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MajorMike
06-12-2009, 08:57 AM
I have a HP Media Center

Link to see CPU (http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4922356)

It has an AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ Dual Core 2.2GHz with Bus Speed of 2000MHz.

I have placed 2 more 512 sticks in to make a total of 2G Ram.

I replaced the video card with a GeForce 7600 about 2 years ago.

What I want to know is can my cpu/motherboard/etc handle one of the new GeForce GTX cards?
Link to Card (http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_geforce_gtx_280_us.html)

So I guess I know I could buy it and plug it in, but I really want to know if the system itself would handle it, i.e. is the motherboard/chip fast enough to release the full power of the card?

I have looked at buying a hard/core gaming computer, but I have most of the components already in mine. The newest cpus are around 2.66 to 3.0. If I can make a state of the art video card work in mine and bump up to the max 4G of RAM and make it work, I don't see why I would need to spend 2000-4000 on a system with cool lights and a fancy gloss finish when I have the skeleton.

Would it work? Would I need to upgrade my chipset? Power supply?

phyzik
06-12-2009, 09:17 AM
Your processor is fine, you might want to think about upgrading to 4gb of ram. ram is cheap right now. Didnt see what size your power supply was but ideally you want to have at least a 400w power supply.

other than those things you should be OK with that video card.

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 09:31 AM
well, you'll need at least a PCI Express slot on your motherboard and depending how old your motherboard is, you might not have one.

Also GTX cards are power hogs, I'd recommend at least a 600w PS.

Finally, GTX cards are monstrous things compared to the old card you have and they produce a LOT of heat, so you might want to check out how big your case is and how good its cooling system is, otherwise you might find yourself without room or worse IMO, with the system overheating.

Now, there is absolutely no point in spending extra for a card like the GTX when you don't have at least a good Core 2 Duo CPU (or equivalent AMX) and at least DDR2 RAM. You should think of upgrading those first IMO. Having said that, your motherboard might be old enough that it doesn't support DDR2 even, so you might find yourself having to scrap everything and start from scratch.

There was a point a couple of years ago where technology took a small leap with PCI express and DDR2 capability, and old motherboards (and even not so old ones) became obsolete quite rapidly. This meant that having to upgrade your computer = buying from the motherboard up. In other words... EVERYTHING! Hopefully, this is not the case with you.

Just my two cents, obviously there's a lot of people in here with more in depth knowledge on the matter. They might be able to explain this better.

phyzik
06-12-2009, 09:41 AM
well, you'll need at least a PCI Express slot on your motherboard and depending how old your motherboard is, you might not have one.

Also GTX cards are power hogs, I'd recommend at least a 600w PS.

Finally, GTX cards are monstrous things compared to the old card you have and they produce a LOT of heat, so you might want to check out how big your case is and how good its cooling system is, otherwise you might find yourself without room or worse IMO, with the system overheating.

Now, there is absolutely no point in spending extra for a card like the GTX when you don't have at least a good Core 2 Duo CPU (or equivalent AMX) and at least DDR2 RAM. You should think of upgrading those first IMO. Having said that, your motherboard might be old enough that it doesn't support DDR2 even, so you might find yourself having to scrap everything and start from scratch.

There was a point a couple of years ago where technology took a small leap with PCI express and DDR2 capability, and old motherboards (and even not so old ones) became obsolete quite rapidly. This meant that having to upgrade your computer = buying from the motherboard up. In other words... EVERYTHING! Hopefully, this is not the case with you.

Just my two cents, obviously there's a lot of people in here with more in depth knowledge on the matter. They might be able to explain this better.

His board has PCIe x16

400w is plenty of power unless he was to go SLI which isnt possible on his board.

The heat issue is a good tip. I cant believe I forgot to mention that :lol

his CPU is dual core so he should be OK there.

his mobo looks to support 400MHz DDR400/PC3200. While not DDR2 I dont think he will see that big of a difference, he would only notice it if he was trying to run a game at some crazy high resolution like 1680x1050 or something like that.

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 09:54 AM
I have PCI-Ex ports. The card I have in there now has a fan on opr, so it takes up 2 slots already, which is what I think the GTX 200s do. I think I see they have 2 fans on top.

I don't know exactly what my power supply is, but i can't imagine it being less that 400; I want to say it is 500ish; I'll have to check on that. I can't find it in the specs, can I look somewhere on the cpu for the power supply numbers?

I am looking at around 150 for 4GB of RAM (or 77 if I keep 2 of my 512s and get a pair of 1GBs to make 3GB total) and 350ish if I get a GTX 285. This ends up at about 500 bucks. If I go for a new MB and chipset, we are talking another 200-400 bucks. Additionally, I am going to have to get a copy of Windows (because with the HP all data recovery is on a 2nd drive) which will run another 150-200 bucks.

So if I go that way, we are talking at least 850 maybe 1100.

Cheaply I could get a GTX 260 for 175 and 2G ram for 77 and have a really nice upgrade around 250. I will not buy and install a new MB, if it gets to that I will buy a new system which is what I'm trying to avoid.

I play WOW, by the way. I run two accounts at once on the system I have a fairly decent grafix and have very little problem. My system is, in reality, just fine for what I am doing; I just want it to be better.

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 10:20 AM
His board has PCIe x16

ok, that's one thing down


400w is plenty of power unless he was to go SLI which isnt possible on his board.No offense, but you're out of your mind bro. 400w won't cut it. You're not just powering the card, you know?


The heat issue is a good tip. I cant believe I forgot to mention that :lolIts essential. GTX card = Big and HOT!


his CPU is dual core so he should be OK there.He should be ok? what? if he doesn't mind the rather small bottleneck that it would create you mean? Again, not worth shelling the bucks for the GTX if you're not going to take full advantage of it.


his mobo looks to support 400MHz DDR400/PC3200. While not DDR2 I dont think he will see that big of a difference, he would only notice it if he was trying to run a game at some crazy high resolution like 1680x1050 or something like that.There is a huge performance spike between DDR 400 and DDR2 1200, and it doesn't just have to do with how high a resolution he uses. Plus, you buy a GTX285 precisely to be able to play games at crazy resolutions (which 1680x1050 is NOT by the way). Otherwise buy yourself an older, cheaper card and you'll be great.

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 10:28 AM
I have PCI-Ex ports. The card I have in there now has a fan on opr, so it takes up 2 slots already, which is what I think the GTX 200s do. I think I see they have 2 fans on top.

I don't know exactly what my power supply is, but i can't imagine it being less that 400; I want to say it is 500ish; I'll have to check on that. I can't find it in the specs, can I look somewhere on the cpu for the power supply numbers?

I am looking at around 150 for 4GB of RAM (or 77 if I keep 2 of my 512s and get a pair of 1GBs to make 3GB total) and 350ish if I get a GTX 285. This ends up at about 500 bucks. If I go for a new MB and chipset, we are talking another 200-400 bucks. Additionally, I am going to have to get a copy of Windows (because with the HP all data recovery is on a 2nd drive) which will run another 150-200 bucks.

So if I go that way, we are talking at least 850 maybe 1100.

Cheaply I could get a GTX 260 for 175 and 2G ram for 77 and have a really nice upgrade around 250. I will not buy and install a new MB, if it gets to that I will buy a new system which is what I'm trying to avoid.

I play WOW, by the way. I run two accounts at once on the system I have a fairly decent grafix and have very little problem. My system is, in reality, just fine for what I am doing; I just want it to be better.

If all you play is WoW, then you don't need a GTX, you need more, faster RAM to be able to handle the two accounts open at the same time. If you really must build yourself a better system, then to my knowledge a GeForce 8800GT should be able to handle anything WoW can throw at you, at a fraction of the price. This would also allow you to look into upgrading your RAM and CPU by the way.

P.S. I don't understand why, ff you're willing to spend 1100 to upgrade your system, you don't add a couple of hundred and build yourself a new one. Its not THAT much more expensive and you'll have a decent rig to hold you for another year or two, depending on what you want to do with it... but that's just me.

sook
06-12-2009, 10:28 AM
you might need a bigger power supply, but what i would recommend is getting a new motherboard/CPU with a combo like this

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Category/category_tlc.asp?CatId=14&name=Motherboard-CPUs

scroll to which one you like, its not that expensive and get an 8800 off of ebay. What kind of games will you be playing? GTXs are pretty damn expensive unless you are going to be an insane game you won't need that.

sook
06-12-2009, 10:31 AM
The GTX280 gave one of my friends around 1500FPS on halo 2 with max settings. He was getting around 50 with his 8300 GS before that...so you can see that it is top of the line, actually the GX2 might be better but I wouldn't go throw your money at it just yet...

The 8800GT is the best buy by far. The 9800 is almost identical

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 10:34 AM
400w is plenty of power unless he was to go SLI which isnt possible on his board.

http://www.evga.com/products/moreInfo.asp?pn=01G-P3-1280-AR&family=GeForce%20GTX%20200%20Series%20Family




Performance
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif NVIDIA GTX 280
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 602 MHz GPU
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 240 Processing Cores
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 400 MHz RAMDAC
Memory
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 1024 MB, 512 bit DDR3
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 2214 MHz (effective)
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 141.69 GB/s Memory Bandwidth
Interface
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif PCI-E 2.0 16x
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif DVI-I, DVI-I, HDTV-7
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif SLI Capable (http://www.evga.com/articles/public.asp?AID=220)
Resolution & Refresh
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 240Hz Max Refresh Rate
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 2048x1536 Max Analog
http://www.evga.com/images/common/blt_subnav.gif 2560x1600 Max Digital

Requirements
Minimum of a 550 Watt power supply.
(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 40 Amps.)

sook
06-12-2009, 10:44 AM
The problem i have with gaming computers...and i used to be a huge fanatic is that technology gets outdatedd sooo fast. Next thing you know you dishing just as much as you spent last time, if not more just 5 months later.

Here was mine

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85610598649_630278649_1908780_6981631_n.jpg

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v4401/225/80/630278649/n630278649_1908660_3045297.jpg
http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs003.snc1/4401_85606028649_630278649_1908663_4647691_n.jpg
http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v4401/225/80/630278649/n630278649_1908665_47534.jpg
http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85606048649_630278649_1908666_233282_n.jpg
http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85610598649_630278649_1908780_6981631_n.jpg

I ended up selling this sucker to my cousin

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 11:42 AM
I didn't mean to say I was going to spend 1100, I was more saying I didn't see spending that much simply upgrading and trying to back it up with the cash numbers.

Do you think going from a 7600 to an 8800GT and adding 2G of RAM would enhance it enough, proportionally?

Obviously if I can get that for 100-130 and the 2G for 77 (to make 3G total) that might be the best and most frugal option.

It'd be even better if I could get a free Quatro razor thrown in.

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 11:51 AM
I didn't mean to say I was going to spend 1100, I was more saying I didn't see spending that much simply upgrading and trying to back it up with the cash numbers.

Do you think going from a 7600 to an 8800GT and adding 2G of RAM would enhance it enough, proportionally?

Obviously if I can get that for 100-130 and the 2G for 77 (to make 3G total) that might be the best and most frugal option.

It'd be even better if I could get a free Quatro razor thrown in.

It all depends, is WoW all you play? if so then yes, a 8800GT and two more gigs of DDR ram should be more than enough. It is by no means a "hardcore gamer" rig though, not by a long shot, but it should hold you over for a while.

You want to see a hardcore gaming rig, check out this thread.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=122832

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 11:57 AM
Right now I play WoW and Spore. I don't get into 1P shooters. I also like to play stuff like Civ4, AOE3, you know civ builders. That takes zero work to do. Therefore WoW is the most intense thing I will have, most likley.

I see that 9800GT is actually cheaper online than 8800GT but looks like it performs better; is there something to that?

leemajors
06-12-2009, 11:59 AM
8800GT is a nice card, still. I have one, and 6GB RAM and can run any Orange Box stuff pretty damn smooth. 9800GT isn't much of an improvement over the 8800GT.

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 12:05 PM
8800GT is a nice card, still. I have one, and 6GB RAM and can run any Orange Box stuff pretty damn smooth. 9800GT isn't much of an improvement over the 8800GT.

Which I see as well, which is why I'm wondering why a 9800GTX+ is the same price or cheaper than a 8800GT. Seems to me the way to go is the slightly better card that is cheaper.

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 12:07 PM
Which I see as well, which is why I'm wondering why a 9800GTX+ is the same price or cheaper than a 8800GT. Seems to me the way to go is the slightly better card that is cheaper.

Where exactly are you finding an 9800GTX cheaper than an 8800GT?

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 12:12 PM
Newegg has 8800GT for 114.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814145149R

They list the 9800GTX+ for 114.99 after 15.00 rebate and this includes a copy of Call of Duty: World at War
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130339

MaNuMaNiAc
06-12-2009, 12:17 PM
Newegg has 8800GT for 114.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814145149R

They list the 9800GTX+ for 114.99 after 15.00 rebate and this includes a copy of Call of Duty: World at War
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130339

Actually... that's not half bad. I'd go with the 9800GTX. Plus, I'm not really acquainted with CHAINTECH. EVGA on the other hand makes quality products IMO.

TDMVPDPOY
06-12-2009, 01:01 PM
with that amount of money go buy a ps3 or someshit....

Cry Havoc
06-12-2009, 01:10 PM
DON'T BUY THE 9800!!!!

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=XFX-487G1B&src=DC

That is a fucking STEAL for a top of the line video card.

sook
06-12-2009, 01:42 PM
DON'T BUY THE 9800!!!!

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?name=XFX-487G1B&src=DC

That is a fucking STEAL for a top of the line video card.

Shit! I totally forgot about ATI.

Yes, the 4870 is a lot better. The x2 might be better than the GTX actually

Cry Havoc
06-12-2009, 01:47 PM
Shit! I totally forgot about ATI.

Yes, the 4870 is a lot better. The x2 might be better than the GTX actually

The 4890 is $170 after rebate from newegg. That just might be the best deal in the history of videocards. 1 4890 will run Crysis on max detail.

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 02:07 PM
I've heard that there is some sort of inherent screen blip problem with the high end ATI cards; is that still true?

baseline bum
06-12-2009, 02:39 PM
I'm not into PC gaming much anymore so I can't recommend a card, but ABSOLUTELY buy your stuff from newegg. They're by far the best online retailer I have ever bought from. I have gotten way too much dead hardware that had to be RMA'd from sellers I found on pricewatch (sellers who had great resellerratings online), whereas newegg has been fast and the one and only time I did have a problem, it took me maybe a 2 minute call to get my refund. Their prices are great too, no sales tax outside of Cali, and they offer free shipping on tons of items.

The Final Countdown
06-12-2009, 03:24 PM
why are your RAM slots empty?

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85606048649_630278649_1908666_233282_n.jpg

Cry Havoc
06-12-2009, 03:33 PM
why are your RAM slots empty?

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85606048649_630278649_1908666_233282_n.jpg

Looks like it's still being assembled. That case seems very low-priority on protecting it's components.

The Final Countdown
06-12-2009, 03:37 PM
Looks like it's still being assembled. That case seems very low-priority on protecting it's components.


Why put the board in with the RAM slots empty? Look at the GTX-250 it's on top wouldn't that make the RAM slots hard to access.

Maybe I am looking at another picture?

sook
06-12-2009, 04:11 PM
why are your RAM slots empty?

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85606048649_630278649_1908666_233282_n.jpg
I hadn't put them in yet, its not directly on top of it, the picture makes it look that way

sook
06-12-2009, 04:15 PM
http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85610598649_630278649_1908780_6981631_n.jpg

Look at it from this angle, you'll see there's nothing on top of the ram

ChumpDumper
06-12-2009, 04:44 PM
For some reason I always envision a Mountain Dew falling into that "case."

ChumpDumper
06-12-2009, 04:51 PM
The problem i have with gaming computers...and i used to be a huge fanatic is that technology gets outdatedd sooo fast. Next thing you know you dishing just as much as you spent last time, if not more just 5 months later.Amen. When I actually feel like gaming, consoles are just as much fun and less of an ass pain.

I just build power saving HTPC-types these days. The capability of low-wattage CPUs and all-in-one motherboards is impressive these days.

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 04:56 PM
So is the general consensus to get the 4870 and another 2GB of RAM?

The Final Countdown
06-12-2009, 05:01 PM
http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs043.snc1/4401_85610598649_630278649_1908780_6981631_n.jpg

Look at it from this angle, you'll see there's nothing on top of the ram



:tu I see it now! hey I have some questions. having that open case and on the floor do you get lots of lint/dust?

Cry Havoc
06-12-2009, 05:40 PM
So is the general consensus to get the 4870 and another 2GB of RAM?

That's a pretty solid deal. :) I suggest newegg.com for the RAM as well, they can get you some pretty awesome deals. I got my last 2 GB for $34, if memory serves.

MajorMike
06-12-2009, 05:50 PM
Here's a thought... what do you think about getting a Killer NIC and trying that first to see what it does? I have the stock NIC that came with the HP system.

TDMVPDPOY
06-12-2009, 09:38 PM
dont listen to these tools

tell me what motherboard is it using, see if its compatible with AMD AM3 cpus, the new ones currently on the market cause they are backward compatible with am2 socket boards

sook
06-12-2009, 10:04 PM
:tu I see it now! hey I have some questions. having that open case and on the floor do you get lots of lint/dust?

I think that is entirely dependent on how clean your room is and where you put it, i consider my room to be ok and i never had any problems.

Cry Havoc
06-12-2009, 10:29 PM
dont listen to these tools

tell me what motherboard is it using, see if its compatible with AMD AM3 cpus, the new ones currently on the market cause they are backward compatible with am2 socket boards

Wtf, he's got a dual core 2.2 ghz processor. His bottleneck is his GPU and RAM.

step up to the mike
06-13-2009, 02:33 AM
I think that is entirely dependent on how clean your room is and where you put it, i consider my room to be ok and i never had any problems.

I couldn't use your pc I have rats, the top of your pc reminds me of the delorean on back to future.

ChumpDumper
06-13-2009, 02:42 AM
It reminds me of the Encounter restaurant at LAX.

http://en.structurae.de/files/photos/1480/img_3203.jpg

Cry Havoc
06-13-2009, 03:15 AM
It reminds me of ChumpDumpers face.

ChumpDumper
06-13-2009, 03:22 AM
You've seen my face?

Cry Havoc
06-13-2009, 03:26 AM
You've seen my face?

I've seen your "O" face!

ChumpDumper
06-13-2009, 03:29 AM
No, that wasn't me.

step up to the mike
06-13-2009, 03:42 AM
It reminds me of the Encounter restaurant at LAX.

http://en.structurae.de/files/photos/1480/img_3203.jpg


:toast

MajorMike
06-13-2009, 09:36 AM
Wtf, he's got a dual core 2.2 ghz processor. His bottleneck is his GPU and RAM.

Ok, please help a techonologically inept person... GPU is graphics card?

BTW I found a Killer K1 for 45 bucks so I bought that. Gonna see how that goes.

sook
06-13-2009, 11:03 AM
It was named, "Sally".

Cry Havoc
06-13-2009, 11:42 AM
Ok, please help a techonologically inept person... GPU is graphics card?

BTW I found a Killer K1 for 45 bucks so I bought that. Gonna see how that goes.

Ugh. Your NIC will NOT affect your frame rates if you can't push the pixels! You wasted your money until you upgrade your other components. They're called "cheap fixes" for a reason. :nope

GPU = Graphical Processing Unit. Yes, your video/graphics card.

Basically you can think of your system like a series of... tubes. :lol

But seriously, wherever your bottleneck is, is where you need to upgrade. You could have a 10Ghz processor, but if your GPU is 5 years old, you will still be unable to play games at a high frame rate.

Your GPU is your main bottleneck. Your RAM is probably second. Make sure you have enough power to upgrade, and go for them.

sook
06-13-2009, 12:47 PM
Ugh. Your NIC will NOT affect your frame rates if you can't push the pixels! You wasted your money until you upgrade your other components. They're called "cheap fixes" for a reason. :nope

GPU = Graphical Processing Unit. Yes, your video/graphics card.

Basically you can think of your system like a series of... tubes. :lol

But seriously, wherever your bottleneck is, is where you need to upgrade. You could have a 10Ghz processor, but if your GPU is 5 years old, you will still be unable to play games at a high frame rate.

Your GPU is your main bottleneck. Your RAM is probably second. Make sure you have enough power to upgrade, and go for them.
Exactly, but I think the whole insane framerate notion is dumb. Its gets to a certain point where differentiating level of gameplay is not possible.Technically everything over 60 frames will will appear as smooth as anything, but as you play graphically intense games like Crysis it is nearly impossible to maintain a stable framerate, which is why you watch all the intense gamers try to set records for fps.


This is on high res / max settings with 9800GX2 QUAD SLI. Now that is just about the epitome of graphical power which I'm sure most people won't need.

QGqEp9irDuE

Cry Havoc
06-13-2009, 01:08 PM
Exactly, but I think the whole insane framerate notion is dumb. Its gets to a certain point where differentiating level of gameplay is not possible.Technically everything over 60 frames will will appear as smooth as anything, but as you play graphically intense games like Crysis it is nearly impossible to maintain a stable framerate, which is why you watch all the intense gamers try to set records for fps.


This is on high res / max settings with 9800GX2 QUAD SLI. Now that is just about the epitome of graphical power which I'm sure most people won't need.

QGqEp9irDuE

I don't think the OP is in that category though. From what it sounds like, he has a pretty old system and needs an upgrade to even achieve basic playable framerates.

I'm in agreement with you, per say, but keep in mind that even that quad SLI rig will probably not be able to play games at full detail/resolution in 2010. Systems get old, and high framerates are a way of assuring that your PC is future-proofed. If I can crank out high FPS on today's games with maximum detail, I know that I'm probably set for the next generation of titles as well.

MajorMike
06-14-2009, 02:46 PM
This is everything I bought. I chose newegg because of a combo of cheapest overall price in conjunction with shipping and good return policy.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16814150352
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16817139009
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820161161
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16819103228
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16835103050
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16835150007

I hope the PSU fits and the chip is compatable.

sook
06-14-2009, 03:12 PM
Bravo on your gfx card! Thats a beast but I really wish you would make the switch from AMD to intel.

The core 2 gen blows them away

Cry Havoc
06-14-2009, 05:36 PM
Bravo on your gfx card! Thats a beast but I really wish you would make the switch from AMD to intel.

The core 2 gen blows them away

Most of the differences are overstated, I think. I mean, faster is great, but an extra 2-3 seconds on many tasks isn't that big of a deal.

That said, I have an Intel Quad Core and love it.

MajorMike
06-14-2009, 08:05 PM
What about just buying a new system instead?

These both have a 9500 GT in them
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229095

MaNuMaNiAc
06-14-2009, 08:14 PM
What about just buying a new system instead?

These both have a 9500 GT in them
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229095

I'm confused... didn't you say you bought the equipment already?

for whatever its worth, ATI's 4870 is quite a few times the card that the 9500GT is.

I'll still insist that you're better off buying DDR2 RAM, but that would probably require you to buy a better MB, and that is perhaps a bit too expensive for what you were thinking. Either way, your previous setup (the one you bought from Newegg) is more than enough to run most games out there. It'll certainly run the shit out of WoW.

Cry Havoc
06-14-2009, 08:24 PM
What about just buying a new system instead?

These both have a 9500 GT in them
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229095

A 9500 GT will play CoD4 on minimum settings with some stuttering.

A 4870 will play CoD4 on maximum detail.

MajorMike
06-14-2009, 08:56 PM
I don't play CoD. I play WoW; that's pretty much it.

Cry Havoc
06-14-2009, 09:49 PM
I don't play CoD. I play WoW; that's pretty much it.

I'm not sure how well a 9500 GT would run WoW, but it would probably get you medium detail settings and framerate. A 4870 would run WoW completely maxed.

sabar
06-15-2009, 03:09 AM
A lot of bad information in here. Time for a little lesson. Gaming wise, your bottlenecks are

GPU>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CPU>>RAM>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>MOBO BUS>>others

An an example, I have a radeon hd 4870 with a single-core amd athlon 3700, 2gb of ddr2 ram and PCI express 1.0

I can keep a frame rate of over 30 on everything I play maxed. Most people would say my CPU is a bottle neck, but the fact is:

1. Very few programs run on multiple threads
2. CPU performance peaked several years ago

CPUs pushing deep instruction pipelines and utilizing the latest in ILP reached a plateu when the pentium 4 debacle occured. Instruction count becnhmarks were increasing much slower than things like GPU processing power. Fact is, there were no more breakthroughs and deep pipelines had many problems. Enter multiple cores. A solution with a new problem in that taking advantage of it is difficult. Multi-threading applications is considerably more painful to program than single-threads. Consequence: almost all programs can't take advantage.

For those wondering, my rig had this upgrade:

2005 mobo, 2005 CPU, 2005 GPU, 2005 RAM: 15-22 FPS on games released from 2007-2009

2005 mobo, 2005 CPU, late 2008 GPU, 2005 RAM: 30-120 FPS on games released from 2007-2009

There are bottlenecks, but you really need to know how a computer works architectually on a hardware level to know how much of an upgrade does what.

Other tiny improvements as far as gaming is concerned:

RAM - newer ram is faster, but not on any significant scale
MOBO BUS - PCI express 2.0 can push more data, but nothing uses that much bandwidth in the first place
HDD BUS - has significant speed ups on newer drives, but few games load large amounts of data from the disk in the first place
HDD read/write speed - same as above
IPS - games have trouble with matrix operations, which are performed on the GPU in parallel, not in sequential normal instructions
ethernet MB/S - unless you are on dial-up, you have enough network bandwidth for any game

The fact is simple, games need to perform complex operations on 3d and 2d data. These takes enourmous amounts of time on a CPU. Almost every issue with frame rate is related to the GPU not being able to calculate how an object should look fast enough. Very few CPU bottlenecks exist. The largest one right now is probably calculating complex physics, but most games use havok and have no problem with these simple calculations, even on 2002-2004 CPUs.

The more you know!

MajorMike
06-15-2009, 09:48 AM
So... what are you saying, exactly?

Cry Havoc
06-15-2009, 11:51 AM
A lot of bad information in here.

I hope you're not talking about me. :lol


Time for a little lesson. Gaming wise, your bottlenecks are

GPU>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>CPU>>RAM>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>MOBO BUS>>others

No, it's GPU>>>>>>>>>RAM. His system is new enough that I doubt he's going to have bottlenecks beyond that, especially for WoW. You don't need more than a 2.2 Ghz dual core to run WoW. For Crysis, yes, his CPU might come into play, but he said he only wants to run WoW.


An an example, I have a radeon hd 4870 with a single-core amd athlon 3700, 2gb of ddr2 ram and PCI express 1.0

I can keep a frame rate of over 30 on everything I play maxed. Most people would say my CPU is a bottle neck, but the fact is:

1. Very few programs run on multiple threads
2. CPU performance peaked several years ago

But games that ARE optimized for multi-core support will affect your frame rates. And 30 fps is NOT smooth. You want 60 fps to have a completely smooth gaming experience. I have the same GPU as you do, and a 2.4 Ghz Quad Core + 4 GB of RAM, and I rarely see my frame rates dip under 50.


CPUs pushing deep instruction pipelines and utilizing the latest in ILP reached a plateu when the pentium 4 debacle occured. Instruction count becnhmarks were increasing much slower than things like GPU processing power. Fact is, there were no more breakthroughs and deep pipelines had many problems. Enter multiple cores. A solution with a new problem in that taking advantage of it is difficult. Multi-threading applications is considerably more painful to program than single-threads. Consequence: almost all programs can't take advantage.

Except the more programs that are developed, the more they are likely to utilize multi-core support, since nearly all computers made today have at least two CPUs.


For those wondering, my rig had this upgrade:

2005 mobo, 2005 CPU, 2005 GPU, 2005 RAM: 15-22 FPS on games released from 2007-2009

2005 mobo, 2005 CPU, late 2008 GPU, 2005 RAM: 30-120 FPS on games released from 2007-2009

I guarantee you that system will not run Crysis or GTA4 maxed at 30 fps. No offense, I'm just pointing out the inconsistency.


There are bottlenecks, but you really need to know how a computer works architectually on a hardware level to know how much of an upgrade does what.

You're basically telling the OP that he has no chance of knowing how to upgrade a computer. That's silly. I don't need to know a lot about cars to know that a bigger engine and a turbocharger will make it go faster. He's asking for simple advice, not a course on how FLOPS and pipelines function.

If he's choked on RAM, it will affect his frame rate a LOT more than his processor. He has a dual core 2.2 ghz. That's a fairly decent processor, especially for WoW. You need more RAM to store all the textures than you do processing power.