a lot more money than nn the Turkoglu's deal, they receive a much better player expecially for their game style (at the moment, RJ is pleying a lot better than Hedo) and Iguodala, also if grossly overpaid, is a kind of player we could really take advantage of in the short (for a last title run) and long time (for replacing an older Gino).

[Spurs da champs]

Could George Hill and D Blair work for portland's 1st round pick? They need a point guard & a back up power forward.

[TJastal]

Since Billups has a fork in him, this is essentially Parker for Fields. Major fail.

Parker for just Landry Fields isn't such a bad idea IMO. Fields is a rising star in this league and at 6'7" is capable of being that lockdown defender the spurs lack.

And I bet Billups could muster another year or so of respectable basketball before he retires. Would mesh perfectly with the last few decent years of Duncan's career most likely.

I don't know what you expect to get from trading Tony Parker, but its not going to be Chris Paul or Dwight Howard. I suspect you are just a Parker homer tbh.

Very good trade idea IMHO.

[spursbird]

I got an idea: Trade TP+RJ+DB(+GH) for Fisher+Artest+Odom(+Brown)+picks
Why Spurs should do this: Spurs need to unload RJ's contract. Artest brings defense and Odom is a very versatile player who brings height and athletism. Most importantly, their contract will all end up in 2013 which allows the Spurs to quickly rebuild.
Why Lakers should do this: Kobe is getting older and if they want another ring they really need a good backcourt player. RJ still can play, and has shown high efficiency with 47 FG% and 44% 3G%. Blair and Hill are both great bench players.
This might make Spurs a lottery team this year, but since the Spurs seem to have no possibility for another title with the current lineup, I think trading for expiring contracts is not a bad idea.

[admiralsnackbar]

I got an idea: Trade TP+RJ+DB(+GH) for Fisher+Artest+Odom(+Brown)+picks
Why Spurs should do this: Spurs need to unload RJ's contract. Artest brings defense and Odom is a very versatile player who brings height and athletism. Most importantly, their contract will all end up in 2013 which allows the Spurs to quickly rebuild.
Why Lakers should do this: Kobe is getting older and if they want another ring they really need a good backcourt player. RJ still can play, and has shown high efficiency with 47 FG% and 44% 3G%. Blair and Hill are both great bench players.
This might make Spurs a lottery team this year, but since the Spurs seem to have no possibility for another title with the current lineup, I think trading for expiring contracts is not a bad idea.

Mike Brown is taking over for Jackson, which means the Lakers will run a more Spurs-like system than they have in the past if Coach Brown's past work is any indication. Considering RJ has struggled in the Spurs mid-court and up-tempo incarnations, I'm going to go ahead and say LA would have zero interest in taking on Jefferson, regardless of trade sweeteners.

[Ditty]

There were a rumor yesterday about Clippers wanting to sign Tayshaun Prince. If their plan is to add an old SF, RJ can be their guy. RJ for Ryan Gomes works salary wise.

RJ,Blair and Mcdyess for Kaman would work by the numbers on the trade machine

Rj would be the veteran small forward they need and can work in there system,Blair is a great contract, and could be solid back up to Griffin. Spurs would get the scoring big man they need.

Spurs wouldn't have a small forward though, but can go after one in free agency, and have Butler be the back up.

[elemento]

RJ,Blair and Mcdyess for Kaman would work by the numbers on the trade machine

Rj would be the veteran small forward they need and can work in there system,Blair is a great contract, and could be solid back up to Griffin. Spurs would get the scoring big man they need.

Spurs wouldn't have a small forward though, but can go after one in free agency, and have Butler be the back up.

This deal is one of a few that I like in this thread. Even if he had to get Ryan Gomes back, It would not be a bad deal.

[Mal]

RJ,Blair and Mcdyess for Kaman would work by the numbers on the trade machine

Rj would be the veteran small forward they need and can work in there system,Blair is a great contract, and could be solid back up to Griffin. Spurs would get the scoring big man they need.

Spurs wouldn't have a small forward though, but can go after one in free agency, and have Butler be the back up.

Then draft JaJuan Johnson and Spurs` frontcourt would be very big. Four 7 footers + Bonner. I like it.

[Ditty]

Then draft JaJuan Johnson and Spurs` frontcourt would be very big. Four 7 footers + Bonner. I like it.

I love jajuan johnson he's my first choice of college prospects to be taken. Lucas Nogueria is my first choice though, he would be a lottery pick taken a year early. It would be nice if jajuan could fall in the second round and spurs would buy a pick to get him and get lucas in the 1st round. If spurs are looking for a cheap decent backup as horrible as it sounds kwame brown would be a bad choice, he's not that bad for a backup, and wasn't that bad in LA.

Small forwards of my choice would be tashayn price then shane battier, and get earl clark for the minimum jusr in case butler doesn't work out.

[Laredoart]

Theres 2 trades that are avalable for us to make our team better:

Pacers Granger, Hibbert & Hansbrough for TP & Blair

Suns Nash, Gortat & RJ, McDyess, Bonner

These 2 trades would make the team alot better, more D, rebounds, lenght, assist, youth, experience, a play maker, and somebody that can teach Hill how to play the PG position the way it should be play.

[elemento]

Of course these trades would make us better. we pretty much rape Indy and the Suns.

We have to come up with realistic trades. With unrealistic trades is really easy to improve any team

[Laredoart]

Of course these trades would make us better. we pretty much rape Indy and the Suns.

We have to come up with realistic trades. With unrealistic trades is really easy to improve any team


This trades at not unrealistic at all. If you look at them all teams will benefit. The trade w/ the Pacers, will would have to send some Draft picks, so they can think about it, is not like they not getting anything in return, they getting somebody to run their offense, and getting a new face to their franchise. The suns already have Brooks and Lopez, this will give them a SF thats younger than their free agent Hill and that can play the up tempo that RJ is used to playing, they will get Bonner to open the floor for them and they will get MC's contract that will open cap space.
So, once again, this trades have logic and common sense.

OR DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING BETTER?????????????????????????????????

[elemento]

How is it realistic ? It is totally one-sided.

Indy trade : We get their starting SF (and franchise player), their starting Center (7"2 foot young Center with tons of potential in his rookie contract) and a PF prospect for Tony Parker and Dejuan Blair? Darren Colison becomes a backup just to fulfil the Spurs needs? They play without a starting Center and start next season with an unproven SF ?

The Suns trade is even worse

Nash and Gortat (the best Suns players) for a terrible contract (you realize they already have Childress as a SF with a bad contract as well), Dice (will retire) and Matt fucking Bonner.

You are clueless.

[Laredoart]

Clueless??

Alright,

Indy Trade: Yes, we get their starting SF(and franchise player) in return we give them our stating PG(and franchise player, NBA Champ, and NBA Finals MVP) so that way they have somebody to run their offense, with championship expierence, we get a SF that has never taken his(franchise) team to the Playoff, their starting C is very negotiable, and they would get 1st round picks for that guy, their PF prospect cancel it selfsout with Blair(whos a better rebounder and better backup), and we will play without our starting PG and unproven PG in Hill.

Suns trade even better

Nash and Gortat (the best trade assets) first, if their starting Hill doesnt resign, which I think he wont(because he will try to get in a championship caliber team), they will have the need for a starting SF that can keep the up tempo, and Childress is not a SF he is a SG, and doesnt have that bad of a contract. They got Brooks for a reason, because his taking over Nash(so they no longer see Nash as a need, but as an assest), they also got Lopez, which is very capable of starting in the NBA, so once again Gortat not a need, but an assest, then they get the cap room from MC's contract, and then they would get Bonner a pretty good shooter that will open the floor for them offensessibly.

Point made, Mr. Clueless

NOW, DO YOU HAPPEN TO HAVE A BETTER TRADE????????????????????????????????

[Mal]

Dude, you really think that Pacers would trade Granger and Hibbert for TP ?

And Suns would trade their starting PG and C , only to get 4th SF with bad contract ?

[Mel_13]

It's gonna be a real long off season.

[Laredoart]

Once again if you read my explanation, then the anwer to your question is yes, I believe it can be done.

[Big P]

You high?

[Tyrone Jenkins]

It's gonna be a real long off season.

You said it brother...

[Tyrone Jenkins]

If I may offer a little light...

TP and RJ are in the beginnings of their contracts - what ever team takes them in a trade must really like both of them to be the mainstays of their franchise. TP would be attractive to the likes of New York, Miami, Atlanta and perhaps New Orleans (if they feel strongly about CPIII leaving).

There are probably very few (read that as almost no) teams interested in taking on RJ's contract; probably the only way he's traded is if the Spurs insist on making him part of a package that is just too attractive for other teams to resist. Maybe Spurs mgt can convince the Wizards, Cavs, Utah or somebody to take him for a draft pic.

If not, Splitter, Blair, Neal and Hill make for good trade bait as they're relatively inexpensive, can play a fairly significant role in just about any system and are in the latter parts of their contracts (except for Splitter).

There ARE some teams that want to part ways w/ their more well known players (Golden State is looking to rid themselves on Monte Ellis, Philly of Iguodala and the Bucks of Brandon Jennings). Unless the Spurs luck up on a situation like these that makes sense to them, they're probably better off just waiting until TD retires and that frees up another $21 million for use in free agency.

So, I'd have to say that I agree - I doubt Indiana is interested in trading Granger. The Suns seem to be expecting Nash to leave as they traded for Aaron Brooks mid season.

[gaspar]

Clueless??

[...]

Nash and Gortat (the best trade assets) first, if their starting Hill doesnt resign, which I think he wont(because he will try to get in a championship caliber team), they will have the need for a starting SF that can keep the up tempo, and Childress is not a SF he is a SG, and doesnt have that bad of a contract. They got Brooks for a reason, because his taking over Nash(so they no longer see Nash as a need, but as an assest), they also got Lopez, which is very capable of starting in the NBA, so once again Gortat not a need, but an assest, then they get the cap room from MC's contract, and then they would get Bonner a pretty good shooter that will open the floor for them offensessibly.

Point made, Mr. Clueless

NOW, DO YOU HAPPEN TO HAVE A BETTER TRADE????????????????????????????????
You are really clueless. Grant Hill already said that he will resign with the Suns or retire if they don't want him. Chilldress has a horrible contract and the Suns don't need another overpaid wing. Lopez isn't capable of starting in the NBA. That's why the Suns traded their second best player (J-Rich) for Gortat. If the Suns trade Nash that means rebuild and they will ask for young talent and draft picks not RJ, McDyess and Bonner.

[UnWantedTheory]

It's gonna be a real long off season.

[mountainballer]

This trades at not unrealistic at all.

oh yes, they are.
currently top of the list of most unrealistic off season trade proposals.
won't stay there for the whole summer.
pretty sure you will soon compete for the top spot again with a new proposal.

[Russo21]

Spurs and Sixers

Parker and Bonner for Elton Brand and Jrue Holiday?

Don't really want to get rid of tony but id love to get rid of bonner so this is just for discussion. Sixers get an all star PG to form with Iguodala to be probably the best back court in the nba.

Jrue Holiday 14pts 4 rebounds 7 assists 1.5 steals 37% 3PT
Elton Brand 15pts 8 rebounds 1 block 1 steal big body

Get rid of RJ for somebody, anyone at all and we'd be pretty solid

Duncan
Brand
F/A SF
Manu
Holiday

Hmm probably not a championship lineup anyway. Would have to see what we could do at SF. Oh well this is the thinktank isn't it:toast

[Spurs da champs]

Spurs and Sixers

Parker and Bonner for Elton Brand and Jrue Holiday?

Don't really want to get rid of tony but id love to get rid of bonner so this is just for discussion. Sixers get an all star PG to form with Iguodala to be probably the best back court in the nba.

Jrue Holiday 14pts 4 rebounds 7 assists 1.5 steals 37% 3PT
Elton Brand 15pts 8 rebounds 1 block 1 steal big body

Get rid of RJ for somebody, anyone at all and we'd be pretty solid

Duncan
Brand
F/A SF
Manu
Holiday

Hmm probably not a championship lineup anyway. Would have to see what we could do at SF. Oh well this is the thinktank isn't it:toast
The 76rs and Doug Collins especially are really high on Holliday I doubt they'd trade him.

[Spursfanfromafar]

If the Clippers are rumoured to be willing to take in Andre Iguodala by swapping him for Chris Kaman, would they not be interested in taking Richard Jefferson instead? Arguably a far worse player than Iguodala, Jefferson's advantage is a relatively better contract than the former. Kaman is no special center, but he will be an adequate backup and a replacement for McDyess, besides commanding an expiring contract. Besides, the Spurs will finally let go of Richard Jefferson and his under-performance.

[tdunk21]

If the Clippers are rumoured to be willing to take in Andre Iguodala by swapping him for Chris Kaman, would they not be interested in taking Richard Jefferson instead? Arguably a far worse player than Iguodala, Jefferson's advantage is a relatively better contract than the former. Kaman is no special center, but he will be an adequate backup and a replacement for McDyess, besides commanding an expiring contract. Besides, the Spurs will finally let go of Richard Jefferson and his under-performance.

latest update about that rumour has the sixers demanding more than kaman for Iguodala....

[Mel_13]

If the Clippers are rumoured to be willing to take in Andre Iguodala by swapping him for Chris Kaman, would they not be interested in taking Richard Jefferson instead? Arguably a far worse player than Iguodala, Jefferson's advantage is a relatively better contract than the former. Kaman is no special center, but he will be an adequate backup and a replacement for McDyess, besides commanding an expiring contract. Besides, the Spurs will finally let go of Richard Jefferson and his under-performance.

There's really no argument.

[Spursfanfromafar]

There's really no argument.

Clips' fan perspective - http://www.clipsnation.com/2011/6/8/2207832/los-angeles-clippers-andre-iguodala-chris-kaman-trade ..

Richard Jefferson seems to be one among the many choices.

[objective]

Clips' fan perspective - http://www.clipsnation.com/2011/6/8/2207832/los-angeles-clippers-andre-iguodala-chris-kaman-trade ..

Richard Jefferson seems to be one among the many choices.

The writer just listed every small forward who's been an all-star. There was no consideration given to Jefferson other than that, he was just listed among other has-beens (Peja) and franchise-killing contracts (Rashard Lewis).

[Tyrone Jenkins]

If I were the Clippers GM, I would not trade Kaman for RJ. Not even if the Spurs threw in their 1st round pick...

[Mal]

If I were the Clippers GM, I would not trade Kaman for RJ. Not even if the Spurs threw in their 1st round pick...

It`s obvious that RJ isnt high on their list, but if they couldnt trade Kaman for SF, Spurs might have a chance. Not a draft pick, but Blair and deal could be done. Clippers need SF, they wont play Aminu or Gomes in s5, and Kaman is already gone.

But they are Clippers. They would take a draft pick, and go into rebuilding mode once again.

[SenorSpur]

RJ would be better off in the more uptempo style of offense, that the Clippers play. And with all the attention generated by Blake Griffin, he'd get numerous wide open looks. Spurs need to set him free because he never made sense in SA from the gitgo.

I'm sure RJ would welcome a return to the West Coast.

[SenorSpur]

It`s obvious that RJ isnt high on their list, but if they couldnt trade Kaman for SF, Spurs might have a chance. Not a draft pick, but Blair and deal could be done. Clippers need SF, they wont play Aminu or Gomes in s5, and Kaman is already gone.

But they are Clippers. They would take a draft pick, and go into rebuilding mode once again.

Clippers probably don't want any more 1st round picks. They could be ripe for the taking. Whatever trade proposals are discussed, if any, the Spurs should fenagle a 1st round pick out of them.

[Bruno]

Asking Clippers to give up a good center with an expiring contract in addition with taking RJ's contract is likely too much.

The RJ trade that makes the most sense for Clippers is RJ for Ryan Gomes. Gomes has been bad for them, has still $8M left on his contract and will be their 3rs sting SF behind RJ and Aminu.

[objective]

RJ would be better off in the more uptempo style of offense, that the Clippers play. And with all the attention generated by Blake Griffin, he'd get numerous wide open looks. Spurs need to set him free because he never made sense in SA from the gitgo.

I'm sure RJ would welcome a return to the West Coast.

I doubt it. It's not about open looks, which he got plenty of with Duncan, Ginobili and Parker getting attention.

It's about touches for RJ, and he wouldn't be getting any more with guys like Griffin, Gordon, Kaman, and so on being ahead of him in the pecking order.

Maybe he would squeak out some more alley-oop attempts, but his declining athleticism would soon leave him out.

[Mal]

The RJ trade that makes the most sense for Clippers is RJ for Ryan Gomes. Gomes has been bad for them, has still $8M left on his contract and will be their 3rs sting SF behind RJ and Aminu.

Do you think Clippers could add theirs pick, since they have T-Wolves pick next year ? RJ = Gomes + pick ? Or RJ + Bonner + Blair/Anderson + Dice = Kaman + Gomes + pick.

[yavozerb]

Do you think Clippers could add theirs pick, since they have T-Wolves pick next year ? RJ = Gomes + pick ? Or RJ + Bonner + Blair/Anderson + Dice = Kaman + Gomes + pick.

Why would the clips add a pick when they are taking on RJ's contract? Damn, I know we all want the spurs to get the best of trades, but this shit is out of control...

[Bruno]

Do you think Clippers could add theirs pick, since they have T-Wolves pick next year ? RJ = Gomes + pick ? Or RJ + Bonner + Blair/Anderson + Dice = Kaman + Gomes + pick.

Clippers already have traded their 2012 first round pick last year to get Bledsoe in the draft.

And I agree with yavozerb. Even RJ + #29 for Gomes would be a great trade for Spurs.

[Duncan2177]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3lkretc

[rascal]

My main problem with RJ is that he is paid way too much. His big contract hurts Spurs by taking away their limited financial resources. If Spurs had basically unlimited financial resources like few teams in the league, RJ wouldn't be a that big problem.

They should have never brought back Bonner or RJ last year.

[Laredoart]

Bottom line,
The Spurs are trading, the question is, what are we getting, everybody knows what the Spurs need, and therefore every big man is going to have more value against the Spurs, what the we need to do is sign a big man from the free agent pool, we all know that Tim is gonna have to let some of his money go, to be able make some cap room. Then we should trade TP for the SF we need, and the reasons we need to trade TP are simple, 1 hes the most value asset we got, 2 the dude is loosing value as he continues playing with all the drama in his personal life, and 3 is alot easier to find the next TP than the next Manu or Duncan. And the last point I would like to make is the following, RJ has to go to any team for any draft pick, and money, just to have them take our garbage out, some people would said that he has no value, but theres a few teams where he will fit their system, and that should be some of our offseason goals.

[Mal]

Why would the clips add a pick when they are taking on RJ's contract? Damn, I know we all want the spurs to get the best of trades, but this shit is out of control...

Just talking. RJ is serious upgrade to Gomes. But since they already get rid of their 2012 pick, it is end of topic.

[Tyrone Jenkins]

Why would the Spurs want Gomes if he's owed about the same money? RJ is bad but not as bad as Gomes...

[yavozerb]

Why would the Spurs want Gomes if he's owed about the same money? RJ is bad but not as bad as Gomes...

Gomes is only owed 4 mil for 2 more seasons...LAC are way under the cap so they can take a player like RJ and not give back a player of equal value..

[Russo21]

I wander if Atlanta want an upgrade at Point Guard?

Tony Parker and Matt Bonner for Al Horford and Kirk Hinrich?

We immediately get a 15pt 9 reb all star calibre Centre and a downgrade at PG but still an adequate Point Guard with career averages of 13 and 6 and shot 40% from three this year.

Atlanta get a superstar Point man and Bonner and or Blair or whoever the hell they'd want.

We'd have a nasty lineup especially if we then got rid of RJ for someone.

[Russo21]

Horford
Duncan
RJ/ or F/A SF
Manu
Hinrich

Not too bad?

[tdunk21]

I wander if Atlanta want an upgrade at Point Guard?

Tony Parker and Matt Bonner for Al Horford and Kirk Hinrich?

We immediately get a 15pt 9 reb all star calibre Centre and a downgrade at PG but still an adequate Point Guard with career averages of 13 and 6 and shot 40% from three this year.

Atlanta get a superstar Point man and Bonner and or Blair or whoever the hell they'd want.

We'd have a nasty lineup especially if we then got rid of RJ for someone.

atlanta will never trade horford

[Russo21]

To me a trade to get RJ out of San Antonio would be to pair him with Parker and see if Utah want to trade them for Al Jefferson and Devin Harris. Unlikely Utah would give up someone of Big Al's size and skill cause that is rare. AK47 is a F/A so the Jazz may have a void at SF to fill and RJ would fill that need nicely.

That would leave us with

Al Jefferson
Tim Duncan
F/A SF
Manu Ginobili
Devin Harris

If you could nab a Boris Diaw, Josh Howard, Andre Kirilenko to start at SF that would be a formidable lineup. (can't think of any other F/A SF at the moment)

It's hard to imagine the spurs not having tony on our team but this is just for discussion for fans hey. Nobody in here is an nba executive or knows what the execs are thinking :-) It's a lineup i'd love to see.

[UnWantedTheory]

I love that fans throw out anything from semi known names to unattainable ones, reasonable or not. Keeps it depressingly fresh.

[Russo21]

I love that fans throw out anything from semi known names to unattainable ones, reasonable or not. Keeps it depressingly fresh.

It's a long offseason:wakeupWe fans have plenty of time to throw out shitty trades (realistic or unrealistic/improve our team or not) which most likely would never happen.

When it comes down to it, you arent a GM, i am not a GM, nobody else in here is a GM so we don't know WTF will happen. It's a longer then expected offseason for fans to dream and pretend what we'd do if we were a GM.

Does anyone here know when Free Agency and the Trade Period begins?:wakeupCan't wait to see what is really going to happen.

[spurs10]

To me a trade to get RJ out of San Antonio would be to pair him with Parker and see if Utah want to trade them for Al Jefferson and Devin Harris. Unlikely Utah would give up someone of Big Al's size and skill cause that is rare. AK47 is a F/A so the Jazz may have a void at SF to fill and RJ would fill that need nicely.

That would leave us with

Al Jefferson
Tim Duncan
F/A SF
Manu Ginobiliior
Devin Harris

If you could nab a Boris Diaw, Josh Howard, Andre Kirilenko to start at SF that would be a formidable lineup. (can't think of any other F/A SF at the moment)

It's hard to imagine the spurs not having tony on our team but this is just for discussion for fans hey. Nobody in here is an nba executive or knows what the execs are thinking :-) It's a lineup i'd love to see.
I've been enjoying reading your enthusiastic trade scenarios, however as R.C. eluded to, Tim won't be playing the 4 b/c he can no longer guard them. So it would seem we need a 4 more than a 5, with Tiago certainly being an important piece at the 5. I think we need to be thinking who can start next to Tim. The idea of finding a new SF is also very much on every one's wish list, but not as likely or as big of a priority.

[Russo21]

Thanks Spurs10, i didn't know or forgot that RC eluded to that.

Sadly tim can hardly guard 5's or score on them either, most are too big and too strong for him especially with the weight he lost last year to minimise the wear and tear on his legs. Then gets abused by smaller quicker more athletic PF's like Millsap, Aldridge etc. It's tough seeing the Great One on the decline. In his prime he would dominate those sort of players while hardly breaking a sweat.

Age is a bitter twisted narcissistic bastard that nobody can defeat:-(

[spurs10]

Thanks Spurs10, i didn't know or forgot that RC eluded to that.

Sadly tim can hardly guard 5's or score on them either, most are too big and too strong for him especially with the weight he lost last year to minimise the wear and tear on his legs. Then gets abused by smaller quicker more athletic PF's like Millsap, Aldridge etc. It's tough seeing the Great One on the decline. In his prime he would dominate those sort of players while hardly breaking a sweat.

Age is a bitter twisted narcissistic bastard that nobody can defeat:-(
Ain't it the truth....:toast

[Tyrone Jenkins]

Essentially, the Spurs delimna is this...

Tim Duncan isn't really an offensive or defensive force - he's more of a 10 pts / 6 rebound guy who will have spurts of his game of old but for the most part will be average. And, he'll be earning $21 million to do it if a new deal isn't worked out. IMO, the only untradeable asset.

Tiago Splitter really should be THE guy relied upon to score and be more of a defensive presence. If all goes extremely well, he'll be a 15-18 pt / 8-10 rebound a game guy. Expectations will be probably be 12/7 or so...tradeable but one of the last to go if needed.

DeJuan Blair is interesting in that he can really play - can score, gets out and fills the lane on fast breaks and can rebound. Just too much of a liability on defense due to lack of length. Not sure of what he will be expected to contribute and when - can't imagine there will be GREATER expectations of him next year.

Richard Jefferson - could possibly contribute if in a different system (that allows him to be one of the primary options AND if given room to make moves). Since SA doesn't run that system, he's a significant liability in that his lack of defense doesn't justify his playing time or salary.

Matt Bonner - role player, 3 pt shooter. Worth every penny when he's shooting >37.5% from beyond the arc; when he's not, he's a defensive liability. Is being paid to much for such a role.

McDyess - retired.

Ryan Richards - not ready for prime time.

Given those options, I would suggest that the Spurs bite the bullet and just concede to re-building. That would mean they trade DeJuan Blair and some other asset (preferably Jefferson but perhaps Hill, Neal, Anderson or Butler) and pick up a VETERAN defensive small forward. Perhaps a sign and trade for Tayshaun Prince, AK47, Wilson Chandler, whomever.

Next, they should commit to starting TP, Anderson or Butler (whichever one is best and isn't traded), FA SF, Splitter and whomever the Spurs can pick up w/ the 29th pick. Manu would be the 6th man and TD would come in off the bench. Essentially, the Spurs would start 3 "new" people.

That would mean that 1 year from now, they would have a core of TP, Anderson/Butler, FA SF, Splitter and 29th pick w/ quite a bit of cap space once Duncan's salary comes off the books. Another few years and Manu's would come off as well.

[ChuckD]

Essentially, the Spurs delimna is this...

Tim Duncan isn't really an offensive or defensive force - he's more of a 10 pts / 6 rebound guy who will have spurts of his game of old but for the most part will be average. And, he'll be earning $21 million to do it if a new deal isn't worked out. IMO, the only untradeable asset.

Tiago Splitter really should be THE guy relied upon to score and be more of a defensive presence. If all goes extremely well, he'll be a 15-18 pt / 8-10 rebound a game guy. Expectations will be probably be 12/7 or so...tradeable but one of the last to go if needed.

DeJuan Blair is interesting in that he can really play - can score, gets out and fills the lane on fast breaks and can rebound. Just too much of a liability on defense due to lack of length. Not sure of what he will be expected to contribute and when - can't imagine there will be GREATER expectations of him next year.

Richard Jefferson - could possibly contribute if in a different system (that allows him to be one of the primary options AND if given room to make moves). Since SA doesn't run that system, he's a significant liability in that his lack of defense doesn't justify his playing time or salary.

Matt Bonner - role player, 3 pt shooter. Worth every penny when he's shooting >37.5% from beyond the arc; when he's not, he's a defensive liability. Is being paid to much for such a role.

McDyess - retired.

Ryan Richards - not ready for prime time.

Given those options, I would suggest that the Spurs bite the bullet and just concede to re-building. That would mean they trade DeJuan Blair and some other asset (preferably Jefferson but perhaps Hill, Neal, Anderson or Butler) and pick up a VETERAN defensive small forward. Perhaps a sign and trade for Tayshaun Prince, AK47, Wilson Chandler, whomever.

Next, they should commit to starting TP, Anderson or Butler (whichever one is best and isn't traded), FA SF, Splitter and whomever the Spurs can pick up w/ the 29th pick. Manu would be the 6th man and TD would come in off the bench. Essentially, the Spurs would start 3 "new" people.

That would mean that 1 year from now, they would have a core of TP, Anderson/Butler, FA SF, Splitter and 29th pick w/ quite a bit of cap space once Duncan's salary comes off the books. Another few years and Manu's would come off as well.

You lost me in the first paragraph when you said Duncan was a 10/6 player (13/9, actual) who wasn't a defensive force. Of all NBA big men, he had the second best pts/100 possessions in the league while on the floor.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3lkretc

I can actually see that happen.

[Russo21]

I can actually see that happen.

Yeah me to. In my oppinion all three teams come out on top in your scenario.

Especially new york who would pair Chris Paul with Carmello and Amare Stoudemire. That's a nasty freakin trio! New Orleans get an all star PG and starting SF and save cash from the retiring dice.

Spurs get a starting C/PF capable of putting up 14pts 10reb 2blocks on high FG% and a solid championship tested, clutch shooting defensive PG.

I'd do that trade for sure. :toastand i reckon new orleans, san antonio's and new york's front office would think about it to, nice one.

[Vic Petro]

SAS: Gasol, Ariza
NO: Parker, Odom
LAL: Paul, Bonner, McDyess

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=5rn28ja

[Russo21]

SAS: Gasol, Ariza
NO: Parker, Odom
LAL: Paul, Bonner, McDyess

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=5rn28ja

Very intruiging to:toast

I say new orleans definately do it
i say san antonio definately do it

Lakers i dont know. They get the best PG in the game but would they get rid of two of there main 3 bigs to get him? They'd probably have the best backcourt in history in Paul and Kobe.

Interesting prospect. We'd need to shop for a starting PG though. I don't quite trust George Hill to successfully run the point all year.

Gasol
Duncan
Ariza
Ginobili
F/A PG

Would be nice to see

[venitian navigator]

Parker+ Neal+RJ+Dice contract+Blair for Paul+Ariza+Okafor

Reasons why could work

for N.O.

N.O. knows that they're going nowhere with the current line-up
Okafor contract is a bad one compared to the player's value
Blair and Neal contract are really friendly for two years and the players are young...Blair have already showed that, if given time, can be a 10/10 man
Parker contract is a very good one compared to the player's value
Dice contract goes off the books
RJ could finally became the second/third offensive option, that's still capable of being

for S.A.
They just get in a single move all the missing pieces they need.
1) a play maker that can defend
2) a small forward that can defend and occasionally hit the three
3) a third (pseudo Robinsenesque) big still young enough to run and block shots

[Russo21]

I wish:depressed

Okafor
Duncan
Ariza
Ginobili
Paul

Now that's just nasty. There's not one weakness in that starting lineup:lobt2:

[Duncan2177]

This trade?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3geljwl

[Tyrone Jenkins]

You lost me in the first paragraph when you said Duncan was a 10/6 player (13/9, actual) who wasn't a defensive force. Of all NBA big men, he had the second best pts/100 possessions in the league while on the floor.

Duncan's efficiency is still up there (21.9) but his time and touches will probably decrease next year - hopefully - w/ Splitter playing more. 10/6 is speculation.

Even at 13/9, the Spurs are still short quite a few points vs. championship competition. Let's quit fooling ourselvesl about Duncan...one of the best (THE BEST in my opinion) PF to every play the game. In his prime, yes, the Spurs are Championship caliber. Now, Spurs not contending.

Time to find his replacements (will be a combination of people).

[Ditty]

Mcdyess,Hill for Darko,Ridnour and the 20th pick...makes sense for Minn to get rid of 2 overpaid long contracts, while Spurs get two needs:Center and backup point guards. Minn doesn't want too many rookie contracts and need a combo shooting guard, and don't want 3 point guards with rubio coming over, and they will compensate us for taking 2 bad contracts for the 20th pick.


Rj and Blair for Childress and Warrick..spurs take 2 more long term contracts that suns want to get rid of, and Rj fits better in there up tempo system. Blair can be there back up PF to Frye, and has a good contract. Childress helps us out and fits better in our system, and warrick is a decent back up power forward.

[Russo21]

I'd take a shot at Nenad Kristic and or Kwame Brown as our bigs next to tim. Boris Diaw at SF. JR Smith as a gunner off the bench or starting if pop wants manu coming off the bench.

Then trade RJ Blair and Bonner for anything we can get.

C Nenad Kristic, Kwame Brown
PF Tim Duncan, Tiago Splitter
SF Boris Diaw
SG Manu Ginobili, JR Smith
PG Tony Parker, George Hill, Gary Neal

Not a bad 10 man rotation. Not brilliant but pretty descent. Fill in some holes by trading RJ Blair and Bonner and we could be in contention without breaking up the big three or doing anything too drastic.

Something like that wouldnt be too bad

[mosdef17]

Krstic just signed a multi-year deal in Russia, doesn't look like he will play in the NBA again at this stage.

[Russo21]

oh! my bad, i didn't know that :toast

[venitian navigator]

Now that dallas is on the market again, one possible trade for RJ haters could be
RJ+ Dice contract for Haywood + Brewer
I wouild never do that 'cause of Haywood contract, but it's clear a trade that could benefit us in the short term.

[admiralsnackbar]

Now that dallas is on the market again, one possible trade for RJ haters could be
RJ+ Dice contract for Haywood + Brewer
I wouild never do that 'cause of Haywood contract, but it's clear a trade that could benefit us in the short term.
Us? Yes. Dallas? No.

No deal.

[tdunk21]

bulls looking to trade gibson and asik for a SG.....both of them make under 2 mil next season....

Hill for gibson and asik?

[tdunk21]

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=20103


Here's what isn't in question: the Chicago Bulls need an upgrade at the two guard position. Nothing against Keith Bogans, Kyle Korver, and/or Ronnie Brewer, but not a single one of those guys is a player you'd expect to be the starting shooting guard on a championship team.

What is in question is what player would fit best with this team, and also what player Chicago can most realistically acquire. There are a few free agents on this list, but the Bulls don't have any cap space, and who knows if the sign-and-trade option will be a possibility under the new CBA? The rest of the guys are already under contract, so Chicago will have to work out a deal to bring them in.

They've got some tradable assets, but not many. Taj Gibson and Omer Asik both make under $2 million next season and have considerable upside, and the team does hold what could eventually be a lottery pick from the Tyrus Thomas trade with Charlotte. It's lottery protected in 2012, but loses more and more protection each year for four years. Charlotte projects to fall short of the postseason for the foreseeable future, so that could be something they toss into a deal, but beyond that pick, Asik, and Gibson, what does Chicago have that other teams would really want?

That's the question at hand, and as we look at a handful of potential two guards today, we'll also explore what the team would have to do (or could do) in order to bring in that particular player. One way or another, though, the Bulls have some work to get done. Here are a few suggestions as to what that work should entail.

[Duncan2177]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3ddekr4


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3resl4t


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3e2h5nu


Any thoughts?

[tdunk21]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3ddekr4


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3resl4t


http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3e2h5nu


Any thoughts?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3ddekr4
Granger is their franchise player and moreover they have darren collison, so no point in trading for tony

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3resl4t
same with suns, they have brooks and will likely pay him to be their starting PG..

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3e2h5nu
this could be possible, but with the news of rubio coming over to play in the NBA for the wolves, this likely wont happen

[ChuckD]

bulls looking to trade gibson and asik for a SG.....both of them make under 2 mil next season....

Hill for gibson and asik?

I can tell you they're absolutely NOT moving Asik.

[ChuckD]

Since Charlotte is re-tooling again, anyone for an RJ/Jack swap? Their money is almost identical, and Jack has one less year remaining. We'd have to do them some sort of solid to take RJ's extra year, maybe throw in one of our young SGs, or work something with Dice's contract. RJ can still score, and his post-season fades won't be a problem for a team that likely won't see that time of year for the rest of his contract.

[tdunk21]

Since Charlotte is re-tooling again, anyone for an RJ/Jack swap? Their money is almost identical, and Jack has one less year remaining. We'd have to do them some sort of solid to take RJ's extra year, maybe throw in one of our young SGs, or work something with Dice's contract. RJ can still score, and his post-season fades won't be a problem for a team that likely won't see that time of year for the rest of his contract.

RJ, dice for jackson, tyrus thomas....MJ was stupid enough to get rid of gerald wallace....spurs FO should throw in a pick and see if he bites

[ChuckD]

RJ, dice for jackson, tyrus thomas....MJ was stupid enough to get rid of gerald wallace....spurs FO should throw in a pick and see if he bites

I think the first part works, but I think CHA can get a LOT more for TT than Dice's half price contract. I don't think even a pick+cash would do it.

[yavozerb]

Jackson and Diop should be packaged if Im MJ..Diop is still owed around 14 mil over 2 seasons.

[ace3g]

not sure if this would impact anything involving the Bobcats but:

sam_amick Sam Amick
RT @jwquick: Rich Cho hired as GM of Charlotte Bobcats, Charlotte Observer reporting

[Tyrone Jenkins]

If bulls are trying to move Gibson, I'd be happy w/ parting w/ Hill, Neal, Anderson or Butler (in that order) for him. Gibson has length, athleticism and can play defense.

The Spurs have 5, count them 5 SGs (I don't care what anyone says, Butler is an SG). Losing one of the above would be of little impact.