George Hill this offseason [Archive]

Wolverine83

05-11-2009, 05:23 PM

I hope George Hill works with Chip England this offseason to improve his shot. I really have high hopes for this guy, I love his athleticism and defense, but as of now, the guy just can't shoot. If Hill could develop a jumper I'd love to see him starting next year at the 2 spot. I think our biggest NEED is to go out and get a CENTER, to start for us, with Duncan playing his natural PF position, and Gooden being on our bench at the backup PF.

Starters:
PG Tony Parker
SG George Hill
SF Manu Ginobili
PF Tim Duncan
C ?????

lefty

05-11-2009, 05:28 PM

George hill's shot is not bad at all.

The only thing we can hope for is that Pop gives him more fucking minutes.

That would be the best thing for his development

rayray2k8

05-11-2009, 05:49 PM

Hopefully now Pop doesn't second guess Hill next year.

BackHome

05-11-2009, 05:49 PM

The first thing they need to do is stop trying to make him a PG it aint going to happen. If he stays at his NATURAL position SG he just needs to work on finishing and his mid range shot.

Spurs_9_20_21

05-11-2009, 05:53 PM

The first thing they need to do is stop trying to make him a PG it aint going to happen. If he stays at his NATURAL position SG he just needs to work on finishing and his mid range shot.
Well if he does develop into a PG that'd be great but don't you think he's a little undersized to play SG? I think so, but that's just me.

SenorSpur

05-11-2009, 06:02 PM

The first thing they need to do is stop trying to make him a PG it aint going to happen. If he stays at his NATURAL position SG he just needs to work on finishing and his mid range shot.

He's too short to play SG in the NBA. There's no evidence at all that indicates he cannot develop into a quality backup PG.

024

05-11-2009, 06:08 PM

DMX7

05-11-2009, 06:20 PM

George hill's shot is not bad at all.

I think that's a stretch.

Marcus Bryant

05-11-2009, 06:31 PM

If Pop can leave Hill at backup point and Mason at the 2 then that will be an improvement right there. Manu back at full strength should take care of 2. If Finley opts to come back then hopefully the Spurs will find a deal that includes his expiring contract.

Fabbs

05-11-2009, 06:40 PM

Spurs were like 35-15 with Hill at the backup point before Lord Numb Nutts benched him for the Mason-at-point-guard *experiment*.

So don't know where you "Not sure if Hill can play point" people come from.

poop

05-11-2009, 07:53 PM

i never understand where all these people get this 'he just cant shoot' BS.

his shot was fine and for many games, his was the only one falling.

Spursfan092120

05-11-2009, 08:06 PM

are we assuming Bruce is gone?

BackHome

05-11-2009, 08:19 PM

Well if he does develop into a PG that'd be great but don't you think he's a little undersized to play SG? I think so, but that's just me.

I know everyone and their mother thinks Hill is the next Tony Parker but someone has to say it.....He aint a PG...........We all know that every time we get a player everyone falls in love with them and thinks they are the next Micahel Jordan.........Pops, Harriston, Ian, Ime, etc....but people need to be real.

It is not like I want the guy to fail but putting him as a backup PG will make him fail. The guy is athletic he can guard people and he can rebound without a doubt. The problem is that he has no court vision and he can not create easy shots for his team mates. That creates problems in that when he has the ball in his hands teams will play off him and make it harder for people like Mason to get their shot off.

urunobili

05-11-2009, 08:34 PM

His three point stroke in the PO didn't seem to need much work :wakeup

NewJerSpur

05-11-2009, 08:56 PM

People seriously need to get off the "undersized SG" wagon.

For the 18th time:

-Jason Terry is 6'2 and plays SG.
-Joe Dumars was only an inch taller and had a very productive career at the 2-guard spot....I believe Hill has more reach and athleticism than Joe did.

Pop felt pretty good playing him where he is in my avatar during the playoffs: Right next to Tony Parker. I think if he expands his jumpshooting capabilities so he is able to pull up and drain mid-tange shots with consistency he'll be a real threat offensively and give us a solid threat on BOTH ends of the court to start the game....which will be especially good on the defensive side of the ball if Bruce does not return, though I'm hoping he does.

angelbelow

05-11-2009, 09:20 PM

i thought his shot wasnt too bad. formed looked pretty good to me.

thOOdee

05-11-2009, 09:34 PM

People seriously need to get off the "undersized SG" wagon.

For the 18th time:

-Jason Terry is 6'2 and plays SG.

using jason terry for an example is something you may want to re-think. if anything it pleads the case why we shouldn't have an undersized sg.

Riverwalkman

05-11-2009, 09:39 PM

I think Hill's shot is not bad,just not so smooth sometimes.

He's got potential to make good shots as Tony's.

He's athletic as Terry and Gordon,he can matchup with them.In his rookie year he defended bigger guys like Kobe, Dirk.So he can play 2.

NewJerSpur

05-11-2009, 09:47 PM

using jason terry for an example is something you may want to re-think. if anything it pleads the case why we shouldn't have an undersized sg.

The guy is a starting caliber SG who just came off of winning the 6th Man of the Year Award and has still averaged double-digit figures in scoring for most of his career.

thOOdee

05-11-2009, 09:55 PM

yuh but how is terry on the defensive end w the minutes he plays...

NewJerSpur

05-11-2009, 10:00 PM

yuh but how is terry on the defensive end w the minutes he plays...

The point of my comparison has to do with their comparable size at the position. Terry has still been successful in general as a 2-guard, particularly on the offensive end, which bodes well for Hill who is of the same height and has more athleticism if he can improve his stroke off of the dribble IMO. If anything, by you bringing up your point, it helps my argument because George has proven he has more potential on the defensive end of the ball than Terry.

Blackjack

05-12-2009, 02:01 AM

No, he's not a point-guard. (Point-guards are born, not made, afterall)

He's a combo-guard, who can run the point.

And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Hill's going to be fine shooting-wise. The guy was consistently around 50% for the entirety of his college days, overall, while also possessing a very solid 3-point stroke.(even as high as 47% in his junior year from 3-point land, IIRC)

The things I needed to see from Hill were his: athleticism at the NBA-level, his toughness/mental-makeup, and his coachability; All of which were better than I could've imagined.

I'll be pretty suprised if you don't see a pretty decent jump in his offensive game going into next season. A year under his belt under the system, a better idea of his role, and a better knowledge of where and when his shots will come in the offense will do wonders for his game.

The thing that he does need to work on though, is allowing his long arms to be as beneficial on the offensive-end as they are on the defensive-end.

I don't have any worries about his shot with his feet set, but off the dribble?

Those long arms become a detriment.

Chip's going to really have to help him refine his mechanics, so that the movement in those long arms, doesn't detract too much in the consistency of his stroke.

His trouble finishing around the rim can also somewhat be attributed to those same long arms. He'll often times have no trouble getting to his spots at the rim but by the time he slows and uncoils for the layup, the defender often times is allowed back in the play to block/alter the shot.

George could do himself a lot of good studying how Tony is able to go off both feet and finish by taking off from different angles, at different speeds. Varying the natural hitch that he has to to give him balance and rhythm before the release of the finish/layup also couldn't hurt; it's that uncoiling that takes away his advantage, at times.

Seeing Rondo's success finishing, ala Parker, with a similar build to Hill, gives me hope that George can eventually do the same.

mingus

05-12-2009, 03:41 AM

i'm not sure if hill can transition into a pg. my only hope is that the spurs' system is too methodical anyways to need a creative point guard. hill needs to develop some court vision if he wants to be pg but he doesn't need to turn into chris paul. drive and kick is the only thing a spurs pg needs to learn.

he was tentative all year out there except when Tony went out with his injury and he had to take over the pg duties ... i'm not sure he needs to develope into a good player at that position for the Spurs as much as he needs to be more agressive and condfident in himself (which may be influenced by Pop) ...

mingus

05-12-2009, 03:46 AM

Hill also needs to learn how to be more productive in less minutes ... the SA offense doesn't run through him like he had it in High School and College .

fyatuk

05-12-2009, 06:59 AM

I think our biggest NEED is to go out and get a CENTER, to start for us, with Duncan playing his natural PF position, and Gooden being on our bench at the backup PF.

No chance getting a starting caliber center AND keeping Gooden.

AusSpursFan

05-12-2009, 07:30 AM

Hill also needs to learn how to be more productive in less minutes ... the SA offense doesn't run through him like he had it in High School and College .

Geez people need to get off his case. The guy has answered the call whenever we needed him, when TP was injured and in the playoffs. What else do you want from a late first round pick in his first year?

MarCowMar

05-12-2009, 09:16 AM

Hill's shot is good. It's just that his reputation as a shooter has been tarnished from his summer league play and his weak finishing skills at the rim.

raspsa

05-12-2009, 09:29 AM

Hopefully he works out this summer with Chip. As far as finishing at the rim, he has Manu and Tony to emulate. Both are tough and fearless in attacking the rim and actually seek out the contact to draw a foul when possible.Hopefully GH can learn something because he has the speed, quickness and leaping ability.

jason1301

05-12-2009, 09:30 AM

i will be happy to see him average 10pts, 5reb and 2 assists per game next year. If he shoots over 40% from beyond the arc, that would be freaking awesome.

koriwhat

05-12-2009, 10:06 AM

GH3 is the real deal no doubt about it. from day 1 i knew this kid would be a special player for us and i still believe he'll pan out to be a stud in this league.

jag

05-12-2009, 10:09 AM

from day 1 i knew this kid would be a special player for us

Didnt we all....

Dex

05-12-2009, 10:11 AM

This offseason, I hope George Hill works on his ability to finish at the rim.

And develops the power to shoot laser beams from his eyes.

That would show 'em.

koriwhat

05-12-2009, 10:23 AM

Didnt we all....

i hope so because a lot of people didn't give him credit or enough credit especially for a rookie. sad enough he was the only bright spot in the PO next to timmyD and tonyP.

jag

05-12-2009, 10:37 AM

i hope so because a lot of people didn't give him credit or enough credit especially for a rookie. sad enough he was the only bright spot in the PO next to timmyD and tonyP.

From day 1 I had no idea what kind of player he was gonna be. I assumed the worst, and i've been pleasantly surprised. I honestly feel he could have shut down Terry.

DPG21920

05-12-2009, 10:38 AM

I would not at all be surprised to see him traded.

koriwhat

05-12-2009, 10:45 AM

I would not at all be surprised to see him traded.

i hope you're wrong.

Indazone

05-12-2009, 10:46 AM

koriwhat

05-12-2009, 10:47 AM

From day 1 I had no idea what kind of player he was gonna be. I assumed the worst, and i've been pleasantly surprised. I honestly feel he could have shut down Terry.

i still don't know why but watching the draft and seeing him get drafted by the spurs i did feel like they made the right choice. i saw some clips from his college days prior to the draft and for whatever reason thought this kid would be legit atleast a couple yrs from now but turned it on instantly with parker/manu out in the beginning of his rookie season.

i hope the spurs don't give up on him so soon.

stéphane

05-12-2009, 11:01 AM

I'd like to see him work his man to man D (his primary weapon), watch tapes of opponents like Bruce do and get to know the plays from our system to the perfection.

Now with these, he could get some regular PT as THE backup point from Mister "I wanna play RMJ at the 1" Popovitch.

Some corner 3 incase he has to play at the 2 spot.

poop

05-12-2009, 12:07 PM

Geez people need to get off his case. The guy has answered the call whenever we needed him, when TP was injured and in the playoffs. What else do you want from a late first round pick in his first year?

exacly, hes been everything we hoped for and more. i guess there will always be the drones that pull a criticism from a hat and point out that he 'needs to improve his shot' or some random bs than has no base in reality.

ulosturedge

05-12-2009, 12:11 PM

No George Hill isn't a natural PG, but they are molding him in the same way they did Tony which is a shoot first point guard. His shooting stroke is fine. What he lacks is confidence, but can you blame him? You play most your life as a SG, and then are asked to be a point guard in the NBA. This stuff takes time give the kid a chance. He needed to get his first year in the NBA under his belt. Now he has time to work in the off season and work towards becoming what we hope he can be.

If he gets the confidence to finish at the rim, he can be the next TP. In otherwords Hill will reach his potential if he can attack first, put pressure on the defense, and then finish or dish the ball to a teammate. But like I said he needs to build his confidence before he can get to that point.

mingus

05-12-2009, 12:13 PM

Geez people need to get off his case. The guy has answered the call whenever we needed him, when TP was injured and in the playoffs. What else do you want from a late first round pick in his first year?

??? maybe you didn't read my post before , but i gave him credit for what he did while TP was out ... and everyone already knows he played very well in the playoffs as well . it goes without saying ...

that said, i still think he needs to work on being more productive in less minutes and staying agressive on offense ... once TP came back his agressiveness went out the window and became less productive UNTIL the playoffs came around ... if he can do what he did in the playoffs for whole season than i'm happy ...

Indazone

05-12-2009, 12:20 PM

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=117419

Only this...G. Hill's minutes mysteriously vanished after this incident. And from our own Timvp

timvp (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8)
I don't have limits

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http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif Re: George hill scandal!
This is bad news. It's sounds lame but mediatakout.com was part of the reason why Jackie Butler fell out of favor with the Spurs. Pop and co. simply can't stand this type of thing.

Indazone

05-12-2009, 12:22 PM

Kori Ellis (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=6)
lol mavericks

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http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif Re: George hill scandal!
Look for him to be gone in a trade now. Spurs don't like this kind of stuff.

Mel_13

05-12-2009, 12:45 PM

When Hill got minutes his name was included in the ROY discussions. This kid can play and if he can just get his minutes he'll be a productive guard for you guys.

Did anyone besides me notice Hills minutes went into severe decline after some internet pics went online?

Hill's mpg remained steady for a month after those pics.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/gamelog?playerId=3438

What changed at that time was his role changed from backup PG to defensive stopper, SG, whatever....

But that change can be traced to Manu's absence which began on 2/17 rather than the pics which came out on 2/19

NewJerSpur

05-12-2009, 06:09 PM

Hill's shot is good. It's just that his reputation as a shooter has been tarnished from his summer league play and his weak finishing skills at the rim.

I think the more resounding issue with his shot is in the area of his jumper off-the-dribble. His spot-up jumper seemed solid from the corners, but it will help him and the team if he gains consistency in his shot and enough confidence to be able to pull up and drain a few from mid-range. He's got a funky form on his shot because he brings the ball over his shoulder (slingshot style) rather than directly centering it over his head, but John Stockton had a similar approach to shooting and did pretty well. BlackJack has an interesting breakdown of his mechanics in this thread.

I still may be in the minority that wants the guy to predominantly play at SG, but I'm cool with being an outsider, lol. The thing I liked about Manu playing point-forward was that he provided a nice contrast to a scoring PG like Tony in that he has exhibited a score-or-pass mentality when driving to the basket(depending on the situation, state of the game, and defense he's shown) and has shown the court awareness/vision to create offense for some offensively challenged 2nd units with Tim and Tony on the bench....and even with them in. George may or may not pick these things up as he grows even more comfortable with the system, but his instincts when driving to the basket are primarily to score (he's even forced a few close-range shots up in traffic in attempts to draw fouls when there have been open teammates around as a result of the attention he's drawn on various occasions). If his potential can be maximized primarily as a scoring guard with that can play versatile/lockdown defense while sprinkling in a few assists a game then that's where I'd prefer his focus be. I think we still have other options at point with Manu and possibly even Marcus Williams (apparently being groomed for point-forward duties) or a draftee. Just my 2 Cents added.

SouthTexasRancher

05-12-2009, 10:06 PM

NewJerSpur

05-12-2009, 11:14 PM

He will be lucky to be a spur next year. Pops will look to deal him.

Why? Next to Bruce he's our best perimeter defender.

NewJerSpur

05-12-2009, 11:21 PM

When did these attempted trades take place? I have a friend that works for the Nets and he said they were ASKING for Hill, Mason, etc. for Carter but the Spurs weren't biting on that stupidity. I still don't know why you create a new hole to fill another when we can look towards the draft and D-League to patch things up and still develop our guys. Pop realized Hill was more important to the team than he originally anticipated at the end of game 4, don't see him being shipped off myself.

NewJerSpur

05-12-2009, 11:41 PM

Besides the trade you mentioned, they included him in a deal for RJ and in a deal for Camby. He fills no hole, as he did not play pg and we have 2 SGs that are gonna get the mins. Even if he will be used as a backup pg, he will get 12mpg max.........if he brings back a guy who can get 30mpg at the SF or C POPS will jump on it. I dont care either way, because this teams window is next year or bust imo. I dont think we will get a star in 2010 and will be stuck with aging starters and no young talent or at least no bench. we need to do what ever it take to win next year or I cant see this team winning another title.

If Manu is placed at the 3 he can get a large amount of minutes at the 2. Again, he's the best perimeter defender we have if Bruce is sent packing or doesn't play much and he, to this point, can give the Spurs a dimension it doesn't really have outside of Tony and Manu on a consistent basis: a slasher.

As far as the trade rumors, if they were anything like the Nets' rumors my friend cleared up, it was more hearsay than anything etched in stone. Again, the Nets asked, NOT the Spurs, and the Spurs wouldn't part with him, Mason, and whatever else the Nets wanted.

The Truth #6

05-13-2009, 12:17 AM

NewJerSpur

05-13-2009, 12:34 AM

Hill isn't a great PG but he's clearly better than Mason. That's all we need to know. There's no reason Hill can't make gradual improvements in learning how to run the offense. Tony is still improving in this regard and he's one of the best PGs in the league.

Mason doesn't have the tools to be even a decent backup PG. Hill has quickness and a good handle. As he learns how to attack the basket better, he'll also learn how to pass out once he's gotten into the lane. At the least that's what I would hope.

Now that we've thrown Mason's "utterly terrible" PG play into the mix again I guess the next thing we'll hear is that George Hill is too small to play SG....if he succeeds at the position I wonder how many would give props to the decision to play him back at his natural position?

Dingle Barry

05-13-2009, 01:08 AM

NewJerSpur

05-13-2009, 01:38 AM

It doesn't matter how high above the floor your head is but rather your hands when raised in defense or shooting. There is no reason Hill can't play the 2.

However, it would be nice if he could be the backup pg we drafted him to be.

And as much as I'd like to see him at the 2 I know there is still a possibility Pop (in his stubborness :lol) gives him minutes at the point...maybe even more so than at SG. I have my strong opinions on the matter, but whatever position he ultimately succeeds at I'll be cheering for him if it means the team wins. Some don't seem to share that same sentiment at the prospect of him playing the majority of the minutes at the 2 though. Sometimes people's interests and ideas are more important than accomplishing the overall goal of success.

sexinthatsx

05-13-2009, 02:59 PM

Hill has shown flashes of greatness as a shooter, but I noticed he's still used to the college 3-point line as everytime he shoots the NBA 3 he almost always comes up short. But then again, if Chip is able to work on Hill's shots, he can become a solid 2 guard no matter how tall you guys are saying he is.

George Hill & Jason Terry: 6-2
Ben Gordon, Flip Murray, & Delonte West: 6-3
Louis Williams: 6-1

Louis Williams is 6 foot 1 and this guy can flat out score. From all the previous posts I'm guessing that you guys are only worried about his ability to score at the 2 since his arm span is long enough to play D at the 2, but if hill's able to work on his shot, height will not matter at all.