Hollinger: San Antonio is not a given to beat Dallas

[urunobili]

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/27361

Louis (San Antonio)


Even with Marion, Mavs can't touch the Spurs, right?
John Hollinger
(3:15 PM)


Um, you watched the playoffs this year, right? San Antonio obviously will be better adding Manu, Jefferson and McDyess to that crew, but I don't think it's a given that they beat out Dallas.

[urunobili]

Josh (Knoxville, TN)


Marcus Haislip - what's his potential ceiling for the Spurs?
John Hollinger
(3:22 PM)


Ever watched "Being John Malkovich"?

[anjlbitz]

That must mean that the Spurs will beat the Mavs

John Hollinger.. jinxing teams since 1996

[benefactor]

Hollinger is still butt hurt over that "Spurs won't make the playoffs" prediction in last years preseason.

[scottspurs]

Me: Hollinger is not a given to be a decent Sportswriter.

[rayray2k8]

It's true.
But who knows if the spurs will actually run into Dallas in the playoffs next season.
I guarantee this though, both teams want that series to happen again.

[urunobili]

Tim Duncan (San Antonio)

With so many teams making big moves, can I really win a championship next year? Assume Manu is totally healthy.
John Hollinger

The problem isn't Manu's health, it's Duncan's. We just don't know how much the knees are going to hinder him next season, and that's the biggest variable for the Spurs going forward. Based on their spending this summer, seems to me they think they have one year, two max, before they have to start over.

[bigdog]

Hollinger is an idiot.

[ninjaskrzypek]

Josh (Knoxville, TN)


Marcus Haislip - what's his potential ceiling for the Spurs?
John Hollinger
(3:22 PM)


Ever watched "Being John Malkovich"?

???

[scottspurs]

Tim Duncan (San Antonio)

With so many teams making big moves, can I really win a championship next year? Assume Manu is totally healthy.
John Hollinger

The problem isn't Manu's health, it's Duncan's. We just don't know how much the knees are going to hinder him next season, and that's the biggest variable for the Spurs going forward. Based on their spending this summer, seems to me they think they have one year, two max, before they have to start over.

Duncan is a great player even with bad knees.

[urunobili]

John Carr (Charleston, SC)

How do you think Antonio McDyess and Richard Jefferson will fit on the court with TD, TP, and Manu? Seems like a solid veteran 5 to have on the court during crunch time...
John Hollinger

Outstanding starting five, I agree, and the pieces fit together pretty well since McDyess can shoot and Jefferson has become fairly proficient at that corner 3. And having Mason and Bonner off the bench as snipers is a nice luxury too. But that's another old team trying to hold it together, much like Dallas.

[hater]

Lakers not a given to beat Spurs

Celtics not a given to beat Spurs

Cavs not a given to beat Spurs

and vice versa, etc, etc. Pointless

[bigdog]

old team? Christ, this guy is completely stupid. The Spurs could possibly have 6 or 7 guys on the roster with less than 3 years of experience. this guy is pathetic.

[Libri]

Hollinger is still butt hurt over that "Spurs won't make the playoffs" prediction in last years preseason.

[boutons_deux]

fuck this asshole Hollinger

[Dingle Barry]

lol "Old Spurs"

Another sportswriter taking a shortcut to thinking

[SenorSpur]

No one should be surprised at Hollinger's retarded take on the Spurs. The fact is that it's tough for him to view the entire NBA landscape, with his head so firmly up his ass.

[I. Hustle]

Hollinger is not a given to give quality opinions.


Hollinger IS a given to beat his meat

[2Cleva]

old team? Christ, this guy is completely stupid. The Spurs could possibly have 6 or 7 guys on the roster with less than 3 years of experience. this guy is pathetic.

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

[Solid D]

John Carr (Charleston, SC)

How do you think Antonio McDyess and Richard Jefferson will fit on the court with TD, TP, and Manu? Seems like a solid veteran 5 to have on the court during crunch time...
John Hollinger

Outstanding starting five, I agree, and the pieces fit together pretty well since McDyess can shoot and Jefferson has become fairly proficient at that corner 3. And having Mason and Bonner off the bench as snipers is a nice luxury too. But that's another old team trying to hold it together, much like Dallas.

John Mark Carr?

[flox]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

Beat me to the punch. Good post.

[kbrury]

John Mark Carr?

I guess the Spurs have too many young players?

[024]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.
bonner is not 33. and the spurs only have 20 something year olds left to sign. haislip, 28 is signed already.

[ChumpDumper]

lakerfan lies!

[vander]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

Bonner isn't 33 and Finley won't be playing much

[urunobili]

lakerfan lies!

:lmao

[it's me]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

Is he 33??? WTF

[2Cleva]

I stand corrected. Looked at the wrong column - he's 29

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 29
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is now an even 30 and that's now - not playoff time.

[Spursfan092120]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.
We were a lot older in '07

[crc21209]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

Being a Laker fan you dont know the rest of the team like we do. You dont know if Bonner or even Finley will still be here or on the active roster...AND being a Laker fan I see you didnt include the Spurs young guns in Mahinmi, Blair, McClinton, Gist, Haislip, and Hairston. 3, 4 hell even all of these guys may make the roster for all we know...so you cant really be averaging out the ages right now when you dont know who will make the final roster.

[ducks]

what is the average age of the lakers
33?

[galvatron3000]

how does Marion help the Mavs, let alone make them better. The biggest advantages the Mavs had were Devin Harris, Avery Johnson and a hurt Manu and Timmy.

[JamStone]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

You gave Matt Bonner an extra 4 years.

I guess his athleticism or lack thereof makes him play like a 33 year old?

[2Cleva]

By playoff time, Bonner will be 30, Duncan will be 34, and Dyess will be 35.

That's an OLD frontline - no matter how you cut it.

Haislip and Blair will try to get them through the regular season but considering their histories (one been out the league, the other doesn't have ACLs) but you're rolling the dice on some oldheads holding down the fort in the middle.

[z0sa]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 29
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

Fixed a little
Looks like a perfect mix of talent, experience, and youth to an objective eye.

[ChumpDumper]

Somehow Mason (28) is going to go from 30 mpg to zero lakerfan?

Is lies!

[2Cleva]

Being a Laker fan you dont know the rest of the team like we do. You dont know if Bonner or even Finley will still be here or on the active roster...AND being a Laker fan I see you didnt include the Spurs young guns in Mahinmi, Blair, McClinton, Gist, Haislip, and Hairston. 3, 4 hell even all of these guys may make the roster for all we know...so you cant really be averaging out the ages right now when you dont know who will make the final roster.

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.

I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late).

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.

[ChumpDumper]

I need to change my drawers.

[z0sa]

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.

And there's little, if any problem with that.

[crc21209]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.

I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late).

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.

Riiight. I'm sorry...you know SOOO much more than I do and talk to Pop every day. :rolleyes

[4down]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.
I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late).

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.


Richard Jefferson.

Doy.

In all Honesty this feels a lot like '03 - several risks bneing taken - new athletic 3 who can score, lakers fresh off a title and suddenly incinvible...

[ducks]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.

I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late).

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.

pop may go with vets after allstar break
but he will play the newbies right away and save the vets for playoffs

[ChumpDumper]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Bonner is 33.

[crc21209]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.

I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late).

Unless the Spurs make another trade - Pop is going with what he knows and those 9 are it.

I'll take our bench: Hill, Mason, Finley, Bonner, Blair, McClinton? Haislip? Hairston? and any other young gun who makes the roster > Vujacic, Farmar, Walton, Mbenga, Powell ANY day.

[coyotes_geek]

how does Marion help the Mavs, let alone make them better. The biggest advantages the Mavs had were Devin Harris, Avery Johnson and a hurt Manu and Timmy.

Marion certainly makes the mavs more talented, but I'm curious how all that is going to fit together. To me it looks like Cuban is playing fantasy basketball again. But who knows, Carlyle is a good coach maybe he'll find a way to make it work.

[urunobili]

Hey Guys did I introduce you to one of my new bitches after Ariza left LAX?

Just in case, meet 2Cleva one of my new ho's...



I see a bunch of young guys who've done nothing in the league and considering the traditionalist of the Spurs, would have to play at damn near All-Star level to get meaningful minutes in the clutch. Ya'll was almost eliminated before Pop rolled the dice with Hill (way too late)

[galvatron3000]

Look for the Spurs to make one more move to bring in a vet Big, then let's see what everyone thinks.

[2Cleva]

what is the average age of the lakers
33?

For the top of the rotation

Fisher 34
Bryant 30
Artest 29
Gasol 29
Bynum 21

Odom 29
Walton 29
Farmar 22
Brown 23

Avg age 27.3 as of now.

They do have a core who will be 30+ come playoff time as well, so the facts don't support the "old Spurs", "young Lakers" argument.

Perception makes the difference because the Spurs have been consistently injury hobbled the last few years, specifically the foundations of the teams (Kobe/Duncan).

Everyone knows Kobe will be ready to go 100% come playoff time. No one would bet the same for Duncan.

[SuperDave]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.


Convenient decision to use Finley in the top 9 instead of Blair or Mahinmi. Blair and/or Mahinmi, and maybe even Haislip or Hairston, will likely log more minutes than Fin this season.

Substituting Blair for Fin, the Spurs average age is 28.7. Substituting Ian instead, their average is 28.9.

With the recent roster changes, the Spurs collective age is no longer concerning in and of itself, it's only the recent injury history of Duncan and Ginobili that is troublesome.

[2Cleva]

ChumpDumper - You don't see Mason? Get your glasses fixed. I admitted my mistake on Bonner, due catch up.

ducks - agreed on the rotations by Pop. SA's problems isn't due to wear and tear in the season, its the cumulative wear and tear over the years for Duncan.

crc21209 - you listed all of SA's bench but missed the key part of LA's. Assuming LO is back, that's checkmate.

SuperDave - can't put a rookie in the rotation off the bat considering the Spurs history. Can't take Finley out for the same reasons.

[ChumpDumper]

Everyone knows Kobe will be ready to go 100% come playoff time. No one would bet the same for Duncan.Nobody knows anything for anyone that far ahead.

If you really need to post all this to convince yourself, go ahead.

[urunobili]

matt (atl)

John:Please answer!!!!!How does a childress for Bowen sign and trade make any sense for the Hawks? Bowen's offense was never very good and considering he is about 100 years-old, he is barely more helpful than Bibby on defense.
John Hollinger

I left out the part about a protected first-round pick; that would be the Hawks' incentive to participate. Bowen's contract is only partially guaranteed and Hawks would waive him in this scenario.

[Marcus Bryant]

That's assuming the Spurs stick with Finley and Bonner, which is far from a given, and ignores the fact that the Spurs are already expecting Blair (20) to make the rotation.

[ducks]

the games kobe has played will start catching up with him
he has played alot
not saying this year but it is not a given he is always going to be healthy anymore

kg was pretty healthy tell this year

[ChumpDumper]

You don't see Mason? Get your glasses fixed.:lol

Sorry. I was focused too much on Finley.

I think we'll be fine.

[crc21209]

For the top of the rotation

Fisher 34
Bryant 30
Artest 29
Gasol 29
Bynum 21

Odom 29
Walton 29
Farmar 22
Brown 23

Avg age 27.3 as of now.

They do have a core who will be 30+ come playoff time as well, so the facts don't support the "old Spurs", "young Lakers" argument.

Perception makes the difference because the Spurs have been consistently injury hobbled the last few years, specifically the foundations of the teams (Kobe/Duncan).

Everyone knows Kobe will be ready to go 100% come playoff time. No one would bet the same for Duncan.


No one would bet the same for Duncan huh? How about your "savior" at Center? How do we know he's going to stay healthy? He may very just go down again...I'm just sayin...

[galvatron3000]

Marion certainly makes the mavs more talented, but I'm curious how all that is going to fit together. To me it looks like Cuban is playing fantasy basketball again. But who knows, Carlyle is a good coach maybe he'll find a way to make it work.

I don't see Marion fitting in a productive way.

Dampier
Norwitski
Marion
Howard
Kidd

Barea
Terry
Humphries
Ross

[Tully365]

When the Bulls won their last championship in 1998, Jordan and Harper were 34, Rodman was 36, and Pippen was 32.

When the '72 Lakers won the championship after winning 69 regular season games, they were led by a 35 year old Wilt Chamberlain and a 33 year old Jerry West.

These are two of the best teams ever assembled.

[urunobili]

This will make it's own thread...

Dave (MN)

Assuming we've never seen "Being John Malkovich," what do you really think of Haislip and how good he can be?
John Hollinger

Fifth big man at best. This year's Anthony Tolliver.

[2Cleva]

Nobody knows anything for anyone that far ahead.

If you really need to post all this to convince yourself, go ahead.

Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

The last time Duncan looked 100% come playoff time was 2007. That's also the last time he won a ring, last time he was at 20+ ppg. The minutes haven't changed much over the last 5 years, yet his rebounding rate is going down. What's even more alarming is his shotblocking - not getting at least 2 per game for the last two years after doing it his first 10.

[ChumpDumper]

Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.Exactly.

Arrogant lakerfans have gotten rather rude come-uppances in the past.

Take heed.

[kbrury]

This will make it's own thread...

Dave (MN)

Assuming we've never seen "Being John Malkovich," what do you really think of Haislip and how good he can be?
John Hollinger

Fifth big man at best. This year's Anthony Tolliver.

I bet you Hollinger was like "Wtf who is this Haislip guy, let me put him through a generator then make something up."

[2Cleva]

the games kobe has played will start catching up with him
he has played alot
not saying this year but it is not a given he is always going to be healthy anymore

kg was pretty healthy tell this year

Agreed, everyone has to pay that piper eventually.

That's part of the reason they got Artest - save Kobe from having to be THE defender in the 4th, also another guy who can create his own shot.

What SA needs to do is find another anchor for Tim, not a shooter from the 4. Dalembert, Chandler, or the like would have been a better fit than McDyess.

[urunobili]

I bet you Hollinger was like "Wtf who is this Haislip guy, let me put him through a generator then make something up."

he was asked about him twice... I think he may have failed in the past projecting him as a star... :lol from there the hate probably

[crc21209]

Those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

The last time Duncan looked 100% come playoff time was 2007. That's also the last time he won a ring, last time he was at 20+ ppg. The minutes haven't changed much over the last 5 years, yet his rebounding rate is going down. What's even more alarming is his shotblocking - not getting at least 2 per game for the last two years after doing it his first 10.

What makes you think Duncan HAS to avg 20 ppg for the Spurs to win a ship'. GTFO. We have enough fire power in Tony, Manu, Jefferson, Mason, Hill, Blair, etc. Timmy doesnt have to be 99' Timmy for this team to be successful anymore...times have changed.

[crc21209]

Agreed, everyone has to pay that piper eventually.

That's part of the reason they got Artest - save Kobe from having to be THE defender in the 4th, also another guy who can create his own shot.

What SA needs to do is find another anchor for Tim, not a shooter from the 4. Dalembert, Chandler, or the like would have been a better fit than McDyess.

Thing is...Dalembert and Chandler are both under contract and would've been harder to obtain. And I'll take McDyess over "All I can do is dunk off an alley-oop" Chandler who can't stay healthy for shit ANY day of the week.

[DBMethos]

Hollinger is such fail.

[ducks]

for this spurs team to be successfully tp will have to have around 20 points in a game
if he gets that many points he is playing agressive and then he will get his teamates open and get those assist

duncan does not have to get 20 a game anymore

[ChumpDumper]

:lol lakerfan is talking about injuries and then recommended Chandelier?

[ducks]

dice is more healthy then brytham

[SteelerNation]

the games kobe has played will start catching up with him
he has played alot
not saying this year but it is not a given he is always going to be healthy anymore

kg was pretty healthy tell this year

Kobe is the only guy in the league that is still running strong against the likes of Duncan, Garnett, McGrady...and whoever else. For all the players that came out then....Kobe is the one still running the strongest.

[JGrice02]

Dallas definitely got better by adding Marion. The Spurs were probably the better team last year when a healthy Manu was in the lineup -- but that is debatable.

Think of the offseason in another light. The Spurs will add Ginobili, Jefferson and McDyess to their rotation. Those are much better additions than Marion and Gortat. But the Spurs did not stop there. They also added Blair, Hailslip, and a host of other young talents whereas Dallas might be oldest team in the NBA next year.

Dallas will be better -- esp if they end up with Gortat. But they still lack a low-post presence on offense. And the Spurs will have a clear edge on paper. Assuming everyone from each team stays healthy, I think experts would pick the Spurs over the Mavs 8 times out of 10.

I think all the movement is great. I love to see good players migrate from the East to the West. It makes for an entertaining regular season...

[2Cleva]

Thing is...Dalembert and Chandler are both under contract and would've been harder to obtain. And I'll take McDyess over "All I can do is dunk off an alley-oop" Chandler who can't stay healthy for shit ANY day of the week.

Both Philly and NO will give those two away for last years at this point because both teams are paying the lux tax (Philly having Brand coming back).

If he plays come playoffs, its not the offense SA needs, its the D. Who is going to protect the basket against teams like LA, Denver, Dallas when Duncan is going to have to focus on just guarding his man?

[SteelerNation]

:lol lakerfan is talking about injuries and then recommended Chandelier?

How many injuries did we have last year? And how many did ya'll have...that made ya'll get spanked by the Mavs in the 1st round....the Mavs....lol.

[crc21209]

Both Philly and NO will give those two away for last years at this point because both teams are paying the lux tax (Philly having Brand coming back).

If he plays come playoffs, its not the offense SA needs, its the D. Who is going to protect the basket against teams like LA, Denver, Dallas when Duncan is going to have to focus on just guarding his man?

You worry about your team and Bynum who's made of glass...and we'll worry bout our team got it? :tu

[ChumpDumper]

How many injuries did we have last year? And how many did ya'll have...that made ya'll get spanked by the Mavs in the 1st round....the Mavs....lol.Why do lakerfans say "y'all" all the time?

Buncha hicks.

And why are they here telling themselves that the lakers are the bestest and no one could ever beat them?

We've heard this song before.

[CubanMustGo]

"SteelerNation" the brand new Laker fan posting here.

Frontrunner much, dude?

[SteelerNation]

Why do lakerfans say y'all all the time?

Buncha hicks.

And why are they here telling themselves that the lakers are the bestest and no one could ever beat them?

We've heard this song before.

Hicks? You faggot. I live in San Antonio and thats the way we talk in Texas...fuckin moron.

[urunobili]

Why is this thread filled with insecure Laker fans when this is about Dallas and San Antonio matching up?

fear much?

[ChumpDumper]

How many injuries did we have last year? And how many did ya'll have...that made ya'll get spanked by the Mavs in the 1st round....the Mavs....lol.Y'all didn't have Chandler, that's for sure.

[SteelerNation]

"SteelerNation" the brand new Laker fan posting here.

Frontrunner much, dude?

How about I beat your ass kid? I bet you run and hide when you see me.

[velik_m]

:lol lakerfan is talking about injuries and then recommended Chandelier?

Hey, he knows basketball!

[DBMethos]

How about I beat your ass kid? I bet you run and hide when you see me.

http://robotpirateninja.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/inet_tough_guy.jpg

[2Cleva]

I'm not trying to trash talk - just comparing rosters and talking about the game.

If not interested, scroll.

[ChumpDumper]

How about I beat your ass kid? I bet you run and hide when you see me.Lakerfan is also an internets tough guy.

[SteelerNation]

How do Spurs fans shrug of guys out side of Texas making fun of you? Stand up and be pround...or are you a bunch of women?

[skervy]

I found a picture of Hollinger

http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/6649/upandlocked.jpg

[SteelerNation]

Faggots one and all

[urunobili]

Why is this thread filled with insecure Laker fans when this is about Dallas and San Antonio matching up?

fear much?

[ChumpDumper]

I'm not trying to trash talk - just comparing rosters and talking about the game.

If not interested, scroll.I'm very interested in why you feel the need to do this on this board so often.

[SteelerNation]

Becareful though....

[ChumpDumper]

Faggots one and allSo the reason you are here is to find love.

Ok.

[2Cleva]

As for Chandler, he's one big man that gives LA fits when he plays. Sheed was the right fit for SA, when they didn't get him, going for someone of his style, albeit lesser, would have made more sense than getting a guy who doesn't help the D.

[CubanMustGo]

How about I beat your ass kid? I bet you run and hide when you see me.

Sounds like I struck pretty close to home, tough guy of the internets.

And I'm probably old enough to be your father, not that I'd want that curse.

[rjv]

hollinger is best when evaluating individual talent but not so much when it comes to teams and projections for the playoffs and titles. he seems at a loss when he can not place a quantitave value to something.

[timvp]

I love how Laker Fan disappeared for years when their team was getting curbstomped by D'Antoni or missing the playoffs but now they are back in full force. Greatness.

All hail Jerry West.

[2Cleva]

I'm very interested in why you feel the need to do this on this board so often.

Because I don't believe the knowledgable and secure Spurs fans mind.

[ChumpDumper]

Becareful though....or what?

[2Cleva]

I love how Laker Fan disappeared for years when their team was getting curbstomped by D'Antoni or missing the playoffs but now they are back in full force. Greatness.

All hail Jerry West.

You already know I've been here since the site opened.

[ChumpDumper]

Because I don't believe the knowledgable and secure Spurs fans mind.That's not a reason for you to be here.

[ElNono]

It's not hard to be Hollinger the prognosticator. Here's a sample:

- In December Hollinger will claim the Spurs are not going to make the playoffs.
- By March, when the Spurs are on pace to 55+ wins, Hollinger will claim Dallas is not going to make the playoffs.
- By April, when both San Antonio and Dallas make the playoffs, he's going to explain why it's so hard to get the numbers right.
- In early May, Hollinger is going to ride the Lakers bandwagon, picking them to win every series.
- In late May, after the Lakers are eliminated, Hollinger will explain that ultimately the signs were there all throughout the season that the Lakers wouldn't get it done.

Rinse and repeat.

[Marcus Bryant]

Has Kobe found the real rapist yet?

[velik_m]

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/9979/sthollingerboardgl9.jpg

[poeticism707]

old team? Christ, this guy is completely stupid. The Spurs could possibly have 6 or 7 guys on the roster with less than 3 years of experience. this guy is pathetic.

:rollin:rollin:rollin

I told you all it was coming!!!

Now that the Spurs are LEGIT Contenders again, EASILY YOUNGER THAN THE LAKERS, all of a sudden, they're old!!!

What, do the Lakers have the fountain of youth, or something?!?:lol

[dbestpro]

Marion with Dallas in a strange way may actually help the Spurs. Howard and Terry give us the most problems. Marion has never played well against the Spurs. When Marion is on the floor more than likely Howard or Terry will be on the pine.
Dallas beat the Spurs because we were very immobile. The off season has fixed that. Dallas lost to Denver because they too were immobile. I do not see how another 30 year old player (Marion), signing ancient Kidd to a mega contract, Humphries and Ross has fixed that with the probable loss of Bass. Also, Gortat will be no better than Dampier if he doesn't still end up in Orlando.
Two tumbs up from this Spurs fan.

[crc21209]

I love how Laker Fan disappeared for years when their team was getting curbstomped by D'Antoni or missing the playoffs but now they are back in full force. Greatness.

All hail Jerry West.

True. Laker fans like to talk trash about the Spurs first 1st round exit in a long ass time, but how about when the Lakers didnt even make the Playoffs PERIOD in 05', and were bounced in the 1st round in 06' AND 07' by the SUNS! :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[HarlemHeat37]

As I've been saying for years..

Laker fans are the most insecure fans in sports..I really don't know why, but they are..look at last year for instance..ALL of us admitted the Lakers were better than the Spurs, it was obvious, nobody ever said otherwise..Laker fans STILL made threads EVERY WEEK about how the Lakers are better than the Spurs, basically re-assuring themselves..

Go to a general NBA board like RealGM(the worst place for Kobe homers arguments, ugh)..Kobe will somehow be brought up in any random thread about other players..for no reason..

The insecurity even comes to play when they talk about their own players..from Kobe being anywhere near Jordan or even the best player post-Jordan, to Andrew "Wilt Chamberlain" Bynum..

It makes a little more sense when you realize that they actually cheer for an alleged rapist that shits on his teammates..and now they're hyping up a wife-beater that abuses animals..it speaks volumes on the character of these people, and how they're scumbags..

We Spurs fans have our differences with Mavs, Suns, Jazz, Blazers, Rockets, Nuggets fans, and whoever else..but if there's one thing almost every NBA fan base has in common, it's that we hate the Lakers and their fans..

[HarlemHeat37]

lZpWJtgvm5Q

[crc21209]

lZpWJtgvm5Q

"Andew Bynum you fuckin' kiddin' me? Ship his fuckin' ass out, we talkin' bout Jason Kidd here." :lol :lmao CLASSIC.

[draft87]

Josh (Knoxville, TN)


Marcus Haislip - what's his potential ceiling for the Spurs?
John Hollinger
(3:22 PM)


Ever watched "Being John Malkovich"?


???


I'm sure everyone's figured this out by now? I thought more people had seen the movie but....-
John Cusack gets a job at an office on the 7 1/2 floor(where the portal to "be" John Malkovich is). He has to stop the elevator shortly after passing the 7th floor and then pry the doors open. The 7 1/2fl obviously has a very low ceiling and everybody has to walk like a hunchback through the office. You know, kinda bending over the way Hollinger will be every time he looks at the standings(especially post All-Star break/Rodeo trip)
....he really needs to stick to #s and stop writing opinions. It's like being an extreme Christian and a scholarly scientist at the same time......

[HarlemHeat37]

That's just being a Laker..

Kobe allegedly rapes a girl and gets himself in trouble..but he doesn't go to prison or get any type of harsh punishment, because he's the best player on the most popular team in the NBA, and he's rich..no taking risks in messing up the Lakers franchise..

Kobe cries and asks for a trade..going on radio shows trashing the Lakers..making tapes about Bynum in parking lots..then at the deadline, they get Pau Gasol from the Grizzlies, who later spend most of the $ they get on acquiring Zach Randolph and potentially Allen Iverson LOL..

I just wonder how successful their franchise would be if they were located in Charlotte or something..

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Parker 27
Mason 28
Jefferson 29
Duncan 33
McDyess 34

Ginobili 31
Finley 36
Bonner 33
Hill 23

Avg age of Top 9 is 30.4 and that's now - not playoff time.

I love posts like this. Misrepresent one players age and then leave out the players on the roster that are inconvenient to your argument. Cherry picking 60% of a roster doesn't demonstrate very much.

Mahinmi, Gist and Hairston are 22. Blair is 20. Mahinmi and Blair especially have a chance to be major contributors.

[sandman]

Kobe is the only guy in the league that is still running strong against the likes of Duncan, Garnett, McGrady...and whoever else. For all the players that came out then....Kobe is the one still running the strongest.

???

Yes, TD was banged up this year and KG had a season ending injury.

Granted, TMac has missed 100+ games over the last 4 seasons.

But KG before last year had only missed 35 games in 13 seasons.

Duncan, outside of missing 13 and 16 games respectively in 03-04 and 04-05, has missed 24 total games in the other 10 years. He missed a total of 7 games this year, and several of those were DNP-CD for rest days.

Kobe has missed an entire season's worth of games during that same 12 years (84 games). Four different seasons he has missed 15+ games.

Duncan also has averaged between 19-22 ppg in all but 3 of his 12 years in the league, with the other three years between 23-25 ppg.

KG as well was a consistent 19-23 ppg scorer for his entire career before this last season.

Kobe saw his scoring average drop for the 4th consecutive year, down almost 10 ppg over that 4 year period, and had his worst scoring, assist and rebounding year (in a non-injury year) since 01-02. Between 2000-2006, his scoring average fluctuated greater than 5 ppg four different times.

I know that the argument is going to be that Kobe has had a better team the last two years and hasn't had to carry all of the burden, but the same argument can be said that TP has taken on some of the scoring for Duncan as well.

Not to mention that both TD and KG are three years older than Kobe. Let's wait and see what his numbers look like at 33. If you want to argue that he has been in the league as long as KG and TD, don't forget that he didn't start his first two years and averaged 20 minutes per game. His third season was the lockout season with only 50 games, so his first three years in the league was very consistent with the amount of minutes he would have put on his body in a college career. For the record, KG was starting and averaging 39 mpg during those same two seasons before the lockout.

Not saying that Kobe is chopped liver or even past his prime, but you can't argue durability or consistent production in his favor over Duncan or Garnett based just on this last season.

[Spursmania]

Hey Guys did I introduce you to one of my new bitches after Ariza left LAX?

Just in case, meet 2Cleva one of my new ho's...

:lmao

[rayray2k8]

What the fuck? How the hell did this thread turn from Spurs and Mavricks to the lakers???
Are laker fans THAT insecure?? :lol

Steelernation, you are nothing more than a goddamn bandwagoner.
I bet you bought a hat of the Pittsburgh Penguins just recently.
Pick a team and stick with it.
Mouse thinks you're a coat tailer and he use to be a spurs fan!

[Johnny RIngo]

Laker fan or not - I know basketball.

I know Pop played Finley last year no matter what - I see no reason for that to change.


To be fair, last year was some of the worst coaching I've ever seen from Pop(Mason playing PG, Bowen/Gooden riding the pine, Hill being sent to doghouse for the last half of the season, Finley getting 30 mpg)

[kobyz]

you have to give some props to Dallas, they had great off season and they one move away by using wisely of Dampier exprin contract to becoming contender.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Dallas always plays the Spurs tough. I'm sure Cuban considered the '09 playoffs a complete success since they beat us in round 1.

That being said, it's obvious Hollinger is falling on his old standby responses and isn't really paying attention to how this team is fundamentally changing this offseason.

[Kent_in_Atlanta]

Well if John Hollinger said it... it must be true.

[DPG21920]

The Mavs made nice moves as well. I do not see why everyone takes issue with this stance. The Spurs are not a lock to beat any of the top teams, but they improved their chances.

The Mavs are a terrible match up for the Spurs and they improved. So it is certainly not a given that the Spurs would beat the Mavs.

[CubanMustGo]

The Mavs made nice moves as well. I do not see why everyone takes issue with this stance. The Spurs are not a lock to beat any of the top teams, but they improved their chances.

The Mavs are a terrible match up for the Spurs and they improved. So it is certainly not a given that the Spurs would beat the Mavs.

+1

Credit where due. Mavs have had a very production offseason.

[phxspurfan]

Such a wet blanket this Hollinger is.

[mountainballer]

I knew it....
Hollinger is Kill_Bill_Pana's dad
(when younger they called him Holl_Boll_Mama)

[SonOfAGun]

The Mavs caught the Spurs when they were a wounded beat up animal. What's the big deal?

They are not scary like the Lakers. Not even close. They are a good team, but the fear is not there like it was around 06,07.

[benefactor]

How about I beat your ass kid? I bet you run and hide when you see me.
Where would you like to meet?

[MarHill]

I have to do some myth busting here.

Rogue, a Mavsfan, in the NBA Forum posted that the Spurs were a senile squad. Lakers fans and many others have posted the same thing!!

Myth Busters #1: Spurs are not a senile squad.

Blair: Age 20
Bonner: Age 29
Duncan: Age 33
Finley: Age 36
Ginobili: Age 31
Gist: Age 23 (when the season starts birthday in Oct)
Hairston: Age 22
Haislip: Age 28
Hill: Age 23
Jefferson: Age 29
Mahinmi: Age 22
Mason: Age 28 (when the season starts-birthday in Sept)
McClinton: Age 24
McDyess: Age 35 (when the season starts-birthday in Sept)
Parker: Age 27

11 of 15 players under the Age of 30

9 of those 11 players are 28 or younger

4 of 15 players are over 30

The Spurs are a senile squad.....hmmm!!

Never let the facts get in the way of a good story!! :lmao:lmao

:flag:

[wut]

ok next, anyone wanna do the research on avg age of the other "title contenders"? ..would be interesting; and then to email it to Hollinger. :lol

[MarHill]

Rogue, a Mavsfan, also posted in the same thread that the Mavs have dominated the Spurs and the Southwest Division.

Myth Buster #2: Mavs have not dominated the Spurs and the SW Division.

Playoff series: Spurs and Mavs have faced each other 4 times in the playoffs since 2000.

1) 2000-2001 Spurs won the series 4-1 (1st round)

2) 2002-2003 Spurs won the series 4-2 (WCF)

3) 2005-2006 Mavs won the series 4-3 (WC Semis)

4) 2008-2009 Mavs won the series 4-1 (1st Round)

Each team has won 2 series a piece!! Hmm.....


Division Titles: The Southwest Division started in the 2004-2005 season.

1) 2004-2005 (Spurs won the division 59-23 record)

2) 2005-2006 (Spurs won the division 63-19 record)

3) 2006-2007 (Mavs won the division 67-15 record)

4) 2007-2008 (Hornets won the division 56-26 record, Spurs had the same record but lost the tiebreaker)

5) 2008-2009 (Spurs won the division 54-28 record)


Spurs won the SW Division 3 of the 5 years and the 2 years they didn't win...they came in second place.

Mavs won the SW Division 1 of the 5 years and the 4 years they didnt win...they came in 2nd place twice, 3rd place once, and 4th place once.

But the Mavs have dominated the SW Division?:wow

Hmmm.....again, never let the facts get in the way of a good story.

BTW, I enjoy reading good stories and I'm a big reader of novels. But, I like my fiction to be fiction and facts to be facts!!! LOL!!

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[45 bank shot]

I think we have the upper hand against the Mavs.
However, we do need to be cautious about that because the mavs sometimes play exceptionally well against us

[MarHill]

I think we have the upper hand against the Mavs.
However, we do need to be cautious about that because the mavs sometimes play exceptionally well against us


45 bank shot,

I would agree that the Mavs have played well against the Spurs. No question about that!

But he said the Mavs have dominated the Spurs and the division.

And the facts don't show that.....Sorry!!!:lol

[45 bank shot]

45 bank shot,

I would agree that the Mavs have played well against the Spurs. No question about that!

But he said the Mavs have dominated the Spurs and the division.

And the facts don't show that.....Sorry!!!:lol

lol ye apparently Hollinger hates the spurs but he sometimes tries to cover it by giving limited props to us.
Afterall, the playoffs matchup record between us and the mavs is 2:2 in this decade

[will_spurs]

I think one can't analyze what the Spurs are doing with statistics, gotta watch the game and try to understand what's going on - that's probably why Hollinger hates the Spurs so much.

[SouthTexasRancher]

Hollinger was an Idiot.

Hollinger is an Idiot.

Hollinger will forever be known as an Idiot.

[poeticism707]

Hollinger was an Idiot.

Hollinger is an Idiot.

Hollinger will forever be known as an Idiot.
:chestbump

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Hollinger is interesting - the guy clearly knows the NBA inside out, understand the cap, gets the way teams trade and assemble their rosters, yet he is also clearly disposed to hating on some teams, and the Spurs are one of those teams. I wouldn't just right his analysis off though, because he's right more often than he's wrong.

I think a number of his comments about us were odd and made little sense, but he's spot on about one thing - Timmy's knees are our greatest concern. As I understand it, tendonosis is a degenerative condition, and for the last 3 months of last season he was playing at about 60%. It will be difficult for us to make the Finals, let alone win them, if that happens again.

For the coming season we really need to wrap Tim and Manu in cotton wool - play them 30 and 24 mins respectively until March, regular rest on b-2-bs, etc. It's time for Pop to adjust to the age of his most important players and tap the depth of this roster. I hope he plays it right.

[Spurtacus]

Hollinger is interesting - the guy clearly knows the NBA inside out, understand the cap, gets the way teams trade and assemble their rosters, yet he is also clearly disposed to hating on some teams, and the Spurs are one of those teams. I wouldn't just right his analysis off though, because he's right more often than he's wrong.

I think a number of his comments about us were odd and made little sense, but he's spot on about one thing - Timmy's knees are our greatest concern. As I understand it, tendonosis is a degenerative condition, and for the last 3 months of last season he was playing at about 60%. It will be difficult for us to make the Finals, let alone win them, if that happens again.

For the coming season we really need to wrap Tim and Manu in cotton wool - play them 30 and 24 mins respectively until March, regular rest on b-2-bs, etc. It's time for Pop to adjust to the age of his most important players and tap the depth of this roster. I hope he plays it right.

Great post.

I hope with Dice, Mahinmi, Blair we can limit Timmy's minutes to around 30 per game average for the season. Last season was his second lowest at 33.6. It has to come down more.

[WildcardManu]

I have to do some myth busting here.

Rogue, a Mavsfan, in the NBA Forum posted that the Spurs were a senile squad. Lakers fans and many others have posted the same thing!!

Myth Busters #1: Spurs are not a senile squad.

Blair: Age 20
Bonner: Age 29
Duncan: Age 33
Finley: Age 36
Ginobili: Age 31
Gist: Age 23 (when the season starts birthday in Oct)
Hairston: Age 22
Haislip: Age 28
Hill: Age 23
Jefferson: Age 29
Mahinmi: Age 22
Mason: Age 28 (when the season starts-birthday in Sept)
McClinton: Age 24
McDyess: Age 35 (when the season starts-birthday in Sept)
Parker: Age 27

11 of 15 players under the Age of 30

9 of those 11 players are 28 or younger

4 of 15 players are over 30

The Spurs are a senile squad.....hmmm!!

Never let the facts get in the way of a good story!! :lmao:lmao

:flag:

That just tells us one thing. The sheep still listen and say what BSPN says, or they stopped watching tv and don't want to face the fact that the spurs have shed a couple of years from their group.

[WildcardManu]

Hollinger was an Idiot.

Hollinger is an Idiot.

Hollinger will forever be known as an Idiot.

The village just called, they're looking for their idiot.

[sribb43]

Mavs/Spurs will be a dog fight once again. Both teams have made great moves. Injuries played a part in the playoffs last season for both teams..Manu was out and J-Ho was playing on eggshells with his ankles.

We all know how Mavs players step there game up 10x when they see a spurs uniform:toast

[urunobili]

Mavs/Spurs will be a dog fight once again. Both teams have made great moves. Injuries played a part in the playoffs last season for both teams..Manu was out and J-Ho was playing on eggshells with his ankles.

We all know how Mavs players step there game up 10x when they see a spurs uniform:toast

It's great they have that special fuel against us... doesn't seem to work to get you guys a ring though...

[Road House Captain]

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/27361

Louis (San Antonio)


Even with Marion, Mavs can't touch the Spurs, right?
John Hollinger
(3:15 PM)


Um, you watched the playoffs this year, right? San Antonio obviously will be better adding Manu, Jefferson and McDyess to that crew, but I don't think it's a given that they beat out Dallas.

Well he had to write something.............

[sribb43]

It's great they have that special fuel against us... doesn't seem to work to get you guys a ring though...

ya mentally were so strong against you guys...everyone else, well its a different story

[spurspokesman]

Hollinger is not a given to give quality opinions.


Hollinger IS a given to beat his meat
:lmao:lmao:lmao:wow:wow

[Extra Stout]

Hollinger is interesting - the guy clearly knows the NBA inside out, understand the cap, gets the way teams trade and assemble their rosters, yet he is also clearly disposed to hating on some teams, and the Spurs are one of those teams. I wouldn't just right his analysis off though, because he's right more often than he's wrong.
Hollinger does not understand the NBA inside-out. He understands anything that can be reduced to rules and numbers. So, he demonstrates expertise in the details of the salary cap. He devises formulas to try to quantify players and teams, with mixed results. His greatest fallacy is that he believes that by devising a formula for how good a player or team is, that his results are by definition dispassionate and objective. The fallacy is obvious, because his models are by definition subjective and unprovable. He also fails to adjust his models when the results defy common sense.


I think a number of his comments about us were odd and made little sense, but he's spot on about one thing - Timmy's knees are our greatest concern. As I understand it, tendonosis is a degenerative condition, and for the last 3 months of last season he was playing at about 60%. It will be difficult for us to make the Finals, let alone win them, if that happens again.That was my understanding for a while. It turns out it is incorrect. Tendonosis can be corrected with rest and therapy in 80% of cases. This therapy consists of low-intensity exercise of the tendon, and of deep massage to break up the disordered collagen, and to remind the body that the tendon is still injured so that the body kickstarts the healing process again with normal collagen. Only 20% of cases are chronic and degenerative.


For the coming season we really need to wrap Tim and Manu in cotton wool - play them 30 and 24 mins respectively until March, regular rest on b-2-bs, etc. It's time for Pop to adjust to the age of his most important players and tap the depth of this roster. I hope he plays it right.I think the minutes will be more like 32 and 28 respectively, and that those numbers won't change until the playoffs. Giving one or the other guy the night off on back-to-backs I expect to be a staple of the upcoming season.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Did all of you forget that Hollinger was the only person on the planet (that wasn't a Spurs fan (and even among them there were quite a few doubters, myself included)) that predicted the Spurs win the Championship in 2007 before the Mavs got knocked out?

Look I don't think he's necessarily right about the Spurs chances to be beat the Mavs, i give it at least a 65% chance, but I don't think he hates the Spurs. I just dont.

[weebo]

Did all of you forget that Hollinger was the only person on the planet (that wasn't a Spurs fan (and even among them there were quite a few doubters, myself included)) that predicted the Spurs win the Championship in 2007 before the Mavs got knocked out?

Look I don't think he's necessarily right about the Spurs chances to be beat the Mavs, i give it at least a 65% chance, but I don't think he hates the Spurs. I just dont.

I don't think Hollinger hates the Spurs either. I just think he really likes the Spurs a lot less than all the other teams in the league.:wow

[Amarelooms]

What's the big deal here...this is not something we didn't know...it's like saying the sun is hot. Mavs just matchup well with the Spurs. Even if the Spurs win...it would be a battle and they would be too worn out to advance much further.

[jack0fspeed]

The important thing here is that the rivalry is alive and kicking. The Spurs upgraded. The Mavs upgraded. You know the competition is going to be fierce when we play each other.

You have to love it no matter who you root for.

[Duncan2177]

John Carr (Charleston, SC)

How do you think Antonio McDyess and Richard Jefferson will fit on the court with TD, TP, and Manu? Seems like a solid veteran 5 to have on the court during crunch time...
John Hollinger

Outstanding starting five, I agree, and the pieces fit together pretty well since McDyess can shoot and Jefferson has become fairly proficient at that corner 3. And having Mason and Bonner off the bench as snipers is a nice luxury too. But that's another old team trying to hold it together, much like Dallas.

But that's another old team trying to hold it together, much like Dallas? BS Does this idiot know that the spurs got a steal in the draft this year? Hey Hollinger we just got younger adding Blair and Jefferson. Fuck you Hollinger :flipoff

[HarlemHeat37]

Hollinger doesn't hate anybody, his opinion is completely based on his calculations and formulas, so you're basically angry at his numbers..

I also don't take offense to this..Dallas has a great roster right now, the 3rd best in the West IMO..they also have a lot of confidence when they go up against us, since they've beaten us in the playoffs multiple times..they match up well..

[poeticism707]

What's the big deal here...this is not something we didn't know...it's like saying the sun is hot. Mavs just matchup well with the Spurs. Even if the Spurs win...it would be a battle and they would be too worn out to advance much further.
:whine

[DrHouse]

Hollinger put it best when he says, "just another old team trying to keep it together".

Truer words could not have been spoken about the status of the Spurs and Mavs. Neither are truly going to win a title with what they have, but it's not like they have any other choice but to try and compete until it's absolutely time to rebuild. It's sad to see the powerhouses fall, but that's the reality of the NBA.

Realistically the next championship is going to be won by LAL, CLE, or BOS.

[MarHill]

Hollinger put it best when he says, "just another old team trying to keep it together".

Truer words could not have been spoken about the status of the Spurs and Mavs. Neither are truly going to win a title with what they have, but it's not like they have any other choice but to try and compete until it's absolutely time to rebuild. It's sad to see the powerhouses fall, but that's the reality of the NBA.

Realistically the next championship is going to be won by LAL, CLE, or BOS.

You need to read my post on Page 5.

Myth Buster #1: Spurs are not a senile squad.

4 of 15 players are 30 or older

11 or 15 players are under 30 and 7 of those are 28 or younger.

Again....never let the facts get in the way of a good story.

[MarHill]

Hollinger put it best when he says, "just another old team trying to keep it together".

Truer words could not have been spoken about the status of the Spurs and Mavs. Neither are truly going to win a title with what they have, but it's not like they have any other choice but to try and compete until it's absolutely time to rebuild. It's sad to see the powerhouses fall, but that's the reality of the NBA.

Realistically the next championship is going to be won by LAL, CLE, or BOS.

And to say SA doesn't have a chance to win the title.....its terrible even by your standards, DrHouse.

They are a legit contender along with LA, Boston, and Cleveland.

[DrHouse]

No the Spurs do not have another chance to win a title.

And the reason is because Duncan and Ginobili are no longer in their primes.

You lost 4-1 to an absolutely god awful Mavericks team last season. You have no idea how far the Spurs have fallen in two short seasons.

[anakha]

No the Spurs do not have another chance to win a title.


100% sure? 'Bet your life' sure?

[poeticism707]

100% sure? 'Bet your life' sure?

He sees holes in other teams: but NONE in the Lakers.

[Sean Cagney]

No the Spurs do not have another chance to win a title.

And the reason is because Duncan and Ginobili are no longer in their primes.

You lost 4-1 to an absolutely god awful Mavericks team last season. You have no idea how far the Spurs have fallen in two short seasons.

4-1 with MANU OUT! The team upgraded with RJ too, add Dyess and Blair etc. and this team is ALOT better than last years!

If Manu is healthy and Tim near 90% come playoff time that team will be deadly, how dare you compare last years beat up team who lost to Dallas as indication the Spurs will not win another title.

Are you serious?:lol

[poeticism707]

4-1 with MANU OUT! The team upgraded with RJ too, add Dyess and Blair etc. and this team is ALOT better than last years!

If Manu is healthy and Tim near 90% come playoff time that team will be deadly, how dare you compare last years beat up team who lost to Dallas as indication the Spurs will not win another title.

Are you serious?:lol
:lol

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Hollinger does not understand the NBA inside-out. He understands anything that can be reduced to rules and numbers. So, he demonstrates expertise in the details of the salary cap. He devises formulas to try to quantify players and teams, with mixed results. His greatest fallacy is that he believes that by devising a formula for how good a player or team is, that his results are by definition dispassionate and objective. The fallacy is obvious, because his models are by definition subjective and unprovable. He also fails to adjust his models when the results defy common sense.

I don't disagree with that - yes, Hollinger is a statistician so he largely relies on statistics for his analysis - but I think he has more non-statistical insight than you give him credit for. Admittedly, he also makes some shocking calls, but so does every commentator on, it's a hazard of the trade.


That was my understanding for a while. It turns out it is incorrect. Tendonosis can be corrected with rest and therapy in 80% of cases. This therapy consists of low-intensity exercise of the tendon, and of deep massage to break up the disordered collagen, and to remind the body that the tendon is still injured so that the body kickstarts the healing process again with normal collagen. Only 20% of cases are chronic and degenerative.


Thanks for the info, good to hear. Let's hope Tim is one of the 80%.


I think the minutes will be more like 32 and 28 respectively, and that those numbers won't change until the playoffs. Giving one or the other guy the night off on back-to-backs I expect to be a staple of the upcoming season.

You're probably right, that's a more orthodox position, but I don't think it has to be that way. With so many youngsters to play, why not cut back on Tim and Manu by a few minutes a game for the first three months of the season, both to trial the youngsters and preserve the aging? In late-January/February you can then ratchet up their minutes to what you suggest. What is the downside of this?

[Spurm]

The spurms are going nowhere...plain and simple...
These mother fuckers are in denial!! hahaha

[Man In Black]

Dr. House: Purveyor of lies and slanted truths.

C'mon Doc. Let's talk weaknesses of these supposedly unbeatable Lakers. Ok, so you got 1 title with Bean as the leader. Everything came together and those teams that lost their stars or had them incapacitated in some form (basically every team you played in the playoffs) could not overcome their missteps and poof...a parade on Figueoroa. Like they say, the sun shines on a dog's ass every now and then.

Cut to today, I'm listening to LA Sportstalk and Kupchak describes the Odom negotiations as "tenuous" or not easy. If the LAL lost Odom, would you same that same shit drivel? I'd like to see you spin that.

Anyways, let's say you luck out and Lo-Dum gets off his 10 mill high horse and signs for 7 mill. I say you got a strong 5. Bryant, Gasol, Odom, Artest, Bynum. Currently constructed(Odom is not yet signed) The rest of the official roster is as follows:
Shannon Brown
Chinemelu Elonu
Jordan Farmar
Derek Fisher
DJ Mbenga
Adam Morrison
Josh Powell
Sasha Vujacic
Luke Walton
Sun Yue
Walton & Fisher basically amount to role players that are used for heavy minutes to either shoot(Fish) or pass(Walton).
Farmar on a reach gives you a speed option and Brown gives you a brawn option.
The rest of your team is basically scrubs that belong on the bench including the overpaid Vujabitch(Lakerfan terminology not mine). Some players once projected to amount to something in the NBA have not and truthfully, can you say that this is the year they will? NOPE.

It's almost as your team outlasted the competition as opposed to outright domination like you guys like to spew. Yeah, I wouldn't call it domination at all.

[Ghazi]

Hollinger is interesting - the guy clearly knows the NBA inside out, understand the cap, gets the way teams trade and assemble their rosters, yet he is also clearly disposed to hating on some teams, and the Spurs are one of those teams. I wouldn't just right his analysis off though, because he's right more often than he's wrong.

I think a number of his comments about us were odd and made little sense, but he's spot on about one thing - Timmy's knees are our greatest concern. As I understand it, tendonosis is a degenerative condition, and for the last 3 months of last season he was playing at about 60%. It will be difficult for us to make the Finals, let alone win them, if that happens again.

For the coming season we really need to wrap Tim and Manu in cotton wool - play them 30 and 24 mins respectively until March, regular rest on b-2-bs, etc. It's time for Pop to adjust to the age of his most important players and tap the depth of this roster. I hope he plays it right.


No he doesn't, he picked the Spurs in 2007 I believe. Or at least his formula did

[poeticism707]

No he doesn't, he picked the Spurs in 2007 I believe. Or at least his formula did
:wow

[barbacoataco]

There was a period where Ray Allen looked finished because of multiple similar ankle issues to Manu. But then he got it together for the 2008 season and has been super durable and very productive for the last 2 seasons. I think to count Ginobili out at his age with the type of injuries he had is ridiculous. He has a great chance to come back and be 90% Super-Manu which will be more than enough to put the Spurs in the hunt.

[poeticism707]

There was a period where Ray Allen looked finished because of multiple similar ankle issues to Manu. But then he got it together for the 2008 season and has been super durable and very productive for the last 2 seasons. I think to count Ginobili out at his age with the type of injuries he had is ridiculous. He has a great chance to come back and be 90% Super-Manu which will be more than enough to put the Spurs in the hunt.

Very true: hopefully that is the case.