Who do you think helps the team more heading into the playoffs, Nazr or Marks?

[whottt]

If we have to leave one of these guys off the playoff roster who do you want to keep?

Edit: dangit I wanted this to be a poll.

They are both similar players but I think you could see the difference in Marks being with the team for a while today...He has a better grasp of what he is doing out there.

[T Park]

maybe because, hes been practicing with the team for a full two years???

Maybe THATS why he looks like he knows what he is doin?

[whottt]

I think you are right...and what do you think is the priority in the playoffs...giving an injured Mohammed time to pull his head out, or winning games by putting non fuckups on the court.

I am not gonna cut Mohammed or the Spurs any slack because they traded for a fucking injured player....we had a healthy one.

But I give you props for no longer arguing that Mohammed is kicking ass...

[CHAMPS AGAIN]

Narz Over Marks Anyday

[T Park]

Id say the priority is putting your best players out there,

and if you want to tell me Sean Marks is better than Nazr Mohammed, your nuts.

[whottt]

Marks is healthy and he's been with the team 2 years...

In case you haven't noticed...sometimes talent isn't enough to fit in on the Spurs...ask Barry.

And BTW, this is the first time this season I haven't wanted to see Marks ass on the IR...

But now he's competing against Nazr and Marks helps more right now.

[ChumpDumper]

If Duncan never came back, maybe -- but Nazr is quite effective alongside Duncan.

[T Park]

I am not gonna cut Mohammed

of course not, would not fit your MO, nor your hate POP MO as well.

But, to hate on Mohammed?? Why, he hasn't done shit to deserve your childish Ire.

Hate on his play?? Thats fine, hes sucked ass since after the Pistons game.

But hate on him cause hes injured?? thats fuckin weak.

[MannyIsGod]

He was better than Nazr today. Nazr looks lost. I'm not sure Massenburg is going to be on the playoff roster, so he may be the one not to go.

I think Sean Marks can make an impact, and I hope Pop plays him more in the next few games.

[T Park]

ometimes talent isn't enough to fit in on the Spurs...ask Barry.

so its the Spurs fault he was missing wide open jump shots??

Classic.

[MannyIsGod]

Yes, Nazr actually is very effective along Duncan because then all he has to do iswhat he does best, rebound. But with any other big combo out there, he looks horrible.

[ChumpDumper]

Yes, Nazr actually is very effective along Duncan because then all he has to do iswhat he does best, rebound. But with any other big combo out there, he looks horrible.Hence my answer.

[usckk]

The only reason Marks played today was that Massenburg was ill.

[whottt]

I don't hate Mohammed...I just like winning titles more than I do breaking him into the team and waiting for him to get healthy.

Fuck, is our goal this season to make Mohammed not suck, or is it to win a title?

You yourself said he is injured still...guess what he's been injured for 3 months now...you want an inexperienced, injured player who doesn't know the team coming off the bench in the playoffs?

[whottt]

The only reason Marks played today was that Massenburg was ill.

Marks got more minutes today...and he looked a hell of a lot less clueless than Nazr does.

[T Park]

nd he looked a hell of a lot less clueless than Nazr does.

because
hes been AROUND THE FUCKIN TEAM LONGER!!!!

MY FUCKING GOD!!!!!!!

[Russ]

The only reason Marks played today was that Massenburg was ill.

And the only reason Lou Gehrig played was that Wally Pipp was ill. I'd pick Marks over Mohammed because Marks brings intelligence and energy, two things that Mohammed has none of.

[MannyIsGod]

because
hes been AROUND THE FUCKIN TEAM LONGER!!!!

MY FUCKING GOD!!!!!!!

Hey Stupid, that isn't going to change by the playoffs.

[T Park]

Uh, show me where I said it would.

He stupid, Im saying, you play the guy that will play best next to guys like Duncan and Ginobili and others.

Thats mohammed.

[whottt]

Do you think Mohammed was better than Marks today? Who do you think contributed to the win more? And why?

This was a playoff style game...

And if your aswer isn't Mohammed then why would you do it differently in the playoffs...

[T Park]

I would do it differently in the playoffs,

1 Duncan is supposed to be back.

2. by the playoffs, thats more minutes, more time, and more looks for him to get used to stuff.



Do you think Mohammed was better than Marks today?

No, I think it was a wash to Marks playing much better,

but if you want to critique offense Mark's jumper wasn't even close.

I liked Mark's play no question,

but if I have to pick, I go with Nazr Mohammed due to what we saw with him and Duncan playing together.

[MannyIsGod]

Nazr isn't going to learn the system before hte playoffs, no fucking way.

[T Park]

playing next to DUncan makes you look alot better in the system.

It also puts you in easier defensive positions.


Once again, you go with the more talented player.

[ChumpDumper]

Marks + Duncan = several Marks 17ft jumpers

Careful what you wish for.

[whottt]

Chump get off the fucking fence and give a straight answer dammit.

Marks or Nazr? And why?

[ChumpDumper]

Scroll up, dipshit.

[Rummpd]

Nazr. Marks role today was to back up Horry due to Massenburg being ill. Nazr still with bigger upside period.

Playoffs take either Massenburg or Marks, I don't care but Nazr will be by that time the primary backup at center, mark it down.

[whottt]

I saw you saying you want Nazr if Duncan is injured...Make the choice now. Not based on an if.

If Duncan is out for the season it doesn't matter which one we choose.

What if he(Duncan) isn't healthy for the first round but might be healthy later...

You answered an if question with an if and attactched another if to it...typical Chump non answer that stays on the fence.

Make your choice with no qualifiers, based on the here and now.

[usckk]

I wonder why Marks was the first big man off the bench today.

[yavozerb]

We shouldn't be talking about jumpers between these two but about the defense and rebounding! Nazr is a much better defender and outrebounds marks even injured. Leave the scoring to the guards when Tim is out..These guys down low just need to rebound, play some defense, and did I already mention DEFENSE..

[ChumpDumper]

What if he isn't healthy for the first round but might be healthy later...We won't make it out of the first round.

[whottt]

I am not so sure we couldn't make it out of the first round...and todays game proved it.

But what ever...You want Nazr...which makes me certain that Marks is the better one to go with :)

With Nazr we definitely won't make it out of the first round.

[whottt]

And BTW...Marks is pretty active on trying to get offensive glass and dunk too...

[ChumpDumper]

It's not going to matter much. Horry's going to trump everyone in the playoffs again.

[nzkickass]

Ofcourse im going to say Marks :smokin

but honestly i think marks would be a better fit come playoff time, (if Mohammed is still injured) Marks knows everyone better.

Lets just see what happens over the next few games. I hope Pop gives Marks a few more mins to get him ready for the playoffs (if he's needed).

:fro

[whottt]

Right...Horry is going to be the guy playing along side Duncan the most if it isn't Rasho...the guy we are looking at is likely to not get many minutes with Duncan period...

And Rasho plays d alongside Duncan better than anyone.

I'd think long and hard about making Nazr the guy...especially if he still has a bad groin.

If he has a bad groin then his talent isn't enough to justify putting him over Marks IMO.

[T Park]

I disagree Chump, I think if the matchups dictate it, like against a Memphis were you need good rebounding I think hell get playing time.

If Duncan doesn't play in the first round/? IMO, Im not that scared anymore, Ginobili, Barry, and others showed today what they are capable of when they are jazzed for a game.

but, if Duncan plays Im for Nazr playing, if he doesnt??

What the hell, against Seattle and others, lets see what Marks can do.

The guy DOES have a nice jumper, he proved that against other teams.

[ChumpDumper]

Your pinning our playoff hopes on the minutes of Sean Marks is pretty typical.

I'd think long and hard about that.

[T Park]

especially if he still has a bad groin

I think hes hurt worse than he is letting on.

If hes hurt, he needs to slow down, get practice time, and learn the system.

Today was just mind boggling.

Atlanta was even more mind boggling.

[yavozerb]

Marks is not going to play in playoffs!! Lets get serious..A guy who gets no pt ever and now yall are talking putting him in at crunch time. PLEASE!

[ChumpDumper]

I disagree Chump, I think if the matchups dictate it, like against a Memphis were you need good rebounding I think hell get playing time.Who? Nazr? Remember how Horry killed them last year?

[whottt]

Your pinning our playoff hopes on the minutes of Sean Marks is pretty typical.

I'd think long and hard about that.


I'd say the same about Nazr...and you know what? That spot matters...it was part of the reason we lost last season... and it's what I didn't like about trading Malik...it does matter on who plays that spot of back up C and our choices are Marks or Mohammed(assuming the rest of the roster stays the same)

Horry cannot match up with Yao or Shaq...and I have only been impressed with Massenburg 1 time this entire season.

[ChumpDumper]

I'd say the same about Nazr...and you know what? That spot matters...it was part of the reason we lost last season... and it's what I didn't like about trading Malik...it does matter on who plays that spot of back up C and our choices are Marks or Mohammed(assuming the rest of the roster stays the same)

Horry cannot match up with Yao or Shaq...and I have only been impressed with Massenburg 1 time this entire season.You act like Pop would take Horry out to the rotation if Shaq was out there. He didn't last year. This is why it doesn't matter.

You have great confidence in Marks against Shaq? Why?

[whottt]

You act like Pop would take Horry out to the rotation if Shaq was out there. He didn't last year. This is why it doesn't matter.

Damn...even I don't think Pop is stupid enough to try that again...you gotta be kidding me...no he traded for Nazr because he knew he couldn't do that again...Stop calling Pop stupid.




You have great confidence in Marks against Shaq? Why?

I don't know if you have paid much attention this season but I haven't exactly been Marks biggest fan...until I got to see him and Nazr play next to each other...

I'll take a guy that knows his ass from a hole in the ground over one who doesn't...I don't care which one has more excuses to suck.

[yavozerb]

Marks seems like a nice guy, but damn lets get serious about winning a title and let the "Play marks more" thing go.!!

[ChumpDumper]

You think Marks is capable of a 12 point, 17 rebound game against Houston since he's uninjured and knows the system?

[ChumpDumper]

Damn...even I don't think Pop is stupid enough to try that again...you gotta be kidding me...no he traded for Nazr because he knew he couldn't do that again...Stop calling Pop stupid.Ok, in that case he'd play Massenburg before Marks. That's obvious.

[T Park]

if it were Shaq it would Mohammed Massenburg and Nesterovic.

Dont go that far Chump come on.


And the reason he went for Horry last year, he didnt have a long athletic center to put up against them.

But if Mohammed is hurt that negates it.


He didn't last year

He didnt have guys like Massenburg and Mohammed last year.


God chump come on.

[ChumpDumper]

He didnt have guys like Massenburg and Mohammed last year.
He had Malik and Willis.

[T Park]

Massenburg >>>>> Willis.

FOr one thing, hes alot better at holding his ground and he can actually make a low post shot, AND, he rebounds a hell of alot better than Willis.

Malik Mohammed???

Its a wash.

[ChumpDumper]

Pop still has Rasho fronting Shaq (well, more like siding him), so you can't say he really learns his lessons that well.

[ChumpDumper]

Massenburg >>>>> Willis.They're quite close.

[whottt]

If Nazr were healthy and knew the team we might not be having this discussion...therefore it's useless to compare Marks to Nazr as if there is nothing wrong with Nazr.

You may think Mark's J sucks, but just based on it's appearance it is going to get more respect than Nazr's...our only hope when Nazr takes a J is that he will kill a member of the opposing team with it, or they will die laughing...because they will be doing everything in their power to encourage him to take that shot...and he'll take it too.

[T Park]

To answer the question in this thread, and to get out of the ridiculousness,

Nazr Mohammed, only because he has shown, next to Tim Duncan he rebounds quite well, and Nazr takes advantage of the easy looks Duncan affords him.

so in answer, Nazr, because of talent, and better rebounding.

[ChumpDumper]

You may think Mark's J sucksYou said that. Everyone in chat saw you say it 10 times. Good God you are a hypocrite.
If Nazr were healthy and knew the team we might not be having this discussion...therefore it's useless to compare Marks to Nazr as if there is nothing wrong with Nazr.Absolutely not, when Nazr was healthy and knew the system he was in, that's the game he had against Houston.

Is Marks -- healthy and familiar with this system -- capable of that kind of game against the Rockets?

Yes or no?

[ducks]

Nazr Mohammed, only because he has shown, next to Tim Duncan he rebounds quite well, and Nazr takes advantage of the easy looks Duncan affords him.

so in answer, Nazr, because of talent, and better rebounding


what has sean every did for the spurs with all the offseason training camp and playing agaisnt duncan for years brought sean
atleast when duncan plays nazr looked awesome out there

[whottt]

You said that. Everyone in chat saw you say it 10 times. Good God you are a hypocrite.

And when have I said Marks J doesn't suck? It's better than Nazr's though...and if I said otherwise I was full of shit. I promise you. Both J's suck...but at least Marks J looks like a J and not a...crap I can't even think of what Nazr's looks like but it's fucking ugly....and he looks like he is injuring himself when he shoots it.






Absolutely not, when Nazr was healthy and knew the system he was in, that's the game he had against Houston.

Guess what? He's not healthy and he doesn't know the system.........now. Hence this thread.


Is Marks -- healthy and familiar with this system -- capable of that kind of game against the Rockets?

Yes or no?

Probably not...but Nazr isn't healthy or familiar with the system so that doesn't do us any good right now.

[ChumpDumper]

And when have I said Marks J doesn't suck?You said I think it sucks. Idiot.

[ChumpDumper]

Guess what? He's not healthy and he doesn't know the system.........now. Hence this thread. And yet he plays well with Duncan. Hence my answer.

[whottt]

Idiot...I am not saying it doesn't suck...but Nazr's is worse.

Pull your head out and get it.

[ChumpDumper]

Pull your head out and stop making lies about what I think.

Idiot.

[ChumpDumper]

Do you even think Marks is capable of 13 and 8 in 21 minutes against the Pistons?

[whottt]

Let me get this straight...you are saying that Marks J doesn't suck? You are a bigger idiot than I thought.

[whottt]

Do you even think Marks is capable of 13 and 8 in 21 minutes against the Pistons?

I don't think that's out of the realm of possiblity. Has Marks even played 21 minutes this season?

You act like Nazr didn't suck against the Pistons...I suggest you forget the stats and rewatch that game.

[ChumpDumper]

Let me get this straight...you are saying that Marks J doesn't suck?I'm saying you are a fucking hypocrite for saying anything remotely positive about Marks' J after bashing it all afternoon. I don't care for the jumper much, but he's going to take it.
You act like Nazr didn't suck against the Pistons...I suggest you forget the stats and rewatch that game.Let's act like Marks would've won the game. And the first round without Duncan.

[whottt]

I'm saying you are a fucking hypocrite for saying anything remotely positive about Marks' J after bashing it all afternoon.

I am only saying something remotely postive about it when comparing it to Nazr's....



I don't care for the jumper much, but he's going to take it.
Better him than Nazr...who will also take it. At least Marks will draw a passing interest from the defenders...



Let's act like Marks would've won the game. And the first round without Duncan.

He couldn't have done any worse.

I flat out think we'd have a better chance of making it out of the first round with Makrs than Nazr...am I being vague about this?

[ChumpDumper]

Marks is shooting a sub-Heal FG% while healthy and knowing the system. i can't say it's a lock he'll do better than Nazr.

[T Park]

ou act like Nazr didn't suck against the Pistons

I watched the game, 13 and 8 against anybody is a good game, come on be reasobable.

Mark's jumper isn't great, but it isn't bad either.

I wouldn't mind seeing him get minutes VS Seattle.

[whottt]

More to the game than FG%...like not having your head stuck up your ass...I think Marks plays better D, he doesn't get the stupid fouls..and his J at least looks like a J...Those are his positives...and sadly they outweigh Nazr's...Marks just looks better out there period.

[ChumpDumper]

If Fortson and Radman are still out, we'll have a great chance against Seattle.

[whottt]

Hey Chump...how come Nazr couldn't outrebound Marks today?

[ChumpDumper]

More to the game than FG%27%? Easy for you to ignore, to be sure.

[ChumpDumper]

How come Marks couldn't outshoot Nazr?

[Useruser666]

This is the most ridiculous thread ever. It ranks with, "Who would rather have in the playoffs in 1999, the coyote or David Robinson?"

Oh I will even dare to justify Nazr. So we would rather have T Mass than Nazr?

Nazr was terrible in his 12 minutes of play today. OMG!!! How many minutes has Marks played this year?

Who will guard the other team's bigs? Marks?

Who will rebound? Marks?

Answer those questions and it should be pretty easy to figure out.

[whottt]

No what's ridiculous as that I am agruing with all the same people who preferred Nazr over Malik Rose in the first place, and who still do.....ignorance is bliss I guess. Must be nice to be wrong and never realize it.

[Useruser666]

Hey Chump...how come Nazr couldn't outrebound Marks today?

That is a pathetic question. He was out rebounded 4-3. In 16-12 minutes of play. All this comes from one game. How many games has Nazr out rebounded Marks when Marks is DNP CD?

[whottt]

How come Marks got more minutes than Nazr?

[Useruser666]

No what's ridiculous as that I am agruing with all the same people who preferred Nazr over Malik Rose in the first place...ignorance bliss I guess. Must be nice to be wrong and never realize it.

I see you have taken up your next "Battle of the Alamo Thread". Guess what side you're on?

[ChumpDumper]

How come Marks got more minutes than Nazr? Because Deke didn't play much.

[whottt]

Probably the same side where Pop admits he made the trade for financial reasons...not talent...like I was the last time. Difference is it didn't take a royal buttfucking by a lottery team to get me say it.

[Nikos]

If Fortson and Radman are still out, we'll have a great chance against Seattle.

Fortson is the type of player that has broken the Spurs. It's not just the scoring from their most potent offensive players that worries me, but the fact that their robo-rebounders Evans and Fortson seem to always get the offensive rebounds for them. Either they convert them into FTs, or give the team extra possesions to eat more clock and eventually score. Even Jerome James has made an impact underneath.

If the Spurs neutralize Seattle's boardwork and energy underneath, they can beat this team should they meet in the playoffs, even perhaps on Wednesday as well.

[Useruser666]

Oh, and FYI, those 4 rebounds are Marks' high for the season.

[whottt]

For all I know that could be Mark's career high...this was probably his season high in minutes as well...but he was a bigger reason for this win than Nazr was IMO. Something to think about as we head into the post season. Big game...believe me..in a million years I never thought I would lobby for Shawn Marks to get off the IR, much less be put on a playoff roster over anyone...but this game gave me a reason to do so.

We aren't talking about who is better...we are talking about who sucks less.

What you have here is a comparison of a career IR player VS a career back up lottery Center...

In this case the IR guy knows the team better and is healthier than the career back up lottery Center....

[ChumpDumper]

Because Marks will leapfrog Mass and Horry as well and play big minutes.

He's that good.

[Useruser666]

For all I know that could be Mark's career high...this was probably his season high in minutes as well...but he was a bigger reason for this win than Nazr was IMO. Something to think about as we head into the post season. Big game...believe me..in a million years I never thought I would lobby for Shawn Marks to get off the IR, much less be put on a playoff roster over anyone...but this game was gave me a reason to do so.

Of course he was a bigger reason. When you go by the numbers of a single game and judge a player, you pretty well are shooting yourself in the foot. If you want to go by numbers then....

Marks > Duncan

Sure that's absurd. But so is Marks > Nazr to a lesser degree.

[whottt]

I don't think Marks was extraordinarly better than Nazr statistically or anything...but Nazr looks lost and gets dumb fouls(although he didn't really do that today with the fouls)...but he is lost period, and it's gamble to think he is going to figure it out by the playoffs. And he still has a bad groin.

[Useruser666]

What does a fireman take to a burning building, a firetruck or a gasoline tanker?

I rather have a big body rebounding Nazr than a smaller weaker Marks who will get destroyed in the post. Do you actually believe that even with knowing the system, Marks is a better defensive presence?

Goodnight

[T Park]

of course he does.

Cause he doesn't like Nazr, how many more I HATE NAZR posts must be make.


Probably the same side where Pop admits he made the trade for financial reasons

Guess you didn't listen to the last pop show on tuesday.

[Kori Ellis]

I hope we don't have to rely on Nazr or Marks to do big things in the postseason.

Rasho and Horry are playing really well and those two, along with a healthy Duncan, should get the bulk of the minutes in the front court in the playoffs.

Rasho was awesome today. He played outstanding D and was an offensive force in the first half (Yes, I said force.) Horry is getting in a playoff groove.

When Tim and Devin get healthy, Marks will probably go back to IR. So though he brings a lot of energy, talking about him in the postseason is probably a moot point. Nazr will get some minutes and hopefully by then be more acclimated on D.

[whottt]

Guess you didn't listen to the last pop show on tuesday.



Malik's contract got him traded

I guess you weren't listening TPark.

[whottt]

Kori...who you choose and why?

[T Park]

she said Marks is gonna go on IR,

so id say that means shes picking Nazr.

[Kori Ellis]

Kori...who you choose and why?

Nazr because Marks looks like a clown. ;)

[timvp]

Nazr has been a huge dissapointment for me and I wasn't expecting him to be too great to begin with. His only real asset is offensive rebounding, but even when he gets the O board he pump fakes and gets blocked even more than Rose did. His hands are equally as good as Rose's were. His jumper is worse. His defense is pretty horrible and his defensive rebounding is average.

I hate how on offense he clogs up everything. He goes to the front of the rim and calls for the ball almost every time up the court. I'm not sure why he does that because he doesn't have a post game to speak of.

He'll be good if he just concentrates on rebounding and gets better defensively. He should never post up and should only shoot jumpers when there is no other option.

If he doesn't do those things, the Spurs traded Rose and two draft picks for Samaki Walker.

[whottt]

she said Marks is gonna go on IR,

so id say that means shes picking Nazr.


No, I'd say that means she thinks the Spurs are going to put Marks on the IR. Her saying she prefers Nazr means she prefers Nazr. She's not one of the people all over Nazr's jock like you are. In fact I'd be willing to bet she thinks that trade sucked even though she hasn't said so one way or the other.

[Kori Ellis]

I hate how on offense he clogs up everything. He goes to the front of the rim and calls for the ball almost every time up the court.

Yeah I've seen everyone from Parker to Pop to Horry yelling at him on the floor to move out of the way. I'm not sure that he knows where he's supposed to go on offense, which is weird. He played well for a few games; I thought his rebounding positioning was great and liked that he wasn't afraid. But somehow he regressed a little. Hopefully he'll catch on by the playoffs. But like I said, I don't think he, or Marks, will be a big component in the postseason.

[T Park]

the Spurs traded Rose and two draft picks for Samaki Walker.

oh good lord.

[timvp]

oh good lord.

Yeah, I am being a little tough on Samaki. At least he could hit 40% from the field and had a decent jumper.

[T Park]

Yeah I've seen everyone from Parker to Pop to Horry yelling at him on the floor to move out of the way. I'm not sure that he knows where he's supposed to go on offense, which is weird. He played well for a few games; I thought his rebounding positioning was great and liked that he wasn't afraid. But somehow he regressed a little. Hopefully he'll catch on by the playoffs. But like I said, I don't think he, or Marks, will be a big component in the postseason.

maybe he wants to help pick up the slack offensively since duncan is down???

Sorry, Im being too positive for this thread, guess I should be pissed and in the dumps about a trade you cant do nothing about and bitch about more than Heal > Jordan.

[whottt]

His only real asset is offensive rebounding, but even when he gets the O board he pump fakes and gets blocked even more than Rose did.

And that's why he gets so many offensive rebounds too...he got at least one O board off his own face today.



His hands are equally as good as Rose's were. His jumper is worse. His defense is pretty horrible and his defensive rebounding is average.

I think his hands are worse...Malik's were good some games and bad in others...Nazr's are pretty much bad.


I hate how on offense he clogs up everything. He goes to the front of the rim and calls for the ball almost every time up the court. I'm not sure why he does that because he doesn't have a post game to speak of.

Now you know why Stephon wasn't sorry to see him go :)


He'll be good if he just concentrates on rebounding and gets better defensively. He should never post up and should only shoot jumpers when there is no other option.

But when? After we get eliminated from the playoffs?

[T Park]

New depths, new depths.

Unreal, now hes samaki walker.


What a total fuckin joke.

[ChumpDumper]

Now you know why Stephon wasn't sorry to see him goStephon was upset.

[Kori Ellis]

maybe he wants to help pick up the slack offensively since duncan is down???

Yeah I'm sure he wants to. But I just don't know why he goes to the wrong spot on the floor in offensive sets. Again, I think he's a great position rebounder and could be an asset. But right now, he's not doing much of anything right. He also needs to stop fouling. He is averaging almost 4 fouls in 16 mpg. He can't get into any kind of flow playing like that.

[T Park]

t I just don't know why he goes to the wrong spot on the floor in offensive sets

uh, unfamiliarity with the offensive playbook?

[timvp]

New depths, new depths.

Unreal, now hes samaki walker.


What a total fuckin joke.

Samaki Walker's 2001-02 season was better than any season in Nazr's career. If he put up those type of number for the Spurs, I'd be damn happy.

[whottt]

Stephon was upset.

Yeah...the "we didn't trade Patrick Ewing" showed the depth of his feelings for Nazr...

[ChumpDumper]

"Who the fuck is my center now?" was the report I read.

[T Park]

fine.

I give up rooting for a guy.

Cause its fuckin horrible to do.

Unreal.

[Manu20]

Nazr will come around just give him some time to learn the spurs system.

[Kori Ellis]

It's not horrible to root for him. I think all Spurs fans are rooting for him; he's just not cutting it ... yet.

[timvp]

I'm rooting for him too. But it doesn't hurt to be honest about the situation.

[ChumpDumper]

Don't give him any time. That's only reserved for guys not traded for Malik.

We'll see. He looks very lost without Duncan, that's for sure.

[T Park]

I'm rooting for him too.

lol.

Thats fuckin rich.

[T Park]

That's only reserved for guys not traded for Malik.

You mean,

like Barry and Marks??

[whottt]

We didn't have a choice with Barry...it was him or someone else...

We didn't have to trade Malik Rose and it was stupid fucking trade where winning a title this season is concerned, and anyone that is still defending it...when even Pop has given that up...is a moron.

[ChumpDumper]

We didn't have a choice with Barry...it was him or someone else...You just contradicted yourself.

[whottt]

"Who the fuck is my center now?" was the report I read.

Link?


Cuz I can find the Patrick Ewing link...I can find the Nazr saying he understand why he isn't missed...I can find some quotes by just about every Knick saying Nazr isn't missed...

I don't think you realize the degree to which Stephon Marbury's lips are attatched to Isiah Thomas's ass and that's why I doubt that quote is true.

[ChumpDumper]

Whottt, unless you can convince me that Marks will pass up both Nazr and Massenburg that he would get any appreciable minutes in the playoffs, this thread is pointless.

[whottt]

You just contradicted yourself.

You wish...it not Barry then another guy that is new to the team...

That's wasn't the choice we had to make with Rose VS Nazr...And your inability to use logic is stunning.

[ChumpDumper]

Link?RealGMs wiretap archive is hosed. I'll look elsewhere.

[ChumpDumper]

You wish...it not Barry then another guy that is new to the team.Nope, it's Barry or Brown, dipshit -- and who knows how many minutes Barry would be playing if Brown was healthy. Barry got plenty of welfare, so don't act like he didn't.

[NZHayden]

I choose Marks ahead of nazr. obvisiously
It was awesome in new zealand when he got pulled off the IR it even made tv news

SOURCE- www.tvnz.co.nz/view/sport_story_skin/480822%3fformat=html

Marks to see court time





Mar 22, 2005

Tall Black foward Sean Marks will see some NBA playing time over the next month with the San Antonio Spurs placing All-Star forward/center Tim Duncan on the injured list.

Marks, who has featured in just seven games for the Spurs this season, has been activated from the injured reserve list after Duncan was forced to leave Monday's game against the Detroit Pistons with a severely sprained right ankle.

Duncan, who is expected to miss the next 2-to-4 weeks, suffered the injury with 10:09 left in the first quarter after he landed on the foot of Detroit's Rasheed Wallace following a basket. He immediately grabbed the ankle and was grimacing in pain.

The 28-year-old Duncan, who was sidelined for a few games earlier this month with the same injury, then had to be helped off the court and was taken for X-rays, which came back negative.

Duncan has appeared in 62 games this season and is averaging 20.9 points, 11.4 rebounds and 2.68 blocks.

[NZHayden]

ohh yeah calm down on the bitching. but it is quite fun to follow

[Rick Von Braun]

I can't believe this thread is 5 pages long... classic spurstalk.com to discuss the 10-11th player off the bench that will probably see (at most) 6-8 minutes per game in the playoffs.

The Spurs' frontcourt playoff rotation will be Duncan, Rasho and Horry. Garbage/foul trouble minutes for Nazr or TMass or Marks (it doesn't matter). IMHO, Nazr and TMass make the playoff roster.

I agree with Kori... if the Spurs shall depend heavily on what Nazr, TMass and/or Marks bring to the team, the Spurs will not go deep in the playoffs. All I ask of any of them is hard nosed D, rebounding, and 6 fouls.

[ChumpDumper]

The Spurs' frontcourt playoff rotation will be Duncan, Rasho and Horry. Garbage/foul trouble minutes for Nazr or TMass or Marks (it doesn't matter). IMHO, Nazr and TMass make the playoff roster.You're a nutjob!

[nzkickass]

CAREER HIGHS
Points 15
Total Rebounds 11 (2 times)
Blocks 4
Minutes Played 36


there not the best numbers but there not the worst.

in the 2001/02 season he played pretty good, he was the starting centre while Mourning was out injured.
G GS Min FG% 3pt FT% Of Def TReb Ast Stl Blk To
01-02 MIA 21 6 15.2 .432 .000 .588 .90 2.70 3.60 .4 .24 . 48 .90
Pf Pts
1.90 4.6

[whottt]

RVB and Chump...I realize that you guys kind of think it's silly to have such a lengthy debate over the 11 or 12th man...

But let me refresh your memory of game 2 of the 2003 playoffs VS the Phoenix Suns...

I don't think anyone would have pencilled in Danny Ferry for 10 rebounds and I don't think anyone would have expected him to be very important...he was, and it had nothing to do with his shooting....the one thing he had going for him was his knowledge of the team.

I also think you guys forget how huge Kevin Willis was in the playoff run...particularly against the Lakers.

And to compare Massenburg favorably to Willis is a crime...

[Useruser666]

This thread is still ridiculous. Unless there are major injuries to the Spurs, Makrs will not and SHOULD not be on the playoff roster.

[whottt]

User...are you fully aware of how bad Nazr sucks? I mean have you watched him? I know he can rebound and o board...but does he really do it well enough to make up for the fact that he does absolutely nothing else well and is lost? I don't think he does it that well and I do think the point is worth debating.

I can tell the guy is trying...and he is a very nice guy...but I don't like the way he looks out there(lost).

He did hit a J yesteryday, a big one, but damn...it just doesn't seem like he has a purpose out there other than crashing offensive glass...and he does do stupid stuff.

[wildbill2u]

Do you think Mohammed was better than Marks today? Who do you think contributed to the win more? And why?

This was a playoff style game...

And if your aswer isn't Mohammed then why would you do it differently in the playoffs...

Well, Nasr shot 33% to Marks 0%. And comparative talent may be the reason why one player has been a starter on an NBA team and contributed elsewhere--and the other player has played in only 68 games in a career and only 11 games in TWO YEARS with the Spurs.

It's not as though Marks burned up the league in previous stints with Toronto or Miami. Good practice dummy though, I'll give him that.

[wildbill2u]

Don't give him any time. That's only reserved for guys not traded for Malik.

We'll see. He looks very lost without Duncan, that's for sure.

When you think about it, Nasr's now having to learn another offensive system since Duncan went down and the playbook (If Pop actually has one that doesn't feature the 4 down) changed.

[wildbill2u]

Whottt, unless you can convince me that Marks will pass up both Nazr and Massenburg that he would get any appreciable minutes in the playoffs, this thread is pointless.

Pointless? I don't think you get the point of the attack. This is another way for Whottt to get a thread going against the Malik trade--simply using Marks as a stalking horse to attack Nasr.

[Useruser666]

It's the classic bait and switch.

A trojan horse thread.

[Russ]

I don't know if this has been noted before, but Sean Marks looks a lot like Bruce Dern.

[whottt]

I don't know if it's been noted before, but Nazr really sucks and Marks is better.

[ducks]

:05.6 SA - Shooting foul on S. Marks
:24.0 SA - N. Mohammed offensive rebound
:24.0 SA - N. Mohammed makes shot
:24.9 SA - S. Marks misses a 4-foot jumper in the lane

[jcrod]

I didn't read this long thread, but my guess Mass is the odd man out.

Marks has look surprisingly well, but I think Nazr would do better than anybody next to Tim. So Mass to IR when Tim is healthy.

[whottt]

:05.6 SA - Shooting foul on S. Marks
:24.0 SA - N. Mohammed offensive rebound
:24.0 SA - N. Mohammed makes shot
:24.9 SA - S. Marks misses a 4-foot jumper in the lane

Ducks...check the box
Nazr did have a good dunk...but that's a given...he'll get those on ocassion

[boutons]

Nazr has impressed me less and less. He looks lost. I don't know where the Nazr of Nov/Dec's great stats went but he hasn't shown up in San Antonio.

Marks seems more alert, more active, more floor sense, he's always going for rebound or trying to de-stabilize an opponent's rebound. He hits his FTs. Too bad his jumper isn't falling, because he is left open. He seems to rush it a bit, too flat.

TMass has had a couple of very good games, but he doesn't get much done when he comes in for shorter periods.

It's a close call. They are all marginal.

[whottt]

I think Marks is just rusty...he and Nazr are almost the same identical player...Nazr is a better rebounder but Marks seems to have a better J so he isn't always clogging up the middle.

They both hop around like a couple a kangaroos trying to get o boards.

[ducks]

well narz will be easier to trade in the offseason if spurs are not intersted in working wiith him this offseason then rose

[whottt]

Nazr is definitely more tradeable..but I don't really want to trade him...I just don't think he's going get his act together before this season is over...but he's got potential for next season for sure, no matter what happens this year.

[ducks]

I do not want to trade him unless they can get a much better big but I do think they will
I am hoping nazr,bowen and tp will practice together like tp,bowen and rose did last year

[milkyway21]

Nazr over Marks.

Reason: offensive rbds. blocks.

[MannyIsGod]

blocks? Yeah, Nazr, the block machine. Only, not.

[timvp]

Nazr might end up being a bigger bust than Charles Smith I. At least he had a good half season.

The Spurs should have gone after any other number of Hawks centers like Joel Przybilla, Obinna Ekezie, Jason Collier or even Alan Henderson.

Nazr is lost and is regressing.

[milkyway21]

The Spurs should have gone after any other number of Hawks centers like Joel Przybilla, Obinna Ekezie, Jason Collier or even Alan Henderson.

Nazr is lost and is regressing.

...there was a news in february that the Spurs was interested in Henderson. what went wrong?

from Express News (2/27/05)
The team would prefer to sign a power forward and has some interest in Alan Henderson, who was released by Milwaukee after Dallas traded him Thursday. The Spurs probably will have a difficult time convincing Henderson to pass on an offer to re-sign with the Mavericks."

[timvp]

what went wrong?

He re-signed with the Mavs.

[T Park]

Obinna Ekezie, Jason Collier or even Alan Henderson.


exagerating much???? :rolleyes

[milkyway21]

blocks? Yeah, Nazr, the block machine. Only, not...Nazr said he'll never be a shot-blocker. But he has some blocks as a Spur...

LAST 6 GAMES

OPP MIN PTS TREB AST TO STL BLK
03/18 CHA 19 8 8 1 4 1 2
03/20 DET 21 13 8 2 1 0 0
03/21 NY 22 7 7 0 3 0 1
03/23 IND 16 6 3 0 1 0 0
03/25 ATL 13 3 5 0 3 0 3
03/27 HOU12 2 3 0 0 1 0

i guess when a player playing limited minutes can't really show his potential at this time. Horry is playing well, Rasho, too! Even Marks. so Nazr just became a bench warmer...

oh, before i forgot, Nazr had 2 blocks tonight vs. Seattle in just 15min gametime.

[timvp]

Notice how you leave off the name Joel Przybilla. Alan Henderson is having an awesome year. Jason Collier put up better numbers last year as a Hawk than Nazr ever did. Obinna Ekezie is now the man in the middle for the Hawks. Odds are he'll put up similar numbers to Nazr before he moves on.

[milkyway21]

Notice how you leave off the name Joel Przybilla. Alan Henderson is having an awesome year. Jason Collier put up better numbers last year as a Hawk than Nazr ever did. Obinna Ekezie is now the man in the middle for the Hawks. Odds are he'll put up similar numbers to Nazr before he moves on...you think the Malik for Nazr trade a mistake? Was it a waste of our time?

Bec. I'd like to think we had that trade not for the bench but for a possible use in the playoffs.if we have MaRKS we can use in the playoffs, THEN WHY SIGN NAZR in the first place?

[whottt]

..you think the Malik for Nazr trade a mistake? Was it a waste of our time?

Bec. I'd like to think we had that trade not for the bench but for a possible use in the playoffs.if we have MaRKS we can use in the playoffs, THEN WHY SIGN NAZR in the first place?

$$$>Title

[wildbill2u]

If Marks is better than NASR why didn't our coaching staff perceive this and trade for somebody else? They've had a very long time to evaluate Marks and give him some time (When he hasn't been on IR)

Marks had a pretty nice game against Seattle, but both of them need some playing time for anyone to tell much about their relative value.

[ChumpDumper]

Jason Collier put up better numbers last year as a Hawk than Nazr ever did.Untrue. If you want to go by each player's first half season with ATL, Nazr averaged 12pts and 9reb per game while Collier put up 11 and 6 in slightly more time.
Obinna Ekezie is now the man in the middle for the Hawks.After beating out the aforementioned Collier, he's only averaging 21mpg as a starter, averaging 7 and 5 and shooting 43%.

Pryzbilla would've definitely been a good pickup. I floated the idea of signing him in the offseason, but big men weren't a priority.

[ChumpDumper]

If Marks is better than NASR why didn't our coaching staff perceive this and trade for somebody else?The trade was about finances more than anything. That Nazr can play was a bonus.

[ducks]

yes money was a big factor in it
rember spurs offered bobcats draft pick plus $ to take rose off their hands

[Kori Ellis]

This thread is worth re-visiting right now. Marks is improving and Nazr is regressing.

Does the coaching staff actually have to give thought to leaving Nazr off the playoff roster?

[nzkickass]

Yes

[ducks]

if devin can not go at all you leave devin off
especially with big dog here

[Hook Dem]

Marks is definetly playing better than Nazr. Nazr needs to go strong to the basket like Marks.

[Kori Ellis]

if devin can not go at all you leave devin off
especially with big dog here

I'm not sure you leave Devin off if he keeps improving how he is.

You need to leave 3 players off. Johnson, obviously, but who are the other two. It's not clear cut at all this seaosn.

[T Park]

If Nazr Mohammed was even close to healthy that would work.

This guy isn't even able to run up the court.


Id IR him only because the guy looks like he can barely walk.


This isn't the same player that I saw back in November kicking Jermaine O'Neal's ass.


The inury quite simply has regressed him.


Another thing though, the guy gets the least consistent minutes of anyone on the team.


But Im sure once again thats HIS fault.

[Kori Ellis]

If Nazr Mohammed was even close to healthy that would work.

This guy isn't even able to run up the court.


Id IR him only because the guy looks like he can barely walk.

:wtf

He's not injured at all.

[bigbendbruisebrother]

Marks has earned a spot. The guy plays hard and smart. He can shoot the jumpshot, play down low, block shots and rebound. He has energy and it seems to carry over to the rest of the team.

While he makes some bad decisions, and forces things down low, T-Mass can hit the 10-15 footer with some consistency, rebounds well and hits his free throws. He also defends well in the post (witness his minutes versus Brand tonight) and he understands the system well enough to get the ball where it needs to be most of the time.

To me Wilks seems redundant we have enough quick guys who can bring the ball up the court well and run the offense, but from what I've read from other posters, Pop wants him around to matchup with Boykins.

Nazr still looks lost and the guy can't catch a cold. I think he's the odd man out. It's unfortunate, because we need another big to backup Rasho at center, but it doesn't look like Nazr is going to fill the bill this season.

[MannyIsGod]

Nazr is one hundred percent healthy Tpark. He just sucks.

[Hook Dem]

For whatever reason, Nazr did suck tonight!

[timvp]

Nazr is horrible. He's not injured. There is no wrap on his leg anymore. He's just a scrub that was starting in New York because he was the team's tallest player.

The Knicks screw the Spurs again.

[Tek_XX]

Marks is picking it up, getting used to being on the court and actually playing. Nazzy is soft as hell, is it just me or is he actually digressing.

[Tek_XX]

err regressing, digressing is something else

[Kori Ellis]

Regressing or digressing, yes it's seems that he's getting worse the longer he's here.

[MannyIsGod]

Kori, LJ, myself and others have been trying to tell you that he's regressed for some time now. Nazr keeps getting time early in games, but he fucks things up so badly and stagnates the offense so badly that he doesn't see the floor again untill garbage time.

If I had Whottt like skills, I'd look for the +/- Nazr has in the past 3 weeks and it would be brutaly obvious how much he detracts from the Spurs.

[Tek_XX]

Looks like pop fell for another charles Smith, wake up Greg, remember if it's too good to be true.............

it probably is.

[whottt]

Manny, I'll look and see but I don't know if I can find segmented +/- like that...And actually RVB and FWDT and guys like that are usually better at finding stats than I am.

Kori might actually be able to do it since she is press and can get access to the high end stats at NBA.com...I don't know what detailed stats they have though since I have never seen them.

[T Park]

Nazr is one hundred percent healthy Tpark

really then why did the trainer give him a heating pad and some other stuff for his groin tonight???

[duncan2k5]

Marks looks more confident on the court and he hustles more than naz. he can inspire the rest of the team with his play like malik used to do. naz is just disappointing. he tend to get down on himself too much. plus i perfet to see marks miss a wide open baseline shot than to watch naz get blocked everytime.

[MannyIsGod]

I don't think that's nessecary Whottt. It's pretty frickin' obvious who the better player is at the moment.

[whottt]

St.Croix Boy just said every thing that really needs to be said...

[whottt]

I agree Manny...but I think Nazr will be on the playoff roster no matter how badly he plays...The Spurs will look like fools if they put him on the IR, after trading Malik Rose, paying his trade kicker, and sending two #1 picks to NY, all for Nazr...

I hope we have seen the last of any Spurfans wanting to see a big midseason trade...this is what happens when we do them.

Fortunately I don't think this one cost us a title like the Strickland trade might have...

[Kori Ellis]

.but I think Nazr will be on the playoff roster no matter how badly he plays

So you think Nazr and Mass make it on, and Marks is left out?

[whottt]

No...I think it will be Devin that gets left out...

[Kori Ellis]

It will be interesting. I wouldn't think they'd carry all those bigs and leave Devin, Johnson and Wilks off. Devin might be left off, but they might keep Wilks -- and then have to pick which big to leave off.

[MannyIsGod]

I don't think there's any chance in hell Brown gets left off of the roster, even if he is not ready to go before the 1st round.

I too, suspect that Nazr and Massenburg are the front runners for the last 2 spots. Nazr has done everything possible to try and give the spot to Marks, but I still think Pop will be very leary of giving it to Marks.

And that's a damn shame. Hopefully Pop can prove me wrong.

[grjr]

Nazr keeps getting time early in games, but he fucks things up so badly and stagnates the offense so badly that he doesn't see the floor again untill garbage time.

When Nazr came into the game in the 4th quarter the Spurs had 86 points. I thought to myself (cause I was alone) I hope that's enough points to win cause we ain't scorin' much more.

I hope management doesn't put Nazr on the playoff roster just to save face. If he turns things around in the next couple weeks then fine but right now it's not even close between him, Marks, and Mass.

I predict if Nazr DOES get left off the roster it will be because of a new "injury". I think we need a poll on which part of his body will be "injured".

[SLOVENIAN 8]

Rose should stay in SA and now when they bring Robinson would be great, but Nazr had onl 2-3 good games , and now.... i dont know if trading nazr for Rose was so good... Spurs got a size but, we will se how will be in playoffs.

[slayermin]

If Devin is good to go, then leave off Marks. If Devin is still hurt or slightly injured, keep both bigs and leave off Wilks and Brown.

[Jimcs50]

Marks>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nazr

[BigVee]

I don't have time to read through 8 pages so someone may have said this but, when the Spurs lose in the playoffs it is generally because the offense goes into a prolonged dumper. So I would keep the player more likely to make a play on offense. Based on what I have seen, that would be Marks.

[Guru of Nothing]

Far be it for me to pimp for Nazr, but I'd rather he be on the playoff roster than Marks.

Call it upside, or whatever, but Nazr has more of it. Yes, I don't like the cute spin off the glass shots he seems to be fond of, but Marks is no better. Sure, he (Marks) can dunk when no one contests him, but I'm amazed at how easily he is snuffed when he gets the ball within an inch or two of the rim in traffic.

I guarantee we won't be having this same discussion a year from now.

[Jimcs50]

Far be it for me to pimp for Nazr, but I'd rather he be on the playoff roster than Marks.

Call it upside, or whatever, but Nazr has more of it. Yes, I don't like the cute spin off the glass shots he seems to be fond of, but Marks is no better. Sure, he (Marks) can dunk when no one contests him, but I'm amazed at how easily he is snuffed when he gets the ball within an inch or two of the rim in traffic.

I guarantee we won't be having this same discussion a year from now.


Marks can shoot just as well as any one on the team from outside, but has yet to get his shot down...if he does, he will be much more valuable than Nazr who has done nothing to deserve a spot on the roster.

[Mark in Austin]

*bump*

Since this thread was referred to in another post, at the risk of beating a dead horse I thought it would be interesting to read through given what has happened in the playoffs thus far.

[Useruser666]

Bingo!