How and why athletes go broke...

[adidas11]

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/1/index.htm

A very interesting and eye opening article by Sports Illustrated.

I knew this stuff happened, but I didn't realize it was to such a high degree.

Discuss.

[mfanatic]

Well my personal opinion on the matter is that about 80% of these athletes are African American, and since they have never been accustomed to seeing money, they just go out and spend it on everything and anything. Take for example 200k earrings, really, do you need that? Etc.

[adidas11]

Well my personal opinion on the matter is that about 80% of these athletes are African American, and since they have never been accustomed to seeing money, they just go out and spend it on everything and anything. Take for example 200k earrings, really, do you need that? Etc.

Yet most of baseball players aren't black, and the problem still persists in that realm as well. The article does seem to point out that the problem is universal, and not relegated to a specific race.

Let's face it, virtually anyone of any race isn't accustomed to the amount of money that these athletes make.

[romain.star]

Well my personal opinion on the matter is that about 80% of these athletes are African American, and since they have never been accustomed to seeing money, they just go out and spend it on everything and anything. Take for example 200k earrings, really, do you need that? Etc.

Ok so, athletes spend their money on everything an anything because they are... black??

[Extra Stout]

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/1/index.htm

A very interesting and eye opening article by Sports Illustrated.

I knew this stuff happened, but I didn't realize it was to such a high degree.

Discuss.

Old proverb about a fool and his money.

[koriwhat]

Let's face it, virtually anyone of any race isn't accustomed to the amount of money that these athletes make.

true that. i don't like that comment above yours at all by that other poster. seems a bit... you guessed it.

[Kori Ellis]

Yet most of baseball players aren't black, and the problem still persists in that realm as well. The article does seem to point out that the problem is universal, and not relegated to a specific race.

Let's face it, virtually anyone of any race isn't accustomed to the amount of money that these athletes make.

Exactly. And though the league supposedly has a rookie program to help them with money management, etc, it's reportedly not done very well. They all go through the rookie orientation program in the summer for the basics, but then a rep from the league is supposed to check with them weekly (or every other week) to help them with an issues they are having. I remember in one of those round table discussions a few years back, Darius Miles said no one contacted him all year.

[spursfaninla]

instead of a league rep, the UNION should do it. The union actually cares about the players after they retire, unlike the league. So, the union should pay some guys to do more serious work on this issue. 60% bankruptcy is both shocking and sad.

[TDMVPDPOY]

its not hard to leave ur money in a bank and worry about spending or meeting ends meet, when those millions earn can easily earn you a millioin in interest payments.....


unless you deposited money into one of them banks that went broke a few months ago.....

[adidas11]

Several factors seem to be at play here...

1) The age of the athletes when they start making money. They start at an early age (early 20s), which isn't exactly the epitome of maturity for anyone. Much like a rock star or hollywood level entertainer.

2) Longevity of career: Unlike rock star or hollywood entertainer, the athletes earning longevity is very short. The average career lifespan for an NFL player is something like 3 years. At the best, most of these athletes are "retired" by their mid 30s!

3) Inability to say "no". Especially when it comes to friends and family.

4) Pressure to live a certain lifestyle. I remember an exception to the rule, in James Worthy. Back in the late 80s, they were profiling Worthy and his lifestyle. Unlike his other teammates who went home to LA manions, Worthy lived in a simple two bedroom house. Very modest lifestyle. Most of these athletes will not do that, however, and are pressured to live in a certain way (the bling factor)

5) I think a lot of them truly don't understand that although they are rich, they are not WEALTHY. A friend of mine on the west coast works for some insurance type company, that has a lot of celebrities as clients. Low level clients in their portfolio would include individuals like Brad Pitt. High level clients would be CEO's of companies and private equity moguls, who have hundreds of millions and even billions, at their disposal.

Look at some of the net worth of the athletes mentioned in the article. A lot, topping off at "only" 30 million or so (which ends up being a lot less, after taxes)

[ulosturedge]

Its a combination of not being able to manage your money and not living within your means. I got this feeling that these athletes continue trying to live the high life years after they have already retired. Where is the money coming from to continue at such a high standard of living? Unless they have made sound investments with their money or have something else that will make up for the "quick cash" they were getting as a paid athlete; the thing they must do is bring down their standards of living. That might be the hardest thing for people who are use to being in the spotlight to do.

On another note:
Not trying to be racist but I do think mrfanatic has some what of a point. I think some of these athletes come from a background where they have a lot of pressure to impress their peers. In doing so they squander away alot of their money. Alot of these same people come from having nothing and all the sudden are loaded. That transition might be disasterous if not watched over carefully.

[Ocotillo]

Exactly. And though the league supposedly has a rookie program to help them with money management, etc, it's reportedly not done very well. They all go through the rookie orientation program in the summer for the basics, but then a rep from the league is supposed to check with them weekly (or every other week) to help them with an issues they are having. I remember in one of those round table discussions a few years back, Darius Miles said no one contacted him all year.

This is an issue that would be better served if taken on by the players union. The challenges these guys face are large and beyond their scope to deal with typically.

They have been give a gift, the talent to play their sport, that enable them to have access to amounts of money most people in this world can only dream of. With that, comes all sorts of risks, hangers on, gold diggers, temptations, peer pressure, etc....

[Kori Ellis]

This is an issue that would be better served if taken on by the players union. The challenges these guys face are large and beyond their scope to deal with typically.

They have been give a gift, the talent to play their sport, that enable them to have access to amounts of money most people in this world can only dream of. With that, comes all sorts of risks, hangers on, gold diggers, temptations, peer pressure, etc....

I'm not sure if the current rep is actually from the league or from the player's union. The rookie orientation program that they go through is run by both. My point was really that in many cases they aren't getting mentored well after that initial week-long program and that in order for them to deal with all the challenges, they need more support and guidance along the way.

[Mark in Austin]

5) I think a lot of them truly don't understand that although they are rich, they are not WEALTHY. A friend of mine on the west coast works for some insurance type company, that has a lot of celebrities as clients. Low level clients in their portfolio would include individuals like Brad Pitt. High level clients would be CEO's of companies and private equity moguls, who have hundreds of millions and even billions, at their disposal.

Look at some of the net worth of the athletes mentioned in the article. A lot, topping off at "only" 30 million or so (which ends up being a lot less, after taxes)

^reminds me of the Chris Rock bit:

"Shaq is rich. The guy signing Shaq's paycheck is wealthy."

[Mark in Austin]

instead of a league rep, the UNION should do it. The union actually cares about the players after they retire, unlike the league.

Tell that to the NFL old timers.

[jag]

great read...thanks for the post

[mathbzh]

^reminds me of the Chris Rock bit:

"Shaq is rich. The guy signing Shaq's paycheck is wealthy."

At least for Shaq, it is safe to say he is wealthy. I don' know how long it will last but right now he worth a LOT of money.

But we tend to think about Shaq when a lot of player will just have a rookie contract or something slightly better. Moreover players making 4 millions a year don't have any endorsment and don't have any "NBA related" incomes once they retired.

[MoSpur]

Divorce!!!!!

[coldsweat]

Well my personal opinion on the matter is that about 80% of these athletes are African American, and since they have never been accustomed to seeing money, they just go out and spend it on everything and anything. Take for example 200k earrings, really, do you need that? Etc.

go take your racist opinions elsewhere, dumbfuck. :nope

[JWest596]

The problem is that spending money requires no discipline until its gone and a rich man knows that to stay rich you have to make your money work for you. Sudden rapid wealth with no understanding of it goes to our easiest needs and desires. Booze and hookers for everyone!

A fool and his money is soon parted and a man who spends his principle will lose far far more many times over

[hater]

hookers are expensive that's why

[DPG21920]

I think that is pretty weak. No one should have to check on anyone. Once these people graduate, and make millions they are adults. When I graduated from college there was no one checking in on me on a weekly basis to make sure I was making good financial decisions.

There are plenty of tools out there available to help those who give a damn. Not to mention, the phone works both ways. The players could call the reps themselves if they had any questions.

WTF.

[kace]

Problems can also happens at the end of their career, not especially when they're very young.

Not all players have made 20 M/year contract. not all of them have big endorsement, even few atfer they retired.

Very few have the ability, talent to make another job (TV or any media consultant or anything else).

so, basically, most of them have big house, big cars and very big and luxurious level of life and they can realize after they retire that they don't have the money anymore to assume this level of life.

Smartest anticipate that, some others could be a little bit surprised and face some problems.

In one word, being rich is expensive.

[Kori Ellis]

I think that is pretty weak. No one should have to check on anyone. Once these people graduate, and make millions they are adults. When I graduated from college there was no one checking in on me on a weekly basis to make sure I was making good financial decisions.

There's a big difference between you getting $30K (or whatever) and players becoming instant millionaires overnight.

And graduate from what? Most players aren't college graduates.

Just FYI, the rookie orientation/mentoring program isn't just for finances .. it's for everything.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i dunno man, some of these athletes do have a degree or attended college, shouldve taken finance lessons or someshit.....

[ploto]

Just FYI, the rookie orientation/mentoring program isn't just for finances .. it's for everything.
The bigger agents have people who specifically are there to monitor the player's finances but I suppose many do not take advantage of it.

[ploto]

At least for Shaq, it is safe to say he is wealthy.
Was it Chris Rock who said--
Shaq is not wealthy. He is rich. The guy who signs Shaq's paycheck is wealthy.

[DPG21920]

There's a big difference between you getting $30K (or whatever) and players becoming instant millionaires overnight.

And graduate from what? Most players aren't college graduates.

Just FYI, the rookie orientation/mentoring program isn't just for finances .. it's for everything.

What is your point? That making 30K means you don't have to worry about managing your money? In fact, you have to work harder to manage your money.

Graduate from high school and enter the working world. Who cares if they become instant millionaires over night? The same principles apply. The NBA is a business and these people are workers and citizens. I understand they are young, but that does not excuse you from making poor financial decisions.

If you want/need help, seek it out. If you are capable of making millions in the free market, you are fully capable of seeking financial advice or at least making responsible decisions on your own.

Do what the rest of the responsible world does and lean on family/friends and common sense. Be modest. I know it is hard not to by 7 cars and planes and 15 houses, but do not put the blame on anyone else or any union.

[DPG21920]

Also, if you say many of the athletes are not graduating from college, then maybe make them. That way they are more prepared.

But then you hear the bs argument: "how can you stop someone from making money, isn't that what you go to college for"? No, you go to college to learn how to make/manage/grow your money and to prepare yourself for the real world. You cannot have it both ways. You cannot say it is wrong to force kids to finish college before making millions and then turn around and complain that they did not graduate from college so they are ill equipped to handle their money.

[Bukefal]

Their whole lives was only focused on sports, sports and sports. They do not know anything else and have never experienced anything else. Then, when they have some success and start making money fast, they are liking it, they are getting high in their heads and spend, spend, spend, spend without thinking about some secure, or secure for the future. After a while their success is dropping and they did not have anything secured for their future before, so they are fucked. Also they have never learned anything other than sports since their highschools, so they dont know what to do, and end up broke.

[Kori Ellis]

What is your point? That making 30K means you don't have to worry about managing your money? In fact, you have to work harder to manage your money.

No my point is that it's much more overwhelming to go from zero dollars to a million dollars overnight, than it is to go from making $10 an hour in college to 30K after college.



Graduate from high school and enter the working world. Who cares if they become instant millionaires over night? The same principles apply. The NBA is a business and these people are workers and citizens. I understand they are young, but that does not excuse you from making poor financial decisions.

I didn't say whether it was the league's responsibility to take care of them or not. I said the league has a system in place to help mentor them and that system is reportedly (according to several players) not working properly after the initial orientation program.



If you want/need help, seek it out. If you are capable of making millions in the free market, you are fully capable of seeking financial advice or at least making responsible decisions on your own.

Do what the rest of the responsible world does and lean on family/friends and common sense. Be modest. I know it is hard not to by 7 cars and planes and 15 houses, but do not put the blame on anyone else or any union.

Family and friends is a big part of what gets young millionaires in trouble financially. That's why they need mentors outside their circle.

[DPG21920]

No my point is that it's much more overwhelming to go from zero dollars to a million dollars overnight, than it is to go from making $10 an hour in college to 30K after college.

Good point, but I already understood that. That is true from one side of the story, but when you go from in college/high school to making 30K and having to actually live off of just that, it can be just as hard scraping by as it is to go from 0 to millions and learning how to slow down.



I didn't say whether it was the league's responsibility to take care of them or not. I said the league has a system in place to help mentor them and that system is reportedly (according to several players) not working properly after the initial orientation program.

The system is poor, but the blame is not solely on the league. I would imagine the players want nothing to do with this help when they are on the road or partying with their friends or buying cars/houses.

In order for any type of mentoring to work (personal finance, psychiatry, ...) it has to be a two way street.


Family and friends is a big part of what gets young millionaires in trouble financially. That's why they need mentors outside their circle.

Certain family and friends are part of the problem, but it boils down to decision making. The world can be cold and unforgiving, but once again it boils down to making smart choices. I have family and friends pulling at me, as does everyone. What is crucial is who you take your advice from.

If you need someone outside of your circle, seek them out. No one is going to come knocking on your door, but they will open theirs if you come knocking.

[Kori Ellis]

The system is poor, but the blame is not solely on the league.


I never said it was. You are just posting looking for an argument. I made a simple statement that there's a program in place and that several players have complained in recent years that after the initial orientation program that they received no further contact. I never even slightly indicated that the players themselves weren't at fault for going broke.

It would be great if they all had common sense, some sort of basic financial background, and family/friends who could advise them instead of mooch off them but that's not the case for a lot of them.

[DPG21920]

I never said it was. You are just posting looking for an argument. I made a simple statement that there's a program in place and that several players have complained in recent years that after the initial orientation program that they received no further contact. I never even slightly indicated that the players themselves weren't at fault for going broke.

It would be great if they all had common sense, some sort of basic financial background, and family/friends who could advise them instead of mooch off them but that's not the case for a lot of them.

Just because I do not agree with you or took what you said the wrong way does not mean I am looking for an argument.

I thought some of what you posted implied certain things. For example when you say: "the players have complained the league's program is not functioning" or that "it is harder to go from 0 to a million than from 10.00 to 30K" that you are ignoring the players responsibility.

And you are taking it as a shot at you. It is not. It is pointing something out, just as you pointing out what the players said. It is not arguing with you but adding to the reasons why such things are failing.

[GSH]

I think that is pretty weak. No one should have to check on anyone. Once these people graduate, and make millions they are adults. When I graduated from college there was no one checking in on me on a weekly basis to make sure I was making good financial decisions.

There are plenty of tools out there available to help those who give a damn. Not to mention, the phone works both ways. The players could call the reps themselves if they had any questions.

WTF.

They are also kids. This isn't something new for an employer to give some guidance to young employees. I've been in that position many times over the years. How to tie a necktie. How to behave at a nice restaurant. Why they need to fund their 401K, or spend the money on insurance.

Some of these guys have never filed an income tax return before, because college players are only there to make money for other people. A lot of them have had people lining up to get a piece of them since middle school, all claiming to be friends. Whether it's someone from the old neighborhood, or a banker in an expensive suit, they see that pile of money and want to get their hands on some of it.

And for the record, educated white lottery winners have the exact same problems. An amazing number of them piss through all their winnings in record time. And they all know that big check is a one-time thing.

[Kori Ellis]

And you are taking it as a shot at you. It is not. It is pointing something out, just as you pointing out what the players said. It is not arguing with you but adding to the reasons why such things are failing.

I'm not taking it as a shot at me. It's your posting style -- it's argumentative (believe me I'm not the only one that thinks so :lol), but I don't care either way. I was just making a simple post about the orientation system... which the league and the player's union established. Many posters don't know it exists.

[td4mvp21]

I knew I should have included DPG21920 in the Debate Club Members in the "If Spurstalk were a highschool" thread.

[DPG21920]

I'm not taking it as a shot at me. It's your posting style -- it's argumentative (believe me I'm not the only one that thinks so :lol), but I don't care either way. I was just making a simple post about the orientation system... which the league and the player's union established. Many posters don't know it exists.

Not to take this thread in another direction but :wtf. Doesn't everyone on ST argue and go back and forth? Sorry to hear that many people think I am overly argumentative, but everyone goes back and forth in every thread because not everyone agrees with everything.

I am not trying to argue, but debate. You rarely see me dropping the f bomb or calling people names (unless it is obviously jokingly).

Sucks to see I am talked about what I perceive to be negatively, although it is not a big deal.

[oligarchy]

"I've got my family to feed!"

:lol at anyone having sympathy for any athlete that goes broke. "boo hoo.. i blew through millions, but don't know what happened. They repo'd my boat, my house, my dog."

[Kori Ellis]

Sucks to see I am talked about what I perceive to be negatively, although it is not a big deal.

No one said it was negatively. I just said that you were trying to create an argument out of nothing. You went on an argumentative rant because you assumed that I was saying all the blame was on the league and the players weren't responsible. If I was really saying that, it would have been a good discussion/debate. *shrug*

Back to the subject at hand ...

[DPG21920]

My gf says I argue a lot too. So does my family. I mean no harm, just my nature; I am an excitable creature...

Do you think the college idea I purposed is a good one?

[GSH]

Certain family and friends are part of the problem, but it boils down to decision making. The world can be cold and unforgiving, but once again it boils down to making smart choices.

If you need someone outside of your circle, seek them out. No one is going to come knocking on your door, but they will open theirs if you come knocking.




The more I thought about that, the more it pissed me off. Smart choices? I didn't know poop when I was 20, but I thought I did. (Some would argue that hasn't changed.) And if I did need some advice, my first choice was one of my buddies who didn't know any more than I did. There's a reason our military doesn't just hand those smart young men a gun and ammunition, and maybe a few grenades, and send them out with a bunch of other young men to do their jobs.

It's not just a matter of smart choices, it has a lot to do with life experience. I've never hidden my dislike for Stu Jackson, but I really do think David Stern is a good guy. Congratulations to him for acknowledging that the league has some obligation to these kids. I'm sure the program isn't perfect, but at least he's made an effort.

[DPG21920]

The more I thought about that, the more it pissed me off. Smart choices? I didn't know poop when I was 20, but I thought I did. (Some would argue that hasn't changed.) And if I did need some advice, my first choice was one of my buddies who didn't know any more than I did. There's a reason our military doesn't just hand those smart young men a gun and ammunition, and maybe a few grenades, and send them out with a bunch of other young men to do their jobs.

It's not just a matter of smart choices, it has a lot to do with life experience. I've never hidden my dislike for Stu Jackson, but I really do think David Stern is a good guy. Congratulations to him for acknowledging that the league has some obligation to these kids. I'm sure the program isn't perfect, but at least he's made an effort.

Yes, smart choices. Everyone is responsible for their own life. Are there tools out there to help those who want it? Is there a common sense factor to know that enough is enough? Is modesty a trait that these kids grow up on? That has nothing to do with life experience, although as you grow you learn. You would think after making 4 million in one year, like the guy in the article, then looking at your bank account and realizing there is nothing left would be an eye opening experience.

I agree that it is a good thing to have something installed in the league. But are these players really interested in it? How do these appointed mentors make these players who travel all the time, who are so young and do not know poop as you put it, who practice all the time, who have a lot of money and like to go out, show up to meetings about their financial future?

I never said it is only good choices, but that plays the largest role. Of course as you deal with a new situation there will be learning pains, but choices present themselves multiple times every day.

You always have a choice, you just have to make good ones. I am not saying be perfect, but everyone knows when they are living beyond their means and being irresponsible. Especially if their parents were not rich. That means they grew up without all of this money so they see what it is like to live modest and plan.

[Bruno]

What would seems logical to me is that players learn how to manage their career and money while they are in college.
I don't know what is currently done but all NCAA basketball program should feature a significant teaching about all the problems a professional basketball player could face during and after his career.

[DPG21920]

By the way, I hope I am not coming off judgmental. I am just a firm believer in empowering ones self. People have the ability to do great things. I know it is not easy to make good decisions consistently.

It is always easier to say yes to everything or not plan ahead. I just feel that people know what is right and wrong and if that is the case, then choosing which to act on is what defines what you do.

I know I might be over simplifying, but 20, although young, is not a child. Some have it worse than others and have many negative influences in their life.

But after hearing the girl from "Homeless to Harvard" speak, it makes me believe anything is possible as soon as you realize no one has more invested in you than yourself.

[DPG21920]

What would seems logical to me is that players learn how to manage their career and money while they are in college.
I don't know what is currently done but all NCAA basketball program should feature a significant teaching about all the problems a professional basketball player could face during and after his career.

This is a good idea and most colleges have some type of money management program (although not specifically for athletes only).

That is why I do not understand the lack of support for making kids stay in college or at least take these types of classes. Not only would the kids have to foot the bill instead of the NBA (which they will easily make up when they get their contracts), it will empower these people to live after their careers are over.

[ploto]

What would seems logical to me is that players learn how to manage their career and money while they are in college.

A lot of careers do not include it. I have a lot of ties to the medical field, and I can tell you that they are one big group of stupid people when it comes to money. They go through medical school and get little or no education on managing money. They likewise often go from being in debt to pay for school to making large sums of money when they finish residency. I know a number of doctors- one very well known- who have filed for bankruptcy.

[adidas11]

A lot of careers do not include it. I have a lot of ties to the medical field, and I can tell you that they are one big group of stupid people when it comes to money. They go through medical school and get little or no education on managing money. They likewise often go from being in debt to pay for school to making large sums of money when they finish residency. I know a number of doctors- one very well known- who have filed for bankruptcy.

I think the key is teaching money management in HIGH school, including classes that help people understand what credit is, what their credit score means, how to save money, etc.

[ducks]

There's a big difference between you getting $30K (or whatever) and players becoming instant millionaires overnight.

And graduate from what? Most players aren't college graduates.

Just FYI, the rookie orientation/mentoring program isn't just for finances .. it's for everything.

like how to have sex?

[ducks]

I think the key is teaching money management in HIGH school, including classes that help people understand what credit is, what their credit score means, how to save money, etc.

why highschool
why not 7 year old and up?
give kids small allowarance and have them buy their own toys

[Dingle Barry]

Some pretty good comedy in that article regarding the stupid "sexy" investments.

[mathbzh]

Was it Chris Rock who said--
Shaq is not wealthy. He is rich. The guy who signs Shaq's paycheck is wealthy.

He said that. But that's wrong. The last time I saw an estimation of Shaq's net worth it was something like 300 millions. With the financial crisis, divorce, lifestyle... it may be less now or someday. But 300 millions... I call that wealthy

[polandprzem]

I was not reading all what was posted here, but why should the leauge take any responsibility for a player having problems with spending his money?
All in all league gives them money, and now they must to menage (in a way) this money?

[Extra Stout]

Let's make one thing clear:

Nobody, whether the league, or society, or us, or anybody else, has an obligation to keep immature and foolish multimillionares from squandering away their money.

Now, we might find it undesirable that people can be so foolish and self-destructive, and lament the state of cultural poverty being such that wide swaths of the population have no concept of basic adult decision-making, much less financial responsibility. We might find that so lamentable that we choose to step into the gap and attempt to educate people on how not to squander away millions in wealth that should leave them set for life. We might measure how effective those attempts at education, even mentoring, are, because we want them to succeed. But the players are not entitled to it.

I'm getting kind of tired of continual excuses for the failure of people to exercise the basic responsibility of adulthood. We cannot continue to argue both ways, blaming the league for keeping 18-year-olds out of the league and making them wait for the big payday, but then also blaming the league when these same immature 18-year-olds don't have the life skills to deal suddenly with being wealthy.

And while I'm at it, as the article points out, it's not like the athletes grow out of it. The 18-year-old fools grow up to be 35-year-old fools. Is David Stern supposed to be the proxy parent for these players or something? Does the NBA need a program where a league official follows the players around and wipes their asses for them?

And I understand that this isn't limited to athletes. It used to be, that if somebody had access to wealth, and squandered it away, that it was their own problem. Now we have a society where people demand a handout and then blame the ones who handed it out to them when they fritter it away, and society wrings its hands and feels guilty. We are a society where fewer and fewer people ever grow up. A nation that refuses responsibility deserves tyranny.

[ploto]

All you have to do is read in the Club here to see many people who have made just as stupid choices, simply on a much smaller scale.

[Capt Bringdown]

I've known and worked for Microsoft millionaires that have gone broke. I think the how's and why's are pretty much the same for everyone: not taking care of your money.

Millions of dollars seems to have a way of making people think they're smarter than they really are, and that their fortunes will always be stable and improve.

[Drachen]

Well my personal opinion on the matter is that about 80% of these athletes are African American, and since they have never been accustomed to seeing money, they just go out and spend it on everything and anything. Take for example 200k earrings, really, do you need that? Etc.

I think it would be more accurate to say that "80% of these atheletes are uneducated and have never been accustomed to seeing money . . ."

[antgomez2009]

These athletes are not aware of their money spending, taxes and everything else you get billed for. Not to mention the women of thier lives, family and their dreams to own a successful business. Its not that they are black, or because they have alot of money, its like everything else, lack of education on the matter. You have to know how to budget your money, take responsibility for what you owe, and save!! If i made 15 million in four years, i would get a cool million dollar home, a few cars, hook up the wifey and kids, and close family members, and save the rest. Along the way, i would be paying my bills, and investing in MUTUAL FUNDS. they get paid, they can add money into an account that they wont touch until retired, and after so long inserting a couple thousands per month for 8 years, you gain interest, make a cool million or 2 or 3 or 4 for just saving!!! YA DIGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!


Well i went to college, and paid attention!!!...that might be the overall factor!!!

IGNORANCE is for losers! ahem, broke atheltes.

[Indazone]

Well at least they are stimulating the economy. Money leaves multimillionaire ball players hands and go directly back into the economy to buy other knick knacks.

[GSH]

I've always believed I had an obligation to the people who worked for me. If not as an employer, then as a friend. Maybe even just from one human being to another. I don't want to believe that I am in the minority for thinking that way.

Haven't any of you ever taken the car keys from a friend after a night out? I bet your friend "knew better" than to drive drunk. So why didn't you just let him go and make his own bad decisions?

Carry that idea a little further. What if the friend has been at your house all evening, and you're the one who's been pouring him drinks? You didn't twist his arm, but you kept his glass full. Technically you're not responsible for him deciding to get drunk... right? Would that knowledge be enough to make you feel good, if he crashed after leaving your house? Seriously, folks, if you see somebody about to step off a cliff, how hard is it to raise your voice?

I think a lot of people are just pissed that "these young punks get millions of dollars thrown at them for playing a damned game". Worse, I think a lot of those same people take pleasure in watching them crash and burn. I think Stern really does care what happens to the players. But I think he is also smart enough to know that the league benefits from trying to give some guidance to the ones who are willing to accept it. I guarantee you that a lot of them don't know anybody who isn't trying to get into their pockets. Bernie Madoff scammed some very well-educated people, who had a lot of experience dealing with money. Why should these 20-something kids be expected to know better?

I don't like the thugs in the league, and I wouldn't begin to excuse them. But I could say the same thing about drunk drivers. Not everyone who drives home after a night out is a menace to society. Some of them just need a friend to ask for the keys and call them a cab.

[polandprzem]

Being drunk and being a friend it's a diferent thing from being employed and getting payed.

[DPG21920]

I've always believed I had an obligation to the people who worked for me. If not as an employer, then as a friend. Maybe even just from one human being to another. I don't want to believe that I am in the minority for thinking that way.

Haven't any of you ever taken the car keys from a friend after a night out? I bet your friend "knew better" than to drive drunk. So why didn't you just let him go and make his own bad decisions?

Carry that idea a little further. What if the friend has been at your house all evening, and you're the one who's been pouring him drinks? You didn't twist his arm, but you kept his glass full. Technically you're not responsible for him deciding to get drunk... right? Would that knowledge be enough to make you feel good, if he crashed after leaving your house? Seriously, folks, if you see somebody about to step off a cliff, how hard is it to raise your voice?

I think a lot of people are just pissed that "these young punks get millions of dollars thrown at them for playing a damned game". Worse, I think a lot of those same people take pleasure in watching them crash and burn. I think Stern really does care what happens to the players. But I think he is also smart enough to know that the league benefits from trying to give some guidance to the ones who are willing to accept it. I guarantee you that a lot of them don't know anybody who isn't trying to get into their pockets. Bernie Madoff scammed some very well-educated people, who had a lot of experience dealing with money. Why should these 20-something kids be expected to know better?

I don't like the thugs in the league, and I wouldn't begin to excuse them. But I could say the same thing about drunk drivers. Not everyone who drives home after a night out is a menace to society. Some of them just need a friend to ask for the keys and call them a cab.

You can offer advice, but you cannot make people do it. It has been stated many times that there is a program the NBA has in place and all rookies are forced to attend. So they know where to look for help.

You are right, people do want to help, but just like a parent who has a troubled child, you lay down the rules and draw the line at a certain point. The point most of us are making is that in your drunk driving scenario, I would take the keys away or call a cab, but I am not always going to be there when that person is drinking.

When no one is around, what will that person do?

[NFGIII]

Do you think Shaq made his money in Orlando? HELL NO! He made his money in college, everyone knows that.

I remember an interview Shaq did awhile back - not sure exactly when - but he spoke of this very issue. When he signed his rookie contract he thought that he had all the money in the world and startded spending it left and right. He hadn't considered taxes at the time. Shocked him how much that was! Pretty soon he found out that he didn't have as much as he thought so he either got an adivisor or started listening to him and set up a financial plan to invest his money. I give him credit for seeing what was happening to his money and doing something about it. Most though probably think that the next contract will take care of the debt that is piling up now. Many seem to think that they can make nore later to help alleviate the current deficit spending. Sounds pretty American to me. :p:

Point is and has been made is that most people aren't very good at handling these sums of money and don't really plan ahead. It's seems to be a "let the good times roll" type of situation until Peter is standing in the doorway and it's time to pay the piper. Always thought that there should be a course in high school about finaces - balancing checkbooks and setting up budgets - that sort of subject matter. Our "buy now and pay later" society is finally catching up with us.

[GSH]

Being drunk and being a friend it's a diferent thing from being employed and getting payed.


Well if they were exactly the same thing, it wouldn't be an analogy, now would it?

You know, politically I'm a pretty hard-assed conservative, and I strongly believe in personal accountability. If somebody screws up, I say they are responsible for their actions. But damn, some of you are hard markers.

I bet not one of you would react the same way to a corporation sending an executive to leadership training, or a life coach. Hell, I can think of four execs I've konwn whose companies paid to send them to fat farms, because they were very overweight. A few people laughed, but nobody got pissed off about it. A large bank I worked with had a young-ish Senior VP (Harvard MBA) who started thinking he was Donald Trump - and his wife shopped like Ivana Trump. He got himself into a serious financial hole, and started drinking too much. The bank paid for a financial consultant and a life coach to help him get his shit together.

Maybe some people are just more deserving of help than others.

Nobody here suggested these guys aren't responsible for their actions. Nobody said that the government should force the league to babysit them. But at least the the league had enough sense to start a program to help these guys deal with their sudden wealth, instead of just saying, "Fuck em... let em drown." I don't see why some people think that's a bad thing.

[manufan10]

If I was good enough to play ball and make tons of money, I would still by my clothes from Wal-Mart.

[DPG21920]

No one is thinking the league mandated system is a bad idea in principle. Everyone is saying it is a two-way street. You can only help those who want to be helped. It is great that the league has these mechanisms in place, but the players must buy into it.

I think it is fantastic when a company pays for programs to help their employees.

[lefty]

Who was that former Chicago Bulls player who had to work tons of hours as a bus driver after retiring from basketball, because he was an undergrad?

[JWest596]

I remember a lottery winner story a few years back in NJ I think, who was a ex-truck driver who with his instant wealth bought a multimillion dollar McMansion, his wife divorces him, his friends abandoned him when the money dried up, high taxes are due, he bought every whim, car and toy and now sits a in a multi room home with indoor/outdoor pool (he can't maintain to use), 2 lane bowling alley, etc. He can't maintain its value, his roof has problems, (minimum 25K roof repairs, not even a replacement), gardening amok, regular house maintenance/upkeep in the thousands and he's was now flat broke. There are legions of such stories from people unaccustomed to sudden wealth who essentially blew it all away. It was the saddest story I ever saw in a strange kind of way.

[ploto]

Look at the people who got FREE houses from that Extreme Makeover show that are now in foreclosure because they borrowed against the value of the house.

[easjer]

Man, my college must have been different than some others, or perhaps it was my liberal arts degree - but there was certainly no financial preparation course or anyone explaining to me how my money was best managed.

I think we've done pretty well for ourselves; we pay our bills on time, we don't live too extravagantly, we are attempting to reduce our debt and increase our savings, we bought a house and car we could afford, waited to have children, have good credit scores, etc etc. And yet, our financial manager was appalled by our savings and life insurance when we met with him. No one had ever told me we should have more or what we should have. I'm educated, I like to think I've made generally good decisions, but here we are knowing that if one of us is killed in a car wreck tomorrow, we're in trouble financially.

I can't blame a 19 or 20 year old kid for not being a good money manager, or for not knowing how to manage the money. A lot of the kids think they will get the big payouts, even if they don't. A lot of kids assume they'll get some supplemental income from endorsements and what not. A lot of kids don't understand that the lavish lifestyle they are setting up now - even a moderate one they can afford, like a 4-bedroom house when they live alone and just one Rolex and one nice car - may not be affordable when they are no longer playing.

It's no one's responsibility to make good decisions for them. You can't stop someone from giving money to their cousins and giving their friends a job or investing in something stupid. But there is a lot of natural ignorance that is often compounded by not seeing their own bills.

How many of these guys sit down and pay the bills every month? How many review their bank statements or the charges from their financial advisers and see what they are actually paying for? Goodness, most Americans don't review their bank statements regularly or closely, and most of these guys aren't paying their own bills.

What is one of the first things they tell you in eliminating debt? Track your money. See where it's really being spent. Since these guys usually aren't paying their own bills, they have no idea how much they are really wasting on things. Let alone whether or not they are being taken advantage of.

Recently, my boss, coworkers and I - all college educated women - were talking about how much money we'd need to win in the lottery to quit our jobs and retire. Of course, me, being the youngest and the only one with/planning to have kids, was in a different situation, because I'd need to cover more years, private insurance for a family (since I get free through work), college educations, etc. My boss was surprised when I said I'd need at least 10 million. She, an accountant, no less, couldn't understand why, when her own number was so much lower. She listed out everything she'd buy, what it would cost and how much she'd need in addition to what she'd receive in retirement, then returned to work.

I looked at my coworker and said, "But what about taxes? True, if I bought a new house, I wouldn't have a mortgage payment each month, but I'd still have to set aside the escrow equivalency to pay for taxes and insurance on it. And what about health insurance? We'd have to pay privately."

Millions of dollars - it sounds really nice, and seemingly for so little (playing a sports season, winning the lottery), but when you really have to stretch it through the remainder of your life if you want to maintain a moderate lifestyle and not work . . . it's a lot less than you would think. And if nobody explains that - how are you to know?

[G-Nob]

Just look at the guy that invented the pet rock. Now THAT was a good investment.

[ManuTastic]

These numbers are simply staggering. No one is saying rich athletes need a bailout, but the players unions should definitely try to educate these players on how to avoid these problems.

Now, if these guys just let ME handle their money, it'd be a lot better.... for me!