Season On court Off court +/- For Spurs Players

[whottt]

Player On Court +/- Off Court +/- Team Net +/-
Duncan +15.6 -1.9 +17.5
Ginobili +15.9 +1.3 +14.6
Glover +15.9 +9.3 +6.5
Nesterovic +11.6 +7.4 +4.1
Horry +11.6 +8.4 +3.2
Marks +11.8 +9.4 +2.5
Parker +9.8 +8.4 +1.4
Bowen +9.1 +10.0 -1.0
Udrih +8.4 +9.8 -1.4
Barry +7.7 +10.7 -3.0
Rose +1.7 +12.2 -10.4
Brown +1.6 +14.1 -12.5
Wilks -3.2 +10.1 -13.3
Massenburg -3.3 +11.8 -15.1
Mohammed -9.4 +10.3 -19.7

[boutons]

What? No comment? "The numbers speak for themselves" ?

Didn't Kori ask us not to start infiinite number of Rose threads?

:)

[whottt]

The freaking code thing never works right.

[boutons]

You have to hard format (letters, spaces only) the text.

Formatting characers like tabs aren't allowed.

Malik would have and the heart and fire to come off the bench figure that out, and Brent would have "led" you to the answer 43% of the time.

:lol

[whottt]

What's that supposed to mean boutons?

I give Nazr a free pass since virtually his entire Spurs career has been Duncanless...plus I am assuming he will get better.

As for Malik...he's been used exclusively as Duncan's back up this season...tough to have an impressive +/- when you've spent less time on the court with Duncan than anyone...he got DNPCD in some of our easiest games of the season...a bunch of them...and no one ever said Malik was the key to blowout vicotories...

Devin Brown OTOH is quite revealing...the team performed the worst with him on the court and the best with him off of it...and he has not gotten DNPCD'ed..he also grades out low in the areas of clutch performance and a few other surprising areas...

It's kinda surprising to me actually...I knew he was overhyped by the board bigtime and that for whatever reason the team doesn't seem to perform as well with him in the game...but I am surprised at how poorly he grades out in a lot of key statistical team performance categories...it's obviously not because of a lack of effort...but there is no denying the team performs the worst with him in the game...he's disruptive to the flow of the team when he is on the court for what ever reason..I think it's greeness...and it's not just the +/- either...

The worst offensive and defensive 5 man units on the team feature Devin Brown.

[whottt]

You have to hard format (letters, spaces only) the text.

Formatting characers like tabs aren't allowed.

Malik would have and the heart and fire to come off the bench figure that out, and Brent would have "led" you to the answer 43% of the time.

:lol

I didn't hard format ot tab space anything...I CNPED it...sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

And I don't get your point on Barry but it seems to be relating to something else at 82games.com.

[whottt]

As for Barry...he comes in for Manu, the second most effective player on the team(and the most in some areas) including starting for him every time he was out this season...and starting some games without Duncan...his +/- is more than adequate, especially for someone that is "struggling".

Honestly the most impressive bench players are Horry and Beno...Horry doesn't surprise me since he's Horry and that's what he does...he's a starter off the bench and teams win with him on the court no matter how disinterested he seems to be(as long as there is a dominant bigman for him to play off of).....but I can't quite figure Beno out...

[Uncle Donnie]

Devin's biggest problem is the same one Malik had...he holds the ball too long and doesn't look to pass as often as he should. Our offense often slows down when he's out there so those numbers don't surprise me. Some games he'll put up a decent amount of points but still hurt the team.

That said, as you pointed out those numbers are not completely reliable because of rotations. Devin is also out there alot with other bench players, which will drag his +/- down a bit.

[Useruser666]

Why is Rose on the list? He doesn't play for the Spurs.

[whottt]

Since you asked User, I'll post the Knicks +/- as well.


Player On Court +/- Off Court +/- Team Net +/-
Butler +35.1 -1.9 +37.1
Marbury +0.1 -11.6 +11.8
Taylor +4.9 -2.2 +7.1
Rose +4.3 -2.4 +6.7
Houston +1.9 -2.7 +4.6
Williams +0.4 -2.9 +3.4
Sweetney +0.3 -3.1 +3.4
Ariza -1.1 -2.3 +1.2
K.Thomas -2.0 -1.6 -0.4
Crawford -2.3 -1.3 -1.0
Norris -3.6 -1.7 -1.9
T.Thomas -3.0 -0.9 -2.1
Mohammed -4.0 +0.0 -4.0
Hardaway -4.8 -0.8 -4.0
Jackson -8.3 -1.8 -6.5
Sundov -10.8 -1.7 -9.1
Baker -15.9 -1.0 -14.9
Anderson -16.8 -1.8 -15.0
Brewer -17.1 -1.0 -16.2

[whottt]

Malik is obviously among their leaders...

I like Mohammed's +/- numbers on the Knicks....those are pretty good numbers considering how bad the Knicks were when he was there...Obviously the team didn't perform that badly with him on the court...

Of course it's always disturbing when a team gets outscored when their starting C is on the court and they don't when he is off of it :wtf

[TDfan2007]

Player On Court +/- Off Court +/- Team Net +/-
Duncan +15.6 -1.9 +17.5
Ginobili +15.9 +1.3 +14.6
Glover +15.9 +9.3 +6.5
Nesterovic +11.6 +7.4 +4.1
Horry +11.6 +8.4 +3.2
Marks +11.8 +9.4 +2.5
Parker +9.8 +8.4 +1.4
Bowen +9.1 +10.0 -1.0
Udrih +8.4 +9.8 -1.4
Barry +7.7 +10.7 -3.0
Rose +1.7 +12.2 -10.4
Brown +1.6 +14.1 -12.5
Wilks -3.2 +10.1 -13.3
Massenburg -3.3 +11.8 -15.1
Mohammed -9.4 +10.3 -19.7


We really need this guy back, I don't care if Mohammed's minutes are killing us, as long as Tim is on the floor, we win.

[wildbill2u]

Devin's biggest problem is the same one Malik had...he holds the ball too long and doesn't look to pass as often as he should. Our offense often slows down when he's out there so those numbers don't surprise me. Some games he'll put up a decent amount of points but still hurt the team.

That said, as you pointed out those numbers are not completely reliable because of rotations. Devin is also out there alot with other bench players, which will drag his +/- down a bit.

although I like Devin, and expected him to be much improved this year, I agree with most of the above. What some folks see as "willing to shoot with lots of heart" I now see as something of a ball hog. Who hasn't played with one of those guys who'll never give the ball up and always shoot?

Granted he's under pressure when he comes in to show he can play, but He can get better when he learns to play smarter.

[kskonn]

although I like Devin, and expected him to be much improved this year, I agree with most of the above. What some folks see as "willing to shoot with lots of heart" I now see as something of a ball hog. Who hasn't played with one of those guys who'll never give the ball up and always shoot?

Granted he's under pressure when he comes in to show he can play, but He can get better when he learns to play smarter.


I would like to also ad that Devin is Often indecisive on the court. I think it has to do with the Ball hog statement, he realizes he holds the ball and shoots to much so then he thinks about passing when he shouldn't. that often causes bad plays, or "busted plays"

[Rummpd]

I guess this means the START GLOVER threads are right around the corner now.

[xcoriate]

I think Whottt hit the nail on the head in regards to Devin.

He plays a lot of minutes with Beno, Barry and Horry. All great passers, with good bball IQ.

Something Devin unfortunately seems to lack. He is the equivilent of rose instead at the SG/SF position.