The Spurs Aren't Done Making Moves This Summer - What Comes Next?

[naico]

http://www.poundingtherock.com/2009/7/23/958937/the-spurs-arent-done-making-moves

The Spurs Aren't Done Making Moves This Summer - What Comes Next?

Myspace2_tiny by rikiddo on Jul 23, 2009 3:14 AM CDT Comment 26 comments

With the Spurs' apparent signing of vet big man Theo Ratliff(big thanks to Stampler for the find), the time has come to wonder what else the Spurs' front office has up its sleeve. The reload is apparently not finished, which is exactly what some of us were hoping. There will be another trade this offseason for the Spurs, there's just no way around it now. An inane attempt to make sense of this, below the fold.

Ian_large_medium
Oh, Yawn, we hardly know ye. [photo from Ridiculous Upside]

Star-divide
The Frontcourt Logjam

Why do the Spurs have to make a trade? Because there are now 7 big men on the Spurs roster, and even though we don't yet have the details on what Ratliff is getting(likely the minimum), there's no way in hell the Spurs head into next season with all of these guys:

DeJuan Blair
Matt Bonner
Tim Duncan
Marcus Haislip (not a SF)
Ian Mahinmi
Antonio McDyess
Theo Ratliff

Before moving on, I do want to mention something about Ratliff himself. He's a true center, and even though he's old, he's been an excellent defender/shot blocker in his time. If he still has anything left in the tank, I actually like this move.
Something's Gotta Give

With that out of the way, which big man is on his way out? I've given it a bit of thought, and don't like the answer that seems to emerge. I think there are 4 guys who could possibly be involved in trade talks(possibly more than one of them could be involved in the trade, but let's keep it simple for now). Either way, the Spurs are probably going to act on those plans fairly soon. Anyway, I'll start with the guy I see as most likely to be traded - who might that be?

Mahinmi. Did anyone notice how the Spurs sat Blair for two games in the Summer League, but gave big minutes in every game to the guy who got injured during summer league play last year? That smelled fishy to me, but I didn't really understand why they would do that until now: the Spurs were showing Ian off. They've probably been contacted about Mahinmi by a number of teams who would love to have a young, athletic C with his upside. The Spurs may have given up on him after the last 2 seasons of injury, and started shopping him. Also, he's not what I would call a good post defender, since his thin lower body allows him to be pushed around quite a bit. I'd like to keep Ian, but knowing how Pop operates makes me very nervous about this whole thing.

Bonner would be the second most likely big to leave, and if I was the GM, he's the one I would be shopping. He has the biggest contract(read: largest potential trade return) of any Spurs big who isn't named Tim or Antonio, and there are some teams who could use a perimeter-shooting big on their roster. However, Pop has also fallen in love with having such a perimeter-shooting big in recent years. It's a totally unnecessary wrinkle in the offense, IMO, but I just don't see Pop agreeing to a Bonner trade, unless he thinks Haislip can fill the role(with more ath-uh-leticism to boot).

Haislip and Theo(sign-and trade?) could also be involved in a trade, but I think the Spurs actually see something in Haislip, and Ratliff fits the Spurs normal M.O.
Roster Situation

Now, there's also a second point to make about the current roster - the Spurs will have 15 players under contract with Ratliff on board:

Duncan
Jefferson
Parker
Ginobili
McDyess
Mason
Bonner
Finley
Hill
Mahinmi
Blair
Williams*
Hairston*
Haislip
Ratliff

* = unguaranteed

15 players is the max you can ever have on an NBA roster, and the Spurs always like to have one or two roster spots open. And we haven't even mentioned the other players the Spurs hold rights to. These guys could be treated as trade assets to sweeten the deal for a rebuilding team:

Nando De Colo
James Gist
Robertas Javtokas
Jack McClinton
Tiago Splitter(damn it Pop/RC, you better not)
What Do The Spurs Want/Need?

A point that has been brought up in several other threads is that the Spurs could use a perimeter defender. The Lakers have 2(Kobe, Artest), so it would be nice to have at least one guy who makes opposing wings/guards have serious trouble getting into a rhythm. Bruce Bowen, Raja Bell, and Shane Battier are all names that come to mind. Bowen would be my first choice, but I'm fairly certain we can't re-acquire him via trade, so he would have to come back as a free agent. I also like Bell, and think that a Michael Finley/Bonner or Roger Mason/Mahinmi package might get him out of Charlotte, but I'm not sure just how stupid MJ is in his current role. Battier is priced a bit higher, but Houston could be a willing trade partner, due to the Yao situation(not to mention that they owe us after we practically gift-wrapped their current starting PF for them).

A third PG would also be useful, but I can't think of who I would want to trade for right this moment.

The last possibilty I can think of is a very large man(7' or more) with an interior presence being brought in, which would mean trading multiple bigs. Once again, Ian and Bonner are the most likely to be traded.
The Two Inevitable Questions

Every time the Spurs make a transaction that causes speculation, these two questions come up. So, without further adieu:

Might Manu be traded?
There's always a chance, but it's nowehere near likely.

Is Splitter coming to SA this year?
No. Stop it already - he'll be here for 2010-11, if his rights aren't traded.

[mountainballer]

Anyway, I'll start with the guy I see as most likely to be traded - who might that be?

Mahinmi. Did anyone notice how the Spurs sat Blair for two games in the Summer League, but gave big minutes in every game to the guy who got injured during summer league play last year? That smelled fishy to me, but I didn't really understand why they would do that until now: the Spurs were showing Ian off.

I do see the logic in this estimation and I was also wondering why people automatically assumed that Bonner will be the odd man out. (if there are any moves at all). not that there isn't also a good chance that Bonner will be gone soon.
some people fell back to the totally overestimating of Ian because he survived summer league and in some games showed some decent things like running the floor or getting some boards. nice moments, yes and yes, he could turn into a NBA player. but did he really look like a player, who will play an important role in this teams future? I didn't see this and I still think his upside is the 9-10th man.
the arrive of Blair made this even more obvious. hell, this is a player, who looked like a legit NBA regular of the future. (and I'm not one of those, who think he will ever be an all-star).
looking at the current roster and payroll situation, I wouldn't be surprised if the Spurs traded Ian for a TE and a 2nd round pick. (btw. Ratliff is cheaper than Ian, considering the league pays part of his salary and also cheaper in lux tax. (I guess the overall difference would be about 400-500K).
what I don't think is, that there is any team out there with a big interest in trading for him anything more than a 2nd rounder because of his potential. teams also didn't exactly start a bidding war, when players like Patrick O'Bryant, Johan Petro, Ryan Hollins or Saer Sene were on the market in the last season.
btw. don't the Spurs have to pick up the 4th year option till Oktober 31st? this would mean they need to guarantee another 2 million $ before they have had the chance to ever use him for some significant action in a regular NBA game. (might be likely 4 million, considering the Spurs very likely will also be lux payers in 2010-11). till now they burned a late 1st round pick and slightly under 2 million $ for him. that's ok.
but are they really willing to invest another 6 million in the Mahinmi project? I doubt it.
summery: I believe Ian will be traded for a TE. maybe even his 2009-10 salary will be included.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

This is an interesting point, Mountainballer.

One of the 7 big men will most likely be gone before the season starts and I'm not really sure that'd be Bonner, because for all his weaknesses, he's the only one of these who can consistently hit the 3 and is a more proven asset than all but 2 of the 7, albeit with little if any upside.

The biggest question is how do the Spurs project Mahinmi's role on the team in the next 2 or 3 years, especially if we're able to bring Splitter over next summer. Will he be able to outperform Blair/Splitter or McDyess? Or will his upside be a 5th bigman on the team? I guess we'll find out by Oct. 31st.

[Rogue]

Spurs have already done a wonderful job this offseason, and the current squad looks even nicer than the Lakers on paper. I don't think any more move is to be executed, lest some scola-mode trades happens again.

[Darkwaters]

mountainballer,

Be careful. When I mentioned the possibility of moving Mahinmi and Finley for a quality player like Sefolosha I was flamed by a mass of ignorance. Suggesting that he might be gone for far less than even that could spell an angry mob! :lol

[rjv]

ian would not have much trade value. at most, you could get a 2nd rounder for him at this time.

[MoSpur]

Trade Ian for a tight end?

[2Cleva]

SA has one more move in them, no doubt. Ratliff was just a body.

I can see this one being a semi-splash. Bonner + Finley for Jeffries would be a nice move. Gets them a versatile frontcourt player who can defend.

[DrHouse]

Spurs appear to be going balls to the wall this offseason. They probably are sensing that this is the last chance for the team to get #5.

[Big P]

No need to trade Ian. Get rid of Bonner & Finley, I would even lose Mason before giving up on Ian.

[Agloco]

Well, as I see it, signing Theo means either Bonner or Ian are up on the chopping block. 6 bigs does not a roster make.

[spursfan1000]

Getting a extra point guard would be nice.

[Seventyniner]

Ian's salary isn't big enough for it to be worth just dumping him. His contract is so cheap for his potential that the Spurs should, at the very least, just let him play his contract out.

You can't get anything worth having for that small of a contract anyway.

[Spursfan092120]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131862

Jamaal Tinsley anyone?

[cd98]

Generally I think the Battier talk is fantasy. I mean, does Houston really want Finley and Bonner at the end of the day?

But an Ian trade intrigues me.

Given the Rockets are without Yao, and this year is most likely a wash for them (no McGrady, No Yao, and traded Artest), the Rockets could do worse than get a center prospect and a year to develop him. Plus they can get salary cap relief with one of our other expendable contracts.

And how bad do they need Battier given they already have Ariza. Why not trade him for a package that includes expiring contracts and a young, athletic center?

[urunobili]

Nocioni would be the dream case scenario...

[cd98]

No need to trade Ian. Get rid of Bonner & Finley, I would even lose Mason before giving up on Ian.

Ian isn't going to give you much in the limited minutes he will get this year. And if Tiago comes next year, then how useful will Ian really be? If I could get a top notch perimeter defender like Battier, I'd do it in a second. We've got enough big men to handle L.A., Boston, Cleveland, and Orlando.

[K-State Spur]

The reason Bonner is used instead of Ian is because of their respective values.

Bonner has more value to other teams than he does the Spurs because of his expiring contract.

Ian has more value to the Spurs than he does other teams because he represents youth along an aging front line.

If we trade Bonner, we can likely receive more value than his production would indicate. If we trade Ian, we will likely receive less value than his potential would indicate.

[lotr1trekkie]

Haislip's signing seems to lean to Mahimni as the main trading chip. The Spurs still don't have a starting #2 that I like. Miller or Bell would give us an awesome starting lineup. If the Spur's FO is sure Spitter is coming next year then Ian is expendable.

[mikeb2016]

mountainballer,

Be careful. When I mentioned the possibility of moving Mahinmi and Finley for a quality player like Sefolosha I was flamed by a mass of ignorance. Suggesting that he might be gone for far less than even that could spell an angry mob! :lol


I cannot speak for any of the others who disagreed with you, but the fact that you suggested he would be traded for so much is what really made your argument unplausible. Thabo Sefolosha for Finley and Mahinimi would ruin Presti's image as a guy who knows what he's doing, and would take RC about 15 seconds to have the paperwork drawn up.

But mountainballer's argument actually has merit, because it makes sense. There probably are a few GMs (Presti being one of them) that would consider throwing a 2nd round pick at a guy who has already shown flashes, and the money saved by dumping Ian for Theo is not inconsequential.

I still say, in my humble and very unimportant opinion, that you trade Finley and Bonner for someone that can actually make an impact, and that doing so may mean waiting until Jan/Feb to find the right deal, and that having those guys in the mean time as a safety net for Blair/Ian/Haislip's development and Manu's health is not a bad thing. Heck, maybe even Mahinimi develops some, and becomes the kicker that gets you a big name at the deadline...wishful thinking, I guess. But the point is that the FO may feel like Mahinimi is not the right guy for this club to make a championship run this year, and that dumping him to save money and get a 2nd rounder may be the way to go.

[rayray2k8]

So everybody still thinks the spurs are still looking to deal? If they somehow find a team to dump Bonner on them, I say that's a wrap.

[buttsR4rebounding]

If Mahimni can get you a Battier, SJax, etc. caliber player you do it. Especially if you think Splitter is on his way next year. Blair changed the Mahimni status significantly. While Ian doesn't get you good value because of his contract size as a kicker in a deal he can be the deciding factor. Teams trade for and draft potential all the time. So they can unload salary and maybe pick up a very athletic big. Depending on his development I could see Ian being a great fit in Golden State.

[Bruno]

Even if I don't think it and i don't wish it, Mahinmi could be traded for the reasons given by mountainballer.

Now the idea that Spurs were showcasing Mahinmi in SL, is just plain stupid. PtR's writers are damn weak when it comes to analyze Spurs. :td

[ChumpDumper]

If the Spurs were showing Ian off, I would think RC and Pop and Newman would have talked him up a lot more. As it was, they acted like they had just signed him the morning of their respective interviews.

Anything is possible though.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Trade Ian for a tight end?

:lol

[Marcus Bryant]

Perhaps the summer league performance of Blair and Mahinmi gave the Spurs enough confidence to sign a veteran bigman for situational spots instead of dealing for one to play heavy minutes....

[Big P]

Ian isn't going to give you much in the limited minutes he will get this year. And if Tiago comes next year, then how useful will Ian really be? If I could get a top notch perimeter defender like Battier, I'd do it in a second. We've got enough big men to handle L.A., Boston, Cleveland, and Orlando.

Limited minutes? You know this how? Theres lots of stuff to learn here, including that Ian will get his chance this year...he is not going to see limited minutes.

If Splitter comes over next year, Ian will be even more useful, dont just think about this year...what other big men are we goingt o have when TD retires? Bringing Splitter over & having Ian here to both learn under Duncan & we can have a nice foundation of Splitter at center & Ian at PF. 29 other teams would kill to have players like Ian & Tiago.

[easjer]

Perhaps the summer league performance of Blair and Mahinmi gave the Spurs enough confidence to sign a veteran bigman for situational spots instead of dealing for one to play heavy minutes....

:tu

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Barring any no brainers dropping out of the sky I think the Spurs are waiting a while until any deals get done. A few months of basketball can change a lot of things. A team that might be thinking playoffs right now could end up thinking "dump and tank" by January. Plus the Spurs don't lose much by waiting and figuring out exactly what they have on their hands. At this point Ian's trade value isn't great given that his biggest asset is athleticism and that is tempered by injury concerns. If he has a great season then the Spurs either have a serviceable young big, or they have a bunch of GM's calling to ask about him. Or he doesn't improve, in which case I imagine there will still be up tempo teams out there that could still find some appeal in him and believe that he'd do well in their system. Meanwhile, barring any massive economic turnaround, those expiring contracts will be just as attractive in a few months, if not more so.

Whatever guy the Spurs would trade for is likely to fall under the category of "proven vet" so I don't think they'll be getting anyone who will need a full season to really find their place with the team. It's tough to picture the Spurs in a holding pattern given what a whirlwind start this offseason got off to, but I think they are going to bide their time for now.

[cd98]

Limited minutes? You know this how? Theres lots of stuff to learn here, including that Ian will get his chance this year...he is not going to see limited minutes.

If Splitter comes over next year, Ian will be even more useful, dont just think about this year...what other big men are we goingt o have when TD retires? Bringing Splitter over & having Ian here to both learn under Duncan & we can have a nice foundation of Splitter at center & Ian at PF. 29 other teams would kill to have players like Ian & Tiago.

I know this because I know how Pop coaches. You know Tim is going to get 28-32 minutes a game. McDyess won't be far behind. I imagine Haslip will get the nod over Ian just based on experience and readiness. Probably the same with Bonner, 'cause Pop likes a three point shooting big guy. And if anyone is getting any extra minutes, it's Blair.

Ian needs lots of minutes to develop. He won't get that in S.A. We are in win now mode. If we can get a Battier type of defender, Spurs will make that trade in a second.

You are getting your hopes up if you think Ian is going to be a significant factor next season. He is raw. Very raw. He has some flashes of potential, but he's not reliable.

[Knoxxx]

The names that make sense for our roster are no doubt Battier/Raja Bell/S Jax. I think Jax is likely a pipe dream though, unless we essentially swap him our for Manu starting in 2010, because we can't otherwise carry his $8-$10 million contract with 3 years remaining. SJ makes $7.7 million in 2009, and we can carry that by swapping out the oft-mentioned Finley/Bonner + filler if necessary.

Battier's $7.3 million in 2010 could also cause cap issues for us, but at least that is partially offset by a reduction in TD salary that year and possibility of bringing in Splitter on the cheap.

Raja is doable and an expiring contract, but not sure what is in it for Charlotte. Would be a great way for us to offload a little salary though, since Raja is getting a little over $5 million and Finley + Bonner alone is more than that.

Yes, hard to see Ian staying around and even harder to see Bonner sticking, unless nobody will take his contract. I'm thinking a buyout may be in the offing for Bonner? I don't really regard him as one of the bigs though, more of a 3 since he plays outside and lacks much athletisicm or mean streak to bang on the inside. Problem is then he has to guard speedy 3s, not too great. OK I'll quit, starting to ramble here...

[Darkwaters]

The most intriguing idea in that initial post is the one involving moving multiple bigs. If we shipped out Bonner/Mahinmi together for another big then it could seriously modify the future of this team. It would really depend on what we're offered, but a young talent and an expiring contract would be tremendously worthwhile to a team trying to rebuild.

[NZ Spurs]

http://www.poundingtherock.com/2009/7/23/958937/the-spurs-arent-done-making-movesBowen would be my first choice, but I'm fairly certain we can't re-acquire him via trade

If you are going to write an article then do some freaking research.

[xtremesteven33]

Hoping for.....likely not gonna happen though.....

Parker/Hill
Bell/Ginobili
Jefferson/Bowen
Duncan/Blair
Mcdyess/Ratliff


Holy **** :wow

[benefactor]

Perhaps the summer league performance of Blair and Mahinmi gave the Spurs enough confidence to sign a veteran bigman for situational spots instead of dealing for one to play heavy minutes....
Agreed. I wanted a big like Foster but the FO seems to think that we can get by with the Blair/Mahimni tandem with Ratliff on the shelf just in case there are any issues with either of them. There is little doubt that both will struggle some, so in those times Ratliff will be there to pick up the pieces.

[buujness]

Hoping for.....likely not gonna happen though.....

Parker/Hill
Bell/Ginobili
Jefferson/Bowen
Duncan/Blair
Mcdyess/Ratliff


Holy **** :wow
If we are relying on Ratliff to be our main back-up C, then we are royally screwed. The guy's 36, and who knows if he has anything left?

I really don't like the idea of trading Mahinmi. He's a 22-year-old athletic C; those aren't a dime a dozen. He may not have a ton of minutes this year, but for the years after that, I can see him being a real force if he develops his technique on the defensive end a bit. Not to mention you could couple him with Splitter (assuming he comes over next year) and you could have a very good core to go after more championships after Timmy D retires, and who would ever think that would be possible in the immediate future?

[mudyez]

can someone explain why theos salary is partly paid by the league?

btw.: I like the mason+ian for raja bell trade a lot!

[jb4g]

Haislip's signing seems to lean to Mahimni as the main trading chip. The Spurs still don't have a starting #2 that I like. Miller or Bell would give us an awesome starting lineup. If the Spur's FO is sure Spitter is coming next year then Ian is expendable.

I agree, and I think there is a place in the lineup for Bonner in a limited role. Pops gotta have a shooting big, no way he can go cold turkey

[ChumpDumper]

can someone explain why theos salary is partly paid by the league?Because he's old, and the players' union didn't want teams being discouraged from signing older vets with higher minimum salaries to pay. I believe it's now basically the same as signing a five-year vet, but I'm not sure.

[mudyez]

Because he's old, and the players' union didn't want teams being discouraged from signing older vets with higher minimum salaries to pay. I believe it's now basically the same as signing a five-year vet, but I'm not sure.

uh...didnt know that!

[Bruno]

Because he's old, and the players' union didn't want teams being discouraged from signing older vets with higher minimum salaries to pay. I believe it's now basically the same as signing a five-year vet, but I'm not sure.

It's a two-year vet.

For Ratliff, Spurs will pay $800K and the league $500K for a total salary of $1.3M. He will also count only for $800K against the luxury tax.

[buujness]

I agree, and I think there is a place in the lineup for Bonner in a limited role. Pops gotta have a shooting big, no way he can go cold turkey
Heh, true.

[ChumpDumper]

It's a two-year vet.

For Ratliff, Spurs will pay $800K and the league $500K for a total salary of $1.3M. He will also count only for $800K against the luxury tax.Thanks for the clarification -- I don't bother looking things up anymore.

[StoneBuddha]

It's a two-year vet.

For Ratliff, Spurs will pay $800K and the league $500K for a total salary of $1.3M. He will also count only for $800K against the luxury tax.

Bruno,

Where does the $500K come from? Is it some escrow account funded by siphoned off luxury tax payments or something like that?

Thanks

[45 bank shot]

I say we ship Bonner's ass

[Bruno]

Bruno,

Where does the $500K come from? Is it some escrow account funded by siphoned off luxury tax payments or something like that?

Thanks

It doesn't come from luxury tax payments. The league has a fund to pay these $500K. This fund is alimented by a part of the NBA benefits.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

The Spurs are obviously planning another move. If there's a weakness in the roster right now I'd say it's at backup point. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Spurs trade for a veteran point guard. A second move might be trying for a guy like Raja Bell.

A trade for SJax would shock me...thoroghly.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't think it's obvious at all. There are currently five players who can supposedly play the point, so I don't know it the perceived weakness is all that glaring to Pop and the FO. I can easily see the Spurs rolling into the season with the 15 players now under contract and shuffling down the line if necessary.

[MaNu4Tres]

The Spurs are obviously planning another move. If there's a weakness in the roster right now I'd say it's at backup point. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Spurs trade for a veteran point guard. A second move might be trying for a guy like Raja Bell.

A trade for SJax would shock me...thoroghly.

Hill is the back up point guard.

They wouldn't be wise to use their trading pieces for a 4th string point guard ( Behind Parker/ Hill/ Manu), who would spend more time in a sport coat in anticipation of the Kiss me cam.

[MaNu4Tres]

The wise thing they would do is to wait it out til the trade deadline and add a defensive starting caliber wing that can hit the 3 offensively. Or maybe even add a Camby like player if the injury bug hits our frontcourt. (or if the production in new bigs sours Blair/ Mahimni/ Haislip/ Ratliff).

[Death In June]

The wise thing they would do is to wait it out til the trade deadline and add a defensive starting caliber wing that can hit the 3 offensively. Or maybe even add a Camby like player if the injury bug hits our frontcourt. (or if the production in new bigs sours Blair/ Mahimni/ Haislip/ Ratliff).The organization has been known to stand pat if things play out well. If we don't get anything in return for Bonner/Finely before the season starts, I doubt we will later.

[objective]

Mahinmi. Did anyone notice how the Spurs sat Blair for two games in the Summer League, but gave big minutes in every game to the guy who got injured during summer league play last year? That smelled fishy to me, but I didn't really understand why they would do that until now: the Spurs were showing Ian off.

Wait, what?

Mahinmi was not hurt during Summer League 2008. He got hurt in a big man camp.

Maybe the article writer smells something fishy because he's eating Fred's Fish Fry, because it's not coming from anything factual in the article.

[barbacoataco]

The easiest way for the Spurs to cut the roster to 14 is to cut either Williams or Hairston. Hairston is on a roll, but I think some still see Williams as the higher ceiling?

[Ocotillo]

Jeez, don't trade Ian to Houston. If by chance he develops into a nice NBA big and Houston has a frontline of Scola and Mahinmi, I would be out on a ledge.

[Biggems]

Trade Bonner to Milwaukee for Bowen.....once the grace period from Bowen's trade is up.

[mountainballer]

back to the topic. even if Ratliff doesn't play much, because either he is injured or neither from the group of Ian, Blair, Haislip and Bonner is injured, to carry 7 bigs doesn't make sense and can't be explained with kind of a waiting game. especially considering the only big that can be sent to d-league is Blair. (wow, what an irony if Blair played d-league.).
one will be traded, if not two. (who says the package can't be Bonner+Ian)
points why likely Bonner isn't the one: his trade value will be much higher at deadline, when some teams will desperately try to improve their position for the 2010 free agency. (the dealing at deadline will be even more frantic, because of the shrinking cap). Bonner is familiar with the team system, this will be a bonus considering he is the only big outside Tim with Spurs experience. (at deadline this could look different, McDyess will learn quick, let's see what Haislip can do). Bonners 3.2 million salary can bring back a decent player. (what Ian's contract can't). so, while I wouldn't rule out that Bonner could be traded this summer, if the right deal is on the table (like Bonner for Stevenson, or Bonner plus Finley for Foster), it does have much logic to keep him at least till deadline.
(or just let his contract expire, considering this might be the number that's needed for Splitter)

my guess for most likely trades:
Ian for a 2nd rounder and a TE.
Ian plus Finley for a defensive wing
Ian plus Mason for a defensive wing

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Mountainballer, do you think the Spurs would consider trading Bonner ( + filler ) for a Foster/Collison type and leave us with no big who can hit the three, and only McDyess with a good midrange J? Both of these players are better than Bonner on paper, but their skill sets would more or less cover Dice/Blair, so they wouldn't represent as much value to the team as Bonner, IMO, because his skillset is much different and gives Pop more options.

I don't think Bonner is on the trading block, unless we're bringing back another big with range or at least a player who can play minutes at the 4 and spread the floor for Duncan, like Nocioni.And,of course, unless there's a no brainer offer on the table.

[DAF86]

I would feel a lot more comfortable with Camby in the middle of the paint.

[timaios]

Mountainballer, do you think the Spurs would consider trading Bonner ( + filler ) for a Foster/Collison type and leave us with no big who can hit the three, and only McDyess with a good midrange J? Both of these players are better than Bonner on paper, but their skill sets would more or less cover Dice/Blair, so they wouldn't represent as much value to the team as Bonner, IMO, because his skillset is much different and gives Pop more options.

I don't think Bonner is on the trading block, unless we're bringing back another big with range or at least a player who can play minutes at the 4 and spread the floor for Duncan, like Nocioni.And,of course, unless there's a no brainer offer on the table.

Marcus Haislip

[mountainballer]

as timaios said.
Haislip is a PF, who can (hopefully) hit the three. and McDyess has range.
a trade for Collison doesn't make much sense, when you have McDyess and Blair on the team. a trade for Foster would make a lot of sense, considering Foster's size and mobility and his ability to defend out to the perimeter. Foster would be a great defender against players like Gasol and Dirk.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Marcus Haislip

Marcus Haislip has hit a total of 4 three pointers in his NBA career and last season in Europe has been a 35-37% from the euro 3 point line. I wouldn't consider him a reliable 3 point threat at all until proven otherwise.

[mountainballer]

Marcus Haislip has hit a total of 4 three pointers in his NBA career and last season in Europe has been a 35-37% from the euro 3 point line. I wouldn't consider him a reliable 3 point threat at all until proven otherwise.

true. but what is the sense of a 3 point shooting PF, if he constantly totally fails in the play offs? Matt is the opposite of Horry in this regard. (in many others either of course)
it just doesn't make any difference, if Matt is on the roster or not next April. and Spurs shouldn't be that much dependent on their 3pt shooting next year anyhow.

[Bruno]

Trading Mahinmi right now for crap makes very few sense.

Spurs have 7 bigmen but you have to look more closely at the situation. Spurs have 2 solid bigmen with McDyess and Duncan. Pop will likely be careful with Duncan's knees and McDyess is quite old. So both won't play heavy minutes.

The rest of the bigmen that will fight with Mahinmi are:
- DeJuan Blair: Very young (20 years old) and has no ACLs. It's possible that he isn't NBA ready or that he struggle staying healthy with a 100 games long season.
- Matt Bonner: Since the 3 point era, 904 players have played more than 100 minutes in the playoffs. Among these 904 players, only 15 have a worst playoff PER than Bonner.
- Marcus Haislip: Last time he played in NBA, it was quite a disaster. He has improved his game but it isn't sure at all that his new NBA try won't also be a disaster.
- Theo Ratliff: Old and had a lot of injuries. He could be done or had another injury.

That's a lot of question marks. The wise thing to do would be to let all these players fight for playing time during the training camp. Training camp will likely settle a hierarchy and it should be quite obvious who should be traded after it. Trading a 22 years old player, on a cheap contract and who could be Spurs best big from the bench next year for crap isn't a smart move.

[BronxCowboy]

The wise thing to do would be to let all these players fight for playing time during the training camp. Training camp will likely settle a hierarchy and it should be quite obvious who should be traded after it.

:tu Of course. I don't think the Spurs will make any more moves until after training camp. That will give them a much clearer picture not only what they have, both in terms of personnel and trade assets, but what they need, what other teams need, and who might be available. In other words, waiting until after training camp (or even partially through the season) allows them to make an intelligent move.

[silverblackfan]

I totally agree. I thought the team was in pretty good shape and leagues better than last year before they picked up Ratliff. Since there are essentially 3 rookies playing in our big man rotation and Pop favors veterans, Ratliff was probably just insurance.
Come mid season we might see a trade, but hopefully it will not involve Ian if he shines during the first part of the season.
Trading for SJak sounds like a fantasy, by the way. Not affordable or necessary.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Hill is the back up point guard.

Maybe. I'm not convinced yet.


They wouldn't be wise to use their trading pieces for a 4th string point guard ( Behind Parker/ Hill/ Manu), who would spend more time in a sport coat in anticipation of the Kiss me cam.

The Spurs are one bad landing from Parker away from having to depend on a second year two-guard, and their designated closer to handle the point duties.

If I'm "all in" like the Spurs are this year, and this is potentially our shot at title #5, I'm not trusting the season to George Hill to handle the quarterback duties should Parker go down.

They'll pick up a backup point...I'm sure of it. And with all the guys currently under contract, and the spending already way over the top, it will likely be through a trade.

[Interrohater]

Maybe. I'm not convinced yet.



The Spurs are one bad landing from Parker away from having to depend on a second year two-guard, and their designated closer to handle the point duties.

If I'm "all in" like the Spurs are this year, and this is potentially our shot at title #5, I'm not trusting the season to George Hill to handle the quarterback duties should Parker go down.

They'll pick up a backup point...I'm sure of it. And with all the guys currently under contract, and the spending already way over the top, it will likely be through a trade.

You can't have an all-star team on the floor AND on the bench. Every team is "one bad landing" from having a ruined season. Every team would also like to have a super-amazing-incredible backup just in case that happens. It doesn't work that way though. And who cares if you're not convinced yet? Is it you who has to be convinced? Who are you anyway?

[mudyez]

Maybe. I'm not convinced yet.



The Spurs are one bad landing from Parker away from having to depend on a second year two-guard, and their designated closer to handle the point duties.

If I'm "all in" like the Spurs are this year, and this is potentially our shot at title #5, I'm not trusting the season to George Hill to handle the quarterback duties should Parker go down.

They'll pick up a backup point...I'm sure of it. And with all the guys currently under contract, and the spending already way over the top, it will likely be through a trade.

If we are "all in" as you say, we also have to asume that the core players like Parker are staying healthy...if he goes down, than we dont stand a chance anyway and befor playing only with Hill and some SG's as our PG's, we could also pull a Orlando Magic and get another player in.

[mudyez]

lets take another look at our rotation:

best-5:

Parker
Manu
Jefferson
Dyess
Duncan

the young players:
Hill/McClinton
Williams/Hairston
Hairston
Blair
Mahinmi

the rest:
Mason
Finley
Bonner
Ratliff

lets take a closer look at this last group, coz the first group is set and the second would only be traded as a trade sweetener (dont see Hairston or Blair beeing that):

Ratliff:
don't see us signing him just to trade him away...he is just what the frontcourt needed: a shotblocking presense for spot minutes...really liked that signing and he should stay...imagine: seriess against dallas...Barea is going to the basket and the sun darkens coz of Timmy and Theo waiting for him :)

Bonner:
two words: unique skillset. there should be games where he doesnt play at all and there should be games where he fits perfectly as a player who does the spacing so well...I'm not his biggest fan, but unless we get another 4 who can hit long range shots, I'm all for keeping him...only thing that hurts is his contract which is to high for his actual production...but its not as bad as with other players on other teams

Finley+Mason:
kind of the same skillset even while Mason has some PG skills as well. and thats the problem. why have two players on the roster, that give the same to the team? ok, with shooters you still have to go with the player who hits shots and so on, but its not like we have invinite roster spots and players like Manu and Jefferson have that ability + other stuff too!



that said I think either Finley or Mason will be traded (IF someone is traded)..I'd think Mason is the odd man, coz he is worth more than Finley.

mybe we add Ian (coz why should a team trade for one of them alone?) and see what we can get and what fits.

...

needs and options:

a backup PG:
we dont need a backup PG, that we have to trade for...if we really need one, ask Jaque to play one more year! (actually I like that idea if we have room, but after all that means someone else would have to go to Austin which shoulnd be needed)

a defensive wing:
we are really lacking one...dont see us getting Battier, but Raja Bell might be an option, Thabo as well...not sure who fits that bill and is a spurs type player too.


WWJD?:

he would try to package either Mason or Finley with Ian and get Bell or Thabo...additionally bring back Bruce!

rotation:
Parker/Hill/ (McClinton)
Bell/Manu/ (Hairston) / (Williams)
Jefferson/Finley
Dyess/Blair/Haislip
Duncan/Ratliff/Bonner

[lotr1trekkie]

The FO is working overtime to relieve Tim of his burdens for the last 2 seasons. Dice, Blair, Haisplip and Rats. That leaves Ian or Matt. Matt does the one thing Ian does't---a proven 3 point shooter. I don't see any minutes for Ian here. Question? What teams need a Mahimni[who needs to play minutes this year]? A rebuiding team! #1 choice -the Rockets. Mahimni + whatever makes sense for us--Bonner or Findley or Mason, Haireston] for LUIS SCOLA. That trade has been a pin in our ass for 2 years. Houston is simply waiting for Yao in 2010. SCOLA coming off the bench for Tim would be awesome. LUIS should have always been a Spur! Rats one year deal indicates that Splitter will be coming next season. If The Rockets were desperate enough to offer Gortat the MLE then Ian[22] is a good risk for a 28-29 year old PF. My #2 choice is the Wizards Mike Miller. The Wizards have too, too, too many shooter/ scorers. Miller really doesn't fit because shooters need to shot a lot. If Air-Arenas is back then Miller will be looking at 6-8 attempts a game. His contract is big[less likely] but expiring. Hell of a starter with Manu relieving him.

[mudyez]

I know, I know...speaking of possible trades, that never have mentioned bei either FO is retarded (start the bashing!), but:...

thinking about the possibilities and the chances of trades happening one trade makes a lot of sense to me:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=l7zn6q

allredy mentioned it (kind of):

Thabo for Finley and Ian!

for OKC:

1) they should be interested in Ian...Mullins could be a nice project, but they could use someone like Ian as an even better prsopect...especially with Krstic beeing able to play PF for some minutes which would give them a nice big lineup

2) they should like Finley beeing the mentor to Harden and Durant

3) they are not there yet...teams like Cleveland, Boston or the Mavs wont trade with us, but they shouldnt have problems

4) Sam Pestri

for us:

1) we get that defensive wing without loosing much

2) "not much"=trading a player with good potential for a player with good potential while only adding someon who is redundant

things that speak against it:

1) Sam Pestri...he should have an open line to RC and Pop...why didnt it already happen

2) its nothing which will double our chances to become champion...it just evens out the lineup, while giving us the oportunity to pick up Bowen too

btw.: I like to play with the new lineups in NBA2k9 and Ian always seems like the player I have no use for (not with ratliff on board)

[Sigz]

Fuckers are crazy if they want to ship Ian away.

[mountainballer]

things that speak against it:


Thunder players who play PF or C: Green, Ibaka, White, Collison, Krstic, Mullens
players, who are projects: Ibaka, White, Mullens
players similar to Ian: Ibaka, Mullens
Thunder players, who are above average wing defenders: Sefolosha

if you are a GM, who wants to keep his job, would you add another project where you already have a longjam and therefore trade away your best defender?

[buujness]

I know, I know...speaking of possible trades, that never have mentioned bei either FO is retarded (start the bashing!), but:...

thinking about the possibilities and the chances of trades happening one trade makes a lot of sense to me:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=l7zn6q

allredy mentioned it (kind of):

Thabo for Finley and Ian!

for OKC:

1) they should be interested in Ian...Mullins could be a nice project, but they could use someone like Ian as an even better prsopect...especially with Krstic beeing able to play PF for some minutes which would give them a nice big lineup

2) they should like Finley beeing the mentor to Harden and Durant

3) they are not there yet...teams like Cleveland, Boston or the Mavs wont trade with us, but they shouldnt have problems

4) Sam Pestri

for us:

1) we get that defensive wing without loosing much

2) "not much"=trading a player with good potential for a player with good potential while only adding someon who is redundant

things that speak against it:

1) Sam Pestri...he should have an open line to RC and Pop...why didnt it already happen

2) its nothing which will double our chances to become champion...it just evens out the lineup, while giving us the oportunity to pick up Bowen too

btw.: I like to play with the new lineups in NBA2k9 and Ian always seems like the player I have no use for (not with ratliff on board)
Not losing much? A 22-year-old C with quickness and athletic ability isn't a lot? Not to mention the fact that, for his age, he's actually quite developed, especially when you see the other Cs his age that are highly thought of (Thabeet, for example) and have similar talents. I understand what you're saying that Sefolosha still has potential, along with far more polish than Mahinmi. However, Mahinmi, despite what you may think, has a TON of potential (more than Sefolosha). The only thing that really stopped him from competing for a spot last year was a badly mis-diagnosed injury. Why would you give up on Mahinmi when he hasn't had a real chance to prove himself?

Not to mention the thought that even if Sefolosha had the same amount of potential that Mahinmi has with his current level of polish that:

Young, very athletic C > Young, talented, defensive wing

Why? Simply put, there are a lot more talented defensive wings out there than highly athletic centers. Hell, why not give Hairston the chance to be that defensive wing that we all covet so much? If he doesn't turn out to be that by the trade deadline, then you can make a trade for a defensive wing, and you might not have to give up as much to get him (depending if the trading partner is out of contention and desperately trying to free up cap room).

All that being said, there is absolutely ZERO reason to trade Mahinmi at the moment, and it would take Scola trade-esque stupidity for the FO to do so.

Add to that, he may turn out to be a better option at back-up C than Ratliff this season; it wouldn't shock me in the least if Mahinmi out performed the 36-year-old who only played in 46 games last year AND who has a rather long history of injury.

Oh, and also, game creators use past performances to decide the ratings of the players, so a video game is not a good indicator of future successes/failings at all, especially during the off-season.

[rjv]

mahimini may still be able to offer something to the spurs and obviously the spurs FO believes this or else he would have been dumped by now.

[mudyez]

Not losing much? A 22-year-old C with quickness and athletic ability isn't a lot? Not to mention the fact that, for his age, he's actually quite developed, especially when you see the other Cs his age that are highly thought of (Thabeet, for example) and have similar talents. I understand what you're saying that Sefolosha still has potential, along with far more polish than Mahinmi. However, Mahinmi, despite what you may think, has a TON of potential (more than Sefolosha). The only thing that really stopped him from competing for a spot last year was a badly mis-diagnosed injury. Why would you give up on Mahinmi when he hasn't had a real chance to prove himself?

Not to mention the thought that even if Sefolosha had the same amount of potential that Mahinmi has with his current level of polish that:

Young, very athletic C > Young, talented, defensive wing

Why? Simply put, there are a lot more talented defensive wings out there than highly athletic centers. Hell, why not give Hairston the chance to be that defensive wing that we all covet so much? If he doesn't turn out to be that by the trade deadline, then you can make a trade for a defensive wing, and you might not have to give up as much to get him (depending if the trading partner is out of contention and desperately trying to free up cap room).

All that being said, there is absolutely ZERO reason to trade Mahinmi at the moment, and it would take Scola trade-esque stupidity for the FO to do so.

Add to that, he may turn out to be a better option at back-up C than Ratliff this season; it wouldn't shock me in the least if Mahinmi out performed the 36-year-old who only played in 46 games last year AND who has a rather long history of injury.

Oh, and also, game creators use past performances to decide the ratings of the players, so a video game is not a good indicator of future successes/failings at all, especially during the off-season.

don't get me wron! I like Ian! I like him very much! It's just, that I think we should win now and that said, its not that much about potential, as it is for production right now.

Lets not call Ian the next coming of Dwight Howard! Can he be good? Yeah! Can he fail badly? Absolutely! Ask the Sonics/Thunder about big players that failed (and yeah, I want to sell them one more of them).

Ian has a nice skillset but nothing thats needed at this point. I see him more on a run and gun team, with more of an offensive agenda.

In terms of C vs. Wings:
First of all: how many defensive wings do you trust to defende players like Kobe? I like Hairston too, but you need to build kind of a reputation. Bowen had it. Battier has it. Bell has it. Thabo is on the best way to earn it. Hairston has nothing like that und would need at least 2 seasons to earn it...by that time we are done anyway.
And for C>smaller players: Thats only true if you have less than 7 frontcourtplayers :-)

As for the idea to wait untill the trade deadline: I like that idea (actually said it a lot of times myself)! By that time there will be teams allready going to rebuilding mode and we might get something cheap.

I'm not the biggest fan of a Ian trade, but it would be a nice step into the "win now" mode...and even while players like Hill and Blair can contribute to that, I don't see Ian getting playoff minutes with vets like McDyess and Ratliff on board.

Could it turn out to be the next Scola f§$% up? Maybe, but in order for that Ian would have to become an allstar. We traded Scola for nothing (basically Butlers money), while we get a quallity player in the mentioned trade.

[raspsa]

If trading Ian or any other Spur for that matter can add value in return which increases the chance of winning a championship during Duncan's shrinking window of opportunity, then why not? All these moves since the Jefferson trade were made with this in mind.

[jag]

I can't stand how so many people think Raja Bell would improve this team.

He looked so slow in his final season with Phoenix, that Suns fans didn't even want him around. He couldn't stay in front of Manu and he didn't look any better against Kobe than Mason did.

He's not defensive stopper that he was 4 years ago and his 3pt shooting is a downgrade when compared to Mason Jr.

[SenorSpur]

Ian needs lots of minutes to develop. He won't get that in S.A. We are in win now mode. If we can get a Battier type of defender, Spurs will make that trade in a second.

Personally, I am certainly not in favor of the Spurs trading Ian for any reason. Even if the it means getting a chance to acquire a player of Battier's caliber, I would have to believe he could be had with some other combination of Finley+Bonner+???. I would really prefer Bonner be sacrificed moreso than Ian.

[Hornets1]

Bonner and Finley are two players that can be traded, but in all honesty they are also two players on this roster that are not wild cards. We don't know what we are getting from Ian, Haislip, Hairston, Theo, Blair, and Williams (that is half our possible active roster). Bonner and Finley on the other hand are players who we know will give us solid minutes on offense, defense not so much.

If Larry Brown will do us a solid I say we offer Bonner and Finley for Bell? The Camby trade is less likely with a lot of bigs already on the roster, and a shot blocker semi crossed off the list. We need that outside defender/shooter and Bell can take care of that.

Our depth chart would look something like this:

Parker/Hill/Williams(?)
Bell/Mason
RJ/Manu/Hairston
Duncan/Blair/Haislip
McDyess/Ian/Theo

The worst part about that is that only 5 players were key in last year's team. I had to REALLY think about who was where because I forgot about a lot od people.

Bell would be a monster for the spurs. He's a younger bruce bowen. Great shooter and defender. He is a battier-type player. A Kobe stopper. Would really help the spurs in the postseason. Don't know if you could get him for just bonner and finley though. Might have to add a draft pick or a overseas prospect as well. I've always wanted Bell to be a Hornet, but it's wishful thinking at best.

[superbigtime]

The only thing that really stopped him from competing for a spot last year was a badly mis-diagnosed injury.

Not debating your other points, I want to see how Ian pans out this season too. But in what way was he 'badly misdiagnosed' ? Why is it someone else's fault that he injured himself? Sometimes shit just happens, it's not necessarily someone's fault or negligence.

[FireDavidStern]

Raja Bell is the Kobe stopper

He's just as good at it as Ruben Patterson was.

[buujness]

don't get me wron! I like Ian! I like him very much! It's just, that I think we should win now and that said, its not that much about potential, as it is for production right now.

Lets not call Ian the next coming of Dwight Howard! Can he be good? Yeah! Can he fail badly? Absolutely! Ask the Sonics/Thunder about big players that failed (and yeah, I want to sell them one more of them).

Ian has a nice skillset but nothing thats needed at this point. I see him more on a run and gun team, with more of an offensive agenda.

In terms of C vs. Wings:
First of all: how many defensive wings do you trust to defende players like Kobe? I like Hairston too, but you need to build kind of a reputation. Bowen had it. Battier has it. Bell has it. Thabo is on the best way to earn it. Hairston has nothing like that und would need at least 2 seasons to earn it...by that time we are done anyway.
And for C>smaller players: Thats only true if you have less than 7 frontcourtplayers :-)

As for the idea to wait untill the trade deadline: I like that idea (actually said it a lot of times myself)! By that time there will be teams allready going to rebuilding mode and we might get something cheap.

I'm not the biggest fan of a Ian trade, but it would be a nice step into the "win now" mode...and even while players like Hill and Blair can contribute to that, I don't see Ian getting playoff minutes with vets like McDyess and Ratliff on board.

Could it turn out to be the next Scola f§$% up? Maybe, but in order for that Ian would have to become an allstar. We traded Scola for nothing (basically Butlers money), while we get a quallity player in the mentioned trade.
I'm not saying Ian is the second coming of Dwight Howard. To put those expectations on him would be rediculous. However, I think that, if he can provide something like 5 pts 4 rebs in 15 mins while providing energy and defense off the bench, then he would be a solid contributor this season to a championship caliber team. I'm guessing he'd outperform Ratliff at least, and would be our best option at back-up C.

However, if, by some miracle, Houston decided to offer Battier to us for a package of Ian + Bonner/Finley, then you'd be foolish to not at least consider it. I would really only look at Battier, though, because of all the wings that you listed, Battier is by far the best defender and really the only one that I think could really slow Kobe down (the thought, though, that Raja Bell would be worth the same package is ludicrous; he was too slow to guard Kobe two years ago). All that being said, it may not be a bad idea to at least give Hairston a look at some of the better perimeter scorers in the league (at least early in the season) just to see what he's capable of.

Though, your point on bigmen never performing is well taken. I just think that Ian can contribute this year, and improve in years to come, and I would hate to see that go for something less than an absolutely fantastic deal.

[timaios]

Not debating your other points, I want to see how Ian pans out this season too. But in what way was he 'badly misdiagnosed' ? Why is it someone else's fault that he injured himself? Sometimes shit just happens, it's not necessarily someone's fault or negligence.

You have an explanation in this article

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/nba/Spurs_big_question_What_about_Mahinmi.html


Mahinmi's injury nightmare began in August, when he stepped on another player's foot during a pickup game.

Initially diagnosed as a high right ankle sprain, the injury didn't improve with rest and treatment. In November, Mahinmi tested the ankle in a Development League game with the Austin Toros and re-aggravated the injury.

Mahinmi didn't know it yet, but his season was finished. He had wasted a year of his life. He had let the organization down.

“I knew they wanted me to play, to show what I can do,” Mahinmi said. “I wanted that so bad, too.”

In January, doctors finally pinpointed the cause of Mahinmi's recurring pain. A small piece of bone had broken off and was floating around inside his ankle. It hadn't appeared on any of his previous MRIs.

Mahinmi would need season-ending surgery to correct the problem. By that point, he was the cheeriest surgery patient imaginable.

“I wish I had surgery from the beginning,” Mahinmi said. “It's usually the last resort, but it made me feel better.”

[buujness]

Not debating your other points, I want to see how Ian pans out this season too. But in what way was he 'badly misdiagnosed' ? Why is it someone else's fault that he injured himself? Sometimes shit just happens, it's not necessarily someone's fault or negligence.
Nevermind. I was typing while the other poster was responding.

[ohmwrecker]

Raja Bell is the Kobe stopper

Anyone can stop Kobe if they clothesline him driving in the lane.

[lefty]

Raja Bell is the Kobe stopper
Raja Bell is the Kobe slapper

[jgome21]

raja bell's washed up, it would be stupid to trade finley or ian for him. Ian has plenty of potential, hopefully we still see that this year. The Fin dog will do his thing, wit this 3's.

[suitedkings]

raja bell is the kobe clothliner

fyp!

[mosdef17]

If we are looking for 3's and some "Kobe Stopping" it could be possible to acquire Shane Battier from the Rockets if they are looking to rebuild. They are waiting to see with Yao, they let Artest walk, they're looking to trade McGrady. What good is Battier for them? Besides, they basically signed a guy who is capable of filling that role, probably not to the standard of Battier though, in Travor Ariza. Not sure I would want to give up Ian in a trade though and the Rocket's probably wouldn't accept Bonner and Finley in return.

Maybe if we can get a 3rd team involved, something like this maybe?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mvqqhb

[loveforthegame]

“The goal right now is to build as productive a team as we can this year, but also try to search out some athleticism for the future,” Buford said.

The main pieces are already in place. Makes me think they're looking at adding a young prospect wing. Might not be a fancy name and might be someone who has sorta fallen off the radar but can get the job done.

I have no clue who that might be but it's my bet they're looking at someone like that than Bell or Battier or Posey and the like.

[Vito Corleone]

I personally love Ian, I think we need to win now but also keep an eye on the future, remember once Tim and manu are gone we will be lead by a still in his prime Tony Parker who will need some motivation to want to resign with us. He needs to know he won't waste the last years of his career on a Lottery team.

the balance to this is if the FO feels that one more move can bring us a championship you do it and worry about the future later.

[ohmwrecker]

If we are looking for 3's and some "Kobe Stopping" it could be possible to acquire Shane Battier from the Rockets if they are looking to rebuild. They are waiting to see with Yao, they let Artest walk, they're looking to trade McGrady. What good is Battier for them? Besides, they basically signed a guy who is capable of filling that role, probably not to the standard of Battier though, in Travor Ariza. Not sure I would want to give up Ian in a trade though and the Rocket's probably wouldn't accept Bonner and Finley in return.

Maybe if we can get a 3rd team involved, something like this maybe?

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mvqqhb


There is absolutely no friggin' way Portland does that deal.

[mosdef17]

There is absolutely no friggin' way Portland does that deal.

Yeah, it was a silly example. I don't think it was THAT far fetched but most unlikely. It all depends on how highly they rate Bayless? They don't seem to rate him too highly as he barely even plays and is reportedly on the trade block. I couldn't really think of a better example in the 90 seconds I thought about it.

The whole point of that last post was basically to say that Battier would be a nice addition if we can somehow pull it off.

[mudyez]

If we are looking for 3's and some "Kobe Stopping" it could be possible to acquire Shane Battier from the Rockets if they are looking to rebuild. They are waiting to see with Yao, they let Artest walk, they're looking to trade McGrady. What good is Battier for them?


Battier is just the type of player, which is always good to have around. if not for his on court stuff, he is perfect to have on vet tems for holding them together and for rebuildin teams to mentor the youngsters. and in the end...even if ou have a freakin' weak team...you like to avoid the Kobes, Lebrons and Carters havin those 50 point nights ainst you.

I'd realy love to get him, as he is one of my favs. I'd even give them Mason+Ian...hell, hate me for it but I'd probably give them Mason+Blair. But thats not going to happen.
With Yao around, there is a place for Battier as well, and I don't see them trading Yao even while rebulding. There are a couple of players, which they might think about it (e.g. Durant, Roy), but I dont see one of these trades working. So why trade your best locker room presense and best defender for the backup of your francise player?

actually I like the chances Houston has. next season will be crappy, but aftr that they should have a nice lineup with Yao and Scola/Hayes inside, a defensive wing couplin Battier+Ariza and Books who should be the second option on offense (after a full year of work, he very well could be an all star PG). add trade possibilities involving T-Mac and a lottery pick and they could be in the running (by that time LA, DAL and SA should have lost a step, while POR should be there too).

So I dont think they will be desperate. Ian dosn't fit that well (not better than Shane does).


The main pieces are already in place. Makes me think they're looking at adding a young prospect wing.

why add a young wing prospect, while we have Hairston and to a smaller degree Williams?



after all we might be done for now. If Ian plays great, we might get someone pretty good at trade deadline or keep him. and if he plays poorly, he will go to Austin or whereever else! (and the odds for the later to happen are not that bad with few minutes available to proof himself!

[Thompson]

Ian can't go to Austin anymore, he's been with the Spurs for more than 2 years now.

I think he'll get plenty of time early in the season so Pop can see what he has. Depending on his performance, he might be our backup center. The Spurs would be crazy to trade him now when his value is low and they have yet to see what he can bring to the table.

[mudyez]

Ian can't go to Austin anymore, he's been with the Spurs for more than 2 years now.

I think he'll get plenty of time early in the season so Pop can see what he has. Depending on his performance, he might be our backup center. The Spurs would be crazy to trade him now when his value is low and they have yet to see what he can bring to the table.

thats the problem...His value might not be that low right now...There should be some teams, which see him as a nice prospect after his summer league play. He might show that he is worth even more but the chances are, that he will not see those minutes (Duncan, Dyess, Blair, Bonner, Haislip, Ratliff is a lot and Pop loves Bonner, shile Duncan and Dyess will be needed and Blair/Haislip are in the same position as Ian) or just bust. He might even get injured and thats it.

Is his chance better now, as a prospect or later after time in a loaded frontcourt?

We dont know and I'm fine waiting it out until feb. I just feel, that we should a least listen to other teams and not treat him like he was the #1 draft pick!

[JustinJDW]

Finley and Bonner can go but Roger and Ian need to stay. Trade Finley and Bonner for Shane Battier in Houston. That would be fantastic. Houston can use someone like Bonner to add depth to their Frontcourt now that Yao is gone.

If we do end up keeping Bonner though, that is fine, but he better not fucking start and he better not fuck up the development of Blair. Let him have his role on the Bench and that's it. We don't need a Starting Center that can only grab 4 Rebounds a Game. That's pathetic.

[mudyez]

Finley and Bonner can go but Roger and Ian need to stay. Trade Finley and Bonner for Shane Battier in Houston. That would be fantastic. Houston can use someone like Bonner to add depth to their Frontcourt now that Yao is gone.

If we do end up keeping Bonner though, that is fine, but he better not fucking start and he better not fuck up the development of Blair. Let him have his role on the Bench and that's it. We don't need a Starting Center that can only grab 4 Rebounds a Game. That's pathetic.

LOL...it will be kind of:

RC phoning Daryl Morey (Houstin GM)

RC: "Whats, up Daryl? Heard one of your players is having surgery"

Daryl: "Duh!?"

RC: "Wanted to call you for a trade proposal!"

Daryl: "Lets hear what you have got!"

RC: "Its about that defense wing."

Daryl: "He is gone to LA."

RC: "Was that the guy which met the president or the boy, that has to stay away 400 feet within the white house?

Daryl: "You mean "within every kindergarden"...?...We still have two, but I guess you mean Shane!"

RC: "Thats his name!"

Daryl: "You know! He is our best player right now!"

RC: "Duh!?"

Daryl: silence

RC: "Can we include your next first round drafrt pick?" :rolleyes

Daryl: silence

RC: "Had to ask...Sorry!" :(

Daryl: "So what do you have for him?"

RC: "Ma..."

Daryl: "WHAT???":bang

RC: "Mi..."

Daryl: "WHAT???":bang

RC: "Des..."

Daryl: "WHAT???":bang

RC: silence

Daryl: silence

RC: silence

Daryl: silence

RC: silence

Daryl: silence

RC: "if we throw in a seondrounder?"

Daryl: silence

RC: "Hello?"

Daryl: silence

RC: "Are you still there?"

Daryl: "Yes! Sorry. Just had ro read this Mail from Mike Kupchak. He wants to give my Adam Morrison for Yao. We can't match the salaries. Any other proposes for Shane?

RC: "Ton..."

Daryl: "Hell yeah! We have a deal!!!":downspin:

RC: "silence"

Daryl: "You got me!"

RC: "Can you say: I got punked! ?"

Daryl: "You are waisting my time!"

RC: "Ok, I have to call Otis about the availability of Dwight! JustinJDW called me and said, it makes sense, coz when we trade them Matt, he can fill the hole they have up front!....a...af...aft...after they traded us Dwight"

"tooooot tooooot tooooot"

RC: "Darly?"

"tooooot tooooot tooooot"

RC: "So do we have a deal?"

[dc_spursfan]

The reason I thought Ian was getting big minutes cause he still is a question mark and also needed the reps. One of Blair's miss games was because he was playing w/o a contract.

Trading Ian does not seem like a smart idea for the moment. While I like Theo, he is nothing more then a 10-12 minute center. SA goes back to being a old, unathletic and undersized frontcourt.

[wildbill2u]

Houston loves Battier and where would we put him? Behind Jefferson? That's a hell of a player to be on the bench. I dont think that is a reasonable suggestion.

[barbacoataco]

Other threads on this board have convinced me that Battier's defense is overrated. Despite what I thought previously based on watching the games, the evidence was substantial that Battier is NOT effective at defending Kobe.

[jag]

Other threads on this board have convinced me that Battier's defense is overrated. Despite what I thought previously based on watching the games, the evidence was substantial that Battier is NOT effective at defending Kobe.

Shane's idea of stopping Kobe is literally putting a hand in front of his face while he is shooting. Having watched Bowen go to work on Kobe for all of these years, it's easy to see how overrated Battier's defense is.

[TDMVPDPOY]

RJ for battier and scola, salary matches man...do it

[justanotherspursfan]

RJ for battier and scola, salary matches man...do it
I've been saying that bringing in an 8th big man was the key to a title.

[portnoy1]

I would trade for battier, but i wouldn't trade RJ even though I'm not a big fan of his. And Battier did do a good job on kobe bryant. Evidence of that was the fact that after every made shot kobe would say "he can't hold me". Kobe bryant torched all the guys guarding him throughout the playoffs, Krilenko / Battier/ D.Jones / Pietrus. Out of all those defenders Battier was the only guy he consistently talked trash to and battier never said a word back. Battier played the best defense out of all the guys listed above. Kobe knew it, that's why he being more of an arrogant d-bag than normal, cause Shane was playing disciplined defense without fouling and was not getting bullied in to a trash-talking game like most do ( Kobe got whistled for Technical foul after jawing and taunting shane battier after each made shot Game 2 or 5 i believe, its on youtube).

[mudyez]

Houston loves Battier and where would we put him? Behind Jefferson? That's a hell of a player to be on the bench. I dont think that is a reasonable suggestion.

I don't see us getting him, but Jefferson and Battier would start a the wings (maybe Manu and Battier if Jefferson would agree to come in as 6th man).